| Or is gameplay only the thing that matters? Update: Some food for thought to think about in regards to this topic |
ethotSep 1, 2016 9:08 AM
| It depends on what type of game it is and what you're hoping to get out of the experience. For example, take The Last of Us. If that game didn't have its amazing characters and story, then there would be nothing to separate it from the other 100 random zombie killing games that are out there. So in the case of TLoU, yes, story (and characters) does matter; vitally so. That's predominately why it's widely considered a masterpiece. On the other hand, take a game like Vanquish. That game has a story (in my opinion it's not a particularly good one, but some might disagree), but I played that game almost entirely for the great gameplay. I'm sure there are people out there who were interested by the story of Vanquish, but it could never grab my attention. I still played and thoroughly enjoyed Vanquish though thanks to the gameplay. And of course there are also games where there is literally no story whatsoever (and that's okay). Like, I'm fairly certain nobody plays Call of Duty for the campaign or nobody plays Rock Band for its "tour" mode. lol. In the case of games like those, most people would agree only gameplay matters. |
LykatheaAug 25, 2016 6:00 PM
| Recently I realized that I hate how story is forced into games. I like games for their core and foundation which is the gameplay. Games is not a good storytelling medium. No matter how hard they try to ''enhance the experience'' by adding cinematic garbage. |
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| If a game can implement a story into it's gameplay well enough, then it's alright. Why do you think the original Bioshock is so critically acclaimed by critics and gamers? |
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| it's more important in single player games when it's single player people focus more than when it's multi due to often being distracted. This used to happen alot with me, i was playing halo with a friend but the bitch kept on spouting shit and i just wasn't enjoying the game and it's story as much as i would if it were single player. I'd argue that majority of multiplayer games are more so about game play than the story itself though this differs depending on the game franchise. |
╮ (. ❛ ᴗ ❛.) ╭ |
Khaosman-ADVENT said: If a game can implement a story into it's gameplay well enough, then it's alright. Why do you think the original Bioshock is so critically acclaimed by critics and gamers? There are several critics that criticizes Bioshock Infinite's gameplay. |
CapitalistGod said: Khaosman-ADVENT said: If a game can implement a story into it's gameplay well enough, then it's alright. Why do you think the original Bioshock is so critically acclaimed by critics and gamers? There are several critics that criticizes Bioshock Infinite's gameplay. He's not talking about Infinite. |
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| For me, no story factors into how much faster I get bored if it didn't have some kind personal goal. Of course the gameplay elements itself can ether speed up or delay how much faster I get bored of on top of a story-less game. Though honestly, the only games I can even think of that I've played that have no story are music/rhythm games and things like Tetris... lmao. |
| Monster Hunter was a game with minimal story, and look what happened to that franchise. I mean yes it has multiplayer, but both the offline and online content can be completed solo. |
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| Depends on the game, but I've found some of the best games, have both great stories and great gameplay combined. If a game has some good, addictive gameplay, but the story is mediocre, I can mostly over-look it just because the game itself is so much fun to play (MGS5 comes to mind). If a game has a good story, but the gameplay is meh, it really all comes down to just how gripping the story is to keep me playing despite sub-par gameplay. Usually though, these tend to be games that don't focus much on gameplay anyhow, such as "interactive movies" like the Telltale games. |
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| They're not necessary, but a decent to good story can enhance the experience. I do think story is probably the least important aspect in a game for me (though that also depends on the kind of game). What's probably more important is the way story is implemented, as in how much it disrupts the flow of the game. The more that can be told through gameplay instead of cutscenes, the better, in my opinion. I can think of a bunch of games that barely had any story, or a story that wasn't anything special, and I still loved them. On the other hand, I can't really think of any game that I loved just for its story. Story really comes in last place for me when I play videogames. |
MilenninAug 26, 2016 1:07 AM
| Depends on a style of a game. Generally any sort of narrative is STILL needed to have a sensible game. The narrative does not necessarily mean traditional plot as you can focus on gameplay and still deliver the narrative you want. Generally Games ARE the narrative medium, where the narrative is presented via gameplay. HOW that gameplay is presented is what decides how the traditional understanding of "The Story" is implemented. Ex: The way something like life is strange implements narrative via gameplay or the way dark souls implements it are fundamentally different, but that does not mean that one of them has less narrative. Does Witness or Braid have no story just because its told ONLY via gameplay? Not really. Every game is a "story". The question is the focus - how does the developer want to deliver the experience - is it via narrative or is it via the gameplay? Both methods are viable in storytelling, there's nothing wrong with either method. Generally if people want to actually have video games be taken seriously having a thoughtful narrative and good quality message within the game is important. How it is presented can differ, but a game, as a narrative medium, HAS to have a meaning behind it. |
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tsudecimo said: I guess you never played Planescape Torment, Fallout 1 & 2, System Shock, Deus Ex, and a metric crapton of other well-written RPGs, adventure games and a few titles from other genres... :PGames is not a good storytelling medium. Games can get away without having any story at all. Multiplayer titles rarely have more than a simple excuse of a plot, same with various sandboxes (Minecraft?), plenty of action-focused games, strategy games and so on. Not all games need a story, some can focus entirely on pure gameplay. However, they can have complex storylines as well, and even be focused primarily on storytelling. They can tell stories using text, dialogues or cinematics, but also gameplay itself (like Another World or already mentioned Braid). Some genres rely on plot more (like RPGs or adventure games) others less (like fighting games or FPS), but all of them can deliver a decent storyline. |
| I'd rather have a game with a well written plot than one with a terribly written plot though I would take a game with amazing gameplay resulting in little attempt at a story than one with terrible gameplay due to a terrible attempt at a story. Basically; Terrible gameplay + terrible story < terrible gameplay + okay/great story. Okay/Great story + terrible gameplay < Amazing gameplay + bad/terrible story. Amazing gameplay + Amazing story > Everything else. |
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Neither of them had good gameplay anyway. Decent, as in being enough to work around the narrative/story structure? Sure. But it wasn't good. Apparently Bioshock 2 had the best one, but I honestly never bothered and probably never will since I doubt it will beat Infinite as a game. Pabloc said: tsudecimo said: I guess you never played Planescape Torment, Fallout 1 & 2, System Shock, Deus Ex, and a metric crapton of other well-written RPGs, adventure games and a few titles from other genres... :PGames is not a good storytelling medium. The combat mechanics of Torment and Fallout 1 (and I assume Fallout 2 is more of the same) ruin the games IMO. I really like the dialog and all, but they would work much better if their stories were made in other medium, because aside from that (and maybe some characters here and there), they aren't very good games. On topic, though, I will have to agree with this: SnugglyWhuggly said: Depends on the game, but I've found some of the best games, have both great stories and great gameplay combined. The best games or at least the most memorable are ones that are good at both things; having a charming/interesting story with great gameplay. |
| I think game developers should stick to what they're good at, and if they cant write a story, don't include one. Same can go for gameplay complexity, and whatnot. The great thing about games are the varied nature of it. If i want to play a shooter, i'll play a shooter, if i want a story, I'll play something that has one (usually an RPG), If i want to be autistic? I'll play a simulation game. |
| There are some multiplayer games where I pretty much ignored the story, mostly Hack & Slash. But in singleplayer games it is of course very important, it has to entertain me all the way through after all. |
Pabloc said: tsudecimo said: I guess you never played Planescape Torment, Fallout 1 & 2, System Shock, Deus Ex, and a metric crapton of other well-written RPGs, adventure games and a few titles from other genres... :PGames is not a good storytelling medium. Games can get away without having any story at all. Multiplayer titles rarely have more than a simple excuse of a plot, same with various sandboxes (Minecraft?), plenty of action-focused games, strategy games and so on. Not all games need a story, some can focus entirely on pure gameplay. However, they can have complex storylines as well, and even be focused primarily on storytelling. They can tell stories using text, dialogues or cinematics, but also gameplay itself (like Another World or already mentioned Braid). Some genres rely on plot more (like RPGs or adventure games) others less (like fighting games or FPS), but all of them can deliver a decent storyline. I loathe RPG so no I didn't play those and never will. I've played games that had a good story. That's not the problem. For example I enjoyed the Last of Us, I would give it 9/10 but when it comes to it I only enjoyed the story and the characters and the gameplay was an after thought. It would have been a lot better as a simple movie. There is nothing in that game that would make me want to play it again because it didn't have any memorable gameplay. They can have storylines but my problem is that they interfere with my experience. I made this thread and realized that my problem was games that put emphasis on the stories instead of letting me enjoy the gameplay. I can play Fifa, street fighter, NBA, etc for long periods of times but I can barely play games like MGS Phantom Pain, Tombraider, Bioshock infinite for more than an hour. I found this a good read: http://thebestpageintheuniverse.net/c.cgi?u=game_stories_suck |
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| Gameplay is the most important thing, but having a good story is always nice. But gameplay can be considered part of the story like the actions you take when playing can affect the story and advance it . |
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| You've got it backwards. Multiplayer is where story becomes irrelevant and gameplay is everything. We can trace this all the way back to the 80s where people would be pumping quarters into arcade machines to beat each others scores. In single player, nothing gets more boring quicker than a game without story and nobody to share the experience with. Gameplay is still important though, considering we're playing video games and not interactive movies. Tarotist said: Monster Hunter was a game with minimal story, and look what happened to that franchise. I mean yes it has multiplayer, but both the offline and online content can be completed solo. I was gonna mention Monster Hunter but then I realized I quit that game within the first 10 hours because I had nobody to play it with. I came back to it with my brother a couple years later and have logged hundreds since. It really makes a difference having someone to share the trouble with. Even just threads online or a community hub makes a difference. |
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| I very rarely give enough of a shit about most video game narratives to play them for the narratives. I play games for the gameplay but it's impossible for games not to have some sort of narrative. |
 Anime is good, fucking deal with it. |
| Of course it is! Fortunately, in the last generation we've got some fantastic stories like: Nier, Journey, 999, VLR, The Walking Dead(Telltale), Heavy Rain, Persona 4 Golden(ya, i know it's a ps2 game but i love this so much), Catherine, Bioshock and others. In fact, there's a lot of games with horrible stories and awesome gameplay and vice versa, today, i prefer a better story than gameplay. Gameplay of course it's important, but today, most of the games deal with us like dumbass like Assassin's Creed. Nintendo and Platinum still the gameplay king. In hack'n'slash for example, we don't need a nice story, but 60 fps and a nice gameplay. But in rpg, story needs to be good. |
| Uhh sure you don't mean multiplayer? That's where gameplay is generally all that matters Single player on the other hand it's normally pretty important. Of course that doesn't mean that's *always* the case but definitely more often than not |
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| I'm quite certain there is a story in every single player game, some probably alot more vague than others. Multiplayer is a different matter though. |
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| Story is usually what pushes you on to play more of a game. But GAMEplay is the most important part about a GAME. A game can have the best story ever, but if the gameplay is terrible, everything is wasted. But if a game has great gameplay but terrible story, it's perfectly fine. |
 "Your sight, my delight. Will you marry me?" |
| Every single player game has a story, or at least the ones I've played all had some kind of a story. |
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| Why play single player for gameplay? Singleplayer is for story and Multiplayer is for gameplay. |
| Well.. It needs a balance of both. Although, there are some games that makes an exception. Mass Effect 1/2/3 Dragon Age Series (Though the 2nd game was awful) Undertale Fallout Series Witcher Series |
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| Gameplay is always the most important thing in a game |
| There's no clear answer. I still replay some games with terrible gameplay but excellent stories/worlds/atmospheres blablabla. |
Prophetess of the Golden Era  |
| I like games where I can create my own story more than following given one. But I like strategy games most and I don't mind story. I can play ones with story though, I dont really care, just give me good gameplay and graphics. That for single player. In multiplayer, I prefer RPG, strategy, FPS. |
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Fantasee said: There aren't a lot of pseudo-stealth zombie games.It depends on what type of game it is and what you're hoping to get out of the experience. For example, take The Last of Us. If that game didn't have its amazing characters and story, then there would be nothing to separate it from the other 100 random zombie killing games that are out there. So in the case of TLoU, yes, story (and characters) does matter; vitally so. That's predominately why it's widely considered a masterpiece. On the other hand, take a game like Vanquish. That game has a story (in my opinion it's not a particularly good one, but some might disagree), but I played that game almost entirely for the great gameplay. I'm sure there are people out there who were interested by the story of Vanquish, but it could never grab my attention. I still played and thoroughly enjoyed Vanquish though thanks to the gameplay. And of course there are also games where there is literally no story whatsoever (and that's okay). Like, I'm fairly certain nobody plays Call of Duty for the campaign or nobody plays Rock Band for its "tour" mode. lol. In the case of games like those, most people would agree only gameplay matters. |
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| Depends on the game. |
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| Gameplay is most important. The same way the most important aspect of a movie is being able to see it but story can enhance any medium in alot of ways but it's not always necessary (I mean, who watches Mad Max: Fury Road, Kill Bill, or Hellsing for their stories) |
Lord_Sithis said: tsudecimo said: The Walking DeadRecently I realized that I hate how story is forced into games. I like games for their core and foundation which is the gameplay. Games is not a good storytelling medium. No matter how hard they try to ''enhance the experience'' by adding cinematic garbage. The Last of Us Life is Strange #NotAGoodStorytellingMedium #CinematicGarbage Yeah.. I can't agree with that. Some gaming storylines have resonated more with me than movies. |
| Of course not, it would be like saying every single song needs to tell a story. A good story can only be experienced once, good gameplay can be experienced hundreds of times if not more. http://insomnia.ac/commentary/for_artfags_only/ |
| Might be unpopular opinion here. But I mostly play for the story. Yes Multiplayer is fun in it's own ways but I like playing for story, A good story + decent gameplay is a win win for me. |
| The point where the darkness lies Is the place I hide my true self Are you prepared to open your eyes? Cause between those line is yourself |
| I hope so. The narrative is an important part of my experience. Playing a game is swell and all, but I'm going to remember Assassin's Creed or Dark Cloud far longer than Mario Party or Slime Volleyball. |
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Lord_Sithis said: tsudecimo said: The Walking DeadRecently I realized that I hate how story is forced into games. I like games for their core and foundation which is the gameplay. Games is not a good storytelling medium. No matter how hard they try to ''enhance the experience'' by adding cinematic garbage. The Last of Us Life is Strange #NotAGoodStorytellingMedium #CinematicGarbage https://myanimelist.net/forum/?topicid=1546425&show=0#msg47503439 Life is strange and the walking dead help my point. They shouldn't even be called games, they are interactive stories. |
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tsudecimo said: The interactivity is what makes them games. That's like saying "They aren't games, they should be called games!"Lord_Sithis said: The Walking Dead The Last of Us Life is Strange #NotAGoodStorytellingMedium #CinematicGarbage https://myanimelist.net/forum/?topicid=1546425&show=0#msg47503439 Life is strange and the walking dead help my point. They shouldn't even be called games, they are interactive stories. A shitty anime is still an anime, and a shitty game is still a game. You don't have to go so far as to say some games are not games just because you don't like them. |
PeenusWeenusCaimAug 28, 2016 9:54 AM
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| For me I prefer story over gameplay in games, so I'd say it's necessary. There are a lotta games I would hate if not for the story. |
95PercentCaim said: tsudecimo said: The interactivity is what makes them games. That's like saying "They aren't games, they should be called games!"https://myanimelist.net/forum/?topicid=1546425&show=0#msg47503439 Life is strange and the walking dead help my point. They shouldn't even be called games, they are interactive stories. A shitty anime is still an anime, and a shitty game is still a game. You don't have to go so far as say some games are not games just because you don't like them. Good grief that terrible reading comprehension. Their quality is irrelevant, whether I like them or not is also irrelevant. Im quite clearly talking about how they are fundamentally. As in the tell tale games like the name implies are more story than gameplay. Saying story is equally important as gameplay is retarded. It's like watching a movie and caring equally about the soundtrack as the story and characters. Gaming as a storytelling medium doesn't offer something valuable, quite the opposite having a story driven game clashes with the essence of games. For me at least. People rationalize it with statements like it offer more immersive experience and what not. There is nothing immersive about watching a story until some point where some text pops up and asks you to choose something. Or when they shove the gameplay into the ''cinematic'' experience like having you control snake in phantom pain in the beginning in the hospital. It's rubbish. If I wanted a story I would watch a movie or read a book or pick any other actual storytelling medium. |
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tsudecimo said: It seemed like a quality issue when you said something as moronic as "these interactive works are not interactive works". All you have to say is you don't like games that have a focus on story instead of fully revising an already established definition to fit your own. Unlike other mediums, games rely on interaction. And in those story games, your interaction with the story is the gameplay as your choices and actions progress and/or affect the story as a whole. Even if it comes to a point where your choices hardly affect anything, they are still fundamentally games (just very shit in this case), and saying they aren't games is only going to weaken your credibility.95PercentCaim said: The interactivity is what makes them games. That's like saying "They aren't games, they should be called games!" A shitty anime is still an anime, and a shitty game is still a game. You don't have to go so far as say some games are not games just because you don't like them. Good grief that terrible reading comprehension. Their quality is irrelevant, whether I like them or not is also irrelevant. Im quite clearly talking about how they are fundamentally. As in the tell tale games like the name implies are more story than gameplay. Saying story is equally important as gameplay is retarded. It's like watching a movie and caring equally about the soundtrack as the story and characters. Gaming as a storytelling medium doesn't offer something valuable, quite the opposite having a story driven game clashes with the essence of games. For me at least. People rationalize it with statements like it offer more immersive experience and what not. There is nothing immersive about watching a story until some point where some text pops up and asks you to choose something. Or when they shove the gameplay into the ''cinematic'' experience like having you control snake in phantom pain in the beginning in the hospital. It's rubbish. If I wanted a story I would watch a movie or read a book or pick any other actual storytelling medium. |
PeenusWeenusCaimAug 28, 2016 10:53 AM
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tsudecimo said: I like your movie soundtracks example. Because you kinda missed musicals, the entire sub-genre of movies that are actually all about soundtracks... :PSaying story is equally important as gameplay is retarded. It's like watching a movie and caring equally about the soundtrack as the story and characters. Gaming as a storytelling medium doesn't offer something valuable, quite the opposite having a story driven game clashes with the essence of games. For me at least. People rationalize it with statements like it offer more immersive experience and what not. There is nothing immersive about watching a story until some point where some text pops up and asks you to choose something. Or when they shove the gameplay into the ''cinematic'' experience like having you control snake in phantom pain in the beginning in the hospital. It's rubbish. If I wanted a story I would watch a movie or read a book or pick any other actual storytelling medium. It's the same with games. If you ignore genres that are especially good as a storytelling medium (like RPGs or adventure games), and play only those where the main focus is almsot always put on gameplay mechanics (like strategy games, hack&slash, sports games, FPS, fighting games and such), you probably won't encounter too many decent stories. Sure, there are some exceptions, but in most cases plot (if any) is only meant as an excuse for gameplay, and it gets in the way when it's overdone. Some types of games simply have better potential as a storytelling medium. Just because you avoid playing those doesn't mean they don't exist. Just like musicals. :P |
| If I don't care about a game's story/characters it's hard for me to keep going if it's single player, yes. Of course being fun to play is nice, but there has to be more to it. |
| "Yes, I have been deprived of emotion. But not completely. Whoever did it, botched the job." - Geralt of Rivia |
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