| MAL editors rewrote an anti-Nazi article due to someone within MAL (this likely means a staff member) found the article to be offensive. They even edited his article without telling him. [...]The new article doesn’t follow the spirit of his original piece at all and in fact included a new addition to the list, Rudol von Stroheim from JoJo’s Bizarre Adventure, described as “an unusually positive portrayal of a Nazi soldier.” Original Article Subheading: The rise of Neo-Nazi hate groups in America and around the world has been terrifying. To help you feel a little better and maybe even inspired, here's a bunch of anime and manga about kicking Nazis in the ass. New Article Subheading: In popular culture, next to zombies, Nazi's have been our go-to stock characters for when lazy writers needed the ultimate evil enemy. Here are 11 examples of Nazis in anime and Manga! The implications of these changes are that offending Neo-Nazis is a concern. It should be recognized that people that hate others for their race, color, or creed are not those we should sympathize with. I'm honestly a bit disgusted that MAL would directly be supportive of this sort of practice. As someone who went to a march against sexist and racist behavior last night in Tokyo, I hope that there are many others on this site against Neo-Nazi ideologies. How do other users feel about the article being changed in that way? |
AlabastreAizoJan 20, 2017 5:14 PM
| neo nazi doesn't exist and only used to label someone that left leaning liberals hate like racist, xenophobic, sexist whatever -ist -phobic |
Cross  AngeHey guys check my profile for current airing season anime recommendation (guaranteed best taste) |
| Hmm, although that does suck, I wouldn't go as far to say that it was the upset person's reason for being angry. The "Nazi sympathizing" is mere assumption, unless there is solid evidence. I mean it clearly says in the screenshot, "... it might have been a little extreme to vaguely advocate for violence ..." I'm pretty sure that's against guidelines. |
ZelevJan 20, 2017 4:55 PM
 Three things cannot be long hidden.. ...the s u n, the m oo n, and the tr u th. |
| Animefeminist, seriously? That's some self parody. |
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GangsterCat said: neo nazi doesn't exist and only used to label someone that left leaning liberals hate like racist, xenophobic, sexist whatever -ist -phobic Are you attempting to argue that Nazis no longer exist? They do. Are you saying there isn't a literal group of people that have joined an organization that call themselves Neo-Nazis? That may be possible, but it is a term used to describe members of organizations that are a revival of Nazi ideologies. I'm not talking about labeling racists as neonazis. I'm talking about literal hate groups established to carry the torch of the original Nazi party. Those most absolutely and assuredly do exist. A quick google search would even direct you to their official websites. |
| Honestly, this sounds like an isolated incident and is irrelevant. We're here to discuss anime not politics. This thread is going to be good.  |
ValysiusJan 20, 2017 4:50 PM
Vailanor said: Honestly, this sounds like an isolated incident and is irrelevant. We're here to discuss and rate anime not politics. This thread is going to be good. "We're here to..." I'm also a member here. Obviously, members are coming in to discuss this topic, so not everyone feels the way you do. |
AlabastreAizo said: nope, nope, nope and nope, they don't exist.GangsterCat said: neo nazi doesn't exist and only used to label someone that left leaning liberals hate like racist, xenophobic, sexist whatever -ist -phobic Are you attempting to argue that Nazis no longer exist? They do. Are you saying there isn't a literal group of people that have joined an organization that call themselves Neo-Nazis? That may be possible, but it is a term used to describe members of organizations that are a revival of Nazi ideologies. I'm not talking about labeling racists as neonazis. I'm talking about literal hate groups established to carry the torch of the original Nazi party. Those most absolutely and assuredly do exist. A quick google search would even direct you to their official websites. |
Cross AngeHey guys check my profile for current airing season anime recommendation (guaranteed best taste) |
| Then let's do an experiment. "Let's kick some nazi butt." “History is written by the victors.” ― Walter Benjamin |
sasalx said: Don't forget that we need to be able to replicate this experiment. Gotta make sure the experiment's success is more than just an accident.Then let's do an experiment. "Let's kick some nazi butt." “History is written by the victors.” ― Walter Benjamin |
| Being wrong is just an occupational hazard. Follow me on twitter. I have an anitube channel so feel free to check it out and subscribe if you like what you see. |
GangsterCat said: AlabastreAizo said: nope, nope, nope and nope, they don't exist.Are you attempting to argue that Nazis no longer exist? They do. Are you saying there isn't a literal group of people that have joined an organization that call themselves Neo-Nazis? That may be possible, but it is a term used to describe members of organizations that are a revival of Nazi ideologies. I'm not talking about labeling racists as neonazis. I'm talking about literal hate groups established to carry the torch of the original Nazi party. Those most absolutely and assuredly do exist. A quick google search would even direct you to their official websites. Lmao, yes they do. Where were you in the whole year of 2016? I think you need to look up the definition of "neo" because it clearly doesn't mean what you think it does. |
Three things cannot be long hidden.. ...the s u n, the m oo n, and the tr u th. |
| @GangsterCat cant tell if youre trolling or uninformed OT: There are many immature folks who find adding adolf hitler to favorites and similar things 'so funny XDD' |
 Oshii is probably the only director that loves dogs. He thinks he's a dog himself. That's right, its slime! It will dissolve your clothing slowly before my eyes! |
GangsterCat said: nope, nope, nope and nope, they don't exist. I really don't understand what you're trying to say. You're disputing something factual. This is not an opinion. neo-Nazi niːə(ʊ)ˈnɑːtsi/ noun noun: neo-Nazi; plural noun: neo-Nazis 1. a member of an organization similar to the German Nazi Party. a person of extreme racist or nationalist views. adjective adjective: neo-Nazi 1. relating to neo-Nazis or neo-Nazism. Here is a law center's researched interactive map which shows you hate groups that are active all over the United states. Take a moment to click and see all the Neo-Nazi groups that are active. --Map of United States Hate Groups-- |
New Article Subheading: In popular culture, next to zombies, Nazi's have been our go-to stock characters for when lazy writers needed the ultimate evil enemy. Here are 11 examples of Nazis in anime and Manga! Now, being a Nazi apologist is one thing, but failing to grasp the subtle differences between the plural form and Saxon genitive and writing "Nazi's" for plural - that I shall take as a personal affront. MAL editors come across as quite capable. |
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| They might even remove the thread since it's rather self promoting and out of place in AD. Bezaliel said: The last time someone complained about Hitler being in the character's list it got a few hundred more favourites...Make a hitler thread and see if the mods will sympathize with it. sasalx said: I'm in, it's usually quite fun. Hellsing Ultimate, South Park the stick of truth, Inglourious Basterds. What do you suggest?Then let's do an experiment. "Let's kick some nazi butt." “History is written by the victors.” ― Walter Benjamin metamorphius said: New Article Subheading: In popular culture, next to zombies, Nazi's have been our go-to stock characters for when lazy writers needed the ultimate evil enemy. Here are 11 examples of Nazis in anime and Manga! Now, being a Nazi apologist is one thing, but failing to grasp the subtle differences between the plural form and Saxon genitive and writing "Nazi's" for plural - that I shall take as a personal affront. MAL editors come across as quite capable. |
zalJan 20, 2017 4:59 PM
| Signature removed. Please follow the signature rules, as defined in the Site & Forum Guidelines. |
| I don't deny that there are pretty horrible racists/sexist/whatever labels that do exist and tag along with alt right parties. But the scale of such problems in far far less significant than people make it out to be. Most are trolls online trying to get a reaction, so seeing news channel go crazy over a tweet is hilarious. My view is that the alt right was born from the cancer of the "progressive liberals" those I label the far left, who want to stamp out the majority. Those who yell "You're a straight white male!!" to invalidate people's logical arguments backed by statistics (No I'm not a straight white male btw). I'm personally a left leaning classic liberal when it comes to societal issues, though I understand conservatives points of view because on a personal level I'm a conservative that holds certain values. Yet I find myself in a struggle because many in the alt right currently are being shut out by the far left, kinda like I'm trying to fix the left from the left. I've seen less often those on the political left acknowledge the filth they have on their side of the political spectrum, while most moderate conservatives condemn the racism/sexism/whatever on their side. They also acknowledge they are conservative before they speak, acknowledged that they have their bias and have their own agendas. What I hear from the left is that they are a beacon of objectivity, they are tolerant of people who are different and they are willing to listen. NO, they are on the left, not objective. They are deluded in thinking of people as groups rather than as individuals. They are NOT willing to listen, but instead shout, chant and label you a racist misogynistic bigoted homophobe. |
| If your favourite character is Tsutsukakushi Tsukiko, you are my soul mate. Been a long time since I've been here, I'll continue expressing myself freely and believe everyone should too. My MAL Interview |
The rise of Neo-Nazi hate groups in America and around the world has been terrifying. To help you feel a little better and maybe even inspired, here's a bunch of anime and manga about kicking Nazis in the ass. My best guess is because the bolded line comes off as encouraging violence/acts of terrorism. And i believe that's against the guidelines. |
scruffs said: The rise of Neo-Nazi hate groups in America and around the world has been terrifying. To help you feel a little better and maybe even inspired, here's a bunch of anime and manga about kicking Nazis in the ass. My best guess is because the bolded line comes off as encouraging violence/acts of terrorism. And i believe that's against the guidelines. If that were the case, the editing could have started and ended with just taking out the part about being inspired. Also, doesn't terrorism imply that people are being unlawfully violent/intimidating towards humans? I'm not sure that Nazis qualify. Wouldn't they fit better under some sort of classification of reptile or goblin? I wasn't quite sure where to post it. I'd be happy to have the thread moved into the correct board. I don't see how it's self-promoting, though. I've never even been to the website where the article was posted before today, and I have no connection to the author of the original article on MAL or the animefeminist website. Out_SiN said: It's less about the quality of the article and more about the odd choice by the editors to be less anti-nazi, which is not a change that should be made in the first place. Maybe assuming that the site's moderation team either is or is trying to pander to neo-nazi is a bit of a stretch, but it's possible and is interesting discussion. Thank you very much. That's exactly the point. People posting about the quality of writing, where this belongs, or the website's name are not being conducive to discussion. |
AlabastreAizoJan 20, 2017 5:06 PM
Denpai said: Big deal... the article was poorly written either way. Even I, a sophomore in high school, would be ashamed of that trash. Nonetheless, there's terms that the writer must accept in order to have the priveledge to post on here. MAL staff members have the right to edit the article. It's less about the quality of the article and more about the odd choice by the editors to be less anti-nazi, which is not a change that should be made in the first place. Maybe assuming that the site's moderation team either is or is trying to pander to neo-nazi is a bit of a stretch, but it's possible and is interesting discussion. |
AlabastreAizo said: Here is a law center's researched interactive map which shows you hate groups that are active all over the United states. Take a moment to click and see all the Neo-Nazi groups that are active. --Map of United States Hate Groups-- There's one in my city, apparently. Good to know. If it's true I'm not at all surprised. Nothing surprises me at this point.. |
Three things cannot be long hidden.. ...the s u n, the m oo n, and the tr u th. |
AlabastreAizo said: If that were the case, the editing could have started and ended with just taking out the part about being inspired. Also, doesn't terrorism imply that people are being unlawfully violent/intimidating towards humans? I'm not sure that Nazis qualify. Wouldn't they fit better under some sort of classification of reptile or goblin? Nah, terrorism is defined as "America's enemy". Sure the official definition is whatever, but in practice it's whoever the US labels as one. Radical islam? Terrorists. The rise in crime since the refugee crisis? Just a few bad eggs. |
| If your favourite character is Tsutsukakushi Tsukiko, you are my soul mate. Been a long time since I've been here, I'll continue expressing myself freely and believe everyone should too. My MAL Interview |
BurningSpirit said: Nah, terrorism is defined as "America's enemy". Sure the official definition is whatever, but in practice it's whoever the US labels as one. Radical islam? Terrorists. The rise in crime since the refugee crisis? Just a few bad eggs. Terrorism exists worldwide. This is not about just America. |
| It IS a big deal, and not only for the nazi apologist implications, which are already relevant and disgusting by themselves. I don't know who the heck was responsible for this in the staff, but whoever you are, and I don't care here if you are a nazi or just a guy with some weird stance on political correctness: what you did here is plain wrong. Editors are not there to change the content of contributors, much less to rewrite articles and publish them under the original contributors' names. If you don't like or don't find the content suitable for the forums, then do not publish it, but don't give this fucked up "solution" by putting words in the author's mouth that he never intended to say. On the other hand, lol at AnimeFeminist blaming an entire community for the wrongdoing of a single editor. |
AlabastreAizo said: Terrorism exists worldwide. This is not about just America. I know, but what the mainstream media defines as terrorism is exactly as I've said. I agree with with what you said, that's how terrorism is defined, my previous response was sarcasm to illustrate my belief of a double standard in labeling terrorists. Yes these groups should all be labelled terrorists, along with the US military which is by far the largest group of violent people violating the sovereignty of sovereign nations by invading them, overthrowing their leaders and installing their own puppet government. |
| If your favourite character is Tsutsukakushi Tsukiko, you are my soul mate. Been a long time since I've been here, I'll continue expressing myself freely and believe everyone should too. My MAL Interview |
BurningSpirit said: AlabastreAizo said: If that were the case, the editing could have started and ended with just taking out the part about being inspired. Also, doesn't terrorism imply that people are being unlawfully violent/intimidating towards humans? I'm not sure that Nazis qualify. Wouldn't they fit better under some sort of classification of reptile or goblin? Nah, terrorism is defined as "America's enemy". Sure the official definition is whatever, but in practice it's whoever the US labels as one. Radical islam? Terrorists. The rise in crime since the refugee crisis? Just a few bad eggs. Are you trying to argue that a "rise in crime" should be considered, in itself, terrorism?... You were trying to be cheeky and claim that the way the way the word "terrorism" is used is usually wrong according to it's definition (which is a fair enough claim), but then the examples you gave include something that is pretty unmistakably terrorism and something that is not terrorism by any definition. You do understand that the actual definition "terrorism" relates to the intent of the action, right? It's a violent act intended to cause fear and that has a political political purpose. I really don't get what you were trying to imply with that line. |
Vailanor said: AlabastreAizo said: I didn't attempt to post in in the wrong board on purpose, but I wasn't quite sure where to put it. Is it really the case that politics shouldn't be discussed here in any capacity? I still think the thread is relevant, and the whole point was to direct discussion at this website—I thought this was worth mentioning. Did you forget about the current events sub-forum? This would probably be better placed at Suggestions or Support, though, since it's about the site and its management. We need a subforum or sub-subforum for Complaints or something like that. |
Out_SiN said: Are you trying to argue that a "rise in crime" should be considered, in itself, terrorism?... You were trying to be cheeky and claim that the way the way the word "terrorism" is used is usually wrong according to it's definition (which is a fair enough claim), but then the examples you gave include something that is pretty unmistakably terrorism and something that is not terrorism by any definition. You do understand that the actual definition "terrorism" relates to the intent of the action, right? It's a violent act intended to cause fear and that has a political political purpose. I really don't get what you were trying to imply with that line. I believe that the crimes committed by these refugees, which according to surveys are illiterate and most likely unemployable (only slightly over 2% have been employed since Germany took the refugees in) have begun to take out their frustration on the civilians. It comes to a point where even the police fear areas where refugee areas, it comes to a point where they cannot persecute or even find them because they have any ID, basically they have no idea who the fuck they are. As for political agenda, I don't think they have any sort of collective agenda, but interviews with a few of them show some pretty crazy views. By no means am I implying that all refugees act like this, but the absolute explosion in crimes rates in Germany by refugees is undeniable. |
| If your favourite character is Tsutsukakushi Tsukiko, you are my soul mate. Been a long time since I've been here, I'll continue expressing myself freely and believe everyone should too. My MAL Interview |
| Personal Opinion Incoming, ignore that I'm a mod: First of all the'inspiring people to violence' part was going too far. If you're gonna stoop to their level and call for violence against people with other ideologies, they are already winning. As someone who passionately hates nazis I still don't think violence is the answer, but even if I did it's not a stance a site with a public image to maintain can take, that much is certain. So I perfectly understand not wanting that part in the article and changing it. In the first place I don't think MAL articles about anime are a place for politics. It's just unnecessary, people come for the anime not the real-life baggage. I would probably have asked for a less political guideline from the start. There's a time and a place for everything. However rewriting the whole thing after already accepting and publishing it to take a more neutral stance towards nazis and emphasizing the 'other side' (the 'good nazis') with a new addition definitely makes it sound like there was more to the intervention than just the violence part. That's very suspicious and doesn't shed a good light on whoever it was that intervened. Personally I don't't condone changes of that degree, especially after the fact. But I can't know for sure what motivated the editor to complain and why people greenlit the changes so in the end it's all speculation. The article only mentioned the violence part and I can understand wanting to change that. Whether the rest was just thoughtless or intentionally trying to make nazis look better is impossible to know. I can't really say anything about whether it's okay that editors can change things whenever they like without notifying the author. If that's some legal thing the authors agreed to, there isn't really much arguing about it, whether you consider it ethical acceptable or not. I don't have insight into the reality of the situation so I can't comment. Of course ideally any complaints and requests for changes from the author would be settled before the article is actually published, but ideals don't always work out as planned. That's pretty much all I can say without more information. |
AlcoholicideJan 20, 2017 5:42 PM
| I probably regret this post by now. |
Pullman said: Personal Opinion Incoming, ignore that I'm a mod: First of all the'inspiring people to violence' part was going too far. If you're gonna stoop to their level and call for violence against people with other ideologies, they are already winning. As someone who passionately hates nazis I still don't think violence is the answer, but even if I did it's not a stance a site with a public image to maintain can take, that much is certain. So I perfectly understand not wanting that part in the article and changing it. In the first place I don't think MAL articles about anime are a place for politics. It's just unnecessary, people come for the anime not the real-life baggage. I would probably have asked for a less political guideline from the start. There's a time and a place for everything. However rewriting the whole thing after already accepting and publishing it to take a more neutral stance towards nazis and emphasizing the 'other side' (the 'good nazis') with a new addition definitely makes it sound like there was more to the intervention than just the violence part. That's very suspicious and doesn't shed a good light on whoever it was that intervened. Personally I don't't condone changes of that degree, especially after the fact. I can't really say anything about whether it's okay that editors can change things whenever they like without notifying the author. If that's some legal thing the authors agreed to, there isn't really much arguing about it, whether you consider it ethical acceptable or not. I don't have insight into the reality of the situation so I can't comment. Of course ideally any complaints and requests for changes from the author would be settled before the article is actually published, but ideals don't always work out as planned. That's pretty much all I can say without more information. Pretty much the rational response that I hoped would spring up. |
 Just this once, I'll fulfill whatever your wish is. |
Pullman said: First of all the'inspiring people to violence' part was going too far. If you're gonna stoop to their level and call for violence against people with other ideologies, they are already winning. As someone who passionately hates nazis I still don't think violence is the answer, but even if I did it's not a stance a site with a public image to maintain can take, that much is certain. So I perfectly understand not wanting that part in the article and changing it. I can't agree with that, Pullman. Anything that is changed by an editor in a minimally substantial way shouldn't be published here becase, plain and simply, it is not what the author wrote nor what he agreed to appear under his name. I think this should be a basic guideline for any editor/moderator in here, and this happens to be an extreme example of why not following it is problematic. |
Pullman said: In the first place I don't think MAL articles about anime are a place for politics. It's just unnecessary, people come for the anime not the real-life baggage. I would probably have asked for a less political guideline from the start. There's a time and a place for everything. I think you had some reasonable statements—and in a lot of ways, we're on the same page—but I disagree with this point. People should be free to write whatever they wish. It is not your place to say what everyone comes here for. If people have an interest in discussing the politics of the anime industry, then what harm comes from allowing them a platform to have that discussion? If people don't want to have that discussion, they can merely avoid it if they're not being directly harassed by it. |
| Censorship is retarded. But your point of view is retarded too. |
Play League of Legends here! Autocrat said: Hitler was good, objectively. |
jal90 said: Pullman said: First of all the'inspiring people to violence' part was going too far. If you're gonna stoop to their level and call for violence against people with other ideologies, they are already winning. As someone who passionately hates nazis I still don't think violence is the answer, but even if I did it's not a stance a site with a public image to maintain can take, that much is certain. So I perfectly understand not wanting that part in the article and changing it. I can't agree with that, Pullman. Anything that is changed by an editor in a minimally substantial way shouldn't be published here becase, plain and simply, it is not what the author wrote nor what he agreed to appear under his name. I think this should be a basic guideline for any editor/moderator in here, and this happens to be an extreme example of why not following it is problematic. Well, as I said if the authors agree beforehand to these conditions they have no basis to complain. While from an ethical standpoint I completely agree with you, from the perspective of MAL editors who know their authors agreed to these conditions, it's a different story. These things need to be complained about before you agree, not after. I try to approach the situation not from an abstract/idealized point of view, but from the real-life perspective where agreements were already made and conditions agreed upon. Otherwise I'd 100% agree that this is no way to treat your authors and their work. But discussions after the fact are mute. I'm working under the assumption that the authors did agree to that based on what little I know about how authors for MAL articles are recruited (I know a few people who write for them sometimes). At least implicitly (if they don't read the conditions given to them before agreeing it's their fault). If that turns out to not be the case that would be a completely different story though. As I said, I don't have enough information about the details to say who's right or wrong in this particular situation even though in a vacuum I share your convictions. |
| I probably regret this post by now. |
BurningSpirit said: Out_SiN said: Are you trying to argue that a "rise in crime" should be considered, in itself, terrorism?... You were trying to be cheeky and claim that the way the way the word "terrorism" is used is usually wrong according to it's definition (which is a fair enough claim), but then the examples you gave include something that is pretty unmistakably terrorism and something that is not terrorism by any definition. You do understand that the actual definition "terrorism" relates to the intent of the action, right? It's a violent act intended to cause fear and that has a political political purpose. I really don't get what you were trying to imply with that line. I believe that the crimes committed by these refugees, which according to surveys are illiterate and most likely unemployable (only slightly over 2% have been employed since Germany took the refugees in) have begun to take out their frustration on the civilians. It comes to a point where even the police fear areas where refugee areas, it comes to a point where they cannot persecute or even find them because they have any ID, basically they have no idea who the fuck they are. As for political agenda, I don't think they have any sort of collective agenda, but interviews with a few of them show some pretty crazy views. By no means am I implying that all refugees act like this, but the absolute explosion in crimes rates in Germany by refugees is undeniable. I'll give into your position in as much as to admit that there may indeed a problematic correlation between increase in crime and refugees (I haven't done the full research on it but I'll still assume it to be true for this argument) ... Even if you assume that to be true, that still doesn't make it "terrorism". Firstly, because most of these crimes aren't directly *intended* to generate fear in the population, that may be one of the consequence of the actions, it's not the original intent. Also, though many of these refugees have "pretty crazy views" (to quote you), unless you are trying to argue that the crimes are intended to promote their ideology or a political organization, it's not terrorism. Not to say that among the crimes committed, there aren't any acts of terrorism, there probably are, but it's a case by case study. Ironically, you were accusing people using the term "terrorism" to mean something that is not the actual definition when you yourself indulge in ignoring definitions. |
| So MAL's now editing other people's featured content? Last month they edited a review of my pal because someone found it too problematic. Tomorrow they might start editing your OP, the day after they might change your about me because it has anime tiddies or Trump on it, next day might even change your entire list for watching problematic anime. I came here to laugh at MAL talk about cartoons with my buddies and not fear being censored by some Neo-Nazi scum. |
 "Your sight, my delight. Will you marry me?" |
| Calls for violence. On an Anime site. Kicking X in the ass Call for viole...? What the fuck are you guys smoking? Also, being against politics in Anime when Anime is bedridden with it like any media is outright asking for water to not be wet.  |
Play League of Legends here! Autocrat said: Hitler was good, objectively. |
AlabastreAizo said: Pullman said: In the first place I don't think MAL articles about anime are a place for politics. It's just unnecessary, people come for the anime not the real-life baggage. I would probably have asked for a less political guideline from the start. There's a time and a place for everything. I think you had some reasonable statements—and in a lot of ways, we're on the same page—but I disagree with this point. People should be free to write whatever they wish. It is not your place to say what everyone comes here for. If people have an interest in discussing the politics of the anime industry, then what harm comes from allowing them a platform to have that discussion? If people don't want to have that discussion, they can merely avoid it if they're not being directly harassed by it. People are free to write what they wish, but MAL is also free to publish what they wish. If they wanted to make the articles a politics-free zone they have the right to do so. You can still write what you want but to have it published in a certain context requires compromises with the publishers. That's how these things work. It should have been discussed before publishing of course, but I don't think wanting politics to stay out of these articles is completely unreasonable in itself. And there are platforms on this site where you can discuss politics. Casual Discussion or Current Events for example. Or Clubs. Personally I just don't think what is essentially a listing article and a stab at real-life politics work well together. If you want to dedicate a whole article about something anime- and politics-related that's a different story, but the jab in this article in no way attempted to inspire discussion, it was mostly provocative which to me, no matter whether I agree with the ideological position, doesn't belong in a listing article. In any case that was just my opinion. I have no idea whether the writing staff wants to leave politics out of it or not so there's isn't much to gain in further discussing this imo. |
| I probably regret this post by now. |
Since when is kicking ass a non-violent act? You need to explain that to me. It's a synonym for beating someone up as far as I know. I'm sure the author wouldn't have been okay with an article saying 'And here, to inspire you for this real life thing I mentioned half a sentence ago, 10 anime about people beating up jews'. Which is basically what the author did, except with Nazis and a few more words in between. Also, being against politics in Anime when Anime is bedridden with it like any media is outright asking for water to not be wet. I said I'm against real-life politics in braindead listing articles and especially when it's just used to provoke. How you turned that into not wanting politics in the entirety of anime is beyond me. |
| I probably regret this post by now. |
AlabastreAizo said: As someone who went to a march against sexist and racist behavior last night in Tokyo, I hope that there are many others on this site against Neo-Nazi ideologies. Japan being "racist" is a good thing. It preserves their indigenous culture. If white countries did the same there wouldn't be a refugee crisis. While I don't agree with outright violence, I think native cultures need to be able to protect themselves from foreign influences. |
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Lost_Viking said: AlabastreAizo said: As someone who went to a march against sexist and racist behavior last night in Tokyo, I hope that there are many others on this site against Neo-Nazi ideologies. Japan being "racist" is a good thing. It preserves their indigenous culture. If white countries did the same there wouldn't be a refugee crisis. While I don't agree with outright violence, I think native cultures need to be able to protect themselves from foreign influences. We do need to make sure all those europeans finally leave america and their native population and indigenous culture alone :>. Immigration is an essential part of the history of prett much every country and culture. Culture isn't something static, and foreign influences don't destroy it, they make it able to keep evolving and staying alive. |
| I probably regret this post by now. |
| You are cancer to Japan and you are helping undermining their culture. Get the fuck ASAP out of there OP, you clearly don't belong to Japan with your degenerate thinking. "Nazis" don't even exist anymore. @Pullman, imigration is fine as long as it's not done in massive numbers encouraging their prosperity and growth, while the native population gets slowly outbred and culturally destroyed. Wink wink "genocide" |
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Pullman said: Immigration is an essential part of the history of pretty much every country and culture. Culture isn't something static, and foreign influences don't destroy it, they make it able to keep evolving and staying alive. What are the Ainu (who lived in Japan btw) and the Old Prussians among other groups? |
Lost_VikingJan 20, 2017 6:45 PM
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| @Pullman Since when is kicking ass a non-violent act? I'm not sure you understand what a "call to violence" is. It's not mentioning a violent act on another group, it's actively asking for a group to have violence inflicted upon them in a serious manner. There has to be a real threat too and it has to be imminent.Basically, intended, likely and imminent. I'm even giving you leeway by the fact I'm not actively reminding you of context. In a court of law, this would not even exist as a case. I'm sure the author wouldn't have been okay with an article saying 'And here, to inspire you for this real life thing I mentioned half a sentence ago, 10 anime about people beating up jews'. You're actively trying to be ridiculous here, right? I hope you are at least.inspiring you for this real life thing Please tell me you're joking. There's no validity behind this statement. I've mentioned the law, but actual incitements to violence do not actually work. More so on the Internet, on MAL, on an article about Nazis in Anime, etc. It's far too detached, it's too far away from a real situation, etc. That's why there has always been a push against censorship of "violent media", because there's no valid correlation. Anyway, I don't care which "group" is "targeted", that's not really relevant. I said I'm against real-life politics in braindead listing articles and especially when it's just used to provoke. Oh no, both the location and method was not of your liking, I am so sorry. Do you want a hug with the pity?So what if it's used to provoke? Provocation creates discussion anyway. Oh right, we're on MAL. Discussion can't be anything but stale. How you turned that into not wanting politics in the entirety of anime is beyond me. It's beyond me too. It's almost as if you mentioned how politics in an article about Anime that uses a subject stained to the brim by politics and is actually political should not exist. And to quote, the reason why is because it's a "braindead listing article", as if that somehow invalidates anything. |
Play League of Legends here! Autocrat said: Hitler was good, objectively. |
| Oh, Anime Feminist has to do with this? Where?! Where are the easy pickings?! |
Play League of Legends here! Autocrat said: Hitler was good, objectively. |
| Nazis were pretty horrible, but so many people on facebook were trashing Tanya The Evil for showcasing them or whatever.. Okay, hate nazis but don't allow it to make you despise a good anime that has yet to mention jews, hitler or anything close to the shit that went down in Germany. |
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| I knew I should never have posted here. The amount of fucks I give about this article and the amount of time I spent on this topic do not match up at all. I just wanted to give one simple opinion on the topic to stand next to the other opinions given, not start some debate about right or wrong in the writing industry. I'm out after this one. Immahnoob said: @Pullman Since when is kicking ass a non-violent act? I'm not sure you understand what a "call to violence" is. It's not mentioning a violent act on another group, it's actively asking for a group to have violence inflicted upon them in a serious manner. There has to be a real threat too and it has to be imminent.Basically, intended, likely and imminent. I'm even giving you leeway by the fact I'm not actively reminding you of context. In a court of law, this would not even exist as a case. This is not a court of law so who cares? The point is not that it would fit any legal definition. 'Hoping to inspire' might be far from being as direct as specifically asking someone to do something but it shows similar intentions so I still find it condemnable. You don't have to agree but, but it's silly trying to make it sound like I'm making up things when it's clearly in the text. The difference is in degree, not principle, which might matter for the law, but it doesn't have to matter for the publishing policy of a website. Or my personal stance on the matter. I'm sure the author wouldn't have been okay with an article saying 'And here, to inspire you for this real life thing I mentioned half a sentence ago, 10 anime about people beating up jews'. You're actively trying to be ridiculous here, right? I hope you are at least.inspiring you for this real life thing Please tell me you're joking. There's no validity behind this statement. He is clearly referncing the real-life rise of neo-nazis he mentioned right before that when he says 'To help you feel a bit better [about those real-life Neo-Nazis I just mentioned] and inspire you'. That's just basic syntax interpretation based on the given context. I've mentioned the law, but actual incitements to violence do not actually work. More so on the Internet, on MAL, on an article about Nazis in Anime, etc. It's far too detached, it's too far away from a real situation, etc. That's why there has always been a push against censorship of "violent media", because there's no valid correlation. When it comes to maintaining a public image it's not always about being reasonable, it's about being as little offensive as possible to avoid any negative backlash (unless the image you want to project says otherwise). That's just reality. Anyway, I don't care which "group" is "targeted", that's not really relevant. I said I'm against real-life politics in braindead listing articles and especially when it's just used to provoke. Oh no, both the location and method was not of your liking, I am so sorry. Do you want a hug with the pity?I'd be fine if you just acceptped it as one opinion among many on this topic and didn't try to make it seem like I want to make a law out of it and you need to stop me from doing so. I need your pity as much as I need your missionary drive to convince people to agree with you on every little detail. I'm fine with just having an oldfashioned, personal preference from time to time and not form every single opinion I have based on applied logics or the definitions of the law or whatever you're trying to do here. Yes, I think articles should focus on their main purpose and nothing else if possible and yes I don't like provocation as a method of communication because more often than not it just starts chain reactions of negative feedback that lead nowhere. Sue me. So what if it's used to provoke? Provocation creates discussion anyway. Oh right, we're on MAL. Discussion can't be anything but stale. That's a very optimistic outlook on provocation. It can lead to discussion, but most of the time it will just lead to negative feedback and people getting frustrated and hateful. I don't see any potential for discussion emanating from this particular line in this particular context which is why I'd request to remove it, if it was up to me. No upside, all downside. 'muh censorship' is not an argument against editors doing their job of making sure an article suits its purpose. How you turned that into not wanting politics in the entirety of anime is beyond me. It's beyond me too. It's almost as if you mentioned how politics in an article about Anime that uses a subject stained to the brim by politics and is actually political should not exist. And to quote, the reason why is because it's a "braindead listing article", as if that somehow invalidates anything. What it does is give a specific context to my disapproval. Which you then take away and generalize my opinion against my clear intentions. That's called twisting my words. But I'm sure you know that. As for why I just want a listing article to focus on listing, I just do. When I click on a listing article I expect a list of shows that fit the theme of the article with minimal information about them attached. Everything else is unnecessary baggage that just weighs the article down. When something I already find unnecessary is then used for needless provocations that serve no discussion purpose, I see no reason why I should approve. Is that so hard to understand? Apparently. |
AlcoholicideJan 20, 2017 7:56 PM
| I probably regret this post by now. |
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