| It's definitely getting lewder, but this isn't a breakthrough unless you just don't pay attention to this sort of shit. It's a natural progression that's been building up for decades now, not a recent development. Some OVA-era stuff like Dream Hunter Rem or Outlanders wouldn't even be considered an ecchi by most of our niche if they were released today, I'd wager, since through modern standards they'd barely constitute as being normal anime with some fanservice scenes here or there. Or, hell, Love Hina was a major international breakthrough that more or less started the transition from being primarily OVA to primarily TV - by 2003 or 2004 or so it was almost exclusively TV - and it's aged like milk because of how tame it is and how much some of its successors just execute the same concepts in a way that's infinitely more refined and less restrained. That said, Reviewers had a lot of roadblocks to airing, both domestically and abroad. It's important to note that stuff like that can be met with major resistance still, but overall, it's only getting lewder and lewder and that's absolutely nothing new with the genre. It's only been getting lewder since the fucking '80s. anyway fuck redo of healer and fuck that entire show's existence, fwiw also your cited examples following up the line "I've seen plenty of ecchi" just read off like you have very superficial experience with the genre that you're trying to pass off as more substantial than you could probably uphold imagine presenting yourself as having seen a lot of anime and then only being able to list stuff like demon slayer and attack on titan, it's not an issue but it's just kind of lmao |
ManabanJan 20, 2021 10:53 PM
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| idk but i dread this stupid anime, and also "peter and the philosophers stone" that was in the summer season I think. Jesus. And people still complaining about the rape in berserk. They dont glorify anything |
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| i mean u not wrong but theres plenty of this type of anime that have been released before soooo who cares more variety of hentai in anime hahaha |
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| I mean if it airs after 12:00 AM it doesn't hurt anyone. |
 Scordolo's Recent Reviews To your eternity Vanitas no Karte |
| I think it would be more accurate to say more series are made with the idea of premium channels in mind. For example the series referenced has 2 very different versions depending on which channel the anime is pulled from being the censored and uncensored versions (the censored version often notably having no reference to sex scenes). In addition short series inherently are cheaper to produce but it can get that pull for premium channels including the little noted aspect that they're often pulled from Josei series which tend to have few adaptations in general. From an overarching mentality I think nudity is less common in "mainstream" anime compared to say a couple decades ago, but they've become more comfortable with innuendos or lewd references for all levels of anime. So the more extreme series tend to stand out a lot more heavily. Edit: For some added reference to the short extreme series basically all of them originate from ComicFesta. |
GamerDLMJan 20, 2021 11:29 PM
ProfessionalNEET said: i did look for both versions, its same basically , well maybe the censored versión is for those who dont care about sex scenes and look for a history but seems like its same thing uncensored or censored, more fan service maybefirstawahono said: Kaifuku is not too extreme for me bcs it cencored almost everything, like simple naked girl with the damn black things It seems like you'd miss half the story with that censorship There are uncensored versions out there, if you know where to look. It's basically rape hentai, but without any visible genitals. |
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| It does not matter whether ecchi is getting more extreme, as ultimately it should be acceptable without delving into hentai territory. You'd have to wrestle with the dilemma that the west doesn't bat an eye for violent, gory scenes in most forms of entertainment. Does GTA glorify theft and shootings? That's what some middle aged parents with teenage children would say for all the past times a GTA game was released, yet look how these kids turned out. |
| Short Answer: No... Long Answer: No... |
| those 5 minute hentai anime are common imo they have that each season i remember few seasons ago there was XL Joushi and others i think those 5 minute hentai anime started like in early 2010s |
| Try reading this ecchi manga called Parallel Paradise, you will be amazed to know that it is only under ecchi. |
I am a useless student of society. Tests are my body and Grades are my blood. I have done over a thousand assignments. Unseen by teachers, nor done properly. Yet, those hands shall never hold an outstanding grade. So, as I pray... Unlimited Homeworks. |
Kenzolo-folk said: idk but i dread this stupid anime, and also "peter and the philosophers stone" that was in the summer season I think. Jesus. And people still complaining about the rape in berserk. They don't glorify anything last i checked Gutz was not the one raping people. the MC in redo hero is. however, there are a ton more reasons to dislike Redo hero then just the first two chapters. ( don't think even the author knows what he wants to do with the series besides more random sex.) anyway back on topic. honestly i don't care. if this means i can finally get Monster girl quest in a non terrible ova and a full anime adaptation for what has probably one of my favorite storylines from the VN's I've read (yes MGQ story is REALLY REALLY good the sex is actually the meh part of the series.) then i say let this trend continue. also where's my Franken Fran? as far as ecchi series for now i'll stick with to love ru darkness, Tsugumomo, high school DxD, and Ishuzoku Reviewers. |
GrimAtramentJan 21, 2021 1:25 AM
| "among monsters and humans, there are only two types. Those who undergo suffering and spread it to others. And those who undergo suffering and avoid giving it to others." -Alice “Beauty is no quality in things themselves: It exists merely in the mind which contemplates them; and each mind perceives a different beauty.” David Hume “Evil is created when someone gives up on someone else. It appears when everyone gives up on someone as a lost cause and removes their path to salvation. Once they are cut off from everyone else, they become evil.” -Othinus  |
| Nowadays anime exs will greenlight anything under the sun just because it has some specific tags and don't look anymore into it than that. I wouldn't be surprised if healer gets the reviewers treatment. |
| haganai is prude man's ecchi, you're better off browsing gelbooru for pics of blondie rich girl than watching the anime. ecchi is getting a bit more lewd but we still have few series airing each year |
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| Yeah redo of healer airs really late at night in Japan. Not sure if the anime made the rape scenes more fanservicey or not.. |
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| Abashiri Ikka was written 50 years ago and has a scene of a boy being swung around by his dick. I have no idea if that made it into the anime. |
| その目だれの目？ |
| Speaking as a fan of ecchi, to my observation it seems more like the opposite has been happening, that over the last 5-10 years they've been toning down the level of ecchiness in most mainstream anime, notwithstanding a few outliers like Interspecies Reviewers. There was definitely some envelope-pushing from the mid-2000s to the early 2010s but since then they've mostly been playing it safer. I don't know why... political correctness, maybe? Is anime still pretty much Japan making what Japan likes, or are they becoming more influenced by increasing awareness that anime is popular internationally, including in countries that are more puritanical about such things? (And what is the trend within Japan, anyhow?) |
A møøse once bit my sister... |
| who tf cares about your glorified rape bs let them be horny and why does it matter if there is a fine line between hentai and ecchi not like it rlly matters anyway dont be cringy just accept they have tits you know spotify covers can have tits on them... does that make it bad? nah man children these days look at tits as early as 12y/o not like its that bad anyway then. |
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| I think the lines are being blurred more and more but this stuff always existed its just not being shelved or put out as soft hentai anymore. I think its sorta two directions. The more extreme ecchi is being seen more but in general ecchi itself is a lot softer. Most ecchi is panty shots and innuendo these days but if you go back 10-20 years it was a lot of nudity in shows. Most ecchi to me has become the cute kind of ecchi where it is panty shots and a couple boob shots on average. It was a lot more sexual I think before. So maybe there is less middle ground and more ends of the spectrum going on than before. I think as anime goes west more it will become even more so as well. In the west there is this weird thing of political correctness that exists so our main media adheres to it but to counter act that we produce massive amounts of porn and "filthy" shit to pretty much balance society out. Anime is like to go more that way as it tries to appeal to that market. |
| insert interepseices reviewers here |
This post is brought to you by your local transfem gamer goblin. Will not tolerate bigotry and will fight against "anti-woke" sentiment to make the anime community a safer place.  |
| So, anyone that has seen the manga knows the anime is probably not going to be as graphic. Also, if you use mangadex (not sure about other sites) they have the tag "smut". I just checked and this series is tagged with sexual violence, smut, gore and ecchi. Which are all 4 of the more "graphic" tags iirc. I looked up the difference between ecchi, smut and hentai. Ecchi being story-driven with some lewd scenes/light nudity/panty flashes/etc. Smut being story-driven with some sex scenes. Hentai being sex-driven with some story scenes. Hopefully that helps. Edit: MAL does not have the smut/sexual violence tag iirc. |
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| Honestly I think that most porn (and softcore like ecchi) will trend to be more extreme/niche over time to stand out from the competition. That and the average coomer seeks out stuff that's more and more extreme over time to contentiously get pleasure from porn. But vanilla content (like just upskirts) won't go away or anything. |
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ProfessionalNEET said: You and @Manaban both brought up Outlanders. Could you by chance say what some of the more extreme elements in that show are? None. It's literally a couple of bath scenes and a couple of anime falls. The way it uses ecchi is heavily rooted in convention,never goes very far with it, is somewhat sparse throughout, and it's more focused on its space opera elements than any ecchi. It's fun, but if it had modern contemporaries instead of '80s OVA contemporaries then it'd look like it's pussyfooting around with this type of content and would fall more into "anime with fanservice" categorization instead of straight up ecchi. If you read me saying that it's an extreme show in this regard then you misinterpreted it, albeit I'm not sure if it's my fault because of word choice or your own that led to that. I legitimately question whether or not this other dude and I even watched the same show considering what he's saying. Old school ecchi in general is comparatively tame to modern ecchi and I still wonder where this narrative that the OVA era was more explicit comes from, as somebody who digs through old ecchi OVAs regularly. 'Specially saying it's returning to its roots when compared to shows like Reviewers or Redo of Healer, which...I kinda just can't say more than yeah, lmao, sure dude, whatever you say. Going back to old OVAs in general - sans maybe a couple of exceptions like Golden Boy, but those are the *exceptions* and not the norm - won't scratch the itch as well as modern stuff if you want fanservice. You'll have to pretty much watch them to appreciate from a historical perspective on the genre rather than because they hold up, because the majority of older ecchi has aged like milk in terms of sexualization. It's just not a genre that gets better by going way far back. Make no mistake, I like them because I like tracking the development of the genre as a whole and I like improving my perspective, not because as individual shows they can go toe to toe with even a mediocre ecchi from the late '00s or early '10s. They almost never can. That's just how it was back then. The industry was way more conservative with this type of content on average, probably because attitudes towards sex/porn were way more conservative 35 to 40 years ago the whole world round, Japan included. It certainly shows when you compare something like Outlanders to something like Asobi ni Iku Yo! in terms of ecchi, where they both have similar premises and styles of including fanservice but ecchi is considerably more prominent in the latter. |
ManabanJan 21, 2021 12:33 PM
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ProfessionalNEET said: Alderu said: So, anyone that has seen the manga knows the anime is probably not going to be as graphic. Also, if you use mangadex (not sure about other sites) they have the tag "smut". I just checked and this series is tagged with sexual violence, smut, gore and ecchi. Which are all 4 of the more "graphic" tags iirc. I looked up the difference between ecchi, smut and hentai. Ecchi being story-driven with some lewd scenes/light nudity/panty flashes/etc. Smut being story-driven with some sex scenes. Hentai being sex-driven with some story scenes. Hopefully that helps. Edit: MAL does not have the smut/sexual violence tag iirc. Huh, I wasn't aware of the distinction between ecchi and smut. BilboBaggins365 said: Compared to some old school ecchi titles like Outlanders as mentioned it's about par for the course. If anything that's more returning to the roots. Reviewers in general I really liked if we moved more towards content like that my interest in the genre would probably increase. I guess that is just making ecchi just basically hentai but in large I don't see the point of a lot of what is considered typical fanservice or what is common in a lot of ecchi shows. They fail at romance and they usually fail at being sexy too. At least more lewd stuff will succeed in the later category. As for Redo of the Healer saw some scenes honestly was kinda surprised they didn't censor more. I don't see how it's some sort of atrocity though consider the kinds of sexual content that has been allowed in mainstream shows. In terms of glorification of rape it's just a dumb borderline h-manga power fantasy or on the flip side sub fantasy. It's hard to take a show with that premise seriously (I mean it could be done though obviously it isn't going for a serious evaluation of someone like that) but to again imply the author is committing some moral misdeed is also ridiculous. Let the guy have his weird non con fetishes. If you want to bash it for poor writing go ahead but it's dumb to imply this is some moral evil that is going to create rapists. You and @Manaban both brought up Outlanders. Could you by chance say what some of the more extreme elements in that show are? Again you would have to define what you mean by extreme. I meant in the sense yeah it does have full blown nudity that is more shown compared to say panty shots and sex scenes granted it's way more implied in Outlanders not as much in the act compared to say reviewers.Though Outlanders is more of action adventure story than say Reviewers. Honestly the most extreme thing about the show was the gore which I didn't expect lol blows most stuff today out of the water but it was an OVA. I am just saying straight up nudity and sex isn't that rare in past ecchi titles. Edit: I think I just misunderstood entirely what you were getting at so feel free to ignore I don't know what my brain was thinking. Going to delete my other post so I don't take up space. I agree it got more extreme since maybe the 80s and 90s in the actual act of showing the sex pretty heavily (I thought you meant nudity for some reason). Though again in the last 12 years you had stuff like Aki Sora as I mentioned to Manaban which is about as sexual as Reviewers (full incest sex scenes, yuri/lesbian sex). So it depends on how recent you want to make this. Again that's just how MAL is defining ecchi and I am pretty sure (again some of these series are hazy in my memory) there is no depiction of genitals so even with all it's sexual content aki sora is an ecchi series. |
BilboBaggins365Jan 21, 2021 1:19 PM
Manaban said: ProfessionalNEET said: You and @Manaban both brought up Outlanders. Could you by chance say what some of the more extreme elements in that show are? None. It's literally a couple of bath scenes and a couple of anime falls. The way it uses ecchi is heavily rooted in convention,never goes very far with it, is somewhat sparse throughout, and it's more focused on its space opera elements than any ecchi. It's fun, but if it had modern contemporaries instead of '80s OVA contemporaries then it'd look like it's pussyfooting around with this type of content and would fall more into "anime with fanservice" categorization instead of straight up ecchi. If you read me saying that it's an extreme show in this regard then you misinterpreted it, albeit I'm not sure if it's my fault because of word choice or your own that led to that. I legitimately question whether or not this other dude and I even watched the same show considering what he's saying. Old school ecchi in general is comparatively tame to modern ecchi and I still wonder where this narrative that the OVA era was more explicit comes from, as somebody who digs through old ecchi OVAs regularly. 'Specially saying it's returning to its roots when compared to shows like Reviewers or Redo of Healer, which...I kinda just can't say more than yeah, lmao, sure dude, whatever you say. Going back to old OVAs in general - sans maybe a couple of exceptions like Golden Boy, but those are the *exceptions* and not the norm - won't scratch the itch as well as modern stuff if you want fanservice. You'll have to pretty much watch them to appreciate from a historical perspective on the genre rather than because they hold up, because the majority of older ecchi has aged like milk in terms of sexualization, it's not a genre that gets better by going way far back. Make no mistake, I like them because I like tracking the development of the genre as a whole and I like improving my perspective, not because as individual shows they can go toe to toe with even a mediocre ecchi from the late '00s or early '10s. They almost never can. That's just how it was back then. The industry was way more conservative with this type of content on average, probably because attitudes towards sex/porn were way more conservative 35 to 40 years ago the whole world round, Japan included. It certainly shows when you compare something like Outlanders to something like Asobi ni Iku Yo! in terms of ecchi, where they both have similar premises and styles of including fanservice but ecchi is considerably more prominent in the latter. I did I remember more scenes when going back but it's more than a few bath scenes you do have some after sex talk and nudity there when scanning through. Again that's why I asked what is the premise of it being more extreme. If it's nudity than no if it's the sexual acts sure. Edit: Also again I would probably argue you can find more weird and fetishitic stuff today outside of hentai but I don't feel the industry was ever more conservative about sex in general. Scenes in Rose of Versailes and LOTGH are more explicit than the average handling of a romance pairing today. |
BilboBaggins365Jan 21, 2021 12:38 PM
BilboBaggins365 said: I did I remember more scenes when going back but it's more than a few bath scenes you do have some after sex talk and nudity there when scanning through. Again that's why I asked what is the premise of it being more extreme. If it's nudity than no if it's the sexual acts sure. I mean yeah, the furry dude and that one chick *talk* about having sex, or at least it's heavily implied - which, hey, fair game, more natural than "yes we fuck huehue" - but heavily implying two characters have a sexual relationship via dialogue and outright showing this type of content are two different things entirely. I mean, if you find that implicit acknowledgement that two characters have had sex erotic, then fair game I guess, but that's an extremely niche fetish and probably wouldn't normally be interpreted as an erotic display in of itself. And outside of that? MC dude falls on the lead chick a couple of times, there's the bath scene(s), so on and so forth. In outright display it doesn't go very far whatsoever and would very much be tame. And showing will normally go a lot farther than just telling, especially when a type of content tends to be pretty heavily predicated on showing. It goes without saying that ecchi is very much a showing type of content. Also, Outlanders did have minor nudity, but again, that would only be exceptional relative to its contemporaries and most modern ecchi do floor it even in that department. Nudity in ecchi wasn't uncommon 10 years ago, let alone today. It just be how it be. |
ManabanJan 21, 2021 12:42 PM
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Manaban said: BilboBaggins365 said: I did I remember more scenes when going back but it's more than a few bath scenes you do have some after sex talk and nudity there when scanning through. Again that's why I asked what is the premise of it being more extreme. If it's nudity than no if it's the sexual acts sure. I mean yeah, the furry dude and that one chick *talk* about having sex, or at least it's heavily implied - which, hey, fair game, more natural than "yes we fuck huehue" - but heavily implying two characters have a sexual relationship via dialogue and outright showing this type of content are two different things entirely. I mean, if you find that implicit acknowledgement that two characters have had sex erotic, then fair game I guess, but that's an extremely niche fetish and probably wouldn't normally be interpreted as an erotic display in of itself. And outside of that? MC dude falls on the lead chick a couple of times, there's the bath scene(s), so on and so forth. In outright display it doesn't go very far whatsoever and would very much be tame. And showing will normally go a lot farther than just telling, especially when a type of content tends to be pretty heavily predicated on showing, like, y'know, ecchi. Again this probably is just me misunderstanding what the OP was getting at because for some reason I thought they were implying making a jump from say panty shots to nudity was a jump to an extreme. So fair I don't know what I was thinking when I read it because going back over what they said yeah I think it's a fair assertion by the OP depending on the time scale. Though again edited more to the last comment again you have more experiance but I mean if we are saying industry wide I don't feel the industry was more conservative as a whole. Ecchi sure probably has veered more towards being borderline hentai. Granted again depends on the time scale and what MAL defines as ecchi. Aki Sora is "ecchi" on MAL and that came out 12 years ago. That is probably a better case than say Outlanders. |
BilboBaggins365 said: Though again edited more to the last comment again you have more experiance but I mean if we are saying industry wide I don't feel the industry was more conservative as a whole. Ecchi sure probably has veered more towards being borderline hentai. Granted again depends on the time scale and what MAL defines as ecchi. Aki Sora is "ecchi" and that came out 11 years ago. Well, yeah, nothing I said wasn't to indicate that ecchi 10 years ago has the same standards as ecchi from 40 years ago, because it doesn't. But ecchi from 10 - 15 years ago does go a lot farther than ecchi from 35 to 40 years ago, and ecchi today probably goes farther than ecchi from 10 - 15 years ago. Modern ecchi is a bit of a blind spot for me, admittedly. I don't really watch it as much as older ecchi due to how so many of them are skewed so heavily on to that aspect to the point where they tend to lose any other type of appeal, whereas 5 or 10 to 15 years ago had the best balance between being multifaceted and featuring ecchi prominently, with '80s and most '90s OVAs going too far into the multifaceted bit over the ecchi. It's just not a total blind spot and I do have experience with a comfortable amount of it to assert that yeah, it does go farther on average than it did 10 years ago, just as ecchi from 10 years ago went further than ecchi from 20 years ago, so on and so forth. Yosuga no Sora and To LOVE-Ru were major problems back in the day. They both not only got met with more or less the same reaction regarding airing domestically as Reviewers did, but were inspected by the Tokyo Municipal Government regarding whether or not they were even safe to be distributed in the city itself. And neither of those shows go as far as Redo of Healer or Reviewers - neither are so heavily predicated on this type of content, and neither are as explicit. Same vein, something from just a few years ago like Masou Gakuen HxH or Sin: Nanatsu no Taizai (not the battle shounen) also are more heavily predicated on this type of content than Yosuga no Sora or To LOVE-Ru, and also go farther. The reason I prefer the former two over any of the other ones I've mentioned - even the only one out of the modern ones I mentioned that I like, Reviewers - is because they're more multifaceted and balanced. Ecchi and sexualization is very prominent, almost inseperable even, and yet they have more going on for them as well in regards to characterization, comedy, drama in YnS' case, etc. That balance doesn't seem to be as present in modern ecchi. Mind you, I typically oppose this type of stance because they tend to take it to ridiculous extremes on what constitutes lacking any other type of appeal. A lot of the time it's incredibly reductive bullshit that involves whittling the whole show down to its ecchi and then disregarding anything and everything else. I do think that it holds up a lot better when you point to these modern shows over ecchi from 10 - 15 years ago, though. I guess for modern ecchi that don't have this problem, there's like, Yuragi-sou no Yuuna-san and Tsugumomo, and those fit more in line with golden era ecchi. It's just that the former is considered a callback to that era of ecchi by a lot of people - kind of like how High School of the Dead was a callback to OVA-era ecchi and even used similar OVA-era ecchi conventions like extreme body shine and excessive gore and violence, it just featured sexualized content more explicitly than most of them - and the latter is literally from that era and just got an adaptation like, 10 years late. |
ManabanJan 21, 2021 12:58 PM
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Manaban said: BilboBaggins365 said: Though again edited more to the last comment again you have more experiance but I mean if we are saying industry wide I don't feel the industry was more conservative as a whole. Ecchi sure probably has veered more towards being borderline hentai. Granted again depends on the time scale and what MAL defines as ecchi. Aki Sora is "ecchi" and that came out 11 years ago. Well, yeah, nothing I said wasn't to indicate that ecchi 10 years ago has the same standards as ecchi from 40 years ago, because it doesn't. But ecchi from 10 - 15 years ago does go a lot farther than ecchi from 35 to 40 years ago, and ecchi today probably goes farther than ecchi from 10 - 15 years ago. Modern ecchi is a bit of a blind spot for me, admittedly. I don't really watch it as much as older ecchi due to how so many of them are skewed so heavily on to that aspect to the point where they tend to lose any other type of appeal, whereas 5 or 10 to 15 years ago had the best balance between being multifaceted and featuring ecchi prominently, with '80s and most '90s OVAs going too far into the multifaceted bit over the ecchi. It's just not a total blind spot and I do have experience with a comfortable amount of it to assert that yeah, it does go farther on average than it did 10 years ago, just as ecchi from 10 years ago went further than ecchi from 20 years ago, so on and so forth. Yeah I don't have enough experience with older ecchi. I just feel that a lot of older series (from what I have seen) were more relaxed with showing say stuff like nudity in general or even some relationships going further than how many titles handle it today. Again I am not pretending to be an expert. Plus I will say that while Reviewers technically isn't hentai because you don't see genitals I will agree it is way more like a straight up hentai and that is why i probably enjoyed it. Probably also why you feel more disillusioned with it. |
| @Manaban Is there a difference between ecchi anime and ecchi manga? I understand a lot of old manga had to be toned down for mainstream television. I've seen approximately 0 ecchi OVAs, but I was under the impression they had more freedom to push boundaries. Yet you're telling me they didn't? Though I haven't seen Interspecies Reviewers or Redo of Healer, I don't consider myself completely ignorant when it comes to ecchi. Go Nagai is easily the most outrageous writer I've come across, and he's been a part of the industry for over 50 years. |
| その目だれの目？ |
Lucifrost said: @Manaban Is there a difference between ecchi anime and ecchi manga? I understand a lot of old manga had to be toned down for mainstream television. I've seen approximately 0 ecchi OVAs, but I was under the impression they had more freedom to push boundaries. Yet you're telling me they didn't? Though I haven't seen Interspecies Reviewers or Redo of Healer, I don't consider myself completely ignorant when it comes to ecchi. Go Nagai is easily the most outrageous writer I've come across, and he's been a part of the industry for over 50 years. I'm not familiar with older ecchi manga nor do I know anything about the inner workings or restrictions of the OVA era, so no comment. I do know that older ecchi anime overall tended to be a lot more tame relative to modern contemporaries, and that's pretty much what I'm talking about here. If they did have more freedom than they do now, they certainly didn't capitalise on what they had to the same extent they do now. |
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| @Manaban Thank you for your input. You've seen the 70s Cutey Honey, right? Was it not tamer than OVAs of the 80s and 90s? Then again, I wouldn't say the Shin Cutey Honey OVA was particularly provocative either. I suppose faithful adaptations weren't as common back then. |
| その目だれの目？ |
Lucifrost said: @Manaban Thank you for your input. You've seen the 70s Cutey Honey, right? Was it not tamer than OVAs of the 80s and 90s? Then again, I wouldn't say the Shin Cutey Honey OVA was particularly provocative either. I suppose faithful adaptations weren't as common back then. Cutey Honey OG was way more tame than I expected it to be and my expectations were for it to be quite tame. |
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| Not as much as you might think. It's just not carying the stigma it used to in the past. Since 2017 I think there is just more ecchi, but not more of any particular kind of ecchi. It's just become easier to accept and you either brush off or accept gratefully. I still see it as something anime studios tip toe around. Not as much now, but it still is frowned upon. Personally I love it, better it than "IDOL or Isekai" anime at least. |
SofiaBulgaJan 21, 2021 6:06 PM
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| Yeah, I don't know if differentiating between smut/ecchi is a normal thing but I like the way that mangadex separates the two. Also, I like that it is referred to as "Content" rather than Genre. Separating "Content" from "Genre" and "Themes" is something I like to see because while using Genre Tags for things like Harem and Ecchi anime/manga is not semantically incorrect (it still deals with the subject matter) I feel like it just sounds strange. For example calling something an Ecchi Harem anime does not really give me any insight as to what it is about other than that the MC is a male and the main supporting characters are likely mostly female. Maybe no one cares, just my opinion, and this weird tangent might not belong here, but its something I didn't know I wanted to see until I saw it on the aforementioned sight. It could just be that MAL doesn't want to use a Smut tag, as it arguably carries a bit of a negative connotation with it. Who knows. As for the topic, I think that as anime/manga become more popularized, especially being introduced to more western streaming services like Netflix, that the animanga community has just grown as a whole and that as a result of this, seeing more ecchi content is less "taboo"? |
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| 90s anime were similar. We are just going back to basics. |
Anime was it's best 20000 years ago, when cavemen drew art with real depth. Modern anime is all garbage. I miss great old days of anime. |
| Yeah it is, I guess those anime just want to be more different and have more impact than their average ecchi anime so more daring = more views = more $$$ for them. Just my wild guess. |
 (っ◔◡◔)っ 𝓘 𝔀𝓲𝓼𝓱 𝔂𝓸𝓾 𝓪𝓵𝓵 𝓱𝓪𝓿𝓮 𝓪 𝔀𝓸𝓷𝓭𝓮𝓻𝓯𝓾𝓵 𝓭𝓪𝔂 ♥ |
| if you think this shits bad man you need to explore some more 90s OVAs. At least this shit takes it so far it doubles back into so bad it's good territory, one would find it harder to make the same argument for some of the fucked up shit that came out in the 90s. |
MoonDragon72 said: It never was anything else. The very first ecchi series to ever be broadcast on TV was Cream Lemon: Lemon Angel. It's a spin-off of the 80s dominant hentai franchise, Cream Lemon made by the same people after talking TV executives into the invention of the "late night anime TV slot" in the late 1980s. A marketing concept which was lucrative for both, and which exists ever since.Ecchi is basically just softcore hentai nowadays The business logic was the same back then and today. Live action in Japan always had JAV (full porn) and Gravure Idol (soft porn). The same relation applies to hentai and ecchi, always has. Of course there are degrees of soft porn, because there are PG-13 and PG-17 and R TV slots to fill. The advent of digital niche TV now allows very narrow audiences / fetishes to technically become TV anime, thus R+ and Rx now have a TV market. This merely is a technical difference, content formerly published as OVA now becomes pay-channel TV. OVA always was far more extreme than TV anime. tl:dr Technical progress in commercial streaming brings former OVA content to TV. Ecchi to hentai is the same as Gravure Idol to JAV videos, which is the business / industry line in Japan for live action porn since 50+ years. So no, little changed. It's just more visible in the age of widely available streaming. |
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inim said: tl:dr Technical progress in commercial streaming brings former OVA content to TV. Ecchi to hentai is the same as Gravure Idol to JAV videos, which is the business / industry line in Japan for live action porn since 50+ years. So no, little changed. It's just more visible in the age of widely available streaming. Please. You can literally just thumb through this site's Database, under the seasons category, and can see where ecchi anime like, iunno, Iketeru Futari started going on TV back in '98, then Love Hina was an international breakthrough in '00, then by '04 pretty much everything ecchi anime was being released on TV and the ecchi OVA was an afterthought instead of the primary medium for the genre. Ecchi transitioned to being primarily television several years before the rise of streaming services, and that's not something anybody in this thread will even have to go that far to find out. Pay-channels TV weren't nearly prominent enough during the timeframe when the ecchi OVA started dying out to be the root cause of it - since it could very much be argued that it started making the transition as far back as '98, and certainly not later than '00. I guess this is just another post to toss into the "Inim is making shit up again" pile, though. Also just lmao at the mere idea that OVA era ecchi is more extreme than TV era ecchi. I've already said my piece about that in this thread, but every time I see someone say it, it just makes me question whether or not they've actually watched anything from the OVA era or if they just add it to their list as filler and then work off of assumptions when they talk about it. I can see where the assumption comes from - direct-to-video will typically feature content that isn't allowed to air on TV in most mediums - but it's not applicable here. I don't know why, but every old ecchi OVA I can rattle off will be tame compared to stuff even from 10 years ago, let alone today. Be it fuckin' Outlanders and that whole discussion we had above or be it Jungle de Ikou! or whatever. Ecchi OVAs back in the day didn't tend to go as far with sexual content, and they didn't feature it nearly as prominently - hell, most of them probably wouldn't even be considered ecchi to modern sensibilities just on account of how sparse ecchi content actually is within them. @MoonDragon72 just because he quoted you, i might as well spam your notifications as well |
ManabanJan 22, 2021 9:46 AM
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| I think it is due to an increased tolerance towards depiction of actions that were once seen as taboo in media portrayal. Back in the day, we had movies where a target just falls over after being shot and promptly assumed dead. No blood shown. Nowadays we have anime/manga that depict actual cannibalism and ripping apart organs in a rain of blood. Same can be said for ecchi. Because people just want the next big thing. When you spend a certain amount of time showing these things, people are initially shocked but just get adjusted to it. So more and more graphic portrayals of violence and sexual acts are needed to shock the viewers. |
FrozenLichJan 22, 2021 9:46 AM
| Best ending line in anime history = "My name is Saiki Kusuo. I am a psychic." |
| As a whole? No. There are so many "ecchi" shows coming out that are afraid to draw a damn female nipple, while they were commonplace in even kids shows in the 80s. This may seem like a weird hill to die on, but if you're gonna show me all of a boob, what is the difference in drawing the thing that gives it a purpose? |
| "No, son, you may not have your body pillow at the dinner table!" |
l--_--l said: \Try reading this ecchi manga called Parallel Paradise, you will be amazed to know that it is only under ecchi. Idk probably because it has a plot of some sort that's why they put into echhi. these days, as long as the guys dick is not shown, its not hentai |
| "Nobody is stronger than me, even when I go easy on them. Remember that" - Ayanokoji Kiyotaka |
| Read the Adult Webtoon, 'Close as neighbors". Its a masterpiece ecchi/hentai. |
| "Nobody is stronger than me, even when I go easy on them. Remember that" - Ayanokoji Kiyotaka |
| There seems to be some confusion on how old mature (pornographic) content in anime really is. Here's the timeline. Mature content closely follows the availability of channels to sell it to adult customers. When I grew up in the 1970s (and was a teenager in the 1980s), only afternoon TV slots for anime existed. So outside cinema, there was no distribution channel for anime not targeted at children, which naturally do not contain explicit content. This changed only in 1987, when the first mature TV slot was created and TV ecchi became economically d feasible. Similar for OVA distribution. With the advent of the VHS video market in the early 80s the "direct to video market" came into existence. It created an incredible boom of adult content not only in anime, it also marks the golden era of zombie and splatter movies, and live action porn movies. The OVA made it possible to produce and market anime on channels not available to kids and teens, and fundamentally changed the content and created a whole new industry. Timeline: 1969: First hentai anime movie Senya Ichiya Monogatari 1973: First periodical erotic manga magazine Ero Mangatropa 1976: Market introduction of NTSC-VHS home video in Japan 1980: Market introduction of PAL-VHS home video in Europe 1983: First commerical OVA released Dallos 1983: Explicit sex scene in non-hentai mass market anime movie Golgo 13 1984: First commerical hentai OVA released Lolita Anime 1984: First serialized OVA hentai franchise Cream Lemon 1986: All out rape, cannibalism and necrophilia in non hentai OVA Violence Jack: Harlem Bomber-hen 1987: First late night anime TV slot, first TV ecchi anime Cream Lemon: Lemon Angel 1992: First ecchi licensed and sold in the USA Mamono Hunter Youko 1993: First hentai licensed and sold in the USA Choujin Densetsu Urotsukidouji 1997: AT-X (TV network) founded as subsidary of Tokyo TV as a station specialized in mature anime 2000: Mass-market introduction of the DVD 2000s: Broadband cable becomes a mass market commodity Arguably the most explicit non-hentai content (as in R+ vs. Rx MPAA-raings) in anime is from the 1980s OVA boom. Examples: Kizuoibito (1986), Crying Freeman (1988), Dokushin Apartment Dokudami-sou (1989), or Violence Jack: Evil Town (1986). The key difference is that most content was in a genre called exploitation, i.e. the sexualized version of GAR. The all adult casts and mature stories did not appeal to children and teenagers. Ecchi as we define it today is not based on GAR, but the sexualized version of comedy and romantic comedy. Early and influential examples which still were tame enough for children's TV slots are Urusei Yatsura (1981) and Maicching Machiko-sensei (1981). The OVA equivalents include Dream Hunter Rem (1987), Project A-Ko (1986), both spin-offs from hentai franchises. In direct comparison of the first TV ecchi (Lemon Angel, 1987) and Interspecies Reviewers (2020), there's almost no difference in the themes and degree of explicitness of single episodes. Rape, tentacle rape, mushrooms phallic symbolism, pedophilia, and so on occur in both. The explotation type titles are far more explicit than any ecchi tagged show I'm aware of. The differentiation of hentai and ecchi didn't really exist back in the 1980s and early 1990s. There are numerous hentai titles which arguably would qualify as ecchi today, and vice versa. The line was basically explored and established during that period, it didn't yet exist. Examples: Momoko or Rance: Sabaku no Guardian. Notable R+ comedic titles with soft porn elements were created which clearly did no longer qualifiy for TV or children. Junk Boy (1987), Minna Agechau♡ (1987), or 1+2=Paradise (1990). During the 90s the growing trend was to find legal forms of soft porn marketable to teenagers, who for biological reasons have a huge demand. There were scantly clad fantasy heroines and romantic comedy. This eventually evolved into the diversified ecchi landscape where a formula for each TV slot age rating (PG-13, PG-17, PG-R, PG-R+) exists and is legally well tested as in what can be shown. Many of that soft porn targeted at teens uses teenage settings and age-adequate fantasies (harems, high school, peeping tom, accidental groping and so on) whereas content targeted at adult audiences has a more realistic approach (prostitution, sex in relations like marriage, diverse fetish fantasies). |
inimJan 23, 2021 4:12 AM
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