| Digibro lamented on the widespread production of mediocre anime in one of his videos, he mentioned that anime like the ones from light novels are inferior to classic anime like Akira and such because they aren't something you would show your family members or something along those lines. My question is, why does he and other people feel like anime has an obligation to present titles and content that appeal to the more mainstream tastes and not simply to whatever demographic they wish to target? Like, for example I know some people are turned off from One Piece because of the sexualized designs of the female characters, but I don't write letters to Eiichiro Oda or Toei Animation to turn the fanservice down so I can show One Piece to my mom without feeling embarrassed bla bla bla, because the author can do what he wants and I don't need the approval of the general public to like something. Same thing goes for people who avoid anime because they think it's all ecchi incest lolicon shit, I don't blame ecchi lolicon shit for anime having a bad reputation, I blame people who make stupid generalizations about anime as a whole and don't bother looking for anime they might like. |
| mainstream means more customers so more profit that the anime industry cares more about |
| Since never. Just Digibro making an absurd statement, specially if you consider that he is into artsy and avant-garde anime. |
| ignore Digidumbass, though if you don't make a thread about him I imagine someone else will |
| Since when were we obligated to care about anything Digibro says? NihilisticLoner said: I'd rather spend 4 hours writing my book then 4 hours searching for a mecha anime I might like. You write a book? |
I'm a shitposter for fun |
dehuman said: mainstream means more customers so more profit that the anime industry cares more about Also, a worse product. Anime shouldn't go mainstream or it will risk horrendous censorship and Western pressure at the source unlike now where it's only affecting licenses and localization. One look at Glitter Force will tell you why anime never should become fully mainstream. |
 |
NihilisticLoner said: SuperRed said: because they aren't something you would show your family members or something along those lines. Incorrect. He was talking about how light novel adaptations wouldn't appeal to something like a family member, because of their general style, look, tropes, etc. Which will your family member be more likely to watch? Akira or Konosuba? And then he mentioned Urotsukidoji. |
NihilisticLoner said: People who like him do? I mean I'm a big fan of his content, but I don't always agree, or even care, about what he says. Fair point Lol, there's actually this kid at my school who wrought a 200+ page book in spite after an argument about how you can't build a society on narcissists or something. |
| I'm a shitposter for fun |
| It's not. It's just one/n amount of people's opinion on the internet. It's more than welcome to appeal to mainstream tastes, but no way is it obligated to. |
Least degenerate visual novel enjoyer.  |
| @NihilisticLoner holy shit, that was kind of ignorant and dumb.... NihilisticLoner said: SuperRed said: because they aren't something you would show your family members or something along those lines. Incorrect. He was talking about how light novel adaptations wouldn't appeal to something like a family member, because of their general style, look, tropes, etc. Which will your family member be more likely to watch? Akira or Konosuba? both, one because heavy violance when the other is depressing helpless stress undertone with heavy fanservice... tbh, if my kids already 13 years old, i would let them watch both... NihilisticLoner said: SuperRed said: My question is, why does he and other people feel like anime has an obligation to present titles and content that appeal to the more mainstream tastes and not simply to whatever demographic they wish to target? Because those, "whatever demographics" are always only ONE demographic: anime fans. There's only 1 Mushishi, but 50 fucking Isekai Smartphones. It's unfair for the 1st demographic. Smartphone anime only sold less than 2K even for it's first volume, mushishi season 2 sold 4K in average, season 1 is 11K IIRC... the disparity even more noticable in manga when in 2007, they sold 4 million copies with more than 400K per volume, smartphone? they barely break 10K per volume... ______________________________________________ NihilisticLoner said: SuperRed said: I blame people who make stupid generalizations about anime as a whole and don't bother looking for anime they might like. Because those people can waste their time on much better things, then spend hours searching for something they might like, in a media they are not familiar with? I'd rather spend 4 hours writing my book then 4 hours searching for a mecha anime I might like. Anime is not targetted towards me.. REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE...*write 10 paragraph useless rant how it's wrong anime not cater towards theri "supperior" taste* you and digibro is selfish AF.... you aren't market for anime yet you want them to cater towards you? you demand something impossible... rather than do useless rant, just change medium which more targetted towards you like what i am doing....barely watch anime for 2 year, has no regretes... |
 "If taking responsibility for a mistake that cannot be undone means death, it's not that hard to die. At least, not as hard as to live on." |
| no one should be allowed to use the anime should go mainstream argument when there's 1 fcking blatantly casual and easy for anime newbie fans of anime , show airing rn but people who much rather watch tg:re to care about it since ofc, no one actually cares about anime going mainstream also not like 4 yrs ago, we just had an anime made for america, and that just went about just as you would expect, thus, fck off america |
| Hottest Take Ever, fite me: Fairy Tail is better than Seiya, Bungou Stray and Hitman Reborn |
| Man, the thread over just stopped getting as much attention more or less, why we gotta restart the discussion over it. |
 |
| I mean by definition anime already appeals to the mainstream taste of its fans. Or else it wouldn't be nearly as successful of an industry as it is now and Digibro wouldn't be able to complain about overgeneralizations like LN adaptations and make a profit by doing so. Anime however has never had an obligation to target the mainstream tastes of people who have no interest in anime. If somebody hates animation, thinks it's childish, etc. the answer isn't to shift gears to that niche the answer is to ignore that demographic. |
| your biggest mistake here is listening to anything the lolicon hobo says. |
Edward Elric > your waifu  |
| i had no idea you were this fucking reasonable until you made that thread about the double standard towards ecchi/fanservice wow.. thank you again... anyway... because people are pussies who are afraid of being judged, so they think japan needs to bow down to western societal norms |
   |
umashikaneko said: dehuman said: mainstream means more customers so more profit that the anime industry cares more about Late-night anime have flourished by appealing to non-mainstream audience from the very beginning(the early 2000s). It became difficult for an anime to gain 10%+ viewership in the 1990s, so they started to make and air anime that with the small but dedicated fanbase aka otaku using anime as commercials of DVD or other merchandise. The existence of late-night anime TV blocks was hardly known to normies in the early 2000s in Japan. Have you watched Genshiken? I think that anime depict what late-night anime was in the early to mid 2000s which is basically the foundation of today's anime fan culture. Normies were not even aware of the existence of anime for non-kids those days. that means even in japan anime is slowly becoming mainstream and that is why we hear record breaking yearly profit for the anime industry this past few years http://www.crunchyroll.com/anime-news/2017/10/24/anime-industry-income-hits-29-trillion-yen-milestone |
SuperRed said: My question is, why does he and other people feel like anime has an obligation to present titles and content that appeal to the more mainstream tastes and not simply to whatever demographic they wish to target? Like, for example I know some people are turned off from One Piece because of the sexualized designs of the female characters, but I don't write letters to Eiichiro Oda or Toei Animation to turn the fanservice down so I can show One Piece to my mom without feeling embarrassed bla bla bla, because the author can do what he wants and I don't need the approval of the general public to like something. Same thing goes for people who avoid anime because they think it's all ecchi incest lolicon shit, I don't blame ecchi lolicon shit for anime having a bad reputation, I blame people who make stupid generalizations about anime as a whole and don't bother looking for anime they might like. Though I do think this is one of my favorite things I've ever seen someone say on this board, now that I look back at this thread. Kind of highkey feel like a dumbass for complaining now xP But yeah, I like this. And I get being frustrated with people grouping you into something you're not, too, that's totally understandable to me and I don't like it when it happens to me either, but it feels like it'd be misdirected anger in cases like that and that it's better to take the anger out on, y'know, the people being assholes and mislabeling you and not people who just like stuff some others may find strange or weird. That sort of "isolate them for other people being assholes" mindset is cancer, and it does apply to fans outside of just ecchi fans or what have you, albeit ecchifans and fujos and such seem to be the primary targets. |
ManabanApr 12, 2018 6:54 PM
|
Which will your family member be more likely to watch? Akira or Konosuba? None, because one is a 90's plotless gorefiesta and the other is a parody that expects you to knwo isekai tropes and what is a JRPG. Because those, "whatever demographics" are always only ONE demographic: anime fans. There's only 1 Mushishi, but 50 fucking Isekai Smartphones. It's unfair for the 1st demographic. OK, list me those 50 Isekai Smartphones, i'll wait. |
| And also, i don't think we should take (((Digibro)))'s personal opinions that seriously. |
Scarlett_ryuken said: no one should be allowed to use the anime should go mainstream argument when there's 1 fcking blatantly casual and easy for anime newbie fans of anime , show airing rn but people who much rather watch tg:re to care about it since ofc, no one actually cares about anime going mainstream also not like 4 yrs ago, we just had an anime made for america, and that just went about just as you would expect, thus, fck off america Would you tell me which one? 30chlimitbs |
Scarlett_ryuken said: no one should be allowed to use the anime should go mainstream argument when there's 1 fcking blatantly casual and easy for anime newbie fans of anime , show airing rn but people who much rather watch tg:re to care about it since ofc, no one actually cares about anime going mainstream also not like 4 yrs ago, we just had an anime made for america, and that just went about just as you would expect, thus, fck off america ANIME is not mainstream. SOME ANIME are mainstream. How many "average Joe's" know KonoSuba? Kobayashi-san? Madoka Magica? Kill la Kill? Made in Abyss? And i haven't said a single "underground" title. |
TheMoeHater said: Scarlett_ryuken said: no one should be allowed to use the anime should go mainstream argument when there's 1 fcking blatantly casual and easy for anime newbie fans of anime , show airing rn but people who much rather watch tg:re to care about it since ofc, no one actually cares about anime going mainstream also not like 4 yrs ago, we just had an anime made for america, and that just went about just as you would expect, thus, fck off america Would you tell me which one? 30chlimitbs lupin the 3rd literally show that has >loveable chars >good action fck, this season's lupin even has an ongoing plot for the first 2 eps, so the episodic excuse can't even be used anymore you know why no one is watching it? cause there isnt any youtuber circlejerking about it, and people like digi dont dare talk about it, cause it would disprove their point there's no anime with mainstream appeal anymore |
| Hottest Take Ever, fite me: Fairy Tail is better than Seiya, Bungou Stray and Hitman Reborn |
thewiru said: Scarlett_ryuken said: no one should be allowed to use the anime should go mainstream argument when there's 1 fcking blatantly casual and easy for anime newbie fans of anime , show airing rn but people who much rather watch tg:re to care about it since ofc, no one actually cares about anime going mainstream also not like 4 yrs ago, we just had an anime made for america, and that just went about just as you would expect, thus, fck off america ANIME is not mainstream. SOME ANIME are mainstream. How many "average Joe's" know KonoSuba? Kobayashi-san? Madoka Magica? Kill la Kill? Made in Abyss? And i haven't said a single "underground" title. never said it was mainstream, in fact, im arguing that it isnt <.< at least in murica land, since in europe, good anime like lupin actually fcking get their recognition :> |
| Hottest Take Ever, fite me: Fairy Tail is better than Seiya, Bungou Stray and Hitman Reborn |
velvetPhos said: The problem isn’t that all anime need to appeal to masses. Rather it’s the problem of lack of shows that appeal to masses. And how many or what sort of percent do you expect? Because shows that appeal to masses still exist, and they are not exactly difficult to find. Of course, if we are fair and take for granted that anime is inherently niche in the West by default due to its complicated relationship with: -Animation as a medium -A product from a foreign culture that reflects trends and interests of that specific culture |
| Wait, so is the stereotypical fanservicey/tropey/LN/VN/etc. type of stuff, is that considered "mainstream" or not? Because I've heard people argue it both ways:
|
| Avatar character is Gabriel from Gabriel DropOut. |
NihilisticLoner said: I'm talking about general appeal. only in the US they freaked out by some tits and ass.... they aren't even main consumer of anime... NihilisticLoner said: I wasn't talking about sales. I was talking about how there are 100s of anime similar to Isekai Smartphone, but barely that resembled Mushishi. For people who like stuff like Mushishi, it's unfair. late night anime main market is small dedicated fanbasses... also stuff like mushishi do always being made.... it's just rarely getting adapted as anime... NihilisticLoner said: When have I ever complained on this thread that anime wasn't catering towards MY taste? I'm still finding plenty of anime that cater towards my taste. Just finished In This Corner in the World, and it was fucking amazing, AND it's the TYPE of movie that could appeal to non-anime fans, because it's not quirky, obnoxious, loud, over-the-top in any way, like most anime are. I'm criticizing the industry for only targeting a very specific group of people. The only people anime seems to be marketed towards to are anime fans who've watched plenty of everything. The problem? Less demographics = less money. So it's actually also a problem for the creators to. becaus ethey are the one actually giving money? that's how is it... it's capitalism... they targetted towards the one who pay.... if you wnat your voice be heard, then be a market... seriously, that's how industry works... |
"If taking responsibility for a mistake that cannot be undone means death, it's not that hard to die. At least, not as hard as to live on." |
| Since when does Digibro ever understand the anime industry? I don't personally think he ever has. This isn't the first time he's stated "Japanese taste is trash. Why can't they like the shit I like? The anime industry would be better if it just catered to my own needs." Anime, just like anything, has its own niche. Sure, some anime like Sazae-san and Ghibli movies are made for a mainstream Japanese audience and ones like Pokemon, Dragon Ball, and Sailor Moon are made in a way that they can appeal to the mainstreams of many different countries and cultures, but for the most part anime is made for anime fans in Japan and it's only really accidentally become popular among Western fans who like the same things as Japanese otaku do. Digibro is wrong, everyone making something creative needs to understand their audience, if everything was only meant for mainstream taste people will less common taste would feel like they were missing out for not enjoying full media like anime, movies, video games, ect. |
  |
| Nonono, Digibro has a point. We need more anime... to cater to my tastes. Bring out the Fakes! We need more gay murder mysteries! We need more gay murder mysteries! ...In all reality, though, of course not all the stuff's going to appeal to the "mainstream." If it did, we'd have a million Sword Art Online copycats...oh wait. I feel like the idea of "appealing to the mainstream" means something different than what everyone else is thinking. Anime is a niche, and the OVAs that Digibro wants is a niche of a niche. That's the problem. If the anime industry catered purely towards his tastes (or mine), it wouldn't be able to support itself. It's because it does cater to the mainstream (or, at least, to what's popular) that it can support the modern niche stuff. |
| And thats why i dont watch videos of anime youtubers. U will just get brainwashed and create such type of threads. |
 |
| Depends on your definition of mainstream here. Western mainstream? Not at all and they also won't cater to them. Japanese mainstream? They are not obligated, but they obviously do cater to them because that's where the money is. And there's nothing wrong with that. |
| Only battle shounens are doing that. |
 |
NihilisticLoner said: Kuma said: only in the US they freaked out by some tits and ass.... they aren't even main consumer of anime... I wasn't JUST talking about tits and ass. Kuma said: late night anime main market is small dedicated fanbasses... also stuff like mushishi do always being made.... it's just rarely getting adapted as anime... We're talking about ANIME. So no, we're not getting more Mushishi ANIME. Kuma said: becaus ethey are the one actually giving money? that's how is it... it's capitalism... they targetted towards the one who pay.... if you wnat your voice be heard, then be a market... seriously, that's how industry works... Foreigners still buy figurines. I keep hearing about how anime is actually also niche in Japan. I mean, how could something like Isekai Smartphone appeal to a mass audience, even in JAPAN? How would it be taken seriously? Regardless of nationality, I'm pretty sure something like Death Note will have a much higher chance to appeal to a 100 middle aged people who don't consume anime constantly. again, different culture have different taste and reality they has... anime (what mostly produced today) is niche but dedicated fanbasses... and it's not for no reason, economic depression during 00's make shift towards it... now late night anime equally produced same amount that normal airing time.... so does that mean japan it self taste generally also like that? again it isn't, only overpriced, pricy maked niche late night anime... anime simply isn't that profitable for non dedicated fanbasses for now... manga still pumping stuff like mushishi (tho not in same names for respect to authors).... @umashikaneko explain it far better than me... and another thing to note, again, outsider profit is only contributed 1/3 of total oversea profit which more than half of it is owned by korea and china alone.... number even much significanly lower to money which actually goes to anime studio, since most money is went to production comitee instead.... you are asking the impossibility for now.... who know the future, but i simply explain why anime become state like now... |
"If taking responsibility for a mistake that cannot be undone means death, it's not that hard to die. At least, not as hard as to live on." |
| Saw digibro, I quickly stopped reading further. Your concern is heard, now fall back in line. |
SuperRed said: Digibro lamented on the widespread production of mediocre anime in one of his videos, he mentioned that anime like the ones from light novels are inferior to classic anime like Akira and such because they aren't something you would show your family members or something along those lines. My question is, why does he and other people feel like anime has an obligation to present titles and content that appeal to the more mainstream tastes and not simply to whatever demographic they wish to target? Like, for example I know some people are turned off from One Piece because of the sexualized designs of the female characters, but I don't write letters to Eiichiro Oda or Toei Animation to turn the fanservice down so I can show One Piece to my mom without feeling embarrassed bla bla bla, because the author can do what he wants and I don't need the approval of the general public to like something. Same thing goes for people who avoid anime because they think it's all ecchi incest lolicon shit, I don't blame ecchi lolicon shit for anime having a bad reputation, I blame people who make stupid generalizations about anime as a whole and don't bother looking for anime they might like. Mainstream is also a demographic, kinda.. |
on 
| Why is anime obligated to be mainstream? According to mainstream media these days, it has to or its sexist and gatekeeping. Digibro ... Just ignore the douche. |
| Good to see mal is keeping up the trend of misrepresenting Digibro's points and twisting whatever he says in a way that makes it easy for you to shit on him. I get that Digibro's elitist an obnoxious, but you guys are worse. |
| No entertainment medium should be obligated to cater exclusively to mainstream tastes. That's frankly how stagnation happens. New ideas should be encouraged, regardless of how out there and inaccessible they may seem at the time. Regardless, the light novel adaptations Digi was moaning about are catered towards mainstream audiences. That being said, they do have their place (as does all media, good and bad) and their target audience should be allowed to enjoy them without being given shit for it. We've all got different tastes after all. |
Take care of yourself |
| No one is forcing anyone to update their business model and products in such a way as to appeal to a broader audience in order to escape the current hellscape the industry is currently in. The word "obligation" is a little much! The anime industry is free to remain stagnant and continue its poor practices. |
| There is absolutely no reason why I should accept "turn your brain off" as a valid excuse to defend a poor show. ~ blatant ad: https://myanimelist.net/blog/Crusader_8 I spend the time to write it, so please read it lol |
| thank god japan doesn't care about digibro and mainstream tastes. thank god. |
  "elles sont bien noires les pensées des nuits blanches"  |
| why, because they might take a chance and find as much success as Shinkai and Miyazaki if they did? What an awful future that would be, to strive to make high-quality anime with worldwide appeal that doesn't rely on inside jokes and esoteric cultural exposition. |
| There is absolutely no reason why I should accept "turn your brain off" as a valid excuse to defend a poor show. ~ blatant ad: https://myanimelist.net/blog/Crusader_8 I spend the time to write it, so please read it lol |
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