| I hate to bring this up, because i really do not like talking bout legal issues when it comes to distributing, downloading and providing anime across the web. Because its something we all do on here and its a part of our community. I am in no way trying to act like an internet police, i am just trying to find out from others what their are thoughts our on this subject matter. To me its a very confusing subject, and alot of different sites have their own legal terms in regards to how it works. So i just wanted to hear some other people's opinions that have been around the block more and be able to discuss information on this matter concerning the real legal issues concerned with downloading anime or illegally distributing it for sites like bakabt I just know the facts bout the law stating it and yet how do sites get away with it, like MAL even though we do not violate any terms of legal activity on here, we still promote the illegal activity by providing such torrent links on certain clubs and what not. I mean in my understanding their is no wiggle room, you either follow the laws or you don't. But yet sites justify their own rules concerning legal activity. Technically it ISN'T legal for you to watch or read ANY anime or manga online (downloaded or streaming). Unless it is from an official distributor who has the license like http://www.theanimenetwork.com/ . Downloading anime or watching them on places like crunchyroll are in direct violation with copyright law (This how ever changed later on due to only providing legal streaming of series that have not been released or licensed yet) The only reason that you can get away with it is everyone thinks it is OK to watch unlicensed stuff) is because there is no one in the states to prosecute you. There is no money interest in Geneon or ADV or whoever to tell you to take down anime if they don't have a license so they don't. THAT DOESN'T MAKE WATCHING IT ANY LESS ILLEGAL. If you are watching unlicensed stuff however, the chances that you are going to get into trouble are less than a thousandth of one percent. So while you won't get into any trouble- but it is still illegal. I mean the law states ANYTHING that is copyrighted, distributed or shared, or what ever that is licensed by another company in the US is ILLIGAL, cut plain and dry, simple as that. No acceptions. But for example bakabt: I know the general specifics of what can be downloaded and what is considered legal and what isn't but yet torrent sites like bakabt put up stuff that is definitively illegal by any standards, so i don't know how they determine what should remain in the white list or the black list according to the rules and justifications of that legality of that content. Yet in their terms, their legality rules apply differently, and its different for every site. But the facts and the law are still concrete and remain the same. How do they stay in business? I don't know, they may think they are following ever legal code of distributing and providing anime, but they aren't, their are some rules they are violating as well. But their terms in regards to illegal anime is different. I realize a discussion like this will probably attract all of the MAL police like a flock of angry birds, but i just want to know more information in regards to this and how are sites able to have that little wiggle room concerning the real laws of the rights to downloading, streaming and even reading manga/anime online. |
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we still promote the illegal activity by providing such torrent links on certain clubs and what not. It's illegal and also against the MAL Terms of Service to provide those links, those clubs are blatantly breaking rules. There is no legal 'wiggle room', it's just a blind spot because; 1. Anime isn't something the bigger companies in the US care about, and so nothing is done. 2. Japanese companies don't have the time, money, or other resources to C&D or file lawsuits against overseas people. 3. Other shit. It's ALL ILLEGAL. There aren't loopholes or gray areas, it's entirely illegal when you're talking about anything that isn't an official release from an official site from the official licensor or publisher. Which is why BakaBT specifically only avoids Funimation releases, as Funi has been known to take legal action on occasion. They aren't "legally" in any way giving the other stuff either - it's just a crime that they easily get away with, just like you do for downloading it. |
TallonKarrde23Mar 18, 2013 4:19 PM
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| Anything you download or stream that isn't provided by a company that paid to license it is illegal. Watching a stream from Crunchyroll/Amazon/Funimation is not illegal, but watching a stream from an unofficial source or downloading from a torrent site is. Whether you'll get prosecuted for illegal downloading is a different matter though. |
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| Well, I guess the Japanese version of the FBI will take my ass to prison in 2084. -Edit- Also, I like this this was posted twice. |
FacelessVixenMar 18, 2013 5:14 PM
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| long thread, didnt read anything, will just give my opinnion. I live in Brazil, and I can't buy animes here... So how can I watch them? Duh. And mangas are like 10 editions late. |
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| I just stream whatever i'd like because... well... why not? I know it's wrong, and i know that it's kinda like stealing from a shop. But i simply do not feel very quilty??? Everybody i know does it, and i have this bad "habit" as well... |
TallonKarrde23 said: we still promote the illegal activity by providing such torrent links on certain clubs and what not. It's illegal and also against the MAL Terms of Service to provide those links, those clubs are blatantly breaking rules. There is no legal 'wiggle room', it's just a blind spot because; 1. Anime isn't something the bigger companies in the US care about, and so nothing is done. 2. Japanese companies don't have the time, money, or other resources to C&D or file lawsuits against overseas people. 3. Other shit. It's ALL ILLEGAL. There aren't loopholes or gray areas, it's entirely illegal when you're talking about anything that isn't an official release from an official site from the official licensor or publisher. Which is why BakaBT specifically only avoids Funimation releases, as Funi has been known to take legal action on occasion. They aren't "legally" in any way giving the other stuff either - it's just a crime that they easily get away with, just like you do for downloading it. I really don't have anything to add. Simply put, it's because anime isn't a large industry in the US and thus, nothing is done about it. |
lupadim said: long thread, didnt read anything, will just give my opinnion. I live in Brazil, and I can't buy animes here... So how can I watch them? Duh. And mangas are like 10 editions late. I almost cried laughing after you basically said "TL;DR" ehh, now I feel bad for saying that :p As for the legality of streaming/downloading anime. It's pretty much a mixed basket. A while ago I used to have a habit of dl'ing anime illegally (not anymore thanks to a certain online service that I don't wanna mention for non-advertising purposes) But once in a while my family would actually receive a notice from our ISP regarding dl'ing anime. Here it's three strikes you're out. I didn't really wanna know what the third strike is, so I stopped. As for the legality, I completely agree, but really, all my friends pirate and don't care. But just remember, the more you pirate crap, the more reason networks have to develop movie DRM (I heard rumors D:) |
78uhMar 18, 2013 5:23 PM
| Someday soon the novelty of your personality will wear off and people will see you for the bore that you really are |
78uh said: lupadim said: long thread, didnt read anything, will just give my opinnion. I live in Brazil, and I can't buy animes here... So how can I watch them? Duh. And mangas are like 10 editions late. I almost cried laughing after you basically said "TL;DR" As for the legality of streaming/downloading anime. It's pretty much a mixed basket. A while ago I used to have a habit of dl'ing anime illegally (not anymore thanks to a certain online service that I don't wanna mention for non-advertising purposes) But once in a while my family would actually receive a notice from our ISP regarding dl'ing anime. Here it's three strikes you're out. I didn't really wanna know what the third strike is, so I stopped. As for the legality, I completely agree, but really, all my friends pirate and don't care. But just remember, the more you pirate crap, the more reason networks have to develop movie DRM (I heard rumors D:) I am brazillian, so english is not my main language, and reading those english texts with different terms and words is hard as shit for me. |
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lupadim said: long thread, didnt read anything, will just give my opinnion. I live in Brazil, and I can't buy animes here... So how can I watch them? Duh. And mangas are like 10 editions late. I also live in Brazil, and I know that's not only the problem. This things are expensive as fuck here thanks to the absurd taxes and traslations (as pretty much every electronic and TCG is). |
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012yArthur0 said: lupadim said: long thread, didnt read anything, will just give my opinnion. I live in Brazil, and I can't buy animes here... So how can I watch them? Duh. And mangas are like 10 editions late. I also live in Brazil, and I know that's not only the problem. This things are expensive as fuck here thanks to the absurd taxes and traslations (as pretty much every electronic and TCG is). He said everything. One manga, at Japan, can be lets say 5 dollars (yes, I know they use yen). In Brazil, it'll be 10 dollars (17,50 reais approximately) |
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| For downloaders, it's never a matter of legality, it's just a matter of not getting caught if it is illegal wherever you live. I haven't heard of any viewer getting caught watching illegally on some low quality streamed flash video (e.g. YouTube). The hosting site and/or the videos themselves get taken down, but they don't go after the viewer as far as I'm aware. |
This topic has not been locked and is still available for discussion. |
lupadim said: 012yArthur0 said: lupadim said: long thread, didnt read anything, will just give my opinnion. I live in Brazil, and I can't buy animes here... So how can I watch them? Duh. And mangas are like 10 editions late. I also live in Brazil, and I know that's not only the problem. This things are expensive as fuck here thanks to the absurd taxes and traslations (as pretty much every electronic and TCG is). He said everything. One manga, at Japan, can be lets say 5 dollars (yes, I know they use yen). In Brazil, it'll be 10 dollars (17,50 reais approximately) Yes, I don't want to pay 3 mangas to read one. Either Brazil stops with the shameless taxes or the Manga/Anime Market starts to invest in global scale. Otherwise, I wouldn't give any fucks about legality and just torrent everything I need. |
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link9us said: Downloading anime or watching them on places like crunchyroll are in direct violation with copyright law (This how ever changed later on due to only providing legal streaming of series that have not been released or licensed yet) Crunchyroll does own the licenses to the series that they stream (now, let's let bygone be bygones...), so it's perfectly legal to watch shows on there. Unless you're trying to say something else, I'm not sure what you're getting at with this... As far as the original question, the amount of money it would cost companies to go after websites like BakaBT/take them to court, etc. would probably be exponentially more than the amount they would gain in sales. Let's be honest, I buy a lot of anime, but most people who go onto sites like BakaBT have no intention of buying anything in the first place and I'm sure companies know that. Funimation, however, is quite aggressive is cracking down on distribution of its content. Even BakaBT doesn't allow stuff from them because they know shit will hit the fan if they do. |
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AndyRayy said: link9us said: Downloading anime or watching them on places like crunchyroll are in direct violation with copyright law (This how ever changed later on due to only providing legal streaming of series that have not been released or licensed yet) Crunchyroll does own the licenses to the series that they stream (now, let's let bygone be bygones...), so it's perfectly legal to watch shows on there. Unless you're trying to say something else, I'm not sure what you're getting at with this... As far as the original question, the amount of money it would cost companies to go after websites like BakaBT/take them to court, etc. would probably be exponentially more than the amount they would gain in sales. Let's be honest, I buy a lot of anime, but most people who go onto sites like BakaBT have no intention of buying anything in the first place and I'm sure companies know that. Funimation, however, is quite aggressive is cracking down on distribution of its content. Even BakaBT doesn't allow stuff from them because they know shit will hit the fan if they do. Crunchyroll started in 2006 as a for-profit video upload and streaming site that specialized in hosting East Asian video content. Some of the content hosted on Crunchyroll, such as fan-subbed versions of East Asian shows or bootlegs of official US releases of anime titles, was illegally hosted without permission from any rightsholders or the fansub team responsible. However, Crunchyroll eventually removed copyrighted content when requested by the rightsholder. In 2008, Crunchyroll secured a capital investment of $4.05 million from the venture capital firm Venrock. The investment drew criticism from anime distributors and licensors Bandai Entertainment and Funimation as the site continued to allow users to upload illegal copies of licensed titles. However, Crunchyroll eventually began securing legal distribution agreements with companies, including Gonzo, for an increasing number of titles. On January 8, 2009, after announcing a deal with TV Tokyo to host episodes of Naruto Shippuden, Crunchyroll stated that it was committed to removing all copyright infringing material from its site and to hosting only content to which it had legitimate distribution rights. In 2010, Crunchyroll announced its acquisition of the North American DVD rights to 5 Centimeters Per Second. This was the first DVD release licensed by Crunchyroll. As of summer 2011, Crunchyroll offers over 200 anime shows and more than 200 Asian dramas to users, although not all programming is available worldwide due to licensing restrictions. ^ Thats what i mean Discussing bakabt for a moment, how do they determine what ends up black listed and what is considered legal to download and put in the white list according to the distribution and legality of the content being administered. |
ArtimesGamerMar 18, 2013 6:54 PM
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| I am from Australia, by removing those streams, it completely cuts me off from THE WHOLE WORLD. Quite a handful of Crunchy Roll Licences do not even cover australia, along with other streams including half of the anime streaming on Funimation itself. At the same time, I am in full support of the industry, I have thousands of dollars of anime that I love because of those illegal torrents and streams. I have tried watching only legal anime, but the coverage is honestly pathetic. I would have to resort to watching something like Gundam (yeah I hate it) just to get my fix. I believe those laws are not made to be strictly enforced, instead they are there as a weapon to be used when a company feels they are being screwed over. |
TheLostProphet said: I am from Australia, by removing those streams, it completely cuts me off from THE WHOLE WORLD. Quite a handful of Crunchy Roll Licences do not even cover australia, along with other streams including half of the anime streaming on Funimation itself. At the same time, I am in full support of the industry, I have thousands of dollars of anime that I love because of those illegal torrents and streams. I have tried watching only legal anime, but the coverage is honestly pathetic. I would have to resort to watching something like Gundam (yeah I hate it) just to get my fix. I believe those laws are not made to be strictly enforced, instead they are there as a weapon to be used when a company feels they are being screwed over. I hear you completely, i contribute alot to the anime industry alot as well. I own my self quite the selection, but honestly speaking you are very very limited if all your able to watch is licensed series so that is why i download. |
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| Maybe one day they'll take the western fans seriously. All we've got right now is Crunchyroll. |
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Glazglow said: Considering how high the prices usually are, most people would usually just download and stream. I would download and if i really liked the anime, i would buy it to support the company and such. But ah who am i kidding, no one does that. I DO LOL since I watch older stuff it only costs me like $3 for a vol. or $17.00 for a whole series. I dont download Anime, and stream 50%. |
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Coolspot said: Glazglow said: Considering how high the prices usually are, most people would usually just download and stream. I would download and if i really liked the anime, i would buy it to support the company and such. But ah who am i kidding, no one does that. I DO LOL since I watch older stuff it only costs me like $3 for a vol. or $17.00 for a whole series. I dont download Anime, and stream 50%. This is true, however in my case i just tend to buy manga/LNs. |
link9us said: AndyRayy said: link9us said: Downloading anime or watching them on places like crunchyroll are in direct violation with copyright law (This how ever changed later on due to only providing legal streaming of series that have not been released or licensed yet) Crunchyroll does own the licenses to the series that they stream (now, let's let bygone be bygones...), so it's perfectly legal to watch shows on there. Unless you're trying to say something else, I'm not sure what you're getting at with this... As far as the original question, the amount of money it would cost companies to go after websites like BakaBT/take them to court, etc. would probably be exponentially more than the amount they would gain in sales. Let's be honest, I buy a lot of anime, but most people who go onto sites like BakaBT have no intention of buying anything in the first place and I'm sure companies know that. Funimation, however, is quite aggressive is cracking down on distribution of its content. Even BakaBT doesn't allow stuff from them because they know shit will hit the fan if they do. Crunchyroll started in 2006 as a for-profit video upload and streaming site that specialized in hosting East Asian video content. Some of the content hosted on Crunchyroll, such as fan-subbed versions of East Asian shows or bootlegs of official US releases of anime titles, was illegally hosted without permission from any rightsholders or the fansub team responsible. However, Crunchyroll eventually removed copyrighted content when requested by the rightsholder. In 2008, Crunchyroll secured a capital investment of $4.05 million from the venture capital firm Venrock. The investment drew criticism from anime distributors and licensors Bandai Entertainment and Funimation as the site continued to allow users to upload illegal copies of licensed titles. However, Crunchyroll eventually began securing legal distribution agreements with companies, including Gonzo, for an increasing number of titles. On January 8, 2009, after announcing a deal with TV Tokyo to host episodes of Naruto Shippuden, Crunchyroll stated that it was committed to removing all copyright infringing material from its site and to hosting only content to which it had legitimate distribution rights. In 2010, Crunchyroll announced its acquisition of the North American DVD rights to 5 Centimeters Per Second. This was the first DVD release licensed by Crunchyroll. As of summer 2011, Crunchyroll offers over 200 anime shows and more than 200 Asian dramas to users, although not all programming is available worldwide due to licensing restrictions. ^ Thats what i mean Discussing bakabt for a moment, how do they determine what ends up black listed and what is considered legal to download and put in the white list according to the distribution and legality of the content being administered. Note that in my post I specifically referenced the present Crunchyroll. Indeed, they were just as illegal as BakaBT back in the day, but now they're 100% legit and actually hold the licenses to the shows they stream. And BakaBT determines what's blacklisted based on what's likely to get them in trouble. They don't care about certain titles being "more legal" than others or anything of the sort. In fact, as far as I know, Funimation and NIS of America shows are the only things blacklisted specifically for legal reasons (high chance of being sued). They hint at this on their FAQ. |
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AndyRayy said: link9us said: AndyRayy said: link9us said: Downloading anime or watching them on places like crunchyroll are in direct violation with copyright law (This how ever changed later on due to only providing legal streaming of series that have not been released or licensed yet) Crunchyroll does own the licenses to the series that they stream (now, let's let bygone be bygones...), so it's perfectly legal to watch shows on there. Unless you're trying to say something else, I'm not sure what you're getting at with this... As far as the original question, the amount of money it would cost companies to go after websites like BakaBT/take them to court, etc. would probably be exponentially more than the amount they would gain in sales. Let's be honest, I buy a lot of anime, but most people who go onto sites like BakaBT have no intention of buying anything in the first place and I'm sure companies know that. Funimation, however, is quite aggressive is cracking down on distribution of its content. Even BakaBT doesn't allow stuff from them because they know shit will hit the fan if they do. Crunchyroll started in 2006 as a for-profit video upload and streaming site that specialized in hosting East Asian video content. Some of the content hosted on Crunchyroll, such as fan-subbed versions of East Asian shows or bootlegs of official US releases of anime titles, was illegally hosted without permission from any rightsholders or the fansub team responsible. However, Crunchyroll eventually removed copyrighted content when requested by the rightsholder. In 2008, Crunchyroll secured a capital investment of $4.05 million from the venture capital firm Venrock. The investment drew criticism from anime distributors and licensors Bandai Entertainment and Funimation as the site continued to allow users to upload illegal copies of licensed titles. However, Crunchyroll eventually began securing legal distribution agreements with companies, including Gonzo, for an increasing number of titles. On January 8, 2009, after announcing a deal with TV Tokyo to host episodes of Naruto Shippuden, Crunchyroll stated that it was committed to removing all copyright infringing material from its site and to hosting only content to which it had legitimate distribution rights. In 2010, Crunchyroll announced its acquisition of the North American DVD rights to 5 Centimeters Per Second. This was the first DVD release licensed by Crunchyroll. As of summer 2011, Crunchyroll offers over 200 anime shows and more than 200 Asian dramas to users, although not all programming is available worldwide due to licensing restrictions. ^ Thats what i mean Discussing bakabt for a moment, how do they determine what ends up black listed and what is considered legal to download and put in the white list according to the distribution and legality of the content being administered. Note that in my post I specifically referenced the present Crunchyroll. Indeed, they were just as illegal as BakaBT back in the day, but now they're 100% legit and actually hold the licenses to the shows they stream. And BakaBT determines what's blacklisted based on what's likely to get them in trouble. They don't care about certain titles being "more legal" than others or anything of the sort. In fact, as far as I know, Funimation and NIS of America shows are the only things blacklisted specifically for legal reasons (high chance of being sued). They hint at this on their FAQ. You were confused by my last statement, so i just explained it to you and i agree with you. Yeah i see now. So bakabt is pretty much just taking risks then to provide their quality content to their subscribers with out attracting to much attention by removing certain titles that may have a huge impact on legal issues, such as "funimation, Viz media, etc. That is mostly what i wanted to know. But yet they do upload naruto shippuuuden, thats a pretty big risk because thats a very popular show in america. So its all gauged upon chance then i guess. Good thing ive already downloaded what i need from certain sites, before they get taken down if they get taken down because the government is cracking down on these things and every day i see more sites being removed, torrent sites, illigal streaming sites, etc. That is kind of my fear anyways is that one day anime won't be available to us any more or fansubs and it will all be like music kind of, you have to digitally purchase the content online through like Itunes or something. In my opinion, i don't think we as the downloaders should be prosecuted for downloading such fansubs that available to us for free. The people that should be prosecuted are the groups that are providing the material and using copy right infringement on anime with out consent from the company. Either way its a loosing game though, for us. But ive seen people like US be jailed for just downloading, to me that is not right. They should be going after the people they are actually breaking the laws and copy righting the material and is violating "the fair use" laws. But like someone else said, technology is evolving, so even though they take down sites prohibited any illigal downloading/streaming, some one will always find a way around it and provide that material for users to share, how ever if they ever implemented some kind of tracking, where they can track each and every IP or computer downloading the content, we would be screwed, but their is such a thing as the privacy act, privacy can't be violated. I remember one time i had my ISP secretly install a spyware software on my machine, now they are taking bout me downloading illegally, in this case it was a few Naruto episodes, but they are no different being able to monitor like that. I deleted the material, of course what i did was move it to another hard drive but they actually new that i had moved it, thats impossible for an ISP to track unless they have some form of spy agent on your pc, and sure enough they did so i removed it. Some companies irritate me when they get away with stuff like that. Youtube has just really infuriated me with their copyright legal issues, in essence i can see what they consider copyright, sure, anything that is copy righted, audio, video you must own the rights. But shouldn't their be some acceptions to that, i mean we as consumers already payed for the damn merchandise, we own the game, we own the media, we contribute to the company. We should be able to upload on a global streaming site with out any repercussion, thats how youtube used to be before Google merged with it and they cracked down on all these copyright infringement policies. I mean its not like we are disstrubiting or selling the product illigally, just simply sharing something that is already owned by a licensing company, but its our own video footage. You know i like to upload some video games every now and then on my channel, but i always get copy right strikes against, even when i provide commentary, its so annoying. |
ArtimesGamerMar 19, 2013 10:39 AM
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| It's a moral struggle. The key for me is to not keep anything. Watch it, if you like it, swell. Pretend like you watched it on Japanese television. Don't keep it on a hard drive. If you LOVE it, buy it. Those are my rules, or at least I pretend that they are. Kuraaiiya said: Oh, man made laws say it's no good, tough shit. Learn to logic, copyright itself is stealing. You can almost smell the ignorance resonating off this one. |
| Merged the same topics from casual discussion and anime discussion into one. Carry on. |
link9us said: AndyRayy said: Discussing bakabt for a moment, how do they determine what ends up black listed and what is considered legal to download and put in the white list according to the distribution and legality of the content being administered. What BakaBT (among other sites) do is tolerated. By law, they're not allowed to host it, and they know it, hence why their server isn't in the US. Anyway, tolerated, not legal. Most anime companies don't really care about it, for various reasons already stated by TallonKarrde23. Only Funimation and a few other license holders actively monitor the site to see if they (don't) host any of their stuff. If they do, C&D letters will be sent. Given that BakaBT is a relatively big torrent site for anime, they'd rather play it safe than face legal action, hence the blacklist. |
| Signature removed. Please follow the signature rules, as defined in the Site & Forum Guidelines. |
| Streaming is free and easy, why would you go to the trouble of going out and physically buying something unless you were a true fan of the product. I do buy anime if I feel thats its worthy, but how will I know that if I don't have the chance the to watch it first? Most anime is fairly mediocre IMO and not worth buying, but it's still a fairly entertaining and as of now cheap form of entertainment. |
 "The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. If you try it, you will be lonely often, and sometimes frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself." -Friedrich Nietzsche |
| I'd love to buy Gintama DVDs but unless the Japanese put English subs on their releases i'll stick with watching them online. Sentai Filmworks tried releasing Gintama in the states but they failed. They only got to 50 episodes + movie and dropped it due to poor sales >.< |
Kuraaiiya said: I didn't know you could smell what does not exist. However, your stupidity is obvious. LAWS SAY ITS BAD SO IT IS! - is what you're agreeing with No. You are a child stuck on "anti-government" mode when this isn't a matter of government so much as it is intellectual property. In many cases (not all, of course), these works are a creator's legacy, pride, and joy. If they are to continue making these wonderful stories, they'll need support. Thus, the consumer needs to buy their product. This is the simplest of concepts. If you want to live in a world where all anime should be free, then my friend, you're going to be living in a world with very little anime. No one would fund the process because there's no profit involved. Hence my comment about your ignorance. |
Dusk252 said: DEMOLITION_D said: You're completely right in what you say about funding. But the reason most people download illegally isn't due to a simple "Screw the laws, I can get it free, so why paying?" attitude. The problem is the sheer amount of stuff we watch, the fact that we want to watch it and the fact that not everyone would have the possibility to otherwise.Kuraaiiya said: I didn't know you could smell what does not exist. However, your stupidity is obvious. LAWS SAY ITS BAD SO IT IS! - is what you're agreeing with No. You are a child stuck on "anti-government" mode when this isn't a matter of government so much as it is intellectual property. In many cases (not all, of course), these works are a creator's legacy, pride, and joy. If they are to continue making these wonderful stories, they'll need support. Thus, the consumer needs to buy their product. For instance, my parents can't help with money so I'm living from a scholarship right now, and stretch my cents to the last each month because I always buy at least 30€ worth of manga or official merchandise, exactly because I want to support the industry. But it would be absolutely impractical to buy everything I read, let alone everything I watch, which is why I download stuff. I end up buying my favorites exactly because I had downloaded and read/watched them before. Otherwise, I'm not the type of person nor do I have the type of money to order stuff blindly. In the end, yes, if everyone had the mindset that we should never pay for things, the whole entertainment industry would take a big fall. However, I think flexibility is a good thing as well. It more of a question of common sense by the viewers, though I admit that realistically speaking, that's not something controllable, therefore not something companies can rely on, unlike laws. Still, for those of us who can't watch it on TV and can't afford to buy everything we might be interested in due to overwhelming prices and absurd shipping taxes, resorting to illegal downloads is both the easiest and one of the few ways out. Understood and agreed. I wasn't refuting that. I mean, did you see the other guy's post? I was only enlightening Mr. F**k tha Police. |
AO968 said: link9us said: Discussing bakabt for a moment, how do they determine what ends up black listed and what is considered legal to download and put in the white list according to the distribution and legality of the content being administered. What BakaBT (among other sites) do is tolerated. By law, they're not allowed to host it, and they know it, hence why their server isn't in the US. Anyway, tolerated, not legal. Most anime companies don't really care about it, for various reasons already stated by TallonKarrde23. Only Funimation and a few other license holders actively monitor the site to see if they (don't) host any of their stuff. If they do, C&D letters will be sent. Given that BakaBT is a relatively big torrent site for anime, they'd rather play it safe than face legal action, hence the blacklist. Fixed that for ya. |
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| I find it pretty funny to see people bitching and whining about the price of anime in their country when the Japanese have to fork out like $60 per 2 episodes on Blu-Ray. In England you can buy a 12 episode series on Blu-Ray for £10. We really don't have a leg to stand on when it comes down to money. |
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| I've always thought that the fact people like to share their media with others is one of mans few redeeming qualities. |
| Its completely understandable if people download and stream anime.There are a lot of people who cant buy anime or manga due to problems(money,location,etc.) but the problem is because of the abundance of illegal ways to find anime and manga,people get spoiled. After all the greatest things in life is free? Wrong.Lets think about the process of creating an anime.The process cost a lot of money so we have sponsor.If the anime doesn't make good profit then they would be at loss,meaning the sponsors wont sponsor anymore. But I guess that's obvious. So super main ultimate point.If you can buy then buy,if you cant then spread the word and let other people know. |
| I live in the US and try to stream as much as I can legally whether it's Premium Crunchyroll or other distribution services but if a show isn't licensed for my territory and I want to watch it there's not really any other convenient choice... Now there're imports and such but do Japanese companies really expect most of their International audience to pay the exorbitant prices that are the norm in Japan targeting a niche crowd but expensive as hell everywhere else? For people that want to support the industry, I believe it's a balance between convenience/availability/price I think it's also a case by case basis depending on what country and show you're pertaining to Legal- Watching Hunter x Hunter on Crunchyroll in US Illegal- Watching Hunter x Hunter from HorribleSubs rip in US |
HybridMBLMar 23, 2013 6:40 PM
| As for me, who lives in Sweden, we have access to some anime on Crunchyroll, but not all. For those anime, I download 'em. And if I like something well enough, I'll buy it. However, I'd most likely have to import it from the UK, as anime is very scarce here. |
| I'm a douche. Deal with it. |
| Sadly most anime aren't available in my country to just simply buy them OR are way too expensive. Also, importing them into my country is expensive due to import duties and taxes that are way too high. I DO buy dvd's, manga, figurines and novels whenever I can get them on anime conventions. I'm using internet to see if an anime or manga is good enough for me to spend my money on it, and then buy what I want from that serie so I can say I'm supporting it. Oh that feeling when you find the dvd/manga/figurine etc. you're looking for and have it in your hands. I turn into a little happy child that just received a christmas present. :'D |
lupadim said: long thread, didnt read anything, will just give my opinnion. I live in Brazil, and I can't buy animes here... So how can I watch them? Duh. And mangas are like 10 editions late. Pretty much this except I don't live in Brazil and there is NO manga here. |
| As long as I have access to anime I'm happy :) |
Kuraaiiya said: DEMOLITION_D said: Kuraaiiya said: I didn't know you could smell what does not exist. However, your stupidity is obvious. LAWS SAY ITS BAD SO IT IS! - is what you're agreeing with No. You are a child stuck on "anti-government" mode when this isn't a matter of government so much as it is intellectual property. In many cases (not all, of course), these works are a creator's legacy, pride, and joy. If they are to continue making these wonderful stories, they'll need support. Thus, the consumer needs to buy their product. This is the simplest of concepts. If you want to live in a world where all anime should be free, then my friend, you're going to be living in a world with very little anime. No one would fund the process because there's no profit involved. Hence my comment about your ignorance. And you're a pseudo-intelligent sheep who thinks everyone who is 'anti-government' is a stupid child. Copyright being wrong is a fact, it's not even debatable. If I don't watch an anime because I don't want to pay for it and there is no illegal way, the author still gets nothing. If I watch an anime illegally but find it good and become a fan, I might buy it if possible. Even if I didn't, what does the author lose? Nothing. He/She already owns the original copy, it's not 'stealing' Resorting to logical fallacies from ignorance isn't going to change it. I'll copy some essay for you and then you can stfu Oh. I recognize that name. You're the guy who argued with me about Berserk and even after I tried being friendly and even delivered proof of why you were wrong on multiple fronts, you continued to argue for the sake of arguing. Based on that experience, I don't think I'm going to read or refute this. Because you're a parrot. And I don't argue with parrots because that would be silly. Go outside, angry little man. The Internet has transformed you into a cynical, easily flustered manbaby. |
lupadim said: long thread, didnt read anything, will just give my opinnion. I live in Brazil, and I can't buy animes here... So how can I watch them? Duh. And mangas are like 10 editions late. + there's no money |
| Insert wise quote here |
| No way for me to buy them legally. If I could buy them and if I had the money to buy them, maybe I would. But for now, I don't care. |
| Forever lost. |
| To be honest, Japanese distribution is kind of behind the times. People don't just download because they want to pirate. People download because downloading is easier. I for one can't stand discs when it comes to actually using them. I get paranoid about scratches and cracks, and it just isn't fun to try to bother with using something and taking care of it at the same time. I'd rather just click a button. Crunchyroll is okay for those who want a legal alternative. Though there's a lot of stuff about Crunchyroll that's terrible. I'd rather see something better spring up to take its place. |
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