Subete ga F ni Naru: The Perfect Insider Episode 11 Discussion

Ikarugax said:


Well, the idea of attaining freedom by being dead relies in the understanding of the inherent limitations on being alive. Like being attached to a body or being attached to other persons in a emotional manner, all those things can also be interpreted as "chains" of ones existence. Also you could understand those ideas through some forms of Buddhism ideologies where life is seen like an illusion or a dream, and one must awaken to the true reality by detaching from the material world, you must even abandon 'yourself'.

Then you have to take in account she's an intellectually gifted girl so her understanding of the world is expected to be somewhat radical. So when Saikawa describes her as a 'pure' person is because she isn't bound to moral norms (or at least she doesn't follow a conventional and socially accepted moral code). That's why, from her point of view, she genuinely believes to be doing something "good" by killing all those persons close to her. However there's this whole melancholic feeling so she could also had been motivated by her loneliness and sadness.

So if Saikawa admires her is because on a first instance he identifies with her because he's also posses a high intelligence that isolates him. Although even Saikawa doesn't fully understand Magata I'd say what he admires from her would be her resolve as well as her super intelligence, he's not on her level but he's intelligent enough to appreciate what she has done better than anyone. That's why they get along well and why he looks up to her. He also feels restricted or limited in a sense, so he also wants to be "free" but he isn't going to necessarily follow the same steps than Magata and going to kill everyone around him; that's something he still needs to figure it out on his own.

ichii_1 said:
Magata called from Tokyo? :O
Maybe she did download her Michiru personality into it :O

9/10, needs more anime like this.


When you're as smart as her, then maybe your opinion would be worth something.
It's like an ape trying to understand Einsteins theories.

MoonStar9 said:
They can say Magata's a genius whose intelligence is on a higher plane all they want, I still think she was just schizophrenic. She keeps taking on the persona of people that die around her. Even her uncle at the very end. Also, was is specified if she did indeed kill her
daughter? And was she really apprehended and killed or did she get away?

All in all, throughout the opposing exchanges and convoluted, almost nonsensical ideologies, I thoroughly enjoyed this anime. The characters were likable, the themes were intriguing, the music was great, the character designs were unique and the atmosphere was duly fitting. 8/10 for me and one of the better anime of this season. Not that there's much competition tbh.

Vatsafi said:
I just watched this anime in one sit.
My first impression was that I liked it very much, but the more I think about it, the less I like some points.

- The aunt, Shindo Yumiko, who is a relative to her should know way better her own family, if she does or does not have another niece

- The locked room mystery (we learn that she could come out whenever she wanted - the glass guy tells authorized persons can open the room door from outside, she can open it from the inside, and the corpse's arm is missing...) she and uncle exchange the crucial parts of the plan?), you kill him also, because FFFF, and...done! Yay.

- the knife which she used to kill the uncle, is it the same she killed her parents with? If it is, how does she still have it, wouldn't the police confiscicate it as evidence?

- the whole "she is a genius", "she does not think as an ordinary people about life and death" etc - until she is desperately trying to find a way to end her own life, I don't see how she is living that "superior life"

(the whole bloody escape plan is unnecessary, she could leave anytime, use the helicopter and disappear just like she disappeared now (and uncle surely would help her escape, if she ever asked).

Feeling superior, murdering people pointlessly, and creating blurry reasoning behind it - this is what Dr. Magata Shiki looks like to me in the end.

- Also, what was exactly her motive for killing her parents? Because they wouldn't let her keep a baby whose father is her uncle?

Being free? If being free equals to lock herself up in a room for some decades alone with a soon to be born child, who needs huge time and attention, and who she wants to keep secret from the world at all costs?

I simply just don't understand her motive clearly for the parent killing either. Or being free for her really just means that free to do whatever and whenever she wants to do, eliminating those who could restrain her? I am really curious, anyone who finds her character appealing, or thinks that understands her actions, could you explain to me?

As for ep.11, I really hoped for a last twist in the events (not exactly hvae idea how), but there wasn't.
I liked the show's atmosphere, at first glance the story too, and it DID make me think about it much more than other shows (see this rant above). What I did not like is the execution of the investigation, some ways it had logic, but some ways they did do it a little random. (Searching for evidences, examining the corpses, asking some questions from everybody present in the building, interrogating suspects could be done more sistematically for my taste). i would rate it 6-7/10, I guess.

Sorry for grammatical errors, it's been a while since I wrote in english, I hope my sentences make more or less sense.

iLostReason said:
I'm going to be generous and give it a 6/10.Pretty sure if it was a 2h anime movie focused on only important story parts i could give it even 8/10.11 episodes tho were too much for this series.LOTS of unnecessary and dragged out scenes.Nishinosono was one of the most annoying characters this year too.
Best part of this show was it's ED without any doubt.Absolutely amazing, one of my favorites this year.

Mich666 said:
So she took-in even her uncle to her multiple personalities in the end, what a interesting end.
I enjoyed the clever art and camera direction of this series and its mood grew on me literally since the first episode. Also, nothing was pushed directly into your face which is also something I liked.
Although this time the last scene (and the scene where Magata vanished) felt a little abrupt - what was the purpose of those two image freezes? Dunno.
Anyway, I really liked this conversation-driven and thoughtprovoking drama. Bit philosophical too.
And characters, their interactions - mainly Saikawa, Moe and Magata's were so well-written. They felt very real to me, that's something not many anime can do.
There were many interesting questions dealing with shades of grey in this series and I really liked its thematic uncorrectness. One has to try to view the life through Magata's eyes to fully understand how she saw the world. Moral ambiguity of our actions and nihilism as main themes of this anime were very interesting topics.

7-8/10 Good mystery anime but even better criticism of our subconscious dependence on our modern society that governs what we think as good or wrong since our very birth.

Jacara said:
This show is such a disappointment because I had such high hopes for it.

The sealed room mystery aspect was delicious, whilst the animation and especially the opening was fresh and unique.

This show was however let down by the many internal inconsistencies and utter abandonment of logic. For example, how is it that no one noticed that Dr. Magata did not have a sister? Even more shockingly, how is it that the director's wife, who is Dr. Magata's aunt not realise the same thing?

The mens rea for the killings is an even larger gaping hole in the structure of the whole story, which they tried to hide behind the "Dr. Magata is insane so she doesn't have to make sense" trope.

Dr. Magata says that death is the cure to the disease called life, and admitted that she performed the serial killings so that she could die/experience freedom. She then claims that being killed is an expression of love, and she would like to be killed by someone. Lets assume we apply her logic- she killed her own daughter and the Director because she loved them- why wait 15 years? And why kill the only 2 people who are remotely likely to grant her wish of being killed? Why go to such lengths to hide her role in the killings and to escape from the lab?

The simple answer is, this is pure rubbish and cloaking it with pseudo-philosophical questions does not make it more acceptable. If you want a good murder story read Agatha Christie, don't bother with this crap.

Elzheimer said:


DID (or Dissociative Identity Disorder) aka MPD (or Multiple Personality Disorder) simply doesn't work the way it was portrayed in the anime, and felt like a thorn in my eye while I watched.

They could have done SO much with this but didn't (for whatever reason).

RedR said:
Seeing people call this pretentious piece of garbage a "good" mystery anime is the most fun thing, especially when you go on their lists and see scores that are twice as retarded as that insinuation.

StevePen387 said:


(TLDR is towards the middle between the breaks---, after the longer explanation in the beginning and after the Tldr there is an afterword if you are interested.)

Finally someone who understands the tones of this anime. Having seen the live-action version I can't say I arrived at some conclusions on my own but it kind of annoys me that so many people fail to understand, proving maybe many did not pay attention that much. She had her own Michiro personality which was the doll that she said killed her parents, which was her in a doll like state as well her being her play doll. She also had a sister that looked out for her in her mind. All these personalities are what protected her after she decided to let her uncle take something from her that she could lose, " I wanted to have something taken away from me" or along those lines. So she gives him her virginity and she gets pregnant, and the others protect her by taking the blame/taking over during the moment she stabs her parents, and in the live-action the uncle is actually the one who stabs them, but Magata is holding the knife, the uncle guiding her arm from behind her basically like teaching someone to play golf kinda deal. She takes her past and adds that to her personalities, so she knows these people are not in the real world anymore, but they do exist in her mind in the way she can best remember, and she does not need to try they just come out spontaneously. At the end of the anime we witness her using this personalities to actually visualize conversations in the virtual space, we don't see but in her inner conscious she is talking to visual people just like when she talked to Saikawa and Moe seperately when she was found out in the virtual space. We may have even witnessed what happens when she invents them for the first time, as her uncle joins the conversation and meets her daughter for the first time when she is older.

For those asking what it is about Dr.Magata getting caught by police outside the library, as well as the police being alerted that she had accessed a computer in Tokyo I will explain. This happens in the live-action as well.

There is no Miki Magata or her sister it is just another disguise, maybe even a complete personality in Dr. Magata. She duped the police by having remote access to a computer terminal in Tokyo I presume, in order to get the police away from Saikawa. After this she visits him, makes him think she is about to be caught to try and get affection from him/or take him with her and escape I assume. She hires people to surround her, not real police.

That is why the scene later shows the "police" that are walking next to her all the sudden walk away casually and she "vanishes".

There are two explanations of what happened, one I just explained, or another that would only be explained if the show continued to show you how she was doing this. In the live-action there are 3 mysteries including Dr.Magata's escape and she is behind the scenes helping Saikawa with a clue in one, and even being the puppet master, screwing up the rich guy that is trying to manipulate Moe by making his murder designs actually real instead of fake and people start dieing because of it. At the end of this arc, we realize that the same hologram technology that the rich guy is designing is actually being used by Dr.Magata. She was never near the events of the third arc, but was a hologram directing things behind the scenes. After that arc Saikawa realizes the neighbor next door who just moved out of the apartment complex was Dr.Magata the whole time, she leaves a "I trolled you, see you later wink" kind of note and message for him because in the end of it all she helped keep Moe safe and kept her from the rich guy.


We learn that Dr.Magata perfected this hologram technology, and it was her that contacted the rich guy and she was the reason they started making hologram tech, she spoon fed him pieces of her perfect hologram tech.
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>In conclusion or >TL:DR- Dr.Magata has perfected hologram tech long ago, and uses this to appear anywhere and maybe uses some other camera or next-gen tech to be able to see and talk from there. So either she was a hologram when she talked to Saikawa sensei, but this can be debunked because he shakes her hand unless she really has some quantum next level tech in this scenario. In the live action she doesn't have the ability to act physically upon the world.

The other explanation is that she really just duped the policed as I explained, led them towards Tokyo by remotely accessing a computer there, maybe manipulating a security camera at the same time to make it seem like someone was on a computer that looked like her. People that watch this show may not know how truly hacker she is, she is basically a god of the system in the live action and books. After she leads them to Tokyo she visits Saikawa, and then pretends to be surrounded by fake police to fool Saikawa, make him think that he doesn't need to call the police in case he might do that.

At the end of the anime we witness her using her new personalities of her daughter and her uncle to actually visualize conversations in the virtual space. She may have had a portion of these personalities already but after they died her mind automatically absorbed memories and thoughts of them and created a virtual representation to talk to her and her other personalities. Maybe that was the exact moment her uncle was created as she seemed surprised and welcomed him, as well as introduced him to their daughter for the first time since she was a baby.
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>Afterword- A lot of anime viewers might not realize but the live-action and books had quite good popularity in Japan. This leads me to believe and especially watching the anime that it was pandering to previous fans more than expecting people to go in without any knowledge. They do this in a way that might turn off new watchers but is suttle enough to mix in with the story. Like more dialogue, the Magata murder arc was not as long time wise as this anime. So instead they gave the audience more dialogue from the books, as this arc is the most important arc as it basically is the intro arc to every other part of the series because Dr.Magata is the deuteragonist, causing trouble and mischief but never harming the main characters in the end, even being considered a guardian angel who likes to play with them sometimes and they seem to get involved with people she might be actively working with like the rich guy. She is so interested in Moe because she is like her with her parents dead from the same age, that maybe she had decided to work with that certain rich guy because Moe was promised to that man but did not want to and was putting it off and Magata wanted to get close to him to discover his nefarious plans for Moe, and screw them up in order to set Saikawa on the right path and mess up the rich mans plans in the process since people were dieing instead of it only being fake. She essentially breaks the rich guy by mind-fucking him after all these manipulations and is able to weaken him so Saikawa can figure out everything and be able to get thru heavy security etc.

Sorry for these long explanation. It just bothers me people hating on this anime and I understand, but realize that this was made in Japan and mostly for Japanese audience viewers. This means they expected a large portion of viewers to have read this entire story or already watched the first 3 arcs with Magata being involved, the murder, the locked room murder where a girls head is cut off and the rich guy trying to manipulate Moe. She was a part of them all.

But since Magata is the most interesting character in the series and novels, fans would want to know more about this first arc or any arc as well. That is why there is more dialogue and perhaps pacing issues. That does not excuse it but realizing intentions always gives a diversified look on a piece of art.

If an artist tries to make a painting seem dark, and the critic does not like it because it is to dark, you can not fault the creator for making it dark like that because that is strictly your own opinion and you are not taking into account objectively "Did the artist fulfill his intent?". I am not saying the critic is wrong to dislike it, but there is a difference between critiquing something as objectively as possible and still being able to add in your opinion, and only giving your opinion forgetting the artist's goal in the first place. It is like saying the architect built an ugly house because it looks victorian and not modern. But if he intended it that way, somebody who knows little about Victorian architecture should be less subjective in that critic then and not add much of there own opinion or add a disclaimer. You guys probably know this and realize I am rambling but it sometimes takes a reminder to change an outlook.

IDK why I spent this time defending this anime, as it was not as good as I expected having watched the TV live-action series, but I still thought it was a 7.5 and deserves no less than a 6 even from new viewers unless they hate mystery or anything like this. My own opinion I know, but this is coming from someone who has seen the live-action so a fan before watching so to speak.

aikaflip said:
A couple more general observations after re-watching this episode.

When Shiki is talking to Souhei in the real world, her views are very antinatalist. Life is a hindrance; death is liberation. However, in the flashbacks when she's talking to her daughter, her words are more optimistic and encouraging, particularly during the camel back ride in—I'm assuming—the virtual world (one of the most beautiful anime scenes ever); these thoughts are extended into—again, assuming—a kitchen back in her lab in the real world. Did the lab have a kitchen? I can't remember.

I also understand why these scenes were so sad to me now. Shiki's optimism turned into a coldness that she fully embraced, then passed on to her daughter. And then it ends with Shiki alone, after having killed everyone close to her, having a schizophrenic conversation with herself. It's really depressing.

8/10 overall

And it's about time I add Kenji Kawai to my favorite people list.

StevePen387 said:


But things did not go as planned- the daughter was not like Magata, not as smart, not as "evolved", no extra personalities etc. No matter how much she was told about her 15th birthday and the day of freedom, she could not understand killing her own parents. So she committed suicide in the bathroom instead by cutting her wrists. Dr.Magata was so upset that she dressed her daughter up in a wedding dress- to give her a wedding in a kind and motherly kind of way(Might seem weird but to Magata and myself watching the series I realized this was out of love and true sadness seeing her daughter die before she turned 15, the day she would be freed).

TheNaturalPerm said:

This year of Noitamina sure was quite bad
Not one presentable show in their line up.


sigh

Zadion said:

Thanks for this. I was incredibly confused about what's going on in those last two scenes, but this more or less cleared it up.

I love how the anime ends with Magata in a way which is open to interpretation. The story really was all about her.

Helpme said:


What's depicted in the anime is not multiple personality disorder, which is a highly disputed diagnosis anyway, but I don't think it's supposed to be either.

The simile made was with children playacting. So it's more like she has invisible friends. It's part of why Sohei calls her pure. (Unaffected by society, not morally good as Moe thinks he means.)

Signore said:
2/10 Fuck A-1 and Kanbe

k11chi said:

You don't like A-1 pictures?

delija9091 said:
Boring mystery - Annoying characters - Way too slow pacing - Pretentious philosophical stuff.