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Mar 28, 2019 3:51 AM
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Nov 2016
2
Ysad_Ziwezhan said:
I wish we wouldn't have been trolled about Hana chan's love (who is it in the end? )


I believe she loves both the twins equally
Mar 28, 2019 4:10 AM
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Nov 2018
4
Enya_Lim said:
Ysad_Ziwezhan said:
I wish we wouldn't have been trolled about Hana chan's love (who is it in the end? )


I believe she loves both the twins equally

Plot twist: she like musa
Mar 28, 2019 4:19 AM
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Nov 2016
2
Zamzamindo said:
Enya_Lim said:


I believe she loves both the twins equally

Plot twist: she like musa


As funny that would be, it's highly unlikely, since they didn't interact much throughout this anime. We usually see Hana around the twins, so it's highly likely she likes both of them.

On another note, can anyone tell me why they think Hana likes Kakeru or Haiji? Kakeru didn't interact much with her and Haiji doesn't seem interested in her as more than a friend. Did I miss something?
Mar 28, 2019 7:49 AM

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Aug 2018
78
Thanks Kansei - crying now
Can I offer you an egg is this trying time?
Mar 28, 2019 9:55 AM
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Sep 2015
5902
Nexosan said:
phantomfandom said:
[/spoiler]
Besides from the sparkling effect from those two, the previous episode Kakeru think now he know what falling in love feel like, with Jota/Joji (still can't remember their name) wondering who he mentioned. Now this episode Kakeru mentioned that Haiji is the answer, but to what question? Previous episode question or the new one, I don't know. That's why I said possible...


I think that Haiji is the inspiration (!) for Kakeru to run, It's most likely not meant to be taken in a romantic way.


I'm not trying to bring information from outside the literature, but the light novel author Shion Miura is a yaoi fan. (source: https://www.shinshokan.co.jp/comic/4-403-22048-7/)
Mar 28, 2019 1:10 PM

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Mar 2012
47
Great anime showing that you can make realistic dreams come true with persistence and hard work.

Score: 8/10
Mar 28, 2019 3:39 PM

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Aug 2014
1547
good ass series

definitely most underrated gem of this season

glad i watched
Mar 28, 2019 11:16 PM

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Oct 2008
13647
Satisfying end!
mezmerizing OST by Hayashi Yuki nails it all! especially the emotional parts
I wonder who Hana likes? but i think not the twins...it either Kakeru or Haiji lolz
5/5.
8/10.


Mar 29, 2019 11:07 AM

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Feb 2014
884
This was everything I ever wanted in a long distance anime. They had elements of track, cross country, and marathon running. And add in the awesome characters and the inspirational story you got yourself an awesome package. There was some stuff in it that was a bit unrealistic (like picking ten random guys and somehow all of them were able to get there times below 16:30 for a 5k), but in terms of the training and real problems you face during running it was pretty spot on. I can let some of those other aspects go when the rest of it was extremely well done. Really loved this show, my favorite sports anime by far.

Tsarko said:
As a former athlete that competed on high level I have to say that this is probably the most relatable anime I've ever seen. This show perfectly captured almost every feeling an athlete might have on his journey.

The cast of characters was phenomenal, with every character being mature, feeling real and extremely relatable, and also having great development.

Watching this show reminded me of those days I used to spend with my crew and friends, training and working towards something big together.

Everyone's different motivation to train, everyone finding their own idea of what the sport is. Even the way everyone hated it at first but gradually starting loving it somewhere along the way felt real.

Thank you Production I.G for giving us another masterpiece! 10/10


As a former track and cross country runner, I really loved what they did here. There was some stuff here and there which was a bit stretching it like finding 10 guys and getting them under 16:30, but overall it was a fantastic show. I could relate it to it so much which brings this to a 10/10 for me as well.
Mar 29, 2019 7:59 PM

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Dec 2018
79
i thought the dog was she lol, i cracked up when it had kids.

My overall opinions about this show are mostly incredible, even its flaws has an impact about everything on its plot(in general). Also, i think everyone noticed in these last eps how they skilled up the graphic anime, i mean fuck i still remember that scene from when they were training on summer break aaaaaaa they did improved if we compare to the first episodes.

Despite being unrealistic on some points, i did catch the idea of not give up even though the circustances arent in your side, you need to step on bc you'll never know what's waiting for you if you dont give a try, right? Give a try, it wont kill ya

At last, my Haiji X Kakeru did happen thank you sensei >.<
Mar 30, 2019 5:48 AM

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Sep 2018
1238
The ending was tremendously beautiful and fun. In the end this anime series was interesting to watch and the time spent looking at it, gave me something, given the many background messages it conveyed. Also this time the IG Production was excellent, having created an anime worthy of its fame. At the end of the episode I was very excited seeing how all the characters had changed in their appearance, especially Takashi astonished me with his looks.

P.S. I was also surprised when I saw how Hanako had changed in her appearance.

8/10
Mar 30, 2019 6:40 AM

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Apr 2011
870
The animation was awesome!! so was sound and story (even thou it got overdramatic sometimes). Still 10/10 for me
Only thing that bugged me were Yuki's glasses... He wore them in bath like nothing and was running with them in rain, snow and whatnot. And it never seemed to bother him...
Even though I do not wear glasses it still looked a little unrealistic to me
Mar 30, 2019 8:29 AM

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Dec 2015
6449
@-michira- I don't like to take a shower or bath without my glasses (despite vapour) because it feels weird to see everything (up to my own hands) so blurry. Under the rain, it can indeed become difficult to see (more than with fog on the glasses) if it pours constantly. But when you don't have to find your bearings, it is possible.
Snow? I never had big snow but light one isn't more of a problem than light rain (it's just annoying).
Rei_IIIMar 30, 2019 9:13 AM
Mar 30, 2019 9:08 AM

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Apr 2011
870
@Rei366 it's just that many of my friends wear glasses and they usually complain about snow, rain, baths, hot drinks and many other things that make glasses foggy. So I assumed Yuki should feel uncomfortable sometimes. ^^"
Mar 30, 2019 7:06 PM

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Dec 2015
499
This show overall was not very good. It relied on way too many tropes from sports anime and it never really delivered on most of them. Most of the characters were obnoxious and/or uninteresting too (especially the twins). The ending was incredibly lackluster, and that weird "running is you" at the end was super gay.

Overall: 4.5/10

phantomfandom said:
Nexosan said:


I think that Haiji is the inspiration (!) for Kakeru to run, It's most likely not meant to be taken in a romantic way.


I'm not trying to bring information from outside the literature, but the light novel author Shion Miura is a yaoi fan. (source: https://www.shinshokan.co.jp/comic/4-403-22048-7/)


That explains why this anime overall was kinda garbage.
BarnaldMar 31, 2019 1:24 AM
Mar 31, 2019 12:05 AM

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Jul 2009
866
Jin_uzuki said:
Felt like Production I.G. was shipping Kakeru and Haiji heavily in the last episodes, with the whole "I'm in love too (with running)" in the previous episodes and then "To me running is you" in this one.


You said it.

Hana-chan fall in love for both <3 That's my girl I totally support them <3`

This anime was perfect!! 10/10
Apr 1, 2019 4:30 AM
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Mar 2012
4039
The art & animation's been fairly clean & surprisingly consistent.
It didn't catch me till ~ep8 I think. The character reality/depth at the end were awesome, but wish they spread or expand this to earlier episodes, as the middle was the usual repetitive tropes like in most sports shows. Prince & a few characters held my interest, but there were too many in the mc group (or just not well expressed/differentiated early on).
The portrayal of pain & internal struggle in the races against the wind & illness was quite amazing.
Apr 1, 2019 9:27 PM
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Jul 2018
564582
Think the series just got progressively better and that last episode was tops. Depressing that he isn't able to run anymore though =(
Apr 2, 2019 6:03 AM

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Mar 2009
8123
Never expected to love an anime about running, but here we are. Like all the best sports anime, they are more about the characters than the actual sport. I thoroughly enjoyed the time we spent with these incredible characters the past two seasons. Especially all the time we spent with Kakeru, Haiji, and Prince. What a long way they've come. Prince used to run like a zombie! Really going to miss these guys...

I can't even come up with any negatives. Maybe the twins were sometimes annoying? Maybe the story wasn't entirely realistic concerning how much the characters accomplished in such a short time? I don't know. I don't care. Loved this show.

Yet another reminder that we need more anime adapted from ACTUAL novels, and less fucking light novel adaptations.
Apr 5, 2019 9:57 AM

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Oct 2013
1367
This is anime definitely the surpassed my expectations! I am happy that everything worked very well for everybody in the end! Although, I wonder who Hana really liked between the twins. :)
Apr 6, 2019 11:36 PM

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Dec 2016
2053
sports animes always have the best endings.

nice to see them all grown up and 'mature'; would be great to have an ova or summat following that theme.
AnimeFreak-San said:
is this a male gender issure...human issue...mental illness perhaps?
Apr 7, 2019 7:58 AM

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Nov 2012
422
Ahh this was a pretty amazing anime. For the last few episodes where the characters and overall show wrapped up beautifully I'd rate it 10/10 but if it's the whole anime probably only 8/10. Either way it was amazing and I loved it. Definitely need to give props to Haiji though, he really is the real MVP from episode 1, what an amazing and inspiring character!
Apr 7, 2019 8:03 AM

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Apr 2013
711
IG really excels at making great sport anime. Cried a bit. I love seeing Haiji getting what he wanted. I'm really weak to emotional sport show
8.5/10
TriZenApr 7, 2019 8:06 AM
Apr 10, 2019 2:59 PM
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Oct 2018
89
Not normally a fan of sports anime but I found the show really funny and endearing. Would give it an 8/10, will probably have re-watched by the end of the year.
Apr 13, 2019 10:44 AM
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Jan 2016
416
Simply beautiful...that passion, man. Sports anime is always amazing and give you a unbelievable passion. I really like how this anime end, is not over yet, it's only the beginning of a new era.
Apr 14, 2019 12:12 PM

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Jul 2014
514
This show is an example of heights the anime medium can reach. For all the trashy ecchi harem wish fulfillment otaku pandering power fantasy anime that seem to characterize modern anime, its gems like this that make it worth sifting through all the trash. Thank you staff at Production IG and Shion Miura for giving us this beautiful work of art.
Apr 16, 2019 9:45 AM

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May 2016
2899
Oh those feels, I loved the anime so much.
May 13, 2019 5:05 PM

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Feb 2013
24143
Too bad Shindo got that cold, who knows what position they would be in now but let's not think about that now, Kakeru broke that record and Haiji gave everyting he had!
May 30, 2019 2:25 AM

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Feb 2018
118
phantomfandom said:
Wow, we now have two sports anime begin in 2018 that end with possible gay ending


What's the second one??
May 30, 2019 3:54 AM
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Sep 2015
5902
Slores said:
phantomfandom said:
Wow, we now have two sports anime begin in 2018 that end with possible gay ending


What's the second one??


I'll put it in spoiler because it'll give away how that anime end...
May 30, 2019 6:40 AM

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Dec 2013
2571
Oh geez, I really cried. Haiji!!!! I just want to hug him with all my might after he finished sthe race. So it means that he will become a coach? Lol at Musa! He's so damn cute! I wonder if Hana likes any of the twins, I'm having doubts right now. Great ending, this anime made me really engaged with the story and characters.
_kukiyomenaiMay 30, 2019 6:46 AM



★━━─
𝘏𝘰𝘸 𝘤𝘢𝘯 𝘐 𝘣𝘳𝘪𝘯𝘨 𝘱𝘦𝘢𝘤𝘦 𝘵𝘰 𝘮𝘺 𝘩𝘦𝘢𝘳𝘵?
𝘞𝘩𝘦𝘯 𝘐 𝘵𝘩𝘪𝘯𝘬 𝘢𝘣𝘰𝘶𝘵 𝘪𝘵 𝘦𝘷𝘦𝘳𝘺 𝘥𝘢𝘺?


May 30, 2019 1:33 PM

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Feb 2018
118
phantomfandom said:
Slores said:


What's the second one??


I'll put it in spoiler because it'll give away how that anime end...


Thank you ^_^






this post contains 15 characters
May 30, 2019 2:23 PM

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May 2013
4702
Awwhhhhh, I loveeeeeee.

Haiji runs drippin' in gold-- that was awesome!!!!!!
And his dad was lowkey keeping up with the news :') how sweet.
I'm just relieved Haiji's still able to walk lol. That's all I'm concerned about for our bby

It ended the best way, with Kakeru asking the question which started it all :'D

Super proud of Kakeru for breaking record in 1:08:59-- fucking monster hahahah. I've never seen Ouji so excited before xD T'was heartwarming <3

Kansei has so many lively runners now! WAOW!!!!! *O*

Betchu Hana-chan likes both HUEHUEHUE. Getchu dem twin fantasies, gurl ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

Really good series. 8/10.
If you love being in your feels, this is def the anime for ya ;D I enjoyed every emotional flashback per team member until the end-- From Ouji all the way to Haiji.
Jul 20, 2019 11:44 AM
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Mar 2013
4
Re: Hana

She was confused by the word "dochi" which means basically "which out of two". She was confused and then she realised Musa was referring to the twins as they could be the only "dochi" in the team.

Who Hana liked was NOT one of the twins. My money's on Kakeru.
Jul 31, 2019 2:18 PM

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Apr 2012
19012
Nexosan said:
phantomfandom said:

Besides from the sparkling effect from those two, the previous episode Kakeru think now he know what falling in love feel like, with Jota/Joji (still can't remember their name) wondering who he mentioned. Now this episode Kakeru mentioned that Haiji is the answer, but to what question? Previous episode question or the new one, I don't know. That's why I said possible...


I think that Haiji is the inspiration (!) for Kakeru to run, It's most likely not meant to be taken in a romantic way.


Exactly. I am glad that at least someone understood this, and did not begin to try to understand it too literally.

kuraharah said:
Jin_uzuki said:
Felt like Production I.G. was shipping Kakeru and Haiji heavily in the last episodes, with the whole "I'm in love too (with running)" in the previous episodes and then "To me running is you" this one.
That was damn good



"too," suggests that they both are in love with him, lol. Then I have a question, if it was really supposed to be a hint, then why aren't they a couple in a distant final? It is strange that the author openly portrays heterosexual crush, but at the same time supposedly avoids any open BL, if by your logic, it should have been so serious.
RobertBobertJul 31, 2019 2:41 PM
Jul 31, 2019 2:27 PM

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Apr 2012
19012
phantomfandom said:
Nexosan said:


I think that Haiji is the inspiration (!) for Kakeru to run, It's most likely not meant to be taken in a romantic way.


I'm not trying to bring information from outside the literature, but the light novel author Shion Miura is a yaoi fan. (source: https://www.shinshokan.co.jp/comic/4-403-22048-7/)


This is only an indirect "proof", especially considering that in her most famous work (Not to mention the other adaptations of her josei works), both of the main male leads are mutually in love with women and are married to them.
RobertBobertJul 31, 2019 2:31 PM
Jul 31, 2019 3:29 PM

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Apr 2012
19012
kuraharah said:
RobertBobert said:
then why aren't they a couple in a distant final?
Who said they aren't? :D

RobertBobert said:
I am glad that at least someone understood this, and did not begin to try to understand it too literally.
We're no morons, of course we understand. People just like to hope that there's some way for their ship, because we hardly ever get gay couples in anime outside of BL genre (and when we do, it gets frowned on by common audience anyways).


Well, after talking with yuri fandom, I came to the conclusion that many yaoi fangirls are quite cute and smart guys, lol.

I understand everything, I just had a bad experience discussing this franchise over the 13th episode, so the discussion of shiping in this show causes me to have negative associations. Well, I haven't checked it yet, but I hope you enjoy Given
Jul 31, 2019 7:00 PM
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Jul 2019
2
One of the best anime i have ever watched
Aug 15, 2019 5:57 AM
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Apr 2016
203
RobertBobert said:
Nexosan said:


I think that Haiji is the inspiration (!) for Kakeru to run, It's most likely not meant to be taken in a romantic way.


Exactly. I am glad that at least someone understood this, and did not begin to try to understand it too literally.

kuraharah said:
That was damn good



"too," suggests that they both are in love with him, lol. Then I have a question, if it was really supposed to be a hint, then why aren't they a couple in a distant final? It is strange that the author openly portrays heterosexual crush, but at the same time supposedly avoids any open BL, if by your logic, it should have been so serious.


Because in 2006, when the novel was written, explicit gay romances in non-BL series almost never exist. Even to this day, there's only Sarazanmai that had a guy explicitly romantically confess to another guy and explicit confirmation that "we are a couple". If she did make this actual BL she can have the relationship be explicit, but she would be severely limiting the target audience of the novel.

Why do we need "proof" that two characters are in love? It can be inferred from subtext. Plenty of heterosexual characters only have subtext too (Meruem and Komugi from HxH, Cells at work, Noragami, Mikasa towards Eren in AOT) but no one tries to deny that they have romantic feelings? If you really dislike the idea, you can choose to ignore it. But no, no one has to prove that two boys are in love. There's enough textual evidence to support that idea than evidence that suggests that they are heterosexual.
Aug 15, 2019 7:22 AM

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Apr 2012
19012
@Tsukizono Oh my friend, of course, many works prefer qeer subtext over a real image of qeer relationships, but the tendency to see a romantic subtext in literally any character interaction just provokes everything into a shitty conspiracy theory. For a complete set, you just lack the allegations that the relationship of the guys are deliberately hidden because of the machinations of Jews, aliens and cultural marxists in the government, lol. However, if you are left, then it’s even easier, just say that "the Russians did it".

And since we are start talking about a heterosexual subtext, then in 90% it is extremely simple and open, without requiring mental exercises like "oh, he considers him his best friend ... so gay!". Noragami had to use all these subtle metaphors in the style of MariMite? Did AoT use any very ambiguous messages like fresh Banana Fish? However, the experience of various shonen and shoujo can serve as a good example of the fact that in the pursuit of the subtext search, slashers can ignore even completely open heterosexual relationships (hi Shouwa Rokugo and BNHA)

But even if you forget about it, if for your theory you need a lot of interpretations and studies of indirect points, then this doesn't speak in favor of the theory. And I won’t even say how much damage the real qeer content get due to the popularity of all this conspiracy shit. It took a lot of years and the adaptation of such a masterpiece as Yagatte Kimi ni Naru, so that real yuri finally got the same financial success as any yuri bait and fake yuri before that.
RobertBobertAug 15, 2019 7:54 AM
Aug 15, 2019 8:22 AM
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Apr 2016
203
RobertBobert said:
@Tsukizono Oh my friend, of course, many works prefer qeer subtext over a real image of qeer relationships, but the tendency to see a romantic subtext in literally any character interaction just provokes everything into a shitty conspiracy theory. For a complete set, you just lack the allegations that the relationship of the guys are deliberately hidden because of the machinations of Jews, aliens and cultural marxists in the government, lol. However, if you are left, then it’s even easier, just say that "the Russians did it".

And since we are start talking about a heterosexual subtext, then in 90% it is extremely simple and open, without requiring mental exercises like "oh, he considers him his best friend ... so gay!". Noragami had to use all these subtle metaphors in the style of MariMite? Did AoT use any very ambiguous messages like fresh Banana Fish?

But even if you forget about it, if for your theory you need a lot of interpretations and studies of indirect points, then this doesn't speak in favor of the theory. And I won’t even say how much damage the real qeer content get due to the popularity of all this conspiracy shit. It took a lot of years and the adaptation of such a masterpiece as Yagatte Kimi ni Naru, so that real yuri finally got the same financial success as any yuri bait and fake yuri before that.


Banana Fish wasn't even frickin ambiguous at all. Even if not in a romantic context, they literally kissed, with tongue, did anything to protect each other, is recognised as each other's weaknesses. In a comedic segment Eiji was excited to see Ash's dick. In the epilogue that wasn't adapted a character even refers to them as "they have a relationship like lovers".

Your "best friend" example isn't even remotely close to any of the "subtext" shows in the recent years. Even Rakugo had clear subtext - Kiku refuses to clean a woman's ear but would clean his best friend's ear, an act that is seen as only a married couple would do. Kakeru, after a phone call with Haiji, says that he is in love. We infer that it is running, though the subtext is still there. The next episode, Kakeru equates Haiji to running. Also in that one scene where Haiji asks whether Kakeru has a girlfriend, looks up and says "the night sky is so beautiful", which is a blatant reference to "the moon is beautiful". Sure, these are metaphors, but it's obvious enough.

I disagree that "real queer content" is "damaged" due to "conspiracy shit". It's not like creators can help it, and I'm sure they don't "prefer" subtext. To producers, it just doesn't sell, and turns off a large portion of audience. At least, not until Yuri on Ice exploded, and all these explicit queer shows popped up. Bloom into You is great, but it is actual GL, so it doesn't need to be "bait". RWTW is not BL, and not everyone can push boundaries, so it remains subtext. I think the yuri bait stuff you mentioned is mostly shows aimed towards straight men, like Sakura trick or something. GL aimed towards women tend to be better. Also, Utena, Aoi Hana, and Yurikuma Arashi exist, even if they aren't popular.
Aug 15, 2019 8:42 AM

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Apr 2012
19012
@Tsukizono Yep, that’s why the author admitted in an interview that she made them two guys, because shiping in the story about a guy and a girl is too obvious. Already in the next paragraph you abuse the word "obvious" because shipers are forced to constantly use this word to convince themselves. There are no unobvious ships for them.

Again, "they do what looks like it" and "this is an obvious metaphor." What can we talk about if you do not even see the difference between intentional subtext (not to mention that homoerotic subtext can have quite different goals depending on the work), interesting interpretation or simple qeerbaiting? Come on dude. As I can tell from your page, you are a big fan of Haikyuu. In your vision of the world, are the characters of this Shonen Jump's title also in a hidden gay relationship?

You yourself claim that the BL industry needed over-hyped shows like Yuri on ICE!, to get shows with real gay males, but you still deny my words. Lol I will not even say that the very appearance of YoI is a direct continuation of shiping in heterosexual sports shows. This is not new, shows like Hanoha are also related to male yuri fanboys' interest in the original mahou shoujo. Ultimately, if yaoi fangirls didn't enjoy gay interpretations of male interaction in old shonen shows like Captain Tsubasa, then now you wouldn't have even that. If BL fandom continues to pursue subtext instead of requiring at least just adaptations of good BL works, then they will continue to receive only teasing and rare enlightenments like Banana Fish and Yuri on ICE!. You just let the insustry continue to treat the LGBTQ theme as a popular fetish that can be used to tease people for money.
RobertBobertAug 15, 2019 9:03 AM
Aug 15, 2019 9:10 AM
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Apr 2016
203
RobertBobert said:
@Tsukizono Yep, that’s why the author admitted in an interview that she made them two guys, because shiping in the story about a guy and a girl is too obvious. Already in the next paragraph you abuse the word "obvious" because shipers are forced to constantly use this word to convince themselves. There are no unobvious ships for them.

Again, "they do what looks like it" and "this is an obvious metaphor." What can we talk about if you do not even see the difference between intentional subtext (not to mention that homoerotic subtext can have quite different goals depending on the work), interesting interpretation or simple qeerbaiting? Come on dude. As I can tell from your page, you are a big fan of Haikyuu. In your vision of the world, are the characters of this Shonen Jump's title also in a hidden gay relationship?

You yourself claim that the BL industry needed over-hyped shows like Yuri on ICE!, to get shows with real gay males, but you still deny my words. Lol I will not even say that the very appearance of YoI is a direct continuation of shiping in heterosexual sports shows. This is not new, shows like Hanoha are also related to male yuri fanboys' interest in the original mahou shoujo.

Ultimately, if yaoi fangirls didn't enjoy gay interpretations of male interaction in old shonen shows like Captain Tsubasa, then now you wouldn't have even that. If BL fandom continues to pursue subtext instead of requiring at least just adaptations of good BL works, then they will continue to receive only teasing and rare enlightenments like Banana Fish and Yuri on ICE!. You just let the insustry continue to treat the LGBTQ theme as a popular fetish that can be used to tease people for money.
RobertBobert said:
@Tsukizono Yep, that’s why the author admitted in an interview that she made them two guys, because shiping in the story about a guy and a girl is too obvious. Already in the next paragraph you abuse the word "obvious" because shipers are forced to constantly use this word to convince themselves. There are no unobvious ships for them.

Again, "they do what looks like it" and "this is an obvious metaphor." What can we talk about if you do not even see the difference between intentional subtext (not to mention that homoerotic subtext can have quite different goals depending on the work), interesting interpretation or simple qeerbaiting? Come on dude. As I can tell from your page, you are a big fan of Haikyuu. In your vision of the world, are the characters of this Shonen Jump's title also in a hidden gay relationship?

You yourself claim that the BL industry needed over-hyped shows like Yuri on ICE!, to get shows with real gay males, but you still deny my words. Lol I will not even say that the very appearance of YoI is a direct continuation of shiping in heterosexual sports shows. This is not new, shows like Hanoha are also related to male yuri fanboys' interest in the original mahou shoujo.

Ultimately, if yaoi fangirls didn't enjoy gay interpretations of male interaction in old shonen shows like Captain Tsubasa, then now you wouldn't have even that. If BL fandom continues to pursue subtext instead of requiring at least just adaptations of good BL works, then they will continue to receive only teasing and rare enlightenments like Banana Fish and Yuri on ICE!. You just let the insustry continue to treat the LGBTQ theme as a popular fetish that can be used to tease people for money.


I don't understand what i am "misreading". You claim that I do not see the difference between such, yet are there REALLY real distinct definitions for each term? And why can't a show be all three at the same time? For the record, yes, Haikyuu probably has intentional subtext, but it is likely for queerbaiting. It would be an interesting interpretation though.

I mostly agree with you actually, aside from subtext being "teasing people for money". I do agree that the industry needs more adaptations of good BL and explicit representation, but not all subtext is "fetish". It's not like boundaries can't blur anyways. I believe most subtext is intended representation, but due to production restrictions they are forced to be subtext and marketed as "shipping" and "fetish" instead. I don't like how you use "real" to refer to explicit representation and "fake" for subtext, because they are both representation. Even if explicit representation is good, we can't deny that subtext paves way for explicit and even subtext can be well-represented.
Aug 15, 2019 9:45 AM

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@Tsukizono I ask you this because you show an “obvious” tendency to mix things that are quite different in meaning and purpose, calling it all with the word “subtext”. Using homoerotic metaphors to emphasize the importance of the character for each other, excessive melodramatization, silly gay jokes, real qeer coding or banal ship bait fanservice, all these things have their own nuances, context of use and intentions on the part of the author.

For example, shows like Free and Tsurune, like many KyoAni's titles, use the “friendship like a romance” approach to be a melodramatic message about friendship and partnership, using romantic metaphors to convey the power of emotional teenage experience while at the same time satisfying the interest of any shipers. I will say right away that any bait in these two shows is absolutely and completely intentional, but this can also serve as an example of how subtext is used for a variety of purposes. Homoerotic subtext for portraying the importance and power of platonic relationships has been used since the Old Testament, where David allows himself lines like "our friendship is higher than love for women".

It's not that the subtext shows are supposedly "fake". MariMite manages to never go beyond the subtext, but at the same time 100% consist of representing Class S as a platonic lesbian love. The problem is that you rely too much on abstract and unprovable crap, often without even understanding the context or intentions of what you call “subtext”. I don't care if people like BL and ship two guys with each other, that's none of my business. But when people tell me that “they understand the subtext”, while thinking that
, I want to take something heavy. Like shiping? OK, your right. But don't turn it into conspiracy theology or cover it up with big words about representation. For me enough fanboys who tried to justify their love for CGDCT by calling feminist shows like K-ON! or Lucky Star.
RobertBobertAug 15, 2019 10:02 AM
Aug 15, 2019 2:02 PM

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@kuraharah From a person, who writes quite openly that "I watch anime for pretty boys and that gay drama", another was not expected. Or did you mean something else?
Aug 15, 2019 2:16 PM

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kuraharah said:
RobertBobert said:
@kuraharah From a person, who writes quite openly that "I watch anime for pretty boys and that gay drama", another was not expected. Or did you mean something else?

What does my bio have to do with me agreeing with other person's perfectly based argument?


I wouldn't call as "perfectly based argument" logic of the level "it happens that people kill. So, if you are suspected of murder, then you are a killer". It is ironic that I heard exactly the same argument in discussions over "Marnie was there", right up to the literal repetition of words and actions.
Aug 15, 2019 4:20 PM

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@kuraharah To begin with, I never required any of you to give up shiping. It's none of my business. My comment was only about the fact that too serious attitude to the ships in such shows is quite problematic.

And to end, such comparisons are demagogy, since people will see romance in absolutely any boy x girl interaction, without even touching my Banana Fish author's quote about that above. As the experience of Golden Kamuy and a number of sibling stories shows, people will ship this even if there are age gap and incest risk.
Aug 15, 2019 7:52 PM

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Back when this started airing, I watched 2 episodes and then put it on hold. I thought it was decent, but nothing about it was particularly note-worthy. I knew I'd return to it one day since one of my favorite genres in anime is Sports, and seeing that it had such a high score just made me even more curious...

Boy am I glad I eventually did give it a second chance. This show is a perfect example of why I think Sports anime are so good. The journey, the camaraderie between the cast, the hype, and the feels. It manages to excell at all of these aspects in only one season, without the conclusion being unsatisfying or feeling like it was rushed. This truly is a hidden gem in not only this genre, but anime as a whole. 9/10

Aug 20, 2019 2:50 AM

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RobertBobert said:

"too," suggests that they both are in love with him, lol.



A bit late to the discussion (Not sure why I didn't get a notification) but I'm not quite sure what you mean with this? The epilogue is kinda vague and not really focused on any relationship, but more on the team as a whole.


It is strange that the author openly portrays heterosexual crush, but at the same time supposedly avoids any open BL, if by your logic, it should have been so serious.


Which author? Kakeru is clearly straight in the book and even has a crush on Hana. It's interesting if anything that the anime (Which is a different canon at this point) completely erases that part and slowly builds his relationship with Haiji until the infamous two last episodes, we should ask ourself why the anime director and writer did that. :P I doubt it was to catch any shipper attention give the anime really wasn't quite homoerotic or shippable until episode 13 or 14.

Well, you can think what you want in the end, but I would argue it is definitely possible to read their relationship like that, as there is some actual textual evidence (I.E., it's not just fanon stuff like Haikyuu)

RobertBobert said:
@Tsukizono Oh my friend, of course, many works prefer qeer subtext over a real image of qeer relationships, but the tendency to see a romantic subtext in literally any character interaction just provokes everything into a shitty conspiracy theory. For a complete set, you just lack the allegations that the relationship of the guys are deliberately hidden because of the machinations of Jews, aliens and cultural marxists in the government, lol. However, if you are left, then it’s even easier, just say that "the Russians did it".



I mean, relationships between guys are deliberately hidden often because of producers/execs/etc, we literally have proof of that, Ikuhara's last anime literally did a commentary on that lol.
Jin_uzukiAug 20, 2019 2:57 AM

Aug 20, 2019 6:09 AM

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@Jin_uzuki I think after things like Eupho, your question is pretty rhetorical. In addition, you yourself mention obviously straight shows as an object of persistent reading between the lines, so this makes reference to the audience’s opinion even more subjective. This practice is not new and unusual, especially if the authors are trying to reach a diverse audience.

I specifically mentioned Marnie was there, because this film is a good straight, but homoerotic film that was declared intentional yuri bait only because of a bare assumption of author's intentions. Neither the original author nor Ghibli ever claimed this work as a hidden lesbian story, but many write about it as a fact only because it happened in history with other works.

In any case, as I said, everyone can think what they want, even support completely impossible ships like twincest. I protest only against attempt to aggressively declare as canon, things that are based either on speculative assumptions or on the subjective interpretation of indirect things.
RobertBobertAug 20, 2019 6:13 AM
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