| If its in a logical situation I don't care. Most of it is really random. Like nice day for a walk huh? Then out of nowhere some fan service just shows up to save the day! |
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| Where's the west |
| Don't give a damn at all. Anime is a Japanese product. |
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| Don't really think its bad or good, but it sells. |
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| OP, you're way off mark. Ecchi/fan-service has always existed. Before DxD, before the 21st century, before anime. This is literally nothing new, with the exception that it can now be more liberal since we're not living in an age of prudes who get off to seeing a woman's ankle. |
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| we westerns like boobies too so idk wtf u talkin about |
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| Yeah, fanservice has always existed. Just because the pre-2000 shows that are popular are not heavy on it doesn´t mean it never existed. I don´t generally mind it, unless its mind insulting (Shitschool of the Dead). Guess its because I am not 4 years old and I am not scared of boobs. |
Ratohnhaketon said: OP, you're way off mark. Ecchi/fan-service has always existed. Before DxD, before the 21st century, before anime. This is literally nothing new, with the exception that it can now be more liberal since we're not living in an age of prudes who get off to seeing a woman's ankle. Isn't that called decency? |
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Ratohnhaketon said: OP, you're way off mark. Ecchi/fan-service has always existed. Yeah, a lot of the 80s anime I saw in the 90s like Project A-ko had heavy fanservice, and I'm sure plenty more examples can be found before that. Fanservice isn't a modern phenomenon. |
Soul-Master said: Yeah, fanservice has always existed. Just because the pre-2000 shows that are popular are not heavy on it doesn´t mean it never existed. I don´t generally mind it, unless its mind insulting (Shitschool of the Dead). Guess its because I am not 4 years old and I am not scared of boobs. Best post. |
Coolspot said: There was a time when a woman revealing her ankle was considered lewd, indecent, and suggestive. It was pandering for horny men who played make believe chivalry.Ratohnhaketon said: OP, you're way off mark. Ecchi/fan-service has always existed. Before DxD, before the 21st century, before anime. This is literally nothing new, with the exception that it can now be more liberal since we're not living in an age of prudes who get off to seeing a woman's ankle. Isn't that called decency? aikaflip said: I'm not familiar with any extremely early titles, but the quote "Nothing is new under the sun" can be applied to most concepts that people are in outrage about.Yeah, a lot of the 80s anime I saw in the 90s like Project A-ko had heavy fanservice, and I'm sure plenty more examples can be found before that. Fanservice isn't a modern phenomenon. It's just convenient cherry picking based off of a narrow perspective on the anime medium. To counter the OP's point on Samurai Champloo, this came out around the same time and was but a drop in the ocean of service available - http://myanimelist.net/anime/275/Love%E2%99%A5Love It is literally 9 episodes of panty shots and boob groping harem antics. The only story is to count how many seconds you can go without seeing one of the girls naked. It even shows an 11 year old strip down and a bunch of middle aged men drooling and marveling over it. |
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| Women get sexualized in anime just like how women get sexualised in Western Films and TV shows. |
Ratohnhaketon said: I'm not familiar with any extremely early titles, but the quote "Nothing is new under the sun" can be applied to most concepts that people are in outrage about. I agree. Cream Lemon, which is basically a lolicon fanservice series, came out in the 80s, and is more than 10 years older than OP. This shit has been around for a long time. |
aikaflip said: I went to look it up and ran into a screenshot of a guy pinning a chick down with an "AIDS" t-shirt on. Ironically that came out around the same time as the AIDS crisis in America in the 1980s.Ratohnhaketon said: I'm not familiar with any extremely early titles, but the quote "Nothing is new under the sun" can be applied to most concepts that people are in outrage about. I agree. Cream Lemon, which is basically a lolicon fanservice series, came out in the 80s, and is more than 10 years older than OP. This shit has been around for a long time. |
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Ratohnhaketon said: OP, you're way off mark. Ecchi/fan-service has always existed. Before DxD, before the 21st century, before anime. This is literally nothing new, with the exception that it can now be more liberal since we're not living in an age of prudes who get off to seeing a woman's ankle. I literally laughed out loud at this. And as for my answer to the OP. The only complaint I have is that some quite normal anime that I would normally share with relatives or my nephews have been ruined by Panties and jiggly jugs for no real reason. FOr that reason I cant share it with a 10 year old nephew, who also likes anime. But yea, like everyone else that is bashing you. There isn't anything "wrong" with it. Its just used in all the wrong places. |
| Baka baka baka! |
TheGadaffiDuck said: No matter how good or bad the fanservice might be, what they all have in common, is they back up the silly arguments, that anyone who hasn't seen an ounce of anime in their life makes, that all Otakus are are perverted panty peepers. This is probably the best answer to the question of whether fan service is bad for the image of anime fans in the west. Certainly, people in the west who are already predisposed to dislike anything associated with a "weird" subculture will latch onto any excuse they can find, and fan service gives them a great excuse. Of course, in many cases, these complaints are likely to be hypocritical since western popular culture is loaded with fan service, and it has been for some time. Scantily clad women are seen in television shows and commercials, and movies sometimes feature nude scenes which do little to advance the plot and are merely there so that horny viewers can see a naked celebrity. Western critics of anime fan service need to take a closer look at their own media before singling out anime for being overly perverted. However, some criticisms are legitimate and deserve to be taken seriously. On occasion, anime includes gratuitous fan service involving clearly underage girls, and when the critics latch onto this stuff, they can add an accusation of pedophilia. This leads to a very bad image for the fan base. Of course, series with this type of fan service are not extremely common, and the most outrageous among them play to an especially perverted niche market, but critics are all too happy to use them as ammunition against the entire community. I do not like this sort of fan service at all. Gratuitous fan service that is unnecessary to the plot and characters is a different discussion, and it is repeatedly brought up on this forum, but it is related. TheJanitor13 said: The only complaint I have is that some quite normal anime that I would normally share with relatives or my nephews have been ruined by Panties and jiggly jugs for no real reason. FOr that reason I cant share it with a 10 year old nephew, who also likes anime. This is one of the problems with gratuitous fan service, and it applies to any media that includes it, not just anime. Of course, many entertainment products are designed for adults and freely explore sexuality. Although the prudes would disagree, there is a place in the world for these works, and there is nothing wrong with adult-oriented anime that is loaded with fan service. However, it is annoying to see a series that would appeal broadly to many types of people and would be suitable for children if not for fan service that does absolutely nothing to advance the plot, characters, or atmosphere. When this happens, it seems like a waste. |
| It is pitch black. You are likely to be eaten by a grue. |
| I don't see how the title of your thread and your OP connect but addressing the question posed in the title I don't believe fanservice affects anime popularity in the West as much as it once might have as conservatism while still alive here in the US is dying out. |
TheGadaffiDuck said: WeirdHeather said: This is probably the best answer to the question of whether fan service is bad for the image of anime fans in the west. Certainly, people in the west who are already predisposed to dislike anything associated with a "weird" subculture will latch onto any excuse they can find, and fan service gives them a great excuse. Of course, in many cases, these complaints are likely to be hypocritical since western popular culture is loaded with fan service, and it has been for some time. Scantily clad women are seen in television shows and commercials, and movies sometimes feature nude scenes which do little to advance the plot and are merely there so that horny viewers can see a naked celebrity. Western critics of anime fan service need to take a closer look at their own media before singling out anime for being overly perverted. However, some criticisms are legitimate and deserve to be taken seriously. On occasion, anime includes gratuitous fan service involving clearly underage girls, and when the critics latch onto this stuff, they can add an accusation of pedophilia. This leads to a very bad image for the fan base. Of course, series with this type of fan service are not extremely common, and the most outrageous among them play to an especially perverted niche market, but critics are all too happy to use them as ammunition against the entire community. I do not like this sort of fan service at all. Gratuitous fan service that is unnecessary to the plot and characters is a different discussion, and it is repeatedly brought up on this forum, but it is related. wowza finally someone took this debate seriously, rather than jumping to conclusions thinking im some sort of booby hater! I was once part of the MLP/Brony fanbase a while back, and despite the hundreds of thousands of dollars raised for charity at conventions and livestreams, and the incredible wealth of media created in a short amount of time because.... i dunno.... they were inspired as artists because of the creativity of the show, the mainstream media and news outlets jumped to conclusions and believed that one person's perversion of the innocent kid's cartoon represented the entire fandom as a collective, instantly ruining our reputation we worked so hard to build up. I've only been in the anime fandom for a year now, and noticing much of the same. I know that there are people that do pull their puds to lolicon (which is a damn side better than to actual children), but that doesn't mean you or i do it.... P.S. Of course the west is no better when it comes to tits and ass in their television shows. I now actually wonder if Japan thinks that way of us?!?? The anime Panty and Stocking with Garterbelt was the Japanese attempt to appeal to Western audience and was done in a western animation style. They apparently think we all giggle at dick jokes. |
TheGadaffiDuck said: Syndiciate said: I don't see how the title of your thread and your OP connect but addressing the question posed in the title I don't believe fanservice affects anime popularity in the West as much as it once might have as conservatism while still alive here in the US is dying out. The title is for the purpose of spurring a discussion, while my comment sorta gives my opinion on fanservice in general.... maybe i was going a bit off topic 0.o That's alright it's hard to contain a passionate opinion sometimes. :P |
TheGadaffiDuck said: I'll see your tasteful, mature Samurai Champloo, and raise you a Girls Bravo, a Desert Punk, a Yumeria, a DearS, an Elfen Lied, a Divergence Eve Misaki Chronicles, a Burn Up Scramble, a Daphne in the Brilliant Blue, a Burst Angel, a Gantz, a Gravion Zwei, a Love Love?, a Godannar 2, a This Ugly yet Beautiful World, a Mezzo, a My-Hime, a Stratos 4 OVA, a Melody of Oblivion, and an Uta~Kata. Like Samurai Chamlpoo, all of these shows aired in Japan in 2004, and were released on disc in the west. What else do they have in common? They all have moderate to significant fanservice content. Granted, these shows didn't get the TV exposure that Champloo did, but 12-13*/19 of them still remain in print to this day. (Including shows that never got released in the West would make the list even longer.)I wouldnt be surprised if this topic has been regurgitated a thousand times on this website. Fanservice once upon a time was a non issue because it was almost never in anime. For example, 10 years ago, when Samurai Champloo was the west's anime baby, the closest thing that show ever came to having fanservice, was during the recap episode with Fuu sitting in a hot spring, enjoying some RnR, with absolutely no lady parts or breasts being remotely visible, despite being completely naked under the hot spring's waters. You can't cherry-pick the best A++ content while ignoring all of its contemporaries to make the point that things were better in the good ol' days. *Funimation is supposed to re-release My-Hime at some point, but it's out of print at the moment. |
| Japan doesn't view the West as a significant market, so they wouldn't really care whether "fanservice" helps or hinders sales in the West. |
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Syndiciate said: TheGadaffiDuck said: wowza finally someone took this debate seriously, rather than jumping to conclusions thinking im some sort of booby hater! I was once part of the MLP/Brony fanbase a while back, and despite the hundreds of thousands of dollars raised for charity at conventions and livestreams, and the incredible wealth of media created in a short amount of time because.... i dunno.... they were inspired as artists because of the creativity of the show, the mainstream media and news outlets jumped to conclusions and believed that one person's perversion of the innocent kid's cartoon represented the entire fandom as a collective, instantly ruining our reputation we worked so hard to build up. I've only been in the anime fandom for a year now, and noticing much of the same. I know that there are people that do pull their puds to lolicon (which is a damn side better than to actual children), but that doesn't mean you or i do it.... P.S. Of course the west is no better when it comes to tits and ass in their television shows. I now actually wonder if Japan thinks that way of us?!?? The anime Panty and Stocking with Garterbelt was the Japanese attempt to appeal to Western audience and was done in a western animation style. They apparently think we all giggle at dick jokes. No it's not, it is targeting domestic otaku. also american cartoon is quite well known in Japan. Did Space Dandy targeted for western audience? did Afro Samurai targeted at western audience? |
| The most important things in life is the people that you care about |
PoeticJustice said: No it fucking isn't. High School of the Dead is not mind insulting. Them titty jiggles are high level, Ray Bradbury levels of complex sciencey shit. I know this, I have a doctorate in faggotry.Soul-Master said: Yeah, fanservice has always existed. Just because the pre-2000 shows that are popular are not heavy on it doesn´t mean it never existed. I don´t generally mind it, unless its mind insulting (Shitschool of the Dead). Guess its because I am not 4 years old and I am not scared of boobs. Best post. |
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| With shows like Highschool DxD being extremely popular or at least being a secret guilty pleasure among many Western anime fans, I doubt fanservice is as controversial as it was in the past. I think the real complain is "too much plot". Well, it's not cool when they throw plot after plot at you to cover up bad storytelling or boring characters. |
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| fan service just seems like a waste of time to me. why do i need to see fake girl's panties in anime, it does nothing for me and I can just go look at porn at the click of a button any time I want. tons of porn. I want action and/or story from my anime.... |
| https://combosmooth.itch.io/ - I make free-to-play browser games for PC and I sell pixel art animation here |
| Anime is made first and foremost by and for Japan. We're free to express our love or disgust for the shows they make, but, at the end of the day, they don't have to take our feedback. Yes, some anime is really "dirty", but it would be pompous of us to try to push our sense of right and wrong on another culture in cases where no verifiable physical or mental harm is being caused. Westerners complaining about anime content is like someone complaining about the colors or length of a Japanese kimono after asking to wear one. No one is forcing you to wear it. No one is forcing you to watch anime. |
| I don't see how fanservice is bad in the west when almost everything on television and in movies is sexualized. Honestly those who know nothing about anime and complain about anime having fanservice are hypocrites. aikaflip said: Anime is made first and foremost by and for Japan. We're free to express our love or disgust for the shows they make, but, at the end of the day, they don't have to take our feedback. Yes, some anime is really "dirty", but it would be pompous of us to try to push our sense of right and wrong on another culture in cases where no verifiable physical or mental harm is being caused. Westerners complaining about anime content is like someone complaining about the colors or length of a Japanese kimono after asking to wear one. No one is forcing you to wear it. No one is forcing you to watch anime. |
AzulBlue said: I don't see how fanservice is bad in the west when almost everything on television and in movies is sexualized. Honestly those who know nothing about anime and complain about anime having fanservice are hypocrites. aikaflip said: Anime is made first and foremost by and for Japan. We're free to express our love or disgust for the shows they make, but, at the end of the day, they don't have to take our feedback. Yes, some anime is really "dirty", but it would be pompous of us to try to push our sense of right and wrong on another culture in cases where no verifiable physical or mental harm is being caused. Westerners complaining about anime content is like someone complaining about the colors or length of a Japanese kimono after asking to wear one. No one is forcing you to wear it. No one is forcing you to watch anime. |
Nicholaevich said: lol who gives a shit about the west? As someone who lives in the west +1. Our opinion is irrelevant when it comes to anime. It's for the best, since the West has become obsessed with being politically correct. Anime is one of the last entertainment mediums that has been left relatively untouched by SJW. DoctorCaim said: No it fucking isn't. High School of the Dead is not mind insulting. Them titty jiggles are high level, Ray Bradbury levels of complex sciencey shit. I know this, I have a doctorate in faggotry. *tips fedora* |
FullmetalRaikouApr 1, 2015 8:56 AM
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Lancehot said: Fanservice is what a lot of people in "the West" watch anime for. Or do you suppose Funimation pay for exclusive distribution rights of all ecchi/harem shows because they consider them high art? Not only does Funimation distribute anime with plenty of fanservice to western fans, they have made NO secret about the fact that these shows have plenty of boobs and panty shots. In fact the marketing for some anime FOCUSES exclusively on the fanservice. Hell, I am looking at my copy of Sekirei right now at the back label and the whole description of the anime is a shameless pun on boobs. Do I hear any Western fans complaining? Nooooooo, if there's a riot, I would have known. |
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Khaosman said: Lancehot said: Fanservice is what a lot of people in "the West" watch anime for. Or do you suppose Funimation pay for exclusive distribution rights of all ecchi/harem shows because they consider them high art? Not only does Funimation distribute anime with plenty of fanservice to western fans, they have made NO secret about the fact that these shows have plenty of boobs and panty shots. In fact the marketing for some anime FOCUSES exclusively on the fanservice. Hell, I am looking at my copy of Sekirei right now at the back label and the whole description of the anime is a shameless pun on boobs. Do I hear any Western fans complaining? Nooooooo, if there's a riot, I would have known. It's not like this is new lol. I remember back when Blockbuster and VHS tapes where all the rage. I use to go into Blockbuster and the anime aisle, yes they had an aisle for anime, was almost all hentai. English translated hentai. So let's not pretend like the west doesn't like toon boobies. |
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Fullmetal89 said: Khaosman said: Not only does Funimation distribute anime with plenty of fanservice to western fans, they have made NO secret about the fact that these shows have plenty of boobs and panty shots. In fact the marketing for some anime FOCUSES exclusively on the fanservice. Hell, I am looking at my copy of Sekirei right now at the back label and the whole description of the anime is a shameless pun on boobs. Do I hear any Western fans complaining? Nooooooo, if there's a riot, I would have known. It's not like this is new lol. I remember back when Blockbuster and VHS tapes where all the rage. I use to go into Blockbuster and the anime aisle, yes they had an aisle for anime, was almost all hentai. English translated hentai. So let's not pretend like the west doesn't like toon boobies. Actually when you look at it that way, anime being generally associated with cartoon pornography might be not that bad at all since you don't have to make excuses for every ecchi anime you buy. |
| The most important things in life is the people that you care about |
azzuRe said: Syndiciate said: The anime Panty and Stocking with Garterbelt was the Japanese attempt to appeal to Western audience and was done in a western animation style. They apparently think we all giggle at dick jokes. No it's not, it is targeting domestic otaku. also american cartoon is quite well known in Japan. Did Space Dandy targeted for western audience? did Afro Samurai targeted at western audience? Argument too strong. I submit. |
TheGadaffiDuck said: Of course, it's not anime's fault that the ignorant masses don't even know what pedophilia is. "Oh, you like that big-breasted, wide-hipped anime schoolgirl in a short skirt? She's 17? GTFO Pedo!!!!1!"On occasion, anime includes gratuitous fan service involving clearly underage girls, and when the critics latch onto this stuff, they can add an accusation of pedophilia. This leads to a very bad image for the fan base. |
Rance-sama said: PoeticJustice said: Lol at monogatari being for pedophiles. It is tongue and cheek humor. You people really need to stop being little pussies about fanservice. You think not liking tits and ass makes you mature? Go fuck yourself. You're the man we need, but not deserve. I bow to this man. Seriously making big deal from just simple funny things. West should learn to stop being such uptight assholes and so annoyingly trying to please soccer moms and SJW's. |
| The west doesn't exist. It's a fantasy land |
 Nico- said: Conversations with people pinging/quoting me to argue about some old post I wrote years ago will not be entertained@Comic_Sans oh no y arnt ppl dieing i need more ppl dieing rly gud plot avansement jus liek tokyo ghoul if erbudy dies amirite |
Lancehot said: Which, as immortalized in ep 26 of Excel Saga, would make them not actually appealing to pedophiles anymore. And given that that body type is exceedingly rare at that age IRL anyway, that brand of pedohysteria is just baseless fear-mongering. The moralists may as well fear that unicorn fetishists are coming to molest their little girls... oh wait, they already do.It's more the big breasted, wide hipped 10 year olds that grind ppls gears Comic_Sans said: Oh, it exists, but it was removed from the circles of the Earth in the reshaping of the world at the end of the second age when Eru brought down his judgment on the country of Numenor for attempting to sail the Golden Fleet to Valinor in hopes of achieving immortality. #ThanksAr-Pharazon.The west doesn't exist. It's a fantasy land |
Shitposta said: Soul-Master said: Yeah, fanservice has always existed. Just because the pre-2000 shows that are popular are not heavy on it doesn´t mean it never existed. I don´t generally mind it, unless its mind insulting (Shitschool of the Dead). Guess its because I am not 4 years old and I am not scared of boobs. You wonder why Rias has 4000+ favorites on MAL. Rias Gremory Gif on Google Images ought to give you an idea. DoctorCaim said: PoeticJustice said: No it fucking isn't. High School of the Dead is not mind insulting. Them titty jiggles are high level, Ray Bradbury levels of complex sciencey shit. I know this, I have a doctorate in faggotry.Best post.  |
Syndiciate said: you don't?The anime Panty and Stocking with Garterbelt was the Japanese attempt to appeal to Western audience and was done in a western animation style. They apparently think we all giggle at dick jokes. |
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