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fluxuscapacitor said: I actually really liked this arc. Since the original Hyouka mystery, I had gotten bored with the series as it went back to the "Houtarou solves mystery" formula and the characters didn't expand much. I found it pretty dull despite the fanservice episode. I hardly love the series (something about the pacing feels off, maybe?) but it's nice to see Houtarou going through some oscillations between coming into his own as a detective and then having his vision of himself shattered again. He seems more human that he can get his hopes up, show a range of emotions. I'll offer a quick theory on how dramatic Satoshi was: the jealousy is definitely there, but what about Houtarou's feelings after getting chewed out by Mayaka (totally in character for her in intensity and brazenness to confront him)? He was probably feeling pretty down, so Satoshi's drama might be a bit overdone to emphasize the way that Houtarou feels about the situation, more than Satoshi actually being that rude about it. IDK. I'm glad that, one way or another, even if there was a bit of OOC, that Houtarou matured a bit as a character without fundamentally changing himself by the end of the arc and thus changing the whole tone of the series from here out JUST YET. Good episode, good arc. +1 I'm glad to see Houtarou being able to show an expression of disappointment like that. Very interesting to see even Houtarou is capable to make a mistake on deduction and not a Mr. Perfect Detective everytime. I'm also growing fond of Chi-chan, how even she can doubt Houtarou (while still keeping his feeling) and how she consider to the writer's feeling. It feels like Oreki is viewing the case with brain and Chitanda is viewing with heart. They complete each other... D awww X3 Btw somehow I guessed the real culprit of the movie right at first (Kounosou, the girl with backpack). Didn't really have any theory but she looks pretty familiar to the building, as shown to her finding the room map and knowing where the keys are located just like that :s Yay, my first time guessing right! I think Hongou's original story is as interesting although the TWIST wouldn't be as grand as Oreki's story. I'm just interested how the victim ended up forgiving and covering the culprit. Though I think it would be that I'm more interested on the drama more than the mystery haha XD |
| I don't know how to feel about this episode. Everything just seems so out of place and unnatural. Like Oreki got the mystery wrong, but I'm pretty sure his sister didn't die, right? Like why is everyone pitying him so much... A relative didn't die. He just solved something wrong. The serious tone was over done between him and Satoshi when they were talking about the narrative trick. They just felt completely out of character. Chitanda, I'm not completely sure how I feel about her even though I'm 11 episodes in. She comes off really illogical. Why does she believe their is an ulterior motive behind everything in life? She really stresses me out. Also Chitanda would realllllly like fairy tail, if ya get me. |
| It seems I may be in the minority here, but I didn't really feel that Mayaka and Satoshi confronting Houtarou was out of character. Mayaka has always been harsh with him; in fact, if anything, the fact that she tried to console him afterwards and stated that it was still a good movie shows how she's warming up to him. And as for Satoshi... He clearly wanted to solve the mystery, he just couldn't because he was dragged away. He probably felt frustration at not being able to provide any final feedback. Additionally, during Houtarou and Satoshi's conversation at the beginning of episode 10, Satoshi stated that he thinks himself a man with no talents and that he is jealous of Houtarou. When he says he's jealous, two separate scenes of his face unsmiling and in shadows are shown. It's meant to represent his inner feelings, to show he's more bitter about that fact than he lets on. Some sort of confrontation is bound to happen. Yes, he's Houtarou's friend and is a pretty upbeat and friendly guy, but just because he's his friend doesn't mean that he can't resent him or be envious of him (their recent talk about the 7 sins comes to mind, and I imagine we're going to be coming back to it at some point; Eru's point about the sins not being completely bad - i.e. a person with no pride may lack self-confidence - really fits with the themes of this show). I'm certain many people have had similar thoughts for those they love. This show expresses the bittersweetness of life. Relationships aren't perfect. Even people we love annoy us. Or just because we have conflict with someone doesn't mean we can't care for them or come to an understanding, such as the case with the two sisters in episode 7 (Rie is possessive about her things, which makes Kayo go behind her back with taking her stuff, but in the end they still care about each other). This arc has helped me warm up to the series more. These past few episodes have probably been my favorite. For one thing, I felt I got to know Eru better - her main desire being able to understand people. She hates having uncharitable thoughts and would rather want to find a way to connect and understand a person. I can sympathize with that viewpoint, and it made me appreciate her character more. I've been having some trouble getting into the series because I don't care for her infantile antics most of the time and how the show constantly shoves in your face how adorable she is. It really annoys me. I've disliked most of her scenes with Houtarou because of it. But I liked their scenes in episode 11 - they were more subdued and introspective. Overall, I feel that these past few episodes have been the strongest in the series yet. |
| Something I'm noticing about this series is that the mysteries, interesting as they can be, are mundane and the answer isn't the most important part. These cases are used as a means to explore the characters and their various social standings. For example, the hanged man case at the inn touched on the sisters. In the case of Hyouka, it was to show how Eru's uncle became the sacrifice/scapegoat for the other students. In this case, the relationship that was being examined is Fuyumi's manipulative nature and how she treats her peers. I have to admit the way they get immersed into some of these cases feels a bit ridiculous, but simultaneously pulls me in before I know it. |
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| why some people hated the episode ? |
| I did not like the way Oreki's friends treated him. They didn't have a clue about how the movie should end but because Oreki forgot about the rope, they give him crap for it? He was doing the film club a favor and everyone liked it so who cares? Of course we can blame Irisu for all of that. What a little bitch. |
| Why do people say what they mean? EP 11. Plot: Oreki got played. After some choice words from the CC, Oreki realizes that the problem was his own perspective. The issue was not to make a good movie but to make Hongou's Movie. And the one who planted this good movie idea to him was none other than Irisu. Character: Whhooo man this was a doozy ep. Oreki got hit hard this time. Not only because he was wrong but that he got manipulated. Hard. The issue of perspective through him off. And those dastardly hormones didn't help either. While he does figure out things in the end, its up in the air on what this means for him later. Will he look at things from the broader perspective now? Will he retreat to the outside observer role in order to make sure he has it right next time. The CC is controversial here. Ibara confronted Oreki but I didn't mind that. She supplied him with the right question that while throwing everything off was what he needed to hear. She Chitanda also but her role is a support and healer for the end of the ep. It was nice and cute. And she's not a fan of killer movies. Satoshi is the wild card here. He's the only one that comes off as dramatic and OCC for many but for me, i can get it. As for the whole arc: "those without talent will feel off if those with talent say it was just luck". Like it or not, the "talentless" look to those with talent to be the best or the right if only to validate the mental workings or place of those without. When Oreki failed and tried to excuse his mistake, it was most likely an annoying shock for Satoshi. I didn't like it but I get it. Irisu: I guess many would label her as the antagonist here. As I said before, she was a manipulator. And she never answers directly on how she feels on things. And if she did, could one believe her? After all the CC's debacle in this was caused by her wanting to "spare Hongou's feelings" and changing the movie when in reality she most likely didn't like the movie either and used manipulation to get what she wanted. Her writings to Hongou and Oreki's sister in the end does point to that being the right answer. Frankly she is a great antagonist just by being the best foil of CHitanda/being the opposite mirror. She, Chitanda, and Eru are great at getting Houtarou to do things Animation/sound: THe episode layed on the drama and facial expressions. Satoshi and Oreki being the most expressive at their more uglier/troubled emotions. Irisu's cold demeanor and the change of shading during her confession to Oreki definitely hyped the emotion of the scene. 5/5. A great ending with a twist we didn't see coming. The first half is not for everyone but by the end it was a good drama piece and now we may have an recurring antagonist in the future. |
 I go where I wanna go, even if its into Oppai. |
| This episode made me hate everyone. What the fuck, calm down. So Oreki got it wrong, no reason to go fucking ballistic about it. Also fuck Irisu. |
aeroFeb 3, 2016 9:02 PM
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Among mystery and mystery, it has reached the middle of the series in a flash-plas. It's not a genius, but quite entertaining. -------- Entre misterio y misterio, se ha llegado a la mitad de la serie en un plis-plas. No es una genialidad, pero es bastante entretenida. |
RanxomareApr 24, 2016 2:40 PM
| It turns out , all possibilities are real possibilities . There is feelings intended . Great Episode . |
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| Shit got intense!! holy mother daisy!! All cause Houtarou messed up. This episode just left me straight out speechless. This "act"/story was sure slow in the beginning but did greatly improved and sure got me fascinated by how it got intense in the episode! Really beautifully done. |
| cause MAL is doing there job for once. |
| Sooo in the end this series comes back to being overly melodramatic. Oh well, that seems to be the style of Hyouka, time to get used to it. Anyway, it was a very well done arc, the conclusion was surprising, didn't expect Irisu-senpai to be a cold, antagonistic mastermind behind this project. Poor manipulated Houtarou! I also sense some drama with Satoshi, there is something suspicious about his behaviour. |
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| Honestly, rewatching this show makes me realise just how much I hate this episode. So, Oreki gets it wrong because he forgets about the rope, and suddenly everyone acts as if he's insulted their families and danced on the graves of their ancestorts or something. I could accept it if any of them had ideas about how Hongou wanted it to end, but they don't. The best they can come up with is Satoshi's talk about how Hongou wouldn't know about the trick Oreki envisaged, but even that's not an actual idea so much as a refute for Oreki's idea. Seriously, there is literally no reason for Satoshi and Mayaka to be so harsh to Oreki just because his idea wasn't up to scratch, especially when they cannot sugest anything better themselves. Damn hypocrites. |
| Yeah, as most people have mentioned, that Satoshi confrontation scene was utter garbage. If there were a reference guide to narrative sins, you'd find that exchange highlighted as the epitome of "out of character" behavior. Still, I liked this arc. Felt more engaging than anything that had come before. |
| That was an interesting turnout... manipulation from Irisu was owpii.. The original script would've been pretty good too. |
| I think this arc should've been no more than 3 episodes, after all these mysteries and puzzles are really silly, they are entertaining to a certain degree, but the depth of them is really low. For example Detective Conan had much better mysteries. The pacing is very slow now and I would like to see more time invested in characters. |
| that was a good arc. i underrated this show the first few episodes but i'm starting to really enjoy it now. |
| Best episode yet and a nice conclusion for this arc. |
One Piece episode 914 & 915 & 1027 were a mistake and 957 brought the salvation - FMmatron |
| So Irisu was manipulating everyone and the 'Senpai' she was chatting to is more likely Oreki's sister. Interesting. It was an interesting turn of events and probably the best episode so far in my opinion. |
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| Do good friends get all worked up just because of their friend made a little mistake damn that's not even possible they even ignored him that was really lame. |
| What they were going for in this episode was truly excellent. Made it a bit melodramatic but at it's core it totally elevated how I thought about the arc. |
| All in all a really good arc. The found footage twist is still the best ending. |
| The amount of shit he got this episode for doing his best to find a suitable ending for a school movie... is quite astounding and shameful for the other characters involved. |
| It makes me angry how obsessed they are about this stupid amateur movie. They all engage in a "mystery buff" circlejerk and criticize the one actually finishing the movie, completely disregarding the fact that a movie is supposed to be FUN TO WATCH. Who gives a shit about the one who wrote the original script, or whether it follows Knox' 10 commandments perfectly? I bet they all felt really smart just saying "no" to everything, sitting on top of their high horses. I don't like these characters at all, they are so arrogant and think they are hot shit. Just have fun with the movie project you nerds. |
| I originally thought the one Irisu was chatting with was Chitanda but now I'm pretty sure it's Oreki's sister. I wonder what she's trying to achieve. This was probably my favorite arc so far. |
| Irisu best girl. Total bae. |
| "The future is always blank. Only your willpower can leave footsteps there." "Ruling over death means ruling over life. Death is the climax of life. To have the best death, you must honor life." |
| Houtarou is wrong in his resolution for once and everybody treat him as if he had insulted their mothers... pretty out of character if you ask me. Anyways, pretty boring arc overall. Not to mention that this episode was handled in such overdramatic way it couldn't be taken seriously. I hope the next episodes to be better. |
| The way Satoshi and Mayaka criticized Houtarou is just off. I think this is an adaptation problem because they actually did appreciate his solution. Maybe the staff wanted to make it as dramatic as possible and it backlashed? So Hongou was actually not ill and everything was schemed by Irisu. She was caught by Houtarou's sister. I guess his saying she is better than him in everything is not a lie. "The strength is symbolized by a lion controlled by a kindly woman." I laughed so hard at this xD Perfectly description of Houtarou at this point. |
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| Not satisfying in the end. :( |
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| Eru is a good friend. &++ a good friend is worth... a lot, lol. Irisu isn't exactly the most loved character in this anime, and after this episode I can understand why. I don't think she manipulates others out of pure malice or 'cause she's an evil character, but manipulating people never sat well with me. "The end justifies the means" type of bee-otch lol. I liked the use of values during her talk with Houtaru |
| for a mystery anime about nothing, this is really good! It's funny, I fell into the same trap as Oreki by viewing the mystery as logic puzzle and blowing off the dialogue about the characters and not considering the title question staring me in the face each episode, "why didn't she ask EBA?" i did the same thing as Houtarou by thinking, "asking about Hongou is stalling for time"while Chitanda was getting red-faced and tipsy on whisky though I'm not clear how The Empress got Eba to play ball with her scheme IAmVan said: I'm here just want to ask something. If houtarou teory said: kounosu (the short hair girl) is the person who attack kaitou (the victim) but she didn't kill him, then kaitou go to the room and he locked the door. So, why his hand been cut-off in the film. Houtarou said kounosu attack kaitou but doesn't cut kaitou hand. So, who Has that piece of hand in the film? The actors, director and prop master improvised the hand cutting scene while filming without Hongou. It was not in the script. |
| To be fair, even if Oreki's deduction matched up perfectly with Hongo's vision, he would still effectively be writing the script for Irisu (and I guess she'd have to reject it). This was a very good episode though. Oreki seems to take his role as 'the detective' much more seriously than he lets on, considering that little existential crisis he went through. And Chitanda is a true scholar of film. Based on that net convo, there's still a puppet show going on. Going to assume that's his sister 'across the world' but maybe that's too obvious. Can only now see the genius of them spending 27 minutes on those three stooges prattling on about their ideas. |
syncrogazerSep 19, 2019 8:30 PM
| The whole story regarding the movie mystery was terrible. Too much drama for something that wasn't even very dramatic and also rather boring. quite frankly I cannot really warm up to this show. The mysteries are a bit dull, Chitanda goes on my nerves but at least it is well drawn and I like the music but it really is very, very low key for a mystery show. |
| This was fun to solve. I'm actually proud to say I had a clean solution by the end of the second episode of this arc. Except the "real" solution is bullshit and makes less sense than mine (lol). Why would that guy lock himself up and proceed to chop his own freaking arm? It's a major leap in logic that can't be overlooked. The solution I came to was far more elegant. Basically, the killer did kill the victim, swapped keys, then locked the room from outside. As the room was opened with the master key and nobody ever checked whether the keys had been swapped, that makes perfect sense. The only issue would be the absence of a rope in the footage, which is once again bullsit, but at least they mentioned it in the second episode of this arc, meaning that the mystery is solvable by then. |
FlamepriesTFeb 15, 2020 1:15 PM
| Houtarou got played from the fucking start like a damn fiddle. Honestly that arc was alright, i think what really shone was the loads of different theories we got as well as that phat plot twist. Honestly i'm not all to mad Irisu played Houtarou like that, if anything it shows the harsh reality and that no one is really "special" and people will play others like puppets to get their own way, i guess we missed the warning signs of how the daughter from the family that literally owns the general hospital could be manipulative and have no interest in others emotions, only their results. Doessss also look like there is someone higher up then Irisu, someone who's actually using her without her knowing. Also surprised Houtarou didn't discuss his findings with the rest of the gang, and instead gave in his findings straight away. I guess the power kinda went to his head without knowing and he thought he had solved the mystery when instead he himself was creating and solving his own mystery. Still, the gang could of been a tad bit less harsh on him, i mean the dude legit got played mega hard after all. |
 "yabe." |
| Irisu’s way to saved their project was a smart move but I feel bad for Houtarou being used liked that and also being judged by Satoshi and Ibara just because he missed something out. But Satoshi’s point and Chitanda’s was a great help for Houtarou to realize what went wrong. I hope this will be another way to develop Houtarou’s character rather than destroy it seeing how depressed he is. Especially that he underestimate his deduction ability, saying that he was just lucky. And I’m pretty sure it’s Houtarou’s sister that Irisu is chatting with. I’m really curious about her and what might be her contribution to all of this. |
SoraaaxiiAug 29, 2020 9:19 AM
| for a stoic, houtarou had some of the best expressions this episode, his expressions were so great! they all, him included, got way too uptight tho. like damn, can't relate. tbh tho now that i'm at the halfway mark for hyouka i still am not completely charmed by this yet. i keep waiting for that moment when i'll fall in love with it, i love the characters, i LOVE the art, the OST is great, but i just....i know the beauty's in the trivial stuff but damn, if this were real life and i had classmates like them i would probably be rolling my eyes at them all the damn time lol |
 ꕤ but i’ll probably remember over and over again you were there and everyone else was there — the day we all searched for just one thing ꕤ |
| That was interesting. The mysteries in this series are rather trivial and inconsequential, at least not on a "grand" scale, but they are still interesting mysteries. So many different currents of thought and motivation in this episode, that for a short time I was having difficulty following it, but it proved interesting in the end. Now I'm piqued by Sherlock Holmes novels... |
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| Oreki messed up bad well he has to fix that problem now So Hongou-san wanted was a no-death ending/script was the kind of her personality (like Eru's) Oreki didn't seem to expect that well me neither that was some heated talk from Oreki to Irisu senpai So Oreki broke down the plot for Eru seems what he would basically do for Eru. |
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| "I was not in a position to allow this project to fail" girl it's a high school amateur film. It can't be taken seriously with that acting and directing anyway. People already pointed out that she's not really 'wrong' for doing this, they needed another ending since the original couldn't work, but also I understand her. It's super frustrating to be in group projects with lots of artistic liberties and yet the group comes up with very bad/mediocre/boring stuff, and you just want to be in charge of everything to fix it. |
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