| I keep reading that this and that other show "deconstructed" this and that other genre and how praised these shows were for having that intention, to the extent that it has almost been accepted as something worthy per se, not regarding the actual quality of the proposal and something every show should attempt to do... Isn't it a somewhat overrated feature? Is any show that deconstructs something inherently good just for that? What's really so wrong in repeating a known formula or not trying to be original enough? A show that has common features or tropes that had been widely seen before in other shows does not need to be mediocre or "not good enough" just because of that...but that seems to be the popular belief... |
| derrida agrees, 9/10 of anime deconstruction are good while only 5/10 of non-deconstructions are |
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| Meh, I've never been fond of the idea of deconstructions on a conceptual level so I'm definitely not going to shit the bed and act like I think they're good. They always rub me as pretentious because they just seem to want to take tropes people like and use the author's possibly ill-defined theory of how "this would reaaaaaally play out, it's all just fiction and nothing would ever happen like that, yadda yadda yadda" - which would still be leaving out how much I hate the idea of trying to force realistic outcomes onto fiction in general. I like muh idealism and all. I think the main reason people cling to deconstructions as an absolute good is because the word "trope" just has a negative connotation to it, though. Like, a trope is something unoriginal by nature and people tend to do the same thing to a much greater extent with originality being an inherent good and unoriginality being something bad. Deconstructions take these tropes and subvert them and apply them to reality; that's basically the whole idea of what one is. People assume tropes are always bad. People assume realism is always good. Because of this, people assume deconstructions are always a good idea. That's what I think is why, at least; that's just conjecture on my end and shouldn't really be taken with more than just a grain of salt. It's more often used to describe shit that's dark anyway, not something trying to take apart tropes from a realistic standpoint. Most people who use it positively barely even seem to know what it means, from my experience, so I may be giving them too much credit. |
ManabanMar 15, 2017 6:04 PM
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| Even if they are bad, they are/become enjoyable because of that intention. |
| Like anything, it can be good if the rest of the show is also good. |
| Be thankful for the wisdom granted to you. |
| If it makes the show entertaining even if it's done badly, I wouldn't mind it. Plus it's funny, to me at least, when a show tries to deconstruct something and others are quick to call it "edgy" or "2deep". All in all, I think it's good though. |
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| i would not call it good by itself but it says that the anime uses the stereotypes from the genre in different ways and also has some commentary in tropes something that can be really appealing for detractors or fans of the genre |
| It's just a meme/buzzword that most don't really know the real meaning behind it. Like when some say that Eva and Madoka are a "deconstruction" because it's "mature" and did it in a certain way, which they aren't btw. |
CabronMar 15, 2017 6:18 PM
Please learn about cel animation and its technical process. Learn how special effects and backlighting were done without computers. |
AntwanMantilla said: If it makes the show entertaining even if it's done badly, I wouldn't mind it. Plus it's funny, to me at least, when a show tries to deconstruct something and others are quick to call it "edgy" or "2deep". All in all, I think it's good though. I don't think it's edgy or 2deep as much as trying too hard... |
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Cabron said: It's just a meme/buzzword that most don't really know the real meaning behind it. Like when some say that Eva and Madoka are a "deconstruction" because it's "mature" and did it in a certain way, which they aren't btw. I wish there was a compilation of people doing this, honestly. It'd be great. I'd want to toss this bit I found a while back on there:  Just for context's sake. |
ManabanMar 15, 2017 6:23 PM
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Manaban said: You ninja'd me yo, I edited my post...Cabron said: It's just a meme that most don't really know the real meaning behind it. Like when some say that Eva and Madoka are a "deconstruction", which they aren't. I wish there was a compilation of people doing this, honestly. It'd be great. I'd want to toss this bit I found a while back on there: Just for context's sake. Anyway, what? Monogatari a deconstruction, heh heh. |
Please learn about cel animation and its technical process. Learn how special effects and backlighting were done without computers. |
| Deconstruction -at least how they use the word now- is nothing but a word people use to intellectualize their favourite show without even knowing what the word means. It has lost all its meaning and now it's just some kind of justification for everything. So, no, saying a show is a deconstruction is like saying a genre. A seinen is not going to be good just because of being a seinen and this applies to deconstructions and even satires, which is also a word used in the same way, seen it a lot with One Punch Man. |
| Signature removed. Please follow the signature rules, as defined in the Site & Forum Guidelines. |
| @Cabron Aye aye, fixed it xP MohitVermillion said: Deconstruction -at least how they use the word now- is nothing but a word people use to intellectualize their favourite show without even knowing what the word means. It has lost all its meaning and now it's just some kind of justification for everything. So, no, saying a show is a deconstruction is like saying a genre. A seinen is not going to be good just because of being a seinen and this applies to deconstructions and even satires, which is also a word used in the same way, seen it a lot with One Punch Man. That's pretty much how most stuff like this operates, I feel like. There's like, this whole set list of terms that tend to just be used in an attempt to intellectualize an opinion on something that people just...accept as good. If somebody wants to tickle their pickle by talking about how they loved the well-paced original symbolic realistic anime of the year, though, then all power to them I guess. I just tend to instantly start dismissing opinions rooted almost entirely in using vaguely applied criticspeak like that. |
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| Gintama is a perfect deconstruction of the shounen genre btw if anyones interested. |
 Oshii is probably the only director that loves dogs. He thinks he's a dog himself. That's right, its slime! It will dissolve your clothing slowly before my eyes! |
| I'm sure constructions are good since people are hired, jobs are floating = $$$ |
| The thing is that every anime is a deconstruction of something else. WatchMojo said: A deconstruction is an anime that does something different than other anime in its genre. Madoka Magica, Haruhi Suzumiya, Angel Beats, Naruto, Erased, Re:Zero, One Punch Man, Little Witch Academia, Sword Art Online, Moetan, and Mars of Destruction are some popular deconstructions It's honestly lost its meaning. A deconstruction doesn't mean it's good, it doesn't mean it's bad, in fact it doesn't say much about the quality of the show itself at all. Just treat it like you would any other anime. |
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| No, not inherently. Just because it deconstructs doesn't make it automatically good. |
zombie_pegasus said: Huh?The thing is that every anime is a deconstruction of something else. WatchMojo said: A deconstruction is an anime that does something different than other anime in its genre. Madoka Magica, Haruhi Suzumiya, Angel Beats, Naruto, Erased, Re:Zero, One Punch Man, Little Witch Academia, Sword Art Online, Moetan, and Mars of Destruction are some popular deconstructions It's honestly lost its meaning. A deconstruction doesn't mean it's good, it doesn't mean it's bad, in fact it doesn't say much about the quality of the show itself at all. Just treat it like you would any other anime. WatchMojo honestly said that? |
Please learn about cel animation and its technical process. Learn how special effects and backlighting were done without computers. |
zombie_pegasus said: The thing is that every anime is a deconstruction of something else. WatchMojo said: A deconstruction is an anime that does something different than other anime in its genre. Madoka Magica, Haruhi Suzumiya, Angel Beats, Naruto, Erased, Re:Zero, One Punch Man, Little Witch Academia, Sword Art Online, Moetan, and Mars of Destruction are some popular deconstructions It's honestly lost its meaning. A deconstruction doesn't mean it's good, it doesn't mean it's bad, in fact it doesn't say much about the quality of the show itself at all. Just treat it like you would any other anime. i guess the problems is more with all the bullshit and limited ideas people have of what is a genre if everyone stopped seeing genres as this static predicatable formula for very show than the things that have minor subversions would stop being labelled as such |
gabrielrroizMar 15, 2017 8:28 PM
| I really don't get the term, since I've seen it several times in reviews and on youtube videos, but thought it was some intellectual word to describe an anime. And the Madoka being a deconstruction thing, seen it thousands of times. |
| Cuteness > Everything else Cuteness is Love, Cuteness is Life |
Cabron said: That wasn't an exact quote, but they called Nichibros, which is a very normal slice of life anime without any real differences from the standard, a deconstruction of slice of life anime for having jokes I think. They could have just as easily called K-On!, Gakkougurashi, Hyouka, or Oreimo deconstructions. Although it's obviously a wrong definition of the word, the fact that they would call generic anime deconstructions without this even being out of the ordinary anymore brings up a valid point that no one really knows what the word means anymore. Maybe WatchMojo is a deconstruction of top ten lists and Trump is a deconstruction of presidents.zombie_pegasus said: Huh?The thing is that every anime is a deconstruction of something else. It's honestly lost its meaning. A deconstruction doesn't mean it's good, it doesn't mean it's bad, in fact it doesn't say much about the quality of the show itself at all. Just treat it like you would any other anime. WatchMojo honestly said that? |
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| If a deconstruction means to rip apart a genre and reconstruct it to contradict the norm, then yes if done correctly. If a deconstruction means to do something different with a genre to be something different, then no, stop trying so hard. |
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| In kinda don't get what's the point of deconstruction of a genre. Deconstucting a piece of art is able to show flaws, paradoxes and disaccords in said constructed work. But in order to deconstruct a genre, you have to construct the genre you want to deconstruct by yourself, since there is no set entity of any genre that contains all the aspects the "deconstruction" wants to rip appart per se. In the end said deconstruction shows that it tries to deconstruct a construct that was created in order to be deconstructed by its creators/writers themselves - an amaizing result... |
slkrdMar 16, 2017 6:14 AM
15poundfish said: People seem to call anime deconstructions that subvert their own expectations of a particular genre. Correct me if I am wrong, but a deconstruction is where you break down elements of a genre and apply worldly consequences to them. If there was a deconstruction of an ecchi anime it would be the pervert characters ending up in prison. Is this really a premise that is intellectual by itself? I seriously doubt it. http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Deconstruction Read for yourself, form your own opinion. PS. I deconstructed OPs mother. |
| Oshii is probably the only director that loves dogs. He thinks he's a dog himself. That's right, its slime! It will dissolve your clothing slowly before my eyes! |
| Is it time to give up on people ever learning what deconstruction means and how to use it? It's a way of reading/interpreting a text/anime. Factually attributing it to a show does not make sense, neither does using it as a verb to describe what a show is doing. The plebification of language is depressingly unstoppable. |
| I probably regret this post by now. |
Pullman said: Is it time to give up on people ever learning what deconstruction means and how to use it? It's a way of reading/interpreting a text/anime. Factually attributing it to a show does not make sense, neither does using it as a verb to describe what a show is doing. The plebification of language is depressingly unstoppable. Wasnt that the original idea that evolved somehow into what most call a deconstruction nowadays? Try to be concise please cause the topic gets touched way too often anyway :P |
| Oshii is probably the only director that loves dogs. He thinks he's a dog himself. That's right, its slime! It will dissolve your clothing slowly before my eyes! |
HamburgerSpike said: Pullman said: Is it time to give up on people ever learning what deconstruction means and how to use it? It's a way of reading/interpreting a text/anime. Factually attributing it to a show does not make sense, neither does using it as a verb to describe what a show is doing. The plebification of language is depressingly unstoppable. Wasnt that the original idea that evolved somehow into what most call a deconstruction nowadays? Try to be concise please cause the topic gets touched way too often anyway :P Pretty sure in academic circles it still refers to what it initially referred to. I've never run into a professor at uni who would have used deconstruction in this 'modern' way. It's just that when people without the necessary background knowledge/education get a hold of a term they don't know they tend to simplify it so much until they can make sense out of it, even if it completely distorts the original meaning. So imo it's less of time thing and more of a question whether people know what they're talking about, or just picked up a buzzword on the internet. Sure, time was necessary for the term to make it from academic circles into the public consciousness but I don't think it's the main reason why the meaning 'changed'. |
| I probably regret this post by now. |
| .... It's a literary tool. It should be as good as how you use it. |
danilitoleon said: I really don't get the term, since I've seen it several times in reviews and on youtube videos, but thought it was some intellectual word to describe an anime. And the Madoka being a deconstruction thing, seen it thousands of times. "Deconstruction", when used to describe a work of art, means that the authors took a hard look at the tropes prevalent in the genre, and attempted to bring in some realism in it. Usually this is done ham-fistedly, and wrecks all the enjoyment the original genre had. With more care, it is possible to make a "reconstruction", that is, look longer and harder at the genre, and add realism in a way that makes the genre's high concept and enjoyment stand even stronger than before. nry said: I keep reading that this and that other show "deconstructed" this and that other genre and how praised these shows were for having that intention, to the extent that it has almost been accepted as something worthy per se, not regarding the actual quality of the proposal and something every show should attempt to do... A good deconstruction, just like any other good thing, is praiseworthy. Any deconstruction is noteworthy, because all too often it ruins the original genre, turning the show into a pointless tragedy. |
| "deconstruction" is already so played-out it's its own trope now. Usually ruins a show more than it helps these days. |
zombie_pegasus said: Ok, gotcha.That wasn't an exact quote, but they called Nichibros, which is a very normal slice of life anime without any real differences from the standard, a deconstruction of slice of life anime for having jokes I think. They could have just as easily called K-On!, Gakkougurashi, Hyouka, or Oreimo deconstructions. Although it's obviously a wrong definition of the word, the fact that they would call generic anime deconstructions without this even being out of the ordinary anymore brings up a valid point that no one really knows what the word means anymore. Maybe WatchMojo is a deconstruction of top ten lists and Trump is a deconstruction of presidents. The sad part is, they are being serious with that. |
Please learn about cel animation and its technical process. Learn how special effects and backlighting were done without computers. |
| The purpose of deconstruction is, overall, a new and deeper understanding of things and the texts. So it sure sounds like something good. You do know that the term originates with Derrida. Maybe you want to read a bit about him to understand this better. |
| WEAPONS - My blog, for reviews of music, anime, books, and other things |
| It is what it is. According to TVTropes, a deconstruction is examining the consequences of certain tropes used in entertainment. While it probably has more effort put into it than a blatantly generic show, I wouldn't call it an inherently good thing. "Deconstructing" a genre in a boring way isn't forgivable. Similarly, a show can be a "deconstruction", and yet be boring as well. And since the point of most anime (if not all) is to entertain, providing an oh-so-insightful deconstruction should come after the writers have made sure that the show itself is entertaining. This makes me remember some Madoka-fans that appreciate Madoka as a "deconstruction" even though they weren't even familiar with the magical girl genre beforehand. |
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| Better forget that word exists. Nobody knows what it actually means, life pro tip: if someone uses it, ignore him, he has no idea what he's talking about. BTW tvtropes is absolute fucking dogshit plebian site, don't even fucking believe anything it says |
AquamirrorMar 17, 2017 12:55 PM
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| Well people very often call School Days a deconstruction of harem while it's absolute trash at any perceivable aspect and has no redeeming qualities whatsoever so there's that |
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Imaishi said: Well people very often call School Days a deconstruction of harem while it's absolute trash at any perceivable aspect and has no redeeming qualities whatsoever so there's that Your shit taste has reached levels that shouldn't even be possible. :O |
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TheDeadApostle said: This makes me remember some Madoka-fans that appreciate Madoka as a "deconstruction" even though they weren't even familiar with the magical girl genre beforehand. Although I haven't watched it yet, as far as I know the only thing particularly different about it in terms of genre norms is the magical creature/mascot being malicious rather than benevolent/helpful. Those who think suffering and death are particularly noteworthy in the genre clearly do not have much experience with it. |
| if deconstructions are now shit like OPM, and konosuba yea no their bad (not saying the series are bad,) just saying if their what is considered deconstruction, yea then its shit |
| Hottest Take Ever, fite me: Fairy Tail is better than Seiya, Bungou Stray and Hitman Reborn |
Scarlett_ryuken said: if deconstructions are now shit like OPM, and konosuba yea no their bad (not saying the series are bad,) just saying if their what is considered deconstruction, yea then its shit Aren't those both considered parodies of tropes rather than deconstructions? Although fuck it, they may as well be deconstructions if they're parodies. Everything seems to be a deconstruction these days. |
|
This is a tortilla This is a deconstructed tortilla.  Nothing much to say. |
Manaban said: Scarlett_ryuken said: if deconstructions are now shit like OPM, and konosuba yea no their bad (not saying the series are bad,) just saying if their what is considered deconstruction, yea then its shit Aren't those both considered parodies of tropes rather than deconstructions? Although fuck it, they may as well be deconstructions if they're parodies. Everything seems to be a deconstruction these days. watchmojo called OPM a deconstruction and like 10% of the comments were like where's konosuba fucking hell someone said gurren lagann was one |
| Hottest Take Ever, fite me: Fairy Tail is better than Seiya, Bungou Stray and Hitman Reborn |
Scarlett_ryuken said: fucking hell someone said gurren lagann was one fuck this gay ass world it's just not worth it anymore |
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Manaban said: Scarlett_ryuken said: fucking hell someone said gurren lagann was one fuck this gay ass world it's just not worth it anymore Scarlett_ryuken said: everyone knows gurren lagann is actually a reconstructionManaban said: Aren't those both considered parodies of tropes rather than deconstructions? Although fuck it, they may as well be deconstructions if they're parodies. Everything seems to be a deconstruction these days. watchmojo called OPM a deconstruction and like 10% of the comments were like where's konosuba fucking hell someone said gurren lagann was one using the analogy 3 posts above, it's like making a better tortilla from the deconstructed materials |
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romagia said: Scarlett_ryuken said: everyone knows gurren lagann is actually a reconstructionwatchmojo called OPM a deconstruction and like 10% of the comments were like where's konosuba fucking hell someone said gurren lagann was one using the analogy 3 posts above, it's like making a better tortilla from the deconstructed materials I dunno Something lovingly embracing tropes that people think they're tired of doesn't sound as smart, so I still wouldn't put it past some people to say it's a deconstruction. at this point, that term can best be defined as "i added this to describe a show i like therefore falsely inflating its intellectual value in the eyes of people too stupid to figure it out huehue i'm smart like me more pls" |
ManabanMar 17, 2017 8:01 PM
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you know wat, here's the video just bask in the stupidity yourself |
| Hottest Take Ever, fite me: Fairy Tail is better than Seiya, Bungou Stray and Hitman Reborn |
oh goddammit, why is monogatari in the thumbnail I don't even want to watch this video now If it says that it's a deconstruction of H/E then I'm going to get an ulcer EDIT:  i'm going to bed |
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