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| The plot twist at the end was a real surprise. Felt sorry for the hubby. |
| That was really hard to watch. But that's just me because I really can't take seeing and hearing characters in physical pain lmao. Hopefully they get deeper with the Psychological part and less with violence ;A; Honestly I still want more explanation regarding the setting. But I'm willing to wait for the future episodes for that. |
| So heaven = reincarnation (back into this cruel world being reborn into God knows what, which seems more like the true hell). hell = void (nothingness or whatever that means). It seems bollocks to think that heaven and hell was decided by one single game. Christianity? certainly not. Islam? also not that way. Buddhism? decided by karma accumulated throughout the whole life and there are actually hell, still there's no such thing as 0 karma and instant reincarnation iirc. If the condition that they were brought in front of Decim to have a chance to choose is being dead in pairs, it seems unfair to others who didn't die as pairs. I'm of the opinion that the woman didn't have an affair, at least after marriage. She seemed to associate with some jackass before meeting her doctor husband. IF she indeed sacrificed herself so that her husband can go to heaven without guilt, it becomes more unfair that she was sent to the void. I think the biggest clue was Decim being surprised when the woman started to lie. Decim was pretty much Enma and I think he must have known about their past lives at the very least. In the end it doesn't seem like the game even mattered at all since all final judgement was left to Decim anyway. At least that's what it seemed to me. Then again if the husband was reincarnated as a worm that was eaten by a chicken then maybe he was indeed sent to hell =p |
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| Holy crap. That is all. |
| The world shall know the truth soon. |
| Mushi-shi After Life 5/5 |
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| I have several thoughts about the episode and the premise. Are we supposed to believe that when told that they were being tested on whether they deserve heaven or hell, the couple continue to be antagonistic with each other? I'd assume that self-preservation should dictate that they at least pretend to be nice. Of course, one can argue that base emotions got the better of their more logical mind, but still, I find it hard to believe that they would continue to bicker about petty stuff when they were already dead and their eternal fate is at stake. I have a problem with a man being the sole arbiter of who's right and who's wrong in a couple's quarrel. A man is more likely than a woman to be disgusted with a woman cheating on a man. How neutral can he be really? Can the arbiter read minds? Because my impression is that she lied about cheating on him to make him more miserable because she was hurt by his accusations and in a heated moment decided to get back at him emotionally. One interpretation would be that she was sent to hell because she was being intentionally cruel. She destroyed him emotionally. By that she was adjudged to be crueler than him. I'll be more ok with this judgement although I still have issues with it. I'll get to those issues in a moment. But if she was sent to hell simply because she cheated, that's incredibly unfair. Would the arbiter be able to read her mind and understand why she cheated? Maybe she cheated because the man is paranoid, insecure and frequently abusive. In that case, I'd say her cheating is not completely acceptable but rather mitigated by the circumstance of having a shitty husband. In any case, deciding who goes to heaven or hell based on little more than a game or few minutes of observing their argument is absurd. How about weighing the good and bad they did for their entire lives instead of judging them based on one moment of extreme stress and emotional turmoil? Back to my earlier point. Yes, a woman can be crueler with her tongue than a man. Generally, a man tends to hurt someone with physical force while a woman is more likely to hurt someone with words. But that's the evolutionary result of a woman being physically weaker than a man. That's due to a biological and psychological difference between the 2 genders that can be backed up by a plethora of social science and neuroscience data. It's unfair to judge a woman crueler because she uses the best resource available to her. It's not like she calmly weighed up all the options available to her and intentionally chose the cruelest one. It's just that our society deems words to be more hurtful than stick and stones. The guy is no angel. He's paranoid. He repressed his negative feelings within him and allowed them to fester, ensuring that the marriage be doomed to fail regardless of any cheating on the wife's part. His lack of emotional self-control and jealousy directly lead to their deaths. He selfishly wanted to survive at the wife's expense. He wanted to kill her just because she said some mean things to him. All things considered, she may be the less moral one, but considering their fates to be binary (and the difference is literally heaven and hell), is it fair that one goes to heaven and the other hell when one is maybe 5% more fucked up than the other? I've probably said too much already but I actually have much more to say, lol. I understand the show wouldn't exist without the premise and I'd welcome any show that provokes or inspires such philosophical moral arguments. I enjoyed this episode as a whole and would eagerly look forward to more. |
TorribleJan 11, 2015 2:21 AM
| FINALLY! ANIME 2015 HAS BEEN SAVED! Oh god, things were going pretty "weird" in 2015 for anime... Thanks for being here for us Death Parade... I was putting all my hopes on Aldnoah Zero, but that wasn't what I can call a "reliable start"... "Shinmai Maou Maoyuu DxD" wouldn't do this for sure. |
BaaaanJan 11, 2015 2:14 AM
| yep very pumped |
"Urushibara Ruka. The mannerisms and voice of a woman... No... More feminine than any woman. But he's a guy. Taller than Mayuri, but so very thin... But he's a guy. Looks great in a miko outfit... But he's a guy. It's already twilight And yet, it's so hot. The cicadas are crying. But... He's a guy." |
Torrible said: Are we supposed to believe that when told that they were being tested on whether they deserve heaven or hell, the couple continue to be antagonistic with each other? I'd assume that self-preservation should dictate that they at least pretend to be nice. Of course, one can argue that base emotions got the better of their more logical mind, but still, I find it hard to believe that they would continue to bicker about petty stuff when they were already dead and their eternal fate is at stake. Humans are selfish and greedy because they are animalistic qualities that every being innately has. You want to preserve your own life, regardless of what the outcome is. Nobody, or any thing, wants to die, or put themselves at necessary risks for no gain. Adultery isn't quite "petty" as you'd like to believe. It's not a sin that's severe, like murder, but it's a sin nonetheless. The problem with their relationship was that that paranoia had been festering in the husband since even before they actually got married. Torrible said: I have a problem with a man being the sole arbiter of who's right and who's wrong in a couple's quarrel. A man is more likely than a woman to be disgusted with a woman cheating on a man. How neutral can he be really? It is implied that he is quite objective. It has nothing to do with him being influenced by a woman cheating on a man. He judges them based on what they say and do during the game. Torrible said: Can the arbiter read minds? Because my impression is that she lied about cheating on him to make him more miserable because she was hurt by his accusations and in a heated moment decided to get back at him emotionally. One interpretation would be that she was sent to hell because she was being intentionally cruel. She destroyed him emotionally. By that she was adjudged to be crueler than him. I'll be more ok with this judgement although I still have issues with it. I'll get to those issues in a moment. From my perspective, no, Decim cannot read minds. If he could, he would never be surprised. I don't believe he even knows the circumstances of their lives or how they died. All he knows is that they are already dead. Watch the episode again. She says and does things for a reason. From my perspective, she lies about the affair and is intentionally cruel in order to give her husband an out. There's far more evidence to suggest this theory than the the other (she actually was having an affair). Torrible said: But if she was sent to hell simply because she cheated, that's incredibly unfair. Would the arbiter be able to read her mind and understand why she cheated? Maybe she cheated because the man is paranoid, insecure and frequently abusive. In that case, I'd say her cheating is not completely acceptable but rather mitigated by the circumstance of having a shitty husband. In any case, deciding who goes to heaven or hell based on little more than a game or few minutes of observing their argument is absurd. How about weighing the good and bad they did for their entire lives instead of judging them based on one moment of extreme stress and emotional turmoil? She doesn't go to the void because she cheated. It's because of what she says to her husband. Torrible said: Back to my earlier point. Yes, a woman can be crueler with her tongue than a man. Generally, a man tends to hurt someone with physical force while a woman is more likely to hurt someone with words. But that's the evolutionary result of a woman being physically weaker than a man. That's due to a biological and psychological difference between the 2 genders that can be backed up by a plethora of social science and neuroscience data. It's unfair to judge a woman crueler because she uses the best resource available to her. It's not like she calmly weighed up all the options available to her and intentionally chose the cruelest one. All of the things you talk about, except men being biologically physically stronger, are societal gender roles that bias your opinion. Torrible said: The guy is no angel. He's paranoid. He repressed his negative feelings within him and allowed them to fester, ensuring that the marriage be doomed to fail regardless of any cheating on the wife's part. His lack of emotional self-control and jealousy directly lead to their deaths. He selfishly wanted to survive at the wife's expense. He wanted to kill her just because she said some mean things to him. All things considered, she may be the less moral one, but considering their fates to be binary (and the difference is literally heaven and hell), is it fair that one goes to heaven and the other hell when one is maybe 5% more fucked up than the other? And what human is an angel, exactly? Everyone is selfish, though not everyone shows it as explicitly as others. If what the wife said was true, then she would have ruined his life from the marriage onwards. That alone is worthy of the hell door. She would have been the indirect cause of their deaths, regardless of the fact that the husband physically caused it to happen. |
SatireJan 11, 2015 3:23 AM
| whoa what the heck did I just see that was insane. I felt sorry for this lady up until the end. But still that was insane. |
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| So this like a mix of NGNL (without the fan servie) and Gantz(but much better paced)? That sounds awesome. What is interesting is that start the bartender was talking about heaven and hell(therefore Christianity),but at the end of void and reincarnation,which would be Buddhism. More importantly,the man is sent to the void,which is according to Buddhism the goal. That would mean it's not about winning the game,but what they are doing during the game. I realised pretty early one that reaching zero with 7 darts is impossible. 7 x 60 =420. One more evidence that the game is not about the games themself. |
Satire said: Adultery isn't quite "petty" as you'd like to believe. It's not a sin that's severe, like murder, but it's a sin nonetheless. Based on prevailing societal or religious opinion, you'll be right of course. I, however, find it absurb that a betrayal of trust is considered so much more severe just because 2 people put their names to a piece of paper. A boyfriend can cheat on a girlfriend and it's just cheating. Cheat on a spouse and suddenly it's a deadly sin or unforgiveable crime. Society and religion wants to tell me that cheating on a spouse you just married is substantially worse than betraying the trust of a friend you have known for ages because of some invisible and intangible sanctity about marriage. I just don't buy it. Satire said: She doesn't go to the void because she cheated. It's because of what she says to her husband. Do you see the problem there? It's just words. How many of us had, in a moment of impulse, said something really hurtful to the ones we love but deep down we didn't really mean them. It'll be tragic if we were sent to hell based on that one moment of verbal cruelty. If Decim cannot read minds, then he just sent a woman to hell based on his own personal interpretation of her words. She could be lying to spite the husband. She could be lying to protect him. How would Decim know for certain? The lack of certainty is the injustice inherent in the system. Sure, our present justice system isn't perfect, but it is certainly a thousand times more robust when it comes to proving guilt. Satire said: All of the things you talk about, except men being biologically physically stronger, are societal gender roles that bias your opinion. Bias my opinion? Maybe. But the fact remains that there are gender differences beyond physical strength: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sex_differences_in_humans Here it states that women abuse men differently than men abuse women, that women generally favor emotional abuse tactics compared to men: http://psychcentral.com/blog/archives/2014/04/09/invisible-victims-when-men-are-abused/ Anecdotally, both online and IRL, I tend to notice women using snide and sarcasm more effortlessly, effectively and frequently compared to men. My guess is women, being physically weaker, often have to rely on language both as a shield and as a weapon. It's perhaps the reason why they tend to be more empathic, better at language and socially more aware than men. Satire said: And what human is an angel, exactly? Everyone is selfish, though not everyone shows it as explicitly as others. If what the wife said was true, then she would have ruined his life from the marriage onwards. That alone is worthy of the hell door. She would have been the indirect cause of their deaths, regardless of the fact that the husband physically caused it to happen. I disagree with how she would have been the indirect cause of their deaths. Until she admitted (truthfully or otherwise) to her infidelity, he had no way of being 100% sure. It could be that she really had a friend who married another doctor. It's not her fault that he was paranoid and would rather keep his suspicions to himself than be openly communicative. If he had just talked to her, she would either reveal the fact about her friend or lie about her. Either way, his suspicions would have been allayed and they would be still alive. |
TorribleJan 11, 2015 6:03 AM
Knightendus said: Honestly, this story was crafted in a way that nobody would be able to tell what the truth is. Just believe whatever you wanna believe. Couldn't have said any better. I hope the future episodes make things clearer. |
| I loved it like the OVA ! Really interesting to see how the human can be when he is in danger. IMO, the end is interesting, the man will be reincarnated because he is not enough bad to go in hell. And Machiko will go to the void (like heaven I think). She never cheated her husband, the flashback could have happened before their relationship. Great episode ! |
| THAT WAS AWESOME! Totally loved the animation!!! Wanted to stop halfway cuz I didnt bear to watch both of them who supposingly loved each other to hurt one another but meh I was wrong YEZZZ THE GIRL WAS SENT TO HELL Definitely a must watch this season |
Torrible said: Satire said: Adultery isn't quite "petty" as you'd like to believe. It's not a sin that's severe, like murder, but it's a sin nonetheless. Based on prevailing societal or religious opinion, you'll be right of course. I, however, find it absurb that a betrayal of trust is considered so much more severe just because 2 people put their names to a piece of paper. A boyfriend can cheat on a girlfriend and it's just cheating. Cheat on a spouse and suddenly it's a deadly sin or unforgiveable crime. Society and religion wants to tell me that cheating on a spouse you just married is substantially worse than betraying the trust of a friend you have known for ages because of some invisible and intangible sanctity about marriage. I just don't buy it. Satire said: She doesn't go to the void because she cheated. It's because of what she says to her husband. Do you see the problem there? It's just words. How many of us had, in a moment of impulse, said something really hurtful to the ones we love but deep down we didn't really mean them. It'll be tragic if we were sent to hell based on that one moment of verbal cruelty. If Decim cannot read minds, then he just sent a woman to hell based on his own personal interpretation of her words. She could be lying to spite the husband. She could be lying to protect him. How would Decim know for certain? The lack of certainty is the injustice inherent in the system. Sure, our present justice system isn't perfect, but it is certainly a thousand times more robust when it comes to proving guilt. Satire said: All of the things you talk about, except men being biologically physically stronger, are societal gender roles that bias your opinion. Bias my opinion? Maybe. But the fact remains that there are gender differences beyond physical strength: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sex_differences_in_humans Here it states that women abuse men differently than men abuse women, that women generally favor emotional abuse tactics compared to men: http://psychcentral.com/blog/archives/2014/04/09/invisible-victims-when-men-are-abused/ Anecdotally, both online and IRL, I tend to notice women using snide and sarcasm more effortlessly, effectively and frequently compared to men. My guess is women, being physically weaker, often have to rely on language both as a shield and as a weapon. It's perhaps the reason why they tend to be more empathic, better at language and socially more aware than men. Satire said: And what human is an angel, exactly? Everyone is selfish, though not everyone shows it as explicitly as others. If what the wife said was true, then she would have ruined his life from the marriage onwards. That alone is worthy of the hell door. She would have been the indirect cause of their deaths, regardless of the fact that the husband physically caused it to happen. I disagree with how she would have been the indirect cause of their deaths. Until she admitted (truthfully or otherwise) to her infidelity, he had no way of being 100% sure. It could be that she really had a friend who married another doctor. It's not her fault that he was paranoid and would rather keep his suspicions to himself than be openly communicative. If he had just talked to her, she would either reveal the fact about her friend or lie about her. Either way, his suspicions would have been allayed and they would be still alive. Everything in you argument is flawed 'If you think the women is an amazing dart player' she always had the lead in the dart game if only by a little bit. That double shot right after his "hand slipped" was amazing if you think it was intentional. After that she trys to get pity from him "not in the belly". Then they are she has one dart left. The last short just needed to hit the board to win. |
| Wow that was really much better than i expected! Reminds me of Jigoku Shoujo :) |
| Quite a start. Intriquing plus visually and animationally stunning. It's a good set up - hopefully this continues into a good story. |
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Sakaitsu said: I loved it like the OVA ! Really interesting to see how the human can be when he is in danger. IMO, the end is interesting, the man will be reincarnated because he is not enough bad to go in hell. And Machiko will go to the void (like heaven I think). She never cheated her husband, the flashback could have happened before their relationship. Great episode ! How's so? She was wearing her marriage ring http://i.imgur.com/MC4F5zr.jpg pyreholocaust said: THAT WAS AWESOME! Totally loved the animation!!! Wanted to stop halfway cuz I didnt bear to watch both of them who supposingly loved each other to hurt one another but meh I was wrong YEZZZ THE GIRL WAS SENT TO HELL Definitely a must watch this season You sure she was sent to hell? It has never been stated so. Void=/=Hell |
| So the wifey was sent to the Void, and the Husband set to be reincarnated.... If I remember correctly, in certain religions the attainment of enlightenment was likened to having achieved a void-like state of being, whereas reincarnation was suppose to be a punishment (for having to go through the pain of birth, life and death, and also because being reincarnated doesn't necessarily mean you stay the same i.e. Humans can reincarnate into bugs, animals, plants). I'm not sure whether there was any symbolism regarding the Haniwas above each elevator (could be just decor for the bar) in showing where they take you, but you have to remember that both the husband and wife stepped out from different elevators as well (and ended up getting on the same one they stepped out from). I'm speculating, but I'm of the opinion that the lift selection doesn't matter, but rather where they end up. Though.... I have no explanation for her flashback of being in bed with another man (nor the ring on her forth finger, considering that if she was wearing an engagement ring it should be on her middle finger.... not that most Japanese people actually wear wedding bands/engagement rings in their daily lives either...). I find myself confused to no end with that freeze flashback because of all the discrepancies, since they were on their way to their honeymoon. I mean, unless the affair took place between the honeymoon and the wedding, that flashback wouldn't really make much sense.... The picture in itself is plenty damning though. Sigh... I really don't know what to think regarding this. I do have an issue with the rules of the game though. The basis of reaching the bar are that two unfortunate souls die at the same moment (or maybe the same accident) right? Should an accident have occurred whereby neither persons were responsible for it, would the judgment for both souls reflect this? Also, the game they played had a winner and a loser, but they never stated whether the outcome of the game was to be used in the judgement of their souls, now did they? Wouldn't it be possible that both souls were judged to be "good", or vice versa both to be "evil"? Shit, this anime is so good that it's making me overthink too many things... Hopefully that question the girl was asking at the end might be the answer to what I need.... if they answer it next episode... |
HESTIA   APPROVES |
| Hmm, good feel and expected twist at the end (the same as in OVA) but now I wonder if they want to go episodic or not because they simply cannot repeat this twist/concept for all episode. Maybe those aribiters will change? Or perhaps there won't be new pair in every new episode. Still, this is going to top of my watch list this season. I just wonder how long they could linger in afterlife before they were forced into playing. And it seem we are getting some backstory of afterlife club in next episode. |
| This shit fuels my soul, i would rate it 10 but i have to wait more eps damn |
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| DAT ANIMATION aawesome similar to jigoku shoujo +- |
Torrible said: Satire said: Adultery isn't quite "petty" as you'd like to believe. It's not a sin that's severe, like murder, but it's a sin nonetheless. Based on prevailing societal or religious opinion, you'll be right of course. I, however, find it absurb that a betrayal of trust is considered so much more severe just because 2 people put their names to a piece of paper. A boyfriend can cheat on a girlfriend and it's just cheating. Cheat on a spouse and suddenly it's a deadly sin or unforgiveable crime. Society and religion wants to tell me that cheating on a spouse you just married is substantially worse than betraying the trust of a friend you have known for ages because of some invisible and intangible sanctity about marriage. I just don't buy it. Meh. Marriage is supposed to be by human standards an ultimate pact generally, hell even boyfriends and girlfriends can expect a certain level of loyalty in this world based on how society thinks. All morals, ethics and such things are based on societies beliefs and standards. If we're going to go in such a route of discussion this whole anime would be pointless because good, evil and all that are subjective. You seem to be trying to go into the direction that loyalty in relationships is some bs human construct demanded, but the same can be said about people expecting others not to kill people, rape kids and all the things we consider wrong. |
| Jaywalker. |
| just finished watching the episode, weird opening for that kind of anime, wow good art style interesting story, i can tell that this is going to be a good overall anime series 5/5 |
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Torrible said: Can the arbiter read minds? Because my impression is that she lied about cheating on him to make him more miserable because she was hurt by his accusations and in a heated moment decided to get back at him emotionally. One interpretation would be that she was sent to hell because she was being intentionally cruel. She destroyed him emotionally. By that she was adjudged to be crueler than him. I'll be more ok with this judgement although I still have issues with it. I'll get to those issues in a moment. Hmm, interesting thought, I was thinking the same. Yes, it seems she really did't cheat on him. There was close-up on main arbiter after she said that though, he just realized or noticed something, or was he suprised? Either way, he was also guilty in its way when you think about it. Being suspicious and jealous of her even when he didn't have to was also one of the reason their marriage wasn't as good as it could be. One can say he provoked her to do some things because of his insecurity. But there really is no 'good' or 'bad' choice in this process, it's 'bad' and 'even worse', that's one thing that this series is trying to tell us. It really don't matter which door you'll go, as no matter what you are already dead. The only difference is, one is getting the chance to make up for his mistakes in another life while the other does not. But who knows if they aren't also judging based on how many of previous choices those people were given before. The most interesting theme here is denying one of reincarnation cycle when his soul is destroyed. That just leaves two more questions: a) whatever happens to souls of those who refuses to play and is every mortal ending his life coming here? b) if there is a Void where a soul is destroyed where those new souls are coming from? or are they effectively lowering amount of souls in the world? (that really could be a big problem one day, I hope they explain this one) Of course, the question also is if this afterlife is torn out of time-flowing or not as that would change a lot of things. The game is really not important as it only serves as sort of reconcilliation with previous life. |
Epicenter said: Torrible said: Based on prevailing societal or religious opinion, you'll be right of course. I, however, find it absurb that a betrayal of trust is considered so much more severe just because 2 people put their names to a piece of paper. A boyfriend can cheat on a girlfriend and it's just cheating. Cheat on a spouse and suddenly it's a deadly sin or unforgiveable crime. Society and religion wants to tell me that cheating on a spouse you just married is substantially worse than betraying the trust of a friend you have known for ages because of some invisible and intangible sanctity about marriage. I just don't buy it. Meh. Marriage is supposed to be by human standards an ultimate pact generally, hell even boyfriends and girlfriends can expect a certain level of loyalty in this world based on how society thinks. All morals, ethics and such things are based on societies beliefs and standards. If we're going to go in such a route of discussion this whole anime would be pointless because good, evil and all that are subjective. You seem to be trying to go into the direction that loyalty in relationships is some bs human construct demanded, but the same can be said about people expecting others not to kill people, rape kids and all the things we consider wrong. " You seem to be trying to go into the direction that loyalty in relationships is some bs human construct demanded, but the same can be said about people expecting others not to kill people, rape kids and all the things we consider wrong." " All morals, ethics and such things are based on societies beliefs and standards." You answered your own question. |
Makaze_no_Moujuu said: Epicenter said: Meh. Marriage is supposed to be by human standards an ultimate pact generally, hell even boyfriends and girlfriends can expect a certain level of loyalty in this world based on how society thinks. All morals, ethics and such things are based on societies beliefs and standards. If we're going to go in such a route of discussion this whole anime would be pointless because good, evil and all that are subjective. You seem to be trying to go into the direction that loyalty in relationships is some bs human construct demanded, but the same can be said about people expecting others not to kill people, rape kids and all the things we consider wrong. " You seem to be trying to go into the direction that loyalty in relationships is some bs human construct demanded, but the same can be said about people expecting others not to kill people, rape kids and all the things we consider wrong." " All morals, ethics and such things are based on societies beliefs and standards." You answered your own question. ? I don't recall asking a question. I don't understand what you're trying to say. |
| Jaywalker. |
| Wow. |
 |
Epicenter said: Makaze_no_Moujuu said: " You seem to be trying to go into the direction that loyalty in relationships is some bs human construct demanded, but the same can be said about people expecting others not to kill people, rape kids and all the things we consider wrong." " All morals, ethics and such things are based on societies beliefs and standards." You answered your own question. ? I don't recall asking a question. I don't understand what you're trying to say. Okay, well you didn't answer a question of any kind, but, to me, it seemed like you were disagreeing with Torrible. If that is the case, I'm just pointing out that your own words prove him right, and, if you disagree, your post contradicts you. |
| Personally her "confession" on "cheating" felt extremely unnatural to me, both in mimics and voice. And her memories of him are clearly happy. Hell, wouldn't she think about her "true lover" for a bit knowing she's dead? It might be that she grew spiteful... or maybe she actually tried to liberate her loved one from suffering? I mean, imagine how disgusted with himrself he was - his lack of trust killed his loved one and their baby, he's basically a low murderer of his own family. So she lied to him to, well, relatively ease his pain, self-hatred and bitter disappointment. Btw, I'm against cheating myself, but I believe that in morals outside of our system of monogamous relationships, attempting to murder another person just because of your shallow and unconfirmed jeaulousy is much worse than having an affair. And yeah, as people above mentioned, the void might actually represent freedom and joy for your good deeds. The masks have always been tricky since the OVA, wouldn't rely on them too much. |
StarryKiteJan 11, 2015 2:36 PM
| We have to keep our dreams alive. Something to look forward to. |
Makaze_no_Moujuu said: Epicenter said: ? I don't recall asking a question. I don't understand what you're trying to say. Okay, well you didn't answer a question of any kind, but, to me, it seemed like you were disagreeing with Torrible. If that is the case, I'm just pointing out that your own words prove him right, and, if you disagree, your post contradicts you. I don't see it that way at all. The point of my post was that morals and ethics are based on human constructs, society has decided these things. He calls out the disdain for infidelity between married couples as if the importance of it is due to what we perceive as right and wrong forced down by society and he thinks that is "absurd", yet he seems to care for concepts of deadly sins and unforgivable crimes which too just like infidelity are concepts we create and care about. If we're going down the rabbit hole of disregarding things simply because its a societal concept, than this whole anime is pointless and so are his thoughts on deadly sins and crimes, we decide what are sins and crime just as much as we decide that infidelity between married couples is severe. |
| Jaywalker. |
| good shit |
| Great episode. I liked Death Billiards more tho. I wouldn't even mind if it's an episodic series, but there is probably an overarching story here. |
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Flyffel said: I thought (because of the way both characters were portrayed at their breakdowns) that the episode was Akame ga Kill ep. 1 level of "BAD PEOPLE ACT NICE BUT ARE BAD AND DISGUSTING" (which is really boring tbh), but the way you guys saw it makes me like the show more. I really do hope that there was more thought put into this instead of just making both people "bad", it would promise a better show to follow. I don't really understand why the show happens the way it does. This (and the Anime Mirai one) both had the characters slowly remember random memories that showed them in a bad light. Why? Why not just have them never forgot, or why not have them remember it all after the game. Is it just to add pointless twists? |
| MADHOUSE.IS.GOD. |
Torrible said: Based on prevailing societal or religious opinion, you'll be right of course. I, however, find it absurb that a betrayal of trust is considered so much more severe just because 2 people put their names to a piece of paper. A boyfriend can cheat on a girlfriend and it's just cheating. Cheat on a spouse and suddenly it's a deadly sin or unforgiveable crime. Society and religion wants to tell me that cheating on a spouse you just married is substantially worse than betraying the trust of a friend you have known for ages because of some invisible and intangible sanctity about marriage. I just don't buy it. Societal biases aside, companionship is something that every animal seeks, humans included. It can be for the sole sake of reproduction, or it can be for the sake of animals wanting to be with their own kind naturally. In the case of adultery, the problem lies in the fact that you're having an affair and have full knowledge about it. You're betraying the trust of another. You know it's wrong, but you've done it anyway. There's malice there. It's not an unforgivable crime, nor did I imply that it was, so I have no idea why you would pull that out of the blue. A boyfriend/girlfriend cheating is not as severe as a spouse cheating. Both aren't stellar scenarios, but you go through more steps to be married to someone and thus cheating on them is worse. Torrible said: Do you see the problem there? It's just words. How many of us had, in a moment of impulse, said something really hurtful to the ones we love but deep down we didn't really mean them. It'll be tragic if we were sent to hell based on that one moment of verbal cruelty. If Decim cannot read minds, then he just sent a woman to hell based on his own personal interpretation of her words. She could be lying to spite the husband. She could be lying to protect him. How would Decim know for certain? The lack of certainty is the injustice inherent in the system. Sure, our present justice system isn't perfect, but it is certainly a thousand times more robust when it comes to proving guilt. He sent her to hell because she set herself up for that route. Her actions, in actuality, were kind. Although at face value it seems as if she says a lot of cruel things, they are not cruel. In fact, they're more of a blessing for the husband. Look at him. He's a broken person. He killed himself, his wife, and his unborn child. They both know it because they both saw the flashback. Now think about it. If it turned out that he caused their deaths and she was not cheating on him, the amount of guilt he would feel would be insurmountable. She gives him an out and relieves some of his guilt. Decim doesn't seem to know their past, because if he did, he would have sent the woman to be reincarnated. Decim judges them on what they say and do. The implications of what she said would have indirectly caused their deaths, which puts her at more fault than her husband. Torrible said: Bias my opinion? Maybe. But the fact remains that there are gender differences beyond physical strength: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sex_differences_in_humans Here it states that women abuse men differently than men abuse women, that women generally favor emotional abuse tactics compared to men: http://psychcentral.com/blog/archives/2014/04/09/invisible-victims-when-men-are-abused/ Anecdotally, both online and IRL, I tend to notice women using snide and sarcasm more effortlessly, effectively and frequently compared to men. My guess is women, being physically weaker, often have to rely on language both as a shield and as a weapon. It's perhaps the reason why they tend to be more empathic, better at language and socially more aware than men. Sure, there are differences. But none of which you cover in your original quote other than men being physically stronger biologically. Saying that women are more likely to use words is based on how they are supposed to act based on society's standards and their role(s) in it. Women are generally more passive and focus less on physical strength because of societal gender roles. Men, in our society, are supposed to be that role. If we were in a more natural, primitive state, let's say the caveman age, I'm certain things would not be the same. Torrible said: I disagree with how she would have been the indirect cause of their deaths. Until she admitted (truthfully or otherwise) to her infidelity, he had no way of being 100% sure. It could be that she really had a friend who married another doctor. It's not her fault that he was paranoid and would rather keep his suspicions to himself than be openly communicative. If he had just talked to her, she would either reveal the fact about her friend or lie about her. Either way, his suspicions would have been allayed and they would be still alive. She does admit it... That's what her whole "cruel" speech was about. Whether she's telling the truth or not is up to the audience to decide. There's far more evidence to suggest that she was not cheating on him though. In case you didn't know, people tend to want to be right. The husband is obviously not thinking logically. If she says she cheated on him and never loved him, which he had been thinking since they got married, then why wouldn't he feel inclined to believe her? If she did in fact cheat on him, then his suspicions would have been justified. He would have been right to suspect her, and thus the weight of his actions are lessened by the fact that she was a terrible person all along and strung him along. |
| After seeing the original OVA back during Anime Mirai, I was pretty damn delighted to hear about this and my expectations were extremely high. This exceeded all expectations I could throw at it this first episode, and MADHOUSE very rarely disappoints me is. I'm excited to see where it all goes from here. |
"I don't want to be alone, I want to be left alone"-AH -Currently Enjoying- Anime: •ORANGE •91 Days •JoJo's Bizarre Adventure: Diamond is Unbreakable [Part IV] •Mob Psycho 100 •Bokuno Hero Academia Manga: •Biorg Trinity •Shingeki no Kyojin •Kangoku Gakuen •Akame ga Kill! •JoJo's Bizarre Adventure: JoJolion [Part VIII] •The Gamer |
| My mouth was opened during the last half OMFG 0___0 Conflicted on wheither she cheated on him or not. But she did let her husband get reincarnated in the end. Darts game reminded me of Hunter X Hunter. Darts Nen user Chimera Ant. |
AnimeFan500 said: she did cheatMy mouth was opened during the last half OMFG 0___0 Conflicted on wheither she cheated on him or not. But she did let her husband get reincarnated in the end. Darts game reminded me of Hunter X Hunter. Darts Nen user Chimera Ant. |
Celestrial2 said: she did cheat Like I've said to other people who think she cheated, watch the episode again and pay attention to the finer details. You might change your mind. The cinematography and screenplay are amazing in this series. |
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