| This thread should be relevant again. Fanboys from all sides are spamming 1s to other shows. There must be something done about it. |
 |
| In the last 3 days, Gintama S4 and LOGH score has dropped 0.02 !! and those two exactly their score change 0.01 once by year. |
| Okay but what about those account which have seen a number of anime and rated them accordingly but have rated Gintama or Aot a 1?Does this rating count? Please fix the score for Logh too. Bloomberry said: This thread should be relevant again. Fanboys from all sides are spamming 1s to other shows. There must be something done about it. Yeah,their votes don't count anyway. |
ScordoloJan 6, 2021 10:43 PM
 Scordolo's Recent Reviews To your eternity Vanitas no Karte |
PrasantGrG said: yeah, @kineta. Lotgh is doomed.LoGH score fix when? We already got Gintama fixed. SnK S4 is still getting bombed with 1s wonder how or if it's impacting the score |
| "I think I wanted to attack something. Like betraying people or hurting people. And, well, it's not exactly nice, but hurting the readers too... In all honestly, I feel that's what I really wanted to do. For me, as a reader, when I think, "this manga will remain in my heart," it means, for example, it phenomenally hurt me: It's those kinds of experiences I'm after." - Pajime Hisayama (My favourite hurting author). |
| when i see Gintama in top rank,, i know the rank is fixed by mal since our biggest troll anime in top |
 |
Play2X said: I think we need some reviewing of the system, because I don't have the feeling it does the intended job with SnK right now. Well, I guess you should be a happy fellow now. |
| I'd like everyone to imagine the scores in the database as an ever-changing fluid system which is not only dependent on the scores given to one entry, but to the scores given across the entire database. Everyone likes to treat it as a simple average, but it's not. Small fluctuations in score are normal, especially while the series is airing, and its score only really becomes "locked in" months after it finishes airing. (And actually, even then it doesn't, because the scores for most series degrade over time as they become older and younger fans don't find them as appealing.) Then I'd like everyone to take a deep breath and realize that a 0.02 change in score out of 10 is not synonymous with words like "demolished" and "insane". Nor is it something to have a panic about and create a bunch of rating accounts trying to counteract (or encourage) a scoring change with. The anime chart isn't a baseball or football game, okay. This shouldn't be viewed as a competition. It's not a competition. No one is winning or losing. It's viewing it like a competition that exacerbates this whole issue and turns it into a giant drama that nobody needs. Please consider priorities and what's most important for your experience on MAL. Is it a 0.02 change in score? Or is it an app with dark mode, a website with more modern design, or XX/YY feature you'd like to see implemented instead? I'll talk to the tech team, review the scores and keep an eye on the situation over the next weeks. However, I'm more concerned about finding a way to combat the ridiculous character favorites botting we've had going on recently. I trust that the rating troll system we have in place is dealing with the majority of accounts, and that we'll catch any ones we may have missed once we sort out what to do for characters. So please: focus on enjoying the show. Not on what the score is today vs yesterday. Else it's going to be a long journey to April... |
Play2X said: \Kineta said: I'd like everyone to imagine the scores in the database as an ever-changing fluid system which is not only dependent on the scores given to one entry, but to the scores given across the entire database. Everyone likes to treat it as a simple average, but it's not. Small fluctuations in score are normal, especially while the series is airing, and its score only really becomes "locked in" months after it finishes airing. (And actually, even then it doesn't, because the scores for most series degrade over time as they become older and younger fans don't find them as appealing.) Then I'd like everyone to take a deep breath and realize that a 0.02 change in score out of 10 is not synonymous with words like "demolished" and "insane". Nor is it something to have a panic about and create a bunch of rating accounts trying to counteract (or encourage) a scoring change with. The anime chart isn't a baseball or football game, okay. This shouldn't be viewed as a competition. It's not a competition. No one is winning or losing. It's viewing it like a competition that exacerbates this whole issue and turns it into a giant drama that nobody needs. Please consider priorities and what's most important for your experience on MAL. Is it a 0.02 change in score? Or is it an app with dark mode, a website with more modern design, or XX/YY feature you'd like to see implemented instead? I'll talk to the tech team, review the scores and keep an eye on the situation over the next weeks. However, I'm more concerned about finding a way to combat the ridiculous character favorites botting we've had going on recently. I trust that the rating troll system we have in place is dealing with the majority of accounts, and that we'll catch any ones we may have missed once we sort out what to do for characters. So please: focus on enjoying the show. Not on what the score is today vs yesterday. Else it's going to be a long journey to April... At least I am not talking about a small change over a few days, but rather about 150k of 10 votes, of which 100k came in the last month. Same for the other seasons of SnK, really. I am aware that a lot of new accounts are made because, well, with corona we have an influx of new people as well, of which certainly a lot of people are legitimate accounts, but when those 100k accounts all just happen to vote specifically SnK as 10, I am a bit dubious. Especially because (at least from what information we have on this thread) the 10 votes are still counted, since they are neither in a single timeframe as happened during Ishuzoku times, nor are they 1s that are simple to filter. Right now, the whole feature of the mean score is abused by both HnR:B and SnK fans, and both give this site a bad name, and a bad time. Of course, the favorite character botting is just as bad, even though a lot of people don't notice that. I talked a long time about this with my best friend, who works in IT security, and according to him the only way to possibly get this situation under control is two-factor authentification. As much as I hate it, but to get the favorites and means to know anything at all and not being some joke, we apparently NEED two-factoring. I mean, a positive is that two-factoring increases security, so it isn't a completely useless allocation of time. By the way, I neither care about Brotherhood, nor Kyojin on a personal level, I just want the mean score to mean something. season 3 part 2 has close to 300k 10/10 votes what the fuck? Why is it hard to believe the final season of the most popular anime of the last decade can't produce 100k 10/10 then? Makes no fucking sense. season 3 part 2 is 9.10, its only natural the final season and the best arc by many in the final season will be rated even higher. Here is the formula https://myanimelist.net/info.php?go=topanime calculate it yourself with the stats and you will realise the score you see is not what is reflective of the overall score. For example snk is t 9.17, with 60.5% 10/10 while fmab is 50% 10/10, the fact that snk is 9.17 means the legit 10/10 vote is probably between 49%-54% so about 7-10% of those 10/10 votes are bot account that are not counted. We don't know how mal anit bot system works, but we can assume that any new account that was made to upvote or downvote a series will not be counted. Despite the final season 10/10 votes still increasing the score is still decreasing it, means more legit accounts are giving it a low score than bot account, hence why even if a snk fan made a 20k 10/10 bot accounts to boost snk it will be a waste because the anti bot system will not include it. S |
| @Kineta My question is, wouldn't it be easier if you make it a bit more harder to make accounts? Like an account would have to verify the email before it can be activated? Because I am sure users that are making bot accounts are using random email generator to easily create fake accounts. |
keragamming said: @Kineta My question is, wouldn't it be easier if you make it a bit more harder to make accounts? Like an account would have to verify the email before it can be activated? Because I am sure users that are making bot accounts are using random email generator to easily create fake accounts. Those type of accounts are not counted into real scores. Kineta said: I'd like everyone to imagine the scores in the database as an ever-changing fluid system which is not only dependent on the scores given to one entry, but to the scores given across the entire database. Everyone likes to treat it as a simple average, but it's not. Small fluctuations in score are normal, especially while the series is airing, and its score only really becomes "locked in" months after it finishes airing. (And actually, even then it doesn't, because the scores for most series degrade over time as they become older and younger fans don't find them as appealing.) Then I'd like everyone to take a deep breath and realize that a 0.02 change in score out of 10 is not synonymous with words like "demolished" and "insane". Nor is it something to have a panic about and create a bunch of rating accounts trying to counteract (or encourage) a scoring change with. The anime chart isn't a baseball or football game, okay. This shouldn't be viewed as a competition. It's not a competition. No one is winning or losing. It's viewing it like a competition that exacerbates this whole issue and turns it into a giant drama that nobody needs. Please consider priorities and what's most important for your experience on MAL. Is it a 0.02 change in score? Or is it an app with dark mode, a website with more modern design, or XX/YY feature you'd like to see implemented instead? I'll talk to the tech team, review the scores and keep an eye on the situation over the next weeks. However, I'm more concerned about finding a way to combat the ridiculous character favorites botting we've had going on recently. I trust that the rating troll system we have in place is dealing with the majority of accounts, and that we'll catch any ones we may have missed once we sort out what to do for characters. So please: focus on enjoying the show. Not on what the score is today vs yesterday. Else it's going to be a long journey to April... So sad to see that an admin had to create a full essay just to advice these users.Come on mal users you can be better than to be involved in these childish score wars. |
ScordoloFeb 6, 2021 11:43 AM
Scordolo's Recent Reviews To your eternity Vanitas no Karte |
| @Scordolo I know that, but she said that they are looking for ways to counter the bot accounts that are increasing the favourite count for characters, example Luffy and Levi, so I'm saying if they had done that, it would be a lot harder and more time consuming for persons to create many bot accounts. So imo, either they shadow ban those accounts from increasing the favourite list or have a automatic kill switch that will delete them instantly after they are created and action shows that it was created sorely to increase the favourite list. |
keragamming said: @Scordolo I know that, but she said that they are looking for ways to counter the bot accounts that are increasing the favourite count for characters, example Luffy and Levi, so I'm saying if they had done that, it would be a lot harder and more time consuming for persons to create many bot accounts. So imo, either they shadow ban those accounts from increasing the favourite list or have a automatic kill switch that will delete them instantly after they are created and action shows that it was created sorely to increase the favourite list. I forgot that favorite characters list even existed...Anyway those list are not even important.It's what the score matters as that is the crucial factor as it decides the early first impression of the anime.If a casual wants to watch it. |
Scordolo's Recent Reviews To your eternity Vanitas no Karte |
| I think I have a solution for this problem once and for all, one that completely discounts brigading altogether. A new vote-counting mechanism in place of the old one. In this new system, anti-brigading is focused on three major scores: 10s, 9s and 1s. For 10s and 9s the overall fanbase size comes into play, and the number is then adjusted to its brigading power, a number based on the ratio between the fanbase size and the oveall MALbase. This means that small anime would not be affected by this, as naturally, the fanbases would be too small and the numbers uninflated. For the 1s, it is more tricky, as brigading is external, and we can't tell how many voters swoop in and from where. While this may be easy for this particular hot topic right now, it is too circumstantial and we can't keep track of all the drama for this (the point is to bypass it.) So instead I used an equation that downscales the number of 1s dramatically for all anime, to a point where it's in-line with the other scores. With that, I would proceed to count the scores for the top 10 anime and make a site for this alternative listing. |
| End Zionazism |
Mikasa said: I think I have a solution for this problem once and for all, one that completely discounts brigading altogether. A new vote-counting mechanism in place of the old one. In this new system, anti-brigading is focused on three major scores: 10s, 9s and 1s. For 10s and 9s the overall fanbase size comes into play, and the number is then adjusted to its brigading power, a number based on the ratio between the fanbase size and the oveall MALbase. This means that small anime would not be affected by this, as naturally, the fanbases would be too small and the numbers uninflated. For the 1s, it is more tricky, as brigading is external, and we can't tell how many voters swoop in and from where. While this may be easy for this particular hot topic right now, it is too circumstantial and we can't keep track of all the drama for this (the point is to bypass it.) So instead I used an equation that downscales the number of 1s dramatically for all anime, to a point where it's in-line with the other scores. With that, I would proceed to count the scores for the top 10 anime and make a site for this alternative listing. The ratio idea is pretty good actually. |
| HUNTER X HUNTER HAS RETURNED!!!!!!! |
| Yes this is a factor I'm taking into account. But also, anime length plays a big factor. It's easier for dupe accounts' scores to count for shorter anime, because the condition of having watched 1/5 of the episodes is more easily fulfilled |
| End Zionazism |
ghostfaceon said: Well the condition for having watched 1/5 can easily be faked anyway. So it's a problem for every show, regardless of its length. The big puzzle is how to verify these votes Yeah but we need to factor in that the shorter the anime, the less savvy the fans are about such things. |
| End Zionazism |
| Or just use reviews as the basis of score. On top of that, disregard duplicate reviews (it's not that hard to detect troll reviews and plagiarism). On top of that, add rating system for these reviews, and give less or no weight to troll reviews. Genuine reviews would have an equal weight no matter what their ratings are. And limit participation of the new accounts (they can rate, but their rating won't be counted until they reach a certain karma, which can be calculated based on activity like making posts or giving reviews, or just commenting in threads. Again tie the users to a rating system, so bots can't gain karma and something like that). It's not a perfect solution, but still a better one. |
 |
| Posts #1252 to #1261 merged from a dupe thread. There's already a system in place, please use this thread if you have any suggestions on how to make it better. |
ghostfaceon said: So for certain lengths, the metric for having watched a certain %age of the show should be changed. So for 1 cour which is the majority of the seasonal shows, ratings should be counted, say after having watched 2/3rds or even 3/4ths of the show, with 2 cours, 50% and for longer, 1/5ths This is absolutey true, there's no reason why one should have to watch over 200 episodes of, say One Piece for their score to count. They should have an equation where the percentage of episodes one needs to watch decreases as the number of episodes increases. But I disagree with your 2/3rds or even 3/4ths requirement. Outside of movies (since there are no fractional episodes), there should be no series where your vote is discounted despite watching half of the series. A range of 5% (for the longest series) and like 1/3 (for the smallest) seems ideal. |
| I'm not sure where to psot this but MAL needs to reassess it's stupid ranking system. I've said this when Gintama raided the top 10 and I'll say it now that it's literally just gintama and SNK. SORT ANIME BY IP NOT BY FUCKING SEASONS. I'm not saying combine the scores. Just sort all gintama, SNK, etc seasons into one IP each, and keep the highest one on the list. Underneath show "other seasons by this show, and list sub-listings with their respective scores. So instead of 2 and 3 being SNK. Just have #2 be SNK and the Season 3 Part 2 show up underneath it as a text. Then number # would be Gintama or whatever is currently number 4. |
| End Zionazism |
| Can something be done for favorites? These botters have now moved from botting the score of their favorite anime to botting favorites for particular anime and characters. One look at archive.org pages from a few months back and the favorites page now should prove this. |
| Why are you Fruit's basket fans trying to make this sound like a serious global conflict when anime's get downvoted from the first place all the time? Life is unfair, bear with it. Fruit's basket is a niche anime and cannot surpass the giant that is FMAB. |
 |
| the Anti Bot System cannot correct scores from legitimate and long time users afaik so clearly there are group of long time users here on MAL that are vote brigading |
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