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| The hypocrisy about making a message to the pirates that they're not worth it without killing any of them made me die a little inside. |
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katsucats said: The hypocrisy about making a message to the pirates that they're not worth it without killing any of them made me die a little inside. Yeah, I think I also wanted to hurt them quite a bit. |
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| Just kill them RED! When two people don't agree with, you kill one! Problem solve! |
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| An advanced civilization has no concept of "thank you"? That's hamfisted. Whatever, I think I being hard on the series because it's Urobuchi/I.G and I automatically expect great things. katsucats said: The hypocrisy about making a message to the pirates that they're not worth it without killing any of them made me die a little inside. True that. |
AnimageNeby said: No it wouldn't. It just covers the land, in essence, it doesn't grind it. Maybe you're thinking about glaciers and the sort, but those erode just because there is *melting* going on; that's why erosion occurs there the most during summertime. Now, imagine a world where everything is frozen solid, and you actually don't have much erosion anymore. Even the erosion of the sea in coastal area's would be gone. And even if it were 'warm' enough to melt and thus have sliding glaciers which cause erosion, area's like the Himalayas 'grow' much faster than they are eroded. In fact, on earth the landmass is continuously replenished through volcanic activity and continental drift. It can't be explained by all land being 'eroded' by the ice, thus. ;-) Glaciers don't erode by melting. They erode by ice movement. What happens is that the massive pressure of the ice causes the very lower layers to become soft and creates a slip layer. Then basically you get massive rivers of ice that gouge out the land. So yes covering the land with ice will erode the land. For the movement to be continuous you need to have continued deposition of ice at the 'headwaters' of the glacier. |
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| His reaction to food is hilarious given it isn't unexpected seeing as how he has never eaten anything of that nature before. |
Hakuromatsu said: An advanced civilization has no concept of "thank you"? That's hamfisted. I think it was more to the point of him not knowing why they kept saying that phrase in their language and wondering about it. Chamber explained that it was a sentiment of gratitude, so he does know what "gratitude" is. They just say "thank you" in another way in his language. |
| First time in the history of an Urubuchi Gen anime, no blood spilled in the 3rd episode. The OP/ED makes me think this anime won't turn gore, but you never know. Fascinating this anime I tell you! 5/5 |
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shanimebib said: First time in the history of an Urubuchi Gen anime, no blood spilled in the 3rd episode. The OP/ED makes me think this anime won't turn gore, but you never know. Fascinating this anime I tell you! 5/5 Remember the Madoka OP =D |
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| I wonder how exactly this will end in just 12 episodes. It's a great pacing for a longer show, but for a 1-cour? Seriously? And the manga isn't even finished yet. |
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| Wow |
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| Awesome episode and that artwork is amazing. |
| just awesome |
| Pretty silly show thus far. Girl asks him to beat pirates. He beats pirates. Girl gets upset that he beat pirates. Like, he probably killed them in the most humane way possible, and they wouldn't hesitate to take their lives, so what's the big deal? I'm not a soldier, and I would agree with his actions, yet it seems like they play him not understanding why it was "wrong" is simply because he is a soldier. And now in retaliation, pirates are attacking. The kid could wipe them all out in a blink of an eye. But instead, they would rather take causalities and pretend like they are playing an important role in fighting the pirates, than just let the kid just destroy them. Even though they still ultimately can't beat the pirates without him. It makes no sense. This is what you get with Urobuchi though I guess. |
Jinta said: I hope so..Does Ledo find a way to talk properly, it kind of annoys me how slow the dialogues sometimes are ... |
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| I too found the whole "you shouldn't kill" thing a bit stupid. But hey, I guess the episode would be far less interesting if he just 1 shot KO'd everyone though. |
| hmm, a little bit boring in this episode |
Irenesharda said: starmaker032 said: Irenesharda said: scruffykiwi said: Kurogashi said: fucking hippies. they lost a bunch of people in that fight when that kid couldve roflstomped them all in one shot. The're not being hippies. They simply don't trust Ledo to not turn his guns onto them after he's wiped out the pirates. The'd much rather kill him and dump him into the sea. I think the reason why some people can't get their head around the locals response is that they are too used to the idea of overwhelming military might, ie 'shock and awe'. Instead this society seem to be living in the world where balance is very important, which is why they didn't want the second battle to be won by overwhelming might. Something that disurbes balance can lead to outright war .. and if Ledo buggers off in the middle of it they are all pirate bate! But "balance of power" IS what it's all about. If the pirates, who are not a nation but parasites and bullies, sees that Gargantia has the ability to protect themselves and cargo, and can take any of them out with ease, they will steer clear of Gargantia as they'd rather handle easier prey. By what your saying, Gargantia would rather keep the pirates alive to prey on them another day, and just hope that they don't take too much from them, or don't become to aggressive. Who wants to live with that kind of threat shadowing over them everyday? If Gargantia shows enough force to make such an impression, to make such a stand, that no other fleet will ever think to attack to them again, then it wouldn't matter if Red is there or not. Just the threat of it will keep them protected. No, everyone is gonna see it's the fucking flying robot who does the work, they are gonna try and get him to their sides and as soon as Ledo leaves or changes sides they are fucked. You do not want to put your "countrys" fate in the hands of a random stranger and machine, and you don't want to anger pirates that are stronger than you. That's why you get to know and strike an alliance with said stranger. If you are a weaker nation, you make an alliance with a larger more powerful nation in order to protect yourself. We've been doing that for decades, and we've even made alliances with nations that were once our enemies. What Gargantia should have done in the beginning, which they didn't do until Ridget decided to take the initiative, was make a deal, aka an alliance with Red. She asked him what he's capable of, what he wants from them and then let him know what they want from him in return. Red protected them when he didn't half to, that was a gesture on his part that they can trust him with their safety. Alliances are built on trust, and contracts, which is effectively what they did with Red. What you say is the truth but you don't want to put all your eggs in the basket called the white kid and his robot from outer space...he doesn't even plan on staying, I'm just placing the counter argument for those that are mad that they didn't tell him to go and wipe the pirates around the area. It would just instigate fear and fear can be great but hey it only lasts as long as you have the robot and the kid. They barely know anything about him so it's natural to try and not get involved with him and rely on him too much...they'll get close to him and name him a hero now I'm sure, but they were barely in talking terms at the start of this ep...hopefully Amy hooks him in on staying if you know what I mean ;) I'm repeating myself people say it makes no sense to not exploit him and ask him to laser everything that doesn't bow down to gargantia as a god, but they have barely talked to him for gods sake, you don't want to be in a situation where the stranger you just met and his machine, that could run out of energy tomorrow for all they know (but I think Chamber is capable for sustaining himself forever), are the only way of keeping yourself in safety and prosperity even if those are increased while he is with you. He is an outsider. You don't depend on a person who can't even communicate to keep you and your people safe and protected pretty much for at least 50 years or more till they get a strong fleet and loyal military that won't turn around as soon as the fear factor (Ledo) is gone. |
starmaker032Apr 21, 2013 7:50 PM
yaHzee said: If they wanted there to be combat that didn't end in an instant, what they should've done, is played the leaders as stubborn, and not trusting this alien. So then Gargantia tries to defeat the pirates themselves using their own power, but bam, they start to lose, pirate leader chick is climbing the side of their ship, so they regrettably call the kid and ask him for his help. He says he will help in exchange for a place to stay, they agree, he goes and saves the day.I too found the whole "you shouldn't kill" thing a bit stupid. But hey, I guess the episode would be far less interesting if he just 1 shot KO'd everyone though. Instead, it's all, "Woah, they may be pirates that rape and pillage us, but you can't just kill them man!" and they have him refrain from killing (while Gargantia soldiers of course still have no qualms about killing the pirates). It's stupid. |
| Wow, the mecha fight in this anime has its own charm, you can't find it in modern mecha animes with beam and energy shield. I think the battle in ep 3 is way better than one in ep 1. |
| Enjoyable episode, lacking a little in character development but fun none the less. |
| "What color do you want to be?" -Shiina Mashiro |
| cool episodes but i can already see future problems i'm gonna have with this one is the no killing policy since it's already been talk about just gonna say it's kinda stupid how they don't want mindless killing but ended up losing some of their own people because of that when they could have just given him the *Okay* and send a clear message to the pirates not to mess with them. oh well MC kinda like whatever just going with it since i need a place to stay :P. |
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| This episode was dumb. I'm so salty about this. Let's teach him that killing is wrong and you have to appreciate human life. *few hours later* Let's have our personal death god act as a flying flashlight so we can murder these pirates with our cannons whilst suffering casualties on both sides. Let's totally forget that Ledo destroyed 5 ships in the blink of an eye and has armor we couldn't even scratch. Why not send him to disable/destroy the ships during daytime, when your whole goddamn plan is to kill them when they get close anyways? Nope, lets wait so we can suffer casualties and be hypocrites. And lol at the commander wanting to sacrifice his life. Because pirates of all people, would surely be satisfied with just the life of the leader. And surely the pirates would never take advantage of a leaderless Gargantia. Still, the show is very enjoyable and probably my favorite this season. Hopefully the next episodes won't be as dumb. |
| I think some of the posts that are arguing that Ledo shouldn't have agreed the pacifist demands are pulling a straw man. When Bellows and Ledo converse, they clarify their positions, not argue against each other. Ledo makes sure that Bellows isn't taking a pacifist position and is satisfied with her explanation: "taking life requires justification." However, I don't find Bellows' following argument unsound. Bellows wants the pirates to view attacking Gargantia as a loss of profit i.e. if the pirates attack, Gargantia will defend to their last breath resulting in losses and no gains for the pirates. If the pirates don't attack, they loose nothing and Gargantia will allow the pirates to assert a feeling of dominance. However, I highly doubt that Fearokk would be willing to risk the entire fleet if the pirates ever decided to attack. Near the end of this episode, as Lukkage was climbing up to the control room, Fearokk asked his subordinates to leave him. He clearly wouldn't have risked the entirety of Gargantia in an all out battle with the pirates as he demonstrates in this episode. What I am saying is that it's meaningless to avoid conflict with the pirates while being the dominated force, especially when Gargantia isn't willing to risk everything. So two things come to mind. First, what has maintained the equilibrium between the pirates and Gargantia until this point. Second, now that Gargantia is longer the dominated force, will their position change? |
jayvon said: Awesome episode and that artwork is amazing. Yeah, I must say, this anime has BEAUTIFUL art. I mean honestly, it is absolutely beautiful. The scenery is amazing. The verdurous greens and beautifully shaded oceans, rusted grays and browns. It's just beautiful. I remember when I saw Earth for the first time I almost felt like I was watching one of Miyazaki's works. I'l also shamefully admit, a good 50% of the reason I started/watched this anime was because on the trailer it looked stunningly beautiful (has failed to disappoint in that regard). |
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nina4life said: I was afraid this would happen. "Hey guys, pirates are attacking" "I can annihilate them for you no problems, all I ask in return is for a place to stay for a little while" "No, no, no, you just distract them" "Ehm, ok" An hour later dozens of innocents die and many more are injured as well as having half of the fleet damaged. Good job idiots, really good job. You're about to get killed and all you think about it: "Well, we don't want unnecessary killing". I hate when anime follows that logic. I agree that human life is precious and every precaution should be done to preserve it, but when it's kill-or-die situation I see no logic in, well, not killing. You wanna know the show which really did a great job on this topic? Trigun! I don't wanna spoil anything for those who haven't seen it (DO IT NOW! :P), but there he knew he was is no real danger, only acted like a fool for the whole time. For those who've seen it, remember one of the last episodes? Now that's how you execute kill-or-lose situation. Not like this. People in this episode died for no reason. No reason AT ALL. Hell, they themselves said it's the whole pirate fleet in the attack, led by pirate flagship, that lobster thingy. Guess what, sink whole pirate fleet in 1 shot (I really doubt it's a problem for Red to do that, and I really, really, really doubt he wouldn't do it if asked, after all, they're enemies, and he's been fighting his whole life with only 1 thing on his mind: eradication of enemy) and no more problems. Lead the rest of your lives in peace and quiet. Even if there're some pirates left, after they hear what happened, I sincerely doubt they'll even think of coming anywhere near you. Hell, they'll run away as soon as they see any of your ships. But no, lets let innocents die because killing is wrong. On the other side, I loved this episode and I really like this show in general. I really do. It's great. Language barrier is great thing, characters are interesting and story overall seems to be very good. It's just the logic that I don't like. I haven't seen too many anime shows, only about 150 so far, but out of all those, only 1, Hellsing ultimate, had "search and destroy" approach to dealing with enemies. Every other show had "wars can be ended with 0 casualties approach". Guess what, they can't. Never mind, I won't drop this show, too many great things here. ^THIS. Amarrez said:  A-alligator I might think to become homo. Also, do you guys think Gen will kill a lot of people (Main characters) like he always does? Or will he be a peaceful good-guy this time? |
AkanezoraApr 21, 2013 7:49 PM
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Akanezora said: Also, do you guys think Gen will kill a lot of people like he always does? Or will he be a peaceful good-guy this time? I hope this becomes Urobuchi-style soon enough, because there's nothing too great about the plot yet. |
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s2012k1993 said: However, I highly doubt that Fearokk would be willing to risk the entire fleet if the pirates ever decided to attack. Near the end of this episode, as Lukkage was climbing up to the control room, Fearokk asked his subordinates to leave him. He clearly wouldn't have risked the entirety of Gargantia in an all out battle with the pirates as he demonstrates in this episode. What I am saying is that it's meaningless to avoid conflict with the pirates while being the dominated force, especially when Gargantia isn't willing to risk everything. Actually what the captain did WAS risk everything. He told them to leave because he was the one she wanted. He was effectively sacrificing his life to the Pirate Queen, who would have killed him and then effectively taken over Gargantia. She could then do whatever she wanted with the people whether that be killing them, enslaving them, etc. It was actually a stupid move when all they had to do was call Red on the radio and tell him to take the pirates out. That way he could speedily take out multiple targets and save Gargantia from being raided and destroyed. In this case, self-sacrifice would have been a waste and had absolutely no point. Even the people who the captain told to leave the room would have had nowhere to go. They're stuck on boats surrounded by water, shark pirates and pirate ships. |
Litrydow said: Akanezora said: Also, do you guys think Gen will kill a lot of people like he always does? Or will he be a peaceful good-guy this time? I hope this becomes Urobuchi-style soon enough, because there's nothing too great about the plot yet. Someone had posted earlier that there's actually a good chance it WON'T be urobuchi because the guy said himself that it was supposed to be a "healing anime." I put the quotes there because I don't know what its supposed to mean, other than that its not urobuchi and K-On is considered a healing anime (so I mean... opposite of urobuchi, you'd think...) If someone could tell me what a healing anime is... much appreciated. |
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Shirubaasouru said: Terrible mecha action in this episode. Alligator. I agree. the shark ones looked silly. The lobster.... no, just no |
| Glorious Titties Nuff Said! Make America Great Again! |
katsu044 said: cool episodes but i can already see future problems i'm gonna have with this one is the no killing policy since it's already been talk about just gonna say it's kinda stupid how they don't want mindless killing but ended up losing some of their own people because of that when they could have just given him the *Okay* and send a clear message to the pirates not to mess with them. oh well MC kinda like whatever just going with it since i need a place to stay :P. I don't know where you lot get a 'no killing' policy from. There were plenty people killed in this episode. What busty babe basically said was that his response to the encroaching pirates was disproportional, and that it lead to a bigger response from the main pirate body. She said life should be valued and you don't take it without consideration. |
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Irenesharda said: Actually what the captain did WAS risk everything. He told them to leave because he was the one she wanted. He was effectively sacrificing his life to the Pirate Queen, who would have killed him and then effectively taken over Gargantia. She could then do whatever she wanted with the people whether that be killing them, enslaving them, etc. That's the entire point. Fearokk only risks his life instead of the life and possessions of everyone the ship. As I argued, Gargantia has to risk everything to ensure that a mutual confrontation is non-profitable for the pirates. |
| Amy's reaction, saw that coming a mile away. Sugita bot too OP. |
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Irenesharda said: I agree, that's pretty much lazy writing. Bellows serves as the wise man figure and says one thing but then the turn of events contradict her all so it serves the purpose of Red/Redo/Led/Ledo (lol) getting the love and adulation of Gargantia's people. Meh. I loved this show until this happened but I still have hope for it.s2012k1993 said: However, I highly doubt that Fearokk would be willing to risk the entire fleet if the pirates ever decided to attack. Near the end of this episode, as Lukkage was climbing up to the control room, Fearokk asked his subordinates to leave him. He clearly wouldn't have risked the entirety of Gargantia in an all out battle with the pirates as he demonstrates in this episode. What I am saying is that it's meaningless to avoid conflict with the pirates while being the dominated force, especially when Gargantia isn't willing to risk everything. Actually what the captain did WAS risk everything. He told them to leave because he was the one she wanted. He was effectively sacrificing his life to the Pirate Queen, who would have killed him and then effectively taken over Gargantia. She could then do whatever she wanted with the people whether that be killing them, enslaving them, etc. It was actually a stupid move when all they had to do was call Red on the radio and tell him to take the pirates out. That way he could speedily take out multiple targets and save Gargantia from being raided and destroyed. In this case, self-sacrifice would have been a waste and had absolutely no point. Even the people who the captain told to leave the room would have had nowhere to go. They're stuck on boats surrounded by water, shark pirates and pirate ships. |
Utagaii said: Someone had posted earlier that there's actually a good chance it WON'T be urobuchi because the guy said himself that it was supposed to be a "healing anime." I put the quotes there because I don't know what its supposed to mean, other than that its not urobuchi and K-On is considered a healing anime (so I mean... opposite of urobuchi, you'd think...) If someone could tell me what a healing anime is... much appreciated. Aria and Tamayura are examples of healing anime. Basically they tell a story of a character dealing with a problem and it being resolved, and we all feel warm fuzzies. |
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Irenesharda said: s2012k1993 said: However, I highly doubt that Fearokk would be willing to risk the entire fleet if the pirates ever decided to attack. Near the end of this episode, as Lukkage was climbing up to the control room, Fearokk asked his subordinates to leave him. He clearly wouldn't have risked the entirety of Gargantia in an all out battle with the pirates as he demonstrates in this episode. What I am saying is that it's meaningless to avoid conflict with the pirates while being the dominated force, especially when Gargantia isn't willing to risk everything. Actually what the captain did WAS risk everything. He told them to leave because he was the one she wanted. He was effectively sacrificing his life to the Pirate Queen, who would have killed him and then effectively taken over Gargantia. She could then do whatever she wanted with the people whether that be killing them, enslaving them, etc. It was actually a stupid move when all they had to do was call Red on the radio and tell him to take the pirates out. That way he could speedily take out multiple targets and save Gargantia from being raided and destroyed. In this case, self-sacrifice would have been a waste and had absolutely no point. Even the people who the captain told to leave the room would have had nowhere to go. They're stuck on boats surrounded by water, shark pirates and pirate ships. The pirates did not look they were slave drivers, it was repeated and said by both sides that all they wanted was revenge, he clearly was hoping that his death would solve it. And Gargantia just wanted to show the pirates that it's best to leave them alone but they also wanted to be a normal fleet, they did not want things getting out of their control by using Ledo. Also it wasn't him with the radio, if worst came to worst the girl who he clearly has lots of trust in, has the radio. |
starmaker032Apr 21, 2013 8:12 PM
randomperson2229 said: Utagaii said: Litrydow said: Akanezora said: Also, do you guys think Gen will kill a lot of people like he always does? Or will he be a peaceful good-guy this time? I hope this becomes Urobuchi-style soon enough, because there's nothing too great about the plot yet. Someone had posted earlier that there's actually a good chance it WON'T be urobuchi because the guy said himself that it was supposed to be a "healing anime." I put the quotes there because I don't know what its supposed to mean, other than that its not urobuchi and K-On is considered a healing anime (so I mean... opposite of urobuchi, you'd think...) If someone could tell me what a healing anime is... much appreciated. I'll let tvtropes explain. http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Iyashikei This should be taken with many grains of salt, however, since he also claimed Madoka was going to be "heartwarming" instead of like his usual works. I really hope he's being honest here though, I'd greatly prefer this to not be grimdark. Cool, thanks for the link. I really appreciate it. Also, by Madoka, do you mean that uh... Madoka magica show or whatever with the girls? That one seemed like a really, really happy anime, but I guess he lied, and if so, yeah, his word isn't so solid then. I also want this to be nice. I just want to look at the nice art and be happy! Haha. |
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Omniknight said: shanimebib said: First time in the history of an Urubuchi Gen anime, no blood spilled in the 3rd episode. The OP/ED makes me think this anime won't turn gore, but you never know. Fascinating this anime I tell you! 5/5 Remember the Madoka OP =D I swear I recall Madoka is shown crying in the OP. :D |
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| There are two ongoing argument that I wish to distinguish. (1) The no-profit argument that Bellows put forth as a reason, so Ledo wouldn't wipe out the pirates. (2) The argument against using Ledo to wipe out the pirates, when Lukkage and her fleet do attack for revenge (both sides clearly knew this) and not for taking over Gargantia,. I have previously argued that (1) makes no sense. (2), on the other hand, makes sense because Ledo is an outsider between the pirates and Gargantia. What would happens when Ledo leaves? What would prevent revenge from upgrading to a full-out war? What would happen to killing with justification? |
s2012k1993 said: There are two ongoing argument that I wish to distinguish. (1) The no-profit argument that Bellows put forth as a reason, so Ledo wouldn't wipe out the pirates. (2) The argument against using Ledo to wipe out the pirates, when Lukkage and her fleet do attack for revenge (both sides clearly knew this) and not for taking over Gargantia,. I have previously argued that (1) makes no sense. (2), on the other hand, makes sense because Ledo is an outsider between the pirates and Gargantia. What would happens when Ledo leaves? What would prevent revenge from upgrading to a full-out war? What would happen to killing with justification? Exactly, you don't want to rely and put everything on the guy you can barely talked to and that you just met. Use him once/depend on him once and well you are gonna need him from then on. Defending themselves made it so the pirates they aren't food but they aren't their enemys either..they aren't pirate annihilators. |
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