| Like, as soon as this upcoming Friday perhaps Snap vote: German lawmakers to vote on same-sex marriage (CNN)German lawmakers will decide Friday whether to legalize same-sex marriage, according to CNN affiliate NTV. The snap vote comes after Chancellor Angela Merkel said Monday that she would like to see parliament move towards a "vote of conscience" on the issue. Merkel's comments on Monday represent a shift for the German leader and her conservative party, the Christian Democratic Union (CDU), which has opposed same-sex marriage to keep in line with "traditional" family values. The Chancellor made the comments in response to a question Monday evening at an event in Berlin hosted by women's magazine Brigitte. Asked by a gay man in the audience whether he would be able to refer to his partner as "my husband," Merkel acknowledged the widespread support for gay marriage among German voters -- who will vote soon in federal elections -- and suggested a free vote on same-sex marriage could be held among members of parliament. Much more at this link Seems like Merkel is caving in to the pressure. She had little choice anyway as most of the major parties have ruled out forming any coalition if Same sex marriage isn't brought to the a vote. This is also going to be one of those rare "vote your conscience" bills as it has been made clear that no voting directives will be given to the MPs by their parties/ party leaders. According to polls, more than 80% of Germans support legalising same sex marriage but Merkel's party (and especially its sister party, CSU) have traditionally opposed it (though they do for the most part support Civil unions which have been legal since 2001). Edit: German lawmakers vote to legalize gay marriage (CNN)German lawmakers voted by a wide margin to legalize same-sex marriage Friday, a landmark decision which came just days after Chancellor Angela Merkel dropped her longstanding opposition to a free vote on the issue. The bill gives homosexual couples in Germany the same rights as heterosexual couples, and will allow same-sex couples to marry and jointly adopt children. It passed by 393 votes to 226, with four abstentions. Speaking after the vote, Merkel said she had voted no on the issue, but that it had been important to put it to a vote of conscience. "For me and the basic law, it's about the marriage of a woman and a man. That's why I voted against it," she said, adding that it had been an emotional debate for many in parliament, including herself. "I hope that the vote today shows not only the mutual respect for different opinions but that this also leads to more peace and social cohesion as well," she said. The vote was welcomed by the International Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, Trans and Intersex Association in Europe, which suggested same-sex couples could be able to marry by the end of the year. "After years of waiting and hoping, rainbow families in Germany will now receive equal recognition under the law -- this is a historic milestone that can inspire even more change for LGBTI people," said ILGA-Europe executive director Evelyne Paradis. You can read more here. This is absolutely fantastic news and I hope that more countries follow the example. Love and equality wins once again. |
AgafinJun 30, 2017 2:58 AM
| C'mon, make it happen! Germany needs same-sex marriage, and so does Australia! No doubt that a "Certain German" is going to enter this thread and complain about it, and we all know who that is. |
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| Wait....Germany doesn't have Same-sex marriage? Really? I had no idea....I thought for sure all the major Western European countries had it. |
| only the SPD wants to vote about it on friday, but i doubt that it actually happens within this legislative period and in the next one, with the afd, they won't have the majority anymore - we can only hope that this will never happen |
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JustALEX said: Wait....Germany doesn't have Same-sex marriage? Really? I had no idea....I thought for sure all the major Western European countries had it. So you had no idea about it? Can't say I am surprised |
swirlydragonJun 27, 2017 9:49 AM
 Join Emilia's self-proclaimed knights club if you are a fellow Emilia fan |
| Does theirs national religion even allow something like this ? You know the arabian countries were always against something like this. |
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| WTF, even the most closed minded places in the US have same sex marriage now and Germany doesn't? More reason to get that failure of a chancellor out of office. |
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| Kek. If they do it now, all the "old people" who "traditionally" vote Merkel's party will reconsider in Fall. I think this would be a big gain for the AfD in the coming elections, because many of the "old fashioned conservative old people" might decide that Merkel's CDU is no longer representing conservative views. That's why I think that the CDU will do its best to postpone it until after the election. I'd be surprised if they actually went through with it. |
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swirlydragon said: JustALEX said: Wait....Germany doesn't have Same-sex marriage? Really? I had no idea....I thought for sure all the major Western European countries had it. So you had no idea about it? Can't say I am surprised Yeah....cuz it's totally natural for someone who doesn't live in a country that is 5,000 miles away to know the intricate laws of said country. And I was trying to give Germany credit here....I thought they DID have it because I know Germany has progressed a lot. But I can't say I'm surprised by you quoting me though....stop obsessing about the things I say. |
Grey-Zone said: Kek. If they do it now, all the "old people" who "traditionally" vote Merkel's party will reconsider in Fall. I think this would be a big gain for the AfD in the coming elections, because many of the "old fashioned conservative old people" might decide that Merkel's CDU is no longer representing conservative views. That's why I think that the CDU will do its best to postpone it until after the election. I'd be surprised if they actually went through with it. On the flip side, this has become a prominent campaign topic snd as long as it remains in the spotlight, it'll hurt the CDU/CSU polling numbers given the public support. So they might want to "settle" it. And I highly doubt that older conservative Germans who probably still remember WW2 and/or its aftermath would switch to vote for a borderline fascist party (AFD). At worst, they'll stay home. |
AgafinJun 27, 2017 10:21 AM
Hoppy said: WTF, even the most closed minded places in the US have same sex marriage now and Germany doesn't? More reason to get that failure of a chancellor out of office. Isn't this actually because they had no choice? Wasn't Same Sex marriage legalized by the Supreme Court, as such became a Federal thing? It used to be State-wise but the Supreme Court over ruled the states didn't it? I may be remembering this incorrectly. ----- I wish you luck Germany. |
| AFAIK, the majority of politicians in the German parliament were in favour of gay marriage for quite some time now, but Merkel's party (which was the strongest party and therefore most influental) was against it, since a lot of their voters are conservative+religious. The SPD didn't want to push for gay marriage because they didn't want to go against the CDU. I guess now that Merkel and her party's position is no longer as strong, the other parties finally made the last push and called out Merkel to finally make a decision. |
| Things can't get better until they get worse. Only a matter of time before people have to face the consequences of their actions. Until then, no doubt the majority will mindlessly go along with this |
Seiya said: If you mean me, well I find it a Waste of Time. There are much more pressing Issues like our military and police Security, our Pensions, the Immigration Policy, the Education System, Policies that may help with our Birthrates, Policies that help Savers get some Money for their Savings, the Energy Transition ("Energiewende"). And out of all those very important Topics, not a single one is pushed because muuuuuuuuhhhhhhhhhh GAAAAAAAAAAAAYYYYYYYY Rights are so important! No doubt that a "Certain German" is going to enter this thread and complain about it, and we all know who that is. On another Topic, seems like some Fun starts to take Shape in Eastern Germany. Not that I would agree with a violent Coup d'État (Putsch/Staatsstreich), but the Country is turning more and more ridiculous. At least, there is one very effective Measure any of us could do this Autumn/Fall, my fellow Citizens of the Federal Republic of Germany. And to my fellow ethnic Germans regardless of Citizenship, there's still Article 146 of the Basic Law (not that I would feel any Need to change much of it other than the Name and to have the German Language explicitly mentioned as national and primary Language, however it should show that we actual Germans ultimately hold all the Power in our own Hands). Darek said: This and whoever hasn't heard about it, here's an accurate Map:Germany is central European, west/east division is stupid and outdated. |
NoboruJun 27, 2017 11:12 AM
Noboru said: Seiya said: If you mean me, well I find it a Waste of Time. There are much more pressing Issues like our military and police Security, our Pensions, the Immigration Policy, the Education System, Policies that may help with our Birthrates, Policies that help Savers get some Money for their Savings, the Energy Transition ("Energiewende"). And out of all those very important Topics, not a single one is pushed because muuuuuuuuhhhhhhhhhh GAAAAAAAAAAAAYYYYYYYY Rights are so important! No doubt that a "Certain German" is going to enter this thread and complain about it, and we all know who that is. On another Topic, seems like some Fun starts to take Shape in Eastern Germany. Not that I would agree with a violent Coup d'État (Putsch/Staatsstreich), but the Country is turning more and more ridiculous. At least, there is one very effective Measure any of us could do this Autumn/Fall, my fellow Citizens of the Federal Republic of Germany. And to my fellow ethnic Germans regardless of Citizenship, there's still Article 146 of the Basic Law (not that I would feel any Need to change much of it other than the Name and to have the German Language explicitly mentioned as national and primary Language, however it should show that we actual Germans ultimately hold all the Power in our own Hands). Lol, we all know how homophobic you are, and how you love your "aryan birth rates." Stop trying to slow down progress. Your opinion is a minority one, especially for someone your age. |
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| Lol this is embarrasing for Germany. |
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Seiya said: Noboru said: If you mean me, well I find it a Waste of Time. There are much more pressing Issues like our military and police Security, our Pensions, the Immigration Policy, the Education System, Policies that may help with our Birthrates, Policies that help Savers get some Money for their Savings, the Energy Transition ("Energiewende"). And out of all those very important Topics, not a single one is pushed because muuuuuuuuhhhhhhhhhh GAAAAAAAAAAAAYYYYYYYY Rights are so important! On another Topic, seems like some Fun starts to take Shape in Eastern Germany. Not that I would agree with a violent Coup d'État (Putsch/Staatsstreich), but the Country is turning more and more ridiculous. At least, there is one very effective Measure any of us could do this Autumn/Fall, my fellow Citizens of the Federal Republic of Germany. And to my fellow ethnic Germans regardless of Citizenship, there's still Article 146 of the Basic Law (not that I would feel any Need to change much of it other than the Name and to have the German Language explicitly mentioned as national and primary Language, however it should show that we actual Germans ultimately hold all the Power in our own Hands). Lol, we all know how homophobic you are, and how you love your "aryan birth rates." Stop trying to slow down progress. Your opinion is a minority one, especially for someone your age. This is the day when MAL user Seiya awakened to "fascism" trying to force his beliefs and opinions on others. Sorry, I couldn't resist. |
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Grey-Zone said: Seiya said: Lol, we all know how homophobic you are, and how you love your "aryan birth rates." Stop trying to slow down progress. Your opinion is a minority one, especially for someone your age. This is the day when MAL user Seiya awakened to "fascism" trying to force his beliefs and opinions on others. Sorry, I couldn't resist. It's not being "forced" on others if a majority supports it. |
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| Hell yeah! It's already 2017 and it's about damn time. |
     "Maybe he's trying to take a shit, but the shit just won't come out." Captain Levi, 2014 (／^-^)／☆♪  ♪☆＼(^０^＼) |
Seiya said: I don't fear Homosexuality and "(Indo-)Aryans" are the People(s) in and around India. Oh and Germans are a Mixture of various European Peoples including Germanicized Celts, Germanicized Romans (Old Stems/Altstämme) and Germanized Balts + Slavs (New Stems/Neustämme). Lol, we all know how homophobic you are, and how you love your "aryan birth rates." Stop trying to slow down progress. Your opinion is a minority one, especially for someone your age. You mean prevent Regress. And I doubt my Opinion is that much of a Minority one, at the very least I doubt that People my Age (middle/late 20s) or generally most People who aren't directly affected would actually care that much about Gay Marriage that they would actively wish for a Change of the Status Quo. If anything, many would be angry about how a Non-Sense Topic like this one gains Attention, but the real striking Issues take forever to be faced. How do we call it again? Oh right, "Populism". |
NoboruJun 27, 2017 12:13 PM
Noboru said: Seiya said: I don't fear Homosexuality and "(Indo-)Aryans" are the People(s) in and around India.Lol, we all know how homophobic you are, and how you love your "aryan birth rates." Stop trying to slow down progress. Your opinion is a minority one, especially for someone your age. You mean prevent Regress. And I doubt my Opinion is that much of a Minority one, at the very least I doubt that People my Age (middle/late 20s) or generally most People who aren't directly affected would actually care that much about Gay Marriage that they would actively wish for a Change of the Status Quo. If anything, many would be angry about how a non-sense Topic like this gains Attention, but the real striking Issues take forever to be faced. How do we call it again? Oh right, "Populism". And exactly how is the legalization of same-sex marriage "regressive?" |
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Seiya said: Grey-Zone said: This is the day when MAL user Seiya awakened to "fascism" trying to force his beliefs and opinions on others. Sorry, I couldn't resist. It's not being "forced" on others if a majority supports it. I guess then racism and other forms of bigotry would fine as well and would not be seen as being "forced upon" the victims, as long as 50%+1 support it? |
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Grey-Zone said: I guess then racism and other forms of bigotry would fine as well and would not be seen as being "forced upon" the victims, as long as 50%+1 support it? We're talking solely about same-sex marriage here. |
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Seiya said: It's regressive, because it distracts from how a healthy Nation is supposed to be: with a strong Mother and Father Bonding towards their Children. Anyone else may live freely and without being harmed, but should not get the same Reputation as those, who can actually produce Offspring. And exactly how is the legalization of same-sex marriage "regressive?" |
Noboru said: Seiya said: It's regressive, because it distracts from how a healthy Nation is supposed to be: with a strong Mother and Father Bonding towards their Children. Anyone else may live freely and without being harmed, but should not get the same Reputation as those, who can actually produce Offspring. And exactly how is the legalization of same-sex marriage "regressive?" There's nothing "healthy" about preventing gay and bi people from marrying someone that they love. Two men can raise children, and so can two women, and the children will end up just fine. |
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Seiya said: They can, but the Ideal is to have a Member from each Sex, so that the Children will get a male and a female Role Model from their Homes in their Lives. Two men can raise children, and so can two women, and the children will end up just fine. Also, they don't need to be married to do so. |
Seiya said: It's not being "forced" on others if a majority supports it. lol democrats seriously believe this. maybe you should speak with the minority who do not support it yet are being forced to accept it. democracy is no less oppressive than any dictatorship, the only difference is a majority of uneducated idiots are calling the shots instead of a single leader or party |
Noboru said: Seiya said: They can, but the Ideal is to have a Member from each Sex, so that the Children will get a male and a female Role Model from their Homes in their Lives. Two men can raise children, and so can two women, and the children will end up just fine. That is complete BS. There's plenty of feminine guys(like myself), and there's plenty of masculine girls, so you don't need two different genders to raise children properly. @Ivich: Lol, minority? You mean the middle-aged and elderly? They don't have a say in what younger people do with their lives. They are archaic, and shouldn't even be allowed to vote. |
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Seiya said: Grey-Zone said: I guess then racism and other forms of bigotry would fine as well and would not be seen as being "forced upon" the victims, as long as 50%+1 support it? We're talking solely about same-sex marriage here. You started it by telling others what to think together with a buzzword ad-hominem. Now you can't follow up on it, so you are deflecting. Seiya said: Noboru said: I don't fear Homosexuality and "(Indo-)Aryans" are the People(s) in and around India. You mean prevent Regress. And I doubt my Opinion is that much of a Minority one, at the very least I doubt that People my Age (middle/late 20s) or generally most People who aren't directly affected would actually care that much about Gay Marriage that they would actively wish for a Change of the Status Quo. If anything, many would be angry about how a non-sense Topic like this gains Attention, but the real striking Issues take forever to be faced. How do we call it again? Oh right, "Populism". And exactly how is the legalization of same-sex marriage "regressive?" Depends on what one actually sees as the purpose of marriage. 1. "civil union" 2. duo that raises children 3. duo that "makes" children There is no problem if same-sex marriage if marriage is interpreted as 1., it's a grey area with 2. and it's absolutely non-sensical with 3. |
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JustALEX said: Wait....Germany doesn't have Same-sex marriage? Really? I had no idea....I thought for sure all the major Western European countries had it. IIRC they have civil unions but a civil union still has less rights than marriage. Noboru said: Seiya said: It's regressive, because it distracts from how a healthy Nation is supposed to be: with a strong Mother and Father Bonding towards their Children. Anyone else may live freely and without being harmed, but should not get the same Reputation as those, who can actually produce Offspring. And exactly how is the legalization of same-sex marriage "regressive?" Those are imaginary social fabrications and countries in themselves are phantasms as well. By your logic as I probably pointed out to you in the past it should be illegal for the infertile to marry and those with kids once they reach age of majority they must produce more kids or have their marriage invalidated. |
traedJun 27, 2017 12:34 PM
Seiya said: @Ivich: Lol, minority? You mean the middle-aged and elderly? They don't have a say in what younger people do with their lives. They are archaic, and shouldn't even be allowed to vote. I am genuinely curious if you would also accept that if the condition would be that the "younger people" have no say in how much taxes the "older people" pay? Or anything else they "do with their lives"? That includes, of course, any "1%ers" who happen to be old. |
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Grey-Zone said: Seiya said: @Ivich: Lol, minority? You mean the middle-aged and elderly? They don't have a say in what younger people do with their lives. They are archaic, and shouldn't even be allowed to vote. I am genuinely curious if you would also accept that if the condition would be that the "younger people" have no say in how much taxes the "older people" pay? Older people should have to pay the highest taxes, and they are the cancer which holds back progress. |
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Seiya said: @Ivich: Lol, minority? You mean the middle-aged and elderly? They don't have a say in what younger people do with their lives. They are archaic, and shouldn't even be allowed to vote. well looks like neither of us support democracy then, the only difference is i think nobody should be allowed to vote |
Seiya said: Grey-Zone said: I am genuinely curious if you would also accept that if the condition would be that the "younger people" have no say in how much taxes the "older people" pay? Older people should have to pay the highest taxes, and they are the cancer which holds back progress. Glad we are finnaly throwing pretenses of democracy out the window. |
JonyJC said: Seiya said: Older people should have to pay the highest taxes, and they are the cancer which holds back progress. Glad we are finnaly throwing pretenses of democracy out the window. Old people are the ones who hold back progress, so there's really no other way. |
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Seiya said: Grey-Zone said: I am genuinely curious if you would also accept that if the condition would be that the "younger people" have no say in how much taxes the "older people" pay? Older people should have to pay the highest taxes, and they are the cancer which holds back progress. If you want a [insert ancient greek prefix for "young age" here]cracy why didn't you say so from the beginning? But then again you just showed a similar attitude to young people who don't share your views, so it seems to prefer facsism totalitarianism after all. Though I wonder whether or not you would be truly "willing" to join the "lower class of older people" once you reach that age where the new "young people" have your fate entirely in their hands. |
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Grey-Zone said: Seiya said: Older people should have to pay the highest taxes, and they are the cancer which holds back progress. If you want a [insert ancient greek prefix for "young age" here]cracy why didn't you say so from the beginning? But then again you just showed a similar attitude to young people who don't share your views, so it seems to prefer facsism totalitarianism after all. I believe in equality for all. I just believe that when it comes to human rights, old people should keep their mouths shut. |
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Seiya said: Grey-Zone said: If you want a [insert ancient greek prefix for "young age" here]cracy why didn't you say so from the beginning? But then again you just showed a similar attitude to young people who don't share your views, so it seems to prefer facsism totalitarianism after all. I believe in equality for all. I just believe that when it comes to human rights, old people should keep their mouths shut. Or, as the saying goes, "some people are more equal than others." |
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Seiya said: You can raise them properly even without having two different Genders, but having Role Models from each Gender makes Things easier, especially when the Roles align with their Strengths and Weaknesses. Men for Example have a rougher Skin and more Strength, so it would be wiser to have them do more heavy Work and Stuff where they would have to dirty their Hands or could even hurt them and/or scrape off some Skin. Women are weaker and have a more delicate Skin, so if possible, they should be barred from doing rough Work with their Hands or from lifting Things.That is complete BS. There's plenty of feminine guys(like myself), and there's plenty of masculine girls, so you don't need two different genders to raise children properly. Just because you can also help around with cooking or washing and/or the Woman can help around with lifting and/or rough Work, it doesn't devalue the Basic Principle behind the Gender Roles. traed said: That's a Reductio ad absurdum. Just because I don't want further Deviation, I don't have to want to enforce more strict "Straightenments" or how you want to call the Process of having a proper Family and punishing everyone who deviate from the Path. Those are imaginary social fabrications and countries in themselves are phantasms as well. By your logic as I probably pointed out to you in the past it should be illegal for the infertile to marry and those with kids once they reach age of majority they must produce more kids or have their marriage invalidated. |
Noboru said: Seiya said: You can raise them properly even without having two different Genders, but having Role Models from each Gender makes Things easier, especially when the Roles align with their Strengths and Weaknesses. Men for Example have a rougher Skin and more Strength, so it would be wiser to have them do more heavy Work and Stuff where they would have to dirty their Hands or could even hurt them and/or scrape off some Skin. Women are weaker and have a more delicate Skin, so if possible, they should be barred from doing rough Work with their Hands or from lifting Things.That is complete BS. There's plenty of feminine guys(like myself), and there's plenty of masculine girls, so you don't need two different genders to raise children properly. Just because you can also help around with cooking or washing and/or the Woman can help around with lifting and/or rough Work, it doesn't devalue the Basic Principle behind the Gender Roles. traed said: That's a Reductio ad absurdum. Just because I don't want further Deviation, I don't have to want to enforce more strict "Straightenments" or how you want to call the Process of having a proper Family and punishing everyone who deviate from the Path. Those are imaginary social fabrications and countries in themselves are phantasms as well. By your logic as I probably pointed out to you in the past it should be illegal for the infertile to marry and those with kids once they reach age of majority they must produce more kids or have their marriage invalidated. Sounds like you need to start worry about all divorced parents, absent parents and bad parents then. They may be a far major issue than two homosexual adopting. |
Bernrika said: Errm two Questions:Sounds like you need to start worry about all divorced parents, absent parents and bad parents then. They may be a far major issue than two homosexual adopting. 1) Where did I write that I would be against two Homosexuals adopting Children? 2) What is easier? To keep the Status Quo and to prevent further Deviation or to straighten Things out with the divorced, absent and bad Parents? |
Noboru said: I didn't say that is what you want I said if you were logically consistent that is what you would want. If you're not logically consistent chances are your reasoning is not logical but emotional. traed said: That's a Reductio ad absurdum. Just because I don't want further Deviation, I don't have to want to enforce more strict "Straightenments" or how you want to call the Process of having a proper Family and punishing everyone who deviate from the Path. Those are imaginary social fabrications and countries in themselves are phantasms as well. By your logic as I probably pointed out to you in the past it should be illegal for the infertile to marry and those with kids once they reach age of majority they must produce more kids or have their marriage invalidated. |
Aureolus said: German already has marriage equality, everyone can marry someone of the opposite sex who is will and of a certain age, what you mean is German might change there laws for a small cabal of people. No, they certainly don't have marriage equality. Most newfs aren't against same-sex marriage, so why are you? |
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| NOOOOOO THE GAY LOBBY ARE GOING TO RULE OVER US ALL ADFSOHOHFOIHSFODISHIPFJSÅODJOÅ |
 Nico- said: Conversations with people pinging/quoting me to argue about some old post I wrote years ago will not be entertained@Comic_Sans oh no y arnt ppl dieing i need more ppl dieing rly gud plot avansement jus liek tokyo ghoul if erbudy dies amirite |
Aureolus said: I don't have to give my reasoning for my opposition to homosexuality. Oh, I actually think that you do. |
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