What the fuck happened to the anime community?

Energetic-Nova said:


Yup... they drank conspiracy kool aid and have no idea weebs like him complained in the 90’s about this stuff. Specifically about fans of cute anime not being real anime fans. Only Captain Harlock and Robotec”. They were mad at the ecchi garbage like Ranma and the girly crap like Sailor Moon.

YossaRedMage said:

I think it's a lazy mental shortcut to dismiss any argument against current changes as just the same as people who are upset at changes in the past. Perhaps you should address the actual issue instead acting smugly superior to someone trying to make an earnest point? Which is more than I can say for the person you replied to who isn't' even worth engaging with. You on the other hand I suspect is more reasonable so please think about what you're saying here.

You're saying someone who wants to preserve the weebness and cute girls and fan service, is the same as someone who complained about the introduction of those very things 20 years ago... Come on dude.

_Maneki-Neko_ said:

Don't worry. It only looks like this kind of guys are dominating the community, but in reality, you will mostly find them online, because they are just a bunch of sad figures. 😅
Rarely met them in real in comparison to the amount of other people in the community.

Energetic-Nova said:


The OP constantly complains about LGBT stuff in media. Trust me, he wants to censor stuff all the time, it’s just different fucking stuff. He is also against women’s rights. I could have sworn most people are for women’s rights, but yeah, the motivation is very similar.


PS the motivation is misogyny and homophobia. As well as a preservation of the past.

YossaRedMage said:

Trust me I know OP well. You're stereotyping and exaggerating slightly, but hey sure, there are things he believes I don't agree with. No ones perfect. But that's not the point and I won't discuss any individuals more than this because it would be rude. You still haven't addressed the point of the thread, which is nothing to do with LGBT stuff or womens rights. But an anime community that is becoming less true to what has always made it great. No, the argument isn't the same as the anti-moe crowd of the 2000s. It's about a loss of character. An interesting, unique character that is being replaced by a new culture, and new people who want to turn anime in to something more "normal", more mainstream, and less Japanese. Do you agree that is happening? Do you think it is a problem? Why? There's a good conversation here that you and others are side-stepping. It's fine if you don't want to have it, but don't bring up stuff from other threads or make personal attacks.

[Edit: To be more clear, the people of the past who complained about changes, were complaining about a change of character. What's going on now is very much a loss of character.]

BilboBaggins365 said:



The Western anime community (unless you are Japanese this is hypocritical) and anime itself only exists because of globalization (without Western influence anime would be quite different in many aspects). There will always be niche content willing to be made by small studios or groups of people. You may even find that content might get wider support if exposed to the world.

YossaRedMage said:

Your first point. It's true, and I think the western influence on anime is impossible to overstate. It's whole character comes from the fusion of western influences and Japan storytelling philosophy. I would argue the difference of late, in both the community and the content, is a move away from the Japanese'ness. Fans are no longer weebs. Which is weird. If anime is Japanese, and people say they fans of Japanese works, surely they like Japan? But far from being neutral on the subject, the community has become weebphobic. And the content is being tailored more and more for a global audience. These things of course go hand in hand.

Of course, this is a problem for fans of anime who like for what's makes it unique and distinct from western media/hobbies/fandoms. But from a less subjective standpoint, I would argue it makes anime as a culture have less character. It is less unique. I could get in to stuff about what makes good art, and how lowest common denominator media is objectively low quality as art, but that would be going off a tangent that I don't need to...

As for you other point. Yes it's true that there will always be that niche content. That's some solace for people like me. But there will be less of it and it will receive less funding. And there will be a loss of identity. For fans of that now side-lined content... we can't call ourselves "anime fans", because the culture around what that means has changed. This is why I say there needs to be a cultural split between fans of anime for what has always made it great, and... whatever I have no idea what the deal is with these new fans...

Energetic-Nova said:



People were complaining about anime going main stream. That all the cheerleaders and preppies were liking anime now. And that was in the late 90s. I saw some thing from his early as 1994 complaining about that. I think there is a perceived sense of small community and belonging that happened, and yeah with the loss of anime clubs, and the democratization of streaming services, more have fast Internet, anime fans are becoming parents themselves.

I really think it’s just because of the centralization by way of social media. There’s a lot of people on one site, which then leads to a lot of fighting. You can just search all day long for shit that will piss you off. There are certain phrases that you know you can search up and you can find the things that will piss you off and let you know that the horrible people who hate you are definitely there.


But before? People usually stayed on their own small sites. The communities were more homogenous, smaller communities means you can’t just be a dick or you’ll be losing that community. But now we can take communities for granted. There are so many options. You don’t need you know those 10 assholes. You can just go be with somebody else. I Donely that, you can go be with somebody else get a new group of friends, and then go attack the people that you’re fucking hate it before. because you’re an immature brat.

There was no presence of re-tweeting something, or re-blogging some thing, to create a targeted harassment campaign. He couldn’t build a huge audience on YouTube on just Internet drama. And I sincerely blame anyone who supports any side of the fucking drama there. you are a part of one community that goes out and attacks another community you are just as bad.

I know what causes this already. It is the lack of mental health care and being online so much of the time. It is extremely bad for people to be on social media all the time. And with a Twitter especially, that one has been starting to be studied as the worst platform for people with ADHD, and people with ADHD already are terrible with social media in general. It’s got the novelty factor, it’s got the triggering engagements, you can stay perpetually angry on that website in ways that you really can’t on others. Once somebody with ADHD is traumatized they typically become exactly like the people who bullied them because of rejection sensitive dysphoria. And people with ADHD are more likely to be in to a Anime. It isn’t that the culture of people has changed or whatever. The composition is the exact same as it’s always been. But the very presence of this kind of social media that is so connected to who you are as a person can create a humiliation factor that just was never present before. And the people who get damaged with that are the most likely to perpetrate because they don’t wanna get hurt. And depending on your identity you’re going to make a choice of one side or another. And if you’re one way you’re more likely to choose the anti-SJW, and if you’re the other way you’re going to choose the SJW.


I don’t know how you break the cycle other than equality act + free or cheap enough healthcare (so people get help and take their meds). Usually if a group becomes the scapegoat for your problems, they will want to defend themselves. Since both sides are ADHD or autistic and wont drop it, it will never end.

juiccbox said:
well one thing hasn’t changed in the anime community over the last few decades, it’s still full of pedophiles!

YossaRedMage said:

Hmm. Well fuck I agree with practically all of that regarding the problems with social media. I still think there is a loss of character happening within the culture as it becomes less focused and more "for everybody" which as I said before, I think is the death of culture. A culture only exists in contract to other cultures. And it's value and character, as with people, is defined by it's uniqueness. You're certainly right about how these issues foster division and anger, but I do think there is a real issue where anime/otaku culture is becoming diluted and objectively less valuable. This is kind of part of a trend that has been happening for a long time. I think back to the 90s where there were very distinct subcultures. Goths, Skate kids, Stoners, Jocks (that one's more of a US thing and I'm in the UK so I'm just going on what other people say), and of course the 90s anime fans, although there less of them where I lived. It feels like all of culture is being squished in to one grey mass. And as I said in a previous post, I think this is largely down to big business who are constantly seeking to consolidate and centralize.

_FRB_ said:
Don't know if I would go as far as to say I'd prefer people carrying katanas and body pillows in public, but I definitely agree with the overall sentiment that there're downsides to going mainstream.

The other thing that sticks out to me is the part about getting pounced for saying anything positive about Japan. I wish that was a exaggeration. The "don't obsess over Japan" mindset has manifested itself into not allowing any praise of Japan that isn't about their quality of animation.

I don't have enough appendages to count the amount of times I've said something about Japan and someone comes in with the "bUt DoN't YoU kNoW tHeIr WoRk CuLtUrE iS tErRiBlE?" No shit, really? One would think in their attempt to prove someone is obsessed with Japan they would not use the most common factoid that everyone who knows anything about the country knows, but it's not surprising since it serves as nothing but a gotcha moment.

juiccbox said:
well one thing hasn’t changed in the anime community over the last few decades, it’s still full of pedophiles!

Glordit said:


I don't see a problem with this. It's never going away and only going to continue to grow.

YossaRedMage said:

Your first point. It's true, and I think the western influence on anime is impossible to overstate. It's whole character comes from the fusion of western influences and Japan storytelling philosophy. I would argue the difference of late, in both the community and the content, is a move away from the Japanese'ness. Fans are no longer weebs. Which is weird. If anime is Japanese, and people say they fans of Japanese works, surely they like Japan? But far from being neutral on the subject, the community has become weebphobic. And the content is being tailored more and more for a global audience. These things of course go hand in hand.

Of course, this is a problem for fans of anime who like for what's makes it unique and distinct from western media/hobbies/fandoms. But from a less subjective standpoint, I would argue it makes anime as a culture have less character. It is less unique. I could get in to stuff about what makes good art, and how lowest common denominator media is objectively low quality as art, but that would be going off a tangent that I don't need to...

As for you other point. Yes it's true that there will always be that niche content. That's some solace for people like me. But there will be less of it and it will receive less funding. And there will be a loss of identity. For fans of that now side-lined content... we can't call ourselves "anime fans", because the culture around what that means has changed. This is why I say there needs to be a cultural split between fans of anime for what has always made it great, and... whatever I have no idea what the deal is with these new fans...

Ryuk9428 said:
Left-wingers are overwhelmingly the ones who want to censor anime because anime is one of the only mediums of entertainment out there that mostly supports conservative messages.

Zelkiiro said:

Ah yes, conservative messages such as...
*checks notes*
...collectivism, acceptance of others, environmentalism, mercy and compassion, progressivism, and being emotionally authentic in a conservative society that values hiding your emotions...?

Tylaen said:
I remain unsure if this is a joke post.

_FRB_ said:


Your view of modern conservatism is most likely warped if you see many of these as being exclusive from conservatism. The overwhelmingly progressive ideas of "having emotions" and "compassion". Give me a break. Next you're going to say the power of friendship proves that anime is contrary to conservative messages.

Two of your examples literally contradict each other. If you consider Japan to be a conservative society (which you do, and many people do, that's what you used as an example), then seeing as Japan is one of the most collectivist countries in the developed world on a societal level, then collectivism is probably not inherently exclusive from conservatism either.

Zelkiiro said:

Conservative philosophy revolves around precisely two things:

1. Humanity must stop progressing. Status quo is god.
2. "Fuck you, got mine."

_FRB_ said:
Your view of modern conservatism is most likely warped

Zelkiiro said:

Ah yes, conservative messages such as...
*checks notes*
...collectivism, acceptance of others, environmentalism, mercy and compassion, progressivism, and being emotionally authentic in a conservative society that values hiding your emotions...?

juiccbox said:
well one thing hasn’t changed in the anime community over the last few decades, it’s still full of pedophiles!

Comander-07 said:
Normies happened, thats what is the cause of the problem here.

Breach344 said:
It amazes me this isnt a joke post. You're the one being toxic here. I guess I'm not a "true fan" because I dont want to wear a fedora and bring a body pillow around with me when I'm buying groceries. Apparently that's me being ashamed or trying to fit in with mainstream people. Well I dont really care about fitting in with you or your crowd cause thats just not who I am. And no I dont worship Japan. I like anime and many things Japan has and does but I'm not looking away from its issues or trying to move there.

This is just gatekeeping. If you like anime that's awesome, heres a site to talk about it. But forcing this culture stuff is ridiculous. I also really dont want to pull this card as it's most of the time dumb and most people including me are nowhere near up to date with their MAL account lists but from your profile you havent seen or read nearly enough to be gatekeeping people and saying they aren't "true anime fans". Relax my dude.

Most of the self deprecating things anime fans say are jokes. Some might ACTUALLY be embarrassed because of the environment they're in or maybe they're just younger and not confident enough yet. Who cares. On MAL we all like anime(mostly. Looking at you 700 days watched average rating of anime 3-4 people) and it's nice that the people like that have a place where they can talk about it without feeling judged aside from normal toxicity and posts like these.

Also you keep bring politics into anime... like... c'mon. No. Nothing about being a Democrat is about wanting to censor anime because anime shows Republican political ideals in a positive light. I'm more economically Republican as well before you start saying I'm a Democratic defending other Democrats. That's just baseless propaganda both sides throw at each other. Yeah Funimation sucks but that's not what the Democratic party particularly the old corrupt people in power are about or in general even aware of.