| Uhhh... CGi is cool and I'm glad we're still getting fully 3D shows. That's about the only thing I can think of. Other than that, I guess it's cool that even if I don't like the new shows coming out, there are more people subbing old anime than ever before. |
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Seiya said: It's interesting how with modern anime, female characters look worse, but male characters now look sexier than ever. So you're telling me that this...   is less sexier than this?  You do make a good point but still. Personally, I would say that old anime can be as good as modern anime and that's that. |
TheKawaiiToon said: Seiya said: It's interesting how with modern anime, female characters look worse, but male characters now look sexier than ever. So you're telling me that this... is less sexier than this? You do make a good point but still. Personally, I would say that old anime can be as good as modern anime and that's that. Well, I'm not attracted to masculinity, so I'm definitely not into Guts or that other guy. As most on this forum know, I love older anime, but I can't deny that the modern bishies are hot, because I love feminine-looking guys. |
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Seiya said: TheKawaiiToon said: So you're telling me that this... is less sexier than this? You do make a good point but still. Personally, I would say that old anime can be as good as modern anime and that's that. Well, I'm not attracted to masculinity, so I'm definitely not into Guts or that other guy. As most on this forum know, I love older anime, but I can't deny that the modern bishies are hot, because I love feminine-looking guys. "That other guy"? Wow, man... I don't even care about the argument of who is handsome or not among dudes. I'm just shocked that Spike Spiegel would be referred to as "That Other Guy" by an anime fan. LOL! Guess I really am getting old. |
Injenss said: Seiya said: Well, I'm not attracted to masculinity, so I'm definitely not into Guts or that other guy. As most on this forum know, I love older anime, but I can't deny that the modern bishies are hot, because I love feminine-looking guys. "That other guy"? Wow, man... I don't even care about the argument of who is handsome or not among dudes. I'm just shocked that Spike Spiegel would be referred to as "That Other Guy" by an anime fan. LOL! Guess I really am getting old. I'm in my early 30s, but I've never actually watched "Cowboy Bebop." I'm from Canada, and we never had Toonami or Adult Swim up here, so Americans got to see a lot of anime back then that we didn't see. I could watch it now, but it doesn't look that interesting to me. |
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Seiya said: TheKawaiiToon said: So you're telling me that this... is less sexier than this? You do make a good point but still. Personally, I would say that old anime can be as good as modern anime and that's that. Well, I'm not attracted to masculinity, so I'm definitely not into Guts or that other guy. I can't believe you don't know who Spike Spiegel is (you probably do, but still). Although I can understand. Judging by your profile, you really prefer older anime over newer ones. And I'm surprised that one of the few modern anime you've seen and like (judging from the anime we've both seen) are Violet Evergarden and Princess Pricinpal (which the latter is very overlooked for a modern anime). |
removed-userFeb 14, 2020 7:40 PM
Seiya said: Injenss said: "That other guy"? Wow, man... I don't even care about the argument of who is handsome or not among dudes. I'm just shocked that Spike Spiegel would be referred to as "That Other Guy" by an anime fan. LOL! Guess I really am getting old. I'm in my early 30s, but I've never actually watched "Cowboy Bebop." I'm from Canada, and we never had Toonami or Adult Swim up here, so Americans got to see a lot of anime back then that we didn't see. I could watch it now, but it doesn't look that interesting to me. OIC. I'm late 30's. But, Toonami and Adult Swim were a huge blessing for us in the U.S. That turned me on to so many animes from Bebop and Champloo to Trigun and Gundam Wing. Really takes me back. I can't say whether or not you'd enjoy Cowboy Bebop because everybody is different. But I can DEFINITELY say you should give it a chance. I find that when an anime has a general consensus as one of the best ever made, you're usually going to enjoy it. Not always, but usually. |
Injenss said: Seiya said: I'm in my early 30s, but I've never actually watched "Cowboy Bebop." I'm from Canada, and we never had Toonami or Adult Swim up here, so Americans got to see a lot of anime back then that we didn't see. I could watch it now, but it doesn't look that interesting to me. OIC. I'm late 30's. But, Toonami and Adult Swim were a huge blessing for us in the U.S. That turned me on to so many animes from Bebop and Champloo to Trigun and Gundam Wing. Really takes me back. I can't say whether or not you'd enjoy Cowboy Bebop because everybody is different. But I can DEFINITELY say you should give it a chance. I find that when an anime has a general consensus as one of the best ever made, you're usually going to enjoy it. Not always, but usually. I never saw Champloo or Trigun, but we did get Gundam Wing up here, and I remember seeing it in the late 90s, but I wasn't too impressed. Many years later, I started watching the original "Universal Century" Gundam stuff, and that was much better. I also remember seeing Robotech, Sailor Moon, Samurai Pizza Cats and various other things, but generally, the US got to see a lot more, because of that one specific channel you had that we didn't have. Based on all the pictures of Cowboy Bebop that I've seen online, it looks like a glorified tobacco advertisement, so I think I'll pass. |
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Seiya said: Injenss said: OIC. I'm late 30's. But, Toonami and Adult Swim were a huge blessing for us in the U.S. That turned me on to so many animes from Bebop and Champloo to Trigun and Gundam Wing. Really takes me back. I can't say whether or not you'd enjoy Cowboy Bebop because everybody is different. But I can DEFINITELY say you should give it a chance. I find that when an anime has a general consensus as one of the best ever made, you're usually going to enjoy it. Not always, but usually. I never saw Champloo or Trigun, but we did get Gundam Wing up here, and I remember seeing it in the late 90s, but I wasn't too impressed. Many years later, I started watching the original "Universal Century" Gundam stuff, and that was much better. I also remember seeing Robotech, Sailor Moon, Samurai Pizza Cats and various other things, but generally, the US got to see a lot more, because of that one specific channel you had that we didn't have. Based on all the pictures of Cowboy Bebop that I've seen online, it looks like a glorified tobacco advertisement, so I think I'll pass. You haven't seen Samurai Champloo? Okay, if you don't watch Bebop, that's one thing. (I wouldn't pass on a GOAT anime just because the characters smoke, but to each their own.) But not seeing Champloo is just cheating yourself. You should at least watch an episode or two of that and see how you like it. Are you averse to those kinds of anime? Like action and whatnot? Gundam Wing wasn't the best Gundam, that's just the show that turned me on to the Gundam world through Toonami. The best of the Gundam series for me was Gundam 00. I haven't seen UC Gundam. I kinda of fell out of the Gundam universe. |
Injenss said: Seiya said: I never saw Champloo or Trigun, but we did get Gundam Wing up here, and I remember seeing it in the late 90s, but I wasn't too impressed. Many years later, I started watching the original "Universal Century" Gundam stuff, and that was much better. I also remember seeing Robotech, Sailor Moon, Samurai Pizza Cats and various other things, but generally, the US got to see a lot more, because of that one specific channel you had that we didn't have. Based on all the pictures of Cowboy Bebop that I've seen online, it looks like a glorified tobacco advertisement, so I think I'll pass. You haven't seen Samurai Champloo? Okay, if you don't watch Bebop, that's one thing. (I wouldn't pass on a GOAT anime just because the characters smoke, but to each their own.) But not seeing Champloo is just cheating yourself. You should at least watch an episode or two of that and see how you like it. Are you averse to those kinds of anime? Like action and whatnot? Gundam Wing wasn't the best Gundam, that's just the show that turned me on to the Gundam world through Toonami. The best of the Gundam series for me was Gundam 00. I haven't seen UC Gundam. I kinda of fell out of the Gundam universe. Sorry, but Samurai Champloo looks like something that I would hate. I like action, but that looks more "adult" in nature, and at my age, I try to avoid those more. I would also never watch something like Black Lagoon. |
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alshu said: Injenss said: like Askeladd, Makishima Shogou and Meruem This is roughly 2005, 2012 and 1998...Makishima Shogou is the newest and the lamest here so not very good examples. Try with others! For my perspective the villains nowadays generally are not that more nuanced but on the other hand more realistic - they have more practical goals. In my opinion there are not many core changes since the 00s but the scripts nowadays sound a bit more polished also the video and audio edits smoother or more dynamic. I guess this comes from all the technical advances - you can research and write faster, you can edit AV faster and the communication between the different teams is eased. Lately have seen some titles heavily relying on Google Maps, Google Earth and computer blueprints for various real buildings. A modern type of workflow also means less errors and more ways to correct them in time. Short_Circut said: Lots of things really. Like modern anime are able to convey good stories in only 12 eps whereas a lot of older anime need to spend lots of episodes to do so This is more a question of planing - older shows were forced to drag the story to fill slots of 50+ episodes but usualy it ended after an year. Nowadays they are forced to rush chunks of if it in singles cours with no grantee there will be a continuation. Thus both have problems! Chiibi said: It's GORGEOUS, full of scenery porn Scenery porn is a concept old as anime. Yon can have it even with more minimalistic styles. For example Takarajima (1979)         Or some screen shots from Heidi (1974).    Definitely NOT on par with Shinkai works or all the stuff by Madhouse...hell, even A-1 Pictures for that matter. Modern anime has come MILES when it comes to water and skies. These examples are pretty 'meh'. The color palette is also kind of boring and limited. |
ChiibiFeb 14, 2020 8:35 PM
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Seiya said: Injenss said: You haven't seen Samurai Champloo? Okay, if you don't watch Bebop, that's one thing. (I wouldn't pass on a GOAT anime just because the characters smoke, but to each their own.) But not seeing Champloo is just cheating yourself. You should at least watch an episode or two of that and see how you like it. Are you averse to those kinds of anime? Like action and whatnot? Gundam Wing wasn't the best Gundam, that's just the show that turned me on to the Gundam world through Toonami. The best of the Gundam series for me was Gundam 00. I haven't seen UC Gundam. I kinda of fell out of the Gundam universe. Sorry, but Samurai Champloo looks like something that I would hate. I like action, but that looks more "adult" in nature, and at my age, I try to avoid those more. I would also never watch something like Black Lagoon. Gotcha. If you hate Seinen animes, Bebop, Champloo and Black Lagoon definitely wouldn't be your cup of tea. That's my favorite kind of anime by far, though. I watch Shounen, of course, but Seinen is far and away my favorite genre. Question though: You said "at your age". You're early 30's. Why would you avoid Seinen because of your age? Just curious. |
Injenss said: Seiya said: Sorry, but Samurai Champloo looks like something that I would hate. I like action, but that looks more "adult" in nature, and at my age, I try to avoid those more. I would also never watch something like Black Lagoon. Gotcha. If you hate Seinen animes, Bebop, Champloo and Black Lagoon definitely wouldn't be your cup of tea. That's my favorite kind of anime by far, though. I watch Shounen, of course, but Seinen is far and away my favorite genre. Question though: You said "at your age". You're early 30's. Why would you avoid Seinen because of your age? Just curious. I just don't like stuff with sex and extreme violence in it. I probably wouldn't mind it when I was 10 years old, but when I got older, it began to disturb me, so now I try to avoid that stuff. |
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Seiya said: Injenss said: Gotcha. If you hate Seinen animes, Bebop, Champloo and Black Lagoon definitely wouldn't be your cup of tea. That's my favorite kind of anime by far, though. I watch Shounen, of course, but Seinen is far and away my favorite genre. Question though: You said "at your age". You're early 30's. Why would you avoid Seinen because of your age? Just curious. I just don't like stuff with sex and extreme violence in it. I probably wouldn't mind it when I was 10 years old, but when I got older, it began to disturb me, so now I try to avoid that stuff. I started out with that stuff thanks to Heavy Metal and Fist of the North Star when I was younger than 10, so I was always into it. I've always been more into mature themes and psychological stuff, more than the kid stuff even when I was kid. My parents probably should've been watching what I was watching. LOL! |
| The only modern series I've enjoyed thus far are the series with compelling stories and good characters within them, such as Violet Evergarden and Kimetsu no Yaiba for example. I grew tired of unnecessary fanservice being added for no reason in the series I watched, so there's a good amount of series I don't want to watch nor read anymore. The other reason is how accessible series are now. I can watch them on my PS4 and continue at it for as long as I wish with no interruptions, so that's nice. :D |
   "No letter that could be sent deserves to go undelivered." - Violet Evergarden signature and forum avatar made by Memor! |
Injenss said: Seiya said: I just don't like stuff with sex and extreme violence in it. I probably wouldn't mind it when I was 10 years old, but when I got older, it began to disturb me, so now I try to avoid that stuff. I started out with that stuff thanks to Heavy Metal and Fist of the North Star when I was younger than 10, so I was always into it. I've always been more into mature themes and psychological stuff, more than the kid stuff even when I was kid. My parents probably should've been watching what I was watching. LOL! Lol. I was 7 when I first rented "Akira" from my local video store. My mom didn't know about the violence in it, but she was always fairly lenient, so she figured that I might as well finish watching the entire thing. Ironically, I wouldn't watch a movie like that now. |
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Seiya said: Injenss said: I started out with that stuff thanks to Heavy Metal and Fist of the North Star when I was younger than 10, so I was always into it. I've always been more into mature themes and psychological stuff, more than the kid stuff even when I was kid. My parents probably should've been watching what I was watching. LOL! Lol. I was 7 when I first rented "Akira" from my local video store. My mom didn't know about the violence in it, but she was always fairly lenient, so she figured that I might as well finish watching the entire thing. Ironically, I wouldn't watch a movie like that now. Probably because it might have scared you XD. Granted I think I have had a conversation with you regarding that a long long time ago. |
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Chiibi said: Definitely NOT on par with Shinkai works or all the stuff by Madhouse...hell, even A-1 Pictures for that matter. 1. Wow, retouching digital photos is such a great form of art! 2. I used simple looking old TV shows on purpose and you immediately reached for Shinkai...I can easily outmatch him with some Ghibli movie from the 80s but this wasn't my point. Chiibi said: Modern anime has come MILES when it comes to water and skies. Missing my point by a parsec. I was talking about minimalistic art and usage of scenery porn not peak quality. Chiibi said: These examples are pretty 'meh'. Yeah painting = meh a photo taken with a phone = art Chiibi said: The color palette is also kind of boring and limited.  "Boring palette" made my day. Not limited tho, those shots were intended to create bleak moods in certain plot points. Both shows have many different locations some of them pretty colourful. |
| What I like the most is how it pisses off retro-fanboys. |
| :v |
alshu said: Chiibi said: These examples are pretty 'meh'. Yeah painting = meh a photo taken with a phone = art I love both styles. And it's really funny for me to read comments like "animation quality greatly improved" while there's more and more 3D shit everywhere. Anyway, most likely I would choose 9 out 10 designs and background art from 00s rather than something modern, but please read about Shinkai's works and about the guy called Mateusz Urbanowicz (he drawn many sceneries in his movies). If you really think that these backgrounds are just a photos taken with phone, then you're a huge ignorant. |
rsc-plFeb 15, 2020 4:15 AM
| Dub = fake crap. Always. |
| Well, definitely not its fans ignorance on old anime or their subtle aggression towards fans of old anime, that's for sure. Lots of cringey comments in this thread... But seriously, the best thing about modern anime is the sheer quantity and variety of offerings. Every season has a ton of shows from all kinds of genres and it's very, very hard not to find plenty of enjoyable shows unless you have super narrow taste. Another big upside of modern anime is Yuasa :>. |
| I probably regret this post by now. |
rsc-pl said: If you really think that these backgrounds are just a photos taken with phone, then you're a huge ignorant. Oh, they are made by high quality cameras and I can admire the shot compositions and the time lapse videos later redrawn in the movies... The "a photo taken with a phone = art" is a reference to what DigiBro said once in one of his videos. Like (trying to formulate it better) "Is something that looks great but was made with minimum creative input be considered art?". |
alshuFeb 15, 2020 5:27 AM
| Nothing really. I have both modern and old anime in my favorites in balance quantity so there's nothing I like in modern anime more than old anime other than HD. |
| None that I can think off and when those moneybags as well as fancypants studios should come back to me when learn to kill off their characters like in The Sopranos and Castlevania. The guys making anime need to let go of that old network television mentality already, its getting old, plus they make battle shounen, waifu, trap or whatever hot comedic garbage being produced out of laziness. In other words, I have not seen anime new anime up the ante like they're HBO action dramas, so where's the substantial improvement and thrills in anime now? |
| What I LIKE about Modern Anime??... Episode 19 of Kimetsu no Yaiba :v |
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| I love the sheer quantity. Like there are alot of titles every season and there are always a ton of fun stuff. Like even if stuff isn't good there is alot of fun. |
  β‘ Harder Daddy β‘ |
alshu said: 2. I used simple looking old TV shows on purpose and you immediately reached for Shinkai...I can easily outmatch him with some Ghibli movie from the 80s Oh I'd love to see you attempt that, yeah. Chiibi said: I was talking about minimalistic art and usage of scenery porn not peak quality. 'Minimalistic' is like the COMPLETE opposite of "porn"...so it's not longer 'scenery porn.' painting = meh a photo taken with a phone = art Of course there are gorgeous paintings but your examples didn't wow me at all. :/ Try harder. Why are you talking about "photos taken with phones", now? I didn't say anything about that. Are you trying to convey that THIS:  "is just a photo taken with a phone"? "Boring palette" made my day. What else do you call a palette that's just various shades of the same color? In the snow pics, I only see grays and blues. But snow isn't actually like that at all. Not limited tho, those shots were intended to create bleak moods in certain plot points. Both shows have many different locations some of them pretty colourful. Then why didn't you use those in the first place? Why the heck would you use 'bleak mood pics' when talking about 'scenery porn'? This makes no sense. We're discussing shots that make you go "OOOH PRETTY!" not, "Bleh, I'm depressed." lol |
ChiibiFeb 15, 2020 12:56 PM
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| SAKUGA I can't get over how pretty modern anime looks. Whether it's overall animation like anything that KyoAni does, or specifically awesome and jaw-dropping fight scenes from Studio Bones and others. Modern anime looks so well done all the time. And it also doesn't help that studios like Orange are starting to get the hand of using 3DCG. It's ironic though since I've just started going into a phase of loving older animation styles (specifically older 2000s stuff). |
But I did and you didn't react. I could summoned even heavier artillery like Oshii or Otomo. Chiibi said: 'Minimalistic' is like the COMPLETE opposite of "porn"...so it's not longer 'scenery porn.' Scenery porn is using the scenery for purposes not directly connected to the plot but setting the mood. The style and it's complexity is are irrelevant. Chiibi said: but your examples didn't wow me at all. My point wasn't to wow you but I already explained that in my previous post. Chiibi said: Try harder. Why bother since you are ignoring what I am trying to tell? Chiibi said: Why are you talking about "photos taken with phones", now? I didn't say anything about that. I explained that in another post. Nope, 1. You guys just assumed that I am talking about Shinkai...I guess you value only his movies and maybe Violet Evergarden, nothing beyond that. Why not Ishizuka Atsuko for example? (I like what she have done with Sora yori mo Tooi Basho...a lot of retouched photos even time lapses there and I don't mind them.) 2. I explained what I meant in another post. Chiibi said: What else do you call a palette that's just various shades of the same color? In the snow pics, I only see grays and blues. But snow isn't actually like that at all. How about the MCs seeing the world trough such palette? How about this is how the director is setting the atmosphere? Chiibi said: Then why didn't you use those in the first place? Why the heck would you use 'bleak mood pics' when talking about 'scenery porn'? As I have written that in my first post - " Yon can have it even with more minimalistic styles.". Chiibi said: This makes no sense. To you... Chiibi said: We're discussing shots that make you go "OOOH PRETTY!" not, "Bleh, I'm depressed." lol OK, last effort - will summon Mamoru Oshii for demonstration because his work popular. In movies like Patlabor Movie 2 and Ghost In The Shell Movies 1-2 he have inserted some long scenes that are absolutely gorgeous but in the same time dark, bleak and dystopian. They are non essential to the plot thus scenery porn and they are depressing yet beautiful. Definitely an "OOOH PRETTY!" will be unappropriated for them. Also will repeat my main point yet again - you can use scenery porn which is not that complicated and overpacked with details. For example like the one in Mushishi or in modern shows like Shoujo Shuumatsu Ryokou (you can say that it has limited palette too and this is totally in purpose) and Hakumei to Mikochi. The last two benefit from said modern technologies but in the same time they don't need to "look modern" but more like hand crafted pencil or watercolour pictures. A good demonstration how those technologies can be uses for many different things...still you guys value more Shinkai's photo sessions. |
alshuFeb 15, 2020 4:02 PM
Chiibi said: alshu said: This is roughly 2005, 2012 and 1998...Makishima Shogou is the newest and the lamest here so not very good examples. Try with others! For my perspective the villains nowadays generally are not that more nuanced but on the other hand more realistic - they have more practical goals. In my opinion there are not many core changes since the 00s but the scripts nowadays sound a bit more polished also the video and audio edits smoother or more dynamic. I guess this comes from all the technical advances - you can research and write faster, you can edit AV faster and the communication between the different teams is eased. Lately have seen some titles heavily relying on Google Maps, Google Earth and computer blueprints for various real buildings. A modern type of workflow also means less errors and more ways to correct them in time. This is more a question of planing - older shows were forced to drag the story to fill slots of 50+ episodes but usualy it ended after an year. Nowadays they are forced to rush chunks of if it in singles cours with no grantee there will be a continuation. Thus both have problems! Scenery porn is a concept old as anime. Yon can have it even with more minimalistic styles. For example Takarajima (1979) Or some screen shots from Heidi (1974). Definitely NOT on par with Shinkai works or all the stuff by Madhouse...hell, even A-1 Pictures for that matter. Modern anime has come MILES when it comes to water and skies. These examples are pretty 'meh'. The color palette is also kind of boring and limited. I still love hand-drawn background art much more, but they still do this today and it looks gorgeous. |
Maneki-Mew said: but they still do this today and it looks gorgeous. Also the modern tools (and we have them for 15-20 years now) are totally capable of replicating that. Just a bit extra efforts and extra libraries with strokes, brushes and textures. You can have oil painting looking picture which is based on vector illustrations which can be edited easily. |
My contributions to the side of the "old cel anime had better backgrounds with more warmth and grit than the CGI crap today" camp (no movies since that's cheating):  (yup this was all hand-painted)  How can you watch that first Inuyasha OP and NOT be blown away by the gorgeous scenery? |
| @alshu: No, THIS is what scenery porn is: https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/SceneryPorn Scenery porn is the emphasis on luscious backgrounds with great detail, lovely lighting or both. It means that the makers put in extra effort for something that might not have direct influence on the plot. It really doesn't have anything to do with mood; it's supposed to look beautiful and that's it. HeruruMeruru's examples are definitely better. 'Why did I only mention Shinkai?' Because he's the only scenery porn guy I know by name. Tons of modern anime are loaded with scenery porn though. Even Studio Deen was doing it by 2014. You said "you explained photos by phone thing" but uh....no, you didn't. And I'm not going to watch f*cking DigiBro explain it; I hate that guy. lol [Edit] I can't find a single freaking source that says 'Shinkai uses his phone photos to make backgrounds' so I think you're both wrong. You shouldn't believe things just because an idiot on Youtube said so. It sounds like a jealous person trying to create rumors. Do you even have PROOF of this claim? I DID find a tutorial on how do it with Photoshop though http://www.mclelun.com/2015/10/makoto-shinkai-style-painting-tutorial.html Despite what all you CG-naysayers think, this can take hours to do. And yes, photographs may be used for reference but every professional artist who does backgrounds does this. You can't just make it up in your head; reference is how to make something look REAL. This is a good article: https://www.tested.com/art/movies/442545-2d-animation-digital-era-interview-japanese-director-makoto-shinkai/ I'm rather shocked Disney was using CG and 3D in their films as far back as Black Cauldron!! o___o |
ChiibiFeb 15, 2020 9:18 PM
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| Well, now we have memes. Gotta clap for that. |
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| I love the background art for anime. I like older background art too, but these kinds of shots really please me in general. These are basically scenery porn to me. Also @Chiibi and @alshu you both do realize that what is scenery porn is basically subjective right? You guys are arguing a point that doesn't have an end lol |
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I guess you are skipping the "or" part. Also there is nothing written against abstract art and heavy atmosphere. Chiibi said: It really doesn't have anything to do with mood; it's supposed to look beautiful and that's it. Here you skipped "Of course, there are extra points to be earned when the scenery actually enhances the plot in some sort of symbolic fashion. " Also there could be some beauty in darkness and depression too. Chiibi said: HeruruMeruru's examples are definitely better. Not abstract and minimalistic enough for my point...I guess you are still missing it. Chiibi said: 'Why did I only mention Shinkai?' Because he's the only scenery porn guy I know by name. Use anime titles than...no need for them now, just a hint for future discussions. Chiibi said: Tons of modern anime are loaded with scenery porn though. I mentioned it early on - it's an anime thing since its dawn...I wouldn't call it modern practice. Chiibi said: Even Studio Deen was doing it by 2014. Shouwa Genroku Rakugo Shinjuu 2016-2017 is a good example for such Deen title...plus its scenery porn applies some gorgeous abstract art. Chiibi said: You said "you explained photos by phone thing" but uh....no, you didn't. And I'm not going to watch f*cking DigiBro explain it; I hate that guy. lol Mentioned him because I disagree - if there is no creative input, than it's not high art, just someone randomly capturing the beauty of the nature. You still don't get it. Not Shikai - it was a rhetorical question about what can be considered art. Now this is funny - I never claimed that. But I am not a CG-naysayer. Chiibi said: this can take hours to do. And yes, photographs may be used for reference but every professional artist who does backgrounds does this. You can't just make it up in your head; reference is how to make something look REAL. See my comment "15-20 years now" and there were Photoshop versions way before but somewhere at that point it was reorganized for better vector integration and using them more intensely for raster image manipulation. (I even think that Adobe took/plagiarised it from Macromedia) Yes it did the same things even before that but around the 00s it become way more easy to use and more flexible. Chiibi said: I'm rather shocked Disney was using CG and 3D in their films as far back as Black Cauldron!! o___o Thus your argument about this being a "modern practice" is kind of invalid? Calal-Chan said: do realize that what is scenery porn is basically subjective right? Yeah, try arguing against "boring palette" and explaining at every step "I used simple looking old art on purpose". I guess Chiibi looks at anime like games - more polygons, more pixels, more frames per second...which are not always good criterium - you also need gameplay, level design and story. |
alshuFeb 16, 2020 6:02 AM
alshu said: I guess you are skipping the "or" part. Also there is nothing written against abstract art and heavy atmosphere. Chiibi said: It really doesn't have anything to do with mood; it's supposed to look beautiful and that's it. Here you skipped "Of course, there are extra points to be earned when the scenery actually enhances the plot in some sort of symbolic fashion. " Also there could be some beauty in darkness and depression too. Chiibi said: HeruruMeruru's examples are definitely better. Not abstract and minimalistic enough for my point...I guess you are still missing it. Chiibi said: 'Why did I only mention Shinkai?' Because he's the only scenery porn guy I know by name. Use anime titles than...no need for them now, just a hint for future discussions. Chiibi said: Tons of modern anime are loaded with scenery porn though. I mentioned it early on - it's an anime thing since its dawn...I wouldn't call it modern practice. Chiibi said: Even Studio Deen was doing it by 2014. Shouwa Genroku Rakugo Shinjuu 2016-2017 is a good example for such Deen title...plus its scenery porn applies some gorgeous abstract art. Chiibi said: You said "you explained photos by phone thing" but uh....no, you didn't. And I'm not going to watch f*cking DigiBro explain it; I hate that guy. lol Mentioned him because I disagree - if there is no creative input, than it's not high art, just someone randomly capturing the beauty of the nature. You still don't get it. Not Shikai - it was a rhetorical question about what can be considered art. Now this is funny - I never claimed that. But I am not a CG-naysayer. Chiibi said: this can take hours to do. And yes, photographs may be used for reference but every professional artist who does backgrounds does this. You can't just make it up in your head; reference is how to make something look REAL. See my comment "15-20 years now" and there were Photoshop versions way before but somewhere at that point it was reorganized for better vector integration and using them more intensely for raster image manipulation. (I even think that Adobe took/plagiarised it from Macromedia) Yes it did the same things even before that but around the 00s it become way more easy to use and more flexible. Chiibi said: I'm rather shocked Disney was using CG and 3D in their films as far back as Black Cauldron!! o___o Thus your argument about this being a "modern practice" is kind of invalid? Calal-Chan said: do realize that what is scenery porn is basically subjective right? Yeah, try arguing against "boring palette" and explaining at every step "I used simple looking old art on purpose". I guess Chiibi looks at anime like games - more polygons, more pixels, more frames per second...which are not always good criterium - you also need gameplay, level design and story. Keep in mind I was saying that subjective thing to both of you XD A lot goes into all forms of art really when you think about it. |
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| Anime is so diverse now, there’s usually something for everyone each season. I also like that they’ve got the hang of digital animation now, so anime nowadays are visually alright. Prefer the cel era/90s art styles, but modern anime doesn’t look terrible. It’s easier to experiment now, so it’s nice seeing the medium getting pushed and pushed even more to it’s fullest potential with animation. Also it’s so much easier to access in higher quality. |
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| I like the fact it's making my pp bigga. Veri cool. |
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So you are missing the point too - never said anything about objectiveness or that everyone should like the examples I presented. They were only a demonstration that scenery porn is not a recent thing also that it can be done with simplistic art not necessary with traced photos. Maybe I should repeat everting from the top? Pfff. |
alshuFeb 16, 2020 10:38 AM
| World building. Sure, there is still a lot of stuff in an anime because it looks cool but these days most shows create some background reasoning behind and shows anticipate basic W-questions. |
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Lil_hentai said: I consider the modern era to be 2000-to now. I did a list of the eras I consider in the thread. Although, I didn't really consider their inceptions as manga characters, as I don't read Manga anymore. I was mainly thinking of when the anime came out. But, honestly, I'm comparing the average amount of villains with a cause over the ones in the past. Just, more often, you see complex motivations from villains today as a whole than you did back then. Of course, you're still going to have shallow villains and characters today, like the villain from Mob Psycho 2 for example, but I think you're seeing less of those and more villains like the ones you mentioned. I would disagree with you on most villains today just being evil to be evil, as opposed to villains from the 80s and 90s, but it all depends on which animes we've seen and haven't seen. Would you really consider Meruem and Askeladd modern ? i mean they were written in 2003 and 2006 id put them in the old school category at this point. Anyways i disagree with modern villains being more complex, cant even remember a complex memorable modern villain off the top of my head on the other hand Kira from JoJo, Griffith, Gendo Ikari, Toguro as i mentioned Askeladd and Meruem are all unforgetable. Same goes for main characters, especially speaking of the modern Kirito carboard box clones. Id say modern villains are the ones that are there to be an obstacle for the MC. Not to just shit on modern anime, i have to say production values have increased obviously |
| I have always avoided old animes {older than 2008} But recently {this week} I watched CowBoy BeBop and start watching Monster so I can say that the animation, sound quality character design {the old animes characters are very similar like spike and samurai champloo MC} also it's very hard to find old animes subbed with very high quality. |
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alshu said: So you are missing the point too - never said anything about objectiveness or that everyone should like the examples I presented. They were only a demonstration that scenery porn is not a recent thing also that it can be done with simplistic art not necessary with traced photos. Maybe I should repeat everting from the top? Pfff. You were missing my point too and being quite arrogant. Maybe I should restart from scratch too? I think the reason people debate with you as they do is that you clearly don't respect the person you are talking too. All I literally stated is that it was subjective and that all forms of art. Which means I was clearly agreeing that scenery porn isn't just a today thing. |
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Really, in which way am I arrogant? Where I said that am better by default than someone here? I am as good as my arguments...and I admit that I am bad at expressing them because my english is bad. Calal-Chan said: Maybe I should restart from scratch too? OK. Calal-Chan said: I think the reason people debate with you as they do is that you clearly don't respect the person you are talking too. - But this is new? How is that starting from scratch? We were never at that point. - In which way I am disrespecting people? Simply by disagreeing and trying to put some arguments against? I never called someone names or implied that every opinion by that person is automatically invalid for some reason. Calal-Chan said: All I literally stated is that it was subjective and that all forms of art. I never disagreed on that. Calal-Chan said: Which means I was clearly agreeing that scenery porn isn't just a today thing. Yeah, but you said that it's both fault. How is that, when you agree on my point? Isn't it like Chiibi avoiding this theme on purpose and pretend to misunderstand me, partially ignoring things that I have wrote? Also implying that I hate CG and that I am somehow against all modern anime and technical advantages. Giving links to Photoshop lessons...to person who knows things or two about it and Illustrator. What I am saying is that Chiibi assumed a lot or maybe projected some other user on me. How is defending my thesis a form of arrogance than? |
alshuFeb 16, 2020 2:13 PM
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