| Yeah, but shit like Agony is still there becasue why not right ? lol. |
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| Bunch of party poopers |
| I guess rest in peace for some visual novels. |
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| Better refund all the VNs then. If you want people to stop pirating stuff, don’t remove a persons avenue to do it legit. |
| So they're cracking down on games that require an additional R18+ patch downloaded elsewhere to unlock the 'full experience' huh. I was hoping they could do something against the asset flips/shovelware that comes out. Direct publishing is awful. |
join the hyper going home club!  |
| It's so pointless cracking down on these games when you could easily download the 18+ patch. Guess Valve wants to keep Steam pure. |
  🔥You're looking at someone🔥 🔥Who is superior to you🔥 🔥You have my permission to🔥 🔥Bask in my glow🔥 |
| This is why I've never been a blind fan of Steam or Valve. I hated when singleplayer-only games like Skyrim were requiring the player to install and run Steam to play so I downloaded cracks for them. Then it got to the point that non-Steam multiplayer was pretty much dead so I finally decided to get on Steam. Now Valve virtually holds a monopoly on PC gaming, and this is what happens when people allow that to happen. |
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| utterly shit company. |
 Oh maybe, maybe it's the clothes we wear The tasteless bracelets and the dye in our hair Or maybe, maybe it's our nowhere towns or our nothing places But we're trash, you and me We're the litter on the breeze We're the lovers on the streets Just trash, me and you It's in everything we do It's in everything we do |
| Im guessing it just means that it will be an opportunity for a new platform to come up and support those that are banned. I think its dumb for steam to do especially that they have a family safe mode which can be turned on for an account when parental vision is required which hides games 18+. What would be smarter on a business level is set all accounts on parental access until unlocked this way they can keep the market for 18+ games while being child safe or w/e they want. But if my games are removed from steam then steam will be uninstalled and ill be contacting the companies for stand alone versions which better not cost me extra because if it does steam will be the company thats going to catch hell from me. |
| I hope Gabe steps in and does something like he did with Hatred. |
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| Seems like a bias against anime titties. I don't understand the rational behind this at all. |
 I can see you |
| I guess they will get rid too of games like The Witcher 3. No? In all seriousness, it's pathetic, what a bunch of nuns. Just put a disclaimer (at least they already do it with some games involving violence and all), couldn't they do the same with these? What's the point of Family View then? Why are *you* asking me every time for my age if it means nothing at all? Couldn't they fix all the bugs their platform has instead of doing pointless things? And if someone doesn't want to see those kind of games, idk, they can block tags at least they did something right. Easy as that. Dunno, I'm not even interested in this kind of games but they're a bunch of hypocrites. Huniepop was fun though. I hope devs learn and take their games to GoG or some other platform. |
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| There could be a way to turn this around if we make enough noise about this. It's worked several times before. But honestly, I wouldn't be opposed to going to a different storefront to buy some anime titty games; like if GOG becomes the good guy and welcomes selling eroge with open arms. |
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| Seems like valve is going on gentleman's path....still Origin/GOG dont support eroge type games either... |
| Honestly, most of those RPG maker porn games that end on Steam are miles better than the shovelware they incontinently squirt out from their hemmorhoidal anus. Not that I really care, but honestly whose fault is it that they're on there anyway. When you literally have no QC, thats what happens. |
| Yeah I literally talked with a moderator from the MAL Harem and Ecchi club in a podcast about this yesterday once the news broke. I don;t play a whole lot of dating sim-type games, but HuniePop is one of few exceptions. This move by Valve annoys me because: 1) Many of the games in question, like HuniePop, had been on steam for YEARS. 2) The adult patches/mods had to be obtained developer or other sites. In this way, it's no different from any other adaults mods for any other types of games. 3) Witcher 3, like what others have said, but I mean, every the older God of War games, and how about Rockstar's GTA franchise?!?! Manaban brought up an interesting point in the podcast about how the sexual aspects of games can be contextualized. The sexual content in GTA, Witcher, etc is secondary to the other parts of the games (like the violent stuff) so it's not perceived to be as sexual, despite actually being more explicit. Here in States, we hardly bat an eye and violent content, but something seems sexually suggestive and some people still lose their friggen minds. This whole thing sucks because I've specifically used Huniepop and Steam as an example of distributors successfully being able to provide sexually suggestive content that is censored, but in a way that avoids controversy and allows people to still obtain the fully x-rated material IF THEY WANT TO. |
PrettiBoiSlimMay 19, 2018 8:44 AM
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| Wonder what'll happen to Hunie Pop. It's a shame they gifted it to me and I played like a couple hours without never getting to the boobie scenes. Guess the original creators of the eroges will release some kind of DLC you have to download from MEGA or shit like that for the games to work correctly. Nothing of value was really lost. |
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| Welp, back to pirating. |
 "... Because when you live in this world of my closed eyes... ... Being alone is very lonely...". |
| If steam removes anime games like VNs and stuff... Well i better get one hell of a refund. Good 75% of my library is games like that. Good amount of them with the H-Patch installed as well. It's hard for me to enjoy games where person needs sound and has to rely on sound. I enjoy games where i can read and sound don't really matter. |
Hanako_San1992May 19, 2018 4:57 PM
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Psyotic said: I don't really see what the problem is. If anything it just creates a demand for a platform specifically for more sexual games, which is a good thing imo. Like, I don't want to see porn on YouTube, I have Pornhub for that. Lord_Sithis said: Valve's retarded. Remember, gouging someone's eyes out is perfectly OK, but panties? That's so unchristian!!! wew boy, we gonna have to go over the difference between violence and sex in media again friendo? I think it hurts smaller studios/developers. Sure, they can possibly sell their games other places, but Steam is a large platform with a large pool of potential consumers. For instance, I probably never would have even learned of HuniePop if I hadn't scrolled past it during a steam sale. I did enjoy it, but it's not my usual kind of game, so I wouldn't have been on any platform other than steam to discover it in the first place. Honestly, I probably still wouldn't be. The steam version of HuniePop (and presumably many of these other games) is censored, the only way to acquire the full x-rated content is through mods or patches obtained elsewhere. And even if they were all uncensored, nobody's forcing anyone to watch or buy it. All those types of games are age-restricted and come with a warning prior to viewing the page. It bothers me that some games from the larger developers like the GTA franchise, Witcher 3, God of War, etc. can include suggestive, and in some cases, very explicit sexual content, yet seemingly be held to a different standard because the sexual content is secondary to the other (in these examples ) violent content. |
PrettiBoiSlimMay 19, 2018 5:07 PM
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Psyotic said: That picture is definitely not pornographic. The game doesn't have any pornographic content at all.Lord_Sithis said: Except they're not porn games or erotic games either. I think it's a good idea to look at the games you're talking about before talking about them. HuniePop isn't erotic? Let's look at the tags: Nudity, Mature, Anime, Dating Sim, Puzzle Not enough evidence, let's look at the description: "HuniePop is a unique sim experience for PC, Mac and Linux. It's a gameplay first approach that's part dating sim, part puzzle game, with light RPG elements, a visual novel style of presentation, an abrasive western writing style and plenty of "plot"." Just look at this definitely not erotic game:  Enjoying Dark Souls for a different reason than enjoying porn doesn't mean the porn is somehow not OK and Dark Souls is. When did I say enjoying porn is somehow not okay? All I'm saying is that the fact that a game is pornographic is a perfectly acceptable reason to keep it off of Steam. Besides, not only is HuniePop not porn, it serves purposes other than being sexually stimulating. Yes, I bet it is an incredibly difficult RPG with compelling puzzle elements and a rich and fascinating story. I'm sure the fact that they loaded it with anime tiddies wasn't a way to make the game sell better whatsoever. Like it's fine if you enjoy these types of games but you don't need to lie about what they are. And what about Kindred Spirits which tells a story of accepting who you are? Looks like a run of the mill VN. Does it have sex in it, because I already said that having sex =/= pornographic. Oh, and it actually is a difficult RPG with interesting characters. And people don't play it for the porn, because there isn't any. While I don't exactly have an opinion on whether pornographic games should or should not be on Steam, again, this is not a pornographic game. That run of the mill VN has nudity, but no explicit sex. |
| @Psyotic "these games don't turn a huge profit inherently" That's why it's all the more helpful for them to have access to a platform like Steam. Again, I'm living proof here that just being available for distribution through Steam can bring in consumers that otherwise never would have even known the product existed. "Age restriction pages are dumb as shit and don't serve their intended purpose at all. It's like saying that it's okay to have porn on YouTube because people won't watch it if they're not 18." That applies to the entirety of the internet. A parent's inability to monitor what their 15 year old kid is watching/playing isn't relevant here. These types of games aren't steam headliner material because, like you said, they're not your big blockbuster titles. The content isn't shoved in anyone's face, and they don't have to view it if they don't want to. "HuniePop where you have to go elsewhere to get the full experience, if anything they're in a tiny minority. Plenty of games have the porn built right in. " You mean like in Witcher 3 where your character can literally have sex with NPC's? And all of those "routes" are basically obtained through dating sim mechanics. "The difference between GTA, God of War, or Witcher 3, and something like Coming Out on Top, Amarous, House Party, or basically any Sakura game, is that the latter are specifically designed for sexual arousal" The content in these games is far more explicit than anything I've played in HuniePop or the few others like it. Ultimately, we play these games for enjoyment of some kind. I didn't jerk it to HuniePop, but I enjoyed playing it. I didn't jerk it while boning that blonde chick in Witcher 3, but it was all fun and games nonetheless. Yes, we can at least agree that not all VN or dating sim types games have the same level of sexual content, but all games across genres have varying levels of sexual content. I don't think we can hold something like Witcher or GTA to a separate standard of censorship just because we can also murder the shit of stuff in it. |
PrettiBoiSlimMay 19, 2018 5:52 PM
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Can we maybe add some Choco on top of that Banana? XD |
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| “Political correctness ” at its finest |
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Psyotic said: albertbrown said: “Political correctness ” at its finest Wut? How is not wanting porn on your platform "political correctness"? A user of that game that I know told me bluntly: “I simply do not understand why someone would make a complaint about the game's nudity. Don't buy it then, don't apply the uncensor patch. Lock your steam account with age restrictions. I am sick to death of people attempting to control what others have access to. Fricken moral busybodies, go to Australia if you want a nanny state where this kind of stuff is banned.” That’s all I have at the moment. I don’t really play HuniePop like that. |
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| People are really defending Valve's double standard here? lol |
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| @Psyotic "Fuck is all you do in Witcher 3 is fuck people? Is that the core mechanic of the game? That's really weird tbh because I'm not seeing it brought up anywhere on the Steam page. You'd think they'd advertise such a big feature of their game a bit more tbh." Maybe you missed the part where I mentioned "because the sexual content is secondary to the other (in these examples) violent content". No, that obviously isn't all you do in the game. But they definitively built it into the game with actual dating sim mechanics, and when you do, it's far more explicit than anything you'll find in something like HuniePop. "Sithis said that a game like HuniePop is good for reasons other than its fanservice. So just remove the fanservice, then it can be on Steam and they can probably make even more money." That's Sithis' opinion, but I actually thought the dating sim/sexually suggestive elements made it more interesting than a typical matching game. I picked it up because it looked like it'd be different from the usual match-4 of a kind mobile phone type game, and it was. "The fact of the matter is that Valve doesn't want games that use sex or fanservice or whatever as a major selling point on Steam" Fact is, they've allowed this kind of content for years. I bought HuniePop like 2-3 years ago. It's been available for AT LEAST that long. I've never played Deep Space Waifu or Titty Crush or the Sakura franchise, but I know Deep Space Waifu is top down shooter of sorts with fanservice. Does it actually have full on sex scenes like Witcher? Do any of the games you mentioned have explicit content like Witcher, or GTA? Do people not complete the dating sim routes in Witcher, and get the sex scenes because it's part of the entertainment experience? And, realistically, I doubt someone would be able to "get their rocks off" while playing a top down shooter type game. If you're simply talking about removing games with deliberate sex appeal, then you can even stretch this hypothetical into something like Bayonetta, in which our character is deliberately sexualized. "If a game exists where all you do is fuck, then are we really gonna put that game on the same level as Witcher or GTA? I sure as fuck know I wouldn't." Again, in my experiences with all of the games that have been brought up here that I've played, the only ones where I've actually witnessed any sex on the screen were in Witcher 3--where you literally play a dating sim and fuck other characters on screen-- and in GTA 5--where you literally record other characters having sex for one of the quest lines. If the devs for Witcher didn't think there was any value to adding sexual content to their game, they wouldn't have done it, but they did. "If a game exists where all you do is fuck, then are we really gonna put that game on the same level as Witcher or GTA? I sure as fuck know I wouldn't. Yes, HuniePop, Titty Crush, and Deep Space Waifu all use sexually suggestive content as a primary part of the game, but all three of them combined probably have less actual sexual content than either Witcher or GTA. By the logic you're seemingly applying here, a game like HuniePop would still be perfectly fine if there was another part that included something about hunting monsters or committing various crimes, and the sexual stuff was more diplomatically phrased like "a storyline with choices" in the description; that's ridiculous. If Valve really doesn't want sexually explicit content on the Steam platform, then it should be consistent in its removal of it. |
PrettiBoiSlimMay 19, 2018 8:45 PM
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| @Psyotic I do remember you stating that having sex in a game doesn't mean a game is pornographic, and that such features aren't even advertised as a selling point on the Steam page. It wasn’t on the page, but it was still important enough to them to build several different dating-sim/sex scene routes into the game, some of which are even plot points. That’s simply more diplomatic marketing on their part. I could rewrite HuniePop’s description so it reads “HuniePop is a unique sim experience for PC, Mac and Linux. It's a gameplay first approach that's part dating sim, part puzzle game, with light RPG elements, a visual novel style of presentation, an abrasive western writing style and plenty of choices.” Does that pass muster now? Because that’s, in essence, what PROJEKT RED chose to do in advertising Witcher. Being vague about the sexual content, or mitigating the amount mentioned in the description doesn’t make the pornographic content nonexistent. In these little side-stories and scenes, you, as a player, are literally conversing with these characters and sometimes playing mini-games, progressing through a route that ends in a sex scene, and it's not just one or two or even three times. Judging a game’s content based on how it’s marketed doesn’t seem like a very good basis for quality control. That said, Steam has struggled for QC for some time now, it seems. “And at the very least you should be able to see why Valve wouldn't want HuniePop on the Steam store (among other far far worse games that make HuniePop look like high art).” Yes. I don’t know of many of these other games, but we never disagreed on this. I don’t agree with it, but I can understand why. The issue I take with it is the seemingly inconsistent enforcement of the guideline over the past 5 years or so. “You can take the sex out of Witcher or GTA, they're still the same game, just with less content overall.” Then if Valve is to be consistent here in limiting pornographic content on its platform, RED and Rockstar should be under the same pressure to remove the sexual content from their games. No harm done since it doesn’t diminish or make a difference in the gameplay experience, right? It ultimately comes down to how the Steam policy is written, and how it defines “pornographic content”. If there is no distinction between games with suggestive sexual content also but reoccuring themes of sex and fanservice and games that have explicit sexual content but also other story elements, then they have to censor it all or they’re upholding a double standard. It’ll be interesting to see how this plays out over the next week or so, because apparently some of the games in question are up for re-review now. |
PrettiBoiSlimMay 20, 2018 6:21 AM
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| Valve sent the devs emails telling them to disregard their earlier statement. Hopefully Gabe fires the person responsible. |
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| Absolutely terrible m8 |
AdolChri said: Just admit you are wrong, that post was embarrassing a synonymic with the cancer in the game community that blames everything on the straw-man they created. Indeed, but conservatives have hate videogames for a long time. I'm sure the president picking of them isn't going to affect his billions of voters? *Blinks at post in bafflement for a moment* "Billions of voters?" How many people do you think there even are in Ameri---. ...Ohhhhh, wait. I get it now. You're one of these guys. Anyway, I'm dropping out of this bizarre exchange before it gets even more off topic. |
| Important Note: I no longer - in any way, shape, or form - consider myself a moral nihilist (even in my old, convoluted definition of the term). I very much do believe there is such a thing as objective good and evil. In addition, I apologize for any of the posts I've made that are rude, aggressive, or otherwise unbecoming. I've always striven to walk a path befitting a follower of Christ, and now recognize some of my old comments here as misguided if not outright wrong. If you happen upon them, pray do not let them darken your view of the God I serve. He is kind, even if I, at times, have not been. |
| While Steam definitely has issues and inconsistencies in what it's allowed through (and that is definitely on them), them going back and cracking down on things isn't necessarily a bad thing and it's entirely within their rights to not want pornographic material on their store. The gross overreaction people are having to this is so ridiculous. Like people are calling this the #waifuholocaust on twitter and people think that's gonna have them taken seriously? Almost all the games that have gotten notifications (which really isn't as many as news reports and people screaming about it would make you think) are porn games. They may have taken the sex scenes out, but you can still look at images of the game and know what it's there for. Besides, there are other store fronts willing to sell adult games. |
 let's live heroically, let's live with style |
| I'm mainly wondering what they're going to do for people who have already purchased these games. Do they suddenly get a huge refund? Unfortunately two games I wanted to purchase are on the list. This definitely isn't affecting anime-only games either... cageofroses said: While Steam definitely has issues and inconsistencies in what it's allowed through (and that is definitely on them), them going back and cracking down on things isn't necessarily a bad thing and it's entirely within their rights to not want pornographic material on their store. The gross overreaction people are having to this is so ridiculous. Like people are calling this the #waifuholocaust on twitter and people think that's gonna have them taken seriously? Almost all the games that have gotten notifications (which really isn't as many as news reports and people screaming about it would make you think) are porn games. They may have taken the sex scenes out, but you can still look at images of the game and know what it's there for. Besides, there are other store fronts willing to sell adult games. Kindred Spirits on the Roof wasn't a porn game. I haven't played it honestly, but it seems to me it was mostly a visual novel with some erotic scenes. I think an issue here is Steam's wishy washy attitude... Back when Kindred Spirits on the Roof was first allowed to come onto Steam, it was the first uncensored game available: "This is monumental news for the industry as a whole...Seeing frank depictions of same-sex relationships welcomed on such a major gaming platform is a true testament to the open-mindedness of our society and the growing desire for mature entertainment that people of all walks of life can enjoy." PC Gamer commented that "It may also indicate the 'guns good/boobs bad' thinking that's guided game ratings for decades is finally starting to change." (from Wikipedia) The fact that they are now retracting this and asking Kindred Spirits on the Roof's developers to make changes to it seems in poor taste. |
ClaptrapMay 20, 2018 12:24 PM
Claptrap said: Kindred Spirits on the Roof wasn't a porn game. I haven't played it honestly, but it seems to me it was mostly a visual novel with some erotic scenes. I think an issue here is Steam's wishy washy attitude... Back when Kindred Spirits on the Roof was first allowed to come onto Steam, it was the first uncensored game available: "This is monumental news for the industry as a whole...Seeing frank depictions of same-sex relationships welcomed on such a major gaming platform is a true testament to the open-mindedness of our society and the growing desire for mature entertainment that people of all walks of life can enjoy." PC Gamer commented that "It may also indicate the 'guns good/boobs bad' thinking that's guided game ratings for decades is finally starting to change." (from Wikipedia) The fact that they are now retracting this and asking Kindred Spirits on the Roof's developers to make changes to it seems in poor taste. Kindred Spirits is advertised as an adult yuri game and features sexual nudity of teenagers plus has a student/teacher relationship, so it really shouldn't have been on steam to begin with. 🤷 I can see that being something Steam thought about after a while and be like 'yeah you know what we don't want that on here'. It's completely understandable to be upset about steam's back and forth policies, though. They definitely need to be clearer on their guidelines. But I just don't see the point in kicking up a fuss when there's other online game stores out there that focus solely on selling adult games. |
let's live heroically, let's live with style |
| @cageofroses I didn't know it had a student/teacher relationship! Thanks for the heads up. That sure is sketchy. Then again, I expect that there are things I have to overlook with a lot of dating sims. With teenagers, unfortunately that's such a large issue in VNs (and anime type games in general) I don't tend to look at that as the reason they get censored. I'm not sure if Steam specifically takes issue with content of teenagers, though it would be valid to do so. To be quite honest, I'm not really interested much in sexual content when it comes to games anyway but I am worried about missing content that makes the game make sense. For example, even though all the sex scenes in FSN are terrible you'd miss out on a lot of context if you skipped them. I think the concept that someone buy a 'full game' and then have it reduced or altered after they bought it is what's annoying me here most of all. I don't mind a store not allowing adult content on it. That's a natural restriction a store can make for itself. What bothers me is that these policies change things customers have already purchased. I guess my main point is, I think they need to reimburse customers who have purchased these games on Steam before they were altered. |
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