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Shikimori's Not Just a Cutie
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Jul 2, 2022 10:28 AM
#1

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Nov 2011
127991
Shikimori's brother only had short scenes in this series but I'm happy to see him get more screen time. Plus, he seems rather popular with the ladies.

I think one of the most interesting part of this episode is seeing a younger Shikimori with shorter hair. Also pretty interesting to see how much she worked to improve herself. It's insipriing imo and she became the cool person as we all know today.

Stark700Jul 2, 2022 5:22 PM
Jul 2, 2022 10:36 AM
#2

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May 2020
10439
Okay those first few minutes gave me the hope that finally we’ll get the mystery behind this incurable disease our dude’s suffering from maybe childhood, but no for some reason we got this uncalled tomboy turned into a girly glam backstory.

Really thankful to god I somehow made it this far, now that this and Kanokari are next day neighbours, anything beyond one more week is just too much for my health.
Softhenic03Jul 2, 2022 10:40 AM
Jul 2, 2022 11:03 AM
#3
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May 2021
2640
Ok episode some backstory of Shikimori is not that bad.Although the uses of bad luck is still kinda lame this episode was watchable so I don't have much problem.
Jul 2, 2022 11:09 AM
#4
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Sep 2015
5947
I never know Shikimori's brother age but since he can drive he must be at least 18 years old.

And I love when he's not good at handle woman. I kinda expect him to be a womanizer so I'm happy he has this personality gap.
Jul 2, 2022 11:34 AM
#5
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Jan 2021
53
I'm going to be completely honest as a manga reader.

I do not remember over half of these scenes being in the manga, even considering all the untranslated chapters.

I absolutely despise a lot of the anime original content presented in this episode. It not only completely butchers Shikimori's entire character arc, it betrays a lot of the central themes presented in the manga.

Adapting chapter 95.5 (a snippet of Izumi's backstory) made absolutely no sense in the context of this episode. I also hated how they tried turning Shikimori into a girly girl. Considering this manga is largely about role reversal, it just makes Shikimori's relationship with Izumi a lot more unbelievable. This episode made Shikimori feel even more generic than she already was in the manga.
Jul 2, 2022 11:37 AM
#6

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Apr 2010
9561
Well a bit about the past of both the characters which was nice to see.
Seems Shikimori was doing a lot to change herself but it's nice to see that she didn't change that much in the end, always try to be yourself being someone else is only stressful.
phantomfandom said:
I never know Shikimori's brother age but since he can drive he must be at least 18 years old.

And I love when he's not good at handle woman. I kinda expect him to be a womanizer so I'm happy he has this personality gap.
From what i can tell he isn't in highschool anymore but when he was talking about quitting Karate he was still in highschool, and they way they act towards each other suggests they are close in age so my guess is that he is 2 or 3 years older than Shikimori.
Jul 2, 2022 11:46 AM
#7

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Sep 2021
434
We get to see Shikimori's brother, he seems like a nice person and brother to her. Next week final chapter and next to the manga
Jul 2, 2022 11:51 AM
#8

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Feb 2021
6405
That face is just something else



Really good episode, Shikimori's backstory was pretty interesting, and her first meeting with Izumi was pretty funny too.
Jul 2, 2022 11:59 AM
#9
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Feb 2022
339
I liked it because the episode shows how Shikimori wanted to become a cute girl and how she met Izumi and how they didn't talk much Izumi thinks of taking Shikimori on a date so she prepare to kiss Izumi
Jul 2, 2022 12:06 PM

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Oct 2017
24054
Loved the backstory, younger Shikimori with short hair looks cute.
Jul 2, 2022 12:11 PM

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Nov 2011
3764
Nice little episode with the Brother getting involved.
That Short hair Izumi mother though...perfect.

This episode really made me feel for Izumi. He loves his friends a lot but at the risk of them getting hurt he has to make unfortunate sacrifices.

Im actually really glad Shikimori is in his life to make it better.

Nice episode.
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Jul 2, 2022 12:22 PM
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Mar 2015
12694
Shikimori's back story and how they met Without her he would not have made it into her HS
Jul 2, 2022 12:30 PM
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Aug 2020
622
Was this entire backstory part for Shikimori anime original? I don't remember that at all from the manga.
Jul 2, 2022 12:43 PM

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Jul 2017
13475
Izumi's backstory of bad luck traces, it's one that stems his entire life, looking for a hero to save him from his predicament.

More backstory moments with Shikimori and her lil' bro (that I believe this entire episode is anime-original content), and even her with Izumi after the cultural festival to finally have a private date together. The dense one will never understand why the heart-throb girlfriend wants in that badly, and the lil' bro is too shy enough to avoid advances.

It's just sad to see Shikimori's family state of being independent from an early age, but it's for their best, and for the karate girl that's hard-and-fast growing up with her younger brother that has his preferences quickly change due to boredom and lacking individuality. But at least he's a kind sibling to her, which slowly defined her change that she is not like him or his mother.

Most certainly, Shikimori shifted out of karate to be a cute girl, she's one that changed because of love. And that's most certainly how both her and Izumi met, where the latter back then is a bad premonition, and the former blew up her ladylike-ness, being in the same class after passing their school's entrance exam, and after exchanging some words, became the couple that we know they are today: the bad luck boy and the un-cute girl that didn't change much to be whom she wants to be.

Despite "questionable" content, Shikimori episodes have continued to bang, and with consistency.

Will Shikimori be able to get the dream and the kiss that she wanted with the date with Izumi? Now I'm eagerly awaiting the finale next week...
Jul 2, 2022 12:50 PM
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Jan 2021
53
Storm1988 said:
Was this entire backstory part for Shikimori anime original? I don't remember that at all from the manga.

Yep. Everything we see in this episode about Shikimori's backstory is anime original. The only parts that were from the manga was Shikimori shopping with her brother and the little snippet of Izumi's backstory.
Jul 2, 2022 12:50 PM

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Jul 2017
13475
dlee2040 said:
I'm going to be completely honest as a manga reader.

I do not remember over half of these scenes being in the manga, even considering all the untranslated chapters.

I absolutely despise a lot of the anime original content presented in this episode. It not only completely butchers Shikimori's entire character arc, it betrays a lot of the central themes presented in the manga.

Adapting chapter 95.5 (a snippet of Izumi's backstory) made absolutely no sense in the context of this episode. I also hated how they tried turning Shikimori into a girly girl. Considering this manga is largely about role reversal, it just makes Shikimori's relationship with Izumi a lot more unbelievable. This episode made Shikimori feel even more generic than she already was in the manga.
You are right, but you are wrong as well.

This is like as mentioned, totally an anime-original episode, but how Shikimori is reflected in the manga and anime are 2 different things. The manga is still ongoing and the author can decide whom he/she wants Shikimori to be, but the anime has to have some closure since it's just an adaptation of it and more.

But I just have a question: what is it about both Izumi and Shikimori that you absolutely detest? Have you heard of this thing called character development?
Jul 2, 2022 12:51 PM
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Dec 2021
1262
Shikimori's brother is so fucking sexy!!!!!
Jul 2, 2022 12:53 PM
Shingster

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Jun 2015
4229
Thats some bad luck there especially on exam day lol. Back in mid school though looks like Izumi's had it rough. Can't blame him from avoiding others. Shikimori and her bro don't seem close huh. But wow seeing him get so flustered and having to be bailed out off was adorable. The insight how Shikimori and Izumi were before they met was pretty insightful. Shikimori was especially different back then. In a way before they met they were very much alike in a lot of things. But being inspired by love sure is an interesting source of motivation. But i guess now we can see where her constant desire to be cute comes from. Can't wait to see how the date goes in the finale next week but have to say really enjoyed this ep and the expansion it gave for both Izumi and Shikimori.
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Jul 2, 2022 1:00 PM

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Feb 2019
8149
Shikimori’s backstory was the second best part of this series for me after kamiya arc.

The shikimori we see on the surface seems to have everything figured out and is so perfect, but she wasn’t always like that and still has her insecurities. Any episode without that loser izumi as the focus is a plus for me.
Jul 2, 2022 1:30 PM

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Sep 2020
5416
Finally more Shikimori! this episode is really nice~Also a lot of funny faces.
Jul 2, 2022 1:32 PM
Deadhead

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Dec 2018
3026
Nice to get some backstory not only on how Shikimori and Izumi got together, but also their individual backstories too, definitely adds a lot to their relationship.

It’s also interesting to know how Shikimori used to be before she found something she wanted to do, funny how it was a manga that got her wanting to become a “cutie” lol, but it wasn’t her cuteness that won Izumi over which was a really nice way to begin their relationship, that expression she made when when she asked for Izumi’s name was a favorite of mine for sure. Also Shikimori’s brother is cool, I like how he helped her realize she needed to make her own decisions, and her mom was hot lol, sad we haven’t seen her until now.

This will be my final Spring 2022 show to end next week, it’s been slightly slept on due to being overhyped but I’ve personally really enjoyed this all the way through, and the last few episodes have been really good too.
Jul 2, 2022 1:36 PM

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Apr 2020
2073
The episode I've long waited for, and what pretty much proved the point of my interest for this series, and that is how the hell Shikimori and Izumi met and how they are like in the past.

Now for Izumi it is simple, he was a boy damned with bad luck and though it has subsided now that he's in high school it really stunted his elementary and mid hs days. For our precious Shikimori, the edgy and badass side actually came first during her karate days with her big bro, Fuji.

It makes sense since she's always been tough when needed but she only tags with the people she's close with since she lacks initiative which I can relate to. And I relate much more since it took a romcom manga for her to change gears and became the girlie that was contrast of her younger days. Then came their first meeting.

The first out of many more moments when Shikimori saves Izumi of whatever trouble he's dealing with. Izumi is the boy that Shikimori is finding all this time, and now knowing what happens since then, it surely has been a very nice relationship. Last episode is coming and it is a date, surely they're at a point to grant us audience that long awaited smooch, let's get it while it's hot!!!
Jul 2, 2022 1:36 PM
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Jan 2021
53
KANLen09 said:
dlee2040 said:
I'm going to be completely honest as a manga reader.

I do not remember over half of these scenes being in the manga, even considering all the untranslated chapters.

I absolutely despise a lot of the anime original content presented in this episode. It not only completely butchers Shikimori's entire character arc, it betrays a lot of the central themes presented in the manga.

Adapting chapter 95.5 (a snippet of Izumi's backstory) made absolutely no sense in the context of this episode. I also hated how they tried turning Shikimori into a girly girl. Considering this manga is largely about role reversal, it just makes Shikimori's relationship with Izumi a lot more unbelievable. This episode made Shikimori feel even more generic than she already was in the manga.
You are right, but you are wrong as well.

This is like as mentioned, totally an anime-original episode, but how Shikimori is reflected in the manga and anime are 2 different things. The manga is still ongoing and the author can decide whom he/she wants Shikimori to be, but the anime has to have some closure since it's just an adaptation of it and more.

But I just have a question: what is it about both Izumi and Shikimori that you absolutely detest? Have you heard of this thing called character development?

What I absolutely detest about Izumi and Shikimori is how different they feel in the manga compared to the anime. In the anime, they feel a lot less like a couple than they do in the manga. They left out a lot of early chapters that clearly demonstrate what kind of dynamic they have in the manga. Shikimori is clearly characterized as someone who enjoys taking the lead in the relationship, and likes Izumi's cuteness, sensitivity, and feminine traits. Considering the manga is about two people in a relationship with a gender role-reversal dynamic, this should be obvious. For some examples, chapter 10 has the first "cool outfit" and chapter 23 has Shikimori clearly enjoying pinning Izumi down on a couch ready to do... something. Let's not forget all the times she tries teasing Izumi and getting reactions out of him. The anime not only tones down a lot of her defining traits, but it seems to emphasize the complete opposite a lot of the time, this episode being the biggest sinner of the bunch.

This episode puts a large emphasis on how Shikimori so badly wants to be a "cute girl" after reading some shoujo manga in order to attract a "cool guy," the complete opposite of Izumi. Now I just no longer understand what she sees in Izumi anymore. Izumi has a lot of good traits about him, but he doesn't fit the typical cool shoujo manga male mc mold one bit. Izumi and Shikimori hardly feel like a couple anymore, and the anime gives me the impression that she only likes Izumi in spite of his feminine traits rather than because of them.

Her giving up karate to do whatever she wants is fine by itself, but giving up literally everything about your identity to become the most cookie-cutter anime girl imaginable is one of the worst decisions they could have possibly made. She escaped her cage of trying to live up to her brother just to run into another cage.

The tl;dr is that the anime not only fails to characterize her the same way that the manga does, but it straight up undoes everything the manga built up. The anime at large has like 5x as many problems, but these were the big ones I had with episode 11.

Definitely in the minority when it comes to Shikimori fans, but I did not like the anime original backstory to Shikimori. I truly hope this isn't canon.

Sorry if my thoughts feel scattered. Normally, I plan things out before writing them, but this post is driven almost entirely by my emotions.

Jul 2, 2022 2:09 PM
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Aug 2020
622
dlee2040 said:
Adapting chapter 95.5 (a snippet of Izumi's backstory) made absolutely no sense in the context of this episode.


I absolutely agree, I felt the same way while watching. It made absolutely no sense to put that scene there at the beginning. Just one more for the pile of many examples why this anime adaptation is simply bad. I'd really like to get some more background information on the production of this show in the future. You can't blame covid for everything.
Jul 2, 2022 2:22 PM

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May 2021
82
The relationship between Shikimori and her brother was very interesting and she got some backstory that helps us understand her better.
Jul 2, 2022 2:37 PM

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Jun 2021
1346
I really liked this episode. Seeing how Izumi and Shikimori were before they met and how that first meeting went was nice. Poor Izumi really had it tough before Shikimori showed up. That cursed luck of his has really been a burden on him. Poor kid never really had a normal childhood because of it.

Shikimori on the other hand has always been kind of “cool”. It seems like she was just chasing after her big brother the whole time. As a younger sibling myself, I can kinda relate to that. It was nice to see her step away from that and become her own person slowly. Seeing her relationship with her brother evolve was nice too. He’s a good big brother and their relationship is pretty heartwarming.

Anyways, looking forward to this date. I remember liking that part in the manga. On an unrelated note, this show has like all the milf waifus lol. First it was Mama Izumi and now we finally get to see Mama Shikimori. Hot damn haha.
Jul 2, 2022 2:59 PM

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May 2021
59547
This was exactly the sort of episode the series needed. Not perfect but definitely elevates the series.




Jul 2, 2022 3:12 PM
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Apr 2020
726
dlee2040 said:
KANLen09 said:
You are right, but you are wrong as well.

This is like as mentioned, totally an anime-original episode, but how Shikimori is reflected in the manga and anime are 2 different things. The manga is still ongoing and the author can decide whom he/she wants Shikimori to be, but the anime has to have some closure since it's just an adaptation of it and more.

But I just have a question: what is it about both Izumi and Shikimori that you absolutely detest? Have you heard of this thing called character development?

What I absolutely detest about Izumi and Shikimori is how different they feel in the manga compared to the anime. In the anime, they feel a lot less like a couple than they do in the manga. They left out a lot of early chapters that clearly demonstrate what kind of dynamic they have in the manga. Shikimori is clearly characterized as someone who enjoys taking the lead in the relationship, and likes Izumi's cuteness, sensitivity, and feminine traits. Considering the manga is about two people in a relationship with a gender role-reversal dynamic, this should be obvious. For some examples, chapter 10 has the first "cool outfit" and chapter 23 has Shikimori clearly enjoying pinning Izumi down on a couch ready to do... something. Let's not forget all the times she tries teasing Izumi and getting reactions out of him. The anime not only tones down a lot of her defining traits, but it seems to emphasize the complete opposite a lot of the time, this episode being the biggest sinner of the bunch.

This episode puts a large emphasis on how Shikimori so badly wants to be a "cute girl" after reading some shoujo manga in order to attract a "cool guy," the complete opposite of Izumi. Now I just no longer understand what she sees in Izumi anymore. Izumi has a lot of good traits about him, but he doesn't fit the typical cool shoujo manga male mc mold one bit. Izumi and Shikimori hardly feel like a couple anymore, and the anime gives me the impression that she only likes Izumi in spite of his feminine traits rather than because of them.

Her giving up karate to do whatever she wants is fine by itself, but giving up literally everything about your identity to become the most cookie-cutter anime girl imaginable is one of the worst decisions they could have possibly made. She escaped her cage of trying to live up to her brother just to run into another cage.

The tl;dr is that the anime not only fails to characterize her the same way that the manga does, but it straight up undoes everything the manga built up. The anime at large has like 5x as many problems, but these were the big ones I had with episode 11.

Definitely in the minority when it comes to Shikimori fans, but I did not like the anime original backstory to Shikimori. I truly hope this isn't canon.

Sorry if my thoughts feel scattered. Normally, I plan things out before writing them, but this post is driven almost entirely by my emotions.


This is like, a weird obsession with the manga ngl
Stop saying they butchered their relationship, I don't even know wtf do you want them to do with the adaptation, if adapting every frame in the anime would made it 10/10 just like the manga is to you, then guess what, that normally won't happen
And I'm not talking about the original scenes in this episode in particular, but rather your claim of how "bad" they made the story look like as if the manga itself is perfect by any means
Like seriously just put your desires and obsession aside and everything will be good, otherwise stop making hate comments on every thread saying how they didn't made everything like you want, because the anime onlys and even other manga readers are enjoying this show
Jul 2, 2022 3:48 PM
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Apr 2020
726
Wow, this was really good introduction to the date episode, I'm expecting a beautiful and very good adaptation of this wholesome date since they left it for the last episode, unlike some toxic people here, I was impressed with the anime original content they added for this episode, since it adds a realistic and positive aspects of Shikimori's character and her interactions with her brother was something helpful to show more of the background she's coming from which in turn was a nice way to reveal her true feelings and the origin of her actions
Jul 2, 2022 4:18 PM
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Jan 2021
53
Khalil04 said:
dlee2040 said:

What I absolutely detest about Izumi and Shikimori is how different they feel in the manga compared to the anime. In the anime, they feel a lot less like a couple than they do in the manga. They left out a lot of early chapters that clearly demonstrate what kind of dynamic they have in the manga. Shikimori is clearly characterized as someone who enjoys taking the lead in the relationship, and likes Izumi's cuteness, sensitivity, and feminine traits. Considering the manga is about two people in a relationship with a gender role-reversal dynamic, this should be obvious. For some examples, chapter 10 has the first "cool outfit" and chapter 23 has Shikimori clearly enjoying pinning Izumi down on a couch ready to do... something. Let's not forget all the times she tries teasing Izumi and getting reactions out of him. The anime not only tones down a lot of her defining traits, but it seems to emphasize the complete opposite a lot of the time, this episode being the biggest sinner of the bunch.

This episode puts a large emphasis on how Shikimori so badly wants to be a "cute girl" after reading some shoujo manga in order to attract a "cool guy," the complete opposite of Izumi. Now I just no longer understand what she sees in Izumi anymore. Izumi has a lot of good traits about him, but he doesn't fit the typical cool shoujo manga male mc mold one bit. Izumi and Shikimori hardly feel like a couple anymore, and the anime gives me the impression that she only likes Izumi in spite of his feminine traits rather than because of them.

Her giving up karate to do whatever she wants is fine by itself, but giving up literally everything about your identity to become the most cookie-cutter anime girl imaginable is one of the worst decisions they could have possibly made. She escaped her cage of trying to live up to her brother just to run into another cage.

The tl;dr is that the anime not only fails to characterize her the same way that the manga does, but it straight up undoes everything the manga built up. The anime at large has like 5x as many problems, but these were the big ones I had with episode 11.

Definitely in the minority when it comes to Shikimori fans, but I did not like the anime original backstory to Shikimori. I truly hope this isn't canon.

Sorry if my thoughts feel scattered. Normally, I plan things out before writing them, but this post is driven almost entirely by my emotions.


This is like, a weird obsession with the manga ngl
Stop saying they butchered their relationship, I don't even know wtf do you want them to do with the adaptation, if adapting every frame in the anime would made it 10/10 just like the manga is to you, then guess what, that normally won't happen
And I'm not talking about the original scenes in this episode in particular, but rather your claim of how "bad" they made the story look like as if the manga itself is perfect by any means
Like seriously just put your desires and obsession aside and everything will be good, otherwise stop making hate comments on every thread saying how they didn't made everything like you want, because the anime onlys and even other manga readers are enjoying this show

Alright where do I even begin with this?

"Stop saying they butchered their relationship"

So do you just not want me to criticize the anime at all? I am expressing my opinions on a thread that was created with this purpose in mind. There are a lot of manga readers who are not satisfied with the anime, because the anime has legitimate flaws that did not exist in the manga, and you're just going to have to accept that. No one is saying you can't enjoy the anime. If you enjoy the anime, that's great. I'm happy that you enjoy something I don't. No one is forcing you to agree with their opinion so stop forcing others to do the same thing.

"I don't even know wtf do you want them to do with the adaptation, if adapting every frame in the anime would made it 10/10 just like the manga is to you, then guess what, that normally won't happen."

Except I never expected the anime to adapt every single chapter, even from the very beginning. However, there are plenty of IMPORTANT chapters that gave these characters personality that were cut out in the manga. I get that it's hard to adapt a manga with very short chapters, but the ridiculous amount of filler content just makes this inexcusable. They very easily could have replaced some of the anime original content with chapters from the manga that would have shown these characters' insecurities, goals, and what they see in each other (or at least help set them up for later in the anime). A good example of an anime adapting short chapters into coherent episodes is Nagatoro. Although the structure isn't quite the same, they still managed to connect largely episodic chapters together without sacrificing a lot of what made Nagatoro... well... Nagatoro. Shikimori, on the other hand, drags out largely irrelevant details of the manga and leaves out some pretty important details resulting in an anime that feels like all the life and passion was sapped out of it.

"And I'm not talking about the original scenes in this episode in particular, but rather your claim of how "bad" they made the story look like as if the manga itself is perfect by any means"

When did I ever say that the manga was perfect? Sure I gave the manga a 10/10 on my own manga list, but I only speak for myself when I rate things. I greatly enjoy the manga because I think there's a lot more depth to it than people give it credit for, but of course there are things to criticize about the manga. The reason I think the anime isn't a very good adaptation is because it fails to capture what made the manga good or add something to the manga that elevates the series as a whole.

"Like seriously just put your desires and obsession aside and everything will be good"

I honestly don't really think I'm asking for anything unreasonable. A lot of points (excluding episode 11) that I have made about the anime are things that a lot of manga readers agree with me on. Asking an adaptation to capture the same beats as the source material is like the most basic thing you could ask for.

"otherwise stop making hate comments on every thread saying how they didn't made everything like you want"

First of all, you are confusing blind hatred with constructive criticism. I absolutely agree that a significant portion of the hate this series gets is unreasonable. A lot of people make very half-assed criticisms like "Izumi is too feminine" or hardly support their claims at all. However, there comes a point where you can no longer justify ALL the hatred as ONLY people with insane levels of toxic masculinity. I don't think I've made a whole ton of half-assed criticisms towards the anime. I always try to justify all of my grievances.

Second, what do you mean "making hate comments on every thread?" I rarely go on MAL forums as you can see by the number of posts, and some posts were actually me DEFENDING the series or just providing factual information. Stop trying to label anyone who criticizes the series as irrational haters because I have met plenty of people who dislike the anime who are still reasonable about it.

"the anime onlys and even other manga readers are enjoying this show"

Did I say that every single anime only and manga reader hates this show? No shit there are still plenty of people who enjoy Shikimori. However I've seen a ton of manga readers express their dissatisfaction about the anime. "Manga > anime" is like the coldest take in the Shikimori fandom right now.
Jul 2, 2022 4:29 PM
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Oct 2020
2406
Ok nice got to see some backstory on Isumi and how he and Shikimori met. Also got more of Shikimori's family. Her mom with the deep voice is nice and glasses! We also got Shikimori with glasses. Also saw her as a little kid.
Jul 2, 2022 5:12 PM

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Aug 2020
2680
Curly-haired Shikimori is all I could ask for. Her brother is thoughtful and kind too, as well as her mother. Shikimori has a wonderful family. I love the throwbacks ><


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Jul 2, 2022 5:57 PM
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dlee2040 said:
Khalil04 said:

This is like, a weird obsession with the manga ngl
Stop saying they butchered their relationship, I don't even know wtf do you want them to do with the adaptation, if adapting every frame in the anime would made it 10/10 just like the manga is to you, then guess what, that normally won't happen
And I'm not talking about the original scenes in this episode in particular, but rather your claim of how "bad" they made the story look like as if the manga itself is perfect by any means
Like seriously just put your desires and obsession aside and everything will be good, otherwise stop making hate comments on every thread saying how they didn't made everything like you want, because the anime onlys and even other manga readers are enjoying this show

Alright where do I even begin with this?

"Stop saying they butchered their relationship"

So do you just not want me to criticize the anime at all? I am expressing my opinions on a thread that was created with this purpose in mind. There are a lot of manga readers who are not satisfied with the anime, because the anime has legitimate flaws that did not exist in the manga, and you're just going to have to accept that. No one is saying you can't enjoy the anime. If you enjoy the anime, that's great. I'm happy that you enjoy something I don't. No one is forcing you to agree with their opinion so stop forcing others to do the same thing.

"I don't even know wtf do you want them to do with the adaptation, if adapting every frame in the anime would made it 10/10 just like the manga is to you, then guess what, that normally won't happen."

Except I never expected the anime to adapt every single chapter, even from the very beginning. However, there are plenty of IMPORTANT chapters that gave these characters personality that were cut out in the manga. I get that it's hard to adapt a manga with very short chapters, but the ridiculous amount of filler content just makes this inexcusable. They very easily could have replaced some of the anime original content with chapters from the manga that would have shown these characters' insecurities, goals, and what they see in each other (or at least help set them up for later in the anime). A good example of an anime adapting short chapters into coherent episodes is Nagatoro. Although the structure isn't quite the same, they still managed to connect largely episodic chapters together without sacrificing a lot of what made Nagatoro... well... Nagatoro. Shikimori, on the other hand, drags out largely irrelevant details of the manga and leaves out some pretty important details resulting in an anime that feels like all the life and passion was sapped out of it.

"And I'm not talking about the original scenes in this episode in particular, but rather your claim of how "bad" they made the story look like as if the manga itself is perfect by any means"

When did I ever say that the manga was perfect? Sure I gave the manga a 10/10 on my own manga list, but I only speak for myself when I rate things. I greatly enjoy the manga because I think there's a lot more depth to it than people give it credit for, but of course there are things to criticize about the manga. The reason I think the anime isn't a very good adaptation is because it fails to capture what made the manga good or add something to the manga that elevates the series as a whole.

"Like seriously just put your desires and obsession aside and everything will be good"

I honestly don't really think I'm asking for anything unreasonable. A lot of points (excluding episode 11) that I have made about the anime are things that a lot of manga readers agree with me on. Asking an adaptation to capture the same beats as the source material is like the most basic thing you could ask for.

"otherwise stop making hate comments on every thread saying how they didn't made everything like you want"

First of all, you are confusing blind hatred with constructive criticism. I absolutely agree that a significant portion of the hate this series gets is unreasonable. A lot of people make very half-assed criticisms like "Izumi is too feminine" or hardly support their claims at all. However, there comes a point where you can no longer justify ALL the hatred as ONLY people with insane levels of toxic masculinity. I don't think I've made a whole ton of half-assed criticisms towards the anime. I always try to justify all of my grievances.

Second, what do you mean "making hate comments on every thread?" I rarely go on MAL forums as you can see by the number of posts, and some posts were actually me DEFENDING the series or just providing factual information. Stop trying to label anyone who criticizes the series as irrational haters because I have met plenty of people who dislike the anime who are still reasonable about it.

"the anime onlys and even other manga readers are enjoying this show"

Did I say that every single anime only and manga reader hates this show? No shit there are still plenty of people who enjoy Shikimori. However I've seen a ton of manga readers express their dissatisfaction about the anime. "Manga > anime" is like the coldest take in the Shikimori fandom right now.

As a fellow manga reader, I don’t really agree with a few of your points (especially regarding this episode) but I agree with not liking how Shikimori and Izumi’s relationship was handled at the start of the anime
Jul 2, 2022 6:50 PM
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May 2014
6
Even tho the anime is ending next week This episode was so wholesome yet simple as it showed you both of the characters change before meeting each other . for shikimori her trying to follow the steps of her brother "which btw is very cool" and upon meeting izumi she starts being herself and not following the standard way of looking a certain way and acting in a cute way because when someone likes you they like you for who you really are and as easy as it sounds but surprisingly people rarely remember that acting cute/cool won't make people like you you're just living a lie.
I hope they make season 2 :(
Jul 2, 2022 7:25 PM
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Apr 2022
381
For filling in the backstory, it sounds like it appeals better for the Anime viewers that haven't read the Manga, or not hardline sticklers for the manga storyline.
Jul 2, 2022 8:35 PM
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Nov 2020
165
dlee2040 said:
KANLen09 said:
You are right, but you are wrong as well.

This is like as mentioned, totally an anime-original episode, but how Shikimori is reflected in the manga and anime are 2 different things. The manga is still ongoing and the author can decide whom he/she wants Shikimori to be, but the anime has to have some closure since it's just an adaptation of it and more.

But I just have a question: what is it about both Izumi and Shikimori that you absolutely detest? Have you heard of this thing called character development?

What I absolutely detest about Izumi and Shikimori is how different they feel in the manga compared to the anime. In the anime, they feel a lot less like a couple than they do in the manga. They left out a lot of early chapters that clearly demonstrate what kind of dynamic they have in the manga. Shikimori is clearly characterized as someone who enjoys taking the lead in the relationship, and likes Izumi's cuteness, sensitivity, and feminine traits. Considering the manga is about two people in a relationship with a gender role-reversal dynamic, this should be obvious. For some examples, chapter 10 has the first "cool outfit" and chapter 23 has Shikimori clearly enjoying pinning Izumi down on a couch ready to do... something. Let's not forget all the times she tries teasing Izumi and getting reactions out of him. The anime not only tones down a lot of her defining traits, but it seems to emphasize the complete opposite a lot of the time, this episode being the biggest sinner of the bunch.

This episode puts a large emphasis on how Shikimori so badly wants to be a "cute girl" after reading some shoujo manga in order to attract a "cool guy," the complete opposite of Izumi. Now I just no longer understand what she sees in Izumi anymore. Izumi has a lot of good traits about him, but he doesn't fit the typical cool shoujo manga male mc mold one bit. Izumi and Shikimori hardly feel like a couple anymore, and the anime gives me the impression that she only likes Izumi in spite of his feminine traits rather than because of them.

Her giving up karate to do whatever she wants is fine by itself, but giving up literally everything about your identity to become the most cookie-cutter anime girl imaginable is one of the worst decisions they could have possibly made. She escaped her cage of trying to live up to her brother just to run into another cage.

The tl;dr is that the anime not only fails to characterize her the same way that the manga does, but it straight up undoes everything the manga built up. The anime at large has like 5x as many problems, but these were the big ones I had with episode 11.

Definitely in the minority when it comes to Shikimori fans, but I did not like the anime original backstory to Shikimori. I truly hope this isn't canon.

Sorry if my thoughts feel scattered. Normally, I plan things out before writing them, but this post is driven almost entirely by my emotions.

Even though you wrote your thoughts might be scattered, you still able to make a very good comment about this episode and it seems like you are a genuine and honest fan of the series. I have read comments about this series before and not only with that, even with other series that are not properly adapted from original source i-e manga, readers do criticize the adaptation but they are unable to genuinely comment about it.They just straight forward vent their frustration on the series without properly explaining why they are frustrated at first place....
Jul 2, 2022 8:44 PM
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Jun 2022
267
good to see the anime not getting too much hate. I mean it's not horimaya or tonikawa but still it's a pretty good wholesome anime.
Jul 2, 2022 9:41 PM
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Jan 2021
6
Storm1988 said:
Was this entire backstory part for Shikimori anime original? I don't remember that at all from the manga.


some of it are in the manga when she met her kouhai in their 3rd year but almost all of it are original
Jul 2, 2022 10:57 PM

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Mar 2010
13623
Really loved the past two episodes!! Can't believe we got a episode of when they were not together. Very cute episode!
Jul 2, 2022 11:12 PM

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Aug 2019
2506
The brother is really attractive
Jul 2, 2022 11:16 PM
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Apr 2020
726
dlee2040 said:
Khalil04 said:

This is like, a weird obsession with the manga ngl
Stop saying they butchered their relationship, I don't even know wtf do you want them to do with the adaptation, if adapting every frame in the anime would made it 10/10 just like the manga is to you, then guess what, that normally won't happen
And I'm not talking about the original scenes in this episode in particular, but rather your claim of how "bad" they made the story look like as if the manga itself is perfect by any means
Like seriously just put your desires and obsession aside and everything will be good, otherwise stop making hate comments on every thread saying how they didn't made everything like you want, because the anime onlys and even other manga readers are enjoying this show

Alright where do I even begin with this?

"Stop saying they butchered their relationship"

So do you just not want me to criticize the anime at all? I am expressing my opinions on a thread that was created with this purpose in mind. There are a lot of manga readers who are not satisfied with the anime, because the anime has legitimate flaws that did not exist in the manga, and you're just going to have to accept that. No one is saying you can't enjoy the anime. If you enjoy the anime, that's great. I'm happy that you enjoy something I don't. No one is forcing you to agree with their opinion so stop forcing others to do the same thing.

"I don't even know wtf do you want them to do with the adaptation, if adapting every frame in the anime would made it 10/10 just like the manga is to you, then guess what, that normally won't happen."

Except I never expected the anime to adapt every single chapter, even from the very beginning. However, there are plenty of IMPORTANT chapters that gave these characters personality that were cut out in the manga. I get that it's hard to adapt a manga with very short chapters, but the ridiculous amount of filler content just makes this inexcusable. They very easily could have replaced some of the anime original content with chapters from the manga that would have shown these characters' insecurities, goals, and what they see in each other (or at least help set them up for later in the anime). A good example of an anime adapting short chapters into coherent episodes is Nagatoro. Although the structure isn't quite the same, they still managed to connect largely episodic chapters together without sacrificing a lot of what made Nagatoro... well... Nagatoro. Shikimori, on the other hand, drags out largely irrelevant details of the manga and leaves out some pretty important details resulting in an anime that feels like all the life and passion was sapped out of it.

"And I'm not talking about the original scenes in this episode in particular, but rather your claim of how "bad" they made the story look like as if the manga itself is perfect by any means"

When did I ever say that the manga was perfect? Sure I gave the manga a 10/10 on my own manga list, but I only speak for myself when I rate things. I greatly enjoy the manga because I think there's a lot more depth to it than people give it credit for, but of course there are things to criticize about the manga. The reason I think the anime isn't a very good adaptation is because it fails to capture what made the manga good or add something to the manga that elevates the series as a whole.

"Like seriously just put your desires and obsession aside and everything will be good"

I honestly don't really think I'm asking for anything unreasonable. A lot of points (excluding episode 11) that I have made about the anime are things that a lot of manga readers agree with me on. Asking an adaptation to capture the same beats as the source material is like the most basic thing you could ask for.

"otherwise stop making hate comments on every thread saying how they didn't made everything like you want"

First of all, you are confusing blind hatred with constructive criticism. I absolutely agree that a significant portion of the hate this series gets is unreasonable. A lot of people make very half-assed criticisms like "Izumi is too feminine" or hardly support their claims at all. However, there comes a point where you can no longer justify ALL the hatred as ONLY people with insane levels of toxic masculinity. I don't think I've made a whole ton of half-assed criticisms towards the anime. I always try to justify all of my grievances.

Second, what do you mean "making hate comments on every thread?" I rarely go on MAL forums as you can see by the number of posts, and some posts were actually me DEFENDING the series or just providing factual information. Stop trying to label anyone who criticizes the series as irrational haters because I have met plenty of people who dislike the anime who are still reasonable about it.

"the anime onlys and even other manga readers are enjoying this show"

Did I say that every single anime only and manga reader hates this show? No shit there are still plenty of people who enjoy Shikimori. However I've seen a ton of manga readers express their dissatisfaction about the anime. "Manga > anime" is like the coldest take in the Shikimori fandom right now.

Ah so you made a paragraph for every sentence I wrote 😂😂
The thing is, the anime isn't bad, and all you have said is based on: "we manga readers aka the hands of God, don't want to enjoy the anime because it didn't live up to our illusional thoughts and expectations of it being the same thing as the manga, they butchered the relationship of the two most well written lovers in fiction 😡 just because they didn't adapt every repetitive chapter that ends the same way"

I don't know what rating system you have but it's really bad ngl, but hey it's your opinion so it's not the main problem here, yes other manga readers are just toxic, and being the most critic about something doesn't mean you're right lmfao
Like have you ever heard of artistic view ? It's the most hard thing to accept as for manga readers since their obsession with the source material can be blind to the point of rejecting every other forms of introducing characters, showing emotions and building up the events to a certain degree, which if we're being objective here, the anime alone (if we ignored the manga to look at the anime's own execution) didn't fail providing these elements at all, sure the manga can be better at times especially at the beginning, but the last 8 episodes were as good as the manga and maybe better

And HOLLY SHIT, when I first replied to your comment I haven't watched the 11 episode (that's why I didn't include what happened in it) so I was expecting a really bad original content because of what you said about it, but tbh what a surprise it was when I realized how much it's well done as an introduction to that boat date which I also didn't finish reading a long ago in the manga.
I'm not caught up with the recent chapters, so I'm just speaking of the 62 chapters that I have read so far, and you know what, it's still not as half bad as what you're implying here, as I said in an earlier comment, the original content served its purpose well.

The only reason I'm being aggressive here is because you're not providing an opinion like the others in this thread, like I wouldn't quote everyone who didn't like the original content since it's just a matter of opinion and I respect it, but the difference with you is that you're saying some exaggerated criticism and acting like it's a matter of facts which isn't necessarily the truth by any means but rather only reflects your own vision and experience with the manga
Jul 3, 2022 12:49 AM

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Jul 2021
5502
Man this was such a great episode. We got little backstories of Izumi and Shikimori from their childhood. We even got the first meeting of our main couple. This was a very enjoyable episode.

I just have hard time believing how Shikimori grew her hair so long in such short time. We can see her with short hairs in middle school and by the time she is giving entrance exam for High school, her hairs are already so long, I mean damn.

Little Izumi's prayer from that day was answered, he got a hero(ine) in his life. Even little Shikimori's wish was granted as well, she got the loving, handsom and kind bf she was looking for.

Seeing the onichan getting shy and uncomfortable over girls fawning over him was funny as heck.

Seeing little Shikimori get shy over reading a romance manga was a pretty funny sight, but thanks to that she knew what she wanted to do and who she wanted to be.

Last episode in amusement park, huh? A pretty dangerous place for Izumi to be I would say. Next is last episode and they way things are going, I'm hoping to see a kiss.

5/5.

The end of an era. Thank you Wit, Mappa and Isayama.
Feeling half happy, half sad.
  

Kawaii waifus
and precious
  best girls <3333
                                             


Jul 3, 2022 12:51 AM

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Nov 2012
1374
this show sure sucks hard

My Candies:


Jul 3, 2022 12:54 AM

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Oct 2016
4363
Man, that opening scene in the beginning was painful. Really loved the episode, that was great! It's nice really nice to see their backstories (well it was mostly Shikimori's backstory) and how they first met.

Shikimori wanted to become a Shojo heroine and she ended up becoming the Shojo prince lmao. They're really building up this amusement park date, I can't wait.

Also nice to see Shikimori's mom, another milf into the record books, and Romi Park is voicing her, like damn. Shikimori's relationship with her brother was really nice to see as well.
Jul 3, 2022 2:34 AM
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Jun 2021
1134
Dang & here I was expecting that atleast the backstory of the Shikimori's character would be interesting since the first 3 episodes but it was a total led down

I am totally disappointed with this show right now, it was doing really well since last 2-3 episodes by giving some screentime to characters like Kamiya, Hachimitsu & Shikimori's brother but this backstory and especially the way it is shown that she changed her goal to be a "cUtE gIrL" just because of a manga & that she wanted to fall in love has made this show Below average than a generic romcom

Well gotta finish this show if I have reached upto 11 episodes, if the last episode keep ups this same method then I wouldn't mind giving it a 3/10
Jul 3, 2022 2:41 AM
scientia exitus

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Mar 2020
5772
We still don't get an explanation for Izumi's bad-luck syndrome (if there even is an explanation), but seeing how he went to the shrine to ask for bad luck to stop plaguing his life kind of got to me. I'm not a manga reader so I don't know what's coming up, but I hope we delve into this whole issue just a little further with the last episode remaining for this season.

I hated this anime at first. The whole thing felt like a gag reel with a wimpy mc and an invincible mary sue character who saves wimpy mc all the time. Like I thought that MAYBE you could enjoy this... if you were twelve years old. Idk when exactly, but about halfway through the season or even a bit before that, it actually became kind of fun, and even carried some weight at times. Then last week's episode 10 was unexpectedly moving. And today's episode... I kind of just loved it. Shikimori's onii-chan (goated character and cool asf despite limited screen time) has a substantial role in this episode, in which a large portion is dedicated to showing Shikimori's backstory and how she came to be how she is now. We get to see the first meeting between Izumi and Shikimori, and how Shikimori fell for the boy who told her she was awesome despite how she thought about herself.

By no means is this anime the deepest one ever, but I still think an episode like this deserves some thought. I'm still just sitting here pleasantly surprised how for myself at least, this anime went from a 3/10 to a 6 or 7/10. We'll see depending on the last episode, but this episode 11 will probably be my favourite of this season.


NYANPASU
5700XT

Jul 3, 2022 3:53 AM

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Apr 2021
271
So final ep would be the amusement park date eh. I wonder if it will go like the one on the promo vid

Jul 3, 2022 4:52 AM
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Apr 2020
5
It was good. But i was confused to begin with since i jumped back and forth in time
Jul 3, 2022 5:45 AM

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Oct 2015
6915
I still don't get how Shikimori went all the way to date Izumi. Okay, I get giving some sort of friendship, but relationship???🤔
How I learned to stop worrying and love the bomb --- Dr Strangelove

Jul 3, 2022 7:22 AM

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Jan 2021
432
Good episode but this should have been episode 3º-4º not 11/12...but thats just my opinion!
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