| So far I've seen the first 2 seasons but as I continued watching I got more and more disinterested in the show. What began as an endearing shounen with a ton of potential started to lose what made it special to me, with the main arcs of S2 being rather disappointing IMO. So I wanna ask the fans of the series, what is it about the series that you love to watch each week, waiting in anticipation for the next episode to drop? |
| I have read the manga and I knew that there ll be some awesome stuff comming soon so that's why. |
| It's fun. The characters grow consistently. I like superheroes. Also, I read the manga so I know what to look forward to. Season 3 is adapting my favorite arc so that keeps me anticipating each week. If you don't enjoy it then its simply not for you. Don't force yourself to like what's popular just because everybody else likes it. |
MoonStar9May 12, 2018 12:34 AM
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thesarcasticguy said: EurekaLuke said: So far I've seen the first 2 seasons but as I continued watching I got more and more disinterested in the show. What began as an endearing shounen with a ton of potential started to lose what made it special to me, with the main arcs of S2 being rather disappointing IMO. So I wanna ask the fans of the series, what is it about the series that you love to watch each week, waiting in anticipation for the next episode to drop? Well, the characters are likeable and the manga is one of my favorite in recent times so. Anyway, I went through your list and I found that you don't like character driven fights.... In MHA, the fights are about the characters and their growth, not the spectacle of the fight itself so maybe that's why it doesn't suit your tastes But hey, don't force yourself to watch it just because it's popular, people have their own opinions and tastes. Peace out. What part of my list brought you to the conclusion that I don't like character-driven fights? |
shonen_fan said: EurekaLuke said: Maybe you can actually explain why you found them disappointing.So far I've seen the first 2 seasons but as I continued watching I got more and more disinterested in the show. What began as an endearing shounen with a ton of potential started to lose what made it special to me, with the main arcs of S2 being rather disappointing IMO. So I wanna ask the fans of the series, what is it about the series that you love to watch each week, waiting in anticipation for the next episode to drop? The entire tournament arc is only important to Midoriya, Todoroki and maybe Bakugo. It's a bit of a stretch for Bakugo but I'll allow it. Every other character in the tournament with any sort of buildup or execution was poorly handled imo. And when it comes to the main characters involved it's barely even a fight. Literally just a ton of exposition with barely any actual fighting happening. At least Dragon Ball Z tried to make their battles look like actual battles. And if we're comparing this to other tournament arcs I've seen, this is easily one of the worse ones. The Stain arc was definitely better and brings forth a practical question to the world about heroism. It probably should've been brought up earlier, but we got it now and I won't complain too much. What this suffered from the most was a significant lack of buildup; it's hard to care about the things that happen here when the story is just rushing through these arcs with barely any continuity. The power mechanics of MHA also show another issue with how Midoriya manages to control his quirk so quickly, but it's not that big of a deal. Overall I still liked the show. A bit less than the first season but it's still fine. I just don't see how it's one of the best shounen anime. |
thesarcasticguy said: EurekaLuke said: What part of my list brought you to the conclusion that I don't like character-driven fights? I meant your favourite list fam. You have Mob Psycho and Eureka 7.... Both of which shounens aren't about character driven fights. Also, you kinda confirmed that when you said you didn't like S2 because s2 had two of the best character fights in shounens is recent times. Eureka Seven and Mob Psycho being on my favourites had very little to do with the types of fights in them. If you wanna talk about character-driven fights, Ping Pong the Animation's matches were much more impressive. Even Naruto's more character-driven battles were better than this. I may have a preference for action that's more stylish and more of a spectacle but even for the types of battles in MHA I've seen so far, it's nothing that impressive or groundbreaking |
| People like it for the fights and characters, I personally dont think highly of it though, wish the plot had a little more meat to it, too clear/straight forward for me. |
TokiWoKezuru said: It's simply entertaining most of the time. The moment you start overthinking and analyzing, it turns into garbage. No, no it doesn't. |
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| I like it cause I find it to be enjoyable. |
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| It's pure action so I can "turn my brain off" and watch it while eating/bingewatch it quite easily. I don't think it's super good, but it's okay. |
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Don't need to prove you wrong. |
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| I'm starting to dislike it too, episode 4 just seemed like a Dick meassuring contest thesarcasticguy said: I tough this anime was based on explosive fights as i never saw any growth, i noticed that the moment i saw no one is going to die they never have any consequenceEurekaLuke said: So far I've seen the first 2 seasons but as I continued watching I got more and more disinterested in the show. What began as an endearing shounen with a ton of potential started to lose what made it special to me, with the main arcs of S2 being rather disappointing IMO. So I wanna ask the fans of the series, what is it about the series that you love to watch each week, waiting in anticipation for the next episode to drop? Well, the characters are likeable and the manga is one of my favorite in recent times so. Anyway, I went through your list and I found that you don't like character driven fights.... In MHA, the fights are about the characters and their growth, not the spectacle of the fight itself so maybe that's why it doesn't suit your tastes But hey, don't force yourself to watch it just because it's popular, people have their own opinions and tastes. Peace out. EurekaLuke said: you stole my words in Naruto they had to plan every single step and it was hard to predict what was going to happenthesarcasticguy said: I meant your favourite list fam. You have Mob Psycho and Eureka 7.... Both of which shounens aren't about character driven fights. Also, you kinda confirmed that when you said you didn't like S2 because s2 had two of the best character fights in shounens is recent times. Eureka Seven and Mob Psycho being on my favourites had very little to do with the types of fights in them. If you wanna talk about character-driven fights, Ping Pong the Animation's matches were much more impressive. Even Naruto's more character-driven battles were better than this. I may have a preference for action that's more stylish and more of a spectacle but even for the types of battles in MHA I've seen so far, it's nothing that impressive or groundbreaking |
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| It's shounen done right. Plain and simple, it takes a lot of classics from Silver Age comics as well as the growth and action shounen is liked for but leaves behind the friendship bs behind. As with almost all shounens there isn't a clear end in sight but here you can distinctly see growth with each arc. I can promise as a manga reader, in the 3-6 episodes, shit is going to get real. |
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| it's fun to watch, simple as that |
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shonen_fan said: EurekaLuke said: I can't really make a comment on this as I haven't seen many(it is also just your opinion after all), but it seems like they were going for something more focused rather than bloated. Think about if most of the character arcs were thrown out here and there wouldn't be much development in the long run. You mentioned the battles not feeling like such, but you have to remember the fact that most of the other characters weren't very experienced for something lengthy. There were still standouts, though. The entire tournament arc is only important to Midoriya, Todoroki and maybe Bakugo. It's a bit of a stretch for Bakugo but I'll allow it. Every other character in the tournament with any sort of buildup or execution was poorly handled imo. And when it comes to the main characters involved it's barely even a fight. Literally just a ton of exposition with barely any actual fighting happening. At least Dragon Ball Z tried to make their battles look like actual battles. And if we're comparing this to other tournament arcs I've seen, this is easily one of the worse ones. Obviously the entire tournament was only used for the benefit of Todoroki and Midoriya, but then why bother wasting time on side characters that don't mean much in the grand scheme of things. Barring Uraraka and Bakugo, no other character mattered here, and even then mentioning Uraraka is pretty generous since her entire conflict is so bad; 1 scene as a child repeated over and over again to hamfist the point that she's a "tragic" character. Even the idea of having a tournament arc so soon feels so weird. I get that it's a way to showcase their skills to potential clients and hero mentors, but if all we're seeing is these first-years who can barely fight with their quirks, then what's the point. It's like having a martial arts tournament where the only participants having only been training for less than a year. They are not ready for it. shonen_fan said: EurekaLuke said: There was buildup, though. He was shown at the end of S1, and his streak of murder was mentioned in S2. We had Iida's brother, a pro hero, suffering severe injuries, increasing the severity of the threat and how personal it was for our protagonists. It's nothing astronomical, but I don't think the quantity was detrimental.The Stain arc was definitely better and brings forth a practical question to the world about heroism. It probably should've been brought up earlier, but we got it now and I won't complain too much. What this suffered from the most was a significant lack of buildup; it's hard to care about the things that happen here when the story is just rushing through these arcs with barely any continuity. The power mechanics of MHA also show another issue with how Midoriya manages to control his quirk so quickly, but it's not that big of a deal. Wait, what? When did Midoriya control his quirk? If you mean 5 percent, well then that's just because he spread it throughout his body rather than focus on one part. It's not good build-up. If you're going to bring in this new villain who's main purpose is to shake the story up, not only do characters need to be fleshed out and given solid development but also the world of MHA. I would even go so far as to say even the creator of the series knew it and that's why so much of Stain's arc is dedicated to him delivering so much exposition to why he's doing what he's doing in relation to the world; may as well spoon-feed us how he views the world. But this seems to be a continuous problem for me; the lack of continuity between arcs. Sure you can barely elude to what's to come with showing a future villain for 10 seconds, but that doesn't change how both the tournament arc and Stain's arc felt thrown in just to give characters something to do. Compare it to something like Naruto or Dragon Ball, even Hunter x Hunter has a better direction with where the narrative goes than what we've seen in MHA so far, and that went from being sent to a game world to a massive war against ants. If the concepts introduced for each part remained fairly integral to the series then maybe this wouldn't be such a problem. But if the series keeps going like it has in the first two seasons, then I'm afraid it's just going to end up as a shounen with ideas thrown around with a lack of care and a lack of it's own identity. And yes, Deku can now control his quirk, even though it's only a small amount. yet look at how he battled against Stain compared to in the Tournament, he's literally a dozen times better and that's only because he learned underneath All Might's mentor. Imagine if this Deku from a week or so post-tournament arc (not really sure the amount of time between each arc is), he would wreck everyone. Bakugo would've had his ass whooped, Todoroki would've had a Sasuke moment and probably brood about it afterwards. It's insane how the power system can be so convenient here, even if the students are like prodigies. shonen_fan said: EurekaLuke said: I hear this sentiment a lot, and I have to say that you guys shouldn't take comments like this seriously. It's just the hype. Fans will say anything that they really like is the best.I just don't see how it's one of the best shounen anime. Yeah it seems like the hype tried to shoot this show up to the moon. I intend to see S3 since everyone says the best thing in MHA so far is probably going to be in this season, but I'll keep in mind that the fans are probably just overhyping it. I even went and started reading the manga just to get an idea of how fast paced the series is. |
EurekaLukeMay 12, 2018 5:24 PM
shonen_fan said: EurekaLuke said: But they don't. Most of the other fights are short or easy, and serve to highlight flaws in their current battle skills.Obviously the entire tournament was only used for the benefit of Todoroki and Midoriya, but then why bother wasting time on side characters that don't mean much in the grand scheme of things. Barring Uraraka and Bakugo, no other character mattered here, and even then mentioning Uraraka is pretty generous since her entire conflict is so bad; 1 scene as a child repeated over and over again to hamfist the point that she's a "tragic" character. Even the idea of having a tournament arc so soon feels so weird. I get that it's a way to showcase their skills to potential clients and hero mentors, but if all we're seeing is these first-years who can barely fight with their quirks, then what's the point. It's like having a martial arts tournament where the only participants having only been training for less than a year. They are not ready for it. It's been a while since I watched, but I honestly don't remember it being particularly overbearing. It wasn't to make her a tragic character, but just to bring her motives to light. Very grounded and somewhat sympathetic motives. The point is that they aren't ready. It shows where they're at currently so that we can see their growth. Even then, we were shown plenty of fights from capable students. There is no reason why the other characters had any of their battles shown at the last stage. Only there to fill up time that could've been used to make the main fights better. And it's not like we don't already know some of what each student can do from the previous season or later on, or even from the previous stages in the tournament. The show seems to want to heavily focus on the main guys but also put some light on the side characters, and it doesn't work because aside from a few side characters, barely anyone is going to care about them because they are entirely replaceable. At this point, it's just wasting time. Dude, it was like, the same thing, repeated over and over while Bakugo put on the sadistic smile for the whole episode. Bringing it up at that point is already kinda of lazy by itself but this was too much. And we already had a basic idea about her motives through her interactions with Deku from S1. But we can agree to disagree on that. I understand the purpose of it in regards to the narrative but it does not make practical sense as to why there is a large tournament set up for these "newbies" to showcase their skills in such public display. And if the show wanted to show their growth, it's not very complicated at all; show their training. Maybe I'm forgetting some parts but I don't really remember seeing any of the other characters training for this tournament. And as far as how far one has come, only Midoriya and Uraraka show how far they've come. Other than them, Todoroki's inner conflict between his dual quirk and Bakugo reacting to these three, there is nothing else worth salvaging from this arc. shonen_fan said: EurekaLuke said: What do you define as build-up?It's not good build-up. If you're going to bring in this new villain who's main purpose is to shake the story up, not only do characters need to be fleshed out and given solid development but also the world of MHA. I would even go so far as to say even the creator of the series knew it and that's why so much of Stain's arc is dedicated to him delivering so much exposition to why he's doing what he's doing in relation to the world; may as well spoon-feed us how he views the world. But this seems to be a continuous problem for me; the lack of continuity between arcs. Sure you can barely elude to what's to come with showing a future villain for 10 seconds, but that doesn't change how both the tournament arc and Stain's arc felt thrown in just to give characters something to do. And yes, Deku can now control his quirk, even though it's only a small amount. yet look at how he battled against Stain compared to in the Tournament, he's literally a dozen times better and that's only because he learned underneath All Might's mentor. Imagine if this Deku from a week or so post-tournament arc (not really sure the amount of time between each arc is), he would wreck everyone. Bakugo would've had his ass whooped, Todoroki would've had a Sasuke moment and probably brood about it afterwards. It's insane how the power system can be so convenient here, even if the students are like prodigies. Stains delivers this exposition because he wants his opponents to know his convictions, and why they don't align with his vision. It's natural and in-character without feeling contrived. Having a normal event after the USJ incident did not seem like it came out of nowhere. It was a natural progression from the other activities that've been shown. And how can you say Stain is just there to give characters something to do? His ideologies have a massive influence on villians as a whole, including Shigaraki and the VA. This is why you need to watch the next season. Nothing is really convenient there. Midoriya came to the realization that he was using his quirk wrong. Of course he would pose much greater growth when he finds out how to overcome its weaknesses. He didn't even do that well against Stain anyway. It was the teamwork. Generally speaking, a gradual increase in relation to a pay-off. For Stain's arc, the build-up was not that good due to a poor understanding of the world itself and having the arc only be 5-6 episodes long, cutting out the amount of build-up that would have been necessary to really capitalise on this villain being a "big deal". I feel the need to stress that I do not find the arc itself bad, but for me it certainly lacks a few things that hold it from really having impact on the show and the shounen demographic as a whole. I would be interested to see if him continually talking about how the hero system is in decay is consistent when he comes back onscreen. And even then, that does not change the fact that the world is pretty unexplored for the most part. I would still say that his placement at this point in the story is still convenient, but I'll wait until I see him reappear to see if him boasting about the problems in their society is moreso in line with his character or contrived. Did you know about the tournament before the arc took place? If it's such a big event, wouldn't the characters already have an idea that it's going to take place soon? Was the event ever alluded to beforehand? Yeah, not so much a natural progression to me. And if Stain did not enter the frey when he did, what would everyone be doing? Stain was very much like Mereum in that he was meant to be a significant change to the story, except he doesn't really do much except for kill off Tenya's brother. At least Tenya's development here was solid because of it though. Maybe his actions will have big changes in this season, or even further on, but from what I've seen he was an underwhelming character, partly probably because of how hyped up he was by fans. Look at the way he fought from before Stain (flicking fingers and breaking many bones in his arms/fingers) to against Stain (practically opened the First of Eight Gates). In that span of time he became a much better fighter that wouldn't be useless after trying a couple big attacks. And yes ofc Midoriya didn't beat Stain alone, but it's clear how much better of a fighter he is when you look at how he fights compared to the end result (though I wouldn't be surprised if he beats a strong villain in S3). He's the underdog still and he's gonna get his ass kicked, as to be expected. But that was surely a big improvement in just a short amount of time. Imagine if these kids actually trained most of the time? Maybe the show could've ended in 3 seasons. |
| I agree with OP. I find the first 4 episodes of S1 to be it's peak so far in terms of quality. Since then I have found it pretty underwhelming and undeserving of all the hype surrounding it. Tournament arc was probably the weakest arc n MHA so far and one of the weaker tournament arcs in shounen I've seen. The Stain arc had a lot more potential with some interesting concepts for MHA but weren't explored adequately enough to be that good in my eyes for the time it had. 100% with how it should introduce concepts that remain integral to the overarching story. Unfortunately it will probably just meander along, presenting mildly interesting ideas in an attempt to keep it fresh. Not a bad show, but perhaps the most standard shounen I've seen. |
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| Bcuz it keeps me entertained. And all the characters are unique and lovable. Unlike other shounens. Naruto I got bored at around episode 130. Bleach dropped at around episode 90. Never started One Piece cuz I hate the art. But Bnha? All the character designs are very memorable and are to my taste. Plot is able to keep me entertained. Never once did I feel bored or lose interest. When bnha updates a new episode/chapter, I always drop everything I'm doing to watch it. This is something no other anime had ever done to me. Which is why I like MHA and it's currently my favorite anime, topping even Death Note, which has been Number 1 on my fav anime list for more than ten years. |
Don't waste your breath arguing with them. They will see reasons as the plot of MHA progresses. If you've read the manga like I have, you'll know how incredible and mind-blowing MHA will become later on. |
shonen_fan said: And seeing how Bones have already done a splendid job with MHA so far I can only imagine how breath-taking that fight will be.ttcchen said: Oh, definitely. The Kamino Ward arc will be awesome. Can't wait to see Bones adapt it.Don't waste your breath arguing with them. They will see reasons as the plot of MHA progresses. If you've read the manga like I have, you'll know how incredible and mind-blowing MHA will become later on. |
| I think @shonen_fan has a more weighted point to your rebuttals. I skimmed through some of your replies and one thing that caught my attention is how it doesn't make prectical sense to set up a tournament rather than a training montage. Training could only go so far than to actual have a match up with actual heroes. It's basically training for them for heroes vs villain fights as well as to see what other weaknesses they have to improve on. Training usually only exposes little of these weaknesses so it really isn't just a showcase of their powers. The author picked a tourney over a training montage for convenience's sake. Mainly because it's more entertaining than the latter and can potentially even have more character development than a slow paced training montage. Heroes are basically stars in My Hero Academia's world so it would make sense for them to broadcast it and pass it off as entertainment. Sure enough the main focus on the tournament arc was Todoroki but it doesn't mean that the other minor characters get overshadowed. I think everyone was given enough focus to still be considered relevant. We also got introduced to the 2nd tier class of the 1st years and the inferiority complex they have over the tier 1 students. Not to mention that arc brought references to the villains as to which hero to recruit to become a villain which we are seeing now and who is there to watch out for and whatnot. As well as giving an advantage to the villains because of the information they have gathered regarding the students. It's not really as insignificant as you may think. Regarding the stain arc and how you think it's stupid as to why they didn't anticipate the attack. Well, that's simple. We get a bit of dialogue of the teachers as to why they think the villain association is laying low for a while since they had a massive loss at the end of the first season. So it's pretty understandable as to think that they will attack more early than they thought. Just before the Stain arc, we get the mini arc with the different students assigned to pro heroes, this is the aftermath of the tournament arc which helps the heroes improve on what they're lacking and this is not all for naught considering these improvements have been showcased on the next arcs. I don't see why it's not a good build up for you when it is. U.A. is a school, not a gym. So it's expected that training is approached systematically. It hasn't been long when they entered U.A as you might have think, it hasn't even been a year as far as I can recall. No, it wouldn't have ended in 3 seasons just with training for a few months. That's what I like about MHA, most of the things it presents doesn't irrelevant even as the story progresses.The storyline may not be something to write about but how it's presented and how each of these arcs are entirely connected. |
| Probably the cheesiest answer you'll see but it's the heart. As of late there's this expectation that anime especially the Shounen demography needs to tell more 'mature' stories along with a strange insistence on 'pushing it's boundaries'. It's often the reason why FMA and HxH are revered as being the greatest Shounen shows ever made. Sure, the aforementioned shows are fantastic, I love them as well but to me the core essence of what makes up Shounen are the simple and classic themes of chasing your dreams, never giving up, standing up for what's right, friendship and well you get the idea. BnHA is a return to those roots, it's a return to the essence of what made up Shounen, it's a throwback to everything I love about the genre and that's why I love it so much. It's a pure, heartfelt coming of age story full of growth, motivation and inspiration. One of the biggest reasons as to why I find BnHA so compelling is because of it's focus on pure heroism. Most superhero fiction as of late has become so skewed that I no longer understand why these works are related with the term hero. To give more concrete examples, both MCU and DCEU have lost meaning to me, I don't look at these movies as superhero movies anymore, they're just action flicks with flashy CGI everywhere, they look cool but they have no heart. The essence of heroism in those movies is often lost to me, sure they always save the world from some random villain but there's nothing compelling about it. Sure, they try to showcase some sort of complex social issue but it's at the cost of losing the essence of heroism. To quote further examples of what's been lost in recent days you need to look no further than the original Spiderman movies, back in Spiderman 2 (2004) where he saves the train. This is the heart I speak of that's been lost in today's superhero fiction, none of the recent superhero movies have a scene that is anywhere close to being as compelling as that one. It's these inspiring and moving acts of self sacrifice that are lost in today's superhero fiction but it's not lost in BnHA. In fact BnHA never fails to showcase this. 182 chapters of BnHA and I can say without a doubt that it still retains this core essence of heroism, it's always about that pure heroic spirit of self sacrifice, the genuine notion of wanting to save, inspire and instill hope in people. Yes, it's cheesy, sappy even but hey that's what it means to have heart and that's why I love it. People can take their exploration of 'social' and 'practical' issues, their 'mature' and 'philosophical' themes wherever they want but to me something as simple as "My body moved before I could think" is worth something far greater. |
Lelouch0202May 12, 2018 9:53 PM
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| OP I do agree with your points for the most part on the first two seasons but this arc happening right now in S3 you'll probably find better than either part of S2. There may be like one part of it where you're like "WTF" but the characters are handled a lot better here compared to the previous arcs |
shonen_fan said: EurekaLuke said: Do we really know what they can do, though? We aren't presented with how they'd fare in battle during the rescue simulation or even USJ. Not much time was spent on what the more minor characters did there, similar to how there was not much time really wasted on these fights. We see more of them this time, and it doesn't really hurt to have a bit more action. The main ones were still very good.There is no reason why the other characters had any of their battles shown at the last stage. Only there to fill up time that could've been used to make the main fights better. And it's not like we don't already know some of what each student can do from the previous season or later on, or even from the previous stages in the tournament. The show seems to want to heavily focus on the main guys but also put some light on the side characters, and it doesn't work because aside from a few side characters, barely anyone is going to care about them because they are entirely replaceable. At this point, it's just wasting time. I understand the purpose of it in regards to the narrative but it does not make practical sense as to why there is a large tournament set up for these "newbies" to showcase their skills in such public display. And if the show wanted to show their growth, it's not very complicated at all; show their training. Maybe I'm forgetting some parts but I don't really remember seeing any of the other characters training for this tournament. And as far as how far one has come, only Midoriya and Uraraka show how far they've come. Other than them, Todoroki's inner conflict between his dual quirk and Bakugo reacting to these three, there is nothing else worth salvaging from this arc. Well, they are a top school and seeing these students use their flashy techniques to try and overwhelm eachother is fun for the in-universe audience. They also try to appeal to pros here. They all prepared before for the tournament and there is currently an arc in the anime where they've been trying to improve. We understand their quirks and how they use them is certain scenarios, but I'd argue that understanding how each would fare in a 1v1 battle against one another, by putting them all against one another in tournament-style fashion isn't needed and certainly not in grand tournament style, especially when later in the 2nd season they use their quirks partly to face their teachers. Not exactly 1v1 but it's close enough and shows how strong they can be when using teamwork. I'll also put here that I thought the exams at the end of the season were the best part, specifically because of the growth shown and how some of the side characters being assessed have adequate time and focus put on them. Once again, not really that practical so early on when only a small few have the capacity to battle in a 1v1 situation. Feels more like it panders to people watching the show so they can see some good-quality animation on display. But apart from the few characters this arc affects, the rest feel awfully like filler, and when they're trying to fit in a tournament arc, Stain's arc, and the examinations at the end, you gotta make the time you have count. EurekaLuke said: I still think the build-up was pretty good, especially with Iida's brother getting killed during the arc before it. We already understood the general morals of the series at this point, along with motivations that were a bit selfish(ex. uraraka) Stain touches upon the very essence of what it means to be a hero, which I think is what made him a big deal.Generally speaking, a gradual increase in relation to a pay-off. For Stain's arc, the build-up was not that good due to a poor understanding of the world itself and having the arc only be 5-6 episodes long, cutting out the amount of build-up that would have been necessary to really capitalise on this villain being a "big deal". I feel the need to stress that I do not find the arc itself bad, but for me it certainly lacks a few things that hold it from really having impact on the show and the shounen demographic as a whole. Did you know about the tournament before the arc took place? If it's such a big event, wouldn't the characters already have an idea that it's going to take place soon? Was the event ever alluded to beforehand? Yeah, not so much a natural progression to me. And if Stain did not enter the frey when he did, what would everyone be doing? Stain was very much like Mereum in that he was meant to be a significant change to the story, except he doesn't really do much except for kill off Tenya's brother. At least Tenya's development here was solid because of it though. Maybe his actions will have big changes in this season, or even further on, but from what I've seen he was an underwhelming character, partly probably because of how hyped up he was by fans. Look at the way he fought from before Stain (flicking fingers and breaking many bones in his arms/fingers) to against Stain (practically opened the First of Eight Gates). In that span of time he became a much better fighter that wouldn't be useless after trying a couple big attacks. And yes ofc Midoriya didn't beat Stain alone, but it's clear how much better of a fighter he is when you look at how he fights compared to the end result (though I wouldn't be surprised if he beats a strong villain in S3). He's the underdog still and he's gonna get his ass kicked, as to be expected. But that was surely a big improvement in just a short amount of time. Imagine if these kids actually trained most of the time? Maybe the show could've ended in 3 seasons. The only reason the improvement was big was because, prior to Full Cowl, he didn't even have any ground to stand on. There was no where to go with him just destroying his limbs. Full Cowl was pretty much his first step, in a way. So, after him training and learning how to effectively use his super strength, his growth just doesn't really bother me.[/quote] There's definitely some nice ideas brought up by Stain's presence here, but I would still say there's not enough there that was explored to make me say that it's anything more thank just "ok". Hopefully if he returns (he probably will) he'll have a greater impact on the series than what we had here cause while some characters may've been affected, the narrative still moves along with no major change. I would've thought if it was that simple to have his quirk be of use, All Might would've mentioned something to him in some way about how to harness it because tearing his body to pieces like he was before was never going to really help him achieve his dream and/or become All Might's successor. Thank goodness he finally learned it but it still is a major step up in his strength. I hope S3 or beyond don't try and make it a more frequent thing. I think we're at the point where we'll just have to agree to disagree. Obviously there's stuff in S2 that I find bad, yet you are able to rationalize and accept, and I assume that you've kept up to date with the manga, so you most likely already know what's coming and that stuff about Stain and the Tournament do have an effect on how the narrative goes. I do thank you for the discussion as it was insightful in some ways and I've started reading the manga so I hope to see how it all unfolds soon :) |
EGOIST said: I think @shonen_fan has a more weighted point to your rebuttals. I skimmed through some of your replies and one thing that caught my attention is how it doesn't make prectical sense to set up a tournament rather than a training montage. Training could only go so far than to actual have a match up with actual heroes. It's basically training for them for heroes vs villain fights as well as to see what other weaknesses they have to improve on. Training usually only exposes little of these weaknesses so it really isn't just a showcase of their powers. The author picked a tourney over a training montage for convenience's sake. Mainly because it's more entertaining than the latter and can potentially even have more character development than a slow paced training montage. Heroes are basically stars in My Hero Academia's world so it would make sense for them to broadcast it and pass it off as entertainment. Sure enough the main focus on the tournament arc was Todoroki but it doesn't mean that the other minor characters get overshadowed. I think everyone was given enough focus to still be considered relevant. We also got introduced to the 2nd tier class of the 1st years and the inferiority complex they have over the tier 1 students. Not to mention that arc brought references to the villains as to which hero to recruit to become a villain which we are seeing now and who is there to watch out for and whatnot. As well as giving an advantage to the villains because of the information they have gathered regarding the students. It's not really as insignificant as you may think. Regarding the stain arc and how you think it's stupid as to why they didn't anticipate the attack. Well, that's simple. We get a bit of dialogue of the teachers as to why they think the villain association is laying low for a while since they had a massive loss at the end of the first season. So it's pretty understandable as to think that they will attack more early than they thought. Just before the Stain arc, we get the mini arc with the different students assigned to pro heroes, this is the aftermath of the tournament arc which helps the heroes improve on what they're lacking and this is not all for naught considering these improvements have been showcased on the next arcs. I don't see why it's not a good build up for you when it is. U.A. is a school, not a gym. So it's expected that training is approached systematically. It hasn't been long when they entered U.A as you might have think, it hasn't even been a year as far as I can recall. No, it wouldn't have ended in 3 seasons just with training for a few months. That's what I like about MHA, most of the things it presents doesn't irrelevant even as the story progresses. The storyline may not be something to write about but how it's presented and how each of these arcs are entirely connected. Ok, firstly, thanks for taking the time to comment your thoughts about it, but it seems like I'll have to clarify some points of me that I feel you mistook. 1) It does not make practical sense for the entire class to be such an important part of this grand tournament because they are all essentially still newbies that have yet to really control their powers as far as we've seen. Showing how some of the characters prepared for the tournament through training would have at least given a better grasp as to how strong they are, how prepared they are, what they aim to achieve from competing, anything they're anxious about heading in, etc. As far as the tournament arc is concerned, the in-world purpose of it is to showcase your skills to potential clients and other heroes to potentially be your mentor, but who would take most students from the first year over students from the second year? Or the third? Matter of fact, who is a 2nd year student at UA anyway? It would've made more sense if this wasn't such a big public event and devoted more time to showing how the characters develop than cramming arc into such a short amount of time. Maybe they were short in manga, I don't know, but I find it a problem. 2) Yes, I agree that it was more convenient for a tournament arc to be made than showing characters train, hell the tournament arc made it more possible to see good animation and good fights. Except they weren't even fights, and weren't that cool either. If we were to look at Naruto's Chunin Exam, where the Genin ninja are put against each other in 1v1 battles and compare these to the fights from MHA's tournament arc, the only part MHA beats Naruto at is the animation. Naruto's battles there had better fight sequences, better strategy, better inner conflict for the characters, better character development, better stakes, etc. And yes, the minor character are absolutely over-shadowed. Half of the class had their battles last maybe 1-2 minutes and do not serve any other purpose at the last stage than to fill the time. And it's even more of a shame, when the last part of the season - the examinations - give much more depth and exploration to the minor characters than the tournamnt arc ever did, whilst not taking away from any of the main characters. And just to point out, I'm not talking about a slow paced training montage replacing the entire tournament arc for 8-9 episodes; that's asinine. But seeing them train in preparation for a big event like a tournament arc IMO would've worked wonder for the series as the time spent on developing characters can be better executed and spaced out, as well as making the event in general a big deal. And I can tell you that the tournament arc in no way felt like a big deal. I haven't seen anything past S2 yet but I'm pretty sure the student they'll try to turn villain would be Bakugo because of his nature and because he won the entire tournament. But I would say that even if there was no tournament, the main villains probably could have gone and attempted to kidnap him or convert him to the dark side. The arc from the beginning felt insignificant and even if that's the only reference to it following it, it's still pretty underwhelming and one of the weakest arcs. 3) Where in the blue hell did you read that I thought the Stain arc was stupid because the heroes didn't anticipate his attack? I literally cannot remember typing that on here. My problem with the arc was that I felt it lacked in adequate buildup and payoff. He only came into the fray directy after the tournament arc, killed Tenya's brother who was barely known beforehand, spouts about what he thinks is the problem in MHA's society before being bested by 3 first-year students. It only lasted around 5 episodes, with Stain barely having any affect on the narrative or characters that we've seen so far. Maybe the villains will start to turn on each other somewhere down the line, but as for now it's arc that while I wouldn't call bad, holds barely any impact on the story. 4) I don't see why it's not a good build up for you when it is. U.A. is a school, not a gym. So it's expected that training is approached systematically. It hasn't been long when they entered U.A as you might have think, it hasn't even been a year as far as I can recall. No, it wouldn't have ended in 3 seasons just with training for a few months. I have no clue what point you're trying to make with this, so I'll take it piece by piece. - The buildup for both the tournament arc was weak, and Stain's arc was better but still far from what I would consider great. Both are hindered by a lack of time and focus put on the story and more specifically, its direction. - Part of the problem is that so far it skips any sort of training taken by the students to get better. Imagine if DBZ or Naruto decided to skip the training parts of their characters: it wouldn't be anywhere near as worthwhile to sit through. And UA is a school where they are learning to become heroes, so natrually I would expect that part of that involves training. Hell, the first season even showed this with a mock battle. Just 1, but they gave time and recognition to it because training is important for these characters to get stronger, and is a key part of most action shounen. - It would've gone on for either half a year or an entire year. The "Final Exams" were on at the end of S2 - You can't deny Midoriya's strength as a fighter has improved a ton in those few episodes with Gran Torino. If he were to improve that quickly, then who knows how strong he'd be by the end of S3. I get why you like it, but I am not going to say that there aren't some serious issues with the 2nd Season. |
| @EurekaLuke I guess it's a matter of preferences at this point. I sure as hell wouldn't want to see them waste a lot of time on preparation. It makes it feel like filler if anything and I dislike things that could be easily cut out. It's really not as if they implied that they train. Studio Clown would have probably did something like that if they had BnHA which I'm having none of. You're reading too much into it. 2nd years and 3rd years are pretty much irrelevant in this show at least currently. No point in adding a bunch of flat characters that probably wouldn't be relevant after. I haven't really read the manga but I feel like Stain's mind set and reasoning might effect to something much more. There's a new villain who seems to idolize stain so maybe we'd see something more from him in the future and whatnot. Actually, I feel like a lot of people became villains after Stain's statement was broadcast in TV as far as I'm aware. I think that's one of the reasons why BnHA is idolized. It doesn't waste any minute on things that could easily be implied off screen. Like I said, only a few months has passed since they entered U.A. You don't expect the villains to wait until everyone is trained now would you? So the idea of them training for a year and beating the villains then is pretty much asking for too much consideration. Midoriya became stronger because of real life scenarios and not just training alone. Training could only take you so far imo. They probably wouldn't kidnap Bakugo if that was the case. How exactly would they know he's violent? You can't really see it during battles which makes the broadcast of the essence imo. I haven't watched the entirety of Naruto so I can't really tell but it really isn't a good comparison considering their duration. Fight sequences and strats are debatable. Character Development? Not so much tbh. If it took that amount of episodes to develop the characters then I think it really isn't as great as you might think. The inner conflicts were as shounen as they could be so I wouldn't really consider them great in that regard. Like I said, we get an introduction on the tier 2 students on that arc and we see development on the tier 1 students with their fights. Although sure yeah, they're not long but you can clearly see they're improvements. A short but memorable fight is better than a lengthy one with the same outcome which most shounens suffer. You're asking for development, here it is. Not everything has to be lengthy to consider it to be development when the arc adds up to the value of each of the characters The main focus is how Midoriya became the greatest hero, well at least that's the slogan of the show. My problem with other shounen is that it wastes too much time. I know you would not agree with me on this but I really don't think giving every character a backstory is a good way to develop a character. Even these encounters and how they deal with them are better for development. Which is exactly what BnHA is doing. I think that buildup is sufficient to gain tension or atmosphere for each of the separate arcs. It seems that its a matter of preference at this point imo. |
EGOISTMay 13, 2018 3:45 AM
| Fun fights and good animation, thats about it. |
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| many reasons good story great characters and their development uraraka bakugo todoroki all might deku lida great villians and great depiction of what a hero is........anyone would love it |
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| In it's essence it's not recreating the wheel. And anytime I ask people like yourself why they end up disliking or being lukewarm on the whole thing I get the whole spiel that they had the wrong expectations. I'll try to explain my perspective but if you're not crazy about the same things I'm invested in then you might not find something here. BUT I'LL DO MY BEST. Main Characters I think it can be very VERY difficult to get invested in this story if you're not interested in Deku's story. This is not just him just trying to get stronger, nor trying to be mature either, no. The story where the anime hasn't fully reached yet and where I think the core of it's story lay in is in how Deku will take on the hero society and essentially reform it. There is the obvious and biggest problem from the first couple chapters on the disparage of quirk users versus non/quirk holders and in extension whose quirks are more powerful aka can be used to become "great heroes" versus those with base level power; this gets more extended later (even in the current arc). Deku proves from the first volume how he's earned his power and continues to strive in his efforts because important people have gotten him as far as he has and he detests his weakness because he's been at the bottom; he's also one of the most likable, grounded, relatable boys; he's very smart not just tactically in battle or in the hero world himself but he's fourth overall in his class, he wears his emotions very openly and though people detract from his "crybaby" aspect; it's not unwarranted he was borderline depressed and very much alone at his introduction, and he's willing to better himself constantly and not just in a I NEED MORE POWER aspect because that does not work in this world against every person he is up against. Honestly he is one of the most well rounded, most off kilter shonen protagonist you'll find, and I know many rather have a "bad ass" whose a power house but that's what Bakugou is for aka the secondary protagonist, his growth and (from chapter one) parallel to Deku's growth will push each other to become the best heroes they can be; All Might eventually says that they are the key to one another's success. So essentially you see two boys who were childhood friends get torn apart by society place for them and eventually be the reason to empower one another. In my opinion, one of the best rivalries this genre has to offer (and this will be more evident by the end of this season where the majority of both of their growth happens) And then All Might, who I think everyone overlooks because he's "the mentor" of the protagonist but his role in the story of passing on the metaphorical torch and the teaching of Deku has he is essentially dying is much more interesting then people give it credit for. The dad aspect to Deku, his support for his growth and hoping not to make the same mistakes he made; which also rubs onto Bakugou later on is key important and I think much more invested in then most mentor/pupil relationships because of them meeting as early as chapter one. But he also has an emotional arc (which does happen this season) all I'll say is that the state both Deku and him were in when they met were very similar but because we don't get much of All Might's perspective dealing with it, it's very subtle to his words and actions until their emotional confrontation later in this arc. World / Building Since the BNHA world takes place in a modern society, I feel as if setting itself is brushed off but as someone whose been a comic junkie and with a world of integrated heroes as a career path it's most definitely thought of down to many small details. I think a lot of the small clean up of world building is going to be lost on the anime because Horikoshi puts them in his in-betweens in the manga. Like how hero costumes are made in detail to enhance certain aspects that aren't obvious (like how Uraraka's press on her pressure points to help her nausea) and the design process with small trademarks behinds them, rules on quirks in public; feedings back into that (quirk disparage), what pro-heroes do for side work, luckily some small stuff (like the scene with Eraser and Mic being in the same class was also in the between pages but still adapted: good on you Bones). And of course the entire discourse of the quirk system, from Deku's first line in the manga "People are not born equal." How the system of education, the government, and majority of people have this notion to judge certain attributes of your character by your quirk and how you use it. There is also future arcs on how quirks are exploited and abused but the best example so far shown is the arrangement of quirk marriages to spawn a perfect child with both parents. Power System I honestly believe that the quirk/superpower world is simple and easy to understand. Everything has a strength and a draw back. No quirk is powerful against all types. Quirks can be trained to expand and be more tactical. And unlike every other fucking shounen, they're not training to improve their power set of one or two moves, the cast including the side cast are constantly trying new aspects of their powers. Side Cast / Relationships This is probably the most colorful most active cast of characters I've seen. Horikoshi doesn't just take time to improve the small main cast but he's slowly wading through the entire 20+ characters, even if it's subtle and simple development; he even extends the hand of having class 1-B in the mix. And everyone in the class (except Mineta) gets along with everyone. Even weird match ups if you pay attention in the background; pretty fun ones are Denki and Ojiro, Tsuyu and Ochako, Momo and Jirou, Kirishima and Deku etc etc. He doesn't stick to one group of friends though there are cliques in the class which I think is a nice touch because they are high schoolers and it's natural to attract into groups. Villians There's not much to say about the villains at this point in the anime. They are still two-dimensional AFO and Tomura are going to get their shine this arc. Other villains like Twice and Toga get really explored emotionally. There is cool community theories on Dabi AND future arc villains really harken back to my earlier point of Deku learning how to understand the other side of the coin of the villains and how they can be different and what needs to be "reformed" but he's only just touching base on this subject (he's only 15 and it's only 6-8 months since the start of the series as of chapter 182) Small Details??? Literally all these kids have families of different varying kinds. Single parent, married dysfunctional, divorced separated, living away from home. It was the biggest detail that the main character had A MOM WHO CARES SO DEEPLY ABOUT HIM. Aside from Uraraka kinda dumb crush (which is under speculation and handled this arc to completion) there is not stupid ass love/crush feelings and I find it honestly so fucking refreshing. None of these girls are tsundere or mean on principle. All the guys (except Mineta) are all upstanding and respect their female classmates to a respectable degree, Aside from Todoroki so far, none of the kids backstories are tragic, they're very realistic and really integrate into their characters. Also this story is more planned out and solid with no holes to be found and maybe it's just me but rereading through stuff like Naruto and Bleach with those critical lenses and seeing those flaws really grinded my gears but maybe you don't pay attention to those things which is fine. Probably other shit I can't think about on the top of my head lets be real. I mean I could go onto how this really is a perfect combination of both anime and comic book culture and how well researched I believe the story is but I'm sure this is enough ground work. All I can say is that if you make it to the end of S3 and still not find it to be in your wheelhouse for whatever reason (in my opinion this is the most tight and crucial arcs in the manga so far) you should just forget about it. |
StripesMay 14, 2018 9:45 AM
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| A decent saturday morning cartoon |
 Steam: Zeemanhuismerk |
| there's All Might and Deku in it |
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