No Game No Life (light novel)
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May 7, 2014 7:32 AM
#351
This episode was pretty stupid... kinda reminds me of Death Note in the sense that L and Near were magical and could deduce things magically without supporting evidence on hunches. Only idiots thought Death Note was clever tho. Also sick of the loli little sister, what a terrible character. This anime could have been so much better than the direction it seems to be headed. |
Dont be a chitogetard!!!! |
May 7, 2014 8:29 AM
#352
catullus said: This episode was pretty stupid... kinda reminds me of Death Note in the sense that L and Near were magical and could deduce things magically without supporting evidence on hunches. Only idiots thought Death Note was clever tho. Also sick of the loli little sister, what a terrible character. This anime could have been so much better than the direction it seems to be headed. I don't understand what was stupid about it, it was rather well thought out and goes way beyond what one would expect with those anime tags. As I can see that it would be hard to read all 18 pages just to understand what I'm taling about, in the spoiler is a post Takuan_Soho made that pretty much explains everything: No, the animation does give the information to work this out, but it does rely on the readers to understand the motivations of pawns, knights, queens, and kings. I'll try one more time, maybe we just need to walk this through differently. Reasons 1-10 1) Kurumi started with chess. We all know the rules. 2) Kurumi had an elf friend who could force chess pieces to move exactly as she wanted. 3) Problem: if Kurumi did this without a "rule" it would be obvious she was cheating. 4) Solution: invent a rule "the pieces have a will of their own" 5) Kurumi cheats the first turn, having the pawn move three spaces (three is important, it is just a little bit more than the game, if it had been too much again it would have been obvious she was cheating, but stating this was about Charisma made an incremental change believable). Go back and read the definition of Charisma given in the game. Its important to understand this. 6) Sora recognized this, but still have faith that Shiro could win despite this handicap. 7) The game continues, but when Shiro has to order a pawn to sacrifice itself, basic human self-preservation gets in the way. 8) Problem: how do you get a pawn to sacrifice themselves for their king? As Sora says, it takes a form of morale bordering on madness to get a human to do it. 9) Solution: provide time honored motivation: women, money, friendship. 10) Kurumi responds, but here is an important point, she isn't willing to risk losing (i.e. expose her king) whereas Sora is. This difference in attitudes is the key to Sora's victory. I want to stop here to stress this point. In the feudal age (which chess is based on), Kings ALWAYS fought in battle. This connection between the soldiers and the leader was essential: Charlemagne, William the Conqueror, Edward the Black Prince, Richard the Lion-Hearted, Fredrick Barbarossa all personally lead their soldiers in battle. It is what gave them authority. A king unwilling to fight was a coward, his soldiers would desert him, as would his queen. This is one thing that the writer is assuming that the reader understands. The writer knows this and Sora's speech reflects this. Because Kurumi would not sacrifice herself as King, Sora claimed she was unfit to rule, but because Shiro was willing to sacrifice herself, she was fit to command (of course for humor sake he takes it one step and makes it about cuteness, but that is what gives it the extra little entertaining bit). Instead of cuteness, think beauty in its most general form: the beauty of seeing courage, the beauty of being part of a team, that is what has motivated people to fight with passion. At this point it is also important that Sora's speech said "Proud Knights, Bishops, Rooks, show me deeds befitting of your rank". This is important because it will help defeat the brainwashing response that Kurumi comes up with next. Reasons 11-17 11) Problem: Kurumi is losing, assuming that Sora is using some sort of magic, but can't claim he is cheating. 12) Solution: she resorts to her next move. She moves her King forward (so she can claim Charisma and make it difficult for Sora to claim cheating) and then uses elf magic to take control of opposing players (think of it as a form of infection, when they touch the each other elf can send the red binds of Kurumi's players to seize Sora's players). 13) Problem: how does Sora counteract this? 14) Solution: by appealing to the fundamental archetypes underlying the chess pieces. In this case the queen. It isn't so much that Sora seduces the queen, what he appeals to is the inherent mercy and nobility a "true queen" is supposed to possess. Nobility is supposed to have a "nobelesse obligation" to the subjects. This is why Sora stresses the tyrannical nature of Kurumi. 15) Problem: as Shiro pointed out, if Kurumi remained calm here, her ability to brainwash pieces would have ultimately won. 16) Solution: Shiro points her camera at Kurumi. Kurumi doesn't think that the camera detects magic (that is Steph), she thinks that the camera IS magic (though she can't prove it). This causes Kurumi to flip out, because remember she thinks she is saving humanity from being ruled by another race (I think the elf is actually helping her out of friendship, not elven strategy), so to her another human using magic means that they are betraying humanity. This is why she accuses Shiro of being a "traitor". 17) This backfire on Kurumi because KNIGHTS don't kill QUEENS in the feudal age. Knights fight for the queens. Its the quintessential aspect of chivalry. This is another thing that the writer counts on the audience knowing, but its one that is a fundamental story in western civilization, from Tristan and Isolde all the way through Shrek. From there, the game is really over. Kurumi as King broke the one rule of chivalry, from there the course of her defeat was pretty much scripted. I explained a couple of pages ago how Sora backed her psychologically into a corner where she basically suicides as King. Edit: The reason I am going on at length is because I respect a writer who thinks things through, and based on how Sora and Shiro explain/speechify through the game, it is very very clear that the writer meant everything I wrote. So my taking time to explain it is my form of homage to the writer. Concerning the suicide, his other post: Let me try again, Sora's knowledge caused Kurumi, as the king, to literally commit suicide. The players will was ultimately her will, just as Sora's player's will were ultimately a reflection of his will. When he started converting her players, instead of responding by being a leader, she remained focused on trying to figure out what Magic he was using. Because of this she allowed him to write the rules of the game, and when he did the tyrant speech, she assumed that something magical like that was going to happen and that broke her will, causing her king to in effect die. This was why the king had her eyes, the person drinking the poison had her hair style, and after the king died she collapsed as if she had been killed. To answer Jiraiya a different way: Cheaters think everyone else cheats, liars think everyone else lies, paranoid people think that everyone else is paranoid. People create their own hells by pretending that they are in heaven. Kurumi to her credit, did want to "save" humanity, but she was willing to sell herself to the elves to become King so she could save humanity, but a funny thing is that people become what they most hate (which is why cheaters and liars are so good at explaining why they aren't cheaters and liars). Kurumi couldn't believe that Sora was able to win on his own, because if it were true then SHE would have to admit that she was wrong, that she wasn't humanity's savior but was their final traitor. So to maintain her illusion, she had to believe that Sora was using magic and that this magic made what he said become true, as Shiro said she was weak and trapped, but where she was trapped was psychologically - she could have survived if she admitted that Sora wasn't using magic, but if she admitted that then she would have to admit that her plan was really her taking the cowards way out. Given that situation she, as most people, would rather be right and lose, then to admit they were wrong and win (when she was finally forced to admit to this was when she completely broke down) Ironically what was most unrealistic about this episode wasn't what everyone has talked about, but rather that humanity would have rallied to Sora's side. It doesn't matter that he offered hope, his beating Elven magic without using magic wouldn't have been greeted with pride, but rather with resentment because he took away their justification for being weak (you couldn't beat magic, so when you lost it wasn't your fault). His victory by defeat makes them aware of their failure, and people absolutely hate that. This said, the writer did a better job than most think with Sora's speech. Sora was smart in lowering himself to their level by flaunting his weakness. The reason the writer did this was because he understood what I wrote above. More so than offer hope, what Sora did was to give their failure dignity, that was why they rallied to him. And this isn't me just justifying the writer, what Kurumi suffered from has an actual name, it is called cognitive dissonance. That the writer knew about this is clear from everything that Kurumi said before the match and after. Now that she has come to this revelation, she will actually become far more powerful (particularly since I think her elven companion helped her because she likes Kurumi as a friend). She was blinded by what she was taught (and hated) all her life, that humans would always lose, but now that she knows better, my guess is that she will become a very valuable human ally for Sora. |
Caleb8980May 7, 2014 8:36 AM
May 7, 2014 9:37 AM
#353
Caleb8980 said: catullus said: This episode was pretty stupid... kinda reminds me of Death Note in the sense that L and Near were magical and could deduce things magically without supporting evidence on hunches. Only idiots thought Death Note was clever tho. Also sick of the loli little sister, what a terrible character. This anime could have been so much better than the direction it seems to be headed. I don't understand what was stupid about it, it was rather well thought out and goes way beyond what one would expect with those anime tags. As I can see that it would be hard to read all 18 pages just to understand what I'm taling about, in the spoiler is a post Takuan_Soho made that pretty much explains everything: No, the animation does give the information to work this out, but it does rely on the readers to understand the motivations of pawns, knights, queens, and kings. I'll try one more time, maybe we just need to walk this through differently. Reasons 1-10 1) Kurumi started with chess. We all know the rules. 2) Kurumi had an elf friend who could force chess pieces to move exactly as she wanted. 3) Problem: if Kurumi did this without a "rule" it would be obvious she was cheating. 4) Solution: invent a rule "the pieces have a will of their own" 5) Kurumi cheats the first turn, having the pawn move three spaces (three is important, it is just a little bit more than the game, if it had been too much again it would have been obvious she was cheating, but stating this was about Charisma made an incremental change believable). Go back and read the definition of Charisma given in the game. Its important to understand this. 6) Sora recognized this, but still have faith that Shiro could win despite this handicap. 7) The game continues, but when Shiro has to order a pawn to sacrifice itself, basic human self-preservation gets in the way. 8) Problem: how do you get a pawn to sacrifice themselves for their king? As Sora says, it takes a form of morale bordering on madness to get a human to do it. 9) Solution: provide time honored motivation: women, money, friendship. 10) Kurumi responds, but here is an important point, she isn't willing to risk losing (i.e. expose her king) whereas Sora is. This difference in attitudes is the key to Sora's victory. I want to stop here to stress this point. In the feudal age (which chess is based on), Kings ALWAYS fought in battle. This connection between the soldiers and the leader was essential: Charlemagne, William the Conqueror, Edward the Black Prince, Richard the Lion-Hearted, Fredrick Barbarossa all personally lead their soldiers in battle. It is what gave them authority. A king unwilling to fight was a coward, his soldiers would desert him, as would his queen. This is one thing that the writer is assuming that the reader understands. The writer knows this and Sora's speech reflects this. Because Kurumi would not sacrifice herself as King, Sora claimed she was unfit to rule, but because Shiro was willing to sacrifice herself, she was fit to command (of course for humor sake he takes it one step and makes it about cuteness, but that is what gives it the extra little entertaining bit). Instead of cuteness, think beauty in its most general form: the beauty of seeing courage, the beauty of being part of a team, that is what has motivated people to fight with passion. At this point it is also important that Sora's speech said "Proud Knights, Bishops, Rooks, show me deeds befitting of your rank". This is important because it will help defeat the brainwashing response that Kurumi comes up with next. Reasons 11-17 11) Problem: Kurumi is losing, assuming that Sora is using some sort of magic, but can't claim he is cheating. 12) Solution: she resorts to her next move. She moves her King forward (so she can claim Charisma and make it difficult for Sora to claim cheating) and then uses elf magic to take control of opposing players (think of it as a form of infection, when they touch the each other elf can send the red binds of Kurumi's players to seize Sora's players). 13) Problem: how does Sora counteract this? 14) Solution: by appealing to the fundamental archetypes underlying the chess pieces. In this case the queen. It isn't so much that Sora seduces the queen, what he appeals to is the inherent mercy and nobility a "true queen" is supposed to possess. Nobility is supposed to have a "nobelesse obligation" to the subjects. This is why Sora stresses the tyrannical nature of Kurumi. 15) Problem: as Shiro pointed out, if Kurumi remained calm here, her ability to brainwash pieces would have ultimately won. 16) Solution: Shiro points her camera at Kurumi. Kurumi doesn't think that the camera detects magic (that is Steph), she thinks that the camera IS magic (though she can't prove it). This causes Kurumi to flip out, because remember she thinks she is saving humanity from being ruled by another race (I think the elf is actually helping her out of friendship, not elven strategy), so to her another human using magic means that they are betraying humanity. This is why she accuses Shiro of being a "traitor". 17) This backfire on Kurumi because KNIGHTS don't kill QUEENS in the feudal age. Knights fight for the queens. Its the quintessential aspect of chivalry. This is another thing that the writer counts on the audience knowing, but its one that is a fundamental story in western civilization, from Tristan and Isolde all the way through Shrek. From there, the game is really over. Kurumi as King broke the one rule of chivalry, from there the course of her defeat was pretty much scripted. I explained a couple of pages ago how Sora backed her psychologically into a corner where she basically suicides as King. Edit: The reason I am going on at length is because I respect a writer who thinks things through, and based on how Sora and Shiro explain/speechify through the game, it is very very clear that the writer meant everything I wrote. So my taking time to explain it is my form of homage to the writer. Concerning the suicide, his other post: Let me try again, Sora's knowledge caused Kurumi, as the king, to literally commit suicide. The players will was ultimately her will, just as Sora's player's will were ultimately a reflection of his will. When he started converting her players, instead of responding by being a leader, she remained focused on trying to figure out what Magic he was using. Because of this she allowed him to write the rules of the game, and when he did the tyrant speech, she assumed that something magical like that was going to happen and that broke her will, causing her king to in effect die. This was why the king had her eyes, the person drinking the poison had her hair style, and after the king died she collapsed as if she had been killed. To answer Jiraiya a different way: Cheaters think everyone else cheats, liars think everyone else lies, paranoid people think that everyone else is paranoid. People create their own hells by pretending that they are in heaven. Kurumi to her credit, did want to "save" humanity, but she was willing to sell herself to the elves to become King so she could save humanity, but a funny thing is that people become what they most hate (which is why cheaters and liars are so good at explaining why they aren't cheaters and liars). Kurumi couldn't believe that Sora was able to win on his own, because if it were true then SHE would have to admit that she was wrong, that she wasn't humanity's savior but was their final traitor. So to maintain her illusion, she had to believe that Sora was using magic and that this magic made what he said become true, as Shiro said she was weak and trapped, but where she was trapped was psychologically - she could have survived if she admitted that Sora wasn't using magic, but if she admitted that then she would have to admit that her plan was really her taking the cowards way out. Given that situation she, as most people, would rather be right and lose, then to admit they were wrong and win (when she was finally forced to admit to this was when she completely broke down) Ironically what was most unrealistic about this episode wasn't what everyone has talked about, but rather that humanity would have rallied to Sora's side. It doesn't matter that he offered hope, his beating Elven magic without using magic wouldn't have been greeted with pride, but rather with resentment because he took away their justification for being weak (you couldn't beat magic, so when you lost it wasn't your fault). His victory by defeat makes them aware of their failure, and people absolutely hate that. This said, the writer did a better job than most think with Sora's speech. Sora was smart in lowering himself to their level by flaunting his weakness. The reason the writer did this was because he understood what I wrote above. More so than offer hope, what Sora did was to give their failure dignity, that was why they rallied to him. And this isn't me just justifying the writer, what Kurumi suffered from has an actual name, it is called cognitive dissonance. That the writer knew about this is clear from everything that Kurumi said before the match and after. Now that she has come to this revelation, she will actually become far more powerful (particularly since I think her elven companion helped her because she likes Kurumi as a friend). She was blinded by what she was taught (and hated) all her life, that humans would always lose, but now that she knows better, my guess is that she will become a very valuable human ally for Sora. not everyone cares enough to understand or humble enough to admit they were wrong...i also didnt understand the concept fully until i read this thread...and lol why did you mention Death Note out of blue catullus?it was clever more than enough. |
May 7, 2014 10:17 AM
#354
the fact that they randomly declared war on all the races based on the preposition that the races would then become wary of who might be supporting them and leave them alone. as far as I can tell they haven't met all the races yet besides maybe an elf they haven't really interacted with them at all yet let alone the leaders of these races. I know they read some books but there is no book on this world or any other that is so accurate that you can predict that sort of reaction with that degree of certainty. a lot of the things they do in this anime are huge logic leaps (like that entire chess match) that require serious suspension of disbelief which is why I compared it to Death Note because the same thing was happening there. Though I never finished watching the anime (because it was so bad) but I did read the manga. |
catullusMay 7, 2014 10:20 AM
Dont be a chitogetard!!!! |
May 7, 2014 11:39 AM
#355
catullus said: the fact that they randomly declared war on all the races based on the preposition that the races would then become wary of who might be supporting them and leave them alone. as far as I can tell they haven't met all the races yet besides maybe an elf they haven't really interacted with them at all yet let alone the leaders of these races. I know they read some books but there is no book on this world or any other that is so accurate that you can predict that sort of reaction with that degree of certainty. a lot of the things they do in this anime are huge logic leaps (like that entire chess match) that require serious suspension of disbelief which is why I compared it to Death Note because the same thing was happening there. Though I never finished watching the anime (because it was so bad) but I did read the manga. That actually is only part of why he said it: 1. the thing you mentioned it makes the other countries wary of which one is helping humanity 2. it helps motivate the people 3. let's say some other countries heard that (which was shown): the king of a country, which has only lost since years, no decades, and only has one last city and a little bit of land remaining comes out and declares war on all other countries, would you take that person for sane, or even mildly intelligent? No sorry you can tell me what you want but everyone would think that guy is a huge fool and only has a big mouth. So instead of sealing of their movements, that sentence opened them way more. Sora always thinks rationaly; he puts potential gains and losses at the scale and then determines his next course of action. So I still fail to see how his move was stupid or random in any way... |
May 8, 2014 1:48 PM
#356
Caleb8980 said: Also scenarios that go against them...well as I said those are not possible, but as I said way way before those rules are far too abstract. For example where in the rules stand that torture (as long as it doesn't invole bloodshed) isn't allowed? Or slavery? Or rape? And how are those any better as war? Yes, I have thought the same. Now, rule 2 also stops violence, as shown In ep2, where the protagonist stopped that slap, but rule 1 allowed it, and throwing him out in the corridor, and many other things. So the rules allow nonleathal surprise violence. I'm sure people could think of a lot of nasty things that fits in that. But the thing is, the author clearly wanted a wishfulfilment fantasy for physically timid otakus that love games, he just didn't think those rules through. So I doubt we will see that stuff. Violence will be used for fanservice, comedy and such. (Well, I think you already know about slavery) Caleb8980 said: On the other end of the spectrum another question to you: how can children be born is this world? 10s of thousands of Marys? Sorry, I don't understand what you mean here. Caleb8980 said: So actually both of you are correct: They can't be broken but everyone does his or her best to bend them. That's just what I was saying. |
May 8, 2014 1:58 PM
#357
Helpme said: Caleb8980 said: Also scenarios that go against them...well as I said those are not possible, but as I said way way before those rules are far too abstract. For example where in the rules stand that torture (as long as it doesn't invole bloodshed) isn't allowed? Or slavery? Or rape? And how are those any better as war? Yes, I have thought the same. Now, rule 2 also stops violence, as shown In ep2, where the protagonist stopped that slap, but rule 1 allowed it, and throwing him out in the corridor, and many other things. So the rules allow nonleathal surprise violence. I'm sure people could think of a lot of nasty things that fits in that. Caleb8980 said: On the other end of the spectrum another question to you: how can children be born is this world? 10s of thousands of Marys? Unfortunately, the anime skipped over explanations for the violence. In actuality, things which are of "malicious intent" are censored from your brain (not just war/violence etc), as in you can't do it at all. Shiro kicking or elbowing Sora is fine, because to Sora anything Shiro does to him is considered okay by default, thus wouldn't count as malicious intent and would be allowed to happen. Non-lethal violence is still violence, anything that can cause harm would be censored from the brain as it is done with malicious intent. So in essence torture, blood or not isn't allowed either. In the novels Steph is always complaining in her mind to god, to let her hit Sora. Having children would be allowed because it would've been an act of 'consent' between both parties. Things like rape or whatever would've been censored from your brain before you can even do it. |
May 8, 2014 2:09 PM
#358
May 8, 2014 3:31 PM
#359
May 8, 2014 5:25 PM
#360
Helpme said: Caleb8980 said: Also scenarios that go against them...well as I said those are not possible, but as I said way way before those rules are far too abstract. For example where in the rules stand that torture (as long as it doesn't invole bloodshed) isn't allowed? Or slavery? Or rape? And how are those any better as war? Yes, I have thought the same. Now, rule 2 also stops violence, as shown In ep2, where the protagonist stopped that slap, but rule 1 allowed it, and throwing him out in the corridor, and many other things. So the rules allow nonleathal surprise violence. I'm sure people could think of a lot of nasty things that fits in that. But the thing is, the author clearly wanted a wishfulfilment fantasy for physically timid otakus that love games, he just didn't think those rules through. So I doubt we will see that stuff. Violence will be used for fanservice, comedy and such. (Well, I think you already know about slavery) And there you are wrong ;-) Slavery is an actual theme in this anime and will be brought up in around 3, at most 4 episodes. As is starvation because of loss of territory for its former inhabitants a theme that will be explored. Hence I always said that people need to look past the comedy and get to the actual point of those scenes. HelpMe said: Caleb8980 said: On the other end of the spectrum another question to you: how can children be born is this world? 10s of thousands of Marys? Sorry, I don't understand what you mean here. Well DivAsakust already busted the bubble but yeah what I meant was how it would be possible to have children if you can't even deflower a girl as that mostly involves bloodshed. The answer is said 'consent' both parties need to give. As DivAsakust also said once 'malicious intent' is involved the brain would autocensor your intent hence making you unable to continue. BUT what DivAsakust didn't say is that there is an easy way around that: One can force sb into a game in which bets your "right to fall under the oaths" and if you lose everyone could do anything to you; from raping to killing you. That is already shown in the first episode where Sora can bet his and his sister's life without any problems for 2 times. |
Caleb8980May 8, 2014 5:29 PM
May 9, 2014 1:34 PM
#361
That was really awesome! I really liked Sora's speech. I like Tet. That scene about beating the God thing and conquering the world was really interesting. This show is getting better and better. |
May 10, 2014 2:51 AM
#362
5/5 Episode that would be great if we exclude the game of chess, not because it was so ugly, but not compelling to some misunderstandings. The speeches are the best part of this show as well as comic roles. The plot has concocted all this time just the prologue? Oh my God, this is great. with this episode we had the answers to many questions. Well-constructed narrative, the next aspect of this today because I was very intrigued. I hope the next episodes of the clashes have big-time. Drawings and animations discrete, Madhouse is trying not to skimp. I'm happy about it. |
May 10, 2014 6:08 AM
#363
DivAsakust said: Unfortunately, the anime skipped over explanations for the violence. In actuality, things which are of "malicious intent" are censored from your brain (not just war/violence etc), as in you can't do it at all. Shiro kicking or elbowing Sora is fine, because to Sora anything Shiro does to him is considered okay by default, thus wouldn't count as malicious intent and would be allowed to happen. Non-lethal violence is still violence, anything that can cause harm would be censored from the brain as it is done with malicious intent. So in essence torture, blood or not isn't allowed either. In the novels Steph is always complaining in her mind to god, to let her hit Sora. Having children would be allowed because it would've been an act of 'consent' between both parties. Things like rape or whatever would've been censored from your brain before you can even do it. OK. It's probably a good thing the anime didn't have that rule, since it shows nonconsensual violence all the time. Most viewers don't care and won't think about mistakes in worldbuilding, but if a rule is stated and then repeatedly broken they do notice. Caleb8980 said: Helpme said: (Well, I think you already know about slavery) Slavery [...] As you see, I did put in an exception for slavery. I didn't go into details since this is still a ep4 thread and shouldn't have spoilers. Caleb8980 said: HelpMe said: Caleb8980 said: On the other end of the spectrum another question to you: how can children be born is this world? 10s of thousands of Marys? Sorry, I don't understand what you mean here. Well DivAsakust already busted the bubble but yeah what I meant was how it would be possible to have children if you can't even deflower a girl as that mostly involves bloodshed. Don't believe what you read in hentai. |
May 10, 2014 4:52 PM
#364
May 11, 2014 12:15 PM
#365
Another great episode. I don't know how many novels are there, but I hope this anime will get 2nd season since there are 16 races and it's impossible cover them all in 12 episodes. |
May 11, 2014 2:52 PM
#366
Helpme said: Caleb8980 said: Helpme said: (Well, I think you already know about slavery) Caleb8980 said: HelpMe said: Caleb8980 said: On the other end of the spectrum another question to you: how can children be born is this world? 10s of thousands of Marys? Sorry, I don't understand what you mean here. Well DivAsakust already busted the bubble but yeah what I meant was how it would be possible to have children if you can't even deflower a girl as that mostly involves bloodshed. Don't believe what you read in hentai. This has nothing to do at all with hentai...ye I admit that mostly was the wrong word but for around 50 percent of women the breaking of the hymen goes with bloodshed. There even is an actual illness where the hymen completely closes the womb followed by a congestion of blood in the womb. Also it doesn't really matter what I think but what Sora thinks as it was originally his question to Steph. |
May 12, 2014 8:17 AM
#367
This episode kinda bores me, it feels like it's gonna be more games after another. The Phoenix Wright reference is getting old already tbh, and now that I see, the old dude looks similar to the judge in the game. That speech about Imanity is weak was pretty good. Kugyuu should do more male roles, loving her "boku". I wonder what Sora and Shiro's race is, are they part of the Imanity? Edit: Steph needs to stop going "Wow they are awesome." too often. |
ToG25thBaamMay 12, 2014 8:27 AM
Honobono Log - best slice of life short -------------------------------------------- most kawaii loli overlord ---------------------------- Donquixote Doflamingo AMV - Control |
May 17, 2014 2:41 AM
#368
For the last three episodes, a lot of people praised this show like it was the best thing since sliced bread while I struggled to understand what's so good about it. But this episode, this was good. Declaring war against all races after beating out a powerful race (though indirectly) = brilliant. |
"May those who accept their fate be granted happiness." "May those who defy their fate be granted glory." |
May 18, 2014 6:05 PM
#369
I'm wondering, why do people think that Kurumi made up the rule of the chess pieces having wills to account for their moving unnaturally? From what I've seen it seemed that the chess pieces did magically have a will in the beginning due to them being magical objects. The implication seemed to be that Kurumi was using magic to increase the morale of her troops to outrageous proportions so that they would be willing to sacrifice themselves for her cause. It was just that even with her magic she still lost to Sora, who could motivate his troops even more. This also explains why Sora could convince Kurumi's queen not to attack and why the knight couldn't attack the queen since increasing morale is not the same as total mind control. In the game, Kurumi had two magic tricks up her sleeve: 1. her troops' morale was largely increased through magic; 2. she could take control of her enemy's pieces. I have a problem with 2 though because there is no reasonable way to say that the troop joined her side because she was more charismatic when the entire scene was showing how Sora was much more charismatic than her. I guess she got away with it because there was no real physical way to prove that that wasn't the case. Note about the episode itself, while I did enjoy it, there were definitely some problems with it. First, like others have mentioned it seems a bit stupid that nobody thought of using intelligence or tricks to beat magic. Even if humanity in general had held the belief that magic was always unbeatable there should have been at least one or two (most likely a lot more) individuals in each generation who probably didn't believe it and at least tried to use tricks to beat magic, in other words outliers. Most likely, there should have been someone who already won using that method considering that these rules were going on for at least a couple centuries. Second, Kurumi's king shouldn't have died like that. The magic surrounding the chess pieces seemed to be that they had wills of their own, not that things would befall them as if they would in real life. Even if the latter was the case, the problem is that the chess pieces are still constrained by rules of the game. There was no "civilian" chess piece in the game so it should't have happened. It would be a different case if one her own pieces had attacked the king but considering that nothing touched it, this is not the case. Third, Kurumi shouldn't have been the only one to have gotten help from other nations. The idea itself is pretty basic and more people should have thought of it, heck I thought of it even before I learned Kurumi was doing it, and if that's the case then more nations should have joined in. This is a pretty good opportunity to gain control of humanity after all. Finally, Sora's declaration of war. That was entirely stupid. He declared war on every other nation, which should have given some doubts about whether he was actually being backed by someone else. If even one single person in the other nations actually considered the possibility of beating someone with magic using tricks, (again, outliers) his bluff shouldn't have worked. Lastly, Sora himself. Sora's personality seems entirely contrary to his backstory. He is a bit too charismatic and can read people a bit too well to have been forced into isolation in the first place. Some might argue that he is only able to do because he is with Shiro, but that reliance on Shiro was because he was isolated and bullied in the first place. His insight into people's motivations should have made it so he never got to that point. Don't get me wrong. I enjoy the anime a lot. It's just that there are some problems with it. On a side note: Tet is just awesome. His speech to the rest of the world and what he said to Sora and Shiro, made him one of my favorite characters. It's too bad that he probably won't appear that often. |
May 18, 2014 6:22 PM
#370
renvent said: I'm wondering, why do people think that Kurumi made up the rule of the chess pieces having wills to account for their moving unnaturally? Because she didn't state the rule until it was to her advantage to do so. renvent said: The implication seemed to be that Kurumi was using magic to increase the morale of her troops to outrageous proportions so that they would be willing to sacrifice themselves for her cause. That is not what she did, that was what Sora did. Kurumi's pieces were not motivated by morale, they were being forced to move. This was indicated by the red threads that entwined their bodies. Kurumi claimed "morale" because that was a "rational" excuse why her pieces moved superior to normal chess moves, while Shiro's pieces moved inferior. What she failed to appreciate (because humanity had no morale) was how powerful morale could be. Sora, coming from our world implicitly understood this. The secret to the game is that Kurumi, in forcing the pieces, was acting like a tyrant. But Kurumi did not want to lead humanity to be a tyrant, she wanted to be a hero. If you can understand this point the game because clear. Sora won by appealing to what is best in humanity, Kurumi couldn't counter that because she felt that humanity had lost any positive traits, so she had nothing to offer BUT her ability to have her elf friend use magic. The King dying was symbolic of this fact. Had Kurumi actually been a tyrant, she would have been able to overcome Sora, but because she honestly did want to save humanity when given the choice of being a tyrant or committing suicide, she decided on the latter. This is why I know in the future Kurumi will reappear to help the siblings, because ultimately she wants humanity to win, not for her to win. Before the game, Sora and Kurumi talked, and Sora said he understood why Kurumi acted the way she did, but that he thought she shouldn't underestimate humanity. This discussion both showed that Kurumi was acting honorably, but also established the flaw that Sora would use to defeat her. I can, and have, go on at length why every single move Sora made both made sense, and fitted the overall point the author was making, but I will leave with just reiterating this point. When Sora knew that Kurumi wanted what was best for humanity, he knew he could win. Had she been otherwise, he probably would have lost. |
May 20, 2014 2:48 AM
#371
The way they won the game was unexpectable but amazing though.She was raped so hard by them that she even cried ahaha xD So much rounds playing agains each other and still "noone" won,amazing! That speech in the end again BOSS speech So they declared war to everyone ahahah BOSS! :D To defeat the Ted (god) they must defeat other 15 races :D Since they won agains him playing chess,he is done,no chance for him :D |
May 24, 2014 7:15 PM
#372
Three words; Sora is awesome. :) |
May 29, 2014 3:44 AM
#373
Sora yah bastard you made a girl cry! (on a side note Kurami is rather cute :P) MORE Phoenix Wright references, also i'm upset i just noticed this with this episode the judge for the game's, has the same design as the judge from the main series. ugh how did i miss that... More epic speeches from Sora. "hey Sora what should we do today?" "We do what we do every day, Try to Conquer the world". |
Argue? Nah Too lazy For That... Are You Ready!~Gulcasa |
May 29, 2014 9:23 PM
#374
Awesome speech from the new king and queen! |
My Candies: |
May 30, 2014 4:17 PM
#375
This was one hell of a episode, can't wait to see the others. |
Jun 3, 2014 2:56 AM
#376
Jun 4, 2014 6:07 PM
#377
Who would say that God was a girl? |
"Me ni wa me wo, ha ni wa ha wo, aku ni wa aku wo." |
Jun 8, 2014 4:19 AM
#378
The chess game was too absurd for me. Too willy nilly with no rules at all, so there was no investment in it. I liked the God's reason for bringing them into the game, and am equally glad it's not to same humanity or something, since they should be equal in his eyes. |
Jun 10, 2014 8:57 AM
#379
Lol.. I never thought that she's a crybaby afterall she always put that tough face Oh Sora, you just made a girl cried... Now take the responsibility Harem??? She just said Harem!!! xD Dat epic speech!! So badass xD |
"Signature removed" |
Jun 14, 2014 8:37 AM
#380
Sora's speech was so exhilarating, and I feel like it applies to us in the real world as well. Awesome episode, and I can't get over how great the art is. |
☩ Discord: the.path.to.pathos ☩ RateYourMusic ☩ last.fm |
Jun 17, 2014 3:18 PM
#381
Awesome episodes with memorable scenes. I see the goal now.. so weird usually you don't see the goal until the really last or 1 episode before the last one. Go siblings!! |
Jun 19, 2014 8:56 AM
#382
Jun 19, 2014 10:12 AM
#383
Jun 21, 2014 1:20 PM
#384
The ending to both the chess game and the battle for the throne were quite surprising! I could never think of something as awesome as the king being killed that way! And Cramy crying? She looked so fierce! Anyway, now I guess action will truly begin. They've risen to the throne, after all, and the war's coming. Also, their talk with Tet was so exciting! GO, KUHAKKU |
Jun 25, 2014 1:56 PM
#385
Jul 1, 2014 9:46 AM
#386
That was one hell of a speech. Reminds me a bit of the Jeff Winger speeches from "Community". Best episode so far. I also like the atmosphere and music in the show, especially during the scene with Tet. |
Jul 7, 2014 4:26 PM
#387
Jul 11, 2014 8:22 AM
#388
That speech~ I am proud, Sora....I am proud. Now, show me how both of you will conquer the world muahahaha. I love chess, and this Anime looks like it loves chess, too. I guess the author of the LN is good at chess. Tet is interesting, and I think she is a girl. Moar Kurami and that elf please!! Steph and Shiro <3 Well, that's it for today. I shall eat, then sleep. I will continue this tomorrow. |
Jul 15, 2014 6:40 AM
#390
Jul 24, 2014 7:11 AM
#391
Okay so now we finally get to the main plot of this anime, 4 episodes in. Beat God in a game of Chess. Again. Pretty original. |
Jul 28, 2014 1:03 PM
#392
That was the best speech I have ever heard!! Got me all pumped up! I like their next goal: To Defeat God |
Jul 31, 2014 2:42 AM
#393
Standing in ovation @ Sora's speech Both Sora and Shiro are truly geniuses i can't even |
Aug 3, 2014 1:33 PM
#394
Fuck yeah. That was one hell of a speech and I always love seeing scenes like that where a huge crowd gets pumped up from it. Lmao at Sora's awesome t-shirt too. And that competition for the absolute authority haha. I am loving all three of these main characters. Shiro and Sora are both so great and Steph is just too cute. Hooray for more Phoenix Wright like scenes too! That trial music, the judge, and all of those "objection!" and "hold it!" signs. |
ZeroZxAug 3, 2014 1:37 PM
Aug 10, 2014 12:34 AM
#395
Aug 13, 2014 10:36 AM
#396
Now the kings but how they couldn't decide was too funny. Sora epic speech to the kingdom now to declare war. Meet the god named Tet seems that they will eventually get their rematch. |
Aug 16, 2014 8:53 PM
#397
Kaioshin_Sama said: Nobody has any sort of criticism to offer over this episode? Okay I'll go then. It pretty much looks like this show really has exhausted it's premise already as is prone to happen with LN stories upon conclusion of their volume/arc. Just really nothing remarkable about this episode again and the main pair continues to be annoying and one note in personality and interaction with others. Can't buy how they're supposed to be loser HikkiNeets either when they pretty much succeed at everything they try to do be it speech making, policy, competing against others in games. It's just such a blatant power fantasy too and you even have Stephanie now reduced to a fan service cheerleader for the duo, not that she was ever a particularly great character in the first place, but that more or less ends her development as a character and really it just looks like everything in this show exists to enable the two MC's at the end of the day. Just gives it a feeling of utter pointlessness, like the show has been spinning it's heels in repeatedly pointing out how awesome [] is and how they never ever lose. It makes the brother sister duo from Mahouka look positively mortal and flawed by comparison. I'd be able to forgive the show a little if it used all of this well and to good effect as comedy or had anything resembling a sense of irony, but the humor is primarily still of the reference and ecchi variety and it looks like it's playing it's premise entirely straight. Just kind of an unremarkable show outside of the production Madhouse is giving it which continues to be all that stands out about it to me. Way to many style over substance anime these days, but I suppose it's far from the worst example of that. Everything about this is spot on. God help me as I continue to trudge through this series MAL loves so much. |
Aug 27, 2014 6:04 PM
#399
It was a nice end of the match bringing in a lot of human history and nature into it The crowning speech was marvelous and again with a lot of thought and tact Being the underdog sure has it's charms Tet showing up at the end was nice with the dialogues I wonder how Sora and Shiro keep their devices powered |
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