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| THIS IS AN ANIME ONLY DISCUSSION POST. DO NOT DISCUSS THE MANGA BEYOND THIS EPISODE. ---------------------------------------- The boss man is here! And boy did he show off there. Not a single one of them stood a chance against Gin's sensei. First time ever seeing Okita shiver. Was interesting to see how Imai betrayed this guy in the past too apparently. Gintoki finally using a real sword<3. Finally, the reveal :). Can't wait to see the reactions of anime-only viewers. Best episode this arc thus far. 5/5. |
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| All those injuries and casualties, damn! Sasaki’s such a badass! Finally some Gintoki stuff! Gintoki vs. Oboro is great (Those Courtesan of a Nation memories are coming back :D)! Gintoki got blown up there O_O. Nobume got hit! The real Shinigami, the king of crows is here… Nobume doesn’t seem to be in good condition. That man is way to OP! Kagura, Nobume and Sougo are teaming up to bring him down, but they could barely scratch him! For the first time Sougo is afraid that he can’t win this fight. That man’s name is Utsuro, the first leader of the Tenshouin Naraku. The Joui Rebels and Shinsengumi don’t seem to be in good condition. Sougo isn’t in good condtion either. Dat Shinpachi rage. Sasaki and his emotional monologues ;_;. Nobume actually got Utsuro there! Gintoki’s back and him popping out of that rubble was badass as hell! Some of Utsuro’s face is exposed and he seems really familiar. Gintoki seems to be a really good competition for Utsuro, though he’s at his limit. Gintoki seem to know that sword very well, that’s why he can read Utsuro’s moves. That reveal! Utsuro is Shoyo-sensei… yep! “Your sword cannot reach me”. Kagura is encouraging Gintoki to fight. Gintoki didn’t take long to man up! Talk about an emotionally strong protagonist XD Gintoki sent Utsuro flying there. Too bad he has regenerative powers. Sh*t’s going down real fast, time to evade! The one that killed Shoyo was not Gintoki, but Utsuro, according to Nobume. That "DARE NANDAAA!!!!" was awesome! :D Four and a half chapters adapted this time. Two episodes left! Probably my favorite episode of Gintama overall. The animations were the best in any Gintama episode ever, and even with a lot of chapters covered, the pacing felt perfect (although, those chapters weren’t that dialogue heavy). Some people may not like the plot twist and that’s fine, but the way they presented it was chilling. Also that OST used for Utsuro, everyone predicted it! It’s soooo good!!! Too bad anime-only watchers will have to wait until the next arc starts in order to find out how Utsuro exists (and god knows when that’ll happen). Next episode should be my favorite one from this arc |
GoldenDevilGamerMar 17, 2016 5:21 AM
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| Holy shit this episode. That Utsuro was fucking OP. at first half i was wondering why his speech pattern seemed familiar... well, no wonder why it was familiar. I'm really curious about the relationship between Utsuro and Shoyo. not to mention after Nobume said Gin wasnt the one that killed Shoyo but Utsuro (i guess it was just a metaphor maybe) But Shit there's only 2 episode left >.< there wont be any info about that Utsuro guy i guess >.> |
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| WTF!!!! Utsuro came out of nowhere and holy shit he is op. Dude is able to heal all wounds and was able to take on so many powerful characters at the same time! Spoiler heavy preview is spoiler heavy. I should get myself ready for dem feels. |
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| Freaking loved this episode. Utsuro making his entrance. Taking down Nobume and Kagura with ease. Freaking Okita is shivering just from his presence. Great fight with Gintoki against Utsuro. And the freaking reveal. Shouyo Sensei!!! 2 more eps left. |
"I’ve set myself to become the King of the Pirates…and if I die trying…then at least I tried!" Monkey D. Luffy (One Piece) |
| Fighting on par with Utsuro, damn that takes mad skillz Gintoki! |
| “Humankind cannot gain anything without first giving something in return. To obtain, something of equal value must be lost. That is alchemy's first law of Equivalent Exchange. In those days, we really believed that to be the world's one, and only, truth. But the world isn't perfect, and the law is incomplete..." -Alphonse Elric "Then and now, what I protect has never changed!" -Sakata Gintoki I'll take anything like The Pet Girl of Sakurasou. Anything as good as that. |
| Jizz in my pants... Dat reveal tho... Utsuro, you cheeky bugger. |
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| I got chills the moment Utsuro/Shoyo appeared, he's too strong for anyone at this moment. |
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| Damn Utsuro is that DUDE, the guy straight man handled Kagura, Nobume and Okita like they're flies, and after that went on to cut Gintoki's head off while smiling back at him. Shit is crazy out there in Edo. But that line by Oboro tho, it tells you everything "Shiroyasha as long as you continue to struggle against the heavens, it is your duty to keep killing that man" and you see Utsuro's wounds start to heal up, meaning the guy is immortal. |
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| Finally! Utsuro's big reveal! The ost fit him perfectly. God seeing this animated is amazing, I have the trembles. Okita x Nobume x Kagura teaming up to fight Utsuro was so epic, especially since Utsuro is OP asf. Despite how strong they all are, in the presence of the Tenshouin leader they're nothing but ants unfortunately. You know that when the sadist shivers it means shit has really hit the fan. Sougo protecting Shinpachi despite being nearly annihilated~~~ Sasaki telling Nobume that he'll eat with her from now on was so precious ;A; But Nobume pulling out Utsuro's sword is most definitely a highlight, along with Gintoki's face when Utsuro's mask falls off. Kagura's "GIN-CHAN!" when she protected him from near-death from Utsuro was perfect. That was one blind moment that could have costed his life. The memories flooding Gintoki as he sees Utsuro's face really got to me, he has to re-live those terrible memories and confront his past all over again. I hope people aren't too upset with the reveal haha, it may seem really random or unplanned but there were many hints in the past of this. |
| The big reveal.. I loved the music. Shit was so intense. |
| :) |
| Friggin chillz dude!! Utsuro that MF'n HAX OP SOB. Taking on Okita, Kagura, Nobume and Gin and barely getting injured after everything they put into it. And even that injury healed O_o I'm an anime only but I kinda know what happens later so I'm not sure if this is a spoiler The way they showed how intimidating he was making even Okita shiver was epic. Kagura, Nobume and Sougo went in tho! I was so relieved when Kagura protected Nobume the first time since she has plot armor while Nobume probably doesn't. So seeing Kagura protecting her made me so happy :D And then dat friggin Gin vs Utsuro was epic AF!! The way he was familiar with his moves. DAMN! Fav scene was definitely Utsuro cutting Gin's neck while he was shocked AF then Kagura stopping it with her bare hands with all the blood coming out. OUCH!! Best girl just being best girl <3 And Gin's ITTAI DARE NANDAAAAAAA was amazing. Props to Sugita as usual I'm scared that either Sasaki or Nobume will die at the end of this arc T^T |
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| IT WAS FUCKING PERFECTION!!! My God... I did not expect them to animate that scene as amazing as they did. The music... the animation... everything, from 18:00 to 19:47. Just... thank you. However, they should've added more impact to the Gintoki slash after saying "Begone, specter" because it didn't leave that same godly impression the manga panel did. Lastly, Gintoki, the peerless; we all know he's the supreme GOAT of Shonen MC's, but that one line -- "Even if my sword can't reach you, our sword will. Begone, specter." -- propelled him even beyond the unseeable heights. 5/5 |
ziggy_ZMar 16, 2016 6:20 AM
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| Felt like the episode crammed too much content into 20 minutes and as a result there wasn't enough build up. I liked the little fights of Okita and Gintoki against Utsuro, but it did seem as if it was rushed. I'm also starting to get tired of the trope where two are fighting and a third (or fourth) party makes a dramatic entrance to save the good guy because it's getting overused to a ridiculous extent. Still a good episode, but I feel like the execution could have been much better. |
| 5 main aspects I base my ratings on: 1. Did DramaEnthusiast make a thread about it? 2. Is it better than Breaking Bad? 3. Did MellowJello recommend the shit out of it? 4. Has it caused a (very entertaining) shitstorm on MAL? 5. Is it actually good? Scratch the fifth point, it's not very relevant... |
| Wth Shit man so much hype. Gintoki is already a badass but that double sword though. Gintoki double sword going on par with Utsuro, so intense. The animation was really good during Gintoki's fight. Also the OST for Utsuro is so fitting for his character. One of my top 5 favourite episodes of Gintama. Seriously though I'm with Gintoki, just who the hell are you? That begone, Spector sent chills man. Other characters would've easily crumbled at Gintoki's scenario but man Gintoki really quick to recover from the shock. 5/5 episode, can't wait for more. But only 2 episodes left, I cri everytime :'( |
CG-SilverMar 16, 2016 8:21 AM
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| Lol that vampire ost. |
| “Right is right even if no one is doing it; wrong is wrong even if everyone is doing it.” ― Saint Augustine |
| I can't think of anything to say... |
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| Goddammit!! What the hell was that? Got to be one of the best Gintama episodes ever, might be the best! |
| Ok what just happen... was Shoyo alive or is he undead now....Gintama is as thrilling as always |
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| Oh well, Utsuro it's here, this should be fun. |
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| I would appreciate this episode a lot more if there was something of Gintama in it. |
| I still hate Utsuro. His reveal was fucking fast. It took some chapters for his face to be revealed. |
| the way Gintoki cut Utsuro still gave me chills, he defitinety didn't hesitate nor asking anything, BADASS although it was revealed the identity pretty fast, it took chapters in manga |
“The greatest crimes in the world are not committed by people breaking the rules but by people following the rules. It's people who follow orders that drop bombs and massacre villages.” -Bansky  |
| In the OP, when I saw Utsuro, I just have a feeling he might be Shoyo or related to Shoyo. Is he Shoyo's clone? Good action scenes. Judging from the preview, Sasaki is going to die? |
But it's important to remember that a movie review is subjective;it only gives you one person's opinion. http://www.classzone.com/books/lnetwork_gr08/page_build.cfm?content=analyz_media&ch=30 It doesn't matter if you like LoGH,Monster etc.If you are a jobless or college/school dropout living in your mom basement, you are still an unintelligent loser. Taste in anime does not make you a better person.If elitist don't exist, casual pleb and shit taste also don't exist. |
Nagirah said: I'm interested to hear what anime only people think about this plot twist. Honestly? One of the most flagrant betrayals to the spirit of Gintama I have ever witnessed in this show. I hope everything is a lie, or a trick or something like that, because otherwise I don't know why the hell is a series that has explicitly criticized and parodied the cheap "familiar villain" plot twists (hi, Tama Quest) indulging in, precisely, a cheap familiar villain plot twist. Other than that I didn't recognize the characters here. Really. And in general I'm having problems during this arc but this episode was the most extreme I can remember and probably in the whole show. Just... what the hell was that Kagura? Or that Sougo? Would anything change if they were replaced by any other characters? Specially regarding their relationship with Nobume... I feel that this arc and specially this episode made a huge step towards something that was totally unexplored, an appreciation for this character that was virtually non-existent before. The speech of Kagura was fine. But I didn't get at all the feelings of Kagura, her transcendence as a character in that scene. Maybe because Nobume has been so sporadic in the show. Whatever. And Sougo basically sees her as a countersadist. There were feels in this episode but they came out of nowhere. I may sound too bitter about this but to be honest this episode has left me in such a WTF state that I don't even know if I've liked it or not. I can't even think of a rating at this point. |
jal90Mar 16, 2016 10:09 AM
| IT'S HERE. THE MIND FUCK EPISODE. The animation is great through-out the episode, especially Gin v Utsuro. We knew Yamadera-san voices sensei/utsuro, but when I heard Utsuro speak, he sounds like a more sinister version of Beerus. Next episode, damn feels once again |
lagba2Mar 16, 2016 10:15 AM
 NANDESUKA KORE? |
Nagirah said: So your complaint wasn't about the Shoyo/Utsuro thing, but the way Kagura, Sougo and Nobume acted? I can't really understand your feelings on that matter, because their behavior seemed completely in character to me. I actually complain about both, sorry if I made the post confusing. The plot twist is the one that bothers me the most, and is probably the thing I have overtly disliked about this episode. But Kagura and Sougo were rather frustrating because there was an emotional delivery and I felt that it was lost in translation. Nagirah said: Kagura and Sougo have had several times to spend with Nobume in the past, but maybe you just don't remember them anymore, because the anime has been going for so long. Please don't give me that. I watched almost the entirety of Gintama between late 2014 and early 2015, just before this season started, so I have the show relatively fresh in my mind. I remember that Kagura and Sougo have shared scenes with Nobume, they have talked a few times, but they haven't grown a relationship in the grounds that would naturally lead to this. Heck, to Sougo till this point Nobume was anything else but a fellow sadist he liked to antagonize. What this episode and probably the previous one did was a sudden step towards something that wasn't built, or if it was, not in a wholly comprehensible way. I am not complaining about the attitudes themselves as much as the timing. |
jal90Mar 16, 2016 10:34 AM
| That was just amazing. Chills throughout the episode. Absolutely brilliant episode, No words to describe how amazing this episode was to me. Utsuro is a beast, Taking out Kagura, Nobume and Sougo. Even with Gin they only injured him. Fight scenes were marvelous but short. I'm an anime only watcher, I started having suspicions once they started showing close ups of Utsuro's face, His hair seemed exactly like Shoyo's and his voice was the same. In the beginning I thought it was just Gintama messing with me but then it was too conspicuous to ignore. The smile confirmed my suspicions. So is Shoyo immortal somehow? Gintoki clearly cut off his head but he's still alive, His wounds healed as well. Nobume says that Utsuro is Shoyo and at the same time not him, Some kind of Split Personality? |
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jal90 said: Nagirah said: I'm interested to hear what anime only people think about this plot twist. Honestly? One of the most flagrant betrayals to the spirit of Gintama I have ever witnessed in this show. I hope everything is a lie, or a trick or something like that, because otherwise I don't know why the hell is a series that has explicitly criticized and parodied the cheap "familiar villain" plot twists (hi, Tama Quest) indulging in, precisely, a cheap familiar villain plot twist. It's not about using cheap tricks honestly. Like you, I would've complained about this but the way it was executed wasn't how your average show would've tackled this. It didn't use this moment as an excuse to make us feel sad that Gintoki would have to kill him again, but Gintoki quickly recovered from the shock without giving much shits. Yes, it would take time to digest this but when you think about it, this was being foreshadowed not only throughout this arc but throughout the entire series. Heck I'd say that we are a bit too quick to judge, I'm just extremely curious to see the outcome of this all. Twists like this bring about a lot of controversies but I prefer to except it as it as and look forward for more. As for the other thing you're complaining about, I don't really have an answer since that's not something I'm troubled over. |
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jal90 said: Nagirah said: Kagura and Sougo have had several times to spend with Nobume in the past, but maybe you just don't remember them anymore, because the anime has been going for so long. Please don't give me that. I watched almost the entirety of Gintama between late 2014 and early 2015, just before this season started, so I have the show relatively fresh in my mind. I remember that Kagura and Sougo have shared scenes with Nobume, they have talked a few times, but they haven't grown a relationship in the grounds that would naturally lead to this. Heck, to Sougo till this point Nobume was anything else but a fellow sadist he liked to antagonize. What this episode and probably the previous one did was a sudden step towards something that wasn't built, or if it was, not in a wholly comprehensible way. I am not complaining about the attitudes themselves as much as the timing. Why was you think that Kagura speech was sudden or something non-existent? They didn't hook up fast during the courtesan arc, crushing Okita balls and fighting against Oboro and company, also aren't both of them friends with Soyo and eveything? |
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| I don't know where to start. I am really trying to add the bits and pieces here. I did not see that coming. I did not see that coming. I did not see that coming. I don't think Shouyo and Utsuru are the one and the same. And I don't want to think that. I am so going to start reading the manga from chapter 1 once this season ends. I have had enough of being toyed around. It's been really bad for my heart for the past couple of months. jal90 said: Specially regarding their relationship with Nobume... I feel that this arc and specially this episode made a huge step towards something that was totally unexplored, an appreciation for this character that was virtually non-existent before. The speech of Kagura was fine. But I didn't get at all the feelings of Kagura, her transcendence as a character in that scene. The part Kagura played here isn't abnormal. Over the years it has been well established by Sorachi that Kagura is the one (yes, more than Shinpachi) who will carry the torch of Gintoki when the time comes. If you can disintegrate her action in this episode and try to integrate it back, you may end up with a mirror reflecting Gintoki's image. There were many a times it had been conveyed to the readers/viewers but maybe it got unnoticed because of the multidimensional nature of Gintama. Coming back to the anime, Kagura remembering Nobume from the earlier episodes was a great way to show she had already seen through Nobume's stone mask that deep inside, she had always been a kind girl. It was just that she grew up in a distorted environment that made her what she is, yet she has been trying to break out of it; even though she was lost with no one to guide her she has been trying at least. As for other aspects of this brilliant episode that felt like 5 minutes of breathless action the thing I noticed the most is Hirono Aya playing Nobume. We usually don't get to hear her voice nowadays as often as in the past but that preview really got me there. She was at the pinnacle of her voice acting as Nobume. Even though the preview kinda felt spoiler-ish, I am not ready for the feels. |
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Nagirah said: I tried, but I still don't understand your point of view. I watched the entirety of gintama from late 2015 to early 2016 so I remember everything very clearly and the way the three's relationship progressed over time felt very natural in my eyes. What exactly about it is so unbelievable? I have explained it already. Twice. No offense, but I can't be doing this forever if there is not reciprocity in the discussion. Please elaborate your point. CG-Silver said: It's not about using cheap tricks honestly. Like you, I would've complained about this but the way it was executed wasn't how your average show would've tackled this. It didn't use this moment as an excuse to make us feel sad that Gintoki would have to kill him again, but Gintoki quickly recovered from the shock without giving much shits. Yes, it would take time to digest this but when you think about it, this was being foreshadowed not only throughout this arc but throughout the entire series. I noticed this, it was fine and definitely a step in the good direction, but I'm not sure if it made enough of a difference. It was still meant to be a shock to the audience, and seeing by the reactions in this thread I'd say it delivered. And again, the foreshadowing does not make this twist more acceptable or less cheap. It just makes it more comprehensible, which was the lesser of my concerns here. I don't know why he -supposedly- survives, and why does he seem to heal so fastly, and I'm looking forward for explanations. But it is an outcome that has been used to death, that Gintama has shown awareness of, and seeing how it indulged in that didn't sound right. Not to mention I'm not very fond of this kind of trope but specially as a fan of Gintama I don't see a proper scenario for this to happen. CG-Silver said: Heck I'd say that we are a bit too quick to judge, I'm just extremely curious to see the outcome of this all. Twists like this bring about a lot of controversies but I prefer to except it as it as and look forward for more. So I am. Heck, I'm the first who wants to end up appreciating this and feeling it as an integral part of the show. So far I failed to do so. |
| finally the reveal of the character that has been teased since beforethe beginning of the SA arc and i'm... lost. WHAT THE ACTUAL FUuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuck?!!!!!!!! i mean how?????? fuck, i don't have words to describe what i'm feeling right now. if this does turn out to be Shoyo i'm going to be royally pissed. i mean, the author can't just piss on Shoyo's memory like that after we just spent the last arc seeing what a positive influence he was on the rebel trio. I mean that kind of dumbassness i associate ONLY with Kishimoto. Even Kubo knows that shit. My best guess/hope would be Utsura is a body snatcher, and in his latest form he took Shoyo's, though i'm still unclear on the why. Coul be because he was expecting to make Gintoki go through a Luke I'm YOur Father moment but i doubt it. Too many plot holes for that. i mean how would they have kept his body fresh for all these years and i mean- ok cut the rest, i'm babbling. Anyway the next episode will be probably the most anticipated Gintama ep for me, so i really,sincerely,wincingly hope the GORILLA didn't screw it up. PLEASE DONT SCREW IT UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! There I'm done. |
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Praland said: Why was you think that Kagura speech was sudden or something non-existent? They didn't hook up fast during the courtesan arc, crushing Okita balls and fighting against Oboro and company, also aren't both of them friends with Soyo and eveything? Friends, I guess yes. To the level of mutual understanding... when? When did this happen? Usually one expects this speech to be an integration of pieces that we have seen through the series, but all I'm saying is that these pieces are weak and very casually if at all explored. @shanimebib Well put here and yes, I see your point of Kagura being an extension of Gintoki's own self, which is most likely what Sorachi had in mind with this outcome. It makes sense now that you say it. But again. Timing. Kagura has an appreciation for Nobume? Sure. Are they friends? Yes... maybe actually. They share some common grounds, but they don't even have an established relationship. They were together in one arc, they shared a common objective and they had sort of matching personalities. Does Kagura understand Nobume to the level implied by this episode? Does seeing Nobume cry immediately ellicit a reaction in Kagura where she's able to see through her emotional armor? I think that the episode tried to extract something very deep out of something that so far had been too shallow and sporadic. Then again, if Kagura follows the steps of Gintoki, then it also means that she's able to feel a connection with people quite easily and without the need of a fully explored narrative. Which I guess is logical and coherent but kind of emotionally unsatisfying. |
jal90Mar 16, 2016 11:14 AM
| Nice action, Shoyo is live :O his body is being used or something. Bankai too good.  |
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hahahaha Ichigo wants his sword back. Dunno why people aren't talking about this. Maybe after the newest version of his sword, he tossed this one away. @jal90 I see your point and I believe it's good that you're expressing what you think about this. Ofcourse, I can't change your opinion on this one since this is a very brave move by Sorachi. IMO this twist has added a lot more to the story, there are now many connections that I can think make sense in my mind. A lot of questions need to be answered and while this has made obvious how Gintama might end, I don't think it'll make it any less interesting. Now how an immortal looking Alien might be defeated is upto the author. |
CG-SilverMar 16, 2016 11:36 AM
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| JESUS christ is gintoki´s teacher hahahah when okita shougo is trembling that is bad  who the hell are you?? tha´s what i´m asking too.... |
Sunakko-ch4nMar 16, 2016 12:12 PM
| wow, i really wasn't expecting that reveal! this episode was so epic |
| holy shit freaking love that Utsuro boss theme this episode was fuckawesome best one hands down |
| This will be one of those threads people while visit when either rewatching Gintama or by newer watchers when this discusion aint relevant anymore. I mean you cant just not want to know whether your HOLY SHIT scream was in line with the community! O-O'' Great episode, finish line sprint worthy. |
Spirits of the light! Wielders of the great power that shines far and wide upon the lands of our world... In my hour of need, grant me the light to banish evil! |
| Gintoki is fing boss. save his kohai from his sensei..? damn those battles were good and feels AGAIN.. |
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| THAT PLOT TWIST!!!!! So Utsuro is actually Shouyou (kinda see it coming though due to the hair resemblance) but what I don't understand is how on earth is he still alive? He was beheaded didn't he? I'll wait for the explanation later on in the future episodes (which is only 2 episodes left) But still the whole episode gave me goosebumps, especially Utsuro's OST came in. Even Nobume, Kagura, Sougo, and Gintoki combined can't defeat him. How can I possibly wait for a week for the next episode?? |
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