| It’s no secret that anime has blown up all over the world—calling it popular would certainly be a freakin' understatement, especially after TheVarus Struck Buck at us. But you know what also would be a huge understatement? How shounen, seinen, isekai, harem, etc always seem to beat shoujo anime in terms of popularity and producer picks... and I don’t get it. The shoujo demographic has several series that are so in line what everyone constitutes as good storytelling. It has a diverse amount of ideas, worlds, and characters, it's beautiful, there’s quality romances, the dialogue is often meaningful, the animation when directed by a competent and passionate staff can be objectively beautiful compared to all other country’s animation... and most importantly, lots of people feel nostalgic for the near-drought of shoujo anime. Yet it still gets dissed by many hypebeasts and people-who-dislike-reading-forums-despite-posting-on-forums than other anime demographics. Even josei anime, which are far less popular and not often as produced, get more wide praise and less evasion as you can see with this thread and this thread. Why is it that the shoujo demographic, a marketing tag that delivered quality stories to preteen girls enough to appeal to those who don't identify as such, isn't more popular with both animanga consumers and anime producers, and instead seems to get endlessly mocked by others in the past for being "gay", "clichéd", "made for losers and mouth breathers"? Now if my last popular shoujo thread's responses mean anything, it seems people think I'm making shit up about how much people hate shoujo. To those people, I appreciate that you came to see my thoughts even if you feel that way, but here is some evidence. Let me ask some of you who feel that way this: have you actually tried to watch/read shoujo? I’m not talking about the "romance" trash that YouTube's algorithm recommends with the H thumbnails or stuff people believe are shoujo like Horimiya or Kaguya-sama, I’m talking about some real good old-but-gold classics: Banana Fish, Cardcaptor Sakura, Whisper of the Heart, Yona of the Red Dawn, Fruits Basket, Natsume's Book of Friends, Lovely Complex, Skip Beat!, Full Moon wo Sagashite, NANA, The Story of Saiunkoku, The Rose of Versailles, Yumeiro Patissiere, Magic Knight Rayearth, KodoCha, BASARA, From Far Away, Dengeki Daisy, Kitchen Princess, Gakuen Alice, 7SEEDS, Last Game, Fairy Cube, Othello., Life... Saying shoujo animanga are shit because of the crap you’ve "seen" with your willy is like saying that high school anime are bad after only having watched stuff like AnoHana and Velma. Even freaking The Anime Man likes Fruits Basket and that dude hates every anime that came out recently. I freakin' love a lot of animanga, regardless of demographic, but truth be told on an objective level a lot of them are missing something for me. I admit I am more of an oldschool mahou shoujo fan specifically when it comes to shoujo, so I'm really feeling that something's missing even more, but it's crazy how much more anime are being made every frickin' season and yet shoujo take up even less of the seasonal charts than they did a decade or two (or even three) ago. But I've already made another thread about that, so you probably already know if you were nice enough to read that thread. But seriously, I love laughing at some of the scores of anime airing every season and how "unexpected" it is that the newest garbage isekai anime "somehow" get low scores. It's clear that I'm not the only anime fan who's tired of some of the shit anime's been pulling nowadays and that we need more quality content. I cry for every day how half of my shelf don't get anime adaptations or even enough love just because they're not the type of anime that most people like and want right now. Maybe they aren’t more popular, but I guarantee that most shoujo are (and will continue to be) more well respected than half the isekai that come out every year now. The average shoujo anime is better than every narou-kei isekai anime. Cope. ★-⋆-⋆-⋆-⋆-⋆-⋆-⋆-⋆-⋆-★ ...Hi. Yeah, I did that kind of shoujo thread again. Sorry for copypasta'ng again for those of you that don't like it. But it seems it worked pretty well last time and most people don't even bother to read threads on forums anyway, so I guess baiting and making fun of bait threads is the only way to get anyone to listen to me. While 50% of the beginning is shitposting, the other 50% is genuine thoughts... yeah I genuinely want to know why some of you don't really like or want to try shoujo at all. I want to make this different from the last time I did a shoujo topic this way in that I want you to enlighten me. Why do you not like shoujo? Why are you not interested in it? I'm asking seriously and am willing to lend an ear. It will be especially enlightening for someone who wants to make stories that people from all walks of life can enjoy, and also be able to provide the something that I felt was lost as I mentioned earlier. I like to make shoujo-style comics, but I think getting honest, civil perspectives from people who don't like that kind of thing will help me understand you all and how to make something more appealing. It might also help us shoujosei fans understand those who don't have the same taste as us better too. ♪ I promise I will make an original high-quality thread again real soon. But in the meantime... happy discussing. ✩ Sincerely, your local MAL forum threadreaper  |
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| Probably because the targeted demographic prefer k drama, and the non targeted demographic prefer shonen/seinen. |
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Sealshark122 said: That doesn’t mean anything at all. Checking their list to prove a stupid point just makes you look bitter.You don't even have a single shoujo anime in your favorites and you wrote all this.... |
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| Hm… that’s true to some degree. I feel as though the only people who don’t like shoujo are the shounen fans. Not all of them, but most of them just want to see action, not drama and romance :p |
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| Most shoujo try to deliver what young girls want. But I am not a young girl nor have I ever been. Fashion, showbiz, the hottest guy in school...these things have no appeal to me. |
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| I think they're just the vocal minority. Most anime fans I know don't mind shoujo, and have seen one or two. That said, I'd like to point out that many of the examples you gave of "shoujo-hate" that you've given aren't hateful, but are really just preference. There's definitely a difference. |
| What the fuck is oatmeal? |
| Well, my ex made me watch 7 Seeds and it was very bad. Both. Otherwise, I'm a huge Cardcaptor Sakura fan and liked a few shoujos. I guess people mostly overlook shoujo for the artstyle and label "for girls". And that even when they try it, they don't stick to it because it's mostly shows with a female MC, slow pace and "fragile" characters. Ans as epidemia78 said, it also probably has to do with the main themes you find in these. |
| I personally like shoujo manga, I think it's better to simply ignore people who won't try something just for its label or demographic. Most of those viewers who dislike shoujo anime/manga can be too close minded to enjoy something different and will continue consuming the content that caters to their tastes. There's still (and will be) an audience for the shoujo genre, celebrated works such as Cardcaptor Sakura, Candy Candy, Rose of Versailles, Nana and others are still beloved around the world and a loud online minority who doesn't even care about such content won't change that :) |
"Be excellent to each other, and party on, dudes!" - Bill & Ted´s Excellent Adventure Check my introduction to Char´s Counterattack interest stack if you´re interested in watching UC Gundam. Also check my Legend of the Galactic Heroes OVA Chronological Watch Order for LoGH info! |
| I guess, I'm not really the target audience for this thread as someone who likes shoujo. This topic does however remind me of some interesting talking points. I always wonder why specifically media oriented towards teenage girls is subject to such extreme aversion, yes women's media in general gets disproportionate hate, but when talking about anime people usually say shoujo (although some people just don't know what demographics are, I guess "shoujo" might just be a comfortable blanket term for "women's media"). Kind of reminds me of media like Twilight or celebrities whom were primarily liked by teenage girls, like Justin Bieber, or Harry Styles to give a more contemporary example, because I was seemingly in 2008. To talk about the point of shoujo being "gay", I guess that would actually be true, like I know people absurdly use the word gay as an insult, but shoujo being "gay" would ironically be pretty true, (maybe that would be more true about the pre 2000's though) as far as homosexuality on screen or on page goes. I suppose people usually point out to the act of viewing something as a male, while that something is intended towards a female demographic as gay though. Or to the fact that the male shoujo characters come off as "gay" in the way the characters present, which is a more interesting talking point than the aforementioned. (I'm suddenly reminded off an interesting youtube video, which touches upon the points which I talked about, it's also a pretty cool video in general) I'd say that shoujo manga/anime has a pretty differing view on masculinity than say your average shounen manga, which is seemingly threatening to some? Maybe? Shoujo male characters being abusive seems to be an argument roughly as popular, as female characters being poorly written in shounen. To me this argument has always been in the same vein as the complaint of sexual assault in BL for some reason. (Scratch BL, maybe) Suddenly violence in men or being abusive is seen as an unacceptable narrative choice when it's in media for women? Do I think that there is valid room for this as an argument in some cases? Yes, in some cases this would be valid critique, however, that's kind of irrelevant for now. Like to give a pretty unrelated example in the newest Gundam show (Gundam: Witch from Mercury) the male characters act in a roughly similarly douchey way to the main character as in say Zeta Gundam from 1985. But suddenly when there's a female protagonist in Witch from Mercury this depiction of the male characters is unacceptable to "male viewer x". I wonder whether at the the end of the day the thing that most turns people away is the fact that the average shoujo anime/manga is from the perspective of a girl, and more specifically usually a teenage girl. I've certainly seen having a girl as a protagonist as an argument for something being shoujo, and that they don't want to watch a series because it's all girly because of that. Do I however think that the lack of popularity is because of aversion to femininity and specifically a feminine perspective? Don't know, I guess. Uuhh, really cool and interesting topic. |
KumiveneellaApr 28, 2023 3:58 PM
| Can you give me the links of the threads where you found all those anti-shojous ppl. I really want to read some of them. |
| “I won’t rely on anyone anymore. I don’t care if no one understands.” – Homura Akemi |
| Anything that doesn't involve bright colors and two teenagers fighting stays in the shadows. Some of the best works I found in the industry were from the mentioned demographic btw |
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| I know part of it is the general aversion of any media for women, especially media that teenage girls like. I don't know what society's deal with teenage girls is, but our interests are constantly mocked and treated as lesser. If a celebrity or a movie, or even a book series is popular with teenage girls, it's automatically seen as "cringey" or "bad". Like it's automatically a shallow, vapid, tasteless thing just because women and girls love and enjoy it. People stereotype shounen as "just fights and action" and shoujo as "just high school romance", but when people defend shounen and bring up other examples to prove that it's not the same, people listen. People don't do that with shoujo. No matter how many times we bring up Banana Fish, Yona of the Dawn, or Natsume's Book of Friends, no one will listen. They'll make excuses as to why they're "not shoujo" because they don't fit their predefined idea of what shoujo is. My theory is they don't want to accept that women's media has more nuance than they previously thought. Feminine things are seen as bad in our society. There's a reason so many girls go through the "I'm not like the other girls" phase. Rejecting feminine things makes them feel cooler and less like they're put into a box. I went through this phase back in middle school. I decided I hated pink, dresses, and shows for girls because I perceived being feminine as being weak and shallow. It's only when I fell in love with shoujo anime that I was really able to accept that I secretly really liked feminine things and they weren't shallow and useless. Sailor Moon, Yona of the Dawn, Snow White with the Red Hair, and Fruits Basket in particular were instrumental in that. (Though it's also perfectly okay for women to prefer masculine things and shounen, I'm just going on about how even women are conditioned to think of femininity as a negative thing.) I genuinely believe that every demographic has something to offer someone. I'll get my guy friends who are mostly into shounen and seinen to read shoujo, and then they'll offer me some shounen or seinen (usually more emotional works) that they like or think I'll like. Some shoujo hits have been Kitchen Princess and Yona of the Dawn, while I read and enjoyed Takopi's Original Sin recently for one friend and plan to read School Live for another. The people who limit themselves to just shounen and seinen are seriously missing out to a lot of great works, as well as perspectives different from their own, since shoujo and josei are written by women for women. I think the reason it's so underappreciated is due to the fact that women and girls who are unafraid of feminine things are the only ones to consume it. That's not to say it's not successful at all, since there are many regularly sales chart topping shoujo and josei such as Do Not Say Mystery, Honey Lemon Soda, and A Sign of Affection. (Interestingly enough, none of those titles have anime adaptations, while their shounen and seinen contemporaries do.) And yeah. That's kind of a weird ramble-y rant, but those are some of my feelings on the subject. |
because obviously, real girls dont exist so why should anime studio adapt more shoujos, my god OP, you're not you when you're hungry. I can't believe this isn't sarcasm.I don't really read that much manga and the most of which I know of, sampled, or glimpsed at just doesn't interest me at all. I already know I pretty much don't like any shonen or shoujo. This person may be narrow minded, but at least he isn't sexist!I think a dislike of shoujo is merely one common example of the strange standards many have. |
| その目だれの目？ |
| I came to this thread expecting some posts that read like they were written by Ferengi and, boy did this thread deliver. Some of you need to rethink your perceptions of women badly. |
| Ultimately, it is for the same reason women do not like many harem and ecchi series. Demographics have a big influence in taste generally. Most shoujo men are not viewed favorably from the male perspective. |
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Usapz said: 2 of the statements were written by a single person in a recent thread.Can you give me the links of the threads where you found all those anti-shojous ppl. I really want to read some of them. https://myanimelist.net/forum/?topicid=2089653 I also came across reviews for Princess Tutu and The Rose of Versailles that complain about the existence of shoujo tropes in shoujo anime. https://myanimelist.net/reviews.php?id=351750 https://myanimelist.net/reviews.php?id=442251 |
| その目だれの目？ |
| I've given plenty of shoujos a try and I came to the conclusion it's just not for me. It's just mostly boring for me. A lot of shoujo isekai for example, focuses a lot on medicine which I have zero interest in. There are a few interesting ones like Ookami Shoujo to Kuro Ouji. |
FlamingMangosApr 27, 2023 10:06 PM
| The reasons why I used to hate shoujo (I don't think like this anymore, I promise, please forgive me shoujo community) is because to me, it felt like while every demographic had it's share of shitty tropes, shoujo felt like it embraced them, my theory back then being that it's easier making tropey shows, and since the shoujo community can't afford to be as picky as the shounen community due to scarcity they never complained. No idea how much of that is accurate, that's just how I justified why shows like Say I Love You existed. I've seen some shoujo in the later years of my time with anime which proved I was mistaken about these shows and I previously got pushed onto the ones that are just pure niche shoujo romance with the tropes that I loathe, but unfortunately by the time I actually decided to be more proactive with watching stuff from different genres and demographics like shoujo, I was already in the late stages of burning out with anime permanently. |
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| I think several factors are at play. - The shounen itself is snuffed/dominated by battle shounen, sport and isekai. Very few other types of shows for boys (mostly some form of escapism) can survive the brutal competition. It needs diversity too. - People in Japan are very strongly influenced by publicity campaigns, not by actual content, this is why the most consumed shoujo titles are mass produced snooze fests like Pretty Cure. - A lot girls are "traitors" of their own demographic consuming nothing but shounen. Part of this phenomena are the fujoshies who are always so easily to be yaoi baited. - Last but not least I guess the japanese girls are not that into manga and anime. Maybe they prefer live action shows and books? PS In my book Fruits Basket is not a good advocate for the "shoujo cause". It employs some of the laziest tropes, the story is kind of boring/obvious, also the MC is unnecessary bland. It being the flagship of shoujo just because randomly became popular (and it was a second attempt even) isn't doing any favors to this sub-media. "Even freaking The Anime Man likes Fruits Basket and that dude hates every anime that came out recently." I bet he does it because he likes the manga...and likes the manga because as teen he watched the old Fruits Basket anime. |
alshuApr 28, 2023 12:39 AM
| Because it is not so interesting. Many shoujo works are typical and cliched, there are exceptions, of course, but it is minority sadly. |
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| I'm positive that most people I see who talk about how much they dislike shoujo, or talk about how all shoujo anime are the same, or try to avoid shoujo when asking for recommendations, have little to no actual experience with shoujo. Most of the time, all they seem to know about it is a little general knowledge of what it means as well as one or two memes or stigmas. I think they often feel obligated to not like it because of those stigmas they have about it. |
FrosteekApr 28, 2023 12:26 PM
| Dunno but I've seen tons of people don't want to watch a girl as a mc. Never seen the opposite tho. |
Kermomancer said: True that...as a Trekkie and DS9 fan you killed me from laughing XD!I came to this thread expecting some posts that read like they were written by Ferengi and, boy did this thread deliver. Some of you need to rethink your perceptions of women badly. |
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| Most anime fans are male and shoujo are intended for a female audience. This is why there are fewer of them and you sometimes see angry teenage boys rather vocally hating on these series. Then again you can pick any genre under the sun and there will be somebody there to hate on it. Having said this, it certainly wouldn't hurt to have more shoujo and josei anime released each season. EdgyLord666 said: Dunno but I've seen tons of people don't want to watch a girl as a mc. Never seen the opposite tho. Now you have. |
| Shoujo is shunned because it's a genre made for and by girls, and unfortunately, society still stigmatizes media that is created for and enjoyed by women.. It's considered "girly" and therefore, inferior or unimportant. Meanwhile, male-oriented genres like echi, harem, and isekai, are celebrated and often deemed as more valuable or entertaining.. This kind of bias is the result of a patriarchal and misogynistic culture that values men and masculinity above all else.. |
| I recenty replied in another thread similar to this, so let me narrow down my two main points: 1. The misconception that shoujo is only high school romance series with very little substance makes a lot of people turn away from it (even though this is clearly not true) 2. General distaste for things that are targeted for girls/women in media (probably misogyny as well) |
The siren of a flightless bird Quietly destroying its cage Dance, until tonight, with a raised voice- For I don't want to lose hope! -Utsuro wo Aogu, Vivid BAS SQUAD |
| Based. The shoujo hate springs from guys who want everything to be about them. |
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| To be quite fair, a lot of shounen are more popular among Japanese women than most shoujo, things like JJK, Bleach, Gintama, One Piece, D. Gray Man, Fullmetal Alchemist, Naruto... Fairly popular among girls in Japan. Shoujo isn't dead, but it doesn't sell as much as shounen I think, yeah even among women. Honestly it all comes down to popularity, marketing and sales. There are some great shoujo out there, but I think the industry doesn't want to take a lot of risks considering that even among women it isn't as popular as shounen or Fantasy/Isekai/LN adaptations. I'd be glad to have more stuff like Natsume Yuujinchou, Rose of Versailles, Mimi wo Sumaseba, Kimi ni Todoke or even josei like Chihayafuru, Honey and Clover, Nodame Cantabile, Omoide Poroporo and so on and so on, but let's be honest those don't come even close to something like JJK in terms of popularity and sales, yes even among girls. If you ask a random girl in the street in Japan what's her favourite manga/anime, you'll probably get a lot of JJKs... |
GuidSMRApr 28, 2023 7:44 AM
  Grant me one hour on love's most sacred shores To clasp the bosom that my soul adores, Lie heart to heart and merge my soul with yours |
| It's a demographic that appeals to a very niche audience. Men have no interest in it cause no waifus and romance that focuses on male characters isn't appealing, most women would rather watch snounen and yaoi. It doesn't help that shojo anime are very cliché you can tell from miles away just looking at the art-style that it's a shojo anime and the kind of people that may like them would rather watch k-drama, read manhwa or something along those lines. This is the reason why not many of them get adapted, cause after all companies need to make a bottom line and shojo anime are not gonna cut it. |
  ❤ Incessant Rain ❤ “Can you let me have some fun this time?”  |
| Personally I did not like shoujo for very long time and it is still something I choose less then other demographics (if I can choose I would just go for seinen or shounen). Probably because early on I was pretty unlucky by choosing mangas which I just did not like, were extremely clichéd, with boring one note characters and such. I watched/read some good ones since then but it is still not something I would be that much interested in as it seems my shoujo taste is extremely niché (something like Requiem of the Rose King and After School Nightmare). When you click on manga search here on MAL and go to shoujo, almost all entries there are romance and their covers just do not look that appealing to me, so I am not that surprised people think all shoujo are just boring romantic schlock. (and it is almost same for anime) And I am also not big romantic fan too, so, yeah, maybe if there would be more shoujo kinda branching out, things would get different but it is rarity. |
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betaweeb said: This is exactly the way Tezuka is marketed in English, and I hate it. Gatekeepers make the hobby so much harder for those of us who enjoy anime outside the major stereotypes.that is to say, that as a part of this particular geek culture, 'real anime' is something that is evidently separated from cartoons and other forms of animation and media, usually by way of being mature, which is (ironically) identified by violence, gore, vulgarity and explicit expressions of perceived masculinity, and the 'real anime fan' is someone that values this and rejects works that do not adhere to this and can be mistaken for something made for children, women and whomever doesn't fit what the stereotypical anime fan is, or something that could be seen as similar to romantic comedies, dramas, or god forbid, anything western. |
| その目だれの目？ |
Sachyan said: Yeah. I definitely agree that one of the reasons on what makes shoujo seems less popular are because they are not placed prioritized for marketing efforts by the industry.To be quite fair, a lot of shounen are more popular among Japanese women than most shoujo, things like JJK, Bleach, Gintama, One Piece, D. Gray Man, Fullmetal Alchemist, Naruto... Fairly popular among girls in Japan. Shoujo isn't dead, but it doesn't sell as much as shounen I think, yeah even among women. Honestly it all comes down to popularity, marketing and sales. There are some great shoujo out there, but I think the industry doesn't want to take a lot of risks considering that even among women it isn't as popular as shounen or Fantasy/Isekai/LN adaptations. Also I think there is a stigma that shoujo is "stupid cliche highschool romance". I love many many shoujo like Akatsuki no Yona, Dengeki Daisy, Kimi Ni Todoke, and many others. But I don't really talk about them to other people. It seems much easier to connect to new people when you just say you like the big shonen names like One Piece or JJK. While in reality, shoujo can be really deep and full of heartwarming moments. It's not just about chasing boys. But I think shoujo's theme is often really about finding yourself, and finding your place in this world. Something that could be said to be relatable to both GIRLS and BOYS. But I guess not many people are willing to admit this yet. |
 Anime analysis & fun chats :) Visit my Youtube @yume.kairi |
| They're not even that popular among women. The girls I know who consume anime watch the popular action shonen |
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| because the bigshots in the anime industry don't wanna invest in a show that doesn't bring money, shoujo manga is already niche and not all girls read it, I mean shoujo is monthly compared to shounen because it simply too expensive and risky to have it weekly considering the already small fanbase (compared to shounen and seinen). So basically a shoujo has to be real big in order to get an anime, like for example the case of Fruits Basket, that was also good because it appealed to larger audiences instead of just girls who read shoujo. 3D Kanojo was fully adapted instead of stuff like Strobe Edge for example because the story was from a guy's point of view, so it was more relatable to another audience even though let's be honest Strobe Edge is better and more popular in the shoujo scene instead of 3D Kano but when talking about tv anime, then fewer people would have watched Strobe Edge |
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| Kinda that it's pretty vanilla, not a lot of smut, not a lot of gore, and there's its romance and drama which is a lot and for girls, so it won't appeal to loads of guys i guess lol |
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Nagadir-chan said: Hana to Yume covers all look the same. I know it's meant to instill brand loyalty, but I'm less likely to read something like Pygmalio after dropping something like Fruits Basket.their covers just do not look that appealing to me |
| その目だれの目？ |
Nagadir-chan said: Requiem of Rose King style kind of shojo arent that niche even if yeah thats not the majority but they tend to be wrongly categorized in the western manga edition market as seinen or josei...that dont help shojo reputation. While its true most shojo are indeed romance many are not and even if they take a bit of search they arent that hard to find. I cant tell you what percent are not romance but they exist and a lot of good titles of shojo arent romance. But yeah the most easy to take ones always are that's part of why they are seen as only romance. The cover are the responsibility of editors in my country one editor only get true to the original cover of their shojo manga and close to their artist style with beautiful covers of all kind of art and color but all the others get lazy and just get a ugly pink glittering cover to their shojo titles that often do not reflect the content at all this is definitively part of the issue. And yes some prepublication magazine of shojo like Hana to Yume are indeed guilty of low cover efforts for their shojo in Japan too...the less known ones less from what i've seen shojo in Japan seems to be treated fairly for what they are...even by male otaku who its not the taste of they say its not their thing without disrespecting it loudly like many western shonen/seinen fans do for the most part...i wonder why that gap?Personally I did not like shoujo for very long time and it is still something I choose less then other demographics (if I can choose I would just go for seinen or shounen). Probably because early on I was pretty unlucky by choosing mangas which I just did not like, were extremely clichéd, with boring one note characters and such. I watched/read some good ones since then but it is still not something I would be that much interested in as it seems my shoujo taste is extremely niché (something like Requiem of the Rose King and After School Nightmare). When you click on manga search here on MAL and go to shoujo, almost all entries there are romance and their covers just do not look that appealing to me, so I am not that surprised people think all shoujo are just boring romantic schlock. (and it is almost same for anime) And I am also not big romantic fan too, so, yeah, maybe if there would be more shoujo kinda branching out, things would get different but it is rarity. |
SylphelineApr 28, 2023 8:37 AM
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ChouunShiryuu said: There is if you read RG Veda and X.not a lot of gore Can you tell these artists like Devilman? |
| その目だれの目？ |
| Shojo media is popularized mainly by romance and SOL stories usually aimed at high school age girls. That is the big reason. Most people get into this medium because of high octane action and adventure not necessarily that. Even for shonen/seinen SOL stories/dramas/comedies even it tends to be more for dedicated anime fans. The casuals who cause shows to blow up are interested in action and shojo rarely promotes that. I think if you had way more action adventure stories (that weren't magical girl shows) popularized there would be a difference. Stuff like Hunger Games is obviously very targeted to female readers but it was widely popular YA work at the time because guys could still enjoy the death game plot or dystopian action adventure angle. You can even hit on this in media that has very little explicit target demographic. Since I am reading it the Mistborn series by Brandon Sanderson has a lot of stuff you could find in traditional shojo female led story, fashion, parties, finding oneself, falling in love with hot prince despite not being one but it's combined with action, politics and rebellion that can get everyone. That's why it's a widely popular fantasy series regardless of gender. I mean female fans also are looking for action, adventure, death defying stuff etc. I mean I know there are shojo media like Yona of the Dawn and Rose of Versailes it's just that isn't what people normally think when they think Shojo. A lot of guys and girls (who later gravitate to shonen/seinen stories) are looking for action and adventure plots and shojo media doesn't really promote that. Still I don't know if it absolutely has to. Otome isekai are starting to get some popularity. Also there are a few notable "shonen" manga/anime to me that are pretty shojoesque that usually get high praise such as The Ancient Magus Bride. I don't think people shun shojo media. Honestly there just hasn't been that much coming out from it. When you do see something well the Fruits Basket remake got plenty high praise. |
Lucifrost said: ChouunShiryuu said: There is if you read RG Veda and X.not a lot of gore Can you tell these artists like Devilman? Ah that's from clamp, well i guess on average then, i stand corrected XD that is quite gory. |
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| I think a lot of people dislike shoujo because they dislike women, in all honesty. Especially teenage ones. Obviously this doesn't apply to everyone who doesn't like shoujo, but still. It's the same reason everyone hated Twilight but not for any of the reasons it was actually bad---because it was a thing teenage girls liked. It's stupid. I'm a girl who has never been into shoujo. My guy friend Kyle eats it up. I'm having a great time watching the next battle shounen whatever and he's enjoying Fruits Basket and Nana. I think men in this society are conditioned to be turned off from anything deemed girly conscious or not. Genres like drama and romance focused on character relationships and emotions (common shoujo staples) should appeal to everyone. It's no coincidence that lots of women watch shounen but hardly any men watch shoujo (besides my buddy Kyle, I guess). You could argue I'm contributing to whatever it is by not watching a lot of shoujo but it's mostly because I'm not a fan of romance, and almost all shoujo focuses on romance. That's all. But it's my individual preference. There's no reason men at large should dislike it. |
| In the end, all girls are like the rose bride |
Curlybrace101 said: That's such a stretch, and probably far from the truth. The themes and genres explored in shoujo are simply not interesting to the average boy. Why? Because they generally have slower pacing, and most importantly they lack action, which is what young boys are most interested in. Also, the mood can be more laid back and relaxed, which they might find boring. Basically hating women has nothing to do with this : PI think a lot of people dislike shoujo because they dislike women, in all honesty. There are some great shoujo anime out there btw, I enjoy it. |
Delphineum said: You misunderstand me. I don't mean being uninterested in shoujo. I mean actively disliking it or even hating it.Curlybrace101 said: That's such a stretch, and probably far from the truth. The themes and genres explored in shoujo are simply not interesting to the average boy. Why? Because they generally have slower pacing, and most importantly they lack action, which is what young boys are most interested in. Also, the mood can be more laid back and relaxed, which they might find boring. Basically hating women has nothing to do with this : PI think a lot of people dislike shoujo because they dislike women, in all honesty. There are some great shoujo anime out there btw, I enjoy it. |
| In the end, all girls are like the rose bride |
Curlybrace101 said: I see. I find that opinion / point even less convincing. I mean if someone really wanted to hate on women, why actively hate on a genre of anime of all things? Surely there's better methods.You misunderstand me. I don't mean being uninterested in shoujo. I mean actively disliking it or even hating it. But I accept your point, maybe it's just not something I paid attention to, so I'm ignorant. |
Delphineum said: A lot of time it isn't conscious. They aren't aware they're doing it out of disdain for women. Subconscious bias is a real thing. Even then, if someone who doesn't like women is hating on shoujo, they aren't only hating on shoujo. You say "surely there's better methods" but they're likely also doing these "better methods."Curlybrace101 said: I see. I find that opinion / point even less convincing. I mean if someone really wanted to hate on women, why actively hate on a genre of anime of all things? Surely there's better methods.You misunderstand me. I don't mean being uninterested in shoujo. I mean actively disliking it or even hating it. But I accept your point, maybe it's just not something I paid attention to, so I'm ignorant |
| In the end, all girls are like the rose bride |
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