Citrus Episode 11 Discussion

MeryNeko said:



Actually, my wish is that Yuzu meets someone better. hahaha, but being "realistic" and true to the plot, I think mei and yuzu will end together, it's obvious, maybe not in this season, but who knows? I feel bad for Sara xd Maybe it ends with yuzu's love declaration and Mei saying: finally! was it so difficult? xdddddddddddd
We have to wait <3

Arcaedes said:
There are definitely flaws in the way things are presented, but Mei's behaviour is still making sense to me. It's messed up, but it makes sense

From what we've seen the only non superficial relationship she had as a kid was with her dad, and when he left she felt like she'd been rejected by the only person she was truly close to. After that relationships meant very little to her, and she put up a lot of barriers between other people and her true self and feelings. At Christmas after everything they'd been through, she finally got to a place where she felt like Yuzu was worth lowering the barriers for, and was willing to to trust her and let her in. But Yuzu's hesitation made her feel rejected again. So she went back into self preservation mode, and a superficial relationship with someone she just met, who apparently needs her is better than one that actually matters where she could get hurt again.

It's kind of like someone who's scared of leaving their house because of something bad/traumatic that happened to them, and the first time they actually get up the courage to do it and step outside they get mugged. They're bound to regress even worse than they were before

SkyDrop said:
very average and cringeworthy and stupid episode. This episode proved me Mei is bad and so cold-hearted character =/ I thought Yuzu was fine as a protagonist but at the same time her characterization feels inconsistent. Yeah atm this show won't get any better AND I really think Yuzu should look for another girl instead of Mei!

LSSJ_Gaming said:


All the psychology under the surface is what makes me love this anime. It sucks it only has one episode in the season and I need season 2

Arcaedes said:


Yeah, I don't think we'll get much of a resolution in the one remaining episode, unless its massively rushed. I'm just hoping for progress at least

Arcaedes said:
There are definitely flaws in the way things are presented, but Mei's behaviour is still making sense to me. It's messed up, but it makes sense

From what we've seen the only non superficial relationship she had as a kid was with her dad, and when he left she felt like she'd been rejected by the only person she was truly close to. After that relationships meant very little to her, and she put up a lot of barriers between other people and her true self and feelings. At Christmas after everything they'd been through, she finally got to a place where she felt like Yuzu was worth lowering the barriers for, and was willing to to trust her and let her in. But Yuzu's hesitation made her feel rejected again. So she went back into self preservation mode, and a superficial relationship with someone she just met, who apparently needs her is better than one that actually matters where she could get hurt again.

It's kind of like someone who's scared of leaving their house because of something bad/traumatic that happened to them, and the first time they actually get up the courage to do it and step outside they get mugged. They're bound to regress even worse than they were before

LSSJ_Gaming said:


All the psychology under the surface is what makes me love this anime. It sucks it only has one episode in the season and I need season 2

PianoManGregory said:
For 21 months, I dated a sociopath. I don't use that term to insult her, I sincerely believe that label applies. She was shallow, lacked any major interests or notable skills, obsessively talked about her problems and gave little more than the most superficial (and probably artificial) concern for the people around her, and I'm not even mentioning her worst personality flaws. Despite all that, when she asked me to be her lover I was in an emotionally-fragile state and I couldn't say no. Our relationship was an on again, off again, toxic, chaotic and painful experience, and when she finally broke up with me I felt like a weight had been lifted from my shoulders.

I say all this because Citrus might be the most important anime this season for me. I see so much of myself in Yuzu and so much of my ex in Mei, it's honestly freaky. I hate watching this "relationship" form between them, it makes me actually angry, but it's also cathartic. It feels, in a way, like I'm reliving my own relationship but from a safe distance, and that means I can learn from it this time. Watching Yuzu fall more and more hopelessly in love with Mei is helping me process how and why I fell so strongly in love with my ex, and hopefully now that I understand, I'll be able to avoid getting myself into a similar situation again.

Of course, the show's bad for a lot of legitimate reasons, I didn't write this to say that I think Citrus deserves a good score. I just... feel something for this anime that I haven't really felt for any other.

larger0o said:


"Heating eggs". Male eggs.

I'm really disappointed about this show. I can't understand Mei, she's like a amoeba.

Kittens-kun said:
Seriously, what the fuck is going on in this show? We move on from one character starting useless drama, then we get two more. I don't think I've ever seen that before. They might even be worse than Matsuri. What are they thinking? What is MEI thinking? None of them actually expect this out-of-nowhere relationship to work right? They know nothing about each other! God this is stupid.

twin7709 said:
I'm so freakin' frustrated by all the astronomical coincidences, terrible choices, and lack of communication between all these characters.

minimiau said:
Loos like a romcance between girls is more complicated that the typical boy/girl romance. That or Yuzu really complicates things. or maybe Mei doesn't want to admit she loves Yuzu (its obvious she likes her)

kcired said:


Ahhhhhhhh finally someone gets it! I completed agree with both of you. There is so much subtext and psychology in this show, that the more you contemplate the characters actions and reactions, the more you understand. I love this anime for this reason. And I went into this series to hate it (the same way ppl enjoy watching bad movies to get a kick out of it) and I was blown away by the respect it had for its audience to not spoon feed you everything. If you pay attention, you can find more of the story. Genius character/story writing.

Can't wait for the last ep!
(I'll be reading the manga after the anime is finished :D )

Catsyk said:
This anime is really, really bad. Somebody please tell me if the manga is any better, I'll give it a try if that's the case.

Citrus is not trashy, not cheesy, not problematic, and - most importantly - not promoting sexual assault. It details the effects sexual assault and neglect has on a child and teenager, and discourages it. As we near the end of this season, the hate towards Mei and the anime in general crescendos. Mei haters, hear me out. This is long, but necessary, grab a tea and sit back and relax. Do forgive any formatting errors, I'm new here, created an account just to share my POV.

Like most people, when I first read the manga and watched the anime, I absolutely hated the gobsmackingly obnoxious fanservice and nonconsensual acts. But then, sometime between episodes 7 and 9, with so many questions about Mei’s bizarre behaviours screaming in my head and refusal to write it off as lousy character building, I reached enlightenment. Trust me, you will too. Don’t give up on this series. Despite some failings and loose plot points, this is a solid series. It is far from brilliant, but makes a giant step forward in terms of shoujo-ai anime. It may be the very first that cares for the characters, cares about their history, and tackles decisions and actions that are influenced by internal and external conflict in a realistic manner. (Kannazuki no miko, Strawberry Panic, I’m looking at you.)

Mei People who hate Mei, I’m about to change your mind. I’ll get straight to the meat of the matter. Her behaviour, attitude, and actions are all consistent with a sexual abuse victim, and someone who has been neglected from a young age. Throw in the pressure from maintaining the honor of her family name, her school responsibilities, living alone (before Yuzu and Mom), lack of emotional support . . . and you have Mei as we know her. She’s overflowing with unhealthy perceptions of relationships (family, friends, romantic), and unhealthy coping mechanisms. Ask anyone who’s been through childhood or teenage trauma, many are still struggling to deal with all that even as adults in their 30s or 40s, let alone Mei who’s in high school.

Sexual Abuse is About Control Right from the first episode, we see the teacher she was engaged to forcing a kiss onto her while in school. The anime art is explicit in showing his dominant behaviour – hand on chin, pushing Mei. After he goes off the scene focuses on Mei with her head down, distressed, breathing heavily in discomfort.

We are told they’re engaged, and have been - as I’m inclined to believe – for quite a while. The ease with which he pushes Mei against the wall, and her submissive body language makes it obvious this is just one of the many times he’s done this. My one gripe about the art is that she’s shown to be blushing, as though she enjoyed it. I’d rather the artist didn’t do that as western audiences may misunderstand it. Blushing in anime is typically meant to show awkwardness, whether in favourable or unfavourable circumstances – unfavourable in this case.

Who knows how long this has gone on, and just how far the teacher has taken it? Mei is probably not a virgin, (tells Yuzu not to worry, it’s your first time isn’t it?)

Emotional Abuse When Yuzu confronts Mei about it, Mei reveals she knew of the teacher’s intentions all along. This brings me to Mei’s next issue: She doesn’t care, or simply accepts this sort of treatment. She’s used to being viewed AND views herself as an extension of her family name, of the school, as her father’s daughter, and never as an individual with unique needs and desires. It’s not a stretch to believe many others have treated her the same way since young. Imagine, “Oh you’re the daughter of ___/grandaughter of/ an Aihara/student council president.” It’s never “Oh you’re Mei.”

Her father’s absence is yet another huge influence on her. He’s been absent for god knows how long, doesn’t speak to her (Mom calls her dad a tsundere, in front of everyone). This was done comically, but it’s no less shocking to me. In my head, I went “YOU IDIOT!”. He deprives her of love and affection, of attention, of his presence, leaves a void for the school that Mei has to fill, and only gifts her with objects and letters that she never opened. And he gets to jet off again without saying goodbye! Guys, if you want someone to hate, I propose Mei’s dad. Unbelievable.

Thankfully, we get to be a part of the tail-end of this father-daughter conflict (the quality of their reconciliation is contestable, I don’t quite like it, but I’ll close an eye to it) - Mei coming to the acceptance her father will not return to take over the school, and her personal decision to do it on her own terms. That’s a turning point for her character arc. She’s finally taking control over a portion of her life in a healthy, accepting manner. Score 1 for Mei. This part is also significant, since she acknowledges Yuzu’s help in closing the father-daughter gap. She sees Yuzu’s annoyingly persistent sincerity through Yuzu’s actions. This I believe is significant since Mei is used to people giving lip service, falling all over her, or exploiting her status. Finally there’s someone who sees her as an individual, who offers help albeit in a stumbling, wide-eyed, persistent manner. Score 1 for Yuzu. The Mei and Yuzu ship is beginning to catch wind in its sails.

This recurs several times in the following episodes. I won't get to that, since this post is about explaining Mei's character.

Impact on Mei She doesn’t value her body. Her attitude towards romantic or sexual relationships, and towards sex itself is distorted – again, consistent with sexual abuse. She's got no romantic notions of love, but is growing fonder of Yuzu because of her sincerity, and in slowly proving herself to be someone Mei could perhaps lean on. She’s detached from her body, is ready to have unspeakable things done to her by a stranger during the Matsuri arc, and offers it to Yuzu as payment. Her body is a commodity, something to offer in exchange for something else. Her entire existence is something to be offered in exchange for family and school honor.

Are we that surprised she’s terrible at voicing her feelings or concerns? Or that she simply doesn’t communicate? I mean, before Yuzu, who did she have as emotional support? Her father? Oops, he wasn’t around, just up and left. Her mother? Nothing is mentioned of her thus far. Her grandfather? What a stick in the mud! Momokino? Her childhood best friend practically views her as a goddess and worships her, has a bizarre perception of Mei and treats her as a precious, fragile, but amazing object that she’s crazy possessive over. Mei has no one to speak to, and is not in the habit of sharing her fears and such to anyone. Yuzu slowly changes this, and Mei struggles through this new development, unable (again) to communicate her frustration.

In order to control the situation, she turns to what she’s learnt from previous abusive relationships – exerting control in the form of physical contact/assault. Kissing Yuzu to shut her up, to shock her – basically to put her in her place so she’d stop bothering Mei. Again, not a stretch to believe that this type of behaviour’s been done to Mei before.

Relationship 'Reset' in Ep 10 It's not a reset. In fact, it's just another obstacle Mei and Yuzu have to overcome, which will be resolved by Ep12. She doesn’t know any other form of love, or expression of love. Finally she’s opening up to Yuzu, but instead of speaking of her feelings, she expresses it through action. Sex is, after all, something to be exchanged, not enjoyed or experienced. When Yuzu says "I can't", to Yuzu it means she cannot accept it as payment because she'd like Mei to genuinely want it too. To Mei, she hears "I reject your vulnerability and your feelings." It's a classic mismatch in expectations and communication styles. This was Mei's confession, that Yuzu completely misunderstood. Thus the cold shoulder and fall-out after.

Mei is developing as a character. Sure, it's frustrating, but that's the point. We all want the big payoff, the happy ending, but payoffs are made even sweeter when we know what obstacles the characters have gone through.

AltoRoark said:
There's a really good comment I found on Reddit that wonderfully summarizes Mei's character and her behavior throughout the series. I think this is something that needs to be shared with people who are ridiculing Mei and downplaying this series as a whole.


https://www.reddit.com/r/anime/comments/8548mc/spoilers_citrus_episode_11_discussion/dvvrtn7/