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| Berserker had a good run |
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| This was painful to watch... Illya... T_T I shed tears.. really. Again, stunning animation... that was a spectacle of lights, impacts, and everything. Both in visuals and sound. I could only have wished the battle lasted longer. But those Illya flashbacks... T_T |
HDarkmantis said: This was painful to watch... Illya... T_T I shed tears.. really. Again, stunning animation... that was a spectacle of lights, impacts, and everything. Both in visuals and sound. I could only have wished the battle lasted longer. But those Illya flashbacks... T_T Goes to show you how being such a VN purist can be as much a curse as anything else. You're not the first person I've heard who feels this way, but most found this episode to be disappointing. |
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Mickdrew said: HDarkmantis said: This was painful to watch... Illya... T_T I shed tears.. really. Again, stunning animation... that was a spectacle of lights, impacts, and everything. Both in visuals and sound. I could only have wished the battle lasted longer. But those Illya flashbacks... T_T Goes to show you how being such a VN purist can be as much a curse as anything else. You're not the first person I've heard who feels this way, but most found this episode to be disappointing. Because even without VN knowledge, the Illya flashbacks are outright out of place and interrupt one of highpoint moments in the story. One moment you are watching this fight and other moment you are watching random flashback, repeat adnauseam.Not to mention adding half-assed "feel bad for this random character" flashbacks just before the death is cringe as hell. Illya is a minor side character at best in UBW. Visually its also while pretty and bright, nothing special choreography and directing wise. A single one minute scene from grands like Yutaka Nakamura, Shingo Fuji, Akira Hamaguchi, Ryo Imamura or Genichiro Abe(and I could list and list and list tbh) already would make this whole episode look like trash in comparison. Its especially obvious when you had Kekkai Sensen airing at the same time with Yutaka Nakamura going crazy with his usual stuff there. So yeah the fight was a letdown. I mean this is ufotable, adapting one of the most awaited complex franchises- they should at least do better than freaking pokemon or a freaking toei magical girl show(AND I SAID TOEI, aka company who usually makes everything look like shit) For those with VN knowledge, t they get to have to explain OVER AND OVER again on what the hell those flashbacks mean and that no, it has nothing to do with the grail itself, etc, etc. At the same time knowing that the Winter Forest scene lost most of its value and meaning(I still don't get why they made it edgier with wolves biting Illya and shit, that was cringe and unneeded). And realization that adding additional stuff in the last second(Why not just add more scenes over the course of cour1 if they wanted to make Anime onlies care?) is Miura just trying to make up for lack of fate route -which is something you absolutely should not do as that was also mistake DEEN did by trying to stuff all that is needed into single route, at the cost of what was actually needed. There's thousands of things one could do with screentime wasted here and on the anime original MrGatorade flashback that could have been spent on developing Shirou/Rin into something more akin to their VN banter or showing Shirou's mindset and that he is not just some dumb shonen hero. No matter the point of view, the episode was badly executed. What's worse, by pacing it like this, it created an utterly weird atmosphere dissonance in next episodes where the show flicks between random comedy and "muh feels" in matter of seconds for no reason. Hell we already had that with maid deaths and SHinji's out of place comedy moments there. |
AhenshihaelApr 16, 2016 12:34 AM
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Fai said: Mickdrew said: Goes to show you how being such a VN purist can be as much a curse as anything else. You're not the first person I've heard who feels this way, but most found this episode to be disappointing. Because even without VN knowledge, the Illya flashbacks are outright out of place and interrupt one of highpoint moments in the story. One moment you are watching this fight and other moment you are watching random flashback, repeat adnauseam.Not to mention adding half-assed "feel bad for this random character" flashbacks just before the death is cringe as hell. Illya is a minor side character at best in UBW. Visually its also while pretty and bright, nothing special choreography and directing wise. A single one minute scene from grands like Yutaka Nakamura, Shingo Fuji, Akira Hamaguchi, Ryo Imamura or Genichiro Abe(and I could list and list and list tbh) already would make this whole episode look like trash in comparison. Its especially obvious when you had Kekkai Sensen airing at the same time with Yutaka Nakamura going crazy with his usual stuff there. So yeah the fight was a letdown. I mean this is ufotable, adapting one of the most awaited complex franchises- they should at least do better than freaking pokemon or a freaking toei magical girl show(AND I SAID TOEI, aka company who usually makes everything look like shit) For those with VN knowledge, t they get to have to explain OVER AND OVER again on what the hell those flashbacks mean and that no, it has nothing to do with the grail itself, etc, etc. At the same time knowing that the Winter Forest scene lost most of its value and meaning(I still don't get why they made it edgier with wolves biting Illya and shit, that was cringe and unneeded). And realization that adding additional stuff in the last second(Why not just add more scenes over the course of cour1 if they wanted to make Anime onlies care?) is Miura just trying to make up for lack of fate route -which is something you absolutely should not do as that was also mistake DEEN did by trying to stuff all that is needed into single route, at the cost of what was actually needed. There's thousands of things one could do with screentime wasted here and on the anime original MrGatorade flashback that could have been spent on developing Shirou/Rin into something more akin to their VN banter or showing Shirou's mindset and that he is not just some dumb shonen hero. I can see how you think that showing stuff about Illya was a waste of time but it wasn't entirely pointless .What would have happened if we didn't get any info at all ?We'd have a loli who didn't show up for more than half of the show getting killed in front of our eyes .Cheap feels whichactually work on people are probably better than a soulless death out of nowhere .Ufotable might have had that in mind . I don't really think Shirou was portrayed as a dumb shounen hero in the anime .At least ,I watched it first before the VN and I really enjoyed his interactions ,especially with Archer during Answer .Following the plot of UBW means that at certain points you're going to notice how people point out his odd nature .I don't think Shirou would be as well written a character if his behaviour wasn't at all noticeable . |
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TheDeadApostle said: I can see how you think that showing stuff about Illya was a waste of time but it wasn't entirely pointless .What would have happened if we didn't get any info at all ?We'd have a loli who didn't show up for more than half of the show getting killed in front of our eyes .Cheap feels whichactually work on people are probably better than a soulless death out of nowhere .Ufotable might have had that in mind . Well The thing is most of the flashback is incomprehensible anyway and most of the same feels could have been accomplished via Winter Forest scene and via showing how this is affecting Shirou(instead of what the show did). And suddenly we have a coherent uninterrupted fight, same amount of feels, no confusion and actual screentime to spend on things that sorely need it at this point. I don't really think Shirou was portrayed as a dumb shounen hero in the anime There are multiple scenes so far where his behavior was altered to be more passive. HIs entire relationship with Rin is changed at this point as none of the teasing and trolling he does towards her is there anymore(ex: there's no context for his lunch scene in the hallway and there are multiple scenes changed - as an example the scene where Shirou drags Rin away from causing a scene in the middle of school yard is changed to Rin doing that to his clueless self. Hell even all of his "Rin always gets herself into trouble" snark is removed. ). Instead of a dynamic relationship of two idiots snapping back and forth at each other and bickering and teasing each other, we have an abusive Asuka-clone towering over a wimpy clueless guy who does not even seem to be aware of her for most of the show. His fights are altered because without exposition and proper inner monologues his fights up till now look like outright asspulls. And then you have huge parts of his fights being cut(like in the church fight few episodes ago) or altered(like having him fucking trip while saving rin in that same fight instead of being a badass). Thousands of little things are altered to make him way less likeable, to the point that he ends up an entirely different character by now. Death by thousand papercuts. .At least ,I watched it first before the VN and I really enjoyed his interactions ,especially with Archer during Answer But that's the point - by the time of Answer you should already KNOW what Shirou stands for and what Archer stands for and how Shirou changed through the show. There's none of that in the anime. .Following the plot of UBW means that at certain points you're going to notice how people point out his odd nature .I don't think Shirou would be as well written a character if his behaviour wasn't at all noticeable . But all that people get is that "he is odd". THat much you could see from DEEN adaptation too. We see none of his ideals or his thinking or his UPSIDES. Only downsides and other people looking at him weird, which makes it very hard to sympathize or agree with him as a character - just look at the final episode of first cour and shitloads of people raging at him for "sacrificing Saber", when by that point one ought to already understand why he did what he did and actually even sympathize. I mean he is literally turned into Evangelion's Shinji - being "broken" is the only purpose his character has in ufoubw. There's none of his brilliance and NONE of his actual character progression to the point that by the end of ufoubw pretty much none of anime onlies actually got what the ending meant and instead just thought that . Yet show does not forget to always tell us how BRILLIANT and GENIUS Rin is(which is total opposite of her actual character and her progression, as its a facade) and have Shirou constantly praise her like she is second coming of jesus christ |
AhenshihaelApr 16, 2016 3:03 AM
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Fai said: TheDeadApostle said: I can see how you think that showing stuff about Illya was a waste of time but it wasn't entirely pointless .What would have happened if we didn't get any info at all ?We'd have a loli who didn't show up for more than half of the show getting killed in front of our eyes .Cheap feels whichactually work on people are probably better than a soulless death out of nowhere .Ufotable might have had that in mind . Well The thing is most of the flashback is incomprehensible anyway and most of the same feels could have been accomplished via Winter Forest scene and via showing how this is affecting Shirou(instead of what the show did). And suddenly we have a coherent uninterrupted fight, same amount of feels, no confusion and actual screentime to spend on things that sorely need it at this point. I don't really think Shirou was portrayed as a dumb shounen hero in the anime There are multiple scenes so far where his behavior was altered to be more passive. HIs entire relationship with Rin is changed at this point as none of the teasing and trolling he does towards her is there anymore(ex: there's no context for his lunch scene in the hallway and there are multiple scenes changed - as an example the scene where Shirou drags Rin away from causing a scene in the middle of school yard is changed to Rin doing that to his clueless self. Hell even all of his "Rin always gets herself into trouble" snark is removed. ). Instead of a dynamic relationship of two idiots snapping back and forth at each other and bickering and teasing each other, we have an abusive Asuka-clone towering over a wimpy clueless guy who does not even seem to be aware of her for most of the show. His fights are altered because without exposition and proper inner monologues his fights up till now look like outright asspulls. And then you have huge parts of his fights being cut(like in the church fight few episodes ago) or altered(like having him fucking trip while saving rin in that same fight instead of being a badass). Thousands of little things are altered to make him way less likeable, to the point that he ends up an entirely different character by now. Death by thousand papercuts. .At least ,I watched it first before the VN and I really enjoyed his interactions ,especially with Archer during Answer But that's the point - by the time of Answer you should already KNOW what Shirou stands for and what Archer stands for and how Shirou changed through the show. There's none of that in the anime. .Following the plot of UBW means that at certain points you're going to notice how people point out his odd nature .I don't think Shirou would be as well written a character if his behaviour wasn't at all noticeable . But all that people get is that "he is odd". THat much you could see from DEEN adaptation too. We see none of his ideals or his thinking or his UPSIDES. Only downsides and other people looking at him weird, which makes it very hard to sympathize or agree with him as a character - just look at the final episode of first cour and shitloads of people raging at him for "sacrificing Saber", when by that point one ought to already understand why he did what he did and actually even sympathize. I mean he is literally turned into Evangelion's Shinji - being "broken" is the only purpose his character has in ufoubw. There's none of his brilliance and NONE of his actual character progression to the point that by the end of ufoubw pretty much none of anime onlies actually got what the ending meant and instead just thought that . Yet show does not forget to always tell us how BRILLIANT and GENIUS Rin is(which is total opposite of her actual character and her progression, as its a facade) In all honesty ,I can't argue with you .Your view of things is a bit more cynical than some other people I've talked with but you're giving some neat points .Still I find it hard to see it's worth reduced in my eyes . I mean ,I watched the anime first and grabbed the theme .I liked Shirou and his character development .I suppose the VN does things better but I don't think that really matters to me .I got a great experience from the show to the point where I actually liked aspects of it more than Fate Zero .Shirou/Archer being one of them .In particular "Answer" felt like a 14/10 moment even though the majority of the series didn't stand up to that .So really it feels like you're judging UBW according to how "well" it was adapted and not how "good" of an anime it was .The VN might be miles better but I think the anime was pretty neat .It sent out the same message as the VN route (albeit with less details) so it might as well be counted as fulfilling it's purpose .That's how I feel anyways .I might be seen as lax . It's not like I don't understand where you're coming from though .Now that I've read HF ,if I imagine an adaptation with almost no monologues and such ,I can't help but find the quality slightly/reasonably questionable .I suppose that comes from having experience with a more detailed version before viewing one that's watered down due to media differences . I actually have a link on the interview booklet which came with the BD .Maybe it'll appease you anger ?It explains some of Nasu's decision-making . http://pastebin.com/8zPfKaNd |
OduduwaApr 16, 2016 3:31 AM
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| Man that really made me upset. RIP Illya! |
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| Not as amazing as Round 1, but still good. ;) I knew it was coming, but I cry every time. |
| If you see that my post is exactly 1 month old (or more) from when it was posted... Don't waste your time, especially when you want to reply with something petty & insignificant. Assume that I've moved on (because I have). |
Rob19MAL said: Not as amazing as Round 1, but still good. ;) I knew it was coming, but I cry every time. Except that "round 1" was literally nowhere near this in terms of power levels. |
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Fai said: Except that "round 1" was literally nowhere near this in terms of power levels. Except that what you're saying is literally irrelevant to me. lol |
| If you see that my post is exactly 1 month old (or more) from when it was posted... Don't waste your time, especially when you want to reply with something petty & insignificant. Assume that I've moved on (because I have). |
| Never understood why people said they were disappointed by the fight and that Berserker should have put up a better fight. Guys, nobody else lasted more then 2 minutes VS Gil, and Berserker went on for a full episodes, and broke Enkidu. He BROKE Enkidu. Nobody else did that. This was by far the closest fight Gill has. |
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| Yes this is the dark side of Fate series that I enjoyed, the brutal death and victor. Only the strong survive and the weak lose. Gilgamesh is fucking scary as fuck. |
 Behold of my awesomeness~ controversial and/or sensitive topics likely devolve into the same repetitive, derogatory, abusive, and harassing comments can no longer be posted. But my feels. |
| 1 minute of fight 15 minutes of flashback 2 minutes fight 4 minutes for goodbye For now, more disappointment, than joy in this series!!! |
| Well, that was quite intensive episode. Gilgamesh is a bastard... |
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| Not cool Gilgamesh, you can't go killing little girls just like that not cool bro |
| Did Gilgamesh just stab a loli? Da fuck man. Also that fight was way too easy for him, not really enjoyable seeing Berserker getting owned over and over again. |
| What a bastard Gilgamesh is. Killing of little girls is not cool man. Rip Illya :( |
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| Illyasviel! Just as we get some background on her, she dies instantly. Man Gilgamesh gave no fuck. Even cut her eyes off, before killing her. The way she screamed in agony and Shirou being held off by Rin was wow! Man so intense! Can't wait for the next one! |
| Holy shit that's brutal. |
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| Wow, what the fuck. Poor Illya. Lost Kiritsugu and Irisviel, then was manipulated into thinking Kiritsugu was made. Had nuerous tests performed on her, got attacked by wolves, loses Berserker, and then is cut down by Gilgamesh. Brutal. Great episode, but damn. Shirou screaming into Rin's hand was well animated too |
| It was so sad watching Illya die alone after everything she's been through. Gilgamesh should just die already, it's been too long. Also, Shirou is annoying, I just think I should mention that. |
| Wow. Just wow. This is already extremely different from OG stay night, for the better. Killing off Ilya and berserker was such a ballsy move, and it was done oh so well. I'm very sad now and that's a good thing |
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| Poor Illya, what a horrific way to die. This really tugged at my heartstrings, especially because I have already seen Fate/Zero and I hate how she was left all alone. Great episode though. I find Shirou's intervention rather dumb though, considering how OP Gilgamesh is and that Illya had already died when he started yelling. He should have acted smartly like Rin. |
| Poor Ilya she was abandoned by her family and went through all that and in the end, she was killed by that jerk I want him to die. |
| Yes it's dark Illya, it's really dark. |
| Well shit.. Here I thought it would just be another backstory type EP. It was more than that. Much, much more #RIPIlya |
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| This... this right here is why I hated this version of Gilgadick... heck, because of this I hated him in general. He could've just easily snapped his fingers and its over for her... quick and painless but no, he just had to make her suffer like that. I hope they dont show that scene... it was horrible in the VN and I don't want to see it again... but seeing as she's already dead... maybe it wont hurt as much... I hope. Funking Gilgadick... still my 3rd most hated character in the fate series. |
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| Gilgadouche makes an excellent villain. Those lolimunculous feels though :( |
| was an episode where smoll Illya suffers non stop really necessary? Im sad now |
| "This emotion is mine alone. It is for Madoka alone." - Homura or how I would descripe Mahou Shoujo Madoka Magica. |
| What is the point of creating such an absurdly strong villian like Gilgamesh? I just feel like this is a waste of potentials between Shirou and Illya's interaction. Damn, watching Fate/Zero first really ruins my UBW's experience. Everything in UBW is inferior in many ways lmao. |
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| Just what kind of child calling his father by his name ? lol. So, Illya assume the reason Heracles protected her from the wolves WITHOUT FIGHTING BACK was he didn't want to make Illya suffer, lol. I don't understand how her brain works really. She's a Homunculus though, that's why I guess. Meh, if only Illya wasn't there Heracles might have a chance. She didn't even do anything to support Heracles, like doing that bird magic when she fight Rin. Gotta say that this is darker than FSN 2006. |
| He who smiles in a crisis has found someone to blame. |
| shitty episode with dumb filler Kish0 said: So, Illya assume the reason Berserker protected her from the wolves WITHOUT FIGHTING BACK was he didn't want to make Illya suffer, lol. I don't understand how her brain works really. She's a Homunculus though, that's why I guess. berserker's movement was causing illya to suffer when she first tried to control him, that's what she meant berserker didn't want to hurt her by moving and taking down the wolves Kish0 said: Meh, if only Illya wasn't there Berserker might have a chance. She didn't even do anything to support Berserker, like doing that bird magic when she fight Rin. it's useless against the blonde guy |
Shayon said: shitty episode with dumb filler Kish0 said: Meh, if only Illya wasn't there Berserker might have a chance. She didn't even do anything to support Berserker, like doing that bird magic when she fight Rin. it's useless against the blonde guy Yeah, but I expect her to at least do something, otherwise she's just gonna be a burden. |
| He who smiles in a crisis has found someone to blame. |
| Wow, that was brutal. Poor Illya. She didn't deserve this. |
| All weebs creatures of the galaxy, hear this message. Those of you who listen will not be struck by western animation. You will no longer know hunger, nor pain. Your Anime have come to lead you now. Our strength shall serve as a luminous sun toward which all intelligence may blossom. And the impervious shelter beneath which you will prosper. However, for those who refuse our offer and cling to their western animation ways… For you, there will be great wrath. |
| Damn who is the blond bastard... with two servants out of picture rider and berserker... while three/ four linked together spear, archor, caster and assassin... I don't know who is lancer fighting against |
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| Crap Berserker died. Hope that Illya isn't dead yet tho |
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| This episode was unexpectedly quite sad. Poor girl. Best ED version though. |
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| Illya's flashback scene is good addition that was missing in the VN, but really though this would have look better if it was done on Fate route or HF instead. Illya in UBW was nonexistent and her death is laughable too, so I can understand some people won't feel about her. |
| Welp, i guess i just really fucking hate Gil now. What he did to Illya was just unforgivable; he could have just offed her in a second, no need to drag it out. Also, the way he beat Berserker was very frustrating, cheap and cowardly. Didn't even have the balls to fight him mano a mano; just stood there spamming him with projectile NPs from a safe distance, the pussy. Saber's more of a man than he is. osumatthew said: This is why I'm happy to have watched Fate/Stay Night first before going into Unlimited Bladeworks, and why I think that anyone getting into this franchise and not familiar with the original VNs should doo likewise. Sure, Stay Night might have been far from a faithful adaptation, from what I've heard, and there was plenty about it that even I, as a newcomer to the franchise, didn't care for. But, watching it before UBW gave me more context on the characters and the story. Getting to see Illya in that story first made this episode legitimately heartbreaking because I already knew her potential as a (relatively) normal child once freed from the concerns of the Grail War. Agreed 100%. Deen/SN is really not as bad as people make it out to be, and at the very least it does a decent job as an introduction to the basics of the Fate universe for those not willing to sit through the VN. UBW by itself just doesn't work as an introduction and neither does Zero, despite most people often recommending newcomers to skip Deen/SN and start with either of those. |
Stygian_PrisonerJun 6, 2020 10:07 PM
| Bro, Gilgamesh so fucking sadic with that kill... |
| ''Ask not the Sparrow, how the Eagle soars'' - Kiryūin Satsuki |
| Shirou is such a fool. He deadass shows himself and tells gilgamesh to stop after he already killed them. This isn't brave, it's just reckless and dumb. |
dusty22 said: Shirou is such a fool. He deadass shows himself and tells gilgamesh to stop after he already killed them. This isn't brave, it's just reckless and dumb. If you consider that shirou suffers from psychological problems (due to his his traumatic past), it's a pretty fitting reaction. His decisions are often irrational, which leads to an realistic portrayal of his survivors guilt, ptsd and martyr complex. After being the only survivor of the big fire, he felt guilty because of it. He saw many people die and every attempt to help was meaningless. In result: he doesn't have any self worth and started to feel empty. However, after seeing kiritsugu's smile it was a big change in this mind. Shirou started to idolize him and wanted to feel the same way like he did. In result: he tries to compensate his own emptiness with kiritsugu's ideals. Before shirou got an character development, his vision of a "hero of justice" is very idealistic and distorted at the same time. He just wants to save everyone.. No matter what! Even if he will die during the process. After seeing illya brutally killed, it reminds him about all the dead people of his past. Shirou doesn't wanna accept her death and is blaming himself for it (survivors gilt). You can even see his empty and obsessed eyes, during the conversation with Rin afterwards. It's basically a psychopathic trait of his personality. |
TypeMercury94Nov 22, 2020 1:39 AM
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| As if I didn’t hate that blond dickhead enough already, well at least now I know the creators purposely are going to make the viewers hate him so I’m prepared for anything this guy does from now on. |
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| R.I.P Illya and Berserker they really died like that... |
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