| Just as other people have said, it's the radicals that are the root of the problem. It's not just Islam, either; in a way it holds true for every religion. The far right-wing Pentecostals and similar denominations are what a lot of people think of when Christianity gets brought up, for instance. But obviously if your radicals are killing people in the name of God on a regular basis the general public is going to be more afraid than they would normally, and when people are afraid feelings of hate are more overpowering than normal. |
| When vahabits and their poisonous influence will be exterminated |
Trance- said: That's not an objective basis, lol. Neither is the proposed word of Allah. I was speaking theoretically. Don't bring in what Muslims are doing. The discussion is about Islam - the ideology. Not the ideologues. We do not live in a theoretical world. The subject of the thread is Islamaphobia. The name is very misleading because it supposed to mean a fear or hatred of Muslims not a fear or hatred of Islam. So it is quite relevant as to what actual followers do. Babies aren't considered Muslim. They're just considered subscribers of monotheism - Tawhid, precisely. That's a flawed argument. Islam means submit to God. Babies are full submission. I never really got the logic some people have with that but still it is what some believe. So if you say it is a flawed argument you are saying the concept of Islam being submission to Allah being a flawed argument. Although of course I am aware there re different standards for children though. What rationalization in the past? I'm not sure what you do not understand here. When you said "Apostasy is punishable by death simply because the time around which Islam came, nations had theological boundaries; and to leave one's religion was tantamount to committing treachery. " You were talking about the past almost as if you were saying this justifies it in this day and age or at least back then. Perhaps I misunderstood your intent. Unless you're committing crimes, no. If sex is the issue, get married. Why should you be forced into commitment when the goal isnt to make a baby? If drinking is the issue, leave the country. Eh that is only if there is no alcohol supply. I'm not sure if someone is punished for drinking in any way but if they were it would apply no matter where they are as long as there are other Muslims there who are against it. I'd sure feel sorry for you that you weren't compatible with the place you were born in but that's no reason for you to cause turmoil in your society. You have made no explanation of support of how not conforming to a society causing it turmoil. It was flogging. Numbered flogging. What if someone is a masochist and sexually enjoys being flogged? Wouldn't the flogger be guilty of something? |
| Easy. When people stop believing what is fed to them by the western media , and when they stop claiming they know the quran when they actually know nothing , Just take a verse google translate it and they think they know it all . It's disgusting seeing them judge the muslim population by the acts of a group who claim they're muslims. We've reached a point were "why did an earthquake happen ? Oh blame it on the muslim " lol |
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| Islam is not only a religion but also a political system. A doctrine and political system that condones violence, war and bigotry is not something to be proud of. Am I a Christianophobe if I criticize Christianity or a Hinduphobe when I criticize Hinduism? If not, then why the special treatment for Islam. Especially, when there is good reason behind the said criticism. Tolerance of intolerance is not a good thing. People should be able to criticize ideas and ideologies. |
Something witty that makes you think I'm funny Defeating a sandwich only makes it tastier |
| islam is not compatible with modern society, they should go back to their mud huts if theyre not happy, enjoy the hell that only their shitty religion can create like in every place its implemented and leave the civilized world alone, live happy as a primitive islam monkey and leave us civilized people be, we surely woudnt mind :P |
SakuraokaMay 2, 2016 5:27 AM
MidnightKYS said: Allahu akbarrrrrr!!!!!!!!! You got scared just now didn't you? No. The answer is no. Not really, In Arabic it means "God is greater(Than everything)" or simply "God is great". So that doesn't give me the goosebumps you guys get because of ignorance. |
| People just need to stop generalizing all the time. They need to analyze the person in question as a human being before grabbing their pitchforks.. As for when Islamophobia will die down? When they stop bending the states laws (or in other words, compromising them) just so fulfill their religious requirements. Society > Your religion.. |
| I can't being an Islamophobic person since I live in Indonesia. And it will die if radicalism die. |
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| Well considering the politician who coined that term(Islamaphobia) apologized for it and saw that people were correct in criticizing Muslim immigration due to their reclusive and nomadic nature, I'd say it's already a word without a valid cause or meaning. It's just a hot word that liberals like to use to make people feel guilty for not trusting a certain set of individuals, who in all honesty, are not very deserving of it. Religion is religion, it teaches an array of different values and morals that guide one through life. Islam just happens to be the more violent religion of our time. It's not like you can say that it was never Christianity or Judaism. It'll come to pass as all things do. |
| I am on the edge ! The edge of the edgiest edge ever edged by edgekind ! я умерте ужасну депрессии... |
| Considering the Quran is filled to the brim with verses against women, gays and members of other religions it sounds justified to me. I wouldn't hurt an individual Muslim unless they were a criminal. But the system of ideas called Islam is a failure. |
| WEAPONS - My blog, for reviews of music, anime, books, and other things |
Epistemophilic said: What do you see from Muhammads character then? Only the good bits about protecting trees and not killing people who surrender? As for reliable hadiths Muslims should have sorted this by now, since they've supposedly got the most secure unchanged Quran. Masked_Mantis said: It's in the most prized biography of Muhammad's life, from Ibn Ishaq. They even have Kenana's wife named who was of course married to Muhammad once Kenana was killed. Muhammad killed lots of people, so you'll have to pick parts of his character, like people pick the hadiths. And there is now due to Sikhs defending Hindus from forced conversions, what matters is how Islam is today. It's become worse and worse, and people have been ignoring "no compulsion" over and over. I could explain it all to you, but it's not worth the trouble, search it for yourself on a website that isn't obviously biased. Don't you find it odd though, some hadith showing Muhammad with a merciful character, and some hadith claiming that he committed acts such as this? It doesn't make sense. Remember that the hadith were collected 200 years after his death, and not all of them can be relied upon. Some have been changed in the details, while others have been completely fabricated. It makes sense when you consider that hadith which contradict the teachings of Islam or the character of the prophet are false. Ibn Ishaq hasn't provided an isnad or matn, so this hadith isn't reliable. A Quran which supports pulling down the pants of surrendering Jews, checking their pubes and killing them if they reached puberty, taking children and women as slaves. And yes I've read the commentary from the Quran that states Muhammad asked what to do with the slaves and they eventually settled on kiling the surrenderd slaves in order to completley subdue the Quraish and strike fear into them. So that's an Islamic teaching, a relaible one. Before all that he's noted for killing poets and people criticising him, so whatever character you're seeing from him is skewed. |
Dick_DawkinsMay 2, 2016 9:59 AM
Trance said: I'm a guy and I can imagine buttfucking another guy. I don't find the thought repulsive, and I can even imagine kissing another man. |
You said: I can't being an Islamophobic person since I live in Indonesia. And it will die if radicalism die. What do you mean? Dosen't makes sense. |
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RobinVPersie said: You said: I can't being an Islamophobic person since I live in Indonesia. And it will die if radicalism die. What do you mean? Dosen't makes sense. means being islamophobic in indonesia will get him a beheading ticket at liveleak |
RobinVPersie said: You said: I can't being an Islamophobic person since I live in Indonesia. And it will die if radicalism die. What do you mean? Dosen't makes sense. Indonesia is the biggest muslim country by population, how can I hate the majority? I'll get screwed if I do. Islamophobia will die when something like ISIS or other organizations like that doesn't exist anymore. |
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| Islamophobia is caused by actions of minority groups that commit atrocious acts of hate. As long as these groups remain at large there will be a fear and hate for that religion. P.S I do not believe that all muslims are bad and believe these acts are fine or just. It is the actions of the few that are louder than the voices of many. I have many muslim friends that are great people that would never think of doing these things. |
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| until they get the stick out of their ass, I will say probably not. "Mainstream" christianity has been diluted a fair bit, and isn't as harmful as it used to be centuries ago, nowadays the "extremists" practically consist of people trying to get trans people out of bathrooms and saying gays belong in hell. extremist muslims think its ok for non believing women to be raped, kill whoever they want, and overall have no regard for human life which makes them way worse than modern western christianity. but i criticize islam for its ideals and what it stands for, there is no way a religion can be protected by the racism card or whatever tumblr crap people may pull, but I do not in any way support ignorant racism which I do see a fair bit, such as people making comments about something involving towels or making jokes that the brown guy or the guy with the "muslim sounding name" is gonna blow us all up, it's ignorant as hell, and people like that are part of the reason SJWs protect Islam in the first place, because they assume everyone who doesn't like Islam is a post 9/11 "kill all muslims" american racist super-patriot. I don't know if I got my views off correctly. I am an ignorant plebian anyway. I really wish I was alive in the year 999,999 I bet we'd have moved past such tribalistic superstitions by then, and religion is pushed to more of a non-deistic spiritual philosophy |
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| There'll always be that bunch of idiots who will encourage racism and islamophobia. People are so scared but yet careless of all this terror happening in the world that they feel the need to blame it on anyone who never wished for this to happen, they feel the need to be ignorant so it would look like they are protecting something. It's sad. |
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TheBrainintheJar said: Considering the Quran is filled to the brim with verses against women, gays and members of other religions it sounds justified to me. I wouldn't hurt an individual Muslim unless they were a criminal. But the system of ideas called Islam is a failure. I second this. Also, let's say you have a pack of 100 MM's. 15 of them are poisoned. Now are you going to take chance and eat one? Only 15% will kill you. That's how it is with islam now. And the hate won't stop as long as "normal" muslims will avert their eyes from radical muslims doing whatever they want. |
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| As long as you don't push your beliefs on me...I'm cool with believing in the flying spaghetti monster. |
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That's exactly the point I'm making here, boy. We do not live in a theoretical world. The subject of the thread is Islamaphobia. The name is very misleading because it supposed to mean a fear or hatred of Muslims not a fear or hatred of Islam. So it is quite relevant as to what actual followers do. Then call it Muslimphobia. In which case, Islam would be quite irrelevant. Islam means submit to God. Babies are full submission. I never really got the logic some people have with that but still it is what some believe. So if you say it is a flawed argument you are saying the concept of Islam being submission to Allah being a flawed argument. Although of course I am aware there re different standards for children though. The verse is about 'fitrah' which means nature (Surah al Rum 30:30). The nature of every man, as Islam states, is that he submits to one God. Islam may mean 'to submit peacefully'. But does Islam say that before Islam came, babies were born 'Christian'? No. Babies are born on fitrah. Not Islam. Islam is the body that accentuates that fitrah. I'm not sure what you do not understand here. When you said "Apostasy is punishable by death simply because the time around which Islam came, nations had theological boundaries; and to leave one's religion was tantamount to committing treachery. " You were talking about the past almost as if you were saying this justifies it in this day and age or at least back then. Perhaps I misunderstood your intent. "Justify'' - that's the worst word you can use in an argument regarding morals. Why should you be forced into commitment when the goal isnt to make a baby? Because you're in a Muslim country. If you want sex, whether for recreation or procreation, do it the Muslim way. Get married. Don't disturb the social fabric. This kind of thinking that you have was exactly the problem with Europeans. When Muslim came to their lands, they let them have their way. Now they regret that. Islam only saves Muslims from that regret. No one told you to accept Muslims with all their demands. And even if someone did, you had no responsibility whatsoever to accept. Eh that is only if there is no alcohol supply. I'm not sure if someone is punished for drinking in any way but if they were it would apply no matter where they are as long as there are other Muslims there who are against it. No. The punishments apply only to a state governed by an Islamic government. An individual Muslim doesn't have the right to pass punishments. Otherwise, the country would be anarchic, not Islamic. You have made no explanation of support of how not conforming to a society causing it turmoil. Look at Europe. Muslims aren't conforming. See the problems they're causing. This is how societies function. What if someone is a masochist and sexually enjoys being flogged? Wouldn't the flogger be guilty of something? That argument applies to any ideology not just Islam. A masochist will enjoy his jail time in America just as he would enjoy getting flogged in Saudi Arabia. Irrelevant argument. Masochism is an abnormality. Abnormalities are outliers. You don't consider them in an argument unless the argument is specifically about them. |
RobinVPersie said: The amount of hate Islam recieves is unbelievable. Unbelievable op really? perhaps when nations run under such laws stop stoning and mutilating women for asking for some equality. When a Muslim man isn't murdered for wishing Christians happy easter, when the majority of all terrorist attacks killing thousands all the time in the world isn't done in the name of said religion can we say the hate it receives is "unbelievable" seems pretty believable to me. |
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| It will end after the terrorists are gone, you can't except people to have good opinion about them these days. |
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Barnald said: TheBrainintheJar said: Considering the Quran is filled to the brim with verses against women, gays and members of other religions it sounds justified to me. I wouldn't hurt an individual Muslim unless they were a criminal. But the system of ideas called Islam is a failure. I second this. Also, let's say you have a pack of 100 MM's. 15 of them are poisoned. Now are you going to take chance and eat one? Only 15% will kill you. That's how it is with islam now. And the hate won't stop as long as "normal" muslims will avert their eyes from radical muslims doing whatever they want. I don't like this analogy. It's too simplified. Islam is a system of ideas that contains a lot of hateful ones, but it's not just bigotry. I'd rather judge a Muslim based on their individual thoughts and actions. |
| WEAPONS - My blog, for reviews of music, anime, books, and other things |
| I hope so. Right now with ISIS the refugee crisis it's worse than ever. I have never seen so much hate on the internet towards muslims. I think (or hope) that people aren't as narrow minded as they seem to be at the moment. And that they act this way because they are scared and don't know how to cope. There's evil people in ever religious group (and every non-religious group too) and you can't define people by religious belief alone. I myself believe that religion is a source used for oppression and control, and I don't believe in God. But i have enough respect for other human beings not to judge them based on belief. Your actions define you, nothing else. Chances are that if you were born in a muslim country you would have that belief. So stop the fucking hate! |
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| Hopefully not, we already have enough traitors in our government letting all the fuckers in we dont need everyone letting the savages into our society. |
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| Nope as long as radicals exist. People don't care enough to learn everything about what Islam truly teaches, they get their information from what the media portrays and shares, and the media focuses on either controversy or its biased political/societal verdicts which most people inhabit due to it being popular or Representative of their irrational fears or ideas. You might as well get used cause it'll stay that way for a while. |
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| Islamophobia will go if both RADICALS and BIGOTS die out. Because RADICALS begot BIGOTS; BIGOTS begot RADICALS Both don't do anything helpful instead cause more problem. They're a troll to both sides. |
#CHEXIT |
| I struggle to reconcile the cognitive dissonance in people who ask these kinds of questions. "Why do people hate Islam so much" the answer: Why does Islam make people hate it so much. >Islam When you want to party like it's 0399 and stone people to death publicly. |
 Vor uns liegt MAL, in uns marschiert MAL, und hinter uns, kommt MAL! |
| Will the ever increasing fear of the communists and their evil empire go away wait.... |
| "I like young-girl sexual creations, Lolicon is just one hobby of my many hobbies," he says. I ask what his wife, standing nearby, thinks of his "hobby". "She probably thinks no problem," he replies. "Because she loves young boys sexually interacting with each other." |
RobinVPersie said: The amount of hate Islam recieves is unbelievable. Rightly so. You might as well ask if murderphobia will ever go. |
| The Islamophobia pretty much brings faith back into humanity that most people are still relatively rational. Expecting your ideology to be respected and loved when it justifies violence against any dissenters. When it kills people just for being gay. When it treats women like property with no agency. When the vast majority of islamic countries are complete war-torn, dictator-filled shitholes where you might get stoned or beheaded for the most trivial of things. When they leave their shitholes for the west, inevitably outbreed the native cultures and start enforcing their beliefs on Europeans. When they are protected by the politically correct media right across the west for the most heinous things, simply for fear of being considered racist. Deep in the back of peoples' minds we all know. Not all cultures are equal and the reality of common sense is crushing that ideal into little pieces. |
| Most of you people who say "they don't know real Islam" or crap like that have never even picked up the book yourself. Find the book and read it, because until you do so to determine whether people who say it is a violent religion are nothing but bigots all you are doing is talking out of your ass. It is so violent that Muslims have to try and justify it with asinine arguments or condone these actions as something that was "only done then!" as if it makes it okay. Just look through this thread and you will see examples of just that. Oh, and "hating" the religion does not = hating Muslims. It is beyond retarded to even suggest it. DragonSlayer_19 said: Easy. When people stop believing what is fed to them by the western media , and when they stop claiming they know the quran when they actually know nothing , Just take a verse google translate it and they think they know it all . It's disgusting seeing them judge the muslim population by the acts of a group who claim they're muslims. We've reached a point were "why did an earthquake happen ? Oh blame it on the muslim " lol Media didn't force anything onto anyone. In fact, western media largely makes it a point to defend "true Islam" as being a "religion of peace" and that, somehow, terrorists are practicing an entirely different religion. People are so afraid to speak about the horrible shit in the religion they can't say anything about it lest get threatened or called a "bigot" or even more hilarious than that a "racist" as if Muslims are a race, but yet anyone can call all Christians homophobic pieces of shit or Jews this and that or whatnot. A bias exists and it is in favor of Islam and Muslims, this much is clearly evident. But go ahead, prove "bigots" wrong. Pick up a Qu'ran from a Mosque with English translations within done by largely accepted Muslim "scholars" and you will see the same horrible things and if you don't, post pictures of some of the pages where the violent parts are "supposedly" mistranslated to prove the world wrong. Or you can just go to an accepted Qu'ran website that provides Arabic and English translations and you will read the same exact crap post here, on "anti-Islam" sites or more. The only difference is that Muslims argue the context in which this violent or hateful shit happens, not that the translations are wrong. For evidence of such, look up websites that defend or attack it or look through this very thread for it. You get many examples of it here alone. RobinVPersie said: You said: I can't being an Islamophobic person since I live in Indonesia. And it will die if radicalism die. What do you mean? Dosen't makes sense. He means he will be violently murdered if he says anything or opposes it. |
 "Let the Dragon ride again on the winds of time." |
| Given today's world, the fear and hatred is not surprising. The problem is that blaming Islam is shortsighted. The true culprit is power politics. Behind every single religious crusade has been a greater political agenda, there is not a single one recorded in history that has been done exclusively for the sake of their god. Power politics was even able to transform something as harmless as Shintoism and turn it into a nationalist war tool for brainwashing Japanese into worshiping the emperor during WWII. People always say the suicide bombers are doing it to go meet their 72 virgins, but the main reason they do it is because their family receives compensation for their sacrifice. So in some ways Trump has the right idea. If we put a target on the family and say "if you blow yourself up, we will blow your sister's brains out", they won't be as keen to go do it anymore. |
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| No because everything is feared by someone |
| Not as long as people who blow everything up in the name of allah still exist |
It is? I'm not sure how you're getting that across. The line between subjective and objective is a little more blurry than people think but still you get what I meant anyway. Then call it Muslimphobia. In which case, Islam would be quite irrelevant. I didn't invent the term Islamaphobia. It was created in this use by the Muslim Brotherhood. http://theamericanmuslim.org/tam.php/features/articles/islamophobia-muslim-brotherhood/0019253 The verse is about 'fitrah' which means nature (Surah al Rum 30:30). The nature of every man, as Islam states, is that he submits to one God. Islam may mean 'to submit peacefully'. But does Islam say that before Islam came, babies were born 'Christian'? No. Babies are born on fitrah. Not Islam. Islam is the body that accentuates that fitrah. Then where do people get that belief that babies are born Muslim from? It doesnt come from no where. "Justify'' - that's the worst word you can use in an argument regarding morals. Why? If you are excusing violence against people who have harmed no one it's an attempted justification. Why should you be forced into commitment when the goal isnt to make a baby? Because you're in a Muslim country. If you want sex, whether for recreation or procreation, do it the Muslim way. Get married. Don't disturb the social fabric. This kind of thinking that you have was exactly the problem with Europeans. When Muslim came to their lands, they let them have their way. Now they regret that. Islam only saves Muslims from that regret. No one told you to accept Muslims with all their demands. And even if someone did, you had no responsibility whatsoever to accept. But attempted punishment happens in non Muslim countries by Muslims too. An underdeveloped society is does not have much social fabric to destroy. I am not saying things have to change drastically right away because that would cause problems but being unable to change leaves a society stagnant and poisonous to itself. Eh that is only if there is no alcohol supply. I'm not sure if someone is punished for drinking in any way but if they were it would apply no matter where they are as long as there are other Muslims there who are against it. No. The punishments apply only to a state governed by an Islamic government. An individual Muslim doesn't have the right to pass punishments. Otherwise, the country would be anarchic, not Islamic. They do try to pass punishment sometimes though. Although I dont think much often for drinking though. You have made no explanation of support of how not conforming to a society causing it turmoil. Look at Europe. Muslims aren't conforming. See the problems they're causing. This is how societies function. There is such a thing as incompatible cultures but you're not really explaining how someone being gay or drinking or having sex somehow destroys the middle east. Im talking about moderate level stuff with an individual not like rampant excess. What if someone is a masochist and sexually enjoys being flogged? Wouldn't the flogger be guilty of something? That argument applies to any ideology not just Islam. A masochist will enjoy his jail time in America just as he would enjoy getting flogged in Saudi Arabia. Irrelevant argument. Masochism is an abnormality. Abnormalities are outliers. You don't consider them in an argument unless the argument is specifically about them. Well not really. Some masochists like being in cages but it has to be in a sexual context for their enjoyment. Its not really meant to be part of the same argument. |
traed said: It is? I'm not sure how you're getting that across. The line between subjective and objective is a little more blurry than people think but still you get what I meant anyway. The line between subjective and objective could not be more clearly defined. Sure if majority agrees on one thing then that would be called objective (such as, the existence of the sun) but that wouldn't make it objective in essence or virtue; that only makes it objective in its treatment by us. I didn't invent the term Islamaphobia. It was created in this use by the Muslim Brotherhood. http://theamericanmuslim.org/tam.php/features/articles/islamophobia-muslim-brotherhood/0019253 Ok he did. But you said that you mean this term as in 'an aversion to Muslims' and not Islam. I'm debating with you here, not that guy. You have a meaning of the term which doesn't agree with the term so instead of changing the meaning, I proposed that you might as well change the 'term'. Get it to Muslimphobia and it fits your meaning. And mine. Then where do people get that belief that babies are born Muslim from? It doesnt come from no where. Where do people get all their misconceptions? Many factors: -Lack of knowledge. -Not intelligent enough to understand something. -Conflating one concept with another. And many more. Any one factor can be a relevant answer to your question. Why? If you are excusing violence against people who have harmed no one it's an attempted justification. Ok, I'll give it to you straight now so you don't poke around with morality any further. There are only 3 possibilities/cases here: 1. My God is the truth: In which case, you'll be wrong by all definitions of wrong. Since God will be the one defining 'right' and 'wrong', not you, nor I. But since I subscribe to the definition provided by the truth, I will be correct. 2. No God is the truth: In which case, your stance of atheism might be correct, but your stance on morality will devolve in moral relativism; since there will be no truth, there can be no objective morality whatsoever. And hence, neither you nor I will be correct. Think of it in this way: There are only 2 people in a world; person A sees everything in black and white, person B sees everything in color; both try to convince each other that their own vision is correct but will they ever go anywhere? Those two people will be like us if case no.2 is the truth. 3. Some other God is the truth: In which case, neither you nor I are correct. So Huzzah? So, basing your argument upon morality is stupid in all cases. For you only. For me, it won't be stupid if case no.1 actually turns out to be the truth. "B-bu-but deism!" Deistic God is an irrelevant God. He doesn't constitute morality. He simply exists. So his case will belong to case no.2. But attempted punishment happens in non Muslim countries by Muslims too. An underdeveloped society is does not have much social fabric to destroy. I am not saying things have to change drastically right away because that would cause problems but being unable to change leaves a society stagnant and poisonous to itself. So you're saying that there's an imaginary cloud in the air with Islam written on it out of which infinite strings are protruding which are controlling Muslims worldwide? that every action a Muslim does is according to the creed or will of Islam? I see a lot of atheist mowing their lawn. Is mowing your learn a part of atheism? Well, don't say atheism is not a religion - I know that. But it nonetheless is an ideology. And since you're creating imaginary connections, so can I. They do try to pass punishment sometimes though. Although I dont think much often for drinking though. What can you or I do about that then? It's like two aunties sitting in the street backbiting a certain auntie that lives around the corner: "Have you seen her drying her clothes? how uncanny she looks'' ''Why yes, she does!'' There is such a thing as incompatible cultures but you're not really explaining how someone being gay or drinking or having sex somehow destroys the middle east. Im talking about moderate level stuff with an individual not like rampant excess. Exclude Middle East. We're talking about a theoretical Islamic State. And since that state is based on the moral code provided by Islam, screwing up with that moral code is screwing up with the basis of that society. Now if you want an empirical explanation of how exactly a gay having sex destroys the building next door, I'll have you refer to case no.1. Social fabric of a society is decided by the society. If that's the kind of thinking you have there, then I propose this: A Muslims comes to a European country; demands that premarital sex be banned; now considering that banning premarital sex bears no harm (just as not banning it doesn't bear any harm), should you ban that? Well not really. Some masochists like being in cages but it has to be in a sexual context for their enjoyment. Its not really meant to be part of the same argument. Rapes happen in jail. They'll definitely enjoy the jail environment. |
| Catholics still get shit for their pedophile priests, and Jewish still get shit for their ancient practice of Usury (which is what all banks do nowadays). So no. It will never go away. |
| Be thankful for the wisdom granted to you. |
| i think people must stop making such threads ....... anything related to religion |
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| maybe you could put it in a positive way by giving example of where people get along even tho they are of different religion... :) just my opinion ^^ i see people arguing endlessly about religion these days :( |
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RobinVPersie said: Wow, i regret making this thread... You're on the internet here, expecting the average person to just ignore what's blatantly obvious and be like 'Radicals are just perverting a beautiful religion!' is retarded, MAL may be full of sad shits, but not stupid shits. |
| Islamophobia is just another "Phase" in earth. we all get these phases in history due to extremists: Holocoast , the KKK, President Bush , ISIS etc~ a new group will eventually be the formed in the future where ppl will hate on them and the innocent ppl who will get blamed as well and ISIS will just be a history that kids will have to study about. it's a cycle of life that just wont end sadly, human nature. |
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Trance- said: The line between subjective and objective could not be more clearly defined. Sure if majority agrees on one thing then that would be called objective (such as, the existence of the sun) but that wouldn't make it objective in essence or virtue; that only makes it objective in its treatment by us. Usually when people talk of an objective morality they are really talking about a subjective God's morality so to expand upon that meaning of objective when talking about morals it fits fine. Ok he did. But you said that you mean this term as in 'an aversion to Muslims' and not Islam. I'm debating with you here, not that guy. You have a meaning of the term which doesn't agree with the term so instead of changing the meaning, I proposed that you might as well change the 'term'. Get it to Muslimphobia and it fits your meaning. And mine. Well I guess it depends on who uses the word. It gets confusing a bit on what people even mean when they say it. Using "Islamaphobia" as a word thrown around to try to shut down any criticism of Islam is wrong. I don't think people who hate all Muslims are really right either though. Maybe people should use the term religious bigotry when referring to hatred of all Muslims. Where do people get all their misconceptions? Many factors: -Lack of knowledge. -Not intelligent enough to understand something. -Conflating one concept with another. And many more. Any one factor can be a relevant answer to your question. It must be a specific source though. Some script or a religious figurehead. Ok, I'll give it to you straight now so you don't poke around with morality any further. There are only 3 possibilities/cases here: 1. My God is the truth: In which case, you'll be wrong by all definitions of wrong. Since God will be the one defining 'right' and 'wrong', not you, nor I. But since I subscribe to the definition provided by the truth, I will be correct. 2. No God is the truth: In which case, your stance of atheism might be correct, but your stance on morality will devolve in moral relativism; since there will be no truth, there can be no objective morality whatsoever. And hence, neither you nor I will be correct. Think of it in this way: There are only 2 people in a world; person A sees everything in black and white, person B sees everything in color; both try to convince each other that their own vision is correct but will they ever go anywhere? Those two people will be like us if case no.2 is the truth. 3. Some other God is the truth: In which case, neither you nor I are correct. So Huzzah? See my point above. I already pointed this out. It's a type of subjective opinion with inflated status. If Allah let people have free will he let them have just as much ability to choose their idea of right and wrong as he dose. Although of course he would pick the outcome more so he has more say but still it doesnt make it right just because he says so. Also youd have to assume he actually said so. When a person trust the Quran as the word of God they are not just trusting Allah, or even also trusting Muhammad's dictation skills, but they are trusting the scribes who wrote it the most. Then on top of that a person would have to trust a scholars interpretation although they are less reliant on that since they can come up with their own but they would have to trust their own and people ted to trust themselves too much overestimating their abilities. The scribes could have altered it any way they wanted or just made it up. So a person would have to place their faith in humans to believe that. Also I don't consider myself an atheist since I believe in something. Hard to say if that something is a god as it depends on the definition of god used. So you're saying that there's an imaginary cloud in the air with Islam written on it out of which infinite strings are protruding which are controlling Muslims worldwide? that every action a Muslim does is according to the creed or will of Islam? Influence of religious writings, interpretations, and figureheads not control I see a lot of atheist mowing their lawn. Is mowing your learn a part of atheism? Well, don't say atheism is not a religion - I know that. But it nonetheless is an ideology. And since you're creating imaginary connections, so can I. So you are comparing punishing people with violence for mundane sins to being the same as mowing the lawn, What can you or I do about that then? It's like two aunties sitting in the street backbiting a certain auntie that lives around the corner: "Have you seen her drying her clothes? how uncanny she looks'' ''Why yes, she does!'' I won't comment on the drinking much since I dont think Ive heard of much an issue with that but for other things you have to address the source of the inspiration for people trying to punish others for mundane things. This would include a combination of mental health and theological progression. Exclude Middle East. We're talking about a theoretical Islamic State. And since that state is based on the moral code provided by Islam, screwing up with that moral code is screwing up with the basis of that society. Now if you want an empirical explanation of how exactly a gay having sex destroys the building next door, I'll have you refer to case no.1. Social fabric of a society is decided by the society. If that's the kind of thinking you have there, then I propose this: A Muslims comes to a European country; demands that premarital sex be banned; now considering that banning premarital sex bears no harm (just as not banning it doesn't bear any harm), should you ban that? You're just using an appal to majority rule. If you gathered up a bunch of murderers and have them create their own country and there are some innocent people living there it doesnt make murder okay or something that should be defended. Rapes happen in jail. They'll definitely enjoy the jail environment. I don't even know where youre trying to go with this now. Even masochists dont enjoy being raped for real or well at least not usually. I was just jokingly pointing out the possibility of irony before. |
tenltd said: Racism, discrimination, etc will never go away as long as people make a big deal out of race. Muslim is not a race, it is a religious identity. |
CapitalistGod said: As I said the words "True Islam" is meaningless....Just as "True Christianity" is meaningless in this kinds of discussions. I could hardly agree more with this and that's what "moderates" need to understand: No matter how often you post shit with the hashtag #NotInMyName or whatever, doesn't change the fact those people kill and die for the same god you believe in. They're legit believers, and no matter how hard it is for you to accept it, those guys blow themselves up for the same reasons you refuse to eat pork or think homosexuals are lesser humans. Because someone told them it was good for them. That's why some atheists often seek debate online. We are afraid of believers, because believing in god is irrational for us, and nobody feels safe around nutjobs. |
DeathkoMay 3, 2016 7:22 AM
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Clebardman said: That's why some atheists often seek debate online. We are afraid of believers, because believing in god is irrational for us, and nobody feels safe around nutjobs. Actually it's more along the lines of if you want to kill a snake you cut off its head. If a person were to doubt their beleif in a god their beleif in their religion would all shatter. I dont really consider it the best method though. |
traed said: He said discrimination as well, since racism is a similar issue. As you're discussing with trance, "Muslimphobia", so that's what he implies by discrimination.tenltd said: Racism, discrimination, etc will never go away as long as people make a big deal out of race. Muslim is not a race, it is a religious identity. |
Trance said: I'm a guy and I can imagine buttfucking another guy. I don't find the thought repulsive, and I can even imagine kissing another man. |
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