| Hey look another person on the internet who read about something, on reddit of all places thinks they are an expert in the field! |
Ghemotoc said: Ethereal-peace said: Sampling and stealing are two completely different things dude lol what Actually if the debate was that simple it wouldn't spark argument in music schools. Sampling is definitely stealing to an extent. Both stealing the music itself, but also stealing the work of instrumentists. Do I think anything with a sample should be burned down? No. Is the problem more complex than "lol totally not stealing"? ... not really. Snoop Dogg's only good album is 99% Funkadelic samples, and the amount of rap songs with not a single note of music written for them is through the roof. A friend of me is into hip-hop big time and the amount of times I told him "lol this is Y or X song" and we argued about wether or not it was an artistical choice or 100% lazy plagiarism and stinginess when it comes to paying instrumentists is quite high. Sampling is only stealing if the artist of the sample that has been used has neither been asked whether they allow their music to be used and said artist has not given permission to use the music (usually also paying for the song sample that was used). Nicki Minaj was slammed with a lawsuit by Tracy Chapman for using samples from "Baby Can I Hold You". They settled only in January and Minaj paid half a million to avoid a copyright infringement trial. Cardi B (who is problematic anyway for other reasons - drugging and robbing men....I mean really?) also has a couple of lawsuits going because she sampled without asking. |
Swiggy said: It would be ideal if the artists she's making pastiches from were credited, but I'm double checking into that now and having some liners from non-translated albums sent just in case they took them out in English. I did get the album liner for OST 2 a while ago but didn't want to bump the thread with something no one really asked for specifically. I had purchased Blue for my brother some years ago and was going to check that too, but it seems like my brother's busy, so I didn't want to bother him by making him look for it. I'm still on the Imperial Drag Song, Zodiac Sign, and Kanno's song, Want it all back, mostly because I know for sure that the band wasn't aware (not sure about their label). Because of that, I nabbed the info on No Disc (the second OST) which Want it all back appears on. Imperial Drag isn't credited specifically in the liners, nor the label they were with. Nor anyone who might have the copyright to Zodiac Sign now (if existent). All it says is "Words by TIM JENSEN/Music & Arranged by YOKO KANNO". That being said, the album notes in general "All Music & Arranged by Yoko Kanno". Anyway, make of all this info what you will. |
| Who gives a fuck...? |
 |
Fullmetalgirl10 said: He clearly said in the video that he looked into her most of her work, not just that one soundtrack and still came to the same conclusion. He was just talking about the songs from that soundtrack just to analyze how they work as jazz songs because he's a jazz pianist so that's his expertise He looked at her jazz songs on an album where no one accused her of copying and then said clearly she doesn't copy because it's just jazz, 12 bar blues. He can't apply that one jazz album to all her songs. No one accused her for that album. When the accusations are against her POP and rock songs that deal with not only melody and rhythmn, but sound, timbre of the singer she hired to mimic the original, effect chains, instrumentation. That's like saying oh no there's no covid problem in the world when you only look at stats for new zealand. |
TsukuyomiREKT said: Who gives a fuck...? The artists whose music was used without their permission and hence did not earn any money from it and no not every single artist is a millionaire. Also, plagiarism is general is a no go. If you don't give a shit, that is totally fine but you should better stay away from any job that requires research and maybe academia in general. |
SolidPayne said: Fullmetalgirl10 said: He clearly said in the video that he looked into her most of her work, not just that one soundtrack and still came to the same conclusion. He was just talking about the songs from that soundtrack just to analyze how they work as jazz songs because he's a jazz pianist so that's his expertise He looked at her jazz songs on an album where no one accused her of copying and then said clearly she doesn't copy because it's just jazz, 12 bar blues. He can't apply that one jazz album to all her songs. No one accused her for that album. When the accusations are against her POP and rock songs that deal with not only melody and rhythmn, but sound, timbre of the singer she hired to mimic the original, effect chains, instrumentation. That's like saying oh no there's no covid problem in the world when you only look at stats for new zealand. He didn't listen very well. I played music for a while, I disagree with a fair bit of plagiarism accusations... But there's no denying that for that Cowboy Bebop song for example, she just sat there with Matrix's OST and simply redid the same thing. yes, the riff's a bit different, yes, the construction changes a little bit. But it's not "influenced". It's copied. |
Prophetess of the Golden Era  |
| That Matrix song is not a good example. Sure the rhythm is pretty similar but the instruments and overall feel are completely different. Kanno's song isn't techno rock for one so they're not even in the same genre |
madhav441 said: I love how some internate fanboy/girl claims to understand music to the extent that they don't know the difference between stolen and influenced. Read up on how the japanese treat even a slight bit of plagiarism. if influences were not allowed, then half the music made by hollywood producers, like literally 1/3rd of anything ariana grande sings, kanye sings, daft punk makes. Theyre all plagiarisers!!! according to huntress. Nah , it' just you butthurt people don't see how someone can take inspiration from something, and be able to "arrange" in a unique way that fits a theme and is additive. Arranging something is ten times harder than creating something from scratch. It's easy to do that, anyone can, but when you truly want something that works, you don't disregard those that already do. Good point. Also important to note that Kanno has preformed for the emperor of Japan. She may not be as famous as Hans Zimmer or John Williams but she's not underground in the slightest. You think someone as high profile as her could get away with it for so long and have no one even threaten charges at her? No way, even if nothing lead to court, somebody would be saying something about it. Not just people on the internet |
| i wouldn't say it's straight up plagiarism, more like taking an already established idea and re-arranging it for a different context. So yes she is taking other peoples work, but what comes out in the end should still be considered an original take. |
| Surprised this thread is still going on and on. At the end of the day, nobody cares what the OP thinks of Yoko Kanno, his reaction towards music and whoever he is should just let it go. Again, nobody really cares regarding this thread so get over it. Talk about something more objective next time. |
Kurt_Irving said: Like my boy Binky from Arthur once said in that one episode when Buster was pretending to be smart in school, "So what?!". Entertainment is 100% subjective. Again, so what?! Kurt_Irving said: Surprised this thread is still going on and on. At the end of the day, nobody cares what the OP thinks of Yoko Kanno, his reaction towards music and whoever he is should just let it go. Again, nobody really cares regarding this thread so get over it. Talk about something more objective next time. Dude are you good? Seems like you care quite a bit. Or maybe not anymore (it's been 2 months after all), anyway if so then ignore me. I'll just be replying to your old self, partly for those who do agree with you. I never understood the whole "who cares it's subjective" argument for like 99% of the time. I guess most arguments don't get used properly anyway. Plagiarism isn't something for you to jerk off to one side and go "haha it's just subjective bro why fuming". Plagiarism is an accusation, and should be discussed properly. Yeah I know "proper discussions on MAL"? What? That's ridiculous. No one cares right? If you don't have anything better to say, and more importantly, if you truly don't care and think the whole thing is a big subjective mess, then the greatest advice ever given out to you in your whole life right now is to ignore it. Unless? Yes, unless you think this is a serious accusation that should be debunked (which it is). Then we're finally in for something. |
| . . . |
| I appreciate this thread for being eye-opening. I still like Yoko Kanno desu. |
| can dis sig fit |
| Truth be told, not many on MAL cares, since they pirate all of their songs or listen to illegally uploaded music albums anyway. Plagiarism is a serious accusation. Whether Yoko really stole other people's works, I leave that to actual lawyers to decide. Depending on whether she gets sued or not, she could be forced to pay a massive fine to the original copyright holders. |
| You can buy lossless digital music from your favorite Japanese artists on https://ototoy.jp/. The songs are all DRM-free and you can re-download your purchased albums as you wish. Show your support to your favorite artist if you can! ps. if you are looking for Japanese albums, you have to search it in Japanese (not romaji). Just copy and paste the name. For those who want to learn Japanese through anime Resources for learning the language |
| I don't really care too much but wow, the similarities between Yoko's "Mushroom Hunting" and "DJ Food - Let The Good Shine" is an impossible coincidence. |
 |
| Music is 100% subjective, everyone knows, get over it. Nobody is ever going to see the real objective of this ridiculous thread. |
| Oh damn I ain't that surprised, I think good musicians are good because they themselves listen to a whole lotta music and it influences their own music. As you can find reminiscence of these "heard" songs in their work. This is my take. |
 |
| I don't know enough about the technical aspects of music to be able to tell where the line is between similar/influenced and actual plagiarism. And to be honest I also don't care, especially when it comes to OSTs. And neither do most people by the way, otherwise the practice wouldn't be so dominant in Hollywood without people making a huge fuss about it. Or maybe they just know exactly what to do to not count as plagiarism while still basically doing it all the time. Either way, as long as it supports the movie or anime and fits well and sounds good in that moment, I don't really care too much. Here's what I mean with Hollywood btw. The music composer is shown a previous track from another soundtrack and asked to emulate that song and as a result a lot of shit sounds very similar to previously used OSTs all the time these days. |
| I probably regret this post by now. |
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