pgmhecateii said: Haoto_Akiyama said: Kinda digress that... If someone is bullied, and takes their life by themselves. Who's wrong? We're not talking about giving someone the chance to kill themselves. It's more like, you're drived into a corner by the bullies. The person who's being bullied is wrong. Why are people so damn weak? Though it is the bully's fault, too... Anyway, for the poll, I think it's the harasser, if I'm making any sense probably not. It's actually both sides' fault, but it's more the harasser who lead the victim to suicide. Harasser's fault is counted but very less why? Because the person who was bullied made the choice to commit suicide all by himself He should've rather done something else |
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Isabee said: ZSTGL_IMA said: Nas reading her long ass passages about how ignorant we guys are, shows how wise the lady is. There's no point of discussing anymore bruh Haha, now you're smart shaming me, really? Look let me just say this. in the end we all have our own opinions and our own beliefs for certain topics. Some people will agree with you, some people will disagree with you. And that's the same with me. Some people will agree with me and some will disagree with me. And that is cool, because if everyone had the same belief on everything, life would be monotonous and probably not fun. We all have our different point of views, because we're all different people in the end. Even if the belief is morally wrong or right. |
NasFeb 27, 2018 10:29 AM
| ~ Nas, The "OG Bulgarian"~ Formerly known as: ~ Gokuvich, The "OG Bulgarian"~  |
ZSTGL_IMA said: Isabee said: Oh, you another confused little thingy here... I merely said your opinion was ignorant and insensitive. Why? I made an elaborate argument about it, and that is why. You talk about how everyone has their own opinion, and in my opinion, your opinion is ignorant and insensitive. And I didn't come here to force my opinion on you, kid. Suit yourself if you wish to live by your ignorance. (Maybe I should just copy+paste this here for those who will pull out the people-have-different-opinion argument, eh?) Oh, and now you are pulling out the "mee to" card just to force your relevance. You've been bullied too, sure. But here's a fact: human minds work differently. Just because you've been through it and got over it unscathed doesn't mean any other person who went through the same should move on from it just the same as you did. No one deserves to get called a dumbass just because unlike you, they are mentally weak. Why is it so hard to understand? Gosh why is it so hard to understand that the "mentally weak" person could have done something to counter the bullying like tell his teachers, parents...... Right now you're making the suicidal person think that it's okay to commit suicide since you're "mentally weak" Ugh I've been bullied today too just like always. May be I am better off this world, I should just commit suicide too since I can't do anything else now Following your logic I am actually surprised that you're still alive Gosh, why is it so hard to understand that the mind of a mentally unstable isn't always rational? Of course the normal thing is to communicate with the parents or teachers, but don't you get it? These poor souls aren't always in their right minds to do what is right. That's why they needed professional help. That why the last thing they need is anyone harassing them or calling them dumbass just because they're sick. Which part did I say it's okay to commit suicide? Kindly quote please. All I'm saying is harassing these troubled souls is wrong, wrong, wrong, and shouldn't be called names and be blamed for their irrational acts because they didn't know better. They're mentally ill, remember? |
ZSTGL_IMA said: Isabee said: Another confusion here: Ignorant - lacking knowledge or awareness in a particular topic. It is quite apparent that you lack knowledge in this topic as you had admitted that your comment didn't make sense etc... I didn't say you are ignorant just to insult you. I'm merely saying you are ignorant on this topic as you obviously "lack knowledge or awareness" to it. I'm not judging you as a whole, don't worry. Of course let's agree to disagree. That's where you're wrong he never stated that his opinion didn't make sense he just stated as an example that if an opinion doesn't make sense.... I mentioned it a couple of times now and he didn't refute it, and it's up to us to discuss. Mind our own argument before jumping onto another one. What's it in you, you trying to make an ally out of this? Haha... Nas and I are in the talks of agreeing to disagree, so if you'll excuse us, please. |
Nas said: Look let me just say this. in the end we all have our own opinions and our own beliefs for certain topics. Some people will agree with you, some people will disagree with you. And that's the same with me. Some people will agree with me and some will disagree with me. And that is cool, because if everyone had the same belief on everything, life would be monotonous and probably not fun. We all have our different point of views, because we're all different people in the end. Even if the belief is morally wrong or right. Of course, of course. Suit yourself with whatever opinion you got there. I've stated my point, and it doesn't seem like you're up for a debate about it, so sure, let's agree to disagree. |
Isabee said: ZSTGL_IMA said: That's where you're wrong he never stated that his opinion didn't make sense he just stated as an example that if an opinion doesn't make sense.... I mentioned it a couple of times now and he didn't refute it, and it's up to us to discuss. Mind our own argument before jumping onto another one. What's it in you, you trying to make an ally out of this? Haha... Nas and I are in the talks of agreeing to disagree, so if you'll excuse us, please. I just stated it since you never read his point clearly well anyways not like I give a crap about it. Oh pardon my intrusion please go ahead with your little chitchat |
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Isabee said: ZSTGL_IMA said: Gosh why is it so hard to understand that the "mentally weak" person could have done something to counter the bullying like tell his teachers, parents...... Right now you're making the suicidal person think that it's okay to commit suicide since you're "mentally weak" Ugh I've been bullied today too just like always. May be I am better off this world, I should just commit suicide too since I can't do anything else now Following your logic I am actually surprised that you're still alive Gosh, why is it so hard to understand that the mind of a mentally unstable isn't always rational? Of course the normal thing is to communicate with the parents or teachers, but don't you get it? These poor souls aren't always in their right minds to do what is right. That's why they needed professional help. That why the last thing they need is anyone harassing them or calling them dumbass just because they're sick. Which part did I say it's okay to commit suicide? Kindly quote please. All I'm saying is harassing these troubled souls is wrong, wrong, wrong, and shouldn't be called names and be blamed for their irrational acts because they didn't know better. They're mentally ill, remember? There's no point in arguing with you anymore, better luck next time Peace out! |
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ZSTGL_IMA said: Isabee said: Gosh, why is it so hard to understand that the mind of a mentally unstable isn't always rational? Of course the normal thing is to communicate with the parents or teachers, but don't you get it? These poor souls aren't always in their right minds to do what is right. That's why they needed professional help. That why the last thing they need is anyone harassing them or calling them dumbass just because they're sick. Which part did I say it's okay to commit suicide? Kindly quote please. All I'm saying is harassing these troubled souls is wrong, wrong, wrong, and shouldn't be called names and be blamed for their irrational acts because they didn't know better. They're mentally ill, remember? There's no point in arguing anymore, better luck next time Peace out! Oh thank goodness! I was wondering how much longer you're gonna pursue me with your baseless arguments. YOU better luck next time, kiddo. Ciao! |
Haoto_Akiyama said: I'm just curious 'cause I've read a lot of polls and most of them were inconsiderate... If someone commits suicide because of an harasser, will the harasser be charged with murder? If so, will it be a 2nd or 1st degree murder? If not, why? I want to know your opinion. Curiosity, and ignorance.. I would suggest the victim to go ISIS on the harasser and "ALLAH AKBAR" his ass with AK rifle. How is that? |
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| I do not know anyone who has ever committed suicide anyways. I mean, I have seen people intentionally commit social suicide to escape. Actually, I am pretty sure I am one of those people. lol Anyways, certain opinions on the topic are to be expected since most actual, successful suicide is male. Males are the disposable gender afterall. It is honestly no wonder they are psychotic. |
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Bacardi-x-Cola said: ZSTGL_IMA said: Looking at the reply of Bacardi x Cola makes it clear that he is incapable of defending his view/opinion... @Bacardi-x-Cola it's the suicidal person's fault since no one ever forced him to commit suicide.... Sure let's just ignore what led the person to it, maybe faggots like you, but no it's all on the person who killed themself I think its highly ironic that you're preaching about how people should take mental illness/bullying/understanding others/etc seriously.. and then aggressively and directly placing blame on other people that you've never met nor understand, and calling them expletives like 'faggots'. Frankly, I could care less about what you or anyone else call someone. My point is that you completely contradict yourself in back-to-back posts. I think you should get checked for mental illness. Here ya go: https://www.nami.org/learn-more/mental-health-conditions @Swagernator I gotchu |
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| makes you wonder. Whos choice it was? |
| henlo |
| well when I was a kid, some other kids tried to bully me. I sent them home crying to their mommies like the lil bitches they were. just bcz someone tries to bully someone doesnt mean the person getting bullied has to be a victim. one can and should stand up to bullies, whether its thru sheer physical violence or snitching, its easy to get rid of bullies/being harassed. hell if yer a grown up, go to the cops or somesuch..... only weak minded ppl allow others to put them down again n again, they are kinda suicidal to begin with..... so I blame the person killing himself. |
| The harasser duh. first of all as some one whos been though school. also for all those saying "oh its the victims fault for being weak and not fighting back." i can say first hand DO NOT FIGHT BACK. or you get the blame for fighting back. |
| "among monsters and humans, there are only two types. Those who undergo suffering and spread it to others. And those who undergo suffering and avoid giving it to others." -Alice “Beauty is no quality in things themselves: It exists merely in the mind which contemplates them; and each mind perceives a different beauty.” David Hume “Evil is created when someone gives up on someone else. It appears when everyone gives up on someone as a lost cause and removes their path to salvation. Once they are cut off from everyone else, they become evil.” -Othinus  |
ExVasterist said: Isabee said: Why, why, if these aren't a bunch of ignorant comments right here. You must be freakin clueless how mental illnesses work to have to come up with such ignorant statements, right? Oh, gees, this is so sad. *Smh* Human minds aren't black and white. They are unimaginably complicated and unpredictable. It may be easy for you. Feel bad, be sad, get over it, be okay. But a mentally unstable person's brain doesn't work this way. It may seem to you like they have control over it, like they can will themselves to be okay whenever they wish to, but no, that's not how their brain works. It would have saved the world a great deal of trouble if only these people are just being overly dramatic or sissies as you all easily put it, but no, that's not the case. They have an illness in their brains which they have no control over, with which they become frail and dependent to what the society is feeding them, thus becoming mentally unstable which, in a lot of cases, leaves them without much choice but to hurt or kill themselves. Why, of course they have every option, a choice to live their lives free from what's eating them, but their illness blocks them from thinking rationally. They may wish with all their hearts to be free from their monsters, but they cannot just walk away and choose to be okay even if they want to for their illness doesn't allow them to. Mental illnesses are just as bad as any other medical illnesses like heart disease, or cancer, or what have you—this is scientifically proven. Telling a mentally unstable person to grow a backbone, to stop being a sissy, and not mind the bullies, etc. is like telling cancer patients to stop growing tumor or the people with heart disease to stop getting a heart attack—do you realize how epically dumb that is? And calling them "stupid" or "dumbass" or "weak ass" or "pussies" for something they have no control over, for being sick? Seriously? You holy mother of ignorant. Also, FYI, just because a person is seeing a doctor doesn't guarantee that he will be okay. The society still plays a huge part in it. That's why you don't go around harassing people just for the heck of it, you don't go around being an ass, because you don't know the battles a person is fighting within. All of your insensitive comments may very well trigger a mentally frail person who could be reading this now, and how would you feel about it? Yes, it sounds absurd, but mental illnesses is an absurdity itself. You may have no responsibility to a stranger's state of mind, but what would it cost you to just be sympathetic and be kind? Or shut up at least, if you're not knowledgeable about the topic, or if you simply haven't got a nice thing to say. What's cool about being an ass? I have lived all my life dealing with a family member with severe depression, and you have no idea of the kind of hell we have to live through just to keep it together. It even affected me at some point that I've actually had my fair share with depression myself, so I always get touchy and overprotective whenever I encounter insensitive comments about the topic. Oh, just you pray to God you would never have to go through one, or I swear you'll be singing a different tune. PS: You have time to watch anime and read manga. How about you kids consider finding time to read materials about the more significant topics that goes on in the real world? Just a suggestion, just so you could refrain yourselves from making any more ignorant comments like you just did. --------------------------------------- Now, back to the topic: The moment a person starts to harass another person, the harasser is definitely at fault. Whether the victim is suicidal or not, the argument should just end there, otherwise it's victim blaming. No one ever has the right to harass anyone. Depending on the degree, harassers should have a cubbyhole reserved for them in hell. Bitch/Asshole, I HAVE BEEN HARASSED, I HAD PLENTY OF REASON TO COMMIT SUICIDE, I HAVE MET PEOPLE EXACTLY LIKE YOU WHO THINK THEY ARE SOMEHOW "SUPERIOR" AND PULL A FUCKING 180 BY PRETENDING "I'M NOT THE BAD GUY". OUR OPINIONS DIFFER, SO FUCKING WHAT. WHO MADE YOU THE EXPERT ON WHAT "THE RIGHT OPINION IS"??? GO BACK TO YOUR "I'M MORE SUPERIOR" FANTASY BASEMENT! IF I DIE SOON, I'LL BE BLAMING YOU SINCE BY YOUR LOGIC, THE ANTAGONIST IS THE ONE THAT CAUSED THE DEATH. *caps lock on purpose. Yes I know it is screaming, YES THAT IS MY FUCKING INTENT* Well you see IF right now there's a guy who's "mentally weak" and reading this...... MY message states that only an idiot would commit suicide and it's the who commits suicide at fault (condemning the idea of suicide), unlike hers she is clearly stating that why the guy should commit suicide (she is justifying the act of committing suicide).. The moment she denied everything she said before SHE LOST |
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ExVasterist said: Isabee said: Why, why, if these aren't a bunch of ignorant comments right here. You must be freakin clueless how mental illnesses work to have to come up with such ignorant statements, right? Oh, gees, this is so sad. *Smh* Human minds aren't black and white. They are unimaginably complicated and unpredictable. It may be easy for you. Feel bad, be sad, get over it, be okay. But a mentally unstable person's brain doesn't work this way. It may seem to you like they have control over it, like they can will themselves to be okay whenever they wish to, but no, that's not how their brain works. It would have saved the world a great deal of trouble if only these people are just being overly dramatic or sissies as you all easily put it, but no, that's not the case. They have an illness in their brains which they have no control over, with which they become frail and dependent to what the society is feeding them, thus becoming mentally unstable which, in a lot of cases, leaves them without much choice but to hurt or kill themselves. Why, of course they have every option, a choice to live their lives free from what's eating them, but their illness blocks them from thinking rationally. They may wish with all their hearts to be free from their monsters, but they cannot just walk away and choose to be okay even if they want to for their illness doesn't allow them to. Mental illnesses are just as bad as any other medical illnesses like heart disease, or cancer, or what have you—this is scientifically proven. Telling a mentally unstable person to grow a backbone, to stop being a sissy, and not mind the bullies, etc. is like telling cancer patients to stop growing tumor or the people with heart disease to stop getting a heart attack—do you realize how epically dumb that is? And calling them "stupid" or "dumbass" or "weak ass" or "pussies" for something they have no control over, for being sick? Seriously? You holy mother of ignorant. Also, FYI, just because a person is seeing a doctor doesn't guarantee that he will be okay. The society still plays a huge part in it. That's why you don't go around harassing people just for the heck of it, you don't go around being an ass, because you don't know the battles a person is fighting within. All of your insensitive comments may very well trigger a mentally frail person who could be reading this now, and how would you feel about it? Yes, it sounds absurd, but mental illnesses is an absurdity itself. You may have no responsibility to a stranger's state of mind, but what would it cost you to just be sympathetic and be kind? Or shut up at least, if you're not knowledgeable about the topic, or if you simply haven't got a nice thing to say. What's cool about being an ass? I have lived all my life dealing with a family member with severe depression, and you have no idea of the kind of hell we have to live through just to keep it together. It even affected me at some point that I've actually had my fair share with depression myself, so I always get touchy and overprotective whenever I encounter insensitive comments about the topic. Oh, just you pray to God you would never have to go through one, or I swear you'll be singing a different tune. PS: You have time to watch anime and read manga. How about you kids consider finding time to read materials about the more significant topics that goes on in the real world? Just a suggestion, just so you could refrain yourselves from making any more ignorant comments like you just did. --------------------------------------- Now, back to the topic: The moment a person starts to harass another person, the harasser is definitely at fault. Whether the victim is suicidal or not, the argument should just end there, otherwise it's victim blaming. No one ever has the right to harass anyone. Depending on the degree, harassers should have a cubbyhole reserved for them in hell. Bitch/Asshole, I HAVE BEEN HARASSED, I HAD PLENTY OF REASON TO COMMIT SUICIDE, I HAVE MET PEOPLE EXACTLY LIKE YOU WHO THINK THEY ARE SOMEHOW "SUPERIOR" AND PULL A FUCKING 180 BY PRETENDING "I'M NOT THE BAD GUY". OUR OPINIONS DIFFER, SO FUCKING WHAT. WHO MADE YOU THE EXPERT ON WHAT "THE RIGHT OPINION IS"??? GO BACK TO YOUR "I'M MORE SUPERIOR" FANTASY BASEMENT! IF I DIE SOON, I'LL BE BLAMING YOU SINCE BY YOUR LOGIC, THE ANTAGONIST IS THE ONE THAT CAUSED THE DEATH. *caps lock on purpose. Yes I know it is screaming, YES THAT IS MY FUCKING INTENT* Oh, you poor thing. Too bad your stunt doesn't really matter to me because first off, I'm not harassing you or anything. I didn't drop any foul word and didn't comment beyond what you have written. If I go by your logic, I could also play the victim here, I can claim I'm unstable and act like I have been attacked by your insensitivity. You even suggested a 3rd option there, see? And "choose for yourself"? Really? You actually think the mentally ill person has the luxury to rationally choose for themselves? Ha, nope. Na ah... That is so insensitive of you, I'm hurt. Do you really think it's that easy for us? I'm trying, but my head is telling me things, I can't. How could you—ashgshgsfffjgj... oops, not gonna pull out that card here, don't worry. Oh, by the way, if you're gonna pull out that people-have-different-opinions argument, sorry, but mine is merely an opinion, too. In my opinion, your opinion was ignorant and insensitive. You made an opinion, I made an opinion. That's that. Yes, our opinions differ, so what? Edit: I was trying to make civilized argument and you're calling me bitch/asshole, really? Classy, kiddo. Hahaha |
IsabeeFeb 27, 2018 7:06 PM
ZSTGL_IMA said: ExVasterist said: Bitch/Asshole, I HAVE BEEN HARASSED, I HAD PLENTY OF REASON TO COMMIT SUICIDE, I HAVE MET PEOPLE EXACTLY LIKE YOU WHO THINK THEY ARE SOMEHOW "SUPERIOR" AND PULL A FUCKING 180 BY PRETENDING "I'M NOT THE BAD GUY". OUR OPINIONS DIFFER, SO FUCKING WHAT. WHO MADE YOU THE EXPERT ON WHAT "THE RIGHT OPINION IS"??? GO BACK TO YOUR "I'M MORE SUPERIOR" FANTASY BASEMENT! IF I DIE SOON, I'LL BE BLAMING YOU SINCE BY YOUR LOGIC, THE ANTAGONIST IS THE ONE THAT CAUSED THE DEATH. *caps lock on purpose. Yes I know it is screaming, YES THAT IS MY FUCKING INTENT* Well you see IF right now there's a guy who's "mentally weak" and reading this...... MY message states that only an idiot would commit suicide and it's the who commits suicide at fault (condemning the idea of suicide), unlike hers she is clearly stating that why the guy should commit suicide (she is justifying the act of committing suicide).. The moment she denied everything she said before SHE LOST Oh, you finally found a perfect ally, have you? Hahaha... You couldn't find a solid argument to counter mine, so there you are twisiting my words to make it something that is not. Kid, you are obviously hopeless and just trying to argue just for the sake of saving yourself. You quote which part I'm encouraging suicide with a valid point, then we'll discuss. Otherwise, what you are saying is rubbish. |
ExVasterist said: Isabee said: Why, why, if these aren't a bunch of ignorant comments right here. You must be freakin clueless how mental illnesses work to have to come up with such ignorant statements, right? Oh, gees, this is so sad. *Smh* Human minds aren't black and white. They are unimaginably complicated and unpredictable. It may be easy for you. Feel bad, be sad, get over it, be okay. But a mentally unstable person's brain doesn't work this way. It may seem to you like they have control over it, like they can will themselves to be okay whenever they wish to, but no, that's not how their brain works. It would have saved the world a great deal of trouble if only these people are just being overly dramatic or sissies as you all easily put it, but no, that's not the case. They have an illness in their brains which they have no control over, with which they become frail and dependent to what the society is feeding them, thus becoming mentally unstable which, in a lot of cases, leaves them without much choice but to hurt or kill themselves. Why, of course they have every option, a choice to live their lives free from what's eating them, but their illness blocks them from thinking rationally. They may wish with all their hearts to be free from their monsters, but they cannot just walk away and choose to be okay even if they want to for their illness doesn't allow them to. Mental illnesses are just as bad as any other medical illnesses like heart disease, or cancer, or what have you—this is scientifically proven. Telling a mentally unstable person to grow a backbone, to stop being a sissy, and not mind the bullies, etc. is like telling cancer patients to stop growing tumor or the people with heart disease to stop getting a heart attack—do you realize how epically dumb that is? And calling them "stupid" or "dumbass" or "weak ass" or "pussies" for something they have no control over, for being sick? Seriously? You holy mother of ignorant. Also, FYI, just because a person is seeing a doctor doesn't guarantee that he will be okay. The society still plays a huge part in it. That's why you don't go around harassing people just for the heck of it, you don't go around being an ass, because you don't know the battles a person is fighting within. All of your insensitive comments may very well trigger a mentally frail person who could be reading this now, and how would you feel about it? Yes, it sounds absurd, but mental illnesses is an absurdity itself. You may have no responsibility to a stranger's state of mind, but what would it cost you to just be sympathetic and be kind? Or shut up at least, if you're not knowledgeable about the topic, or if you simply haven't got a nice thing to say. What's cool about being an ass? I have lived all my life dealing with a family member with severe depression, and you have no idea of the kind of hell we have to live through just to keep it together. It even affected me at some point that I've actually had my fair share with depression myself, so I always get touchy and overprotective whenever I encounter insensitive comments about the topic. Oh, just you pray to God you would never have to go through one, or I swear you'll be singing a different tune. PS: You have time to watch anime and read manga. How about you kids consider finding time to read materials about the more significant topics that goes on in the real world? Just a suggestion, just so you could refrain yourselves from making any more ignorant comments like you just did. --------------------------------------- Now, back to the topic: The moment a person starts to harass another person, the harasser is definitely at fault. Whether the victim is suicidal or not, the argument should just end there, otherwise it's victim blaming. No one ever has the right to harass anyone. Depending on the degree, harassers should have a cubbyhole reserved for them in hell. Bitch/Asshole, I HAVE BEEN HARASSED, I HAD PLENTY OF REASON TO COMMIT SUICIDE, I HAVE MET PEOPLE EXACTLY LIKE YOU WHO THINK THEY ARE SOMEHOW "SUPERIOR" AND PULL A FUCKING 180 BY PRETENDING "I'M NOT THE BAD GUY". OUR OPINIONS DIFFER, SO FUCKING WHAT. WHO MADE YOU THE EXPERT ON WHAT "THE RIGHT OPINION IS"??? GO BACK TO YOUR "I'M MORE SUPERIOR" FANTASY BASEMENT! IF I DIE SOON, I'LL BE BLAMING YOU SINCE BY YOUR LOGIC, THE ANTAGONIST IS THE ONE THAT CAUSED THE DEATH. *caps lock on purpose. Yes I know it is screaming, YES THAT IS MY FUCKING INTENT* You do realize there IS such a thing as a right and a wrong opinion, right? And the right opinions are determined by whether or not they are supported by facts and evidence. You can say the earth is flat all you want. Doesn't make it true, because all the facts are against you. The fact is, humans aren't perfectly logical robots. Doubly so when someone is suffering from a mental illness. When you're mentally ill, your brain doesn't function properly. Depression and mental illnesses actually alter the nerve connections, the brain's internal chemistry, and even the size of certain parts of the brain. All of which prevent the person from making rational decisions. So, when you say why didn't he just go ask for help instead of killing himself, or why he didn't grow some balls and go beat up his harasser or something, that's you being ignorant and spouting bullshit, because you don't know how things work. That's not a matter of fucking opinion. |
| I picked suicidal person because I felt like that would annoy the OP. |
| Hands down the suicidal person, if they were too weak mentally to handle bullies and choose the cowards way out thats on them. |
| If there is evidence of causality by the harasser then that person will be tried for manslaughter. Yet, at the end of the day, the choice is that of the person who commits suicide. However, I don't think fault is the word I would use. We would need the entire story to know, and even then, it would be difficult to tell. Human beings are not uniform, I don't think this topic can be generalized. |
| There are so many factors that play into suicide, you really can't narrow it down to simply two choices of fault. |
"Wonder is always difficult until you forgive whoever destroyed your love of surprises" — Edmond Manning  |
| The the glorious thousand onlookers. |
Vhailor said: ExVasterist said: Bitch/Asshole, I HAVE BEEN HARASSED, I HAD PLENTY OF REASON TO COMMIT SUICIDE, I HAVE MET PEOPLE EXACTLY LIKE YOU WHO THINK THEY ARE SOMEHOW "SUPERIOR" AND PULL A FUCKING 180 BY PRETENDING "I'M NOT THE BAD GUY". OUR OPINIONS DIFFER, SO FUCKING WHAT. WHO MADE YOU THE EXPERT ON WHAT "THE RIGHT OPINION IS"??? GO BACK TO YOUR "I'M MORE SUPERIOR" FANTASY BASEMENT! IF I DIE SOON, I'LL BE BLAMING YOU SINCE BY YOUR LOGIC, THE ANTAGONIST IS THE ONE THAT CAUSED THE DEATH. *caps lock on purpose. Yes I know it is screaming, YES THAT IS MY FUCKING INTENT* You do realize there IS such a thing as a right and a wrong opinion, right? And the right opinions are determined by whether or not they are supported by facts and evidence. You can say the earth is flat all you want. Doesn't make it true, because all the facts are against you. The fact is, humans aren't perfectly logical robots. Doubly so when someone is suffering from a mental illness. When you're mentally ill, your brain doesn't function properly. Depression and mental illnesses actually alter the nerve connections, the brain's internal chemistry, and even the size of certain parts of the brain. All of which prevent the person from making rational decisions. So, when you say why didn't he just go ask for help instead of killing himself, or why he didn't grow some balls and go beat up his harasser or something, that's you being ignorant and spouting bullshit, because you don't know how things work. That's not a matter of fucking opinion. To add: Don't stand up high because you haven't been bullied. Try to understand their point of view before saying shit like the victim holds all the fault. It's easy to say that they are weak, but the truth is the bully is weak. He needs to cause harm to someone who had done nothing for the sole enjoyment or redemption of themselves. No one attacks someone for no reason. There is always an intent behind action. Also, is it not the fault of the bully causing them to see down a narrow path? The bully who torments everyday? The bully who makes everyday a living hell? Ultimately, the victim has the final decision, but the actions that pushes him to the edge are what finalizes his fate. Other things to consider, everyone handles things differently, and everyone is unique. That is to say, you will do something different then someone else. One may choose death, and one may choose to live. I could say your opinion on them being weak is irrelevant because the victim could've tried every single way to prevent it and still gets shit on. |
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Vhailor said: ExVasterist said: Bitch/Asshole, I HAVE BEEN HARASSED, I HAD PLENTY OF REASON TO COMMIT SUICIDE, I HAVE MET PEOPLE EXACTLY LIKE YOU WHO THINK THEY ARE SOMEHOW "SUPERIOR" AND PULL A FUCKING 180 BY PRETENDING "I'M NOT THE BAD GUY". OUR OPINIONS DIFFER, SO FUCKING WHAT. WHO MADE YOU THE EXPERT ON WHAT "THE RIGHT OPINION IS"??? GO BACK TO YOUR "I'M MORE SUPERIOR" FANTASY BASEMENT! IF I DIE SOON, I'LL BE BLAMING YOU SINCE BY YOUR LOGIC, THE ANTAGONIST IS THE ONE THAT CAUSED THE DEATH. *caps lock on purpose. Yes I know it is screaming, YES THAT IS MY FUCKING INTENT* You do realize there IS such a thing as a right and a wrong opinion, right? And the right opinions are determined by whether or not they are supported by facts and evidence. You can say the earth is flat all you want. Doesn't make it true, because all the facts are against you. The fact is, humans aren't perfectly logical robots. Doubly so when someone is suffering from a mental illness. When you're mentally ill, your brain doesn't function properly. Depression and mental illnesses actually alter the nerve connections, the brain's internal chemistry, and even the size of certain parts of the brain. All of which prevent the person from making rational decisions. So, when you say why didn't he just go ask for help instead of killing himself, or why he didn't grow some balls and go beat up his harasser or something, that's you being ignorant and spouting bullshit, because you don't know how things work. That's not a matter of fucking opinion. WOW so you mean the victim who's mentally ill/weak/unstable should just commit suicide because there's no other way to solve the matter HUH? what you just said now justifies that committing suicide is the right/ultimate thing.... Nope you're fucking wrong about this shit... He could've done things differently there are so many ways... Well how would you understand since you never got bullied if you did you would get what others are trying to state.... SO ENOUGH WITH THE MENTALLY UNSTABLE CRAP ...... |
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Thrashinuva said: This, but unironically. I picked suicidal person because I felt like that would annoy the OP. Everyone has choices. Choosing not to live is a choice, and the reason it's called suicide is because you decided to kill yourself. If you are being harassed, please call the cops and take steps to prevent the harasser from contacting you. If it's the Yakuza, wait until they kill you so it's a homicide. also this is the kind of thread where at least one person is gonna wind up banned, isn't it |
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ZSTGL_IMA said: Vhailor said: You do realize there IS such a thing as a right and a wrong opinion, right? And the right opinions are determined by whether or not they are supported by facts and evidence. You can say the earth is flat all you want. Doesn't make it true, because all the facts are against you. The fact is, humans aren't perfectly logical robots. Doubly so when someone is suffering from a mental illness. When you're mentally ill, your brain doesn't function properly. Depression and mental illnesses actually alter the nerve connections, the brain's internal chemistry, and even the size of certain parts of the brain. All of which prevent the person from making rational decisions. So, when you say why didn't he just go ask for help instead of killing himself, or why he didn't grow some balls and go beat up his harasser or something, that's you being ignorant and spouting bullshit, because you don't know how things work. That's not a matter of fucking opinion. WOW so you mean the victim who's mentally ill/weak/unstable should just commit suicide because there's no other way to solve the matter HUH? what you just said now justifies that committing suicide is the right/ultimate thing.... Nope you're fucking wrong about this shit... He could've done things differently there are so many ways... Well how would you understand since you never got bullied if you did you would get what others are trying to state.... SO ENOUGH WITH THE MENTALLY UNSTABLE CRAP ...... Jeezus, kid, you are one misguided poor soul. Your reasoning astounds me, seriously. No one is ever saying anything about encouraging suicide in any way. It is merely being explained to you why a mentally ill person isn't capable to do things differently as you say, because they're not fit to think rationally as you suggest, not with with their brain condition, simple as that. Thus, the least thing they need is your mockery just because you don't understand what they're going through. You may have also been bullied or harassed at some point in your life and easily got over it, good for you. But that doesn't give you any right to mock anyone who weren't as mentally strong as you. Oh my Gee, somebody save this poor clueless kid! No, I'm not saying this to insult you, honestly, I'm genuinely astonished by your way of thinking. It is quite apparent that you're freaking clueless about all these yet there you are still acting high and mighty with your own "opinion" while shutting out arguments that actually make a valid point and twisting them to something that is not. Gosh, I really do hope you're "so enough" of it, because, ughhh, goodness, you're unbelievably clueless. Smh |
ZSTGL_IMA said: Vhailor said: You do realize there IS such a thing as a right and a wrong opinion, right? And the right opinions are determined by whether or not they are supported by facts and evidence. You can say the earth is flat all you want. Doesn't make it true, because all the facts are against you. The fact is, humans aren't perfectly logical robots. Doubly so when someone is suffering from a mental illness. When you're mentally ill, your brain doesn't function properly. Depression and mental illnesses actually alter the nerve connections, the brain's internal chemistry, and even the size of certain parts of the brain. All of which prevent the person from making rational decisions. So, when you say why didn't he just go ask for help instead of killing himself, or why he didn't grow some balls and go beat up his harasser or something, that's you being ignorant and spouting bullshit, because you don't know how things work. That's not a matter of fucking opinion. WOW so you mean the victim who's mentally ill/weak/unstable should just commit suicide because there's no other way to solve the matter HUH? what you just said now justifies that committing suicide is the right/ultimate thing.... Nope you're fucking wrong about this shit... He could've done things differently there are so many ways... Well how would you understand since you never got bullied if you did you would get what others are trying to state.... SO ENOUGH WITH THE MENTALLY UNSTABLE CRAP ...... How about you properly read what I wrote? I never said it was okay for anyone to commit suicide. Sure, he could have done things differently, but when you're depressed/mentally ill, you're not in the state to make those rational, logical decisions. Bullying/bullying further only pushes you over the edge. So it's not entirely the fault of the person who committed suicide. And you don't know me, dude. Just because I didn't bring up my personal experience, doesn't mean I wasn't bullied. I can say the same thing about you failing to understand over and over again how a depressed/mentally ill person feels. Just because you (or I) were able to properly deal with bullying, doesn't mean everyone can. Like I said, we're not a bunch of robots. Everyone responds differently depending upon their personality, mental state, and the severity of their situation. |
YayaChibi said: "overdramatic and sensitive"Both. The harasser is at fault for being an extra ass dick. The suicider is at fault for being overdramatic and sensitive. lmao this thread is mind boggling |
Haoto_Akiyama said: This has nothing to do with your post but do you fap with your right or left hand :)I'm just curious 'cause I've read a lot of polls and most of them were inconsiderate... If someone commits suicide because of an harasser, will the harasser be charged with murder? If so, will it be a 2nd or 1st degree murder? If not, why? I want to know your opinion. Curiosity, and ignorance.. |
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| There is a nice concept called "shared responsibility". Why assume that it has to be either 100% the harrassers fault or 100% the suicidal persons fault (as the poll suggests), if you have the whole spectrum to work with? It could be 80/20, 60/40, 10/90.... why assume that it has to be either 100/0 or 0/100 ? Makes no sense. Which way the balance tips and to what degree certainly depends on the specifics of the case, such as: Did the harrasser know about the mindstate of his victim? How big of a role did the harrassment play for the suicide, where there other things on the plate of the suicide victim? What was the mental state of the harrasser? And so on. |
Railey2Feb 28, 2018 4:59 AM
| "my life at this state could be transposed into a pretty massive biography" - Cneq, "the guy who was literally using BTC in 2012 to make deals in the first main instance of a digital itemized economy forming naturally in all human history (also the precursor of NFTs) and who had 20k+ total trades.", 23 years old MAL's most prolific antivaxxer, Noboru. |
I'm suicidal and your post is fueling my depression. |
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Oh, you poor thing, that's unfortunate. Awww... |
| I believe in the principle of individual responsibility: the one and only person responsible for an individual's actions is that individual. Period. War criminals and the like are not excused for their crimes simply by giving the excuse that they were merely following orders; they are forced to answer for the wrongs they have done. The example here involves directly killing others, which is monumentally different from just mouthing off. That being said, intentionally influencing someone to commit suicide is a horrible thing to do, and I do not think that it should go unpunished; but it is absolutely not murder; just harassment. (I don't care what the laws say. You cannot alter morality with the stroke of a pen.) |
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| @SadMadoka That differs in 3rd & 4th degree murders. But it's still consider as a murder without culprit killing, right? |
-Haoto-Apr 19, 2018 1:31 AM
 ➢ YouTube ➢ Weird Videos ➢ Anime Edits ➢ Pixiv ➢ SheetHost "Salvation is a thin thread dangling from heaven." - Mary ~ Death Mark |
| Harassment can take diverses forms. A lot of you are referring of bullying. Nonetheless, harassment is illegal. As soon as you intentionnaly start harassing someone, you are indirectly to directly involved with that person well being. That said, if it happens that this person takes its life, multiple variables are to be considered. Are you the one who explicitely pushed them to the act? Did you encourage them? It all depends on how far you - the harasser - went and how much trouble you knew you were causing. The sad thing is once someone kill themself, you can't ask them why. |
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-Haoto- said: I'm just curious 'cause I've read a lot of polls and most of them were inconsiderate... If someone commits suicide because of an harasser, will the harasser be charged with murder? If so, will it be a 2nd or 1st degree murder? If not, why? I want to know your opinion. Curiosity, and ignorance.. Society should teach people to defend themselves, teach people that if someone harasses you it's time smack their face on the curb off the street. Do you think bullies, rapists and other criminals or even mafia would exist when everyone is armed to the tooth and knows various martial arts, has high endurance and the mindset need to break bones or even kill for self defense? I already suggested this same thing on another thread, like ''teach women to defend themselves from rapists'' and everyone was like ''you misogynist stop putting the fault on the victim side''.... People are truly retarded. I still believe that you if you don't fight until the end even at the cost of killing someone or being killed you are just a passive human creature who will only find failure and our society teaches us to do just that, be passive and stagnant. |
EkaenApr 19, 2018 12:32 AM
-Haoto- said: @SadModoka That differs in 3rd & 4th degree murders. But it's still consider as a murder without culprit killing, right? There is nothing to debate here. I do not care what it is considered as. Each individual is responsible for their own actions. If someone intentionally kills themselves, that person made the decision to do so and bears full responsibility. The fact that you can influence others' actions indirectly does not change this fact. Again, I do feel that harassment should be punished, but it should be limited to what the person actually did: harass someone else. It is not possible to murder a suicide victim; that would be homicide, not suicide. Speech is not murder unless it involves something like hiring someone to kill another. Now, if we're talking about what actually happens in the legal system, then yes, people can be charged with murder or manslaughter for harassing someone until they commit suicide. However, the only point I've been making is that it is not actually murder, no matter how many people claim it is. |
SmugSatokoApr 19, 2018 12:44 AM
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| @SadMadoka At least you are implying that both people are doing wrong. You don't have to reply this, I just feel bad for not replying since that may leave an imitation of me ignoring your reply.. |
➢ YouTube ➢ Weird Videos ➢ Anime Edits ➢ Pixiv ➢ SheetHost "Salvation is a thin thread dangling from heaven." - Mary ~ Death Mark |
-Haoto- said: @SadMadoka At least you are implying that both people are doing wrong. You don't have to reply this, I just feel bad for not replying since that may leave an imitation of me ignoring your reply.. Well, of course it's wrong. All I'm saying is that harassing someone is not murdering them, and suicide is not murder. This stuff should be common sense, but apparently not for some lawmakers... |
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| The harasser is 100% at fault. If you set out to cause deliberate harm to someone like that, the consequences are your fault. But the harasser isn't a murderer, because the only difference between them and the next harasser is bad luck. A murderer is someone who sets out to kill someone else. They are just a harasser whose fault a death is. |
| suicide is a personal choice. they are at fault for taking it into account i say suicidal person |
| both are at fault, the harrasser for instigating and the harrassed for killing themselves over someone else's actions |
 アニメの幼女を見てるのが楽しいぜ |
| This thread... I hope people are just being edgy trolls. How can someone who has peacefully gone out be at fault instead of someone who actively makes the lives of others miserable (we're talking about fault, right?)? Also there's a whole variety of types of harrassment, and you often can't do anything about it, because of any amount of reasons - numbers, societal support, class difference, money, strength (including health condition). Beat bullies up? Good luck, when they're bigger, stronger, more numerous and experienced. Plus what's with all "ask for help"? In many places you don't have safe therapy available, paid therapy is damn expensive and you need to find something that works for you, which takes time, money and motivation (plus there's a possibility of failure with an even worse outcome). And people around you usually don't know how to deal with mental damage, are plain wrong about methods (do more harm) or you don't want to involve/trouble them. I mean - god damn. "Be strong". Yeah. When you're at the peak of depression going out to buy some bread takes so much force of will it's almost to the point of breaking. Being suicidal is your baseline and you work hard just to keep going, one step at a time, often literally. Like you have any energy left to man up against some random abusive shits. It's not even about feeling hurt, it may be about numb "maybe I really should just do it after all today". I can't even express how much I hate people who hurt others randomly and try to handwave or justify it. Burdening already overburdened, hurting already hurt just for giggles. Nobody has unlimited strength, the ones who consciously spread suffering are responsible for it. |
deadoptimistApr 19, 2018 3:20 AM
deadoptimist said: How can someone who has peacefully gone out be at fault instead of someone who actively makes the lives of others miserable (we're talking about fault, right?)? Simple: The person who committed suicide is the one who did it! The only person who is at fault and responsible for any individual's actions is that individual. You can't blame anyone else, because they didn't force them to do it. If someone insults someone and the other person takes whatever action, the first person is only responsible for being a jerk; not for the actions the second person takes. Think of it this way: If person A insults person B and person B kills person C, person A is not responsible for the actions of person B. Same goes for if person B kills himself instead of someone else. Hurting someone's feelings is not the same as murdering them. |
SmugSatokoApr 19, 2018 3:45 AM
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Blarey said: In situations like this, don’t they usually go after the bully who harassed them to suicide? That is what usually happens in movies anyway. I say that both should be at fault, but it’s not like you can get arrested over verbal harassment, I think the bully would have to have physically assaulted the person who committed suicide to face legal charges. On the contrary: some people have been convicted of murder or manslaughter purely for verbal harassment towards someone who committed suicide. And I think this is wrong for the reasons stated in my previous posts. Again, I do think the bully should face consequences: for harassment; not murder/manslaughter. |
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SadMadoka said: deadoptimist said: How can someone who has peacefully gone out be at fault instead of someone who actively makes the lives of others miserable (we're talking about fault, right?)? Simple: The person who committed suicide is the one who did it! The only person who is at fault and responsible for any individual's actions is that individual. You can't blame anyone else, because they didn't force them to do it. If someone insults someone and the other person takes whatever action, the first person is only responsible for being a jerk; not for the actions the second person takes. Hurting someone's feelings is not the same as murdering them. Making someone's live hell is pretty much "forcing to do it". Mind is a part of a person. We're talking about responsibility for suicide, not about murder. And if you have consciously contributed to the person's suffering, you share responsibility. Depending on the length and degree of the involvement, it can be full responsibility. It's no rocket science that it's pretty easy to damage a person mentally, law acknowledges that. In practice it's already vulnerable who are usually picked. Plus mental health is a scale, you can move along it. And nobody can have enough strength for everything. |
deadoptimistApr 19, 2018 3:52 AM
| If someone commits suicide solely because of one harasser, then in that case I feel they should be held accountable. Most instances I've heard about were in regards to people who were struggling financially or being bullied by large groups, in which case it is society that needs to grow up and fix itself. In a few cases people consider or even attempt suicide simply because they feel people don't appreciate them, or that they won't make it anywhere in life. You can try to council these types of people but I reckon there's only so much you can do as a person (speaking from personal experience). |
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deadoptimist said: We're talking about responsibility for suicide, not about murder. And if you have contributed to the person's suffering, you share responsibility. Depending on the length and degree of the involvement, it can be full responsibility. It's no rocket science that it's pretty easy to damage a person mentally, law acknowledges that. In practice it's already vulnerable who are usually picked. Plus mental health is a scale, you can move along it. And nobody can have enough strength for everything. Absolutely not. If a person makes the decision to off themselves, that's on them. And if someone forces someone to die (with the victim having no choice in the matter), that's called murder, not suicide. I keep repeating myself: If you take any action, you alone are responsible for making the decision to take that action and going through with it. You cannot blame someone else for the actions you choose to take, because you (and you alone) are the one who took those actions. Yes, it can be easy to damage someone mentally and emotionally, but that does not shift the responsibility of an action to anyone but the person who took that action. Even if it is the fault of the harasser for someone feeling bad, that does not make it their fault that the person being harassed made whatever decisions they did. I've been harassed plenty of times. Is it the harassers' fault that I didn't kill myself? Of course not. I made the decision to continue living. Same goes for the opposite scenario. Verbal harassers should (in some cases) be punished, but not convicted of murder or manslaughter. That is my strong conviction. (Pun intended.) |
SmugSatokoApr 19, 2018 4:14 AM
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