Is the statement in title True or False?
Azmarath said: Ghemotoc said: You have watched like 15 shows before 2000, and 95% of it is Dragon Ball and One Piece... "old anime were all just trash battle shonen" No, you only watch trash battle shonen lol. You didn't see a single anime predating the modern battle shonen creation with DB. The hilarious thing is that you hated every show you saw that WASN'T a battle shonen so I'm not even sure why you're complaining lmao. "you hated every show that wasn't a battle shonen", lmfao, monogatari, horimiya, your lie in April, monster, Vinland saga, Psycho Pass, mahoutsukai no yome, those shows are battle shonen for you? bruh You have NGE on your favs, one of the worst and most overrated shows of the past century, Most of the shows you have watched are old, and the few modern anime that you completed has low ratings. Staying in the past is bad buddy. LMAO, were you hurt that much by your own contradictions that you switched to insults? You hated every pre 2000 show that wasn't a battle shonen, excuse me for expecting too much of your reading comprehension. I thought it was a given that I was talking about the topic at hand. It's funny how you act as if I was hating and avoiding modern anime, when you're the one who'se close-minded, and pass judgments on things you're absolutely ignorant about. Come back when your experience with old shows is something else than days of Sangoku yelling. I saw more 2010 shows than anything else. My fav list spans 30 years, yours 8. Unlike you I actually know what I'm talking about when I talk about old or recent shows. |
Prophetess of the Golden Era  |
Ghemotoc said: Azmarath said: "you hated every show that wasn't a battle shonen", lmfao, monogatari, horimiya, your lie in April, monster, Vinland saga, Psycho Pass, mahoutsukai no yome, those shows are battle shonen for you? bruh You have NGE on your favs, one of the worst and most overrated shows of the past century, Most of the shows you have watched are old, and the few modern anime that you completed has low ratings. Staying in the past is bad buddy. LMAO, were you hurt that much by your own contradictions that you switched to insults? You hated every pre 2000 show that wasn't a battle shonen, excuse me for expecting too much of your reading comprehension. I thought it was a given that I was talking about the topic at hand. It's funny how you act as if I was hating and avoiding modern anime, when you're the one who'se close-minded, and pass judgments on things you're absolutely ignorant about. Come back when your experience with old shows is something else than days of Sangoku yelling. I saw more 2010 shows than anything else. My fav list spans 30 years, yours 8. Unlike you I actually know what I'm talking about when I talk about old or recent shows. So you say i hated every pre-2000 show that wasn't a battle shounen...lol, if i have bad reading comprehension, then you're straight blind or don't know how to read numbers...i rated Akira with an eight, so for you an eight is bad rate and akira is a trash battle shonen, ok, don't know if you are serious of just trying to troll me. I would also like to know when did i insult you. |
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| This type of threads never fail to put on display the silly preconceptions people have about old anime and their fans. They are about how certain people disregards or puts down newer titles for questionable reasons, yet you get to see a whole assortment of people doing the exact opposite while they fight some invisible enemy. I concur with the two evidential facts that have been mentioned so far though. The one in comment #20 that points out the numbers on produced quantity and how the beginning of the 2010s was actually more productive than now, and the one shared in comment #26, in regard to how certain genres are virtually dead nowadays compared to before. |
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| "the anime industry is dying?" is it really though? lmao "old animes (80-90s) are better" sounds like a generalization though. As somebody who's watched many anime from then, and now, I wholeheartedly disagree. I think there's a ton of shitters from every period, and gold from every period. That's just how it is. |
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ChartTopper60 said: "old animes (80-90s) are better" sounds like a generalization though. As somebody who's watched many anime from then, and now, I wholeheartedly disagree. I think there's a ton of shitters from every period, and gold from every period. That's just how it is. I don't particularly wanna gatekeep, but you have like 12 series completed between 80 and 90. The main bulk of it is DBZ + Arale, One Piece and Detective Conan + a Ghibli. I mean... >.> I dunno, am I a dreadful gatekeeping elitist if I think that's a pretty thin basis to say "I watch both and I totally know what 80s and 90s anime is about"? No Sailor moon, no NGE, no Hokuto no Ken, none of the influential movies or OVAs... |
Prophetess of the Golden Era |
Ghemotoc said: ChartTopper60 said: "old animes (80-90s) are better" sounds like a generalization though. As somebody who's watched many anime from then, and now, I wholeheartedly disagree. I think there's a ton of shitters from every period, and gold from every period. That's just how it is. I don't particularly wanna gatekeep, but you have like 12 series completed between 80 and 90. The main bulk of it is DBZ + Arale, One Piece and Detective Conan + a Ghibli. I mean... >.> I dunno, am I a dreadful gatekeeping elitist if I think that's a pretty thin basis to say "I watch both and I totally know what 80s and 90s anime is about"? No Sailor moon, no NGE, no Hokuto no Ken, none of the influential movies or OVAs... Oh jeez, do y'all hate my profile that much? I have watched Sailor Moon before, I have watched NGE twice, I have seen Fist of the North Star (not its entirety), I have seen a lot more than just 12, a lot more than just 50, a lot more than just 100 & a lot more than just the popular stuff 😂 I'm just too lazy to update my list. |
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ChartTopper60 said: Ghemotoc said: I don't particularly wanna gatekeep, but you have like 12 series completed between 80 and 90. The main bulk of it is DBZ + Arale, One Piece and Detective Conan + a Ghibli. I mean... >.> I dunno, am I a dreadful gatekeeping elitist if I think that's a pretty thin basis to say "I watch both and I totally know what 80s and 90s anime is about"? No Sailor moon, no NGE, no Hokuto no Ken, none of the influential movies or OVAs... Oh jeez, do y'all hate my profile that much? I have watched Sailor Moon before, I have watched NGE twice, I have seen Fist of the North Star (not its entirety), I have seen a lot more than just 12, a lot more than just 50, a lot more than just 100 😂 I'm just too lazy to update my list. Well... "My anime & manga lists have been mostly updated" :p |
Prophetess of the Golden Era |
Ghemotoc said: ChartTopper60 said: Oh jeez, do y'all hate my profile that much? I have watched Sailor Moon before, I have watched NGE twice, I have seen Fist of the North Star (not its entirety), I have seen a lot more than just 12, a lot more than just 50, a lot more than just 100 😂 I'm just too lazy to update my list. Well... "My anime & manga lists have been mostly updated" :p Yeah I just took a look and updated it, I'm stupid as fuck. I meant graphically the lists have been updated with new layouts. 😂 |
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| If were to measure quality by how much gay there is, then yeah, anime has gotten way more gay, so it is getting gaye- better. |
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| > animes should tell you all you need to know about this thread |
Alioune said: Are you joking right? Go back at that times here on MAL. They were barely producing 3-4 anime each season at that time. Compare that times with the recent years where 30 anime each season are produced That's a myth. Shows were much longer back then and not randomly split into a billion seasons by the database, so there's that. I'm looking at winter 90 (first one to pop up when searching 90), and there are 33 TV shows airing, 23 OVA released, and 10 movies. |
Prophetess of the Golden Era |
Ghemotoc said: Only 6 new TV anime that season though. You don't count continuations when looking at what came out that season. Alioune said: Are you joking right? Go back at that times here on MAL. They were barely producing 3-4 anime each season at that time. Compare that times with the recent years where 30 anime each season are produced That's a myth. Shows were much longer back then and not randomly split into a billion seasons by the database, so there's that. I'm looking at winter 90 (first one to pop up when searching 90), and there are 33 TV shows airing, 23 OVA released, and 10 movies. Compare that to the fucking 60 we get now each season. And most OVAs don't even have many episodes too. Definitely not a myth that there's 10x more stuff produced now, it's common sense at this point. |
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Kaasfondue said: Ghemotoc said: Only 6 new TV anime that season though. You don't count continuations when looking at what came out that season. That's a myth. Shows were much longer back then and not randomly split into a billion seasons by the database, so there's that. I'm looking at winter 90 (first one to pop up when searching 90), and there are 33 TV shows airing, 23 OVA released, and 10 movies. Compare that to the fucking 60 we get now each season. And most OVAs don't even have many episodes too. Definitely not a myth that there's 10x more stuff produced now, it's common sense at this point. Please, most anime back then aired for years and didn't have split seasons like current anime which is being shat 12 eps by 12 eps just in case it fails to find its audience. Some old shows even have different seasons not counted on MAL, like Ranma 1/2 which stopped after a dozen eps then resumed with a different staff as far as I remember. I'm not contesting that the volume is higher nowadays. Tons of dreadful light novel 12 eps adaptation to chose from. It's certainly not what some users here seem to believe tho. |
Prophetess of the Golden Era |
Ghemotoc said: Yeah that's true. Does seem like the era of long runners is over. Only stuff aimed at young children and some battle shounen adaptations. But I still think that overall more episodes are being produced, some franchises being split season doesn't change that. A lot more stuff is being made throughout the year I think.Kaasfondue said: Only 6 new TV anime that season though. You don't count continuations when looking at what came out that season. Compare that to the fucking 60 we get now each season. And most OVAs don't even have many episodes too. Definitely not a myth that there's 10x more stuff produced now, it's common sense at this point. Please, most anime back then aired for years and didn't have split seasons like current anime which is being shat 12 eps by 12 eps just in case it fails to find its audience. Some old shows even have different seasons not counted on MAL, like Ranma 1/2 which stopped after a dozen eps then resumed with a different staff as far as I remember. I'm not contesting that the volume is higher nowadays. Tons of dreadful light novel 12 eps adaptation to chose from. It's certainly not what some users here seem to believe tho. |
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| I think nostalgia and the feeling of novelty plays a huge factor into how much we enjoy things, and how we remember ourselves enjoying things. Back when I got into anime I was a lot younger and I liked almost everything I watched, whereas nowadays it takes more for me to really enjoy a show. 10 years ago I thought I'd never grow out of anime, and while I think I'll always appreciate anime to some degree, now I can imagine losing interest in most shows as I get even older since stories about high school kids aren't relatable for me anymore. And it's not really a bad thing, or a reflection on the industry as a whole, it's just that the role of this specific hobby in my life and how I view it will change over the years. That being said, there's a whole new generation of younger people who continue to get into anime for the first time. If you get on TikTok, where most teenagers are these days and there's tons of anime fans there, it seems like it's not as embarrassing to be a weeb these days if you're young but maybe that's just my perception. And stuff from Japan is a lot more accessible than it was years ago so these kids are actually buying a lot of merch and stuff, so I feel like the industry is gradually evolving. |
| What? Haven't even heard of that. Imo the animation has gotten so much better that there's a loooot of things that new anime can do which were impossible in the 80s-90s. I want to believe that it's just a start if anything |
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| i knew this guy favorites list before clicking on his profile Azmarath said: You have NGE on your favs, one of the worst and most overrated shows of the past century, |
| Anime is thriving more now than ever, so uh... Myth? |
| Nice, the 2nd option is leading as it should. I tried a few 90's anime, didn't like them. |
| "Well, she's flatter than a pancake" -Mimi Alpacas |
| You'd have to be delusional to say anime is dying in terms of popularity and profit. Nobody believes that. In the rare case that someone does say so, then they probably mean in a creative sense, which I can get behind. There's also certain genres that have had one foot in the grave for what feels like forever now. I suppose whatever view one has on anime as a whole depends on their level of experience. Modern anime never really surprises or impresses me anymore. Once you've seen a handful of anime from every genre, then you've pretty much seen everything. Anime basically repeats over and over with a new coat of paint. The outside may look different, but the core is the same. Because of that I usually don't have much interest in whatever popular seasonals people are raving about. More casual fans would of course not feel that way. it's not really a matter of better or worse. I don't think the overall quality has changed drastically. There's plenty of bad older anime from the 70's-00's and definitely no shortage of bad anime today. The main difference is that there's so much more anime that is being pumped out now. Like, a stupid amount that no person can feasibly keep up with them all. Let's be real, most people couldn't care less about the countless lesser known and obscure anime that falls to the bottom every passing season. In that case, I do think quality over quantity would be best. Instead of studios throwing a bunch of stuff at the wall and hoping something sticks, a more calculated approach would probably benefit the industry. At the end of the day, it all really comes down to preference of animation style, design, and trends of the time. Some people really love cel animation and older, classic character designs. It just speaks to them. On the flipside, most newer fans naturally prefer modern aesthetics and trends like moe and isekai. Everyone should just watch whatever they like since there's more than enough on both sides to keep everyone happy. |
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| I've mostly watched anime from 1990 - 2010 period, so I have no idea. I'm quite interested in watching both very old and very new anime, and I'm pretty sure there is some interesting stuff in every anime decade. Doesn't look like anything is dying though. |
| There are bad anime from 80s-90s, people just don't watch them whereas people watch loads of anime if it is modern making newer anime seem bad. And no the anime industry is the best it has ever been, it won't die any time soon |
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| This argument.... THIS FUCKING ARGUMENT. I've been around this medium for over 5 years now and from then till now, people just won't stfu with this topic. There is no such thing as a "good era" for Anime. Every era had their good and bad. If people think Anime industry is dying after watching stuff like Mob Psycho 100 2 then they're the ones who're lacking brain cells. Also, if you think that all anime are generic isekai then it's your own fault for not digging deep enough in the medium to discover shows like Rakugo, Sangatsu no Lion, Rainbow, Banana Fish, Death Parade etc. Also also, any sane person wouldn't say that Anime is dying after seeing how strong the Winter 2021 Anime season was. This debate is even more annoying than English Dub vs Sub BS and I hope you lose sleeps of several nights for creating this thread. AMEEN |
| Neither older or new anime are better than the other. There's good stuff and bad stuff from each. There will be better years but it's all subjective really |
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| People will always say this because of nostalgia. I have heard it numerous times whether it's anime, music, movies, sports, etc. They always say "90s are better" which could be the case, but mostly they will feel that way because of nostalgia. 10 years from now, we will say 2010s anime or any other thing is better, it is cyclical. People will most certainly defend their nostalgia rather than something new. End of story. |
| So I think its subjective, some guy would prefer old anime, other new, but also objectively anime industry growing every year and more people watching anime around the world and its fact supported by numbers you can't deny. |
| Quality is naturally subjective, so nobody can claim objectively that the medium is better or worse now. In one way the industry is thriving, larger global audiences and revenue. In other it's dying, as they find less and less people willing to work themselves to death working on animation for pathetic wages. |
| Engaging with those so clearly beneath you achieves nothing but lowering yourself to their level. |
Schwarzenn said: Quality is naturally subjective, so nobody can claim objectively that the medium is better or worse now. In one way the industry is thriving, larger global audiences and revenue. In other it's dying, as they find less and less people willing to work themselves to death working on animation for pathetic wages. Minimum wages 40 years ago were something you could live off without being homeles. At least here, dunno in Japan. |
Prophetess of the Golden Era |
| It's neither "myth" nor "fact" that "old animes (80-90s) are better" because that's just an opinion. The anime industry, meanwhile, isn't dying. However, the anime industry is also not the same anime industry that existed in the 80s and 90s. It's a lot bigger, for one, and there are far more shows being made, and they use different animation methods/technologies, and different genres and art styles have gained/lost popularity over time, and there's a far bigger English-language industry licensing and official-subbing and dubbing them, and so on. Oh, between then and now, fansubbing became big but later shrank again as official subs became more of a thing. So, if you meant the anime industry of the 80s and 90s, well, that's "dead", to some metaphorical extent, because it no longer exists, but something similar to it yet different from it exists today in its place. |
| Avatar character is Gabriel from Gabriel DropOut. |
| It’s a myth. There are tons of really great anime in the 2000’s and 2010’s decade too. |
Sydd said: Nope, when you look back at old anime you're seeing it with rose tinted nostalgia glasses. I enjoyed gintama for example and looking back it it I wanted more shows to have that level of intensity in terms of story but what I conveniently forget is the stupid annoying pointless comedy and parody, something I'm not a fan of and the 50 starting episodes that were almost painful to watch to get to the good stuff. Why might this be the case? Well its simple really... You're more likely to remember the things you enjoyed in a show that you like, this is how you psychologically justify that the show was good for you, you selectively ignore the things you didn't like about the show. This also has compounding effect with other aspects. Namely, oversaturation within the industry, there are so many anime being dished out each season and there is very little uniqueness to them simply because most genres have been oversaturated and a fresh story is extremely hard to think of. Contrary to the saying Imagination has no limit, it actually does and I can prove it by asking just one question "Imagine a new colour" So yeah, older shows seem to be nicer this includes shows in the 80s and 90s because the shows you HAVE heard about from then are shows that were amazing, does anyone talk about obscure shows from those eras? Nope. This goes back to my point that people will only remember the good stuff about shows they like. Also, no the anime industry isn't dying, its thriving... Think about it, majority of the folks have been locked up at home because of the damn pandemic, the demand for entertainment has gone up drastically since the 20s. I can tell you from experience that old anime watchers dig for obscure shows harder than any other portion of the community. Also where's the nostalgia when someone born in the 2000s watches 70s and 80s anime? The nostalgia argument is invalid everywhere it's used, music, video games, anime. People don't watch B&W movies because of nostalgia... |
Prophetess of the Golden Era |
| A lot of anime follow templates these days. They look great visually because of technological advancement and if you are new, you won't see how unoriginal a lot of them are. But that's all it is. Granted, I would argue good stuff still came out in the 2000s and early 2010s. Just afterwards, its mostly a lot of filler anime following a template that worked before and hoping to hit it big. Example 1: "Osananajimi ga zetta makenai love comedy" is an example of yet another harem with literally nothing to it but 1 dude with no interesting qualities and a ton of cute girls into him. If I go through my list, I can find dozens of such shows whether completed or onhold that did the same idea. Example 2: "Kumo desu ga, nanika?" is another isekai that is effectively another dude/dudette isekai'd and gains OP powers (levels) told from with heavy monologue of the MC ala Youjo Senki. Example 3: Re:Zero & all isekai where a male MC gets isekai'd and surrounded by chicks who are all inexplicably nice to him and gets an OP power can all be grouped into 1 umbrella. Example 4: "Yuukoku no Moriarty" borrows a noticeable amount of elements from Code Geass and Black Butler. I could go on, but the point is, most shows aren't very original anymore within anime. Older anime arguably borrowed from outside the medium but what made them great was that they were the first to borrow something from outside and they set the stage for all their successors. I can't emphasize enough: For people who got into anime long ago, we are watching the same ideas on loop and hoping for that once every few years entry that gives something good. For people who get into anime recently (last 5 years), everything looks new and your eyes are just spoiled by sparkly graphics. |
| There's no inherent right or wrong in this universe, but when we think with emotions rather than logic, we make things so. |
| Most of my favorite anime are newer shows. I think cause anime is more watchable nowadays people are aware of the garbage anime where back then people were only aware of the good ones since those are the shows that bothered to be shown on tv in America. |
"In the End, Only Kindness Matters" -Jewel |
| The 80s and 90s have a few really good shows that are exceptions within the trash. The "new gen" is somewhat similar, though there aren't really any shows that are on the level of the old ones, atleast from the last few seasons. The average show quality has gone up though. |
| My opinions is that most of anime are bad or mediocre at best, if they are old or new that's totally irrelevant. That's a myth btw. Sometimes I want to puke when I watch how they treat women in old anime. It's disgusting. It's like watching troglodytes. |
| I prefer older anime because they're what I grew up with and I'm just so much more used to the older art style and I just prefer them in general. Sure a lot of them are trash but they're fun as hell to watch. Also they have one thing that a lot of anime nowadays don't have: Actual freaking gore. Not just blood, but like actual gore. However no the anime industry isn't dying, if anything it's thriving more than ever. A ton of more anime is being produced which is why it feels like there's so much garbage nowadays. |
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| False, the industry is better than ever and is way bigger than the 90s. What I think you mean is quality which is debatable. |
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S5-Astraea said: Example 2: "Kumo desu ga, nanika?" is another isekai that is effectively another dude/dudette isekai'd and gains OP powers (levels) told from with heavy monologue of the MC ala Youjo Senki. Neon Genesis Evangelion is another mecha about a young boy who pilots a giant robot and fights a monster of the week. I am not defending the spider isekai as some pinnacle of originality, but you can make everything look generic as fuck by throwing in the least inspired summary possible. Spoilers just in case for this show in particular: And I think all of these elements are worth mentioning to have an idea of what exactly this series is about; instead you pick the two elements you can use to reduce the series to its common denominator with any RPG isekai and make a summary with them. I don't know about the other shows, but I can at least do that with this one because I'm watching it. |
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