| A lot of people here not only seems to think the tag shounen actually has anything to do with the content of the anime but many use it to refer to any battle anime targeted towards teens. Are people really this ignorant? Let's consider that K-on is considered a Seinen and the manga Banana fish is considered Shoujo. Clearly these tags are worthless and I figured weveryone knew they only reflected the demographic of the magazine the manga were featured in. |
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| Though technically only referring to a demographic, in the West Shounen has developed into a colloquialism referring to a fighting genre that resembles the classic Big 3 style. Lots of training and growth for the MC, arc based, themes geared towards teens, etc, etc,. |
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| There Isn't a lot to discuss in this one except just pointing out the blissful unawareness of said people. Hip hurrah? |
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| k-on not only 'is considered', but also 'actually is' a seinen |
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| Maybe because the most popular shounens are all about battles with superpowes and stuff. It's just easier that way. |
 Ｓｗｅｅｔ♥I guess, as long as I have life, all I can do is fight with all my might. |
| Dunno, it shows who the show is supposedly made for. |
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| Just because the tags don't have the meaning you want them to have doesn't make them worthless. Other than that I don't see any point of discussion here. This is speculation on people that are likely not going to appear in the thread. |
Milk_is_Special said: Dunno, it shows who the show is supposedly made for. May I remind everyone that Violence Jack was originally a shounen. I want you all to keep that in mind. |
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| Why focus on just the shounen "tag" ? Other tags are mostly useless as well. Genres and other tags are not meant to be understood as sth. definite, they are merely an attempt to sort things. And it hardly ever works out really well. Look at your music collection - don't you find lots of stuff that is tagged this or that "genre" that totally does not fit / give a wrong impression ? Ever tried to sort music by "genre" yourself ? (I mean applying "genre" yourself) - I at least ended up with several HUGE top-level folders of "other", "var" and such :p - the way it is. With anime it imo. is particularly bad - lots and lots of mostly useless tags, or tags that only if you combine them with other tags give an idea. Like ecchi means a totally different thing when combined with either R+ or PG-13. And shounen/ shoujo/ seinen and such - the most useless, probably, since defined by where it was published. That's like declaring everything literature that was published by Playboy media as "p0rn". (in case you don't know - Playboy has published LOTS of highly respected (nowadays) literature - several Nobel prize winners and whonot) So why get upset about folks misunderstanding "shounen" - it is inherently due to provoke misunderstandings. And imo. "battle shounen" IS a genre that deserves being called a genre. |
| *darn, using my right hand is off-limits for a while. Typing with my left hand only is ... eww.* |
BannoBunka_snork said: Why focus on just the shounen "tag" ? Other tags are mostly useless as well. Genres and other tags are not meant to be understood as sth. definite, they are merely an attempt to sort things. And it hardly ever works out really well. Look at your music collection - don't you find lots of stuff that is tagged this or that "genre" that totally does not fit / give a wrong impression ? Ever tried to sort music by "genre" yourself ? (I mean applying "genre" yourself) - I at least ended up with several HUGE top-level folders of "other", "var" and such :p - the way it is. With anime it imo. is particularly bad - lots and lots of mostly useless tags, or tags that only if you combine them with other tags give an idea. Like ecchi means a totally different thing when combined with either R+ or PG-13. And shounen/ shoujo/ seinen and such - the most useless, probably, since defined by where it was published. That's like declaring everything literature that was published by Playboy media as "p0rn". (in case you don't know - Playboy has published LOTS of highly respected (nowadays) literature - several Nobel prize winners and whonot) So why get upset about folks misunderstanding "shounen" - it is inherently due to provoke misunderstandings. And imo. "battle shounen" IS a genre that deserves being called a genre. If people say battle shounen that's fine but their are plenty of shounen anime that aren't about fighting. |
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| It's easier to say and identify the matter |
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| I'm more confused about "psychological" being a genre. What the fuck does that even mean? I've heard it defined as "exploring characters emotions/mental states" or some variation, but.... isn't that like, literally ALL anime? How the fuck do you not explore a character's emotions/mind? Are they just a vegatable? Do they literally do nothing? Do they not.. think? The only time I've seen something I'd call "psychological" was Ghost Hound, and that's because the main character had therapy sessions with a psychologist and it was actually part of the plot. Other than that it seems like a useless tag to cram onto a show so that it feels more "legitimate". Sorry, Mirai Nikki has shit to do with psychology. |
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Red_Keys said: maybe psychological is about the top 10% of anime focusing on a variation of "exploring characters emotions/mental states" I'm more confused about "psychological" being a genre. What the fuck does that even mean? I've heard it defined as "exploring characters emotions/mental states" or some variation, but.... isn't that like, literally ALL anime? How the fuck do you not explore a character's emotions/mind? Are they just a vegatable? Do they literally do nothing? Do they not.. think? The only time I've seen something I'd call "psychological" was Ghost Hound, and that's because the main character had therapy sessions with a psychologist and it was actually part of the plot. Other than that it seems like a useless tag to cram onto a show so that it feels more "legitimate". Sorry, Mirai Nikki has shit to do with psychology. like ecchi.. you can fap to any character, but ecchi ones are made for that reason in particular |
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Waifu_Strangler said: That's why I said supposedly, because the shounen tag gets misplaced a lot.Milk_is_Special said: Dunno, it shows who the show is supposedly made for. May I remind everyone that Violence Jack was originally a shounen. I want you all to keep that in mind. |
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Waifu_Strangler said: If people say battle shounen that's fine but their are plenty of shounen anime that aren't about fighting. Well, we are (selectively) lazy - I am - so they shorten it to shounen. Red_Keys said: I'm more confused about "psychological" being a genre. What the fuck does that even mean? hahaha. I entered so many threads asking for "psychological" anime in the recommendations section only for wanting to understand what the heck they mean with that. No avail, I am no further into knowing what that means than I was at the beginning. |
| *darn, using my right hand is off-limits for a while. Typing with my left hand only is ... eww.* |
Red_Keys said: I'm more confused about "psychological" being a genre. What the fuck does that even mean? I've heard it defined as "exploring characters emotions/mental states" or some variation, but.... isn't that like, literally ALL anime? How the fuck do you not explore a character's emotions/mind? Are they just a vegatable? Do they literally do nothing? Do they not.. think? The only time I've seen something I'd call "psychological" was Ghost Hound, and that's because the main character had therapy sessions with a psychologist and it was actually part of the plot. Other than that it seems like a useless tag to cram onto a show so that it feels more "legitimate". Sorry, Mirai Nikki has shit to do with psychology. MAL is kind of inconsistent with that genre tag, but I always interpreted it as a narrative focus rather than a specific theme or mood. That is, a narration that picks a subjective sort-of-first-person point of view to tell the events, and deals with the emotions and/or states of mind of the character(s) as the main filters to observe and interpret the reality of the story. |
jal90Apr 12, 2016 6:39 PM
| Even if it's not, I still call certain anime a shoenen because it's just simpler that way. Same reason I call most anime fans weeaboos even though they mean different things. I don't care. |
   I envy your delusion; I wish I could live in it  |
| It's used as shorthand to describe a particular sub-genre of show, specifically the shounen battle show archetype. It's done because there are so many of them that it deserves to be it's own genre, separate from action, but nobody has come up with a better name for it yet. If it bothers you so much help me do something constructive and come up with a better name. that captures it's essence in one word. |
| "The name's Gambit. Remember it." -Gambit "X-Men '97"  |
| Shonen is a genre for anime that is about power-ups, nakama, and fighting. <Going Fishing> Forgot to add the serious part of my post. Shounen is a demographic, but you can also use it as a genre tag like people have said above: Battle Shounen. The same goes for Seinen as well. When I see most people talking about Shounen, I just automatically assume they are talking about battle shounen as it is mostly known as that for some reason. |
CejaraApr 12, 2016 6:58 PM
Kruszer said: It's used as shorthand to describe a particular sub-genre of show, specifically the shounen battle show archetype. It's done because there are so many of them that it deserves to be it's own genre, separate from action, but nobody has come up with a better name for it yet. If it bothers you so much help me do something constructive and come up with a better name. that captures it's essence in one word. Let's call it polyurethane! I think that captures its essence perfectly! |
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| Because the most popular shounens are: Bleach, One Piece, Dragon Ball Z, Naruto and Fairytail and all those shows involve overpowered people fighting each other and have tons of filler and people saw that all of these shows were Shounen and probably though that it was a genre. A person with a lot of anime knowledge would refer to those as "shounen battle series's". |
| Shounen itself isn't a genre but when it's combined with other genres it can describe what you will be watching. Action + shounen is "battle shounen" which tends to be mindless battles, but can some in-depth stuff. Slice of life + shounen tends to have silly humour geared towards young teenage boys, as you would expect. Action + seinen is "battle seinen" which is quite different from battle shounen as it tends to be more violent and bloody while also being of a more serious tone (not always the case as Fullmetal Alchemist, a battle shounen, was more serious than Elfen Lied, a battle seinen). Slice of life + seinen is usually referred to as either "cute girls doing cute things" or "moe anime" and it usually involves cute high school girls doing activities that most people would consider to be "cute". There are some more serious ones as well such as Bartender and Space Brothers which are not about cute girls. |
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| It should be written somewhere. As it doesn't have separate category, it goes along with the genres. You can advice mal to put it though |
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| Well, for a lot of people it's just simpler to put it that way. |
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EfiChan said: Studios and licensors used to be lumped in with producers on MAL pages but now they have their own categories. Maybe MAL could have a separate thing for "demographics". "Male" and "female" should be added if this were to happen just so it wouldn't be blank most of the time. Most light novels and even some manga target a gender instead of an age/gender demographic. For example, Haruhi Suzumiya is targeted at males so they are the targeted demographic. Yuru Yuri is a manga that also targets males in general.It should be written somewhere. As it doesn't have separate category, it goes along with the genres. You can advice mal to put it though |
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| It's a demographic that's seemingly became its own genre. People instantly know what you mean when you say "(battle) shounen" whereas if you say something like "seinen" then you can't instantly know exactly what's going to happen. Kinda funny how the term evolved. |
 It's an entirely different kind of flying, altogether! It's an entirely different kind of flying. |
| Battle shounen is definitely a genre. It's a nice way to categorize all the monomythic anime following a young hero - Naruto, Bleach, Digimon series, One Piece and so forth. |
| WEAPONS - My blog, for reviews of music, anime, books, and other things |
| Shonen is just a demography to describe mangas directed to kids/teens. And that's all. Honestly, I never heard of the term battle shounen refered as a genre. |
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| Why are anime fans so obsessed with categorization in general? I mean who really gives a shit ultimately if someone thinks shonen is a genre or subclass or whatever? Why would anyone care enough to make this topic? |
| In the majority of the people I know, there are rarely any who think shounen is a genre so maybe it is a forum thing. |
| Are you kidding me? Do you people have nothing more important to worry about? Who cares what the majority of a website thinks of a genre? |
| It's a demographic thing, although it's technically not a genre most shows catered towards the shounen demographic have similar styles/tropes The bigger issue is that so many people think that "moe" is a genre, or even worse, that something like Slice of Life is automatically "moe". |
lady_freyja said: agreeed. but "CGDCT" it self can be called genre.And I agree with @Lobinde about the moe ""genre"", which it isn't. If a character is "moe", it means that it attracts you, from an emotional or even sexual perspective. The fujoshi search for the "moe" over the male characters, in order to ship them. i dont really mind when people reffered battle shounen, but agreed, when they generelize demographic, it can be problem. for example, http://myanimelist.net/anime/22297/Fate/stay_night:_Unlimited_Blade_Works_%28TV%29 "shounen". LMAO..... |
 "If taking responsibility for a mistake that cannot be undone means death, it's not that hard to die. At least, not as hard as to live on." |
| Pretty much as mentioned You list shounen under genres and for an entire year I thought it was a genre, same with the rest of the demographics |
| Well, it is listed under genres on MAL so that's probably what misleads a lot of people here. But i think the term battle shounen is perfectly adequate to describe a certain genre. It's better at letting me know what type of show it is than saying it's an 'action' or 'drama' show. Most genre tags are incredibly vague after all which is why people come up with more specific ones like battle shounen or cgdct |
| I probably regret this post by now. |
Aedrin said: mirai nikki, claymore, akame ga kill, azumanga daioh, gekkan shoujo, aria, love hina, death note, seikan no qweser, everything of this is shounen. seriously shounen also mean nothing. it can be everything too just like any demographic. even worse UBW adapted from eroge VN that supposed for 17+ (seinen).Kuma said: i dont really mind when people reffered battle shounen, but agreed, when they generelize demographic, it can be problem. for example, http://myanimelist.net/anime/22297/Fate/stay_night:_Unlimited_Blade_Works_%28TV%29 "shounen". LMAO..... Fate is textbook example for shounen anime. Mc at start is weak but brave and honest. In the end girl who was supposed to be very strong was only his supporter. |
KumaApr 13, 2016 10:59 AM
"If taking responsibility for a mistake that cannot be undone means death, it's not that hard to die. At least, not as hard as to live on." |
lequack said: the problem is this generelazation lead to many misinformation like what i mentioned above. sure shounen have many similiaryty, that because they are also most produced. that's why josei feel very unique, because they are still very small to produce.From what I have seen a lot of shounen anime or manga are a bit similar. Of course there are exceptions like those that you mentioned but for the most part when someone says shounen, I think of it as an anime with a teen protagonist (either a delinquent or someone dumb) who trains, fights 1 on 1 battles of increasing difficulty until he saves the world or prevents a huge threat. |
"If taking responsibility for a mistake that cannot be undone means death, it's not that hard to die. At least, not as hard as to live on." |
Aedrin said: that's just MAL become incosistent. use baka-updates. if you try to searching genre with those kind of mindset, you will surprised how wide shounen and shoujo is.@lady_freyja @Kuma Some of examples aren't tagged shounen on MAL but I'm not sure how it is on other sites so ok maybe there are some irregularities in my theory. |
"If taking responsibility for a mistake that cannot be undone means death, it's not that hard to die. At least, not as hard as to live on." |
Lobinde said: It's a demographic thing, although it's technically not a genre most shows catered towards the shounen demographic have similar styles/tropes The bigger issue is that so many people think that "moe" is a genre, or even worse, that something like Slice of Life is automatically "moe". I thought it was obvious moe was an art style. A lot of SOL is moe but you can find a lot of moe outside of SOL. Shounen is, even if a demographic, useful to put a lot of similar shows under. |
| WEAPONS - My blog, for reviews of music, anime, books, and other things |
TheBrainintheJar said: Lobinde said: It's a demographic thing, although it's technically not a genre most shows catered towards the shounen demographic have similar styles/tropes The bigger issue is that so many people think that "moe" is a genre, or even worse, that something like Slice of Life is automatically "moe". I thought it was obvious moe was an art style. A lot of SOL is moe but you can find a lot of moe outside of SOL. Shounen is, even if a demographic, useful to put a lot of similar shows under. Well it should be, but I've seen lots of people saying that moe is a genre. |
| Oh look, it's this again. Shounen anime are invariably all the same, which makes it a genre by commonality. And it's not accurate to describe the tropes they portray calling them just by their main genres, because there are for example action anime that are different and lack the tropes shounen does. TL;DR - shounen is used as an impromptu genre because there is no other genre that includes shounen tropes and never deviates |
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