the hate anime tourists get is kinda crazy !!

On Halloween many underage women dress like sluts and no one seems to care.
Anime do not objectify/sexualize underage women.

@TransferUser

Underage woman is an oxymoron, correct term is underage girl.

You could join the Olympics with your advanced mental gymnastics.

@inklingboi08 keep your opinion to you you don't need to shit it out in twitter or tiktok to validate yourself. If you don't like it don't watch other people watch and enjoy it you don't have any right to demean them.
If you think ecchi is bad and should be banned then everything pornographic soft or hardcore also should be banned. Will you want that no nah?. Lots of it also include minors. But this won't stop so why does ecchi anime need it to.

Even if certain portion of japanese people don't like it (I am sure there are) they doesn't start hate wagon on internet like westoids.

@thewiru

I am an artist so I see things from perspective of nothing is perfect. Every piece of art, which animation falls under, will have some sort of flaws because we humans are imperfect in nature. Whenever I experience a work of fiction I will notice flaws and critique them even if it is in a work I enjoy. A great example of this would be with video games as I have recently played through Yakuza Kiwami and while I enjoyed my time with the game, I had issues with how some elements of the game were handled compared to the original 2005 Yakuza. This led to me writing a list of what I think each game handled better for a video idea I had lined up about remakes of games. If I just read out the list of what I saw as flaws in the game, it would sound like I hate the game, but that paints an incomplete picture because even if I enjoyed Kiwami a lot, the negative emotions tend to ring louder and stand out more in conversation for most people compared to the positive ones. Therefore criticisms can echo louder than praise even if both are given in the same conversation. This is generally what I mean when I say I tend to consume media critically and how one can still analyze flaws in something they like while still enjoying it.

Imagine how it would feel if someone asked for more representation in movies and you answered with "DO YOU NOT HAVE BASKETBALL? DO YOU NOT HAVE RAP? CAN YOU NOT GO FIVE MINUTES WITHOUT SEEING SOME AFRICANS? WHAT IS THE POINT OF IT? THIS IS NOT ABOUT CENSORSHIP.".
Because that's how you sound right now.

Thinking 👏 that 👏 human 👏 sexuality 👏 should 👏 be 👏 segregated 👏 is 👏 fascism.

@LSSJ_Gaming I fear you may be the only sane person in this thread. Everyone else seems to have their hands actively wrapped around their dick saying "How DARE you insult my love of underaged big breasted teenage girls! It's art!"

Someone went so far as to edit my words and say I went through "mental gymnastics" to make my point. Can you block people on MAL?

@TransferUser I.... I don't even know what to say to this. Anime doesn't objectify or sexualize underaged women? What about like... all of hentai and ecchi and fanservice scenes? Sure, sometimes the women are over 18... oftentimes they aren't.

Also, way to slutshame. Yes, underaged girls can wear revealing clothing. One, that doesn't mean people don't care. Two, that doesn't give YOU the right to objectify THEM for the way they dress. As the old adage goes, costume/cosplay is NOT consent.

@inklingboi08 Ecchi and hentai are targeted towards guys who pay for that specifically the same way fujoshi pay for good looking guys in bl so that make your argument hypocrite since you only acknowledge one side while forgetting the other.

@LSSJ_Gaming
I don't think you can, though, just like you can't separate a person from their bones.
It would make no sense for someone in the XIX century to say "Well, I support the southern cotton industry, but I'm critical of the concept of slavery".

That's why it makes no sense to me and I can't comprehend it, "consuming a thing critically" is still consuming a thing. "Critically" isn't a magical word.
It makes even less sense to me when it comes to ecchi and loli because that person will live in the community for years, will see that the "apocalypse" they thought would happen because of those things never actually happened, but for some reason will still choose to be against them because... just because.

@Otakupervert890 No, the fetishization of gay men is problematic as well.

@inklingboi08 then where are you then? Why are you only here for thread when women is in question but not men?

@TransferUser I.... I don't even know what to say to this. Anime doesn't objectify or sexualize underaged women? What about like... all of hentai and ecchi and fanservice scenes? Sure, sometimes the women are over 18... oftentimes they aren't.

Also, way to slutshame. Yes, underaged girls can wear revealing clothing. One, that doesn't mean people don't care. Two, that doesn't give YOU the right to objectify THEM for the way they dress. As the old adage goes, costume/cosplay is NOT consent.

@LSSJ_Gaming This is known.


Yeah except for all the jobs that will be lost because this shit doesn't sell, not to mention all the actual females who increasingly get harassed for not putting their "pronouns" in their bio (AOC had to apologize for this 2 years ago but she recently removed them again. The tide is turning) the more this retarded ideology for deranged narcissists takes hold.


Who cares? Everyone hates it and and even you admit it's objectively dogshit, no one wants to be subjected to some mentally ill dementoid trauma-dumping through a once-beloved franchise.


Dragon Age was never about that, make your own shit instead of infesting existing franchises you parasites.
If Veilguard hadn't been attached to an existing IP, it would've been another Concord or Dustborn, only reason it sold at all it was wearing the Dragon Age franchise as a skin suit.


Where did I even complain? I just used it as an example of something that was different than the type of sociopolitical commentary found in games like Bioshock and Deus Ex.
There's nothing being "tackled" anyway, there's zero depth or nuance to it, it's the writing equivalent of a drug-addicted whore covered in tattoos.
I may as well have pointed out that there's a fundamental difference between the works of Shakespeare and the word "queen" written above some cunt's cunt.


It's important that not every fucking franchise normal people used to like gets co-opted and turned into a diary for people who would've been in a mental institute the century prior.


The hate tranoids send towards actual femoids eclipses the hate tranoids get to an incredible degree.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jPjekYTeD4s
The rhetoric shown in this video is the same I've seen countless times before, completely fair, level-headed skepticism of some aspect of tranism is characterized as violence that will inevitably lead to Total Troon Death™ in order to justify their own explicitly violent rhetoric, so I actually don't give a shit how many threads 4chan has where people have fun posting videos of tranoids getting killed.


Peak tranoid acceptance has passed, not too long ago people were relatively fine with people letting their cross-dressing fetish define them, but your greed got ahead of you, the women's sports and bathrooms were just too juicy for you, it wasn't enough that people used your preferred pronouns, it also had to be a hate crime if they didn't, you pushed too hard and the pendulum swung right back in the other direction, and there's no going back (I know that's not how pendulums work, you don't have to write me an entire paragraph about them)


I'd ask you to forgive me for suffering a minor brain-fart and forgetting to write "anti" twice, but I did actually write "anti-anti-woke golem", you just overlooked the second "anti" for the same reason you overlooked the second "and" back in the third section of this post.
Although I doubt you actually had trouble understanding what I said, irrespective of whether you noticed the number of "anti"'s was even or odd.

@Nutella71 Tell us you do leave your wife's bedroom every time Tyrone comes over without telling us you do leave your wife's bedroom every time Tyrone comes over.

Ironically, the people calling other tourists, are tourists themselves. A lot of those throwing the term around mostly watch Ecchi and harem Isekai series. They think they're cultured because of it. And they conveniently ignore that a lot of the Western shows they dislike, were inspired by anime.

@TransferUser I.... I don't even know what to say to this. Anime doesn't objectify or sexualize underaged women? What about like... all of hentai and ecchi and fanservice scenes? Sure, sometimes the women are over 18... oftentimes they aren't.

Also, way to slutshame. Yes, underaged girls can wear revealing clothing. One, that doesn't mean people don't care. Two, that doesn't give YOU the right to objectify THEM for the way they dress. As the old adage goes, costume/cosplay is NOT consent.

@thewiru these are vastly different issues... A horny person wanting rep is not the same as a whole race being left out. And why does your mind immediately go to black people? 🤔

@thewiru A weird comparison again... For the anti-woke to be so anti-black, y'all are really obsessed with us...

I think "tourist" is a dumb term, all things considered. It relies on the idea that one must be familiar with Japanese media culture to be able to properly critique works, but there are two issues with this.

Firstly, Japanese media culture is only a small aspect of Japanese culture. There are many Japanese folks who do not like many of the anime some fans dislike for similar reasons. "That weird anime shit" here is often "that weird anime shit" in Japan as well. Believe it or not, Mushoku Tensei is not a universally beloved property among domestic audiences, or is Uzamaid. It makes the tacit assumption that the Japanese love all anime like Mushoku Tensei as if they were a monolith whose opinion on anime is simply "Japanese=Good".

This makes me angry because people are basically saying that every Japanese person likes even the weirdest and arguably "most depraved" shit in anime and manga, which is a disservice to the people they are purportedly defending. "So you do not like X anime? You must be a tourist", as if actual Japanese folks by contrast love X anime. I actually like some weirder and arguably depraved work, but I am not going to defend it by claiming its detractors are not Japanese or well-acquainted with Japanese culture.

What the heck do you think the average Japanese person would say about this anime?

Secondy, it assumes you need to watch anime to know what is "good storytelling to you", but I think this is wrong. Of course things should be understood in the original context of their culture, but that does not invalidate criticisms, if criticisms could even be valid or invalid in the first place. What is "good" does not change with culture, even if the contexts of certain scenes does. For example, Oldboy (2003) is a great movie, and though a fuller appreciation does require some understanding of Korean culture, perfect knowledge of Korean customs is not needed to simply watch it and say it is a masterclass in film-making. Good stories are more or less 'universal" in the same way music is. You cannot simply hit a bunch of keys on a piano and expect good music. There is logic in taste, and this extends to storytelling.

I argue people who watch only anime are the least able to provide thoughtful commentary on it. People who resort to this sort of gatekeeping are the same sort of people who watch Critical Drinker. It is not protecting anime so much as fostering an echo chamber on the basis of defending some perceived ethnocentric ethnostate, because they cannot welcome criticism as anything other than a personal attack.

I think the biggest headache is how vague these defenses are. What about Japanese culture do I not understand that keeps me from appreciating this anime I think is just bad? For example, if I wanted to defend one of the decisions in Oldboy (2003), I could type the following.



I never heard any such defense for the anime I disliked.

Ironically, the people calling other tourists, are tourists themselves. A lot of those throwing the term around mostly watch Ecchi and harem Isekai series. They think they're cultured because of it. And they conveniently ignore that a lot of the Western shows they dislike, were inspired by anime.

@LuxuriousHeart Funny how you people always target us ecchi fans out of nowhere. The fuck we ever do to you? Fuck outta here, I'm tired of this ecchi fan bashing shit you people like to do here lately.

@LuxuriousHeart



Both are the same thing: One side wants the thing/group they like integrated into mainstream stuff, the other side says this isn't necessary because "If you want to see that thing/group so much, you can go to a place segregated from the mainstream which is 100% focused on that thing/group", not noticing that it misses the point (To have it integrated into the mainstream).

@LuxuriousHeart There's traps and otoko no ko/femboy (男の娘) (men who dress/look effeminate), shemale and futanari (women with male genitalia), and of course the elusive "cuntboy" (men with female genitalia), none of which are the same as tranoids, although I will concede shemales and cuntboys come pretty close, although they are almost nonexistent within non-R18 animanga.
The closest is TS (transexual)/genderbend, which is when someone is changed from one sex to the other (Ranma, Onimai)
Of course there are sometimes actual tranoids in animanga, but they are rare, it's not something I recall ever encountering, except maybe all the trannies (that's how it's been translated, I'm not familiar with the Japanese term) in Gintama.


Please take that back, Nutella71's wife's boyfriend is not defined by the tone of his skin or anything so arbitrary, he's every bit as human as the rest of us, maybe even an inch or two more.

It's worth pointing out that these are the same people programmed to watch western television. These people think the same jokes run into the ground back in the 80s is peak TV. Tourists have been brainwashed to think that entertainment must be clean first, entertaining last. They seem evangelical almost in their belief of clean undies walking by homeless screeching profanities and enormous wealth inequality.

They aren't moral, because that takes action. Rather they are judgmental about a philosophy they don't even believe in, so basically pilgrims.

@Nutella71 Tell us you do leave your wife's bedroom every time Tyrone comes over without telling us you do leave your wife's bedroom every time Tyrone comes over.

@thewiru Ironically, anime fans argue this for black people... Y'all are the ones calling anything with a black person "woke". And the comparison makes no sense, because there's not subgenre of anime with mostly darker skinned people. So not only do y'all have your own subgenres, but there's fanservice and perverted jokes in mainstream series. So y'all are getting what you want, while having a dedicated space. This isn't the case with black characters.

I think there are tourists in both sides of the chessboard (the conservative side and the progressive side). There are definitely people pushing for censorship of basic anime tropes but there are also people pushing for EVERYTHING to be NSFW (ecchi or gore) who are just as obnoxious. You know both sides are tourists because they only talk about the same 3 shows. It's like when people say "Go Woke Go Broke" with games ignoring the plethora of games that have been progressive and have been loved in the past. HELL, THEY EVEN FORGET THAT A WOKE GAME WON GOTY 2023.

Both sides in this arguments are tourists. You can't change my mind.

@Tropisch Y'all are the main ones calling people tourist and normies, and y'all seem to be the main ones who hate diversity in Western cartoons (particularly black people and muscular women).

@ryzxgum
Really? I found it quite weak.

Stop interpreting it so "literally".
Yes, it's about familiarity with otaku oriented media as a whole.
That otaku oriented media is only a part of Japanese culture is of no importance, people area aware (Or at least should be, since it isn't exactly hidden) that otaku culture is a sub-culture.

...we know, normies exist everywhere.
As I've said, otaku culture is a sub-culture.

Irrelevant, it's one of the most sold LN series.
As fair as it is concerned, that the closest to "universally beloved" you can get on otaku oriented media.

Once again, you're taking the term too literally.

If a person said that a theater play was bad by cinema metrics, we would say that person is silly.
The same applies here: In order to fully and fairly judge anime, one must understand it's language, conventions and what it is trying to do, and usually the best way to do that is by watching a lot of anime.

Well, I don't.
Quite the opposite, in fact.

Who the hell is "Y'all"? Stop assuming dumb stuff about me.

Irrelevant, the argument is for the inclusion of ecchi scenes in non-ecchi focused anime.

We know.
The argument is that it's becoming less over time and we want it to keep being there.

...how would you feel if you didn't eat breakfast today?
No, seriously, you don't seem to understand hypotheticals or analogy.

@LuxuriousHeart Nice projection and generalization idiot. Fuck off.

@Tropisch Y'all are the main ones calling people tourist and normies, and y'all seem to be the main ones who hate diversity in Western cartoons (particularly black people and muscular women).

@WaterMage I mean, it's completely normal for people to take offense to the objectification and sexualization of underaged women. That's not a Japanese or western ideal. It's not woke to think that ecchi is weird. I think ecchi is weird. I recognize the culture of the art, but I'm also intelligent enough to know that Japanese people think that shit is weird too. It's not disrespectful to Japanese culture to think ecchi or lolis are weird.

@inklingboi08
>hnyurrr drawings are real people
Can't you people split fiction from reality? Reality is reality, fiction is fiction. Fictional worlds are constructed and they don't have to abide real world rules.
Stop being outraged at random things on the internet and touch grass. You can decide what you will consume. You can't decide what others must consume.

@thewiru But the comparison makes no sense. dark skinned people don't have a subgenre in anime/manga, nor are they regularly in mainstream series. It seems you have an obsession with us (black people, or I guess dark skinned people in this case), and just wanted to bring us up.

@TheMechaManiac I'm not deciding what others MUST consume, nor am I outraged at anything on the internet. I simply believe that the oversexualization of UNDERAGED characters or people, male or female, fictional or otherwise, is wrong. You can choose to believe that or not.