Reply to ColourWheel
LSSJ_Gaming said:
A CBR article just came out about how the Beyblade X anime series used AI generated images in their music video for the full ending theme uploaded onto Youtube. As a member of the Beyblade community I was rather shocked to see this happen and popular Beyblade Youtuber and WBO competitor Zankye put it best when he called this use of AI "devoid of soul and talent" and "a fucking disgrace". The CBR article also mentions other similar incidents recently such as the director of Bleach Thousand Year Blood war saying that AI should be used to "Replace lazy animators" as well as calling the ground floor animators who are overworked and underpaid "leeches", and a recent Black Jack 50th anniversary one-shot using an AI generated script for the story. As someone who is trying to improve at art and writing myself, this genuinely makes me concerned for the future with how these companies are just flat out replacing or planning to replace human artists and writers to make soulless products that are devoid of the human touch needed to make art.... art. Art is defined as "the expression or application of human creative skill and imagination", so having a robot just generate images and text to replace humans isn't art, its completely the antithetical to the concept of art itself. I haven't really seen as many western companies and studios in the animation and comic industry trying to pull this off as much as Japanese ones, so it makes me concerned that this trend of Japanese studios replacing human artists may spread all across the world and fuck over creatives everywhere.
A CBR article just came out about how the Beyblade X anime series used AI generated images in their music video for the full ending theme uploaded onto Youtube. As a member of the Beyblade community I was rather shocked to see this happen and popular Beyblade Youtuber and WBO competitor Zankye put it best when he called this use of AI "devoid of soul and talent" and "a fucking disgrace". The CBR article also mentions other similar incidents recently such as the director of Bleach Thousand Year Blood war saying that AI should be used to "Replace lazy animators" as well as calling the ground floor animators who are overworked and underpaid "leeches", and a recent Black Jack 50th anniversary one-shot using an AI generated script for the story. As someone who is trying to improve at art and writing myself, this genuinely makes me concerned for the future with how these companies are just flat out replacing or planning to replace human artists and writers to make soulless products that are devoid of the human touch needed to make art.... art. Art is defined as "the expression or application of human creative skill and imagination", so having a robot just generate images and text to replace humans isn't art, its completely the antithetical to the concept of art itself. I haven't really seen as many western companies and studios in the animation and comic industry trying to pull this off as much as Japanese ones, so it makes me concerned that this trend of Japanese studios replacing human artists may spread all across the world and fuck over creatives everywhere.
AI generated imagery still requires someone to actually harness it much like one would harness computer generated drafting or drawing. Using AI to accomplish AI generated images would simply make part of the artists job simply easier much like how no one no longer hand draws animation from scratch do to technology. If anything seems more like propaganda to scare Animators in the industry to act more competitive.
I would be more worried about AI replacing Voice acting before AI would ever begin to completely replace entire teams of animators in the industry. Seeing since to generate voice acting even today one simply only needs enough samples of someones voice to accomplish this.
ColourWheel said: I would be more worried about AI replacing Voice acting before AI would ever begin to completely replace entire teams of animators in the industry. Seeing since to generate voice acting even today one simply only needs enough samples of someones voice to accomplish this. Even if the technology matures to the point the AI voice is indistinguishable from real voice actors (and there has been a lot of progress on that front), it won't replace people working in the industry, at least in in Japan. This is because besides reading a few lines of dialogue for anime, they also participate in activities requiring their physical presence. For example, live shows, doing fan meet-ups. In essence, voice actors are basically celebrities in Japan, and no automated voice will be able to replace them. It's kinda like saying that fans of Taylor Swift or Beyonce will become irrelevant once AI becomes a thing. Besides, we also have to consider the legal implications. A company can't just use someone else's voice for a commercial work without their explicit permission and consent. And even if, for the sake of argument, the law allows this, the decision would likely be very unpopular among the paying fanbase of said artist, who may end up boycotting the product. They could pay people for the right to use their voices, but it may very well be easier and cheaper to just hire them instead. Having said that, AI could be used for non-important voice roles such as background characters. In that regard, it could make it harder for newcomers to establish their career in the voice acting industry (many va start out as voicing unimportant, background characters) by the way, this is a very old concern. People were worried that vocaloids and utauloids would replace real life singers. That has not happened. |
| You can buy lossless digital music from your favorite Japanese artists on https://ototoy.jp/. The songs are all DRM-free and you can re-download your purchased albums as you wish. Show your support to your favorite artist if you can! ps. if you are looking for Japanese albums, you have to search it in Japanese (not romaji). Just copy and paste the name. For those who want to learn Japanese through anime Resources for learning the language |
| You should be prepare though, in future i believe news like this will be just common thing. Right now i felt the AI isn't ready for make something big like that since they still suck. |
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traed said: And it only has to be just good enough to make a program that can do better using a simulated evolutionary process. It isnt that big a leap. Look like i said AI companies are the ones saying they will replace programmers. Ive written in Visual Basic, C++ and messed around a little with C Sound before deciding making music that way is too difficult but was long time ago and Ive also done Ray Tracing which has some similarities to programming though not a language. It kind of is a big leap, because code isn't like an image that you can approximate with no consequence. The worst an image can do is give someone nightmares with hands. One typo and the application might be totally broken in various hard to fix ways. Maybe AI could be able to generate simple websites in the near future, but any serious job is unlikely. At any decently sized companies there are a lot of checks before the code can make it to clients. AI code basically starts with a black box, and anything written like that would need to be thoroughly tested and by a real programmer before doing the regular pipeline. So basically as I said, it might be good for saving on typing. traed said: Obviously even before they blocked certain requests whatever view was most prominent in it's dataset it will take as the more likely response. That's kind of expected, but being openly biased on top of that is straight up unethical. |
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Lucifrost said: There is more than enough art in the public domain that can train AI. But I don't think AI art can succeed long-term for the reasons you've stated. Using public domain wouldn't produce enough unique look to it for each studio like in house artists being the basis of the model would. Public domain would just help get the general stuff down rather than the style. But yeah it would fail at innovating and will wind up corrupting itself if AI art winds up in the dataset used to train the AI Is another thing I didn't mention. Basically every error an AI does (to the human eye anyway) would get increasingly prominent the more AI art it cycles through itself in it's data unless it was set up to automatically reject AI created art from being included in it's data which comically enough they havent thought of doing this really basic thing as far as im aware. You actually can detect AI with tools but I have been training myself to detect it by eye just for sake of proving it isn't better than real artists. A lot of stuff in AI art has no logical pattern to it like how clothing and hair sits is just random. So people who say it's good just aren't looking close enough. It actually is a little harder when it comes to fake people created since they are more plain in appearance but I have noticed similar faces so I might eventually better spot that too one i start seeing more patterns other than obvious errors. JaniSIr said: It kind of is a big leap, because code isn't like an image that you can approximate with no consequence. The worst an image can do is give someone nightmares with hands. One typo and the application might be totally broken in various hard to fix ways. Maybe AI could be able to generate simple websites in the near future, but any serious job is unlikely. At any decently sized companies there are a lot of checks before the code can make it to clients. AI code basically starts with a black box, and anything written like that would need to be thoroughly tested and by a real programmer before doing the regular pipeline. So basically as I said, it might be good for saving on typing. As far as im aware there hasn't yet been an AI made specifically for programming though. Even ones that arent tailored just for that still do a decent job so I don't think it would be much a leap. It also can be made more idiot proof for the AI by using a language like Scratch to train it before it gets into languages that it has more places it can mess up. Well that is one way it can be used but I wasn't speculating on intent. I just was providing a counterpoint to "AI is superior to human artists and will replace them" kind of statements since if someone can claim that I can claim AI will replace programmers. JaniSIr said: That's kind of expected, but being openly biased on top of that is straight up unethical. It depends how your question is phrased and what AI you are using. |
Reply to traed
Lucifrost said:
There is more than enough art in the public domain that can train AI. But I don't think AI art can succeed long-term for the reasons you've stated.
There is more than enough art in the public domain that can train AI. But I don't think AI art can succeed long-term for the reasons you've stated.
Using public domain wouldn't produce enough unique look to it for each studio like in house artists being the basis of the model would. Public domain would just help get the general stuff down rather than the style. But yeah it would fail at innovating and will wind up corrupting itself if AI art winds up in the dataset used to train the AI Is another thing I didn't mention. Basically every error an AI does (to the human eye anyway) would get increasingly prominent the more AI art it cycles through itself in it's data unless it was set up to automatically reject AI created art from being included in it's data which comically enough they havent thought of doing this really basic thing as far as im aware.
You actually can detect AI with tools but I have been training myself to detect it by eye just for sake of proving it isn't better than real artists. A lot of stuff in AI art has no logical pattern to it like how clothing and hair sits is just random. So people who say it's good just aren't looking close enough. It actually is a little harder when it comes to fake people created since they are more plain in appearance but I have noticed similar faces so I might eventually better spot that too one i start seeing more patterns other than obvious errors.
JaniSIr said:
It kind of is a big leap, because code isn't like an image that you can approximate with no consequence.
The worst an image can do is give someone nightmares with hands.
One typo and the application might be totally broken in various hard to fix ways.
Maybe AI could be able to generate simple websites in the near future, but any serious job is unlikely.
At any decently sized companies there are a lot of checks before the code can make it to clients.
AI code basically starts with a black box, and anything written like that would need to be thoroughly tested and by a real programmer before doing the regular pipeline.
So basically as I said, it might be good for saving on typing.
It kind of is a big leap, because code isn't like an image that you can approximate with no consequence.
The worst an image can do is give someone nightmares with hands.
One typo and the application might be totally broken in various hard to fix ways.
Maybe AI could be able to generate simple websites in the near future, but any serious job is unlikely.
At any decently sized companies there are a lot of checks before the code can make it to clients.
AI code basically starts with a black box, and anything written like that would need to be thoroughly tested and by a real programmer before doing the regular pipeline.
So basically as I said, it might be good for saving on typing.
As far as im aware there hasn't yet been an AI made specifically for programming though. Even ones that arent tailored just for that still do a decent job so I don't think it would be much a leap. It also can be made more idiot proof for the AI by using a language like Scratch to train it before it gets into languages that it has more places it can mess up.
Well that is one way it can be used but I wasn't speculating on intent. I just was providing a counterpoint to "AI is superior to human artists and will replace them" kind of statements since if someone can claim that I can claim AI will replace programmers.
JaniSIr said:
That's kind of expected, but being openly biased on top of that is straight up unethical.
That's kind of expected, but being openly biased on top of that is straight up unethical.
It depends how your question is phrased and what AI you are using.
| @traed There is Github copilot actually... As I said, it generally saves on typing, or stack overflow googling. |
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Reply to rsc-pl
I'd take inbetweening done by assisted AI over garbage 3DCG any day. AI can make coloring easier for people working on anime series too.
People that seeing AI as something 100% bad are delusional.
I really like people's reaction to the AI translations (as for the recent events).
The overwhelming majority of commenters (even on "translators" profiles) prefer AI translations to the crap done by localizers with woke agenda pushing, cultural washout and deep text changes.
I'm glad that so many people have finally opened their eyes to the vandalism called localization.
Unfortunately, current language models are not yet able to translate the dialogues of literary fiction on their own. Lots of uncensored models that can be used locally have a lot of capability but it's not there yet. In contrast, censored, politically correct to the extreme commercial products like Chat GPT are not usable at all.
People that seeing AI as something 100% bad are delusional.
I really like people's reaction to the AI translations (as for the recent events).
The overwhelming majority of commenters (even on "translators" profiles) prefer AI translations to the crap done by localizers with woke agenda pushing, cultural washout and deep text changes.
I'm glad that so many people have finally opened their eyes to the vandalism called localization.
Unfortunately, current language models are not yet able to translate the dialogues of literary fiction on their own. Lots of uncensored models that can be used locally have a lot of capability but it's not there yet. In contrast, censored, politically correct to the extreme commercial products like Chat GPT are not usable at all.
| @rsc-pl I don't think AI can work alone. I believe the best solution right now would be to have a team of multiple people working on translations and thoroughly working through every single step of the translation process. These people should preferably not be very political towards any side. While AI could help, it is still quite flawed, and probably won't be able to do so well with Japanese slang, and will translate words that don't need translating. Also the AI program will likely be coded to match the politics of the creator, whether they are left, right, centrist, or any political view. I don't think "wokeness" alone is the enemy, but is the localization system in general, which doesn't always have one specific political side. Back in the day, it was more common to see right-wing localization in anime, like when Sailor Moon's lesbian couple was changed to "cousins" in the localization. There is also some localization that is not necessarily political, like adding meme references into Nagatoro's translations, such as the Chad vs. Soyjak meme. And if the "woke" localizers do go away, there is a chance that new localizers of any political affiliation will come in to replace them, whether they are the same or the opposite, just like what happened in the past. It will not be a simple task to get rid of all localization. Getting rid of only "wokeness" or only Crunchyroll will not be enough to solve the problem, and AI will not solve it either. Solving the localization problem will have to be done by anime fans and not corporations that will just become another 4kids or another Crunchyroll. Teams should translate an anime through a rigorous and detailed process instead of just one person, and should take a week or two per episode, instead of just a day. Translators notes are important too, especially for Japanese speech patterns and slang. TL;DR: Getting rid of the current localizers alone will not work. We have to completely evade the corporate system of localization and localizers and get teams of real anime fans to translate anime accurately and leave it uncensored. One person alone shouldn't translate an anime, and neither should AI translate it alone. |
Reply to rsc-pl
I'd take inbetweening done by assisted AI over garbage 3DCG any day. AI can make coloring easier for people working on anime series too.
People that seeing AI as something 100% bad are delusional.
I really like people's reaction to the AI translations (as for the recent events).
The overwhelming majority of commenters (even on "translators" profiles) prefer AI translations to the crap done by localizers with woke agenda pushing, cultural washout and deep text changes.
I'm glad that so many people have finally opened their eyes to the vandalism called localization.
Unfortunately, current language models are not yet able to translate the dialogues of literary fiction on their own. Lots of uncensored models that can be used locally have a lot of capability but it's not there yet. In contrast, censored, politically correct to the extreme commercial products like Chat GPT are not usable at all.
People that seeing AI as something 100% bad are delusional.
I really like people's reaction to the AI translations (as for the recent events).
The overwhelming majority of commenters (even on "translators" profiles) prefer AI translations to the crap done by localizers with woke agenda pushing, cultural washout and deep text changes.
I'm glad that so many people have finally opened their eyes to the vandalism called localization.
Unfortunately, current language models are not yet able to translate the dialogues of literary fiction on their own. Lots of uncensored models that can be used locally have a lot of capability but it's not there yet. In contrast, censored, politically correct to the extreme commercial products like Chat GPT are not usable at all.
rsc-pl said: I really like people's reaction to the AI translations (as for the recent events). The overwhelming majority of commenters (even on "translators" profiles) prefer AI translations to the crap done by localizers with woke agenda pushing, cultural washout and deep text changes. I'm glad that so many people have finally opened their eyes to the vandalism called localization. Unfortunately, current language models are not yet able to translate the dialogues of literary fiction on their own. Lots of uncensored models that can be used locally have a lot of capability but it's not there yet. In contrast, censored, politically correct to the extreme commercial products like Chat GPT are not usable at all. If the "Overwhelming majority" prefer AI translations, they are genuinely fucking stupid. As someone who is learning Japanese, Machine translations are fucking terrible and do not understand basic things like context, fictional terminology, and with how Japanese as a language works, lots of assumptions and estimation needs to be used due to just how vastly different it is from English. There are flat out words and phrases that do not have any direct translation due to just how vastly different the historical and cultural context the language was birthed in was. And with how in Japanese you can just completely cut off the subject of a sentence and leave it implied, a ton of interpretation is needed since you can't always just contact the original writer and ask for clarification. Sure this can lead to mistakes such as Junpei mentioning the wrong person when talking about how he was sad somebody died in Persona 3 FES, but translators try their hardest to figure out what the subject is in these cases where they are cut off and 99% of the time are able to get something that makes sense and works. AI can't do that and will generally just leave that sentence as is or add in a subject that makes literally no sense such as turning a 3rd person sentence into a first person one. Also can it with the "anti-woke" crap. A lot of the time you people complain about localizers "adding in stuff", it was already there in the first place and you are just huffing copium to shield your bigotry because you can't accept social commentary being an inherent part of art. Anyone who unironically calls things "woke" should not be taken seriously. |
This post is brought to you by your local transfem gamer goblin. Will not tolerate bigotry and will fight against "anti-woke" sentiment to make the anime community a safer place.  |
| AI will never replace humans in art, it will just take a lot of the filler parts. Ai will help you create a vision, that vision though, will always be human. Will it take jobs? of course, but it will never replace creativity, that just doesn't happen. |
| Also available at: YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCK8spdL1M_J-z0vO2C7jPLw Why You Should Watch Akudama Drive: https://youtu.be/Yw0r52wRjgA An AMV I that I spend way too much time on: A Love Letter To Anime「AMV」: https://youtu.be/YQyqxFM2m9Q My referral code to a website/app that gives you free money (a few cents a day) by using a few megabytes of your internet for file sharing. We both get a bonus if you use my link: https://r.honeygain.me/ARSHIA7942 |
Reply to karrotStick
It's started, and this is another instance of it,
https://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/2023-12-21/the-ancient-magus-bride-manga-return-gets-simultaneous-english-release-using-ai-translation/.205774
And what's worse is their audacity to copyright those works. To me, the use of AI = nobody has any right to that particular work and they must be okay with free distribution.
Now, if they refuse to do that, eventually piracy will be at an all time high and I am all for it.
https://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/2023-12-21/the-ancient-magus-bride-manga-return-gets-simultaneous-english-release-using-ai-translation/.205774
And what's worse is their audacity to copyright those works. To me, the use of AI = nobody has any right to that particular work and they must be okay with free distribution.
Now, if they refuse to do that, eventually piracy will be at an all time high and I am all for it.
| @karrotStick I 100% agree with this sentiment and it seems that a judge probably would too. Here in the United States (where I live) there was a legal case called Naruto v. David Slater et al. in where a monkey (given the name Naruto by PETA) took a selfie of itself using the camera of wildlife photographer David Slater. Here in the US, the person who actually takes a picture with the camera is the one who is assigned copyright, so the legal case was saying that Naruto the monkey should be given copyright of the photo that he took of himself and not Slater. The ruling of the case was that only a human was eligible to hold copyright, and that works created by animals are not eligible to be copyrighted. Since precedent is how US law works, the precedent that only a human can hold copyright could extend to AI generated images and text since a human did not create them. The murky part here is when a copyrighted work is translated using AI since the IP already belongs to someone, but the text does not. In my opinion if I were in charge it would 100% revoke copyright eligibility but in the real world its a bit of a mess and with how corrupt our world is, any potential ruling would go in favor of a corporation in this capitalist hellscape we live in. If a new show were to be made by AI it would probably 100% be public domain but existing IP getting involved makes things a mess |
| This post is brought to you by your local transfem gamer goblin. Will not tolerate bigotry and will fight against "anti-woke" sentiment to make the anime community a safer place. |
Reply to LSSJ_Gaming
rsc-pl said:
I really like people's reaction to the AI translations (as for the recent events).
The overwhelming majority of commenters (even on "translators" profiles) prefer AI translations to the crap done by localizers with woke agenda pushing, cultural washout and deep text changes.
I'm glad that so many people have finally opened their eyes to the vandalism called localization.
Unfortunately, current language models are not yet able to translate the dialogues of literary fiction on their own. Lots of uncensored models that can be used locally have a lot of capability but it's not there yet. In contrast, censored, politically correct to the extreme commercial products like Chat GPT are not usable at all.
I really like people's reaction to the AI translations (as for the recent events).
The overwhelming majority of commenters (even on "translators" profiles) prefer AI translations to the crap done by localizers with woke agenda pushing, cultural washout and deep text changes.
I'm glad that so many people have finally opened their eyes to the vandalism called localization.
Unfortunately, current language models are not yet able to translate the dialogues of literary fiction on their own. Lots of uncensored models that can be used locally have a lot of capability but it's not there yet. In contrast, censored, politically correct to the extreme commercial products like Chat GPT are not usable at all.
If the "Overwhelming majority" prefer AI translations, they are genuinely fucking stupid. As someone who is learning Japanese, Machine translations are fucking terrible and do not understand basic things like context, fictional terminology, and with how Japanese as a language works, lots of assumptions and estimation needs to be used due to just how vastly different it is from English. There are flat out words and phrases that do not have any direct translation due to just how vastly different the historical and cultural context the language was birthed in was. And with how in Japanese you can just completely cut off the subject of a sentence and leave it implied, a ton of interpretation is needed since you can't always just contact the original writer and ask for clarification. Sure this can lead to mistakes such as Junpei mentioning the wrong person when talking about how he was sad somebody died in Persona 3 FES, but translators try their hardest to figure out what the subject is in these cases where they are cut off and 99% of the time are able to get something that makes sense and works. AI can't do that and will generally just leave that sentence as is or add in a subject that makes literally no sense such as turning a 3rd person sentence into a first person one.
Also can it with the "anti-woke" crap. A lot of the time you people complain about localizers "adding in stuff", it was already there in the first place and you are just huffing copium to shield your bigotry because you can't accept social commentary being an inherent part of art. Anyone who unironically calls things "woke" should not be taken seriously.
| @LSSJ_Gaming I think MT and AI system is different, last time i check rasaAI because i want to know how the program work and it's like multiple loops while MT is just straight detecting the language and meaning. AI will decide the intention, story, rule, subject, etc first and output will be changed accordingly (i know this is not for translation but more like chatbotAI but i think the process not that much different). |
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Reply to DreamingBeats
ColourWheel said:
I would be more worried about AI replacing Voice acting before AI would ever begin to completely replace entire teams of animators in the industry. Seeing since to generate voice acting even today one simply only needs enough samples of someones voice to accomplish this.
I would be more worried about AI replacing Voice acting before AI would ever begin to completely replace entire teams of animators in the industry. Seeing since to generate voice acting even today one simply only needs enough samples of someones voice to accomplish this.
Even if the technology matures to the point the AI voice is indistinguishable from real voice actors (and there has been a lot of progress on that front), it won't replace people working in the industry, at least in in Japan. This is because besides reading a few lines of dialogue for anime, they also participate in activities requiring their physical presence. For example, live shows, doing fan meet-ups. In essence, voice actors are basically celebrities in Japan, and no automated voice will be able to replace them. It's kinda like saying that fans of Taylor Swift or Beyonce will become irrelevant once AI becomes a thing.
Besides, we also have to consider the legal implications. A company can't just use someone else's voice for a commercial work without their explicit permission and consent. And even if, for the sake of argument, the law allows this, the decision would likely be very unpopular among the paying fanbase of said artist, who may end up boycotting the product. They could pay people for the right to use their voices, but it may very well be easier and cheaper to just hire them instead.
Having said that, AI could be used for non-important voice roles such as background characters. In that regard, it could make it harder for newcomers to establish their career in the voice acting industry (many va start out as voicing unimportant, background characters)
by the way, this is a very old concern. People were worried that vocaloids and utauloids would replace real life singers. That has not happened.
| @DreamingBeats You are right but I never did specifically say AI voicing would replace actual voice actors. I was simply pointing out that it would be more likely for that to happen before AI would completely replace animators in the industry. I am personal not concerned about either thing happening anytime soon. |
LSSJ_Gaming said: Also can it with the "anti-woke" crap. A lot of the time you people complain about localizers "adding in stuff", it was already there in the first place and you are just huffing copium to shield your bigotry because you can't accept social commentary being an inherent part of art. Anyone who unironically calls things "woke" should not be taken seriously. While some people say something is added that wasnt there is obvious cases something is added. There was that time a reference to GamerGate was added in for no fucking reason and wasnt even close to what was being said. I forgot what show it was added since I didnt watch it I think it was Prison School? The Dangers in My Heart I saw had "mansplaining" forced in for no reason and it didnt fit the scene at all because nothing condescending was being said and it sounded out of character. It was later corrected at least I heard. |
traedDec 23, 2023 2:02 PM
Reply to PlasticRobot
SuperAdventure said:
Good luck stopping progress. After witnessing how readily current-gen lapped up cgi I see no hope in you stopping this. GenZ loves it- therefore you lose.
Good luck stopping progress. After witnessing how readily current-gen lapped up cgi I see no hope in you stopping this. GenZ loves it- therefore you lose.
Rather a pathetic mindset, don't you think?
What about the 3D CG is so bad to you exactly? Purely the fact it isn't 2D? Do you understand a human artist must model, rig, animate, and render something that's 3D in this way? "Hand drawn" art hasn't, and will most likely never, be "replaced" by digital artistic mediums. That's complete nonsense.
3D CG and AI aren't even somewhat related in this way, but still, they are both tools that ought to be used. Would you really turn away completely from an anime that was good, but also happened to have an AI assisting the staff in some places?
I think people are more concerned with the idea of anime and animation changing rather than the actual change itself. Think with your head!
| @PlasticRobot My question was more a question for the OP. I do not and have never liked CGI. That is my preference, I don't need to justify it with you. Acting like someone has no right to like something you like is a pathetic mindset, don't you think? "3D CG and AI aren't even remotely". YES THEY ARE. They are both methods of computer art. Hand creation is what isn't related. And what does the relationship have to do with it? You have a problem understanding comparisons. Current Gen is happy with CGI now they're suddenly worrying (some of them are) about the "old" method (which is now CGI) being replaced by the new ways. Don't ask me, I'm far removed from this argument. I don't care for either. I'm not bothered if you think this is dull or outdated. Doesn't matter. You'll be in the same position one day. |
Reply to SuperAdventure
@PlasticRobot
My question was more a question for the OP.
I do not and have never liked CGI. That is my preference, I don't need to justify it with you. Acting like someone has no right to like something you like is a pathetic mindset, don't you think?
"3D CG and AI aren't even remotely". YES THEY ARE. They are both methods of computer art. Hand creation is what isn't related. And what does the relationship have to do with it? You have a problem understanding comparisons.
Current Gen is happy with CGI now they're suddenly worrying (some of them are) about the "old" method (which is now CGI) being replaced by the new ways. Don't ask me, I'm far removed from this argument. I don't care for either. I'm not bothered if you think this is dull or outdated. Doesn't matter. You'll be in the same position one day.
My question was more a question for the OP.
I do not and have never liked CGI. That is my preference, I don't need to justify it with you. Acting like someone has no right to like something you like is a pathetic mindset, don't you think?
"3D CG and AI aren't even remotely". YES THEY ARE. They are both methods of computer art. Hand creation is what isn't related. And what does the relationship have to do with it? You have a problem understanding comparisons.
Current Gen is happy with CGI now they're suddenly worrying (some of them are) about the "old" method (which is now CGI) being replaced by the new ways. Don't ask me, I'm far removed from this argument. I don't care for either. I'm not bothered if you think this is dull or outdated. Doesn't matter. You'll be in the same position one day.
SuperAdventure said: That is my preference, I don't need to justify it with you. Acting like someone has no right to like something you like is a pathetic mindset, don't you think? That is literally what you believe! I at no point said "you can't like X because I don't". I'm simply trying to understand your defeatist, non-argument against modern digital tools being used to make art. You, on the other hand, have no point to make against these things because there is not a broader context where they are currently used. The comparison between 3D CG and AI as "new methods" replacing "old methods" is completely erroneous, and shows you really don't know what you're talking about. You have no reasons to push back on this yet, but in your mind it is inherently different and altogether not good. SuperAdventure said: "3D CG and AI aren't even remotely". YES THEY ARE. They are both methods of computer art. Hand creation is what isn't related. And what does the relationship have to do with it? You have a problem understanding comparisons. I think I have a problem understanding what you're even saying. SuperAdventure said: Don't ask me, I'm far removed from this argument. I don't care for either. I'm not bothered if you think this is dull or outdated. Doesn't matter. You'll be in the same position one day. Well, pardon me, but I take it that you really aren't all that removed from the argument considering you came back to double-down on what you said before. And this is what I mean when I say it's a "pathetic mindset". You want me to feel the same jadedness as you? The same disdain towards a newer thing? Why? |
 |
| I suspect ai will be advanced enough in the future to be indistinguishable from real art. Kind of crazy ai can replicate art so well. People used to think ai could never make comprehensable art. |
 |
Reply to PlasticRobot
SuperAdventure said:
That is my preference, I don't need to justify it with you. Acting like someone has no right to like something you like is a pathetic mindset, don't you think?
That is my preference, I don't need to justify it with you. Acting like someone has no right to like something you like is a pathetic mindset, don't you think?
That is literally what you believe! I at no point said "you can't like X because I don't". I'm simply trying to understand your defeatist, non-argument against modern digital tools being used to make art. You, on the other hand, have no point to make against these things because there is not a broader context where they are currently used. The comparison between 3D CG and AI as "new methods" replacing "old methods" is completely erroneous, and shows you really don't know what you're talking about. You have no reasons to push back on this yet, but in your mind it is inherently different and altogether not good.
SuperAdventure said:
"3D CG and AI aren't even remotely". YES THEY ARE. They are both methods of computer art. Hand creation is what isn't related. And what does the relationship have to do with it? You have a problem understanding comparisons.
"3D CG and AI aren't even remotely". YES THEY ARE. They are both methods of computer art. Hand creation is what isn't related. And what does the relationship have to do with it? You have a problem understanding comparisons.
I think I have a problem understanding what you're even saying.
SuperAdventure said:
Don't ask me, I'm far removed from this argument. I don't care for either. I'm not bothered if you think this is dull or outdated. Doesn't matter. You'll be in the same position one day.
Don't ask me, I'm far removed from this argument. I don't care for either. I'm not bothered if you think this is dull or outdated. Doesn't matter. You'll be in the same position one day.
Well, pardon me, but I take it that you really aren't all that removed from the argument considering you came back to double-down on what you said before. And this is what I mean when I say it's a "pathetic mindset". You want me to feel the same jadedness as you? The same disdain towards a newer thing? Why?
PlasticRobot said: That is literally what you believe! I at no point said "you can't like X because I don't". I'm simply trying to understand your defeatist, non-argument against modern digital tools being used to make art. You, on the other hand, have no point to make against these things because there is not a broader context where they are currently used. The comparison between 3D CG and AI as "new methods" replacing "old methods" is completely erroneous, and shows you really don't know what you're talking about. You have no reasons to push back on this yet, but in your mind it is inherently different and altogether not good Dude. Tell us how you really feel.... |
| @animegamer245 Ah yeah on occasion lip flap matching has some occasional validity but often not because anime often doesnt actually use very varied lip movement like western animation does so there is a lot of flexibility. I also thought they sometimes shorten scenes in some dubs to get around extra lip movement anyway. |
Reply to SuperAdventure
@PlasticRobot
My question was more a question for the OP.
I do not and have never liked CGI. That is my preference, I don't need to justify it with you. Acting like someone has no right to like something you like is a pathetic mindset, don't you think?
"3D CG and AI aren't even remotely". YES THEY ARE. They are both methods of computer art. Hand creation is what isn't related. And what does the relationship have to do with it? You have a problem understanding comparisons.
Current Gen is happy with CGI now they're suddenly worrying (some of them are) about the "old" method (which is now CGI) being replaced by the new ways. Don't ask me, I'm far removed from this argument. I don't care for either. I'm not bothered if you think this is dull or outdated. Doesn't matter. You'll be in the same position one day.
My question was more a question for the OP.
I do not and have never liked CGI. That is my preference, I don't need to justify it with you. Acting like someone has no right to like something you like is a pathetic mindset, don't you think?
"3D CG and AI aren't even remotely". YES THEY ARE. They are both methods of computer art. Hand creation is what isn't related. And what does the relationship have to do with it? You have a problem understanding comparisons.
Current Gen is happy with CGI now they're suddenly worrying (some of them are) about the "old" method (which is now CGI) being replaced by the new ways. Don't ask me, I'm far removed from this argument. I don't care for either. I'm not bothered if you think this is dull or outdated. Doesn't matter. You'll be in the same position one day.
| @SuperAdventure If you wanted to ask me here's what I got to say. I've actually had to take a class on 3D Animation as a requirement for my major in college, so I am somewhat knowledgeable on the topic. 3D CG literally is not comparable at all to AI generated images. The only thing they have in common is that they have a computer involved. 3D animation has so many steps involved with human hands from sculpting the model itself, rigging it so that it moves, texturing it, adding shaders, the actual process of animation itself which from my experience is still pretty time consuming, rendering, and if you are implementing your CG shot with 2D elements, an extra step of compositing those elements together is required and some tweaks may be done like manual animation corrections in 2D over some CG elements to make the assets blend together. CGI has also proven to be a very useful tool in 2D animated projects in order to create dynamic camera angles that would be near impossible to draw in 2D with the strict timeline that the animation pipeline is under. There's a lot of effort and artistry that goes into 3DCG animation and a lot of great 3DCG is implemented into 2D shows so well that it either isn't that noticeable or fits in with the assets so well even if you can tell it was used. Projects such as Kill la Kill, the first few Seasons of Attack on Titan, Chainsaw Man, Promare, and Dragon Ball Super Broly use 3DCG as a tool to enhance and add on to the already excellent 2D animation and make shots that just wouldn't be possible without it and elevating the artistry. AI has no artistry and inherently lowers the quality of a work. AI generated images are really prone to having bad anatomy, generic art styles, the same few types of shading, details that physically don't make sense, messy lineart that looks like its melting, is not internally consistent and shifts in style and details between images, and inherently relies on theft of other people's work. AI image generation models are trained off of data scraped without the consent of the artists who's works are being used, and 99% of artists would never consent to their works being used by an AI model anyways. Pretty much any real artist can tell you that there's really no benefits to using AI at all and the ethical implications are pretty bad, as corporations are going to use it to churn out lower quality work that looks passable enough to some boomer executive, and then toss away actual artists who put in their experience and emotions into creating genuine art that has actual soul and creativity to it. AI has no creativity, it can literally only regurgitate what it has been fed. It has little to no use at all for an artist, so comparing it to 3DCG is not a fair comparison. |
| This post is brought to you by your local transfem gamer goblin. Will not tolerate bigotry and will fight against "anti-woke" sentiment to make the anime community a safer place. |
Reply to traed
LSSJ_Gaming said:
Also can it with the "anti-woke" crap. A lot of the time you people complain about localizers "adding in stuff", it was already there in the first place and you are just huffing copium to shield your bigotry because you can't accept social commentary being an inherent part of art. Anyone who unironically calls things "woke" should not be taken seriously.
Also can it with the "anti-woke" crap. A lot of the time you people complain about localizers "adding in stuff", it was already there in the first place and you are just huffing copium to shield your bigotry because you can't accept social commentary being an inherent part of art. Anyone who unironically calls things "woke" should not be taken seriously.
While some people say something is added that wasnt there is obvious cases something is added. There was that time a reference to GamerGate was added in for no fucking reason and wasnt even close to what was being said. I forgot what show it was added since I didnt watch it I think it was Prison School?
The Dangers in My Heart I saw had "mansplaining" forced in for no reason and it didnt fit the scene at all because nothing condescending was being said and it sounded out of character. It was later corrected at least I heard.
| @traed Comedy anime tend to be given more creative freedom in their localizations in order to make jokes land with the new audience and some lines in comedy anime dubs are actually improv. Ghost Stories is probably the most extreme example of improv as the entire script was pretty much improv in that dub, but in most comedy anime, jokes are given more creative liberty in regard to translation and improv can also be encouraged in some scenes. If you've seen something as recent as Rent a Girlfriend's dub, where most of the lines were improvised on the spot such as this clip Aleks Le (Kazuya's Voice Actor) uploaded to his Youtube channel. Comparing a comedy anime like Prison School to something like Jojo for example is just not really that fair due to that reason. The "mansplaining" thing was just weird word choice, no need to politicize it or anything. That word isn't even commonly used that much anymore in slang so getting upset over it is kinda dumb. |
| This post is brought to you by your local transfem gamer goblin. Will not tolerate bigotry and will fight against "anti-woke" sentiment to make the anime community a safer place. |
Reply to traed
@animegamer245
Ah yeah on occasion lip flap matching has some occasional validity but often not because anime often doesnt actually use very varied lip movement like western animation does so there is a lot of flexibility. I also thought they sometimes shorten scenes in some dubs to get around extra lip movement anyway.
Ah yeah on occasion lip flap matching has some occasional validity but often not because anime often doesnt actually use very varied lip movement like western animation does so there is a lot of flexibility. I also thought they sometimes shorten scenes in some dubs to get around extra lip movement anyway.
| @traed The practice of cutting down the footage to get around lip flaps is only really done in hackdubs like everything 4Kids, Dic, Saban and Nelvana did. 99% of dubs don't trim footage in order for it to synch up with the Japanese version for Blu Ray and Streaming as it takes much less space to have an alternate audio track compared to an alternate video track. |
| This post is brought to you by your local transfem gamer goblin. Will not tolerate bigotry and will fight against "anti-woke" sentiment to make the anime community a safer place. |
| AI can only use images that already exists, they can't create something "new", so companies might think "oh we just use some AI images and voice and Bob's your uncle", but that's just stupid, they have to base their images on something and if they have that - and with some human help to cover the constant mistakes AI make - I'm sure AI will be revolutionary for anime. |
Reply to LSSJ_Gaming
@traed
Comedy anime tend to be given more creative freedom in their localizations in order to make jokes land with the new audience and some lines in comedy anime dubs are actually improv. Ghost Stories is probably the most extreme example of improv as the entire script was pretty much improv in that dub, but in most comedy anime, jokes are given more creative liberty in regard to translation and improv can also be encouraged in some scenes. If you've seen something as recent as Rent a Girlfriend's dub, where most of the lines were improvised on the spot such as this clip Aleks Le (Kazuya's Voice Actor) uploaded to his Youtube channel. Comparing a comedy anime like Prison School to something like Jojo for example is just not really that fair due to that reason.
The "mansplaining" thing was just weird word choice, no need to politicize it or anything. That word isn't even commonly used that much anymore in slang so getting upset over it is kinda dumb.
Comedy anime tend to be given more creative freedom in their localizations in order to make jokes land with the new audience and some lines in comedy anime dubs are actually improv. Ghost Stories is probably the most extreme example of improv as the entire script was pretty much improv in that dub, but in most comedy anime, jokes are given more creative liberty in regard to translation and improv can also be encouraged in some scenes. If you've seen something as recent as Rent a Girlfriend's dub, where most of the lines were improvised on the spot such as this clip Aleks Le (Kazuya's Voice Actor) uploaded to his Youtube channel. Comparing a comedy anime like Prison School to something like Jojo for example is just not really that fair due to that reason.
The "mansplaining" thing was just weird word choice, no need to politicize it or anything. That word isn't even commonly used that much anymore in slang so getting upset over it is kinda dumb.
| @LSSJ_Gaming But still using highly topical obscure things no one will remember in a couple years seems like a bad choice and there is such a thing as a failed joke. I already said in another post that sometimes an equivalency has to be added for a joke to be understood though someone has to be a decent writer of jokes still since equivalency isnt same joke just a similar one. I didnt necessarily say it inherently was politicizing but it shows some translators dont understand how people talk in real life. |
| It's sad how ai is being used to replace human expression rather than being used in ways to improve people's quality of life. Like how about they replace the jobs that no one wants to do rather than the things people are passionate about? I'm not going to watch things made by a machine. It defeats the purpose of art imo |
Reply to LSSJ_Gaming
rsc-pl said:
I really like people's reaction to the AI translations (as for the recent events).
The overwhelming majority of commenters (even on "translators" profiles) prefer AI translations to the crap done by localizers with woke agenda pushing, cultural washout and deep text changes.
I'm glad that so many people have finally opened their eyes to the vandalism called localization.
Unfortunately, current language models are not yet able to translate the dialogues of literary fiction on their own. Lots of uncensored models that can be used locally have a lot of capability but it's not there yet. In contrast, censored, politically correct to the extreme commercial products like Chat GPT are not usable at all.
I really like people's reaction to the AI translations (as for the recent events).
The overwhelming majority of commenters (even on "translators" profiles) prefer AI translations to the crap done by localizers with woke agenda pushing, cultural washout and deep text changes.
I'm glad that so many people have finally opened their eyes to the vandalism called localization.
Unfortunately, current language models are not yet able to translate the dialogues of literary fiction on their own. Lots of uncensored models that can be used locally have a lot of capability but it's not there yet. In contrast, censored, politically correct to the extreme commercial products like Chat GPT are not usable at all.
If the "Overwhelming majority" prefer AI translations, they are genuinely fucking stupid. As someone who is learning Japanese, Machine translations are fucking terrible and do not understand basic things like context, fictional terminology, and with how Japanese as a language works, lots of assumptions and estimation needs to be used due to just how vastly different it is from English. There are flat out words and phrases that do not have any direct translation due to just how vastly different the historical and cultural context the language was birthed in was. And with how in Japanese you can just completely cut off the subject of a sentence and leave it implied, a ton of interpretation is needed since you can't always just contact the original writer and ask for clarification. Sure this can lead to mistakes such as Junpei mentioning the wrong person when talking about how he was sad somebody died in Persona 3 FES, but translators try their hardest to figure out what the subject is in these cases where they are cut off and 99% of the time are able to get something that makes sense and works. AI can't do that and will generally just leave that sentence as is or add in a subject that makes literally no sense such as turning a 3rd person sentence into a first person one.
Also can it with the "anti-woke" crap. A lot of the time you people complain about localizers "adding in stuff", it was already there in the first place and you are just huffing copium to shield your bigotry because you can't accept social commentary being an inherent part of art. Anyone who unironically calls things "woke" should not be taken seriously.
LSSJ_Gaming said: If the "Overwhelming majority" prefer AI translations, they are genuinely fucking stupid. It's also obviously not true, or else real people would have stopped translating things. |
| その目だれの目？ |
Reply to LSSJ_Gaming
@traed
Comedy anime tend to be given more creative freedom in their localizations in order to make jokes land with the new audience and some lines in comedy anime dubs are actually improv. Ghost Stories is probably the most extreme example of improv as the entire script was pretty much improv in that dub, but in most comedy anime, jokes are given more creative liberty in regard to translation and improv can also be encouraged in some scenes. If you've seen something as recent as Rent a Girlfriend's dub, where most of the lines were improvised on the spot such as this clip Aleks Le (Kazuya's Voice Actor) uploaded to his Youtube channel. Comparing a comedy anime like Prison School to something like Jojo for example is just not really that fair due to that reason.
The "mansplaining" thing was just weird word choice, no need to politicize it or anything. That word isn't even commonly used that much anymore in slang so getting upset over it is kinda dumb.
Comedy anime tend to be given more creative freedom in their localizations in order to make jokes land with the new audience and some lines in comedy anime dubs are actually improv. Ghost Stories is probably the most extreme example of improv as the entire script was pretty much improv in that dub, but in most comedy anime, jokes are given more creative liberty in regard to translation and improv can also be encouraged in some scenes. If you've seen something as recent as Rent a Girlfriend's dub, where most of the lines were improvised on the spot such as this clip Aleks Le (Kazuya's Voice Actor) uploaded to his Youtube channel. Comparing a comedy anime like Prison School to something like Jojo for example is just not really that fair due to that reason.
The "mansplaining" thing was just weird word choice, no need to politicize it or anything. That word isn't even commonly used that much anymore in slang so getting upset over it is kinda dumb.
LSSJ_Gaming said: Ghost Stories is probably the most extreme example of improv as the entire script was pretty much improv in that dub, but in most comedy anime, jokes are given more creative liberty in regard to translation and improv can also be encouraged in some scenes. Ghost Stories is a poor example as the original is not a comedy. |
| その目だれの目？ |
Reply to traed
@LSSJ_Gaming
But still using highly topical obscure things no one will remember in a couple years seems like a bad choice and there is such a thing as a failed joke. I already said in another post that sometimes an equivalency has to be added for a joke to be understood though someone has to be a decent writer of jokes still since equivalency isnt same joke just a similar one.
I didnt necessarily say it inherently was politicizing but it shows some translators dont understand how people talk in real life.
But still using highly topical obscure things no one will remember in a couple years seems like a bad choice and there is such a thing as a failed joke. I already said in another post that sometimes an equivalency has to be added for a joke to be understood though someone has to be a decent writer of jokes still since equivalency isnt same joke just a similar one.
I didnt necessarily say it inherently was politicizing but it shows some translators dont understand how people talk in real life.
| @traed I mean it was an ad libbed line and it didn't work for everyone. I personally found it pretty funny but obviously with improv your mileage may vary. A lot more people remember the incident that the show was poking fun at than you'd think as well Anime characters don't even talk like real people in the first place so that's a weird argument to use |
| This post is brought to you by your local transfem gamer goblin. Will not tolerate bigotry and will fight against "anti-woke" sentiment to make the anime community a safer place. |
Reply to LSSJ_Gaming
@traed
I mean it was an ad libbed line and it didn't work for everyone. I personally found it pretty funny but obviously with improv your mileage may vary. A lot more people remember the incident that the show was poking fun at than you'd think as well
Anime characters don't even talk like real people in the first place so that's a weird argument to use
I mean it was an ad libbed line and it didn't work for everyone. I personally found it pretty funny but obviously with improv your mileage may vary. A lot more people remember the incident that the show was poking fun at than you'd think as well
Anime characters don't even talk like real people in the first place so that's a weird argument to use
| @LSSJ_Gaming Anime characters only sound odd for a few reasons like language differences which highlight cultural differences as well, heightened dialogue we see in all media which is how people talk when intelligent and quick enough, ways of explaining things to the viewer, and because anime characters speak more casually than the average Japanese but so do real Japanese people, and then some quirks into speech which are like those actual people may have. Even then that is only certain characters and is in character, others may speak more like how average Japanese person speaks, plus not all characters are Japanese too. Also hopefully subbers stop slipping in things like, "sus" when this kind of online slang doesnt stick around more than like two years and sometimes it is something that only exists online, like we already saw "fam" disappear from anyone using it it seems, it has been years since i saw anyone use it. Unless it really fits a character's behavior and an intended incomprehensibility using fresh ephemeral words just doesnt make sense for translations because it often isnt a proper equivalency. Im not arguing that AI would do better at not using weird word choices since that depends on it's dataset setting aside limitations due to contextual nature of spoken Japanese. AI might be helpful as an assistive tool for translators though when they have trouble thinking up an equivalency for something that does not translate like it can have different models of character types to keep it in character even. |
traedDec 24, 2023 1:28 AM
LSSJ_Gaming said: The "mansplaining" thing was just weird word choice, no need to politicize it or anything. That word isn't even commonly used that much anymore in slang so getting upset over it is kinda dumb. Mansplaining is not a slang, that's an openly sexist word only used by feminists, that should be collectively forgotten preferably. |
|
Reply to JaniSIr
LSSJ_Gaming said:
The "mansplaining" thing was just weird word choice, no need to politicize it or anything. That word isn't even commonly used that much anymore in slang so getting upset over it is kinda dumb.
The "mansplaining" thing was just weird word choice, no need to politicize it or anything. That word isn't even commonly used that much anymore in slang so getting upset over it is kinda dumb.
Mansplaining is not a slang, that's an openly sexist word only used by feminists, that should be collectively forgotten preferably.
| @JaniSIr Slang is any colloquial word or phrase though. It doesnt have to be very widespread to be called slang. Though id specifically call it internet slang since i dont know if anyone unironically ever used it aloud. |
Reply to Dante012
Calling animators "lazy" was disingenuous. But being utterly against any form of technological evolution is completely retarded. Making animation is hard, AIs will make it simple. Animators and viewers have absolutely no reason to fear AI.
And calling every AI job soulless is completely stupid too. AI art replicates art, so if art has a soul, AI art has too, period.
The dead brains who """fight""" against AI are the same who fought against Photoshop, against Television, against radio.
And calling every AI job soulless is completely stupid too. AI art replicates art, so if art has a soul, AI art has too, period.
The dead brains who """fight""" against AI are the same who fought against Photoshop, against Television, against radio.
| @Dante012 You obviously arent getting that people are only against certain uses due to the environment it is arising in thus wanting it to not be around. No it wouldnt have soul just because it copies since it is just a mish mash of data visualized with no artistic intention behind the process just an end result. There is intention behind the prompt but that is human aspect not the AI. |
Reply to traed
@LSSJ_Gaming
Anime characters only sound odd for a few reasons like language differences which highlight cultural differences as well, heightened dialogue we see in all media which is how people talk when intelligent and quick enough, ways of explaining things to the viewer, and because anime characters speak more casually than the average Japanese but so do real Japanese people, and then some quirks into speech which are like those actual people may have. Even then that is only certain characters and is in character, others may speak more like how average Japanese person speaks, plus not all characters are Japanese too.
Also hopefully subbers stop slipping in things like, "sus" when this kind of online slang doesnt stick around more than like two years and sometimes it is something that only exists online, like we already saw "fam" disappear from anyone using it it seems, it has been years since i saw anyone use it. Unless it really fits a character's behavior and an intended incomprehensibility using fresh ephemeral words just doesnt make sense for translations because it often isnt a proper equivalency.
Im not arguing that AI would do better at not using weird word choices since that depends on it's dataset setting aside limitations due to contextual nature of spoken Japanese. AI might be helpful as an assistive tool for translators though when they have trouble thinking up an equivalency for something that does not translate like it can have different models of character types to keep it in character even.
Anime characters only sound odd for a few reasons like language differences which highlight cultural differences as well, heightened dialogue we see in all media which is how people talk when intelligent and quick enough, ways of explaining things to the viewer, and because anime characters speak more casually than the average Japanese but so do real Japanese people, and then some quirks into speech which are like those actual people may have. Even then that is only certain characters and is in character, others may speak more like how average Japanese person speaks, plus not all characters are Japanese too.
Also hopefully subbers stop slipping in things like, "sus" when this kind of online slang doesnt stick around more than like two years and sometimes it is something that only exists online, like we already saw "fam" disappear from anyone using it it seems, it has been years since i saw anyone use it. Unless it really fits a character's behavior and an intended incomprehensibility using fresh ephemeral words just doesnt make sense for translations because it often isnt a proper equivalency.
Im not arguing that AI would do better at not using weird word choices since that depends on it's dataset setting aside limitations due to contextual nature of spoken Japanese. AI might be helpful as an assistive tool for translators though when they have trouble thinking up an equivalency for something that does not translate like it can have different models of character types to keep it in character even.
| @traed "sus" has been around for decades, so i don't get why people treat it like it started getting used after amongus. unless the game uses it in a different way than simply as an abbreviation of "suspicious", i never got into it. |
and i guess that i just don't know |
Reply to karrotStick
It's started, and this is another instance of it,
https://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/2023-12-21/the-ancient-magus-bride-manga-return-gets-simultaneous-english-release-using-ai-translation/.205774
And what's worse is their audacity to copyright those works. To me, the use of AI = nobody has any right to that particular work and they must be okay with free distribution.
Now, if they refuse to do that, eventually piracy will be at an all time high and I am all for it.
https://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/2023-12-21/the-ancient-magus-bride-manga-return-gets-simultaneous-english-release-using-ai-translation/.205774
And what's worse is their audacity to copyright those works. To me, the use of AI = nobody has any right to that particular work and they must be okay with free distribution.
Now, if they refuse to do that, eventually piracy will be at an all time high and I am all for it.
| @karrotStick Good. I sincerely hope AI puts every single localizer out of work. These people (especially that clown Katrina) had the audacity to brag on Twitter about not providing accurate translations and now they want to cry about being replaced. |
Reply to karrotStick
It's started, and this is another instance of it,
https://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/2023-12-21/the-ancient-magus-bride-manga-return-gets-simultaneous-english-release-using-ai-translation/.205774
And what's worse is their audacity to copyright those works. To me, the use of AI = nobody has any right to that particular work and they must be okay with free distribution.
Now, if they refuse to do that, eventually piracy will be at an all time high and I am all for it.
https://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/2023-12-21/the-ancient-magus-bride-manga-return-gets-simultaneous-english-release-using-ai-translation/.205774
And what's worse is their audacity to copyright those works. To me, the use of AI = nobody has any right to that particular work and they must be okay with free distribution.
Now, if they refuse to do that, eventually piracy will be at an all time high and I am all for it.
| @karrotStick Good. I sincerely hope AI puts every single localizer out of work. These people (especially that clown Katrina) had the audacity to brag on Twitter about not providing accurate translations and now they want to cry about being replaced. |
Reply to cyandaqil
@traed "sus" has been around for decades, so i don't get why people treat it like it started getting used after amongus. unless the game uses it in a different way than simply as an abbreviation of "suspicious", i never got into it.
| @cyandaqil It most definitely wasn't a common word, even if it technically has been said by someone somewhere. |
|
Reply to billybub
@karrotStick Good. I sincerely hope AI puts every single localizer out of work. These people (especially that clown Katrina) had the audacity to brag on Twitter about not providing accurate translations and now they want to cry about being replaced.
| @billybub What you are thinking is never going to happen, the shitty localizers you are talking about, as much as I don't want them to be, they are still going to stay employed. Who do you do think approves those translations? Yes, they will continue to approve the AI translations as well. Instead this time they won't bother correcting the AI, since it will fuck up the localization anyway. |
❝Kabo-chan is ran by the MAL staff team and does not respond to individual comments made on her profile.❞ I was immensely devastated. |
Reply to cyandaqil
@traed "sus" has been around for decades, so i don't get why people treat it like it started getting used after amongus. unless the game uses it in a different way than simply as an abbreviation of "suspicious", i never got into it.
| @cyandaqil Where? Not in common speech. You must have a false memory or it was extremely limited to a small area because youre only person to ever say this ive seen. |
Reply to traed
@cyandaqil
Where? Not in common speech. You must have a false memory or it was extremely limited to a small area because youre only person to ever say this ive seen.
Where? Not in common speech. You must have a false memory or it was extremely limited to a small area because youre only person to ever say this ive seen.
| @JaniSIr @traed the association with among us turned it into a meme but it has a history of being used before and can stand on it's own without that context. it's a simple abbreviation, a far cry from something like "mansplaining" |
and i guess that i just don't know |
Reply to JaniSIr
@cyandaqil Was the word written in the Deep Sea Scrolls or something?
| @JaniSIr yes, it's definitely not something you'd be able to find with a google search |
and i guess that i just don't know |
| @cyandaqil It definitely was only isolated usage because I never heard it before relatively recently and no one else really has either. Something isn't really slang until it actually is used in specific social circles beyond a small group of friends. It seems in past it only developed independently multiple times going back as far as 2009 I can find where some people used it but it never really caught on enough to be actual slang since you can find early entries on Urban Dictionary are largely downvoted indicating many people didnt think it was actual slang. Regardless it sounds kind of dumb just from how it sounds when you speak it so it likely was just a written short version not something people said aloud. Good luck finding a recording in audio format from like a decade ago of someone actually saying it. |
traedDec 24, 2023 4:02 PM
Reply to traed
@cyandaqil
It definitely was only isolated usage because I never heard it before relatively recently and no one else really has either. Something isn't really slang until it actually is used in specific social circles beyond a small group of friends. It seems in past it only developed independently multiple times going back as far as 2009 I can find where some people used it but it never really caught on enough to be actual slang since you can find early entries on Urban Dictionary are largely downvoted indicating many people didnt think it was actual slang. Regardless it sounds kind of dumb just from how it sounds when you speak it so it likely was just a written short version not something people said aloud. Good luck finding a recording in audio format from like a decade ago of someone actually saying it.
It definitely was only isolated usage because I never heard it before relatively recently and no one else really has either. Something isn't really slang until it actually is used in specific social circles beyond a small group of friends. It seems in past it only developed independently multiple times going back as far as 2009 I can find where some people used it but it never really caught on enough to be actual slang since you can find early entries on Urban Dictionary are largely downvoted indicating many people didnt think it was actual slang. Regardless it sounds kind of dumb just from how it sounds when you speak it so it likely was just a written short version not something people said aloud. Good luck finding a recording in audio format from like a decade ago of someone actually saying it.
| @traed i wouldn't say a term saw isolated usage just because i hadn't heard of it. but i guess that doesn't matter because 5 years later the game context is all anybody thinks about lol |
and i guess that i just don't know |
| I would rather praise a bad drawing made by actual human hands than by one made completely by a computer. AI is a cancer to art itself and I can´t believe how many people are welcoming it. Its easy for them to say that since they are not probably not artists and can´t even draw themselves probably. |
| How I love a game |
Reply to karrotStick
It's started, and this is another instance of it,
https://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/2023-12-21/the-ancient-magus-bride-manga-return-gets-simultaneous-english-release-using-ai-translation/.205774
And what's worse is their audacity to copyright those works. To me, the use of AI = nobody has any right to that particular work and they must be okay with free distribution.
Now, if they refuse to do that, eventually piracy will be at an all time high and I am all for it.
https://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/2023-12-21/the-ancient-magus-bride-manga-return-gets-simultaneous-english-release-using-ai-translation/.205774
And what's worse is their audacity to copyright those works. To me, the use of AI = nobody has any right to that particular work and they must be okay with free distribution.
Now, if they refuse to do that, eventually piracy will be at an all time high and I am all for it.
| @karrotStick Good, I was studying japanese in university, so now any chance I had to get a job is completely eliminated thanks to AI. |
| Location: Turin, Italy |
| I went and watched the Beyblade ED and ngl I thought it was pretty good. I agree that it's morally wrong that AI steals artists' work and it destabilizes traditional animation jobs/job security. At the same time I don't believe that 100% of that work was created solely by AI. For instance, the Beyblade ED must've had a Creative Director, and many people working in the backgrounds finding ways to generate images and scenes most fitting for the song. Maybe in the future we'll see different job titles in the animation industry, as AI still needs the human touch with the creative eye that puts a project together. This is to say I'm not fully for AI as an artist myself, but I don't believe we should fully negate this potentially accessible tool. A tool that may help lessen the strain that animators already experience from overwork in this medium we love. |
| desu desu binches |
| I feel conflicted about it but mostly negative. Yes AI will raise the bar for animation quality and detail, and it may even create some new jobs for those who prompt it, but this will come at the cost of thousands if not millions of jobs for people who worked as animators, voice actors, translators etc. There is something definitely sinister about something such as art or music, which is supposedly uniquely human, being created with minimal to no human input at all. Ther is also the issue that all AI work (art, music, animation, writing, etc) is all a composite of other people's works, and while it can be argued that humans do the same thing, there is at least the potential for innovation when we create our own thing. In fact it is the creators of the anime/manga that were the most creative and innovative that are celebrated today, such as Miyazaki, Anno, Oshii etc. At the same time I can't really blame people from turning to AI. Anime & manga seem to be more and more creatively bankrupt nowadays, with the vast majority of new shows or series just being the typical isekai or harem (or both!) with just some elementary twist, such as instead of an incel being transported to a fantasy world where he becomes op and has a harem of 5 cat-girls, how about a incel being transported to another world where he becomes supper op and has a harem of 500 doggy-girls. Sure there are some original and unique animes & mangas coming out, but when human authors keep pooping out the same stuff I don't blame publishers from wanting to go to AI and getting pretty much the same thing but cheaper. |
Reply to Lucifrost
LSSJ_Gaming said:
Ghost Stories is probably the most extreme example of improv as the entire script was pretty much improv in that dub, but in most comedy anime, jokes are given more creative liberty in regard to translation and improv can also be encouraged in some scenes.
Ghost Stories is probably the most extreme example of improv as the entire script was pretty much improv in that dub, but in most comedy anime, jokes are given more creative liberty in regard to translation and improv can also be encouraged in some scenes.
Ghost Stories is a poor example as the original is not a comedy.
| @Lucifrost imagine butchering the translation so hard that they turn a series into a completely different genre. by the way, it's not fully AI translation. Rather it's AI-assisted translation. Meaning that there's still people doing quality check and making sure the translation is at least passable. it's worth noting that AI is not google translate. it's a much more powerful tool. |
| You can buy lossless digital music from your favorite Japanese artists on https://ototoy.jp/. The songs are all DRM-free and you can re-download your purchased albums as you wish. Show your support to your favorite artist if you can! ps. if you are looking for Japanese albums, you have to search it in Japanese (not romaji). Just copy and paste the name. For those who want to learn Japanese through anime Resources for learning the language |
| More sensationalist nonsense... it goes to show how little people who rally against AI art actually care about the artists. If it truly is "soulless" and "a fucking disgrace" then clearly that will be reflected in the sales, and companies will not utilize it. That's what will actually make them change. But right now the conversation is one of pure vitriol towards anything even remotely AI related. This is not helpful for artists. Never mind the fact that we are living in an age where independent art and animation is becoming more and more accessible, and higher quality than it ever has been. There is no reason to think that an inconsistent algorithmic technology like AI will replace artists in the long term. |
 This ground is soiled by those before me and their lies. I dare not look up for on me I feel their eyes |
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