Beastars Episode 9 Discussion

Yautja said:
A genuinely good seinen, not a shounen masquerading as seinen by throwing in pseudo-philosophy, murder, or rape or other cheap shock factors / faux mature themes, color me fucking impressed.

PrettyColors said:

I'm amused by this because Beastars is a shounen. It runs in Weekly Shonen Champion alongside Saint Seiya, Yowamushi Pedal, and Baki.

Yautja said:

It's quite ironic isn't it? A shounen is more of a seinen than most of the seinen out there.

IMO, this doesn't really fit as a "shounen" at all, despite being in a shounen mag, which seems to be the deciding fact at the label. When looking at this compared to other series that epitomize the shounen genre / demographic, it sticks out very much. It's absolutely nothing like BnHA, Naruto, AOT, Bleach, etc, all of which, despite radical differences, share very similar "feels". Like how is Until Death Do Us Part a seinen, but this isn't? How is this in the same category as Fairy Tail, Blue Exorcist, Fire Force, Soul Eater, Nanatsu no Taizai, etc? How is it not with Kiseijuu, Erased, Black Lagoon, etc?

I can see the overlap in the appeals to the age ranges; I'd peg this series as 16+, but to align it to shounen, a term I'd usually apply to someone 15<, seems strange. Shounen manga usually seem to appeal to the 8-18 range, whereas Seinen is 18+. The shounen genre seems to go too low to reasonably classify this as one, whereas I'd say 16, 17, 18+, the low end of the ages I'd say that are attracted to this, are all close enough to "seinen".

I guess it's because of my opinion that shounen (and shoujo, seinen, and jousei) are just as much genres as they are demographics. It's seeming more and more the case that what magazine the manga is listed in is deciding which label the series get, but I hard disagree. I'd wager if this was a stand-alone anime it'd likely get a Seinen label.

ttcchen said:
suuuuuuper disappointed they still didn't add in the Louis and Bill scene... sighhhhhh

Manga included Louis' thoughts regarding Haru in the beginning:



Legosi also wasn't holding that bottle/can in the beginning, but instead was holding a flower:


it's trivial but anime made it seem as if it was Legosi pushing down the jaguar's head that's hurting him, but in the manga it's pulling his tail lol:


some might wonder why wolf can win in wolf vs jaguar well in the manga Legosi thought: "I can't compete with a feline's speed... I need to restrict his movements."

in the anime after Shishigumi kidnapped Haru we see their shoes that looks like this:

but in the manga they have scales and studs on the tip:


the three lions that kidnapped her look a bit different too:

and in the manga they look like this:


there're also a lot more lions in the room in the manga


they also never pulled her up by her ears, just talked to her normally. in the anime they said "heard rabbits with all white furs taste the best" (or something along that line, i watched raws), but in the manga they said "our boss thinks that..." before that line. so it was the boss's idea, not theirs.

boss also looks vastly different. in the manga he didn't wear glasses and has scars on his face



they cut out the end of the boss and haru interaction and didn't add in some dialogues. it'll probably be in the next episode so i wont post the pictures here (now if THAT got the same treatment as the louis and bill scene... imma be pissed) also the bathtub wasn't in the manga

the ones who found haru's shoes and the shishigumi card are just random students in the manga.
when the mayor ripped up the shishigumi card, legosi was there to see the whole interaction



in the manga when legosi punched louis...
louis flew.

Shocku_ said:


Thanks for the effort of your post it was really interesting to see.
But as a non manga reader I wasnt disappointed at all.
Sure, some meaning gets lost and all, but it is not like that is really that bad.

THough, your post made me want to read the manga.

Gosha32 said:


It actually checks a lot of shounen tropes. MC growing and motovations to do things, check. Highschool setting, check. Romance, check. Chicks with tits, check. Battles, check. Rivals/frenemies that make MC a better person, check. Comedy, check. Tragic backstory, check. I'd point out more, but that goes into spoiler territory.

Its a shounen that rides the very fine line between shounen and seinen due to its mature themes. Very much like AoT and Death Note.

Yautja said:

MC growing and being motivated is literally something any story based series has to do so that's an out, highschool setting is used across the board, both shoujo, seinen, shounen and jousei and series that don't fall into any of those use them, so that's also out. Romance is a genre in it of itself, so that's out. Tits. Really? Battles is action IE, a genre, and in both Shounen and Seinen, so that's out. Rivals and frenemies is a really shakey one, especially when it's lacking the Bakugo, Sasuke level characterization. Louis is really not anything like that kind of character and I couldn't even think of whom you were referring to for a while. Comedy is also a genre. Tragic backstory, again, is not a shounen specific, but it is an extremely common and specific trope, so fine, I'll tentatively agree to that one, even though tons of Seinen, Shoujo, Jousei and manga that aren't any of those use it.

You hit like 1 out of 8, and that 1 is kind of pushing it.

Gosha32 said:


I meant the specific tropes of that genre in shounen. The trope of MC growing from sorta pathetic to a bad ass. The trope of highschool as a typical shounen setting being as characters are mostly high schoolers. The trope of a love interest and love rival with an overwhelmingly dense charcater. Juno prolly has the biggest tits as featured in episode 8. And a shounen series usually has a character with big tits. The trope of gag comedy in shounen. Louis and legosi actually does have that naruto/sasuke thing going. One lives in the shadows, ones lives in the light. One having a tragic past and working towards trying to forget it, one trying to hold somethign back.

But yeah. If ye feel shounen is more of a genre than a demographic, then i suppose thats yer interpretation. This is my interpretation of how beastars is very much shounen due to the fact that it hits a lot of shounen tropes.

Yautja said:

Again, none of those are really shounen specific.

"MC growing and motovations to do things, check" / "MC growing from sorta pathetic to a bad ass", happens in a lot of manga and isn't a shounen specific. It also happens a shit ton in Seinen; Parasyte, Erased, Black Lagoon, remember? And Legoshi isn't really "sora pathetic". Character growth, or going from loser to hero is literally the hero's journey, something most certainly not a shounen trope.

The school setting happens everywhere and isn't a shounen trope. It's a Japanese trope. Just looking at the most popular Shounen, maybe a third of them have a school setting whereas all of them have action. That doesn't make action or school settings a "shounen trope", they just tend to follow. Sort of like how romance tends school settings or drama. It doesn't make drama or schools a "romance" trope. Just like how almost all slice of life have a school setting, doesn't make schools an SoL trope or vice versa.

That's just romance, not a shounen trope. Anyways, look at the most popular shounen, almost none of them have that. That's what happens when you cross romance and shounen, not just a consequence of shounen. And Legoshi isn't a "dense character".

Tits are not a shounen trope... Jesus Christ. Again, that's an anime and Japanese in general thing.

Comedy is a fucking genre, not a shounen trope. Gag comedy is again, a Japanese thing. There's plenty of gag comedy in, shocker, comedy series, be it Seinen like OPM, or SoL like Kobayashi-san.

Really? Louis and Legoshi are like Naruto and Sasuke. Now that is a hot take. I wonder how many fans of either series think that's even remotely true. You're being extremely abstract and stretching things real damn far. And either one of them could fall into that characterization. You're basically saying rivals are a shounen trope. And as far as I can tell, neither of them are going evil, they're not antithetical to each other yet best friends, they don't have a love hate relationship like Bakugo & Deku, like Sasuke & Naruto, like Natsu & Grey, etc.

You literally also just argued Shounen was a genre, a genre is a category based on a set of characteristics, IE, listing a bunch of tropes and claiming they're what makes it a shounen is literally arguing shounen is a genre. None of what you said had anything to do with demographics.

This is what I get for talking to someone who made a dummy account to upvote an anime...

Gosha32 said:

I never said shounen was a genre. Ye said ye consoder shounen as a genre.
And no. This is not a dummy. I made this account so i can talk about beastars. Cuz just reading the comments made me want to engage more in the discussion.

Anyways. We are getting off topic here so lets leave it at that. I just think beastars is shounen as it gets, ye think its seinen. I respect yer opinion, and i was just saying my piece.

But yeah. Ive read the manga and i still stand by the rival thingy.

Yautja said:

I know you didn't say that, but that's effectively what you did. A genre is a category based on collection of characteristics, and similarities in subject matter, form, etc. Listing a bunch of tropes, regardless of whether or not they're accurate, is you describing Shounen as a genre. List trope X, Y, Z and saying they all appear in Shounen, is describing Shounen as a genre. You're literally agreeing with me unless you disagree about what makes a genre, a genre.

Not saying you're a liar or that doesn't happen, but I don't really believe that. Especially not when this website is in the middle of a dummy account epidemic, how old the account is, how old the manga is, how old the anime is.

Fair nuff, but I've also begun to check out the manga, and looking at the top shounen manga on MAL, as well as your explanations, it really doesn't fit; it's nothing like any of the highest rated shounen. The only clear reason to label it as such as far as I'm concerned is that it's published in a Shounen mag.

FabriF said:
Could someone confirm if they have adapted that specific scene that was cut from last episode's?

Yautja said:

It's quite ironic isn't it? A shounen is more of a seinen than most of the seinen out there.

IMO, this doesn't really fit as a "shounen" at all, despite being in a shounen mag, which seems to be the deciding fact at the label. When looking at this compared to other series that epitomize the shounen genre / demographic, it sticks out very much. It's absolutely nothing like BnHA, Naruto, AOT, Bleach, etc, all of which, despite radical differences, share very similar "feels". Like how is Until Death Do Us Part a seinen, but this isn't? How is this in the same category as Fairy Tail, Blue Exorcist, Fire Force, Soul Eater, Nanatsu no Taizai, etc? How is it not with Kiseijuu, Erased, Black Lagoon, etc?

I can see the overlap in the appeals to the age ranges; I'd peg this series as 16+, but to align it to shounen, a term I'd usually apply to someone 15<, seems strange. Shounen manga usually seem to appeal to the 8-18 range, whereas Seinen is 18+. The shounen genre seems to go too low to reasonably classify this as one, whereas I'd say 16, 17, 18+, the low end of the ages I'd say that are attracted to this, are all close enough to "seinen".

I guess it's because of my opinion that shounen (and shoujo, seinen, and jousei) are just as much genres as they are demographics. Such manga and anime always share very similar themes, atmospheres, plot structures, etc, because they demographic they appeal to. It's seeming more and more the case that what magazine the manga is listed in is deciding which label the series get, but I hard disagree. I'd wager if this was a stand-alone anime it'd likely get a Seinen label.

Yautja said:
I know you didn't say that, but that's effectively what you did. A genre is a category based on collection of characteristics, and similarities in subject matter, form, etc. Listing a bunch of tropes, regardless of whether or not they're accurate, is you describing Shounen as a genre. List trope X, Y, Z and saying they all appear in Shounen, is describing Shounen as a genre. You're literally agreeing with me unless you disagree about what makes a genre, a genre.

Not saying you're a liar or that doesn't happen, but I don't really believe that. Especially not when this website is in the middle of a dummy account epidemic, how old the account is, how old the manga is, how old the anime is.

Fair nuff, but I've also begun to check out the manga, and looking at the top shounen manga on MAL, as well as your explanations, it really doesn't fit; it's nothing like any of the highest rated shounen. The only clear reason to label it as such as far as I'm concerned is that it's published in a Shounen mag.

ttcchen said:
suuuuuuper disappointed they still didn't add in the Louis and Bill scene... sighhhhhh

Manga included Louis' thoughts regarding Haru in the beginning:



Legosi also wasn't holding that bottle/can in the beginning, but instead was holding a flower:


it's trivial but anime made it seem as if it was Legosi pushing down the jaguar's head that's hurting him, but in the manga it's pulling his tail lol:


some might wonder why wolf can win in wolf vs jaguar well in the manga Legosi thought: "I can't compete with a feline's speed... I need to restrict his movements."

in the anime after Shishigumi kidnapped Haru we see their shoes that looks like this:

but in the manga they have scales and studs on the tip:


the three lions that kidnapped her look a bit different too:

and in the manga they look like this:


there're also a lot more lions in the room in the manga


they also never pulled her up by her ears, just talked to her normally. in the anime they said "heard rabbits with all white furs taste the best" (or something along that line, i watched raws), but in the manga they said "our boss thinks that..." before that line. so it was the boss's idea, not theirs.

boss also looks vastly different. in the manga he didn't wear glasses and has scars on his face



they cut out the end of the boss and haru interaction and didn't add in some dialogues. it'll probably be in the next episode so i wont post the pictures here (now if THAT got the same treatment as the louis and bill scene... imma be pissed) also the bathtub wasn't in the manga

the ones who found haru's shoes and the shishigumi card are just random students in the manga.
when the mayor ripped up the shishigumi card, legosi was there to see the whole interaction



in the manga when legosi punched louis...
louis flew.

Ashhk said:
I just wonder how Louis put on his shirt... it was my main question during the episode.