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tkrisz2 said: It's widely-believed that "if you change the past, future will change as well", and such. Now it's quite different. After I realized DB's concept, I just kept ignoring plotholes (if there are plotholes at all). I have never watched DB for a complicated plot, so I won't let myself getting confused by some kind of "try-hard" time-travel plot. There is Steins;Gate and such for that. I just can't take a complicated time-travel thing serious in Dragon Ball. Maybe some can relate. About the episode: Goku rages, yet gets almost killed. I just wonder why can't they use those senzu-beans instantly? They forget it, like it wasn't even there. I bet they forgot about Omni-sama's button too. I think it will be pressed accidently when goku gets beaten up again. Maybe Goku will beg to Omni-sama not to interfere, and by a clutch he wins somehow. Trunks gets a random power-up. It's logical that he fought against vegeta, he gets some godlike ki, and it's not enough to turn into SSJB of course. But everyone was surprised, and this entire thing looked like Trunks surpassed the SSJB, while that form's supposed to be as strong as SSJ3. He will fight better than Goku who was also enraged. Now that wouldn't make much sense. I agree with you about time travel plotholes and I decided not to take them seriously as in other series... however, I dislike a little about strength hierarchy plotholes... I expect a good resolution at least |
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GangsterCat said: Horizon355 said: the only plot hole here is trunks asspull power upFight scenes were nice, but lord, so many plotholes... Yea that one only plothole trunks power up Nowhere. Super Saiyan Rage Trunks very similar legendary Super Saiyan Broly with no pupil in eye. |
| One of the best episodes of this arc imo. Trunk's new form seems like regular SSJ with blue aura and blue sparks, that blue aura could be God ki. Since Trunks has been around Goku/Vegeta, he probably absorbed some God ki. It has to be God ki since SSJ Blue has blue aura but wow Trunks is one strong guy now. If you think about it, he's achieved all this power on his own, unlike a certain Gohan. Anyway, if hating Zamasu wasn't already high, there's even more reason to dislike this guy. Feel bad for Goku's family, getting killed by Zamasu. But they can wish them back with the Dragon Balls right? So now we know the origins of Black. I'd say, Zamasu kills Goku and fam in a timeline where Buu is defeated and right before Ep 1 of Super. Goku sure kicked some butt here. That rage boost, he was a beast. Funny how he punched Zamasu without looking at him, backhand punch. But man just when you think Black is getting owned, he comes right back and with more tricks up his sleeve. Attacks Goku with some technique that spears Goku with blades that self destruct. Can't wait for the next episode. Trunks looks so amazing in that form. Forget SSJ 3, this new form looks even better. |
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tkrisz2 said: It's widely-believed that "if you change the past, future will change as well", and such. Now it's quite different. After I realized DB's concept, I just kept ignoring plotholes (if there are plotholes at all). I have never watched DB for a complicated plot, so I won't let myself getting confused by some kind of "try-hard" time-travel plot. There is Steins;Gate and such for that. I just can't take a complicated time-travel thing serious in Dragon Ball. Maybe some can relate. I strongly relate. |
Stash said: During the episode I was wondering when are we going to get an asspull power up.. and we actually already got it. gg wp Toriyama. DBS is a disgrace to Dragon ball series. Don't know what you are crying about, DB series as a whole is always about new 'power ups'. Personaly I thought Trunks new (LSSJ?) powerup was god damn epic. |
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caio_ken said: This is without any doubt, one of the best episodes in Dragon Ball Super and DB history. Black, Zamasu, Goku, Trunks, the battles and the history, it was great! yeah I agree with you this episode was epic. |
| Hmmm I don't know what to think of this new transformation, I don't think Trunks really deserves it. I hope they'll have a good explanation for it. |
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| I hope this is not another new transformation for Trunks, We've already watch SSJ Blue and SSJ Pink, now SSJ + blue aura... Best part in this episode is when Goku on rage and kickin both Zamasu and Black. |
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| Alright, lots has happened this episode! Very exciting: + that kabedon Zamasu gave Goku (LOL) + It was very interesting to see Goku fight from anger. The last time we saw this was when he was fighting Frieza and turned into SSJ. + Trunks' power up was great. He needed it I think, being normal SSJ he was quite behind the rest. What I did not enjoy though - the usual DBS stuff: - lack of blood. I mean...seriously?! - the animation was rather rocky sometimes Overall, very nice episode! |
| its always nice to see goku get pissed and be serious about the fight though didnt last long and also why is vegeta just standing around he's been so useless through out this whole arc so far smh anyway next ep trunks all going broly and all cant wait |
| "one step at a time" |
| Awesome........... |
HenryT said:  Actual dialogue in the episode. Also, the most important scene in the episode:  Bromasu! Holy shit Thanks for the laughs dude |
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| It's official. Black and Zamasu are the new Team Rocket. Also, Trunks turned into Broly. |
LucDiswayOct 9, 2016 9:38 AM
| Ruka desu. |
Stash said: During the episode I was wondering when are we going to get an asspull power up.. and we actually already got it. gg wp Toriyama. DBS is a disgrace to Dragon ball series. This has been the standard for years, what are you moaning about? |
| Leaving all the plot aside. Gotta admit this was hype asf. This is the first time Goku got pissed since Frieza. Holy shit that's a long time ago. The way he was REKTing them and that back hand to Zamazu after instant transmission was HILARIOUSly epic XD I'm really impressed by the art staying at least pretty consistent during these action full eps. And then we have Trunks...dunno how they'll explain but hype nonetheless lol |
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Barion-Zara said: I'm really impressed by the art staying at least pretty consistent during these action full eps.  Yep, I'm sure you're right. |
| Ruka desu. |
| great comments everyone <3 So where is the Zamasu x Black Yaoi at? so what does Zeno-chan think of all this? Calling bullshit they killed all the gods, isn't the whole point of being... **** this anime. And no, the earthlings were doomed anyway if Trunks didn't use time travel, so no matter what Earth would have been trapped in some kind of bullshit. broly tier rage with SSB aura while still being SS. honestly 5/5 because so ****ing bad i love it! |
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Lucky96u said: Barion-Zara said: I'm really impressed by the art staying at least pretty consistent during these action full eps. Yep, I'm sure you're right. > Said ''pretty'' consistent > Uses ONE scene where it wasn't > Thinks he proved his statement wrong Are you illiterate? He said ''pretty consistent'' which does not mean ''constantly consistent''. Before bashing, at least try to improve your understanding of english. SS2Sorin said: This episode was amazing. Goku getting angry after being told Black killed his family. We still havent found out what timeline the Black Goku's body is from. I am really curious if they will ever reveal that. Vegeta needs to step his game up. Did future trunks already have Super Sayian 2 or Did he only have Super Sayian 1 and Super Trunks? I think he had SS1, SS2 and Super Trunks. He looked like he was about to go SS3. But then he had lighting around him. He did look like Broly to so I don't know. So I really am curious on what the transformation will be called. Thought's anyone. They revealed it was merely another timeline, nothing more. I don't think there's much more to add to that. And Trunks had SSJ2 in Super. I believe he fought Goku in SSJ2 form. He didn't have it back in Z, though. So I assume he attained it in the time when he went back to when he came back. Mod Edit: Merged duplicated posts; please use the edit button. |
ShockedNov 25, 2016 12:58 PM
Dregora said: > Said ''pretty'' consistent > Uses ONE scene where it wasn't > Thinks he proved his statement wrong Are you illiterate? He said ''pretty consistent'' which does not mean ''constantly consistent''. Before bashing, at least try to improve your understanding of english. ...I'm not going to send every frame of the episode to prove that the animations are bad. Not that I'm surprised, we're talking about Toei here. |
| Ruka desu. |
Lucky96u said: Dregora said: > Said ''pretty'' consistent > Uses ONE scene where it wasn't > Thinks he proved his statement wrong Are you illiterate? He said ''pretty consistent'' which does not mean ''constantly consistent''. Before bashing, at least try to improve your understanding of english. ...I'm not going to send every frame of the episode to prove that the animations are bad. Not that I'm surprised, we're talking about Toei here. I promise you that very few anime remain consistent if you are gonna look at them frame for frame. Your argument is still invalid. Most notably most shounen anime do this. The only exception I can think of is HxH. |
ECHOnce said: Way too many plotholes from this ep's explanation of how Zamasu obtained Goku's body >> They mentioned killing all the gods in the Future-Trunks timeline (we'll call it 1T, short for 1st timeline from here) as if they had done so before setting about killing all the mortals. If that were so, then Black managed to kill gods of destruction like Beerus from before meeting the present timeline (2T) Goku. Yet he claimed to have developed SSJ Rose after their only confrontation in 2T, and treated his SSJ1/SSJ2 as if they had been the strongest things he had faced since obtaining that body. When Zamasu stole the body and killed the Son family, that should have created a new timeline (3T). We have no indication for when Gowasu was killed in 2T, but when the Son family is murdered, Goten was still a child. That means it would have taken place before the androids arrived, since Future Trunks would've been the same age. Tbh I can't recall whether Goku knowing Goten at that point would be a plot hole on it's own lmao. Even ignoring all those plot holes and taking that info for what it's meant to say...it's kind of disheartening lol. We're essentially being told that Goku's body has the potential to become unchallenged in all the universes, since we haven't been told that Black's body is immortal like 1T Zamasu's (and even if he is immortal, he probably wouldn't have been of much help to Black anyhow). Obviously shouldn't be looking for too much of a plot in a hype-based series like DB, but...this is just sloppy. They killed the Kaioshins to kill Bills. Wtf. Before the androids arrive? Are you really watching DB? This is in the episode 1 of DB Super in the 4th timeline where they construct a bomb to destroy the androids and the series progress similar to the main timeline Lord_Odous said: ZBRAillusion said: I has a thought, and bare with me here as I am sure it's confusing.However, if we think about it Zamasu(GokuB) should have altered history as well correct? Since Trunks time is still the safe it is safe to assume that Zamasu(GokuB) isn't from his "time". Meaning that since OUR Goku is still in Trunks time Zamasu(GokuB) is from another time. If we consider that now. Zamasu(GokuB) killed Goku,Chichi, and Goten, but no one else is mentioned. So if Gohan is still alive as well as the other Z Warriors they could eventually show up correct? This could happen as the Z Warriors would be able to use the Time Machine that Bulma still has to possibly travel through time in search of Zamasu(GokuB). I suppose the writers want us to assume that in this particular timeline, everything that opposes the Zamasus fail miserably. With Goku seen plowing the fields and Goten spotted around 7 years old, I am guessing Zamasu took over his body before Majin Buu's arc. (I wasn't sure if DBZ is still considered spoilers at this point but oh well gonna include the spoiler tag anyway) Man, is quite obvious that this is the first episode of super. Lelouch0202 said: Well it was a good episode. Let me try to get this straight Timeline 1 : Cell Timeline, Possibly unrelated to any of the events happening now. Timeline 2 : Future Trunks timeline where Goku died cause of the heart disease. Basically the timeline of the current episode and Zamasu is still alive. Timeline 3 : 'Z' Timeline where Goku defeats Zamasu and eventually Zamasu is obliterated by Beerus. Effectively this timeline is safe Now Black states that he is the Zamasu from the past, Meaning he went through the same experience as the Timeline 3 Zamasu (Referenced by the flashback shown as well). So I guess the only way to relate this information is that this is a new timeline, So now I guess we have Timeline 4: Follows events of Timeline 3 but Zamasu is not killed by Beerus (Reasons unknown), Proceeds to collect Super Dragons Balls become Black and kill Goku's family. The scene depicting the death of Goku's family is kind of reminiscent to one of the early episodes of DBS where Goten brings Goku lunch. Now the thing here is that if Timeline 4 were to follow Timeline 3, Then Future Trunks should have arrived here as well as it's the main reason for the entire Goku-Zamasu meeting to even occur. If that meeting did occur then it makes no sense as to why Zamasu was not killed by Beerus in this timeline as well. Also everyone else can be assumed to be alive in this timeline. Now if Timeline 4 were to exist as I said it does, Then we need another Future Trunks timeline where he interferes with Timeline 4 cause obviously the same Future Trunks can't have gone to two different timelines. So we have, Timeline 5: New Future Trunks timeline where he intervenes in Timeline 4 but possibly dies in the process since he has to set up the events of Timeline 4. In order for this Timeline to exist we need a new Black. And so we're stuck in an endless loop of new timelines to fill up for every other one. You know what, I think it's best for me to ignore the whole timeline concept since the writing feels very nonsensical or maybe I'm just overthinking like crazy or missed some important point. Dragon Ball is always best kept simple, I see that there's a lot of praise for this arc/episode but I don't think anything will ever top the Buu arc of DBZ. The fight scenes were great, Goku getting angry was awesome. Trunks transformation at the end was epic, It's kind of like that False Super Saiyan transformation in one of the DBZ movies. So False Super Saiyan Blue? There's always more than three timelines. robertocabral said: there's one plothole: black is from another timeline, ok. so how can he manage to stay in future trunks' timeline using the time ring? because the ring let him go to goku's timeline only for a short time and then he was forced to go back to trunks' timeline again. after that, beerus says that he went to his "original timeline", it's not true now. i guess we should just ignore black travelling to the past. anyway, it didn't even happened in the manga. There's no plot hole. The time ring can travel to the future but not to the past, it's stated in the anime. |
| Ok, that Black on Zamasu hug was weird as fuck. Andi t seems like Trunks just went full Brolly. |
NomThead said: Creepy_Noire_fan said: I'll admit that it was epic but trunks transformation is just dumb imo (super saiyan super saiyan God super saiyan ) There will be no transformations...we'll mostly get ssj and ssjb...BS ! who's next? is goten going to turn ssjb? gohan? it's just dumb. having them running away and pulling off fusion would have been way better! but no! we get the same "everyone gets a power up " bs. he did not train like goku and vegeta. he should not have god ki!!! 2 much whine 4 mich I'm sorry (i'm calm now...) It's just annoying seeing all the other characters get random power ups and zenkai boosts |
| The hell. So he turned into some semi-SSJG, looking like Broly. Thought he was going SSJ3 but that wouldn't have been enough against black |
Zamasu is nasty as f*ck! He has a solid plan I want to know how the Z warriors are going to stop him especially the immortal part of him because he got rid of the Super Dragon Balls, he was thinking various step ahead of his foes. I like him as a villain (that does not mean I want him to live)… Damn! Milk & Goten R.I.P. Goku went HAM but it wasn’t enough it was a shame that Son Goku could avenge them, now is up to Trunks... I like this development because like I said in my previous post it is Trunks earth, he is the one who needed to solve this matter thus he is the one who needed this character development the most and I hope he can save his timeline and Kill Black in the process… |
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| This episode was really intense, one of the best ones we've gotten so far. Putting aside the mega stupidity of Zamasu not simply using the Super Dragon Balls to wish for whatever they're trying to achieve (seriously, why go through all this trouble when you could have made it happen in an instant, using the wish), I loved this episode. Goku's rage moment and still getting his butt kicked. Trunks's power up at the end was awesome. Unfortunately, there's still not much he can do due to his opponents being immortal. I wonder what kind of trick they'll find to counter that. Lucky96u said: Barion-Zara said: I'm really impressed by the art staying at least pretty consistent during these action full eps. Yep, I'm sure you're right. It's not nearly as bad as some of the earlier parts of Dragon Ball Super. While it's still not that impressive a lot of the times, you can at least see some improvements. |
| No good moments except for Gokuu's rage boost. Such a shame he was defeated, I would love if he beat those 2 trashy fanfic villains. I'm annoyed by that stabbing trend, it's really irritating. Trunks's transformation looks awful, and I bet he will be beaten like and idiot in the next episodes, so it will be another useless transformation without any build up, like SSJ3 and SSJB (ok, there is a little foreshadow in Super, but it's an useless transformation which didn't attain anything in the series). 2/5 |
ChloeVonEinzbern said: Also, a technique to defeat Zamasu and they show Kame Sennin at the end of the preview. Don't tell me that this technique will be Mafuba, because that would br REALLY ridiculous... - . - Haha, for some reason I was thinking about a possible Mafuba (a variation of it, at least, since the original only works on demons) as well. |
| I don't really get the timeline's anymore I just enjoy the action. |
| 'Let's not have these characters show up for this entire arc to show how much Goku cares about them. Let's note that Goku has "never" kissed one of those characters despite being married to them. Good set up? Everyone knows how much he cares about them now? Great! Now let's have Goku evoke a powerful emotion about those same characters who have been MIA this entire arc.' That's not to say I don't believe Goku cares about his family at least a little, but they did a pretty awful job of showing that as they've pretty much being showing us the opposite. They kinda just pulled a "it's his family so of course it's important to him". You can't just do that. It's like you show someone owns a cat in a movie but they just ignore it the whole time, and then a villain comes and kills the cat and the person gets all emotional yelling, "YOU KILLED MY CAAAAAT". Like, bro you didn't even feed it this entire movie. Yes, you own the cat so we can assume you care about it a little, but you've failed to show us how much you actually value the cat. Same thing here. Could have EASILY had Goten and Chichi come over asking, "Where the heck is my husband/dad? He's been gone for-- wait, what's going on over here?" It's good to avoid clutter, but they showed almost everyone else, so what's the problem? They didn't even have to pop up at Bulma's, maybe just a scene at home. I don't know, but instead we got nothing and are just kinda expected to accept that Goku cares THAT greatly about his family. I don't even remember how he reacted to Gohan's fate? He's his family too, so like...?? |
Milennin said: This episode was really intense, one of the best ones we've gotten so far. Putting aside the mega stupidity of Zamasu not simply using the Super Dragon Balls to wish for whatever they're trying to achieve (seriously, why go through all this trouble when you could have made it happen in an instant, using the wish), I loved this episode. Goku's rage moment and still getting his butt kicked. Trunks's power up at the end was awesome. Unfortunately, there's still not much he can do due to his opponents being immortal. I wonder what kind of trick they'll find to counter that. It's not nearly as bad as some of the earlier parts of Dragon Ball Super. While it's still not that impressive a lot of the times, you can at least see some improvements. Black is immortal too? I thought it was just Zamasu. |
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| duuude this episode was intense af ! I wasnt able to hold myself on my chair ! really wished goku would have been a bit more powerful when he got mad, well, I got pretty mad hearing Zamasu killing his family ... grrrrr and the whole episode I was like omg, please, turn insane into f**** rage into legendary ssj, and baaaaam, Trunks goes Legendary .. kind of .. awesome |
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| not gonna lie really thought ssj3 trunks was gonna be a real thing |
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robertocabral said: caio_ken said: There's no plot hole. The time ring can travel to the future but not to the past, it's stated in the anime. You're right, I forgot this explanation. Thank you, now what Black said makes more sense to me. He was originally from Goku's timeline. After Trunks changed the reality (telling Beerus to kill Zamasu) everything was undone, except for Black's existence because he uses the ring. Now I get it! Makes a lot of sense! |
| Never really got that excited whenever Goku or Vegeta got their powerups (SSJ Red, Blue or Kaio Ken x10) but goddamn, seeing Trunks like that has got me fired up more than ever for the next episode. Truly the best Character out here. |
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