Deca-Dence Episode 3 Discussion

What did you think of this episode?

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Jul 25, 2020 6:38 AM

#101

siradix

Offline

Oct 2015

103

Noumu said:

_Dusty_ said:
So... I was right last week. It is an anti-capitalist show.

If anything it's "anti anarcho capitalist" but that's about it.

I thought it was an authoritarian capitalism system. Capitalism is allowed to exist, but you have a single entity or party that controls the freedom of the citizens. Examples would be Russia and China.

Jul 25, 2020 8:10 AM

#102

TheBerserker

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May 2015

1228

This anime is amazing and it's proving itself with every single episode, I am glad I picked it up.

Jul 25, 2020 9:23 AM

#103

Hegar

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Nov 2018

576

They say "cyborgs" but we can't be sure it's humans in robots. I'm guessing the cyborgs are "human minds uploaded to the computer, then inserted in cyborg bodies". But uploaded means it's a computer program mimicking a human mind that once existed.

Jul 25, 2020 9:25 AM

#104

Hegar

Offline

Nov 2018

576

siradix said:

Noumu said:

If anything it's "anti anarcho capitalist" but that's about it.

If anything it's communism. Communist countries also had some small stores allowed. At least in the Soviet Union and the rest of Eastern Europe. Not in the total extreme, like Cambodia, where people were killed even for wearing a wristwatch or a pair of glasses, or knowing a foreign language.

A small cabal owns everything in the country, and forces everyone to work for them. No private production of goods and services is allowed, except on a very small scale.

Seems to be what this imaginary world is like. Though by magic, their economy keeps working at a high-tech level. (Perhaps they have more private business than a communist state usually has, then. Or it's just not something the creators think of.)

And of course they'll insert "PROFIT!!!" in the story, always a sign of EVIL in fiction, thanks to the Hollywood bosses making it such.

While we're on the topic, allow me to include some examples of what life in a Soviet state is like:

All prices and wages are set by the cabal, as opposed to the normal process through history where a change in demand leads to a change in prices in the store which leads to a change in orders to the factory, and thereby a change in supply. Without this process, supply doesn't change except for every five years or so when the bureaucracy decides to change it. As opposed to the normal thing in history where shifting demand leads to shifting production pretty much every week.

You'll have coats of one size piling up on the shelves, because no one buys them, while coats of another size are all sold out. Tractors of one kind piling up behind the factory, while engines for another kind of tractor are also piled up behind another factory. Tons of low-grade candy produced in one province because that's what is ordered from above since several years back, while you don't have enough bread and no one except party bosses can afford meat. Plenty of rubber boots using up all the rubber, but not enough rubber for other production. (All of these real Soviet examples.)

There is no reward for innovation: The officer who invented the Kalashnikov died poor. (And he only got the mechanism by interrogating enslaved German technicians. Other Germans went to Spain and continued the production of automatic rifles, which became the basis for the automatic carbines used in e.g. Scandinavian countries today.) Any innovation at a factory is just a hassle for the bosses, who are already struggling with shortages and all kinds of problems. They wouldn't be rewarded if your idea worked, anyway. But they'd be punished if they tried it and it caused trouble. They have their quotas and they stick to them, or they'll be replaced by the Moscow bureaucrats above them.

The Soviet Union didn't even have medicine after a 1920s level, they only had what they imported for France, and only top party members could shop in the stores that had it. Their dentist equipment was also at a 1920s level. They couldn't afford fruit - especially not something fancy like bananas.

Lakes died because they dumped toxins straight in the lakes without filters. (Some visitors who took a bath in the 1990s had poisoned, dizzy fish swimming straight into them without turning away. If you swallowed any of the water you needed to be stomach pumped right away.) The chimneys in Eastern Europe were unfiltered and built very tall so the smoke would blow to West Germany and beyond. The life in Baltic Sea was almost killed off. The forests died. They dumped radioactive waste by the North Pole ice. The air in some Soviet cities was so dirty that they couldn't use it for welding - they had to pump in oxygen from outside the city.

And importantly, no one was allowed to leave, as then everyone would leave.

Mao destroyed China's economy this way. When he died the dissident Deng Xiaoping, exiled to the rural western provinces, was brought back. He filled the government with other dissidents and they introduced a market economy, like China had always had before. He excused this by saying "It doesn't matter if it's a black or white cat as long as it catches mice," so really, it was actually still communism, because communism equaled whatever was good for the country. They would pretend. China survived while the Soviet Union didn't. Vietnam is struggling along, though with a corrupt leadership and ports filled with floating garbage, while North Korea is a basket case that needs food donations from the West.

HegarJul 25, 2020 9:54 AM

Jul 25, 2020 11:03 AM

#105

FrozenRaider

Offline

May 2015

5922

Ah yees there goes your typical MC trainig scenario.

"The future is always blank. Only your willpower can leave footsteps there."

"Ruling over death means ruling over life. Death is the climax of life. To have the best death, you must honor life."

Jul 25, 2020 12:00 PM

#106

RobinTK

Offline

Jan 2016

1619

I am still confused. Why the hell are there "bugs" if this is the real world? How are the cyborgs able to be in their own cyborg body and the human body at the same time?

Jul 25, 2020 3:05 PM

#107

Dottie

Offline

Feb 2020

The whole concept of this is still very confusing to me but I enjoy it regardless.

Also Pipe is so ugly that its cute.

Jul 26, 2020 2:16 AM

#108

poiuytrewq

Offline

Feb 2011

RobinTheKing said:
I am still confused. Why the hell are there "bugs" if this is the real world? How are the cyborgs able to be in their own cyborg body and the human body at the same time?

In a far future world run by an AI system after humanity ruined earth, it seems very reasonable that unwanted behaviors and actors are considered bugs. If you could upload people into robot cyborg bodies it isn't a stretch that you can remote desktop into a mostly organic host body. I also don't think the gear bodies are 100% human its just end stage genetic engineering + cybernetics at a low low cost of being the property of an AI run mega-corp. The governance AI for the corperation is merely performing the company objectives to the tee and nothing more and nothing less. It is entirely possible the previous human>cyborg leadership team tried to cheat the system and was considered a bug by the AI so were also scrapped.

Think of it as reverse westworld were hosts are just 100% real humans and the players are basically synethic host humans that are the players. The governing AI is actually smart to a degree and seperates the player from the game while still maintaining a sense of real impact as when you're remote body dies you have to start over but you don't actually die unless you break company policy at which point they drag your cyborg body to a recycling station and cut you up real good. In westworld it never made sense when they explained the super expensive, super important, super desired host core thing was just in their heads. If you have such high level technology you'd think you just remotely connect the host cores.

Jul 26, 2020 2:22 AM

#109

poiuytrewq

Offline

Feb 2011

Hegar said:
They say "cyborgs" but we can't be sure it's humans in robots. I'm guessing the cyborgs are "human minds uploaded to the computer, then inserted in cyborg bodies". But uploaded means it's a computer program mimicking a human mind that once existed.

Given there was still a population of very small but 100% human people on earth it is perfectly possible a small fraction of people realized selling your mindprint to a corperation to destructively copy is basically equal to a death sentance. The cyborgs are not technically human and certainly are not the same people from the initial copy but given they have a squishy organicish magic core it is very likely they are just a mostly synethic cyborg race the corperation made off of templated human minds. I don't think the cyborgs are just computer programs mimicking a human mind. They are more like a new species that just so happened to be directly bootstrapped off of human minds. We can't 100% trust most of the exposition as it is from the perspective of the corporation's propaganda.

Jul 26, 2020 8:55 AM

#110

Rasco

Offline

Mar 2010

55559

The world building is really well done. Even a bit relatable with the pollution, deca dence irl when? Can't wait to fight them slimy monsters lolz

Behold of my awesomeness~
controversial and/or sensitive topics likely devolve into the same repetitive, derogatory, abusive, and harassing comments can no longer be posted.
But my feels.

Jul 26, 2020 2:57 PM

#111

HectorBlaze

Offline

Apr 2016

2210

I don’t know if I’m happy with the way this series is progressing and the way it will progress probably. However, rather than that, what’s not convincing me are the characters. It’s interesting anyway, so I’ll still keep watching it.

Jul 26, 2020 8:31 PM

#112

AivanK

Offline

Jan 2013

4202

This was one of the best episodes! Finally some character development. Kaburagi finally decided to teach her. And the start wasn't the best xD
But the upgraded hand is the best thing that she could have gotten!

And now they end like this, that's gonna be a hard situation for everyone...
But i do expect to see Natsume doing some good kills xD

"There is no such thing as an Anime elitist. You watch Anime, therefore, you are trash by society's standards."

Jul 27, 2020 4:12 AM

#113

Vindicater

Offline

Jul 2016

2945

Rasco said:
The world building is really well done. Even a bit relatable with the pollution, deca dence irl when? Can't wait to fight them slimy monsters lolz

I keep harking back to her dad in the first episode and wondering what they were doing out there?

Jul 27, 2020 6:50 AM

#114

Aryale

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Jul 2020

514

wow this anime is really intriguing, cant wait for the next episode!

Jul 27, 2020 9:00 AM

#115

Rickydory123

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Dec 2016

1396

I'm glad Natsume now has a proper hand looking prosthetic, that worm-like three fingers was pissing me off.

Well it's getting less confusing to me so now I'm enjoying it.

Jul 28, 2020 3:03 PM

#116

Rasco

Offline

Mar 2010

55559

Vindicater said:

Rasco said:
The world building is really well done. Even a bit relatable with the pollution, deca dence irl when? Can't wait to fight them slimy monsters lolz

I keep harking back to her dad in the first episode and wondering what they were doing out there?

Now that you mention it, Now I"m wondering as well.. Perhaps he was glitching out.

Behold of my awesomeness~
controversial and/or sensitive topics likely devolve into the same repetitive, derogatory, abusive, and harassing comments can no longer be posted.
But my feels.

Jul 28, 2020 3:47 PM

#117

Red_Ranger_Wien

Offline

Sep 2011

2215

So we have aliens, cyborgs, VR, Eurasia being turned into a big video game and probably bioengineered monsters.

I look forward to what next week's poorly handled info dump adds on to the pile.

Jul 28, 2020 4:18 PM

#118

Zipzo

Offline

Jul 2020

So maybe I'm thinking a little bit too hard on this one but bear with me...

Does anyone see the references to the Xeno series of games here (Xenogears, Xenosaga)?

So humanity is pushed to the brink by a completely not-well-understood race of beings. In Xenosaga it is the "Gnosis" who looks *very suspiciously* like Gadolls in terms of design. This is a depiction of a few different types of Gnosis from a magazine around the time Xenosaga 1 was current.

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/323424025739132928/730841332691763260/gnosisep1.png?width=549&height=677

The Gnosis are a concept that ends up going way deeper, in terms of where they are from and what they represent.

In this they are called "Gadolls", and they have a similar mysterious origin that gives a similar vibe.

Maybe a stretch but there's more.

The organization of robotic people that is utilized to defend humanity are known as "Gears". Which, along with being the suffix of the name "Xenogears", Gears are also the name of the mechs used in Xenogears, ultimately used to defend humanity from it's meta-control by higher organizations plotting humanity's demise and rebirth through use of the Zohar.

The emblem for the organization is also suspiciously shaped similar to an "X" shape. At one point we're given a diagram that shows how the all-controlling brain, or the "system" means to eliminate all bugs. The X-shaped emblem then exposes some kind of mysteries eye, and zaps all the bugs.

https://i.imgur.com/PwyzV4c.png

The Zohar in Xenogears (and Saga) is a mysterious object that is used by the humans to try and control...well, everything.

https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/xenosaga/images/7/7c/ZoharEye.gif/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/250?cb=20151121005517

https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/xenosaga/images/1/1f/Zohar1.jpg/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/250?cb=20120516042104

Notably, the main character's best friend's name is 'Fei', which is the name of the main protagonist of Xenogears.

I mean, these references almost seem a bit too on the nose for it to be a coincidence to me, but someone else can lend their opinion and tell me if I'm bein' crazy.

ZipzoJul 28, 2020 6:03 PM

Jul 29, 2020 12:09 PM

#119

Noumu

Offline

Jun 2016

197

Rasco said:

Vindicater said:

I keep harking back to her dad in the first episode and wondering what they were doing out there?

Now that you mention it, Now I"m wondering as well.. Perhaps he was glitching out.

As shown in episode one it's a tanker search unit, they're kind of like archaeologists. The company records their "adventures" and sells the video footage for profit.

Jul 29, 2020 7:45 PM

#120

Karsaaa

Offline

Apr 2018

992

Natsume becoming a better fighter due to Kabeguri's tutoring and fighting experience. Pipe is kinda cute tbh with his derpy face.

Aug 9, 2020 1:25 PM

#121

Battlesentory

Offline

Jul 2020

God this was kind of boring.i still dont understand the believing in eliminating bug thing with kaburagi.
I still cant grasp an understanding on the different realities in the world building of this anime.
I still dont understand how corporation X managed to claim ownership of all humanity.
Dude im just confused,shit is going too fast for me.I also still dont understand why everybody calls the information revealed in ep02 a plot twist while its not.
My heart is just not catching this show,think im gonna drop.

Aug 9, 2020 3:25 PM

#122

noirblumen

Offline

Feb 2019

So this is basically the future anarcho-capitalists want

Sep 2, 2020 9:33 AM

#123

Khufu05

Offline

Sep 2020

okay all NPCs are human but why tanker are different than fighters when all are being controlled by robots ar cyborgs ?

Sep 2, 2020 9:39 AM

#124

ame-furi

Offline

Jul 2009

195

Khufu05 said:
okay all NPCs are human but why tanker are different than fighters when all are being controlled by robots ar cyborgs ?

Tankers - humans. They're not cyborgs, they're just humans with chips.
Gears - cyborgs/avatars.

Sep 2, 2020 10:36 AM

#125

Khufu05

Offline

Sep 2020

ame-furi said:

Khufu05 said:
okay all NPCs are human but why tanker are different than fighters when all are being controlled by robots ar cyborgs ?

Tankers - humans. They're not cyborgs, they're just humans with chips.
Gears - cyborgs/avatars.

oh now it makes sense. ty

Sep 16, 2020 5:43 PM

#126

HagePotPotato

Offline

Oct 2019

4232

So that's how the world ended up like that. Still a little confused on how a corporation too over and who's running it. But it obviously controls the cyborgs politically as well as owns their brains and/or bodies (ie, "property")?

It's crazy that Kaburagi knows the truth but it's just watching everything. And it's crazy how all these people simply have no clue. It legitimately kind of hurts.

That oxyone powers the deca-dence, powers their gadoll fighting equipment, powers the cyborgs themselves? How was this stuff discovered and what are gadoll?

This is a surprisingly deep and complex show, that doesn't necessarily "feel" deep while you watch it. That's an impressive feat.

Oct 7, 2020 1:30 PM

#127

Nurguburu

Offline

Aug 2017

10979

Well, they explained better why the world is in that state, sadly the first explanation in episode 2 was awful making many believe that nothing is real. As I understand it, what happens is real but robots treat it like a 'game'. I still don't understand if these creatures showing up are intentional or not.

Regardless of that, it was basically a training episode and they explained better how the fighting mode works. Too bad they didn't explain it before, but hey, it was now or never! I wonder why that pet is so important to Kaburagi. I hope something interesting happens because generic monsters already bored me.

All weebs creatures of the galaxy, hear this message. Those of you who listen will not be struck by western animation. You will no longer know hunger, nor pain. Your Anime have come to lead you now. Our strength shall serve as a luminous sun toward which all intelligence may blossom. And the impervious shelter beneath which you will prosper. However, for those who refuse our offer and cling to their western animation ways… For you, there will be great wrath.

Nov 25, 2020 3:43 AM

#128

BetaMaleUltra

scientia exitus

Offline

Mar 2020

5786

Dang it dang it DANGIT I LOVE this stuff man I actually ENJOYED this episode but then it cuts to freakin CARTOONS and then I’m reminded of the alien AI whatever SHIT that’s there as the main driving force of this whole narrative in the background and I’m just UUGGHH

I didn’t need this plot twist man... I loved the plain and simple premise introduced to us in episode 1... I love everything that happens as long as I forget about the alien AI shenanigans... I love the ED.... but yeah no we gotta watch some cartoons because cartoons is really good!

All that said I do want to give this show a chance. It’d be wrong to trash on it and not even finish all that it has to offer. But really at this point I’m not expecting anything redeeming enough to make me personally like it at all

NYANPASU

5700XT

Dec 19, 2020 3:22 AM

#129

Catalano

Offline

Oct 2010

20759

not a bad transition after episode 2, natsume trains and for the moment she's very bad, who knows what will happen, this show is weird in a good way, you think you know the plot, then BAM plot twist. her new metal hand looks cool

Dec 30, 2020 2:15 PM

#130

Unkrowned

Offline

Jul 2015

9969

Really appreciate the history explanation around 13:00 of this episode, cleared up a lot of vague stuff from last episode. Still curious to what exactly the gadoll are considering they are also chipped by the system. Got to say, this is pretty incredible so far as an original anime as some original anime tend to kinda suck imo.

Jan 3, 2021 8:08 PM

#131

-Cracker-

Offline

Nov 2015

Loved the first episode so much, but this cyborg society thing is so weird. What happens to the funky robots if their human dies? They talked about removing a limiter which endangers the robots themselves so do the robots die if the human dies? Are the robots chipping new-born children? Why are the humans showing emotions if they're being controlled by robots!!!!!!

Apr 13, 2021 7:37 AM

#132

iamDragoncat

Offline

Mar 2016

161

So the girl's doing better in training! And she got a brand new arm too :D looking forward to seeing her master the new weapon.

The soundtrack only further proved to me how good it is. Still love it.

However, the holy situation with cyborgs becoming the leading race and humans being enclosed in a capsule is a tricky one. I do hope by the end the humans will find a way to win the Earth back, possibly the rest of it has returned to habitable state? We'll see

Apr 18, 2021 6:04 PM

#133

G_Spark233

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Dec 2013

14984

That really does look like a tough game.

Natsume must be really confused at the end.

Aug 6, 2021 11:55 AM

#134

metawin

Offline

Mar 2020

Natsume is a confirmed bugged whereas it is Kaburagi's duty to report all bugs he comes across, however, he has a soft spot for both Natsume and Pipe which shows his sweet side.

The way I would sacrifice everything to have a gadoll like Pipe, he is so adorable

May 6, 2022 8:07 PM

#135

CQLLIST

Offline

Jul 2021

9012

Yeah the whole interpretation and concept of Gadolls fight choreography is nothing special tbh, I had a bit of a hatred with the choice of storytelling in this one..

"......If I told you that I was a real witch, would you believe it?"

Dec 8, 2022 7:19 PM

#136

RawrOMG

Offline

Nov 2022

524

The combat system alone is so well thought out, to add the additional layer that it's also a game is just unheard of. What an ambitious story.

Am I correct that everything in the Deca-Dence world is real? It's not a simulation? The creatures are real, the machine is real, the people are real, and the gears are all real?

I imagine eventually they're going to hit the "wall" of their world. (though it seems the Deca-Dence is controlled by Power people)

Dec 13, 2022 9:03 AM

#137

BumbleBeez

Offline

Dec 2021

490

The anime seems cool, I just can't follow the storyline. I'm still confused about the world and the computer chip thing
like the scenes where they cut between humans and some miniature sized version of the human in some cyborg world???
Are they even human or are they all cyborgs. This is messing with my brain

May 28, 2023 4:23 AM

#138

katakumplat

Offline

Dec 2022

498

Plot just keeps getting better. So the bright tic tac thingies are cyborgs who control/transfer into robot avatars that look like humans and are fighting as gears, protecting real humans living as tankers inside deca-dence who just thinks everyone is human.

Aug 13, 2023 2:33 PM

#139

Comander-07

Offline

Sep 2014

4545

This explained a lot of questions I had with the setting, so the "aliens" are actually cyborgs and I assume they are AI.
Now I just wonder how the guys human body functions and to which extend human society is aware of their situation, since deca dence seems to be piloted by humans still.

"This emotion is mine alone.
It is for Madoka alone." - Homura
or how I would descripe Mahou Shoujo Madoka Magica.

Aug 14, 2023 5:52 AM

#140

GrandMarquis

Offline

Aug 2023

it seems to me like K-man and dead girl are going to have to fight the corporation and the system. hopefully they do, and win, so humanity can be free from the system. I noticed the other corporations logos over other parts of the Earth, are there other areas like Eurasia with humans in them?

Feb 24, 11:04 PM

#141

bubba460z

Offline

Jul 2021

939

Natsume is improving. Pipe is one weird fella, though i like him.

Im still kinda confused by the last episode.

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