Why people believe that &quot;all isekai are the same&quot;?

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Feb 2020

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[quote=TodAboT message=59222689]

L0rdV1ct0r said:

If you show me a screenshot of Naruto and My Hero Academia, I can actually tell that they are different series; if you show me a screenshot of any of the shows I linked, I couldn't do that.
.

Sure, but you are picking the most trash isekais ever And comparing to relative good protagonists of battle shonen

I don't mind OP characters as longs htere are a relative good expalantion to why he is OP. Diablo isekai for example, as a sorcerer defeated a demon that can reflect magic and got a ring that can reflect magic. Such broken piece of item makes no sense to exist on a mmo and makes no sense that a sorcerer could defeat such a boss. IF the ring worked like the nulification(overlord) that can only negate magic up to circle "X" and not negate the strongest magic in the world, then it will make a little more sense.

Giving broken items to the MC when makes no sense to such item exist or the player get this item makes zero sense.

Isekais can be interesting. For example, imagine being transported to another world as a necromancer, not a overpowereed necromancer, just strong as a mdi to high tier magician in this world and this world being dominated by a inquisition that hates , hunts, torture and execute anyone with necromancer affinity. That is a interesting premise IMO in the typical medieval fantasy world.

JustMonaka said:
When thing like this image exist, can you really blame those people?

Historically cities was created around rivers. Using your logic, there are no difference between Diablo 1/2, Gothic 1/2/3 and Dark Souls 1/2/3 because all of then have a lot of gothic style armor and archtecture...

You can don't like the medieval fantasy genre and prefer SCI-FY fantasy or any other type of sub genre, but not all pirate movies are the same, not all "space operas" are the same, not all cowboy movies are the same and not all fantasy medieval world are the same.

Knosuba iis a comedy show, far different than the other two.

L0rdV1ct0rFeb 27, 2020 10:27 PM

Feb 27, 2020 11:23 PM

#55

RayReynolds

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Feb 2019

665

because most of isekai or anime of MMORPG repeat common cliches between them, which obviously generalizes the majority opinion, cliches for example
-Overpower character in a typical fantasy world
-The lack of tension
-Generic characters and waifus around the protagonist

However, a cliche is not bad, the negative is that the abuse of these generates a repellent reaction for being repetitive as shit, except if the protagonist is a pretty girl like maple de bofuri She is an amalgamation of all the main in isekai styled anime and mmorgs but a girl so the weebs will love her and not care about story

Feb 28, 2020 1:13 AM

#56

katsucats

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Oct 2012

16077

I think it's absolutely hilarious, and embarrassing, that you think that when people say isekais are all the same, that they mean that literally everything, down to the characters must be the same. That's so obviously not the case that I would posit you're dishonestly trying to "win" with some premature argument instead of actually trying to understand the issue.

First, we're going to have to specify, for lack of better words, thematic genres and structural genres. Thematic genres are related by an important element or concept that the author wanted you to feel, or an overarching direction of the plot. For example, adventure as a genre might evoke some feeling of exploration; fantasy might evoke feelings of awe and magic; and psychological thriller grounds the external world to one similar to the one we live in, but explores the possibilities in perception. There is no definite similarity between one adventure anime and another adventure anime besides this feeling they evoke, and the types of themes -- not even the themes themselves -- they explore.

Structural genres, like isekai, follow a dramatic structure. If we're going to use classical definitions, we can throw drama and comedy in here. Shakespearean comedies had specific beats, or dramatic acts, such as one that introduces the characters, one that sets up a main conflict, and one that resolves. Isekai is a structure genre because it, too, has dramatic acts. The characters mostly start out as rejected members of modern society; they get transported into a new world and get a chance to make something of themselves; they discover through the rules of this other world some objective or goal; they meet friends that they didn't have in real life; they gain powers and a standing in this alternate reality.

Every isekai, by definition, follows such a structure, but it's a shame that most isekais never really deviate from the specifics of this formula. Let's look at two recent examples, Shield Hero and Slime. For good measure, we'll throw Re:Zero, Log Horizon, No Game No Life. Their similarities are:

The protagonists aren't super popular in real life.
The protagonists are, for the foreseeable future, irreversibly transported into an alternate, medieval fantasy reality.
The protagonists gain some mysterious powers.
The protagonists start out lost, but slowly gain trustworthy nakama, and a reputation.
The protagonists meet some anime that don't like their newfound presence in this new world.
There's never really a doubt that the protagonists would win this battle, and gain more reputation.
The protagonists accrue enough power to become a central figure or leader in their capacity.

In fact, we can go further. If we play these shows back episode by episode, we can see the analogy between what episode 1 of each show sets up, versus episode 2, and episode 3, and so for some time. Yes, the details are all different, but what these details establish are all the same.

My subjective reviews: katsureview.wordpress.com
THE CHAT CLUB.

Feb 28, 2020 1:23 AM

#57

Daniel_Naumov

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Apr 2016

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Thread lacks logical and factual arguments. Its main point has no reflection in the reality. And it reads like cringe. Consider abandoning it to avoid further humiliation.

Re:formed

Feb 28, 2020 7:26 AM

#58

GlennMagusHarvey

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May 2009

8386

TodAboT said:

L0rdV1ct0r said:

They aren't exceptions. My point is that there are way more variation among isekai protagonists

Zeroflamez said:
He won't ever admit they all mainly have the same aesthetics. Sure you'll get out liers like Accel World or Overlord but OP is just cherry picking to make his point valid.

So basically this is all about first impressions from appearances.

justceei7 said:
KONOSOBA is an exception to all isekai

Ironically, it looks like stereotypical isekai fantasy stuff, and thus doesn't look distinct.

Avatar character is Gabriel from Gabriel DropOut.

Feb 28, 2020 7:58 AM

#59

alice_stairs

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Dec 2019

27

L0rdV1ct0r said:
They aren't exceptions.

Just to be 100% sure... did you really mean "They aren't exceptions"?

No -> Yeah, they are exceptions and your point is correct.

Yes -> Well, the "My point is (...)" part is still correct, but there's a little bit of issue here: you're saying that they constitute the entirety of isekai out there. Yet, isn't No game no life an isekai?

However, that's all off topic. I would just like to say that as soon as "All [X] are [Y]" pops up, all you have to do is to find some exceptions (or even one single exception is okay) and we're done, no need to pay more attention ;)

Feb 28, 2020 8:10 AM

#60

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Jan 2018

902

L0rdV1ct0r said:

TodAboT said:

If you show me a screenshot of Naruto and My Hero Academia, I can actually tell that they are different series; if you show me a screenshot of any of the shows I linked, I couldn't do that.
.

Sure, but you are picking the most trash isekais ever And comparing to relative good protagonists of battle shonen

You're missing the point.
Even if I picked the most trash shonen ever, I can still tell them apart because they have different character designs. That's why people think "all Isekai are the same".
And when people say "all Isekai are the same" they don't mean it literally. How do you expect to give a reasonable argument when you don't even understand the phrase in the first place?

I don't mind OP characters as longs htere are a relative good expalantion to why he is OP. Diablo isekai for example, as a sorcerer defeated a demon that can reflect magic and got a ring that can reflect magic. Such broken piece of item makes no sense to exist on a mmo and makes no sense that a sorcerer could defeat such a boss. IF the ring worked like the nulification(overlord) that can only negate magic up to circle "X" and not negate the strongest magic in the world, then it will make a little more sense.

Giving broken items to the MC when makes no sense to such item exist or the player get this item makes zero sense.

Isekais can be interesting. For example, imagine being transported to another world as a necromancer, not a overpowereed necromancer, just strong as a mdi to high tier magician in this world and this world being dominated by a inquisition that hates , hunts, torture and execute anyone with necromancer affinity. That is a interesting premise IMO in the typical medieval fantasy world.

What does this have to do with anything I said?
Of course the genre has potential, and of course that OP abilities with no merit are trash.
If only the shows actually tried.

JustMonaka said:
When thing like this image exist, can you really blame those people?

Historically cities was created around rivers. Using your logic, there are no difference between Diablo 1/2, Gothic 1/2/3 and Dark Souls 1/2/3 because all of then have a lot of gothic style armor and archtecture...

You can don't like the medieval fantasy genre and prefer SCI-FY fantasy or any other type of sub genre, but not all pirate movies are the same, not all "space operas" are the same, not all cowboy movies are the same and not all fantasy medieval world are the same.

"Historically cities was created around rivers, so that justifies the river going through the exact same area, the city having a round wall, having nearly identical color palettes..."
Please dude, just stop.

Feb 28, 2020 8:11 AM

#61

Milennin

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Feb 2015

6844

I guess mostly because the setting feels very same-y across the many different isekai (European medieval fantasy world inhabited by all of the common European medieval fantasy races), and they tend to share similar story lines (a nobody from the real world finds himself suddenly in fantasy world, meets female characters who become his allies, and sets out on an adventure to defeat evil monsters). They also tend to reference videogames or videogame mechanics.

Feb 28, 2020 8:15 AM

#62

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Jan 2018

902

GlennMagusHarvey said:

TodAboT said:

Zeroflamez said:
He won't ever admit they all mainly have the same aesthetics. Sure you'll get out liers like Accel World or Overlord but OP is just cherry picking to make his point valid.

So basically this is all about first impressions from appearances.

Considering that it was L0rdVictor's argument from the start, yes.
And most of the shows I mentioned have the main guys being overpowered, collecting girls and being super popular.

Feb 28, 2020 8:23 AM

#63

GlennMagusHarvey

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TodAboT said:

GlennMagusHarvey said:

So basically this is all about first impressions from appearances.

Considering that it was L0rdVictor's argument from the start, yes.
And most of the shows I mentioned have the main guys being overpowered, collecting girls and being super popular.

and a list of generally similar/standardized tropes can be provided for any genre. Magical girl shows have cute girls with transformations (from a transformation trinket) into fancy dresses as protagonists, wielding magic, often with a staff of some sort, and a cute animal partner to go along with them. And so on.

They're clearly not the same shows though, despite the shared tropes. And the same goes for isekai.

I think it might be useful for us to recognize that "isekai" is basically used in two different ways:
* to refer to the mechanic, of being shoved into another world, and
* to refer to the genre, which involves the above mechanic as part of the premise, but then also tends to share a number of other elements, such as having "ordinary guy" lead protags, a variety of associated important female main characters, and the lead protags being special in some way.

Avatar character is Gabriel from Gabriel DropOut.

Feb 28, 2020 8:40 AM

#64

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Jan 2018

902

GlennMagusHarvey said:

TodAboT said:

Considering that it was L0rdVictor's argument from the start, yes.
And most of the shows I mentioned have the main guys being overpowered, collecting girls and being super popular.

and a list of generally similar/standardized tropes can be provided for any genre. Magical girl shows have cute girls with transformations (from a transformation trinket) into fancy dresses as protagonists, wielding magic, often with a staff of some sort, and a cute animal partner to go along with them. And so on.

They're clearly not the same shows though, despite the shared tropes. And the same goes for isekai.

I think it might be useful for us to recognize that "isekai" is basically used in two different ways:
* to refer to the mechanic, of being shoved into another world, and
* to refer to the genre, which involves the above mechanic as part of the premise, but then also tends to share a number of other elements, such as having "ordinary guy" lead protags, a variety of associated important female main characters, and the lead protags being special in some way.

You are correct, but it's kind of sad that Isekai barely do anything to be different, while Magical Girl shows do things that make different conflicts (turning the protagonist into someone much older, making her an idol, magical girl from a different world, animal-based attacks, etc.).
There is just so much potential for it.

Feb 28, 2020 9:25 AM

#65

GlennMagusHarvey

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Do note that the magical girl genre has been around a lot longer than the isekai genre.

Avatar character is Gabriel from Gabriel DropOut.

Feb 28, 2020 9:45 AM

#66

Oterino

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Feb 2019

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I don't think the Isekai genre is "trash", there is indeed a possibility for a good Isekai. However the only times I've encountered one that fits my liking was almost never in Anime but rather in Manga, some very specific ones that happened to stand out more than the generic use of the trope were those who focused twice more on the world-building and the MC's development within that world but through a much more mature approach, basically the character isn't OP in that scenario and are more prone to failing some tasks or encountering danger in some situations.

The one that came to mind for me was Koushaku Reijou no Tashinami especially but Ascendance of a Bookworm is also interesting in that aspect, the MC's in both of these manga are definitely not what I could call OP characters at all, they are much more appealing in my opinion to someone who's not into Action but rather into a more Adventuruous type of SoL. These are what I would consider good Isekai in particular.

Though there's also this idea that most of Isekai are better in their source material which is a Light Novel, while I haven't explored that part much yet I'm guessing it might be true for works like Overlord.

Feb 28, 2020 9:47 AM

#67

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Feb 2020

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Daniel_Naumov said:
Thread lacks logical and factual arguments. Its main point has no reflection in the reality. And it reads like cringe. Consider abandoning it to avoid further humiliation.

TEchnically Magic Knight Rayearth is a Isekai AND a mahou shoujo.

katsucats said:
I think it's absolutely hilarious, and embarrassing, that you think that when people say isekais are all the same, that they mean that literally everything, down to the characters must be the same. That's so obviously not the case that I would posit you're dishonestly trying to "win" with some premature argument instead of actually trying to understand the issue.

First, we're going to have to specify, for lack of better words, thematic genres and structural genres. Thematic genres are related by an important element or concept that the author wanted you to feel, or an overarching direction of the plot. For example, adventure as a genre might evoke some feeling of exploration; fantasy might evoke feelings of awe and magic; and psychological thriller grounds the external world to one similar to the one we live in, but explores the possibilities in perception. There is no definite similarity between one adventure anime and another adventure anime besides this feeling they evoke, and the types of themes -- not even the themes themselves -- they explore.

Structural genres, like isekai, follow a dramatic structure. If we're going to use classical definitions, we can throw drama and comedy in here. Shakespearean comedies had specific beats, or dramatic acts, such as one that introduces the characters, one that sets up a main conflict, and one that resolves. Isekai is a structure genre because it, too, has dramatic acts. The characters mostly start out as rejected members of modern society; they get transported into a new world and get a chance to make something of themselves; they discover through the rules of this other world some objective or goal; they meet friends that they didn't have in real life; they gain powers and a standing in this alternate reality.

Every isekai, by definition, follows such a structure, but it's a shame that most isekais never really deviate from the specifics of this formula. Let's look at two recent examples, Shield Hero and Slime. For good measure, we'll throw Re:Zero, Log Horizon, No Game No Life. Their similarities are:

The protagonists aren't super popular in real life.
The protagonists are, for the foreseeable future, irreversibly transported into an alternate, medieval fantasy reality.
The protagonists gain some mysterious powers.
The protagonists start out lost, but slowly gain trustworthy nakama, and a reputation.
The protagonists meet some anime that don't like their newfound presence in this new world.
There's never really a doubt that the protagonists would win this battle, and gain more reputation.
The protagonists accrue enough power to become a central figure or leader in their capacity.

In fact, we can go further. If we play these shows back episode by episode, we can see the analogy between what episode 1 of each show sets up, versus episode 2, and episode 3, and so for some time. Yes, the details are all different, but what these details establish are all the same.

Wrong.

Look to Death March, the MC is a lead programmer popular among his dev team. And the Shield Hero IRL was a universitary guy satisfied with his confortable life.

TodAboT said:

GlennMagusHarvey said:

So basically this is all about first impressions from appearances.

Considering that it was L0rdVictor's argument from the start, yes.
And most of the shows I mentioned have the main guys being overpowered, collecting girls and being super popular.

My point is simple. Only because there are bad implementations of the genre, doesn't means that are good implementations. There are a lot of GEnerikuns on isekais? Sure as there are in battle shonens.

If 1000 animes with asta level of main characters comes, it will not means that battle shonen is a bad genre, only that there are a lot of bad executions

Feb 28, 2020 9:57 AM

#68

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Jan 2018

902

L0rdV1ct0r said:

Daniel_Naumov said:
Thread lacks logical and factual arguments. Its main point has no reflection in the reality. And it reads like cringe. Consider abandoning it to avoid further humiliation.

TEchnically Magic Knight Rayearth is a Isekai AND a mahou shoujo.

katsucats said:
I think it's absolutely hilarious, and embarrassing, that you think that when people say isekais are all the same, that they mean that literally everything, down to the characters must be the same. That's so obviously not the case that I would posit you're dishonestly trying to "win" with some premature argument instead of actually trying to understand the issue.

First, we're going to have to specify, for lack of better words, thematic genres and structural genres. Thematic genres are related by an important element or concept that the author wanted you to feel, or an overarching direction of the plot. For example, adventure as a genre might evoke some feeling of exploration; fantasy might evoke feelings of awe and magic; and psychological thriller grounds the external world to one similar to the one we live in, but explores the possibilities in perception. There is no definite similarity between one adventure anime and another adventure anime besides this feeling they evoke, and the types of themes -- not even the themes themselves -- they explore.

Structural genres, like isekai, follow a dramatic structure. If we're going to use classical definitions, we can throw drama and comedy in here. Shakespearean comedies had specific beats, or dramatic acts, such as one that introduces the characters, one that sets up a main conflict, and one that resolves. Isekai is a structure genre because it, too, has dramatic acts. The characters mostly start out as rejected members of modern society; they get transported into a new world and get a chance to make something of themselves; they discover through the rules of this other world some objective or goal; they meet friends that they didn't have in real life; they gain powers and a standing in this alternate reality.

Every isekai, by definition, follows such a structure, but it's a shame that most isekais never really deviate from the specifics of this formula. Let's look at two recent examples, Shield Hero and Slime. For good measure, we'll throw Re:Zero, Log Horizon, No Game No Life. Their similarities are:

The protagonists aren't super popular in real life.
The protagonists are, for the foreseeable future, irreversibly transported into an alternate, medieval fantasy reality.
The protagonists gain some mysterious powers.
The protagonists start out lost, but slowly gain trustworthy nakama, and a reputation.
The protagonists meet some anime that don't like their newfound presence in this new world.
There's never really a doubt that the protagonists would win this battle, and gain more reputation.
The protagonists accrue enough power to become a central figure or leader in their capacity.

In fact, we can go further. If we play these shows back episode by episode, we can see the analogy between what episode 1 of each show sets up, versus episode 2, and episode 3, and so for some time. Yes, the details are all different, but what these details establish are all the same.

Wrong.

Look to Death March, the MC is a lead programmer popular among his dev team. And the Shield Hero IRL was a universitary guy satisfied with his confortable life.

TodAboT said:

Considering that it was L0rdVictor's argument from the start, yes.
And most of the shows I mentioned have the main guys being overpowered, collecting girls and being super popular.

My point is simple. Only because there are bad implementations of the genre, doesn't means that are good implementations. There are a lot of GEnerikuns on isekais? Sure as there are in battle shonens.

If 1000 animes with asta level of main characters comes, it will not means that battle shonen is a bad genre, only that there are a lot of bad executions

Please understand this.
When people say that "all Isekais are the same" they don't mean it literally. They mean the MAJORITY.
M A J O R I T Y
I've mentioned this many times and you don't understand at all.

Feb 28, 2020 10:01 AM

#69

Chiibi

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Nov 2008

10493

Because they haven't seen enough of them, obviously.

Every isekai I watched was pretty different....

Feb 28, 2020 10:49 AM

#70

DesolatePsyche

Lewd Depresso

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Jul 2008

2386

I'm just happy they keep making em. I love isekai genre. Or in general fantasy RPG setting. So far I have loved almost every isekai.

Feb 28, 2020 2:04 PM

#71

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Feb 2020

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TodAboT said:
Please understand this.
When people say that "all Isekais are the same" they don't mean it literally. They mean the MAJORITY.
M A J O R I T Y
I've mentioned this many times and you don't understand at all.

Then the correct sentence should be "the MAJORITY of isekais are the same" not "all isekais are the same"

Feb 28, 2020 2:18 PM

#72

Tuliharja

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Jul 2019

245

Because isekai has become a genre. Just like you expect certain elements from say romance stories, same applies to isekai. It needs to have certain elements to qualify as isekai to be isekai. Otherwise you couldn't tag it as isekai. Sure, one story can have more than one genre yet still be labelled as certain one, but the main core points are what makes it recognized as one. When looking only those certain points, people can start to view every show that belongs to the same genre as same. That's because you can't really change that much those points (because the fear of changing the genre and thus losing audience), so people often change how it's represented to watcher/reader and possible add other genres or change certain elements. Really, if you watched any genre, you'll start to see certain patterns that are being repeated over and over again. I think the easiest one is detective stories. When you've read/watched too many, you start to guess faster and faster who is the criminal/murderer. When that happens, it becomes boring, eh? Same with isekai. It uses certain patterns to be known as one, but if you watch too many...well, it can become boring and thus 'all those are same'.

Other places where to find me:

☆ AO3/FF/tumblr/YouTube: Tuliharja
☆ Pixiv: Tuliharja/72847426
☆ DA: Tuliharja-art

Feb 28, 2020 7:47 PM

#73

katsucats

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Oct 2012

16077

L0rdV1ct0r said:
Wrong.

Look to Death March, the MC is a lead programmer popular among his dev team. And the Shield Hero IRL was a universitary guy satisfied with his confortable life.

I didn't watch Death March, but the guy in Shield Hero clearly found something missing in his life. You're a lost cause if you're this desperate to poke holes on a reoccurring trend over 5+ anime with your 1 example.

Edit: Okay, I just watched the beginning of Death March just to entertain you. He's 29, no girlfriend, working at a dead end job with high turnover rate, overloaded with multiple projects with rushed deadlines. He hasn't taken a shower in 3 days, and he calls his job the "death march". He eats takeout alone for lunch, and his boss can't remember his name. And you thought he's happy with his life. LOL

Stop lying.

L0rdV1ct0r said:
Then the correct sentence should be "the MAJORITY of isekais are the same" not "all isekais are the same"

This is like someone saying "roses are red as violets are blue", and you're there shaking your head like a smartass thinking, Nuh uh, some roses are not red! And everyone in the room just lost brain cells. Where's the adult in this household?

Edit 2: Just finished episode 1. They made MC so OP that they had to come up with an excuse to gimp him "so he doesn't look like a villain". lmao That episode played out exactly like Slime. No surprise.

katsucatsFeb 28, 2020 8:10 PM

My subjective reviews: katsureview.wordpress.com
THE CHAT CLUB.

Feb 28, 2020 8:14 PM

#74

Soverign

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Dec 2016

7175

Its like almost nobody ever watched Hai to Gensou no Grimgar ;_;

Those feels of guilt, shock, and shame at making your first kill. You realize you just ending a living breathing things life.
Then after like 200 or something back stabs you are just like ¯\\_(ツ)_/¯

Feb 28, 2020 9:56 PM

#75

TheBigGuy

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Nov 2013

21386

Soverign said:
Its like almost nobody ever watched Hai to Gensou no Grimgar ;_;

Those feels of guilt, shock, and shame at making your first kill. You realize you just ending a living breathing things life.
Then after like 200 or something back stabs you are just like ¯\\_(ツ)_/¯

I did and it's one of my favourite Isekai. You're right.

By the way, that's Tira from Soul Calibur in your avatar and signature, right?

You're a louse, Roger Smith. - R. Dorothy Wayneright
This is my fight! No Senpai, this is our fight! - Kojou Akatsuki & Yukina Himeragi

Feb 28, 2020 9:59 PM

#76

Soverign

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Dec 2016

7175

@TheBigGuy

Yep. The most requested character that they made her DLC. Pure sadism right there.

Feb 28, 2020 10:01 PM

#77

TheBigGuy

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Nov 2013

21386

@Soverign

I see, that's cool. Indeed.

You're a louse, Roger Smith. - R. Dorothy Wayneright
This is my fight! No Senpai, this is our fight! - Kojou Akatsuki & Yukina Himeragi

Feb 29, 2020 12:34 AM

#78

arrowsofjudgment

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Aug 2017

1428

i don't think that all people believe that all iseakai are the same because isekais are always different than eachother

Feb 29, 2020 4:44 AM

#79

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Feb 2020

39

katsucats said:

Edit: Okay, I just watched the beginning of Death March just to entertain you. He's 29, no girlfriend, working at a dead end job with high turnover rate, overloaded with multiple projects with rushed deadlines. He hasn't taken a shower in 3 days, and he calls his job the "death march". He eats takeout alone for lunch, and his boss can't remember his name. And you thought he's happy with his life. LOL.

NO. I said that he is not the typical otaku. HE is the typical semi enslaved game dev. And his life is the reality of many mobile developers in Asia.

My point is that the rgeat majority of isekai protagonists are unhappy with their lives but not all of then are NEETs. Tanya the Evil was a successful businessman who hates the "mister X" that claim to be a God and send the MC to another world as a orphan woman in middle of a brutal war .

Anyway, i an at moment playing Gothic 2 with returning mod. Go to the Gothic universe would not be a pleasant experience...

Feb 29, 2020 7:53 AM

#80

Kurt_Irving

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Jul 2013

2489

Because all of them have to take place in an alternate timeline with medieval whatever and plot all over the place, plus the characters are often unrelatable.

Why don't they make a fantasy anime where the main character is from that world? you know, make a hard fantasy anime.

I rather watch a Quest for Camelot webcartoon or remake any day over some run-of-the-mill isekai anime that you can find anywhere, plus Quest for Camelot can live up to the genre than these generic light novels with "fantasy" slapped on 'em.

Just goes to show you that LNs require infinitesimal skill to write at all. If only Japan knew how to write complete fantasy stories based on prose.

Kurt_IrvingFeb 29, 2020 7:59 AM

Feb 29, 2020 10:55 AM

#81

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Feb 2020

39

Kurt_Irving said:
Because all of them have to take place in an alternate timeline with medieval whatever and plot all over the place, plus the characters are often unrelatable..

NOt true. Tanya the Evil is a isekai to a ww2 like war world.

And IMO Ainz from Overlord is far more relatable than Asta from Black Clover.

Even the WORST isekai protagonist is better than Asta and Midoria.

Feb 29, 2020 11:11 AM

#82

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Jul 2018

561867

because they are?
isekai is utter garbage mixed with trash

Feb 29, 2020 12:07 PM

#83

Nadechi12

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Jul 2019

2700

Isekai means another world. In most isekai animes, the plot is someone from earth is sent to another world, obtains power, and has to defeat the demon king or someone. Most of the time they are accompanied by females companions and they usually support the MC in battle. MOST isekai anime are like that so I guess that is why people say they are the same. But that logic can be applied to literally any genre of anime

Feb 29, 2020 12:09 PM

#84

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Dec 2008

3959

There is no such thing as “People believe so and so. Some people, that is. Don’t flat out say people think, people like, people hate. Differences in people is 100% happens. However, Isekai genre anime aren’t same in every aspect. How each universe works, that’s up to the author. Every author wanna make an extraordinary isekai story better than others, and rates between Konosuba, Shield Hero, RE:Zero to SAO vary. Obviously there is even Isekai wars between fanbases. Just like ol days of the old Big 3.

I love Shield Hero and KonoSuba more than SAO, RE:Zero and other isekai anime. One has good sense of humor, the other has gradually built up aspects:

- Story and Plot-Twist
- Character Progression and Development
- Universe and its Laws

etc

Feb 29, 2020 12:11 PM

#85

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Jul 2018

561867

Because they ain't fans of isekai and to them they look all the same. Why do you think people say all of mecha sucks, or romance, or slice of life? They ain't bothered to explore them below surface level to know better.

Feb 29, 2020 1:11 PM

#86

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Dec 2008

3959

Ejector said:
Because they ain't fans of isekai and to them they look all the same. Why do you think people say all of mecha sucks, or romance, or slice of life? They ain't bothered to explore them below surface level to know better.

Are you denying the existence of GUNDAM and MACROSS fanbases?

Feb 29, 2020 1:34 PM

#87

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Jul 2018

561867

ArabianLuffy said:

Ejector said:
Because they ain't fans of isekai and to them they look all the same. Why do you think people say all of mecha sucks, or romance, or slice of life? They ain't bothered to explore them below surface level to know better.

Are you denying the existence of GUNDAM and MACROSS fanbases?

I don't understand the question?
Macross is too small of a fanbase to make a difference. Gundam may as well be its own medium.And those two are well respected (EVA also comes to mind), while new regular mecha in general struggles to survive.

Feb 29, 2020 1:44 PM

#88

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Dec 2008

3959

Ejector said:
I don't understand the question?
Macross is too small of a fanbase to make a difference. Gundam may as well be its own medium.And those two are well respected (EVA also comes to mind), while new regular mecha in general struggles to survive.

When you said: "Why do you think people say all of mecha sucks", it came like all people of the anime community don't like GUNDAM and MACROSS.

Also when you said: "Because they ain't fans of isekai and to them they look all the same."

Who is they?

All or Some?

Feb 29, 2020 1:48 PM

#89

Offline

Jul 2018

561867

ArabianLuffy said:

Ejector said:
I don't understand the question?
Macross is too small of a fanbase to make a difference. Gundam may as well be its own medium.And those two are well respected (EVA also comes to mind), while new regular mecha in general struggles to survive.

When you said: "Why do you think people say all of mecha sucks", it came like all people of the anime community don't like GUNDAM and MACROSS.

Also when you said: "Because they ain't fans of isekai and to them they look all the same."

Who is they?

All or Some?

I mean in general, not literally everyone. I guess, replace these with "most" instead. I guess I was being hyperbolic for the heck of it.

Feb 29, 2020 2:01 PM

#90

FinalReality56

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May 2019

754

ArabianLuffy said:

Ejector said:
I don't understand the question?
Macross is too small of a fanbase to make a difference. Gundam may as well be its own medium.And those two are well respected (EVA also comes to mind), while new regular mecha in general struggles to survive.

When you said: "Why do you think people say all of mecha sucks", it came like all people of the anime community don't like GUNDAM and MACROSS.

Also when you said: "Because they ain't fans of isekai and to them they look all the same."

Who is they?

All or Some?

He was making a general statement, there's a far amount of people online who refuse to watch mecha (like the people who refuse to watch isekai, magical girl, or sports anime), because they saw what general anime fans consider the "best of the genre" (in mecha's case it's Gurren Lagann, Evangelion, and Code Geass that get this treatment), and think they don't need to watch anything else because the major ones are just so "not like the rest of the genre," despite actually sharing a fair amount of elements.

Feb 29, 2020 2:02 PM

#91

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Feb 2020

39

Lavaa said:
because they are?
isekai is utter garbage mixed with trash

Yes. NO difference between Tanya the Evil, Overlord and no game no live...

Feb 29, 2020 2:02 PM

#92

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Dec 2008

3959

Ejector said:
I mean in general, not literally everyone. I guess, replace these with "most" instead. I guess I was being hyperbolic for the heck of it.

Well, "most" would make a lot of sense. Anyone says "all is this and that" loses the argument instantly about something subjective. The hashtag #NotAll is just right.

FinalReality56 said:
He was making a general statement, there's a far amount of people online who refuse to watch mecha (like the people who refuse to watch isekai, magical girl, or sports anime), because they saw what general anime fans consider the "best of the genre" (in mecha's case it's Gurren Lagann, Evangelion, and Code Geass that get this treatment), and think they don't need to watch anything else because the major ones are just so "not like the rest of the genre," despite actually sharing a fair amount of elements.

It didn't came sound a general statement to me. Just saying people this or that is to me means all. It's not hard to say most people or some people. I need to confirm his position of a status.

ArabianLuffyFeb 29, 2020 2:11 PM

Feb 29, 2020 6:10 PM

#93

katsucats

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Oct 2012

16077

L0rdV1ct0r said:

katsucats said:

Edit: Okay, I just watched the beginning of Death March just to entertain you. He's 29, no girlfriend, working at a dead end job with high turnover rate, overloaded with multiple projects with rushed deadlines. He hasn't taken a shower in 3 days, and he calls his job the "death march". He eats takeout alone for lunch, and his boss can't remember his name. And you thought he's happy with his life. LOL.

NO. I said that he is not the typical otaku. HE is the typical semi enslaved game dev. And his life is the reality of many mobile developers in Asia.

My point is that the rgeat majority of isekai protagonists are unhappy with their lives but not all of then are NEETs. Tanya the Evil was a successful businessman who hates the "mister X" that claim to be a God and send the MC to another world as a orphan woman in middle of a brutal war .

Anyway, i an at moment playing Gothic 2 with returning mod. Go to the Gothic universe would not be a pleasant experience...

I never even used the word "otaku" in my post. MC in Death March had a shitty life. He might not admit it in the beginning, but you could see it in his face. You could see it in the people around him. And you're saying MC in Tanya the Evil was happy?

A key property of isekais is that the alternate world awakens MC to a suppressed angst and makes them realize a fuller life. This is true in every isekai. Every. Single. One. The two anime you listed are perfect examples to my point.

My subjective reviews: katsureview.wordpress.com
THE CHAT CLUB.

Feb 29, 2020 6:19 PM

#94

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Jul 2018

561867

Because people don't look beyond the picture. Plus most male mc's look generic

Feb 29, 2020 6:27 PM

#95

JameaZ

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Nov 2016

22

In reality deep down or not, almost everyone wants a girlfriend and overpowered magic/skillset.
It's generic in a way that it strategically fits in what every man desires.

I'd rather embrace it from being generic, than complain about what everyone really wants, deep down.

Feb 29, 2020 6:53 PM

#96

StormShaun

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Sep 2019

402

I think it's due to the popularity or amount. For a person who doesn't watch or even dislike them, I can imagine they tend to blend together for a "ugh, another isekai". Not to mention, if these people come together and discuss... well, more just say "why are there so many?" and so on until such a viewpoint is created for a vocal minority and others/fan of the sub-genre see more often than not.

I feel like we could have a roundtable philosophy discussion at this point. Anyway, getting over that bullshit, some of these isekai can share similar traits like setting and... well, don't know if it's just me, but when there's a harem, all the girls/characters just blend together and you can hardly tell them apart from another harem Isekai; well, at least when compared to a smaller cast. On the other hand, I think we can tell something like Tanya the Evil and Konosuba apart rather easily. So I guess it depends on theme, design, and character... and probably other minor details.

Those who do watch quite a few of them, you can probably find points that stand out. Like "video game vs yeeted/ded to another world vs yeeted to another world with game mechanics", and all those specific points that make. Still, I won't deny, there's a fuck-ton of them out there... to the point I just want a pure fantasy setting. Makes me remember when people said Goblin Slayer was an Isekai... and... whaaaa?

Honestly, dissecting a genre/sub-genre can get rather complicated. I mean, do you want to discuss common colour themes and how a popular one can easily become a common one, thus increasing less unique properties. *Sigh* I mean, it's like that one picture on page one of the central town and how they're very similar. That kind of shit doesn't help.

Still, would I read something like Yuusha desu ga Isekai de Elf Yome to Pizza-ten Hajimemasu? Yes, I would. So I can enjoy some Isekai... but I can't want to watch more than one per season... or if I do, they have to be unique from one another.

"You know you've reached peak quality when a doujin is better than the actual source series." (Eg. To LOVE-Ru)

Just to list a couple of biases.
Likes: A good story, characters, writing, romance, a good plot twist or something that breaks expectations (In a good way), 'backstory' and justice.
Dislikes: Bad romance, too much fanservice, the harem genre, yuri, yaoi, and bad writing.

Feb 29, 2020 8:56 PM

#97

Agent_Redacted

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Apr 2019

535

It's just another way of lazily saying that the majority of the isekai are bad.

Feb 29, 2020 9:17 PM

#98

scruffs

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Jul 2015

2731

Idk I guess they can't pick up on the difference.

Mar 1, 2020 3:30 AM

#99

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Feb 2020

39

katsucats said:
A key property of isekais is that the alternate world awakens MC to a suppressed angst and makes them realize a fuller life. This is true in every isekai. Every. Single. One. The two anime you listed are perfect examples to my point.

In every not. In majority? Yes.

How many percentage of the world population are 100% happy with the family? Job? Friends? And everything else?

I only don't like when they summon useless piece of shits as MCs like the smartphone isekai. Seriously. Imagine that you are in a typical medieval fantasy world and needs to summon someone from this world to help with a war against Orcs. Who would you summon?

A ) A professional hitman that killed dozens of people, know how to make blackpowder, smokeless powder, how to make modern weaponry, understand a lot of the RL technology and can help you preparing traps, guerrilla warfare, making the weaponry of your army advance hundreds of years and communication technology
B ) A teenager who can't even run 50m, can't lift weight, can't live without his parents help, if magic exists in the new world, is too undisciplined and dumb to learn(...)

This is one reason that i liked Drifters. A lot of historical figures goes to the "new world"...

And guess what. On most good RPG's you goes from nothing to godlike. On Gothic 1, you goes from another convict in the penal colony that any wolf can tear you apart in a fraction of second to a guy capable of defeating a archdevil that is worshiped as a God. And when you pay for someone to teach you how to use one handed weapons, your animation and stance changes. Hell, even shonen protagonists follow a similar progression. See Luffy on OP starting as a average capitain in east blue and now able to tangle with the most powerful guys on new world like Katakuri.

L0rdV1ct0rMar 1, 2020 3:36 AM

Mar 1, 2020 6:29 PM

#100