Food Wars is suffering from the Escalation problem, and the SAO problem, yet it's still this highly rated?
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Dec 12, 2017 10:03 PM
#51
zero-r said: I stopped reading halfway through this long-ass wall-of-text rant. Even the title of the topic is longer than it needs to be (it looks like you just wrote a whole paragraph in it). Excuse me if I couldn't make interesting enough for you, I should have condensed it so all you little whiny babies can read it and I should have added emojis too! 👄💓💖🔫🔪🔕 It's ironic because I stated I wrote this post because it insulted all of our intelligence, but I am starting to wonder how many here actually have any... It was fully intentional to make the title long, as to convey to the people looking at this post that I am fully willing to hold a hearty conversation, and a long one at that, about the issues I specified. Just wanted to clarify. |
Dec 12, 2017 10:13 PM
#52
Dec 12, 2017 10:15 PM
#53
I do feel that this season isn't anything special or good as compared to season 1. I prefer the manga more, and only felt obliged to watch season 3 as a refreshment while I am still kept up to date with the manga. Casually watching it and fast-forwarding on certain episodes now, and I can still feel that this season is sucky. Totally agree with your points. |
Dec 12, 2017 10:16 PM
#54
lol wtf why even compare this to sword art online in the first place I actually quite like this season possibly more than season 2. This show thrives on being super dramatic, and adding an actual villain in it actually ups the ante. There's also some much needed character development for the nakiri sisters. Maybe the animation quality has decreased, but this show is probably one of the most consistent at keeping me entertained. |
Dec 13, 2017 3:39 AM
#55
Kittens-kun said: Different opinions = whiny babies? Lol. Why don't you share you're opinion and not just comment on everyone elses? |
Dec 13, 2017 4:53 AM
#56
Isn't it like that since the 2nd season actually? The 2nd season was already like -> Cooking "Fight" -> Someone has a high score -> Explains how (s)he rekt them -> Then it's the next students' turn The 2nd season wasn't good but the 3rd one is even worse. When I knew this season would have 24 eps I thought that it would have been.. well better executed than that. I'm reading the manga atm, I'm a little bit further than the anime but the anime is catching up really quickly. It feels like they're adapting 3/4 of a volume, if not an entire volume in 1 episode. Not to mention the lazy animation. At first I didn't notice that, but then I saw this comment Zelev said: Literally every scene is a panel zooming in or zooming out. Sometimes you don't really notice it, but then there's times where it's so awfully obvious. The entire episodes are filled with panning scenes as if they wanted to "copy/paste" what was in the manga and "animate" it. It's really annoying to see how this anime is being adapted since the 1st season was good, the manga (I'm not all caught up) is okay, but the 2nd and 3rd season are rushed like hell. Everytime this anime has a new season, it keeps getting worse. Let's not talk about the comedy lol |
Dec 13, 2017 7:49 AM
#57
Dinoe said: Food Wars on the other hand has one of the best sets of female characters I've seen so far, a new take on the 'shounen' genre, food animation that makes me darn hungry, a good animation and overall a good and solid storyline. So you think it is bad hmm? Well, just stop watching it.... This is not a “new” take on the shounen genre. There have been lots of other food-centric-shounen mangas/series before this one, so this is nothing new (the difference? this one became popular). The overall storyline is average, not to mention it gets stale after a while, so it is its characters and their development. Also, If this is the best set of female characters you have seen, then I really don’t know what to say…. I know everything is subjective, but c’mon. Not quite. We have what? 8 animes about food? Maybe 3 of them are "good", so yes, SnS is a new take on shounen and food manga/anime, because we have like 20/30 animes about future-mecha-RPG-fantasy comedy shit every year. And, what makes SnS better than others - behind SnS food stands professional cook, all dishes u can make yourself. |
Dec 13, 2017 9:40 AM
#58
Draconix814 said: Kittens-kun said: Different opinions = whiny babies? Lol. Why don't you share you're opinion and not just comment on everyone elses? I don't really need to. I already said I think you're overreacting and I don't feel like getting into an argument when neither of us is going to change our stance anyway. |
Dec 13, 2017 12:07 PM
#59
MyEnglishIsGood said: Can't believe I just read this entire thread, this dude is salty af. When someone makes a valid point, he completely ignores it 'cause he's trapped inside his own ego. 😂😂😂 If you don't like the show, just don't watch it, bitching ain't gonna change anything. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Wow, I thought I made it painfully clear that I was salty, rather, I am beyond salty I AM OFFENDED. You claim that I don't like this show, and that's why I am bitching? You obviously skimmed over the five or six times I stated in this forum that I rated the first and second season a 9 out of 10; which isn't even true, because I actually rated both a 10 when I watched them! If it weren't for my rating system changing in the span of 2 years they would still be among my highest rated anime, so don't talk to me like I'm just some random hater. It's a similar feeling to having a close friend talk shit about you behind your back, because in both cases the friend and the show is insulting you. By the way, I may come off as sarcastic and narcissistic cunt, but at the very least, I AM FULLY WILLING TO EXPLAIN MY THOUGHT PROCESS, unlike a good percent of the people in this forum. If you could prove everything I said to be wrong, I would leave a satisfied fan of this series like I once was, yet two pages worth of forum later, and no one has left me a satisfying answer. Unlike most, I am very critical of my favorite anime and manga, they need to pass every test to be worthy of my praise and affection, if they do not, I won't hesitate to rip it to shreds. So, go on. Prove it to me, or get someone that can. |
Dec 13, 2017 3:06 PM
#60
Overall I can't say I agree with you in the series becoming terrible, the hype of the cooking/foodgasms and the satisfaction of the characters succeeding in the challenges never fails to make me smile, I also enjoy the comedy as always. I somewhat agree that the series went downhill as the story progressed (S1 is one of my favorites in general), but I personally still love Shokugeki to this point, manga included. One thing I 100% agree with is the "animation" of this 3rd Season, pretty much all of it is still images sliding from one direction to another to fake movement, I'm not someone who pays much attention to this stuff but it ends up being very distracting. |
Dec 13, 2017 4:16 PM
#61
I decided to try and answer your posts with my thoughts since you asked. Everything I've written is based off of just the anime and nothing else (haven't read the manga). Just my opinion, so take it as you will. = I don't understand this. This season has GOT to be the WORST season of Food Wars by a fucking long shot. Not only is the plot for this season more cliche than Sword Art Online was in its entirety of its first season, but it shares the same broken internal logic that it had, and tries to cover it up with absurd humor that ruins the experience tenfold. Only thing to respond to here is your comment about the humor in the show. It's been stated several times and it should be pretty obvious that opinions on humor can be pretty subjective, so if the humor ruins the experience for you, that is more indicative of whether you like the humor or not rather than the quality of the show itself. What I will say is that the way the show is set up and has progressed for two seasons already makes humor par for the course, so I don't find anything particularly wrong with this seasons use of comedy (disregarding any personal opinion on the comedy itself) = It's suffering from the Escalation problem, the same problem that all shounen have to face after coming out of a huge tournament ark, but unlike My Hero Academia, it looks like Shokugeki didn't know where else to go. This new villain drastically raises the stakes so fucking high, that I lost all suspension of disbelief in mere moments of his introduction, began to despise Erina tenfold in comparison, and lost faith in Soma for being any sort of believable character and not just some Deus ex Machina for the plot. I will agree that Azami's introduction raises the stakes for sure, and I feel that its particularly jarring because the stakes have been risen slowly and steadily (exactly what a tournament arc produces during its run). Up to this point, expulsion was really only on the table during particular Shokugeki (and of course whenever Yukihira wagers it in exchange for something else). Also, with the exception of Shinomiya, the conflicts have really only been confined to student-vs-student, so having someone who isn't restricted in the same ways as students take sudden and massive control of Totsuki is a pretty intense and sudden ramp-up in pressure and intensity. When Azami is in control of the academy, it feels like being behind enemy lines, where any mistake or loss means losing everything, and conflict can come at any time since Azami sits outside of the normal restrictions of Shokugeki for students (for students, stepping out of line means having to answer to the administration, but Azami is the administration, so he only has to answer to himself). I don't think that really makes his introduction and presence bad or unbelievable, however. As I said, it's quite interesting for a character to appear that is in such direct opposition to Yukihira's ideals and to also exist in a position where his previous methods of solving conflicts (directly confronting his opponents and challenging them to a Shokugeki to solve the problem) doesn't really work. Instead, he gets put on the defensive and has to fight a psuedo-proxy war against Azami's agents. As for Azami's character itself, in the context of the show itself, I think he's believable enough to be able to suspend your disbelief. Characters in SnS are exaggerated and publicly exhibit their ideals and personalities much more strongly than most people would in real life (imagine meeting someone like Kurokiba Ryo in real life). Ignoring what your personal opinion of Azami's beliefs are, his ideals are something grounded in some reality. Wanting to reserve "true cuisine" for only those he believes are refined enough to truly appreciate it is certainly an extreme ideal that you'd be hard pressed to find in real life, but certainly not something completely unreasonable for a show about food and the various intricasies of cooking and cuisine itself. His introduction in the restaurant with Erina is actually pretty believable for how his ideology is portrayed. He views the people eating there as nothing (even straight up calls them animals), so his over-the-top villainy is just him expressing his views and beliefs so openly it feels unreal, like something no one would ever do in real life, but once you take into account the fact that he disregards the people around him as worthless, the room might as well just be empty to him while he's expounding his ideals. I'll save Erina for a bit later (you talk about her in more detail later on), but I will mention here that I personally dislike Erina's character (not because I think it's bad for any particularly glaring reason, just a personal dislike). Something to keep in mind for later. As for Yukihira being not believable and just a Deus ex Machina (plot device), I think this is just a result of the pacing and the fact that this is a shounen. Yukihira is the character we are meant to root for and support, and when the character everyone is invested in loses, its a morale blow for the audience if its not done right. Yukihira wins most of the time (if he didn't lose in the Autumn Election finals, I would probably actually agree with you), but he is not infallible. In fact, the show presents his glaring weaknesses in the aftermath of the Autumn Elections (the fact that he lacks a particular style or flair with his cooking that is truly his). What I will say is that in a shounen, the journey of following the main character and having them struggle and then succeed is a large part of the appeal. When characters meaninglessly lose, it just kills the momentum and drags the show to square one again. You brought up Kuroko no Basket later on, but another show I think is relevant to this discussion is Haikyuu. I did like Haikyuu overall, but the section in the middle of the show where the cast goes to the training camp with some other teams from far away was a grueling experience to watch. Karasuno consistently loses and gets destroyed and loses over and over again with very minor improvements in their play until they finally reach a point where they put everything they've learned into action and... lose. With shounen, watching the main characters struggle and win is thrilling because it is a departure from the somewhat jaded and pessimistic perception we have of life (whereby struggle is just a means to more struggle or just loss). Watching Karasuno lose over and over again with no perceived gain or end in sight is hard to be invested in, as the show has no momentum. In SnS, the problem stems from the fact that the show has a very fast pacing (ignoring the Autumn Elections), where every episode it finds a new set of characters to battle it out in a Shokugeki (and in a few cases that is the first time we are ever seeing those characters). This means that the show can't really afford much time to have Yukihira lose and struggle to work his way up (they do fit in several non-Shokugeki moments where he does "fail", usually by failing to impress Erina or something). The show wouldn't be nearly as interesting if Yukihira constantly went up against people stronger than him and just lost for the sake of realism. Fairly soon, no one would care about rooting for Yukihira because no one would have any confidence or momentum built up behind him. So will Yukihira win the vast majority of the time? Yes. Is he just a bullshit Deus ex Machina plot device? Partially. He is the shounen protagonist who's role it is to produce the desired effect of being entertained by a story where the "underdog" struggles against the odds and pulls out an unlikely victory. The problem is that there are so many battles in SnS that the victories stack up and make Yukihira feel like less and less of an underdog. = Of course, the cliche plot can be overlooked by good execution... BUT THE EXECUTION IS FUCKING TERRIBLE! (I sincerely apologize for my abundance of cursing) But it is. I understand that the pacing "works better in manga format", but the retards at J.C. Staff turned the already fast pacing up to 11, letting all the comedy crash into the moments of tension and explode faster than Uchiage Hanabi crashed in the box office. They not only sped up the scenes and dialogue, but there's always some kind of soundtrack playing in the background, and the song feels like it changes EVERY 30 SECONDS TO A MINUTE. Needless to say, IT'S FUCKING ANNOYING. I agree, especially with this season, the pacing is very, very fast. Without the story being structured (like the Autumn Elections), the show seems to want to try and create the same tension and stakes with every match, but has to try and create that background with new characters in a new way with new cooking techniques and dishes and new plot points, all while not trying to have the show lag or drag on. As a result, it seems like we end up a few thousand miles from where the last episode ended by the end of the week and everything that was important last week gets thrown to the wayside. Seeing it like that, I have to agree with what other people here have said. With the pace of the show and the nature of the genre, if you watch this show expecting to see a masterpiece of storytelling with each individual episode, you're probably going to be disappointed. If you watch each week as specifically an entertainment investment, you'll probably follow the flow of the show better and get more enjoyment out of it. I can't speak for the soundtrack, as I am pretty heavily biased towards it. I don't usually pay much attention to the particular use of the OST, so I won't comment on that part. = Just to be clear, I understand comedy is subjective. For example, a show with polarizing opinions to its comedy airing right now is March comes in like a Lion. I can understand why there are diverging opinions on how that show handles comedy, because the whiplash effect created by Rei's depression taking the spotlight then it transitioning to the lighthearted comedy moments can be jarring for those who can't relate with his mental state. I don't necessarily agree, but I do understand why it would be considered an issue for most, BUT FOOD WARS IS JUST RUINING EVERYTHING IT SETS OUT TO DO WITH ITS COMEDY. Every single time it tries to create tension it is bombarded with chibi art ripped straight from the manga, even when the music is trying to make my adrenaline pump. It contradicts itself, unlike March comes in like a Lion, and there's nothing anyone can relate to for consistency. At least for those who hate the comedy in March, they at least acknowledge that the dark elements are fascinating in its own right, but in Shokugeki's case, if one hates the comedy, there's really nothing else to like. Let's just see Soma stick it to the man! That'll get fans HYPED! *rolls eyes* I talked about this earlier, but I'll expand a bit on what I think you're getting at here. An example I'm going to use here (that will probably be somewhat unpopular, but w/e) is Kyoukai no Kanata. Admittedly I dislike this show, and the reason why is because it is a show that presents the premise of having a lot at stake within the story and characters, with most of the interactions being set up in a serious and dramatic environment with serious background to the conflicts and events. Yet, this flow is inconsistently diverted and cut up whenever the comedy of the show comes through. The problem is that the show goes from 600ft deep in the drama of the situation, then cuts to some stale character jokes that don't really add anything to the situation, and then the next second, we're thrown back into the drama, where we'd rather have just stayed in the first place. In some ways, SnS does have this same problem (if you're really that invested in the action and intensity of the Shokugeki), but the show has set itself up in a way where that type of interruptive comedy is expected from the characters as presented. Yukihira is usually in a state of confidence and has little regard for normal social standards (and is oblivious in some respects), so him saying something out of place is to be expected. Besides this, the show very clearly has its intense and serious moments that they don't joke around with (i.e. Yukihira challenging Shinomiya to a Shokugeki to rescind Megumi's expulsion). That means that you can sort of get a feel for how the show will flow and utilize its comedic and serious elements. When the show cuts to Yukihira with a sharp glare and without his usual carefree expression, you can get invested in the moment because you feel that the show will not cut off the flow with a random act of "comedy". But during the rest of the show, you can freely mix the comedy and action together without being too jarring. Again, I can't really speak for the music, as I don't really pay too much attention to it to be honest (I usually just listen to the OSTs outside of the show itself). As for the 3-gatsu no Lion comparison, I can't weigh in completely (I haven't seen it personally), I do want to point out that essentially what it looks like you said is "I can understand why some people don't like the transition from light-hearted comedy to depression, but I can't understand why some people like the transition from light-hearted comedy to action/suspense/literally anything else". You essentially say that in the case of 3-gatsu no Lion, people can have whatever opinion they like on comedy in a not-strictly just comedy show, but that in the case of SnS, that same logic just doesn't apply (for some reason). = Back on topic. So not only is the production incompetent from an editing standpoint, but the animation looks like a powerpoint presentation that was ripped straight from the manga. The art is riddled with derps, and the camera has a bad habit of sliding across the frame to try to distract from it. You know what anime has the same exact problem? I'll give you a moment to think about it, unlike Food Wars... The answer is: Berserk 2016 and 17, and the original 90s anime also looked like a powerpoint. I'm not an animator or an artist by any remote definition of the words, so I'm definitely not qualified to say whether the animation itself is objectively "good" or not (whatever that would even define), but I personally have not found any major problems with the way the animation has been this season. SnS is a non-combat shounen, so the usual points of noticeable low-quality animation during any fight scenes don't exist, so it's possible I just haven't seen any glaring issues. I should also mention that I am a fan of the character designs in SnS, so that's mostly what I'm looking at/paying attention to. = Also, the exposition is fucking atrocious, even if I was trying to take notes on what the fuck the characters are cooking, between all the other problems the series has, I can't breathe long enough for me to comprehend what the show is trying to get at, both in terms of the on-screen Shoukugeki's and what the story is even trying to say at a conceptual level. I hope my point that this season is insulting mine and everyone else's intelligence on so many levels is getting through to everyone here, because it is really aggravating me. Who knows? Maybe I've just overlooked this problem from the beginning of the anime and only now am I starting to notice it and bitch about it. I mean, unless you are familiar with and use the cooking methods, ingredients, and cooking terms that they talk about in the show, then you're probably going to be lost on that front. It is kind of a bummer that for a large majority of the show, the meaning I can get from the Shokugeki lies in trusting what I've been told by the characters, but that's not really a fault of the show. Realistically, the show could just not explain anything and just leave the intricasies of the food to the niche audience that has a great understanding of that kind of thing, but I personally appreciate it being more accessible by trying to explain a lot of concepts quickly. Either it wastes a lot of time giving you a true full understanding of complicated cooking concepts, or it shoots enough by you for you to get the jist and still enjoy the show. = Did someone say bitch? Yeah, Erina was a bitch in the first and second season, now she is a fucking stupid and weak damsel in distress that leaves me severely disappointed for she is supposed to be the MAIN FEMALE CHARACTER. What is she Asuna??!! Megumi should have been the main love interest, instead of a tsundere with a god complex, for whom is also unreachable in terms of plot and has no logic to back up this stupid "ability" if you can even call it that. The whole point of Soma's and Erina's relationship was that Soma was supposed to reach Erina with his cooking, BUT HE ALREADY HAS since the first episode, so it defeats the point. Instead of just sharing a mutual growth and love with Megumi as time progressed. You know what this means? Shokugeki has been doing nothing but chewing the fat this entire time, and now it has finally backfired. It's the Masamune-kun problem! Someone call Digibro-senpai, for he will be proud of me! Okay, a couple of points here. Remember that I personally share your dislike of Erina, but I wouldn't say that I'm super disappointed in her characterization in this season. With what little we know of her past with Azami, having some residual trauma as a result of the treatment she recieved from Azami isn't totally ridiculous. Another thing you have to remember is that Erina has been shown to rely on no one but those she trusts (like Hisako). So when faced with someone she believes she cannot stop (Azami), it kinda makes sense for her to shut down and fail to think logically about what she should do (like teaming up with Yukihira and Alice to stand up to him). Her past has convinced her that the thought "Stand up to Azami" is not a valid option worth pursuing. I still would like to see more of her development this season to make any final judgements on whether I think it was handled well though. Also, her "ability" is not something that can be instrisically be called anything because it derives its value from outside sources. Her "God Tongue" is a valuable ability because it has importance placed on it by Totsuki and the culinary world. The "God Tongue" is powerful because people put their trust in it (if it pleases Erina's palate, it is good food). Erina's palate could be just kinda decent but the importance placed on it by the culinary world is what makes it powerful (seeing as how everyone's taste differs so one person's opinion on what's "good" or not couldn't ever really have truly universal application). = Jokes aside, I hope I am not the only who sees how retarded this season is. I feel passionate about this because Food Wars was a favorite of mine until this latest season. I don't remember this being a problem earlier on in the story, but I certainly know its a problem now, and I don't approve of it being the third highest rated show if the season. That's simply preposterous. This season, to me, is just a half-baked, half-assed, and uninspired mess of a dish, and I feel ashamed that I expected more. On to the next post. = Before anyone calls me out on it, I forgot to explain that Azami is the most stereotypical villain character ever. I mean, disregarding the laziness of his design, what is even up with that backstory? He brainwashed Erina to enjoy his tastes... Does anyone else realize how retarded and plain unrealistic that is? He couldn't have just educated her slowly on the refinement of quality cuisine, he had to brainwash her. Erina got tormented because she didn't throw out a meal, and then, all of a sudden, now she has a god complex and is paradoxically dependent on her father... Which doesn't even make sense, because she didn't even mention him in the entirety of the anime. Well, try to convince someone that murder is okay by educating them slowly on the refinement of perfect killings. If someone doesn't believe in your ideals and has their own set of morals, its really hard to just "convince" them that they should think the way you do. It's fairly likely that Azami wanted to imprint his ideals and beliefs onto Erina while she was still fairly young and impressionable. Especially being her father, it would be very difficult for her to oppose the primary authority figure in her life. And I felt that it was clearly implied that her way of thinking wasn't changed by the single solitary event that we were shown. Like most "brainwashing", she was probably conditioned and influenced with Azami's way of thinking over a long period of time with many events like the one we saw culminating in her current state. Also, is it really that strange that she hasn't said anything about her father for the whole anime? What about Nikumi's father? Isshiki? Why hasn't everyone just walked up to Yukihira and mentioned their father that they hate for brainwashing them to submit to their ideology of fine cuisine? Case in point: She hadn't mentioned him because he wasn't relevant or something she wanted to think about. = Azami overthrowing Grandpa Director-sama was the laziest asspull I've seen this year. It shouldn't be that easy for the Elite Ten to do a coup de tat against the FUCKING DIRECTOR OF THE SCHOOL. I don't care how much power the Elite Ten is supposed to have, but overthrowing the very man that owns the school is so unrealistic IT HURTS. I never understood why student councils in anime were given more power than the teachers, but at least most shows had the decency to hardly include teachers or mentors in the narrative in the first place. Furthermore, HOW DID HE EVEN PERSUADE THEM TO DO IT?!?!!? I doubt a goody-two-shoes like Tsukasa would agree, and I don't see any motives that anyone else would agree either, but I expect that to be explained to some capacity, even if it doesn't make sense. If you watched the scene where Yukihira talked with Sonzaemon after he got removed as the Totsuki director, you might have noticed that he seemed pretty... normal. Happy and relieved, even. I thought this was very strange until he revealed that he was tired out by holding the position as well as revealing his ulterior motive. As someone said earlier in this thread, he wouldn't have let Azami or the Elite Ten get away with what they did unless he wanted them to. He didn't even really fight it because he didn't want to. Totsuki under Sonzaemon operated under the philosophy that through conflict and struggle between themselves, those who survived would become strong enough to reach the top and be successful anywhere in the culinary world. With this in mind, it's clear that (regardless of whether you think it was the right move or not) Sonzaemon sees this as an opportunity for Erina, Yukihira, and anyone else who's willing to fight and struggle against a new and stronger obstacle in order to grow (Erina breaking free from her messed up mental state and Yukihira standing up and protecting his ideology of cuisine). As for why the Elite Ten Council did it in the first place, we don't have a whole lot of information about most of their reasonings, but there are two I'll talk about in the next part. = Also, the Elite Ten are fucking retarded. Even before Azami fucked everything up, I couldn't understand the motivations of those fuckers, and I couldn't get invested in the mystery of those motivations either. Tsukasa is basically characterized as amazingly good at cooking, but not at all confident in his cooking. It would make sense on a practical level, but NOT when it defines his entire personality. I guess he's also bad at paperwork. The red-haired chick for whom's name I had to look up, Rindo, has motivations that are confusing as hell, if she even has any. One moment, she's cheering on Soma's "fighting spirit", the next, she's reluctant to do the villain's bidding, the moment after that she's more than willing to pummel the clubs that are showing their spirit and are trying to be free from the tyranny of CENTRAL. Did someone say contradictory? Because she is that. Usually, contradictions in their thought process can add to the believability of the character, but her contradictions are so paradoxical, that her personality nearly flips on its head when they do occur. They aren't subtle whatsoever, and they have even less meaning to it. Next, we have loli chick, for whom's name I'm not going to look up because I couldn't care less about her. She is just supposed to be cute, but I guess she also hates people because STRANGER DANGER! There's also the new fuckers that just got introduced that have no notable personality. There's Kuga-senpai, but he got shafted the moment he got actual characterization, thanks to the fact he only had one purpose in the plot anyway. There's that asshole Eizan who's just an asshole, no matter how great a voice actor Sugita Tomokazu is at portraying him. I already got into what a fucking mess of a character Erina is... Then there are what? 5 other top 10 members? The only other one of note is Isshiki, but even his character got shafted because he believed that Soma would save their precious dorm. I guess he also tried his best to sabotage CENTRAL from the inside, but this only shows the one purpose he has in this ark. Okay, since (ironically) you didn't pay enough attention, I'll point out the reasoning behind Tsukasa's and Rindo's support of Azami. At the end of Episode 5, when Azami presents the message that the Elite Ten Council has removed Sonzaemon and appointed him as Director of Totsuki, Rindo says, "There's a new wave. Riding that wave feels like the most exciting possibility". Her goal is to seek out the most interesting possibilities in life. So when it seems like her actions contradict themselves, remember that her character is based on doing what will result in the most interesting path. When she's surprised by Yukihira standing up to Eizan, she cheers him on because she thinks the most interesting possibility is Yukihira defeating Eizan in a supposedly impossibly rigged challenge. She's reluctant to do the dirty work of Central because a)beating people in a Shokugeki that they are practically guaranteed to win isn't very interesting and b)its hard to find the most interesting option when someone else is telling you exactly what to do. She doesn't want to be tied down by Azami and Central's orders, but finds the resulting conflicts (namely Yukihira's challenge of Eizan) as an interested option that wouldn't have happened otherwise. As for Tsukasa, it's apparent now after Episode 11, but that wasn't released when you wrote this comment, but I'll add it here for completeness sake. Tsukasa was shown to have complete confidence in the quality and supremacy of his cooking in Episode 5 when he didn't even bother asking if his guests liked the food, since he was 100% sure they would. In addition, it was shown that he has no confidence in pretty much anything or anyone besides his own cooking, as well as the fact that his cooking style involves removing himself as much as possible from the creation of his dishes, instead making the quality of the ingredients replace the passion of the chef. All of this combined means one thing: he would most definitely agree with Azami that there is a single proper way to cook gourmet cuisine (Tsukasa's way; he has no confidence in anyone else's way of doing things) and he would also probably agree that there are only certain people who can truly appreciate that level of cuisine. For Momo, you're problem with her character is that she's cute and she's shy and dismissive around strangers. That's it? That seems like a you-problem rather than a problem with her character. If two traits of a character that haven't even been explained yet (and one of which isn't something she can really change willingly) is all it takes for you to just call her character bad and dislike it, then I don't know what to tell you. You're problem with Eizan is that he's an asshole. Well, a lot of people are assholes. You don't have to like them. Doesn't make him a bad character. Just means you don't like him. Isshiki did what he did because he had no other choice. If he tried to interfere with Central's operations more directly, they would have responded more directly to remove him from his seat. Instead, he trusted Yukihira to pull something off while he prepared to create a way for people to fight back against Central. If he hadn't done that and something different happened with Yukihira's Shokugeki, everyone else could have been completely screwed with no way of opposing Central at all. The other members haven't had enough screentime to really say anything meaningfull about, but hopefully that will change at some point. = AND WHAT THE FUCK IS WITH THIS "CENTRAL" BULLSHIT?!?!!? What is it supposed to be the CIA???? This is retarded even without considering the fact that it would be impossible to implement this new system in the time Azami did AND shut down every single club and DORMITORY by fucking force. With the Elite Ten Council on his side, Azami can really do whatever he wants (with one minor exception I'll talk about next). Those who want to rise through the ranks of Totsuki and be successful in the culinary world (ideals and passionate cooking be damned) and those who actually agree with Azami (for their own personal reasons) would most definitely exist in a not-insignificant number and would most definitely be willing to follow Central's orders to get ahead. What's so hard about filing paperwork and then giving the clubs the notice in person? = To add insult to injury, these orders can be disregarded if the students win a Shokugeki, which doesn't make sense. If these were orders from the school, then no matter how much the students bitch about it, they shouldn't be able to rebel. Why didn't Azami just ban all Shokugekis??? MAYBE BECAUSE THERE WOULDN'T BE A SHOW TO WATCH!!! This is bad. Really fucking bad. This is the one exception I mentioned earlier. The explanation I would give for this is that what makes Totsuki the school it currently exists as is the Shokugeki. The confidence and importance placed in the graduates of Totsuki stems from the trust that the culinary world places on the procedures of Totsuki and the trust that those procedures will produce the best chefs. If Azami just outright banned the Shokugeki, the culinary world would have nothing but Azami's word to go off of that the chefs he graduates are the best chefs. In addition, when instituting a takeover like Azami has done, it's important to keep up the appearances of legitimacy in order to consolidate power without bringing the rage of the masses against you. By using Eizan and rigging the Shokugeki, Azami could effectively "ban" Shokugeki by making them impossible to win, but could always claim that you can in reality challenge someone and win (although in practicality it is impossible). = However, by far the BIGGEST PLOT HOLE IN THIS ANIME IS: If the school is now being run by tyrants that are restricting your freedom and hindering your education in learning how to cook... WHY NOT JUST DROP OUT AND GO TO ANOTHER SCHOOL? As many people in this thread have said, its because this is Totsuki. Just like how in Danganronpa Kibougamine Academy "all but guarantees success in life", graduating from Totsuki all but guarantees success in the culinary world. If you've ever thought that something you had to do in school was kinda stupid and bureaucratic, you probably still did it. Why? Because if you did it and graduated, the benefit would make up for that bit of annoyance. Same concept here. For most people at Totsuki, why make a big deal out of rebelling or leaving to a lower ranked school when you can just sit back, deal with some stupid policy changes and glide all the way to graduation. Also, for most people, they have dedicated a lot of time to progressing in Totsuki, and leaving would not only put a blemish on the school record (in that they left and did not complete the course at Totsuki), but would also need to deal with transferring their progress to another school (which could have radically different requirements). = Better yet, just go to normal high school, and learn how to cook on the side. I think everybody forgets that these kids went straight in from Middle School and still haven't attended High School yet, but for what reason? So they can be 3 years behind in their education when they eventually do have to transfer back into the school system? No, so that they can set themselves up for guaranteed success in the culinary world through an endorsement by graduating from the school that everyone in the culinary world has complete confidence in their ability to produce the best chefs. = I am starting to think that this entire show was retarded from the beginning, but it doesn't explain why I gave it a 9/10 when I watched the first season. Maybe I should reevaluate my score sometime in the future. Also, this season's method of adding characterization seems to be shoving flashbacks into our faces of scenes of the characters acting uncharacteristically for no reason, getting put down, then it somehow "develops" them into the present. Take Ryou for example, neither his personality nor his character changed whatsoever, but of course, we need a flashback of him being put down because he didn't win the Autumn Elections, and now he learned how to cook spices! Just because it wasn't his specialty beforehand, doesn't mean he couldn't learn how to cook spices from a textbook, but the show tries to pass this on as development. It would have been downright expected of him to do so, its just his personality and any other cook would do the same. Why this show INSISTS on trying to make that a huge development in his character is not only beyond me, but it just comes across as cheesy and melodramatic as a result. I would argue that the difference between knowing how to cook with spices and knowing how to masterfully apply them to a specific dish in a specific scenario are two very different things. If you were suddenly asked to cook your best meat dish, would you decide to cook Filet Mignon if you knew what it was and vaguely how to cook it? Especially if your cooking was then going to be judged by respected food critics and people who could help influence your future career options, or if you didn't impress them you'd get expelled? I think most people would cook the best possible dish that they have complete confidence in making. All this means is that previously in the Autumn Elections, Kurokiba hadn't yet mastered the ability to apply the intricasies of spices to his dishes in a way that he would feel absolute confidence in serving. Remember that everything they serve in a Shokugeki will reflect back on them and their potential future. Just serving up something with some spices thrown in because you read it in a book is probably not the best way to make a winning dish. Also, you've pointed this out several times already, but the characters in SnS are still teenagers in school. I don't know about you, but I doubt that you could learn, experiment, and master all of the techniques you'd need to make a perfect dish for any occasion like they are expected to in this show all before they even turn 20. = Everything in this season is fucking predictable. I know we all know Soma is always going to win, except in those rare instances, and I am not going to bash the show for that. What I am going to bash it for, is how he can even win when the judges are paid off, in the second most predictable asspull this show committed. From the very moment this scenario was set up, I thought to myself "How is Soma going to win? He couldn't just charm the judges with his amazing cooking even though they were paid off and he's up against a member of the elite ten, right?" Yes, Yukihira will always win. Except when he doesn't. Brilliant deduction. I'll point back to what I said earlier about why Azami didn't just ban Shokugeki altogether to answer this part. Yukihira was essentially relying on the fact that Eizan and the judges would be so overconfident that they would just try his dish even though the entire Shokugeki was rigged. If they did, they would for sure realize that Yukihira's dish was better. Now this would lead to a scenario where the judges would know that Yukihira's dish was better but still ruled in favor of Eizan. This would completely break the reality where the Shokugeki is technically allowed but impossible to win, because everyone would know for sure that the judges were bought off, which would mean that the Shokugeki (which Totsuki's reputation and importance stem from) would be useless and meaningless, and Totsuki's influence would fall, as would Azami's. So Yukihira had to put them in a situation where they either had to lie and destroy Totsuki and Central, or give Yukihira the win and tell the truth. If they just lied anyway, I bet that Yukihira was planning to have the rest of the students (or a small section of them) to taste both dishes and reach that same conclusion, turning the entirety of the student body against Central and destroying the school's reputation. = For EVERY single plot turn, I kept asking myself, "How did I know this was going to happen?" EVERY single Shokugeki is determined by who is underestimating who, and every other plot turn is just plain typical of shounen anime. Like Erina staying at the dormitory for example. Called that. Ryou beating annoying minion #1? Called that too. Soma beating Kuga at his own game? Called that as well, but at least it was entertaining and a bit fascinating while it lasted. Again, the plot of a shounen is intended to have the main character struggle against the odds and then win. This isn't a mystery show. If you know what's going to happen next before it happens, great! It means you're paying attention and not a corpse with no brain. The show will logically progress to the outcome that produces the best overall outcome for producing a narrative where the main character overcomes some hardship. = If you COULD prove me wrong, that would be much appreciated, but this season is just too bad to be defended, guys. So that's my opinion on your opinion on the show. If you want to reply, I'd appreciate it if you actually responded to points made instead of just repeating the same thing over and over again and ignoring any criticism of your argument. I'll gladly revise what I've written here if I'm shown that I was incorrect or mistaken on something. |
Dec 13, 2017 6:57 PM
#62
Draconix814 said: MyEnglishIsGood said: Can't believe I just read this entire thread, this dude is salty af. When someone makes a valid point, he completely ignores it 'cause he's trapped inside his own ego. 😂😂😂 If you don't like the show, just don't watch it, bitching ain't gonna change anything. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Wow, I thought I made it painfully clear that I was salty, rather, I am beyond salty I AM OFFENDED. You claim that I don't like this show, and that's why I am bitching? You obviously skimmed over the five or six times I stated in this forum that I rated the first and second season a 9 out of 10; which isn't even true, because I actually rated both a 10 when I watched them! If it weren't for my rating system changing in the span of 2 years they would still be among my highest rated anime, so don't talk to me like I'm just some random hater. It's a similar feeling to having a close friend talk shit about you behind your back, because in both cases the friend and the show is insulting you. By the way, I may come off as sarcastic and narcissistic cunt, but at the very least, I AM FULLY WILLING TO EXPLAIN MY THOUGHT PROCESS, unlike a good percent of the people in this forum. If you could prove everything I said to be wrong, I would leave a satisfied fan of this series like I once was, yet two pages worth of forum later, and no one has left me a satisfying answer. Unlike most, I am very critical of my favorite anime and manga, they need to pass every test to be worthy of my praise and affection, if they do not, I won't hesitate to rip it to shreds. So, go on. Prove it to me, or get someone that can. People have given good responses explaining shit but you're too far up your own ass to acknowledge any of it, you're never going to find a satisfying answer 'cause you've already made up your mind about this season, nothing's going to change that. People have different opinions, just because someone disagrees with you and doesn't want to engage in some pointless debate, doesn't mean they're whiny babies, if anything you're the whiny baby acting like some pseudo-intellectual crying over a piece of fiction for not being exactly how you want it to be. And personally for me, I ain't feeling this season all that much, it's probably a 6 at best, but it still has its moments and I can enjoy it for what it is. So once again: if you don't like the show (anymore), just don't watch it, bitching ain't gonna change anything. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ |
#dicksoutforhughmungus |
Dec 14, 2017 7:19 AM
#63
Lel I read the manga and I'm lovin it. But for the anime... since the first season I find it really bad, as always with JC Staff adaptations. (Same this season with Kujira). For me all of them are a big disapointment... |
Dec 14, 2017 2:13 PM
#64
MyEnglishIsGood said: Draconix814 said: MyEnglishIsGood said: Can't believe I just read this entire thread, this dude is salty af. When someone makes a valid point, he completely ignores it 'cause he's trapped inside his own ego. 😂😂😂 If you don't like the show, just don't watch it, bitching ain't gonna change anything. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Wow, I thought I made it painfully clear that I was salty, rather, I am beyond salty I AM OFFENDED. You claim that I don't like this show, and that's why I am bitching? You obviously skimmed over the five or six times I stated in this forum that I rated the first and second season a 9 out of 10; which isn't even true, because I actually rated both a 10 when I watched them! If it weren't for my rating system changing in the span of 2 years they would still be among my highest rated anime, so don't talk to me like I'm just some random hater. It's a similar feeling to having a close friend talk shit about you behind your back, because in both cases the friend and the show is insulting you. By the way, I may come off as sarcastic and narcissistic cunt, but at the very least, I AM FULLY WILLING TO EXPLAIN MY THOUGHT PROCESS, unlike a good percent of the people in this forum. If you could prove everything I said to be wrong, I would leave a satisfied fan of this series like I once was, yet two pages worth of forum later, and no one has left me a satisfying answer. Unlike most, I am very critical of my favorite anime and manga, they need to pass every test to be worthy of my praise and affection, if they do not, I won't hesitate to rip it to shreds. So, go on. Prove it to me, or get someone that can. People have given good responses explaining shit but you're too far up your own ass to acknowledge any of it, you're never going to find a satisfying answer 'cause you've already made up your mind about this season, nothing's going to change that. People have different opinions, just because someone disagrees with you and doesn't want to engage in some pointless debate, doesn't mean they're whiny babies, if anything you're the whiny baby acting like some pseudo-intellectual crying over a piece of fiction for not being exactly how you want it to be. And personally for me, I ain't feeling this season all that much, it's probably a 6 at best, but it still has its moments and I can enjoy it for what it is. So once again: if you don't like the show (anymore), just don't watch it, bitching ain't gonna change anything. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Wait. So you said that there were already people that proved me wrong, then you said that you weren't "feeling" this season (kind of like how I'm not feeling it), then directly after that, you say you can enjoy it for what it is. Did it ever occur to you that I am just pointing out why exactly this season is off in the first place? So basically, what you are saying, is that as a fan of this series, I cannot criticize what this show does wrong? Because that is essentially what you said. In the meantime, it seems you don't realize what I meant about whiny babies, and I was referring to the ones who skimmed through or disregarded, everything on this forum, then complained about the fact that I was making it in the first place. I'll admit, however, that I did a grave mistake using the term saying, "all you whiny little babies", as that can and has been interpreted as "everybody". I should have known better, and all I can do is learn from that mistake, just like if a piece of fiction made a mistake, I have the right to criticize it. Might I also point out that no one proved me wrong on my two essays of a post, and if you think someone already did, retract your statement about you not "feeling" this season, then point to that person; that goes for anyone else reading this post. I happen to think its a fact that the animation is anywhere from subpar to horrible, and from a logical standpoint, the plot is riddled with holes that can only be filled in if the author recognizes them and bends over backward just to justify them. Maybe that's why this season isn't exactly resonating with you, and others in general, and I believe that deserves to be debated. |
Dec 14, 2017 6:29 PM
#65
I have to agree. The story took a nosedive compared to First Season. The First season had a very good blend. It was more funny to watch students trying to get pass grade in a hell's kitchen style mixed with one and other challenges and a championship at the end. The teachers were interesting characters and the student relationships were better developed. Megumi, Aldini and etc were fun to watch. The Second Season resumes the first championship, so it didn't felt out of place. The Third Season with the evil director is a very weak excuse to create a new challenge. I would prefer a new championchip and Soma getting school challenges from the teachers. Come on, Soma is still a first year student. I found the chinese cusine challenge in the first episodes interesting though. A plot including an evil director that will close all restaurants in Japan is just cringeworthy. I'm not too picky in animation quality. That's the least of the problems. |
AdrianRubinskyDec 14, 2017 6:44 PM
Dec 14, 2017 7:11 PM
#66
Draconix814 said: ikr, so if you watched the latest episode, souma gets asked to be the right hand man for eishi, THE FUCKING FIRST SEAT. like any main character, he says no. so what? JUST PRACTICE YOUR COOKING AT YOUR OWN TIME. its not like eishis always going to need you. your plan of being number "1" at the school got fucking dropped by that little thing. if you were his right hand man, youre basically 2nd after the 1st seat. i really dont understand why eishi said "well i see that you have your own style so im not going to get the help i thought i needed in the first place." yeah so? respect that shit and just bring it up. its also not likely souma would have a covert op to take central down. the whole monologue about his family diner closing shouldnt bother him also. YOUR DAD IS LITERALLY A "WORLD RENOWNED" CHEF. IF YOU REALLY CARED FOR THE DINER YOU WOULD KNOW THE DINER WOULDNT REALLY MATTER TO HIM, AS HE COULD HAVE A FUCKING MENU UPGRADE. anyways, if central was really a problem to 90% of the students at his school, they could just drop out. thats it. problem solved. DISCLAIMER: Anything positive I seem to say is actually sarcasm. You've been warned. AND WHAT THE FUCK IS WITH THIS "CENTRAL" BULLSHIT?!?!!? What is it supposed to be the CIA???? This is retarded even without considering the fact that it would be impossible to implement this new system in the time Azami did AND shut down every single club and DORMITORY by fucking force. To add insult to injury, these orders can be disregarded if the students win a Shokugeki, which doesn't make sense. If these were orders from the school, then no matter how much the students bitch about it, they shouldn't be able to rebel. Why didn't Azami just ban all Shokugekis??? MAYBE BECAUSE THERE WOULDN'T BE A SHOW TO WATCH!!! This is bad. Really fucking bad. |
Dec 14, 2017 8:27 PM
#67
@ElCommunisto I actually have to applaud you both for writing an even larger response that I have in my entire life and for actually making sense a good portion of it. I don't think you are right about everything, as I do stand by a good chunk of the arguments I made in the beginning, but I can certainly see you put a lot of thought and effort into this response, and I greatly appreciate it. Furthermore, unlike most people, I can clearly see where your thought process is coming from, not from what I infer based on what you said, but because you actually understand your thought process and explained it to me, which is also something I greatly appreciate. Well, now I shall address your criticisms; if I skip something, you may assume I generally agree with you, or you can assume that I don't think it would be necessary to cover, or both. Only thing to respond to here is your comment about the humor in the show. It's been stated several times and it should be pretty obvious that opinions on humor can be pretty subjective, so if the humor ruins the experience for you, that is more indicative of whether you like the humor or not rather than the quality of the show itself. What I will say is that the way the show is set up and has progressed for two seasons already makes humor par for the course, so I don't find anything particularly wrong with this seasons use of comedy (disregarding any personal opinion on the comedy itself) Admittedly, I think I could have worded it a bit better when I said "absurd humor", for what I was actually referring to its absurd comedy, which got even more absurd with this season and its reliance on absurdity in general. I think the worst instance of this for me was when those students tried to raid the dormitory, and then, everybody thought up of absurd ways to defend it. You talk more about what I said about the comedy aspect later on, so I'll save the rest of this for later. I will agree that Azami's introduction raises the stakes for sure, and I feel that its particularly jarring because the stakes have been risen slowly and steadily (exactly what a tournament arc produces during its run). Up to this point, expulsion was really only on the table during particular Shokugeki (and of course whenever Yukihira wagers it in exchange for something else). Also, with the exception of Shinomiya, the conflicts have really only been confined to student-vs-student, so having someone who isn't restricted in the same ways as students take sudden and massive control of Totsuki is a pretty intense and sudden ramp-up in pressure and intensity. When Azami is in control of the academy, it feels like being behind enemy lines, where any mistake or loss means losing everything, and conflict can come at any time since Azami sits outside of the normal restrictions of Shokugeki for students (for students, stepping out of line means having to answer to the administration, but Azami is the administration, so he only has to answer to himself). I don't think that really makes his introduction and presence bad or unbelievable, however. As I said, it's quite interesting for a character to appear that is in such direct opposition to Yukihira's ideals and to also exist in a position where his previous methods of solving conflicts (directly confronting his opponents and challenging them to a Shokugeki to solve the problem) doesn't really work. Instead, he gets put on the defensive and has to fight a psuedo-proxy war against Azami's agents. As for Azami's character itself, in the context of the show itself, I think he's believable enough to be able to suspend your disbelief. Characters in SnS are exaggerated and publicly exhibit their ideals and personalities much more strongly than most people would in real life (imagine meeting someone like Kurokiba Ryo in real life). Ignoring what your personal opinion of Azami's beliefs are, his ideals are something grounded in some reality. Wanting to reserve "true cuisine" for only those he believes are refined enough to truly appreciate it is certainly an extreme ideal that you'd be hard pressed to find in real life, but certainly not something completely unreasonable for a show about food and the various intricasies of cooking and cuisine itself. His introduction in the restaurant with Erina is actually pretty believable for how his ideology is portrayed. He views the people eating there as nothing (even straight up calls them animals), so his over-the-top villainy is just him expressing his views and beliefs so openly it feels unreal, like something no one would ever do in real life, but once you take into account the fact that he disregards the people around him as worthless, the room might as well just be empty to him while he's expounding his ideals. I'll save Erina for a bit later (you talk about her in more detail later on), but I will mention here that I personally dislike Erina's character (not because I think it's bad for any particularly glaring reason, just a personal dislike). Something to keep in mind for later. As for Yukihira being not believable and just a Deus ex Machina (plot device), I think this is just a result of the pacing and the fact that this is a shounen. Yukihira is the character we are meant to root for and support, and when the character everyone is invested in loses, its a morale blow for the audience if its not done right. Yukihira wins most of the time (if he didn't lose in the Autumn Election finals, I would probably actually agree with you), but he is not infallible. In fact, the show presents his glaring weaknesses in the aftermath of the Autumn Elections (the fact that he lacks a particular style or flair with his cooking that is truly his). What I will say is that in a shounen, the journey of following the main character and having them struggle and then succeed is a large part of the appeal. When characters meaninglessly lose, it just kills the momentum and drags the show to square one again. You brought up Kuroko no Basket later on, but another show I think is relevant to this discussion is Haikyuu. I did like Haikyuu overall, but the section in the middle of the show where the cast goes to the training camp with some other teams from far away was a grueling experience to watch. Karasuno consistently loses and gets destroyed and loses over and over again with very minor improvements in their play until they finally reach a point where they put everything they've learned into action and... lose. With shounen, watching the main characters struggle and win is thrilling because it is a departure from the somewhat jaded and pessimistic perception we have of life (whereby struggle is just a means to more struggle or just loss). Watching Karasuno lose over and over again with no perceived gain or end in sight is hard to be invested in, as the show has no momentum. In SnS, the problem stems from the fact that the show has a very fast pacing (ignoring the Autumn Elections), where every episode it finds a new set of characters to battle it out in a Shokugeki (and in a few cases that is the first time we are ever seeing those characters). This means that the show can't really afford much time to have Yukihira lose and struggle to work his way up (they do fit in several non-Shokugeki moments where he does "fail", usually by failing to impress Erina or something). The show wouldn't be nearly as interesting if Yukihira constantly went up against people stronger than him and just lost for the sake of realism. Fairly soon, no one would care about rooting for Yukihira because no one would have any confidence or momentum built up behind him. So will Yukihira win the vast majority of the time? Yes. Is he just a bullshit Deus ex Machina plot device? Partially. He is the shounen protagonist who's role it is to produce the desired effect of being entertained by a story where the "underdog" struggles against the odds and pulls out an unlikely victory. The problem is that there are so many battles in SnS that the victories stack up and make Yukihira feel like less and less of an underdog. First of all, I never mentioned Kuroko no Basket... I think you meant to say Boku no Hero Academia lol. I also think I need to bring up your criticism against Haikyuu, for which I don't really understand why "failure" is something shounen, in particular, should shy away from. Haikyuu is about learning from failures and overcoming obstacles, and they do win in the end. Have you watched Season 3? I am not quite sure how valid of a criticism that is, but I understand what you mean about shounen being an "escape from pessimistic society"... however, like I said to Alwerien, just because it is a shounen, doesn't excuse it from ignoring reality. Narratives are compelling, not because they provide an escape, but because they feel like they can happen in real life. Haikyuu is actually one of the best shounen in the last few years that is like this. It knows just how much a character can succeed and inevitably fail to convince us that these could be real human beings, even if their personalities are exaggerated, and it is particularly great in weaving in those narratives into the heart of the game. It can create a world that is much like our own, yet it feels spectacular in comparison, and if you really want to, you can pursue it in real life and have those same rush of emotions. I can attest to that because I've played sports for a good chunk of my life. Shokugeki doesn't do this, but I'll get into it later because there is a specific instance where you bring it up again. I would actually argue that Haikyuu has tremendous momentum, and Shokugeki doesn't However, I think your biggest mistake here is that you believe everything can be blamed on the pacing and the fact that it is a shounen, and I think how you best demonstrate this mistake is when you state that Haikyuu isn't easy to get invested in because they lose for "no reason". You use the same argument to partially justify Soma's shounen plot armor, and it just doesn't work, because Haikyuu IS an underdog story, it's in the premise of the story, yet Shokugeki no Soma IS NOT. The appeal of Haikyuu is to see the trials and tribulations of someone with seemingly no talent and work their ways up to the top of their sport and THAT is what works about Haikyuu. The appeal of Shokugeki seems to be a mix of Soma sticking it to the higher-ups that sneer at him, and food-porn, and porn-food. If anything, Soma is an overdog story, rather than an underdog, because most of the appeal of seeing him "stick it to the man", was how all of it seemed to make logical sense and it made us think about how Soma was going to defeat the next opponent. STRATEGIZING WAS WHAT KEPT SHOKUGEKI'S MOMENTUM STRONG, without having to pace everything at 100 miles per hour. Where's all the strategy now? It's too rushed to make sense, and it isn't weaved into the narrative at all, so why should I care about the dishes? You respond to this in more detail later, so I guess I have no choice but to do save it as well. I am going to speed things up because this is a lot to sift through. What ruined Azami for me, wasn't necessarily his introduction, personality nor his beliefs, rather how quickly he overthrew Grandpa-Director-sama and how quickly that became his only important character trait. And no, it really isn't that fascinating that a villain has different ideals than the main character, nearly every shounen action series has one. Seeing it like that, I have to agree with what other people here have said. With the pace of the show and the nature of the genre, if you watch this show expecting to see a masterpiece of storytelling with each individual episode, you're probably going to be disappointed. If you watch each week as specifically an entertainment investment, you'll probably follow the flow of the show better and get more enjoyment out of it. I don't remember saying I was expecting a masterpiece, I remember expecting it to be competent. The way I judge my enjoyment of a series is by evaluating how competent a series actually is. You're basically saying, "If you expect everything you watch to be good, then obviously you're not going to like it when its bad. You should just shut your brain off and HAVE FUN!". I've been on that side of the argument before, and even I realize how inconsiderate it is. I talked about this earlier, but I'll expand a bit on what I think you're getting at here. An example I'm going to use here (that will probably be somewhat unpopular, but w/e) is Kyoukai no Kanata. Admittedly I dislike this show, and the reason why is because it is a show that presents the premise of having a lot at stake within the story and characters, with most of the interactions being set up in a serious and dramatic environment with serious background to the conflicts and events. Yet, this flow is inconsistently diverted and cut up whenever the comedy of the show comes through. The problem is that the show goes from 600ft deep in the drama of the situation, then cuts to some stale character jokes that don't really add anything to the situation, and then the next second, we're thrown back into the drama, where we'd rather have just stayed in the first place. In some ways, SnS does have this same problem (if you're really that invested in the action and intensity of the Shokugeki), but the show has set itself up in a way where that type of interruptive comedy is expected from the characters as presented. Yukihira is usually in a state of confidence and has little regard for normal social standards (and is oblivious in some respects), so him saying something out of place is to be expected. Besides this, the show very clearly has its intense and serious moments that they don't joke around with (i.e. Yukihira challenging Shinomiya to a Shokugeki to rescind Megumi's expulsion). That means that you can sort of get a feel for how the show will flow and utilize its comedic and serious elements. When the show cuts to Yukihira with a sharp glare and without his usual carefree expression, you can get invested in the moment because you feel that the show will not cut off the flow with a random act of "comedy". But during the rest of the show, you can freely mix the comedy and action together without being too jarring. Again, I can't really speak for the music, as I don't really pay too much attention to it to be honest (I usually just listen to the OSTs outside of the show itself). As for the 3-gatsu no Lion comparison, I can't weigh in completely (I haven't seen it personally), I do want to point out that essentially what it looks like you said is "I can understand why some people don't like the transition from light-hearted comedy to depression, but I can't understand why some people like the transition from light-hearted comedy to action/suspense/literally anything else". You essentially say that in the case of 3-gatsu no Lion, people can have whatever opinion they like on comedy in a not-strictly just comedy show, but that in the case of SnS, that same logic just doesn't apply (for some reason). Many people have said this, but the comedy works better in the manga, and it works terribly when brought over to animation. In the manga, the author can dedicate a small panel to something comedic and not distract from the atmosphere too long, and the quality of the art can do the rest of the build-up with its aesthetic. In anime, the animators can't gloss over those small panel jokes, if they try to adapt it at all, so it would have been much more beneficial for this show to cut them out completely. I certainly don't get instantly invested whenever I get a zoom in on someone's eye, and just because they do doesn't mean they won't ruin it a second later, in fact, it has multiple times; you even said it yourself, that the pacing goes "very very fast". Interruptive comedy just feels suffocating when everything else is going 100 miles per hour. An important part of every story (it can be anything from an anime to a book, or a play written by William Shakespeare), is to give the audience a chance to breathe and process the situation before getting back into the action. In the manga, I assume the interruptive comedy would have been just that small break the audience needed before they continue; in animation, especially when the pacing is already cranked up faster than I am sure the author intended, the interruptive comedy only interrupts the flow and it doesn't work. It's painfully obvious that J.C. Staff is doing this on purpose too, because they don't want to animate more than what they have to, as evidenced by the staggering lack of creativity in the animation department, opting to just use panels from the manga and do nothing with them except pan across the screen and animate their mouths. The only other time they'll animate anything else, is when the manga itself shows movement in the panels, and the anime simply did the bare minimum in that department, opting for simple movements typical of a manga's restrictions. I'm not an animator or an artist by any remote definition of the words, so I'm definitely not qualified to say whether the animation itself is objectively "good" or not (whatever that would even define), but I personally have not found any major problems with the way the animation has been this season. SnS is a non-combat shounen, so the usual points of noticeable low-quality animation during any fight scenes don't exist, so it's possible I just haven't seen any glaring issues. I should also mention that I am a fan of the character designs in SnS, so that's mostly what I'm looking at/paying attention to. You don't need to be an animator to have eyes. I mean, unless you are familiar with and use the cooking methods, ingredients, and cooking terms that they talk about in the show, then you're probably going to be lost on that front. It is kind of a bummer that for a large majority of the show, the meaning I can get from the Shokugeki lies in trusting what I've been told by the characters, but that's not really a fault of the show. Realistically, the show could just not explain anything and just leave the intricasies of the food to the niche audience that has a great understanding of that kind of thing, but I personally appreciate it being more accessible by trying to explain a lot of concepts quickly. Either it wastes a lot of time giving you a true full understanding of complicated cooking concepts, or it shoots enough by you for you to get the jist and still enjoy the show. If it tries to explain how cooking works and it fails, then obviously I am going to get lost. If it tries to make an exposition interesting, then it should have weaved it into the narrative, so I can get invested. Alas, Food Wars did neither, they just shoehorned it into the fast-paced "action", next to the interruptive comedy, and expected it to be awesome. A half-baked meal indeed. Shokugeki and Haikyuu are both essentially sports anime. How come anybody who watched Haikyuu can explain Tsukishima's position in detail, even if they never played the sport in their life (and they don't go back and listen to an exposition again to confirm), while in Shokugeki little to no one can tell you how Soma beat Eizan by stating the intricacies of his cooking strategy, and what exactly he cooked? See the problem now? Okay, a couple of points here. Remember that I personally share your dislike of Erina, but I wouldn't say that I'm super disappointed in her characterization in this season. With what little we know of her past with Azami, having some residual trauma as a result of the treatment she recieved from Azami isn't totally ridiculous. Another thing you have to remember is that Erina has been shown to rely on no one but those she trusts (like Hisako). So when faced with someone she believes she cannot stop (Azami), it kinda makes sense for her to shut down and fail to think logically about what she should do (like teaming up with Yukihira and Alice to stand up to him). Her past has convinced her that the thought "Stand up to Azami" is not a valid option worth pursuing. I still would like to see more of her development this season to make any final judgements on whether I think it was handled well though. Also, her "ability" is not something that can be instrisically be called anything because it derives its value from outside sources. Her "God Tongue" is a valuable ability because it has importance placed on it by Totsuki and the culinary world. The "God Tongue" is powerful because people put their trust in it (if it pleases Erina's palate, it is good food). Erina's palate could be just kinda decent but the importance placed on it by the culinary world is what makes it powerful (seeing as how everyone's taste differs so one person's opinion on what's "good" or not couldn't ever really have truly universal application). I actually agree with what you said in the first paragraph. I honestly think you are the strongest with how you present your character arguments, just like I was, until I took a step back and realized that characters are supposed to define the plot, not the plot defining the characters. Shokugeki isn't the former anymore, unfortunately. The only response I have to your second paragraph is: How does someone identify a "god tongue", exactly? She just looked like a spoiled brat when she was younger, who didn't like other people's food, because she didn't like them. Not because she was a natural born critic and could precisely identify just what was wrong with any specific meal in comparison to every other meal or anything (not that that's remotely possible), but exactly because everybody put their faith into something so incomprehensibly broken. She would NEVER be who she is today, because she would NEVER be respected for disliking a few meals, even if she is a part of a family famous for their cooking. This doesn't make sense. What also doesn't make sense is that she's the main female character; there have been many people that tried to deny what I said about Erina's relationship with Soma, but to put it bluntly, it would have never worked out unless they added in a deep character flaw that bumped her down a peg so she can stand on Soma's level... and now she is about as useful as Megumi was in the first season. The ironic part is, that it isn't even true, all they had to do to make Soma's and Erina's relationship work, was to introduce Soma's father to Erina and it would put Soma in a new light to her. Then she could have gotten all the necessary development without all the Azami bullshit, and it wouldn't ruin the integrity of either character, as characters. And THAT isn't even completely true because she's had feelings for him since the first episode; maybe feelings of hatred, but you know the saying "there's a thin line between love and hate", right? Well, try to convince someone that murder is okay by educating them slowly on the refinement of perfect killings. If someone doesn't believe in your ideals and has their own set of morals, its really hard to just "convince" them that they should think the way you do. It's fairly likely that Azami wanted to imprint his ideals and beliefs onto Erina while she was still fairly young and impressionable. Especially being her father, it would be very difficult for her to oppose the primary authority figure in her life. And I felt that it was clearly implied that her way of thinking wasn't changed by the single solitary event that we were shown. Like most "brainwashing", she was probably conditioned and influenced with Azami's way of thinking over a long period of time with many events like the one we saw culminating in her current state. Also, is it really that strange that she hasn't said anything about her father for the whole anime? What about Nikumi's father? Isshiki? Why hasn't everyone just walked up to Yukihira and mentioned their father that they hate for brainwashing them to submit to their ideology of fine cuisine? Case in point: She hadn't mentioned him because he wasn't relevant or something she wanted to think about. Actually... you can teach a child about the refinement of murder if they are young and impressionable enough... and the cut-off age is 25. It wouldn't be that hard either, it just needs to be subtle, as forcing a child to do something never particularly bodes well for them. Besides, he had her toddler years to educate her on how to mutilate one's corpse, why did he need to shove it down her throat when she was 5 AND FORCE HER TO THROW OUT A PLATE?!?!!? Despicable indeed. The worst villain since Joke Shou Tucker. I actually agree with what you said about her not willingly want to mention him, but I find it hard to believe it wouldn't have affected her in some noticeable way throughout the anime, especially considering how much of an "impact" he's had on her. If you watched the scene where Yukihira talked with Sonzaemon after he got removed as the Totsuki director, you might have noticed that he seemed pretty... normal. Happy and relieved, even. I thought this was very strange until he revealed that he was tired out by holding the position as well as revealing his ulterior motive. As someone said earlier in this thread, he wouldn't have let Azami or the Elite Ten get away with what they did unless he wanted them to. He didn't even really fight it because he didn't want to. Totsuki under Sonzaemon operated under the philosophy that through conflict and struggle between themselves, those who survived would become strong enough to reach the top and be successful anywhere in the culinary world. With this in mind, it's clear that (regardless of whether you think it was the right move or not) Sonzaemon sees this as an opportunity for Erina, Yukihira, and anyone else who's willing to fight and struggle against a new and stronger obstacle in order to grow (Erina breaking free from her messed up mental state and Yukihira standing up and protecting his ideology of cuisine). I am thankful you cleared that up for me with the Director, as I didn't quite know what Alwerien(?) meant when she said it. But that doesn't excuse the credibility of the council overthrowing him, nor does it adhere to the integrity of his character. If the director wanted to retire, he would have retired by the end of the school year, so he can see all of his students graduate at least, and if he didn't care about Azami taking over, then why did he outright ban him from campus and get outraged when the coup de tat occurred? I also doubt that Grandpa would particularly view this as an essential obstacle to his granddaughter, rather, he'd more likely view it as a threat than anything else. Remember he is old, he hates Azami, and they are all rich and spoiled (at least Erina is, she's literally a himedere). Okay, since (ironically) you didn't pay enough attention, I'll point out the reasoning behind Tsukasa's and Rindo's support of Azami. At the end of Episode 5, when Azami presents the message that the Elite Ten Council has removed Sonzaemon and appointed him as Director of Totsuki, Rindo says, "There's a new wave. Riding that wave feels like the most exciting possibility". Her goal is to seek out the most interesting possibilities in life. So when it seems like her actions contradict themselves, remember that her character is based on doing what will result in the most interesting path. When she's surprised by Yukihira standing up to Eizan, she cheers him on because she thinks the most interesting possibility is Yukihira defeating Eizan in a supposedly impossibly rigged challenge. She's reluctant to do the dirty work of Central because a)beating people in a Shokugeki that they are practically guaranteed to win isn't very interesting and b)its hard to find the most interesting option when someone else is telling you exactly what to do. She doesn't want to be tied down by Azami and Central's orders, but finds the resulting conflicts (namely Yukihira's challenge of Eizan) as an interested option that wouldn't have happened otherwise. I kinda figured that but is it not painfully obvious that its just lazy characterization based on an existing character trope. You know who else did stuff that was interesting with no thought to morality, loyalty or common sense? Basically, every shounen villain character hiding in plain sight, and Makoto from School Days... only he was interested in an entirely different thing... As for Tsukasa, it's apparent now after Episode 11, but that wasn't released when you wrote this comment, but I'll add it here for completeness sake. Tsukasa was shown to have complete confidence in the quality and supremacy of his cooking in Episode 5 when he didn't even bother asking if his guests liked the food, since he was 100% sure they would. In addition, it was shown that he has no confidence in pretty much anything or anyone besides his own cooking, as well as the fact that his cooking style involves removing himself as much as possible from the creation of his dishes, instead making the quality of the ingredients replace the passion of the chef. All of this combined means one thing: he would most definitely agree with Azami that there is a single proper way to cook gourmet cuisine (Tsukasa's way; he has no confidence in anyone else's way of doing things) and he would also probably agree that there are only certain people who can truly appreciate that level of cuisine. For Momo, you're problem with her character is that she's cute and she's shy and dismissive around strangers. That's it? That seems like a you-problem rather than a problem with her character. If two traits of a character that haven't even been explained yet (and one of which isn't something she can really change willingly) is all it takes for you to just call her character bad and dislike it, then I don't know what to tell you. You're problem with Eizan is that he's an asshole. Well, a lot of people are assholes. You don't have to like them. Doesn't make him a bad character. Just means you don't like him. Isshiki did what he did because he had no other choice. If he tried to interfere with Central's operations more directly, they would have responded more directly to remove him from his seat. Instead, he trusted Yukihira to pull something off while he prepared to create a way for people to fight back against Central. If he hadn't done that and something different happened with Yukihira's Shokugeki, everyone else could have been completely screwed with no way of opposing Central at all. The other members haven't had enough screentime to really say anything meaningfull about, but hopefully that will change at some point. I'll verify your comment on Tsukasa when I watch the next episode, even so, I still doubt I'd be convinced. I love moe characters! I hate Moe clones that are trying to bash over our heads how cute they are AND OMG SHE MAKES CONFECTIONARIES!!! If she ever gets any backstory on how she hates strangers, I bet it had something to do with being forced to throw out a piece of cake or something by a random individual. I'm being sarcastic of course, but it really feels like the show is just relying on the fact she's cute to sell her character, just like Shokugeki has been doing with literally every other character this season... Sakata Gintoki is an asshole. Orihara Izaya is an asshole. Eizan is just an asshole for the sake of being an asshole, so Soma can beat him. Sakata Gintoki is my favorite character of all time, and he's voiced by the same seiyuu as Eizen, published in the same magazine as Eizen, but I can see why this comparison would get a little broken because Gintoki is the main character in a 300+ episode anime. Orihara Izaya is a better asshole then Eizen; his motivations to be an asshole and to fuck around with all the characters in Durarara, is because he loves the human species and wants to observe how they react to stimulus, and his "fatal" flaw is that he is also a human, so trying to observe humanity by separating himself from his own humanity was never going to work out in the long run. It's been 3 months since I last watched Durarara. Eizan is just full of himself and is only there to stir up drama and so Soma can beat him in a big asspull. Do you have any evidence to the contrary? Fair point, but it really does seem Isshiki was forced into that via plot convenience. Why should Azami have the power to throw out people of the elite ten? They earned their spots, didn't they? This just goes to show how broken and contradictory the system is, but I'll get to that in a moment or two. With the Elite Ten Council on his side, Azami can really do whatever he wants (with one minor exception I'll talk about next). Those who want to rise through the ranks of Totsuki and be successful in the culinary world (ideals and passionate cooking be damned) and those who actually agree with Azami (for their own personal reasons) would most definitely exist in a not-insignificant number and would most definitely be willing to follow Central's orders to get ahead. What's so hard about filing paperwork and then giving the clubs the notice in person? The first paragraph: Has hardly anything to do with what I said. This has more to do with your next argument, than anything else. What's so wrong with big guys in black suits waiving a paper thingy to force students out of their clubrooms and dormitories BY FORCE? Harassment, mistreatment of students on campus, harm to personal belongings and vandalization of property that isn't even theirs, and they aren't getting fucking arrested? The media isn't making a shit storm about how students aren't being treated correctly, and how they need to fight for their rights? Oh, I forgot this is Japan, not America, my bad. Still against the law though, even over there. As many people in this thread have said, its because this is Totsuki. Just like how in Danganronpa Kibougamine Academy "all but guarantees success in life", graduating from Totsuki all but guarantees success in the culinary world. If you've ever thought that something you had to do in school was kinda stupid and bureaucratic, you probably still did it. Why? Because if you did it and graduated, the benefit would make up for that bit of annoyance. Same concept here. For most people at Totsuki, why make a big deal out of rebelling or leaving to a lower ranked school when you can just sit back, deal with some stupid policy changes and glide all the way to graduation. Also, for most people, they have dedicated a lot of time to progressing in Totsuki, and leaving would not only put a blemish on the school record (in that they left and did not complete the course at Totsuki), but would also need to deal with transferring their progress to another school (which could have radically different requirements). If you're going to regurgitate information other people said, then I will also regurgitate the information I fed to Curian: 1: If the school is hindering your education, then it isn't the top school around. 2: What do you mean they don't have a choice? They can quit if they want to, or they can just get expelled on purpose of no one will allow them. Its easy enough apparently for aspiring cooks to be expelled before they can gain experience cooking. 3: If they were already great cooks, then it doesn't matter if they go to the #1 prestigious school or some shit, to be great cooks. If cooking is their passion, in today's society (even over in Japan), they could pursue it quite easily. ... Azami stated when he took over that there was "injustice" in how the school system, and generally, I am inclined to agree with his sentiment at least on a minuscule level. What he refers to as the "injustice" of Totsuki was that there was "too much competition" and they can get "expelled too easily". I generally agree that both these are bad things, but you know what is even worse? No competition and getting expelled even easier. The whole point of Totsuki, which was made apparent from Episode 1, was that Totsuki is a highly competitive environment and only the ones that can withstand and overcome these obstacles have the privilege of graduating from the school and gaining access to their connections. To be honest, this would make more sense if this was a college, instead of a middle school/high school, but hey this is anime right? They aren't perfectly aligned with your points, but you get the point. By the way, wouldn't it be a more epic plot twist if Soma and his rag-tag group of friends decided to leave the school despite everyone insisting they should stay just because it is easier than doing it the hard way? No, so that they can set themselves up for guaranteed success in the culinary world through an endorsement by graduating from the school that everyone in the culinary world has complete confidence in their ability to produce the best chefs. THEY'RE NOT EVEN IN FUCKING HIGH SCHOOL YET!!!! AND ONLY A MEASLY 10% GRADUATE ANYWAYS!!! I understand your point, but it doesn't change the fact that it makes no sense in terms of narrative!!!! I would argue that the difference between knowing how to cook with spices and knowing how to masterfully apply them to a specific dish in a specific scenario are two very different things. If you were suddenly asked to cook your best meat dish, would you decide to cook Filet Mignon if you knew what it was and vaguely how to cook it? Especially if your cooking was then going to be judged by respected food critics and people who could help influence your future career options, or if you didn't impress them you'd get expelled? I think most people would cook the best possible dish that they have complete confidence in making. All this means is that previously in the Autumn Elections, Kurokiba hadn't yet mastered the ability to apply the intricasies of spices to his dishes in a way that he would feel absolute confidence in serving. Remember that everything they serve in a Shokugeki will reflect back on them and their potential future. Just serving up something with some spices thrown in because you read it in a book is probably not the best way to make a winning dish. Also, you've pointed this out several times already, but the characters in SnS are still teenagers in school. I don't know about you, but I doubt that you could learn, experiment, and master all of the techniques you'd need to make a perfect dish for any occasion like they are expected to in this show all before they even turn 20. Learning how to cook with spices isn't like learning a new jutsu technique. All Ryou had to do was go up to Hayama and ask for his advice, in fact, that would have been a bigger character moment WITH SUBSTANTIAL GROWTH AND DEVELOPMENT. He learned how to cook a new dish, and they tried to pass it off as development... What is even your point in that last paragraph? You're literally regurgitating my points, and they aren't jutsu techniques. Just because they are teenagers, doesn't excuse them from having any meaningful character growth, in actuality, it should make them more prone to them as they are still developing. Yes, Yukihira will always win. Except when he doesn't. Brilliant deduction. I'll point back to what I said earlier about why Azami didn't just ban Shokugeki altogether to answer this part. Yukihira was essentially relying on the fact that Eizan and the judges would be so overconfident that they would just try his dish even though the entire Shokugeki was rigged. If they did, they would for sure realize that Yukihira's dish was better. Now this would lead to a scenario where the judges would know that Yukihira's dish was better but still ruled in favor of Eizan. This would completely break the reality where the Shokugeki is technically allowed but impossible to win, because everyone would know for sure that the judges were bought off, which would mean that the Shokugeki (which Totsuki's reputation and importance stem from) would be useless and meaningless, and Totsuki's influence would fall, as would Azami's. So Yukihira had to put them in a situation where they either had to lie and destroy Totsuki and Central, or give Yukihira the win and tell the truth. If they just lied anyway, I bet that Yukihira was planning to have the rest of the students (or a small section of them) to taste both dishes and reach that same conclusion, turning the entirety of the student body against Central and destroying the school's reputation. I did say that there were rare instances that he loses, right? Are you for real right now? This is the reason its so fucking predictable, I KNEW Soma was going to play to their overconfidence, and he would magically beat them, but the fact of the matter is, THEY WERE PAID OFF! They weren't EVER GOING TO FUCKING JUDGE FAIRLY!!! Even IF they enjoyed Soma's dish more than someone from the elite ten, the ELITE TEN STILL PAID THEM TO VOTE FOR HIM!!! A DEAL IS A DEAL, WHY DON'T YOU UNDERSTAND THAT? At the end of the day, Eizan is the one giving the judges their money, and it only benefits them if they vote in favor of that asshole, even if they liked Soma's more! What was the point of having the contest rigged, in the first place? There was none, it's just lazy writing. Last paragraph: Is there any evidence of that claim? Don't make excuses. Well, I hope you're happy I wasted 5 hours of my life on this when I could have used this time to do something more productive. Did I ignore your criticism, or was this acceptable as a highly sophisticated debate? Either way, I am tired now, so if you want to reply, please condense it. |
Draconix814Dec 14, 2017 8:30 PM
Dec 14, 2017 10:00 PM
#68
Oh god, not this shit again. Quite frankly, I can't agree with anything you say, As a manga reader, I find it quite over exaggerated. One, similar rants and criticisms have been evident ever since the Central Arc started in the manga. And you, the one who made the thread, is just an over exaggeration of those rants/crticisms. Anime only watchers essentially have a decision to follow where this arc is going or not. Dislike where its going? that's fine, but you'll probably be disappointed even more if you keep following since the final showdown of this arc is underway and at its climax in the manga. Two, JC staff is handling 4 shows for the remainder of the year, including Shokugeki. 3 out of 4 shows are nearly finished, with Shokugeki being in the middle (since its unsure whether it is a split cour or just one cour) And the animators are making a fastbreak in between shows, leading to a good number of them burning out, resulting in a rather unfinished, slow style of animation for some parts of each of those 4. Three, I'll tag this as spoilers; Azami's attitude and why he's doing this, the root of it all, being his fascination with Soma's father, Saiba. Specifically, Saiba's 'Asura' persona. He says 'reform', when in actuality, he wants revenge for what the gourmet world did to his beloved Saiba senpai. Yes, I said Senpai. The father daughter duo, specifically Azami and Erina, look up to Soma's father like their 'ideal chef' or whatever else the fans think of calling it. In Erina's case, its admiration for Saiba, but for Azami....its evolved into a sinister sense of admiration, if that's the right word for it. Hence, why he's trying to 'reform' the culinary world of Japan. Since you didn't read the manga, its understandable to have a 'wtf is this' kind of answer to the current arc. Your reply to ElCommunisto about Erina is wrong, or rather, off. to quote what you said from the start of this thread; "The whole point of Soma's and Erina's relationship was that Soma was supposed to reach Erina with his cooking, BUT HE ALREADY HAS since the first episode" His goal from the very start is to make Erina say "It's delicious" and that still hasn't changed since the first few chapters/1st episode. But thanks to Azami's brainwashing/training, she's been in between Saiba and her own father's ideology on how the cooking world is supposed to be, making it harder for him to reach that goal, luckily a certain chapter in the manga gave the answer for which path/ideology she should follow, making her stand up to her father in the process. To quote your recent gripe: "What also doesn't make sense is that she's the main female character; there have been many people that tried to deny what I said about Erina's relationship with Soma, but to put it bluntly, it would have never worked out unless they added in a deep character flaw that bumped her down a peg so she can stand on Soma's level... and now she is about as useful as Megumi was in the first season. The ironic part is, that it isn't even true, all they had to do to make Soma's and Erina's relationship work, was to introduce Soma's father to Erina and it would put Soma in a new light to her. Then she could have gotten all the necessary development without all the Azami bullshit, and it wouldn't ruin the integrity of either character, as characters." Erina's photo of Saiba when she was little that was showcased in the first season as well as the first 10 or 20 so chapters in the manga, that photo's backstory had been explained a few months before,however, Saiba didn't mention anything of his son, Soma to her during that meeting. Ironically, the meeting between the two happened before Azami 'trained' Erina. With the upcoming reveal that JC staff cutout, which they either moved that reveal scene later on or to the upcoming episode 12, is going to be the defining point where Erina starts to regard Soma highly. As of now , for the past 30 or 40 chapters in the manga, the relationship between Soma and Erina has turned for the better. It working wonders, so to speak. So say goodbye to the notions of Megumi being the main heroine due to how much character development Erina's getting, and unless Tsukuda Yuuto, the author, makes a total 180 in later chapters. I'm just giving my opinion on the events behind the current arc of Shokugeki, which I find quite interesting. You can take it however you want, but this arc in itself, it has its ups and downs, and a lot don't like where it's going, and its you're choice whether you want to follow the current arc or not, but there are also a lot of people who continue to enjoy watching it, especially the audience here in Japan, which have mixed opinions on the arc itself as well as JC staff's 3rd installment of the series. The choice is yours if you want to continue with the current story arc or not. Criticism is welcome, but I'd suggest keep any oversimplifying thoughts to yourself since this is just fiction that has both unrealistic and realistic parts. |
IzayoiArashiDec 15, 2017 2:41 AM
Dec 16, 2017 3:09 PM
#70
They had to split the two cours to accommodate their bad production schedule, guys, it's basically undeniable that J.C. Staff and the director behind it cannot animate it properly. |
Dec 16, 2017 3:26 PM
#71
Draconix814 said: MyEnglishIsGood said: Draconix814 said: MyEnglishIsGood said: Can't believe I just read this entire thread, this dude is salty af. When someone makes a valid point, he completely ignores it 'cause he's trapped inside his own ego. 😂😂😂 If you don't like the show, just don't watch it, bitching ain't gonna change anything. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Wow, I thought I made it painfully clear that I was salty, rather, I am beyond salty I AM OFFENDED. You claim that I don't like this show, and that's why I am bitching? You obviously skimmed over the five or six times I stated in this forum that I rated the first and second season a 9 out of 10; which isn't even true, because I actually rated both a 10 when I watched them! If it weren't for my rating system changing in the span of 2 years they would still be among my highest rated anime, so don't talk to me like I'm just some random hater. It's a similar feeling to having a close friend talk shit about you behind your back, because in both cases the friend and the show is insulting you. By the way, I may come off as sarcastic and narcissistic cunt, but at the very least, I AM FULLY WILLING TO EXPLAIN MY THOUGHT PROCESS, unlike a good percent of the people in this forum. If you could prove everything I said to be wrong, I would leave a satisfied fan of this series like I once was, yet two pages worth of forum later, and no one has left me a satisfying answer. Unlike most, I am very critical of my favorite anime and manga, they need to pass every test to be worthy of my praise and affection, if they do not, I won't hesitate to rip it to shreds. So, go on. Prove it to me, or get someone that can. People have given good responses explaining shit but you're too far up your own ass to acknowledge any of it, you're never going to find a satisfying answer 'cause you've already made up your mind about this season, nothing's going to change that. People have different opinions, just because someone disagrees with you and doesn't want to engage in some pointless debate, doesn't mean they're whiny babies, if anything you're the whiny baby acting like some pseudo-intellectual crying over a piece of fiction for not being exactly how you want it to be. And personally for me, I ain't feeling this season all that much, it's probably a 6 at best, but it still has its moments and I can enjoy it for what it is. So once again: if you don't like the show (anymore), just don't watch it, bitching ain't gonna change anything. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Wait. So you said that there were already people that proved me wrong, then you said that you weren't "feeling" this season (kind of like how I'm not feeling it), then directly after that, you say you can enjoy it for what it is. Did it ever occur to you that I am just pointing out why exactly this season is off in the first place? So basically, what you are saying, is that as a fan of this series, I cannot criticize what this show does wrong? Because that is essentially what you said. In the meantime, it seems you don't realize what I meant about whiny babies, and I was referring to the ones who skimmed through or disregarded, everything on this forum, then complained about the fact that I was making it in the first place. I'll admit, however, that I did a grave mistake using the term saying, "all you whiny little babies", as that can and has been interpreted as "everybody". I should have known better, and all I can do is learn from that mistake, just like if a piece of fiction made a mistake, I have the right to criticize it. Might I also point out that no one proved me wrong on my two essays of a post, and if you think someone already did, retract your statement about you not "feeling" this season, then point to that person; that goes for anyone else reading this post. I happen to think its a fact that the animation is anywhere from subpar to horrible, and from a logical standpoint, the plot is riddled with holes that can only be filled in if the author recognizes them and bends over backward just to justify them. Maybe that's why this season isn't exactly resonating with you, and others in general, and I believe that deserves to be debated. People have different opinions, how can you not understand that? Most of what you've said is subjective, some people are loving this season and they have every right to. Just because they have a different opinion, doesn't mean they're wrong, you've already made up your mind about this season, so it'll be hard for you to find anyone who can sway your thoughts on the matter. And yeah, I may not be feeling this season, but it's for different reasons than to you, I never cared much for this series to begin with, so it going from a slightly-above average series to a mediocre one doesn't change all that much for me, it's still enjoyable for its over-the-top shenanigans, even if there's some questionable moments. Sure you have the right to criticize, but that doesn't mean you have to be an ass about it, I'm not here to argue, I'm just letting you know that all you're doing is coming off as aggressive and ignorant. |
#dicksoutforhughmungus |
Dec 16, 2017 3:53 PM
#72
Draconix814 said: They had to split the two cours to accommodate their bad production schedule, guys, it's basically undeniable that J.C. Staff and the director behind it cannot animate it properly. Bitch, bitch, bitch. Cry, cry, cry. |
Dec 17, 2017 7:47 AM
#73
Basically what I’m reading is, you A. Dislike the show for escalating in its THIRD SEASON (what, you just wanted it to be competitions and semi-meaningful shokugeki’s forever?) B. You...don’t like the art because it’s so similar to the manga? I don’t even have a comment for this. (Edit: I understand what you were saying now, and I still can’t comment because I haven’t even noticed the transitions...how hard were you looking at this to find something to hate? Jeez.) C. Generally anime (ESPECIALLY THE GOOD ONES) have some sort of soundtrack, and I think season 3 of Food Wars has executed its soundtrack timing perfectly, when the dorm the main crew had been staying in for almost a year is about to be taken away, they inserted a piano version of one of the original intros(which was fing awesome btw) and when things are escalating and getting intense they play a variety of different soundtracks (not just one copy paste hype soundtrack for everyone). D. It sounds like you have not been aquanted with the legendary...”Pause button”: this magical device can be used to freeze time and let you take notes, take screenshots, or when paired with the mysterious rewind button: go back if you missed something. E. Now this is the only point that I personally believe holds some merit, the switch from serious to not so serious is definitely a big problem in all spectrums of anime. However, in Food Wars the seriousness of every situation is not undermined by these “chibi outbursts” but rather fortified by them. In real life people have a tendency to change moods drastically when a situation is simply too miserable or depressing, and that is exactly what is happening here. The serious development is not thrown away, and the characters do not suddenly pretend that it’s not there, but they have small outbursts trying to deflect the reality away from themselves for a short while. I’ve seen a lot of the comments replying to this point by saying “this show isn’t meant to be serious” or something to that affect. I would disagree, sure you have some pointless foodgasms simply for the sake of fanservice, but looking past that, this show is actually quite serious, and I think Season 3 has made that more clear than ever. Say what you will, but I believe Food Wars is one of the best anime that mixes multiple genre types to come out in awhile. |
FireandIceDec 17, 2017 11:14 AM
Dec 17, 2017 12:14 PM
#74
Dinoe said: Food Wars is getting worse? Well, that is your opinion. Comparing it with SAO is a wrong thing to do, since SAO wasn't solid (the first arc) to begin with. The show was good for people that started anime, or those that wanted something with good visuals & fightsc... just visuals. Food Wars on the other hand has one of the best sets of female characters I've seen so far, a new take on the 'shounen' genre, food animation that makes me darn hungry, a good animation and overall a good and solid storyline. So you think it is bad hmm? Well, just stop watching it. I think that this season is even better than the last one. And it is without a doubt the most highly praised show this season. Can't agree more with you. I'll never understand how people have to complain about stuff that they don't like instead of just dropping it. I mean its not like they would've paid to watch it. I enjoy this show and if i wouldn't i would just stop watchin, which i recomment those who dislike the show. |
Dec 17, 2017 12:19 PM
#75
Welp this season is the worst until now and the animation and tge art became lazy af and it was the first shit i noticed when i watched its first ep |
Dec 17, 2017 12:23 PM
#76
I'm just re-experiencing the manga by watching the Anime so I haven't seen any problem with the execution thus far. Yes, I know, I'm shit for doing it for that reason. Kittens-kun said: Different opinions = whiny babies? Lol. Over 2000 posts and you still haven't noticed this is MAL lol? |
Eight-Man said: Remember, be an artist, not an autist. "If anything simply cannot go wrong it will anyway." ~ Murphy's 5th law |
Dec 17, 2017 12:24 PM
#77
This is really what put me off from watching it after the first season. I found that it became way too repetitive and it failed to maintain my interest. |
Dec 17, 2017 12:24 PM
#78
Draconix814 said: lol what They had to split the two cours to accommodate their bad production schedule, guys, it's basically undeniable that J.C. Staff and the director behind it cannot animate it properly. splitting shows into different seasons of the year isn't uncommon now a days so I don't understand how you'd reach that kind of thought process |
Dec 17, 2017 12:57 PM
#79
I have to say it really is starting to feel stale after the first two seasons. And that art kinda sucks now. |
Signature removed. Please follow the signature rules, as defined in the Site & Forum Guidelines. |
Dec 17, 2017 1:59 PM
#80
>Digibro-sempai Okay, I'm done with this thread. Aside from that, I don't really know why but it seems like you're still not old enough to actually experience real foodgasm huh... Don't worry since we've had been in that situation before... |
Dec 17, 2017 2:14 PM
#81
Deknijff said: Draconix814 said: lol what They had to split the two cours to accommodate their bad production schedule, guys, it's basically undeniable that J.C. Staff and the director behind it cannot animate it properly. splitting shows into different seasons of the year isn't uncommon now a days so I don't understand how you'd reach that kind of thought process Yep exactly. This is probably one of the most stupid things I've seen when it comes to claims. The studio / staff doesn't decide the split cour more often than not. It's the committee or the publisher. Nowadays series have split cour and its not because of production issues. |
Dec 17, 2017 3:18 PM
#82
Dinoe said: Food Wars is getting worse? Well, that is your opinion. Comparing it with SAO is a wrong thing to do, since SAO wasn't solid (the first arc) to begin with. The show was good for people that started anime, or those that wanted something with good visuals & fightsc... just visuals. Food Wars on the other hand has one of the best sets of female characters I've seen so far, a new take on the 'shounen' genre, food animation that makes me darn hungry, a good animation and overall a good and solid storyline. So you think it is bad hmm? Well, just stop watching it. I think that this season is even better than the last one. And it is without a doubt the most highly praised show this season. Gintama and 3-gatsu are more praised. 3-gatsu is arguable. |
Dec 17, 2017 11:19 PM
#83
This thread is everything wrong with Anime. Into the trash it goes. |
Dec 18, 2017 9:34 AM
#84
-Alians- said: tbh I dont have interest on 3-gatsu bcause Shogi is boring, I prefer karuta battle after all like Chihayafuru. so not all people take interest with that anime, Gintama is exceptionalDinoe said: Food Wars is getting worse? Well, that is your opinion. Comparing it with SAO is a wrong thing to do, since SAO wasn't solid (the first arc) to begin with. The show was good for people that started anime, or those that wanted something with good visuals & fightsc... just visuals. Food Wars on the other hand has one of the best sets of female characters I've seen so far, a new take on the 'shounen' genre, food animation that makes me darn hungry, a good animation and overall a good and solid storyline. So you think it is bad hmm? Well, just stop watching it. I think that this season is even better than the last one. And it is without a doubt the most highly praised show this season. Gintama and 3-gatsu are more praised. 3-gatsu is arguable. |
Dec 18, 2017 9:44 AM
#85
GosuGian said: yeah, i agree with u. straight to the point from his moaning crybaby talk that come to pursuing people dropping the series when he acting like "Elitist" w*eb. Who the hell cares? |
Dec 18, 2017 11:55 AM
#86
I agree that animation and plot for this season don't hit as hard as the previous seasons did (maybe it's in part an overhype problem that makes you get your expectations up higher than reasonable), but it's still pretty entertaining, so a little score drop in comparison to the previous seasons for me, but only by 1 point so far, and 7 is still a good score. |
ったく、嫌な世の中だよ。 |
Dec 18, 2017 12:04 PM
#87
Dec 18, 2017 1:23 PM
#88
Weakest season yet, for sure. The plot leaves a lot to be desired. That aside, i find the pacing, humour, animation and soundtrack fine. They don't bother me at all. Now that it's mentioned though, it would be nice to see good food orgasm scenes again, these ones have been subpar. |
Dec 19, 2017 5:05 AM
#89
The series went downhill this season because of the over-the-top and Aizen-esque generic shonen villain that is Azami. Not to mention the absolutely ridiculous idea that students have enough power to overthrow the school. It was a fun, tournament-style shonen. Why shoehorn this dumb villain into the series? Anyway, I've heard most manga readers hated this sudden development as well. Highlight of this season has been Rindou. |
MormegilDec 19, 2017 5:08 AM
Dec 19, 2017 5:48 AM
#90
FireandIce said: I whole heartedly agree. There were a lot of things that went bad with this season but that doesn't mean everything went bad. I kinda feel that the gentleman in question was exaggerating many of the things you mentioned. Yes the show had it's bad parts, but that doesn't mean it's equal to SAO. Comparing any anime to SAO is like comparing a rusty tool with dog droppings, as in everytime SAO will lose. You voiced my opinions entirely on this. +1 from me.Basically what I’m reading is, you A. Dislike the show for escalating in its THIRD SEASON (what, you just wanted it to be competitions and semi-meaningful shokugeki’s forever?) B. You...don’t like the art because it’s so similar to the manga? I don’t even have a comment for this. (Edit: I understand what you were saying now, and I still can’t comment because I haven’t even noticed the transitions...how hard were you looking at this to find something to hate? Jeez.) C. Generally anime (ESPECIALLY THE GOOD ONES) have some sort of soundtrack, and I think season 3 of Food Wars has executed its soundtrack timing perfectly, when the dorm the main crew had been staying in for almost a year is about to be taken away, they inserted a piano version of one of the original intros(which was fing awesome btw) and when things are escalating and getting intense they play a variety of different soundtracks (not just one copy paste hype soundtrack for everyone). D. It sounds like you have not been aquanted with the legendary...”Pause button”: this magical device can be used to freeze time and let you take notes, take screenshots, or when paired with the mysterious rewind button: go back if you missed something. E. Now this is the only point that I personally believe holds some merit, the switch from serious to not so serious is definitely a big problem in all spectrums of anime. However, in Food Wars the seriousness of every situation is not undermined by these “chibi outbursts” but rather fortified by them. In real life people have a tendency to change moods drastically when a situation is simply too miserable or depressing, and that is exactly what is happening here. The serious development is not thrown away, and the characters do not suddenly pretend that it’s not there, but they have small outbursts trying to deflect the reality away from themselves for a short while. I’ve seen a lot of the comments replying to this point by saying “this show isn’t meant to be serious” or something to that affect. I would disagree, sure you have some pointless foodgasms simply for the sake of fanservice, but looking past that, this show is actually quite serious, and I think Season 3 has made that more clear than ever. Say what you will, but I believe Food Wars is one of the best anime that mixes multiple genre types to come out in awhile. |
Dec 19, 2017 7:59 AM
#91
Moekou said: Eh, I don't know why people seem to judge school decisions on real world logic and thus calling it stupid. I see it the exact same way as other shows about their dramatized subject matter like Yu-gi-oh or Pokemon. In Yugioh students are never seen studying, they just play Yugioh all day, and in Pokemon it's decided that sending 10-year olds out to travel the world on their own is a great idea (even though a good number of Pokedex entries make it clear that they can be very lethal to humans). In each the series subject of the show is SERIOUS BUSINESS and you don't need to apply real world logic to it. Here, the show is about cooking, cooking is everything, why are people thinking so seriously about how things would work out in real life? I treat the Elite Ten in a similar way to the Gotei 13 from Bleach and other similar super groups. It doesn't matter if they're high schoolers or not, what matters is that they're strong and thus have massive sway within the setting. ^This It's normal that the show is slower than usual because it just got out of the climax of the last arc. Also, people comparing characterisation between Elite Ten and the main cast even though the main cast has been focused on show for two seasons (roughly 36) episodes. For people saying that some actions have no motive, either you didn't pay attention to what is happening or you have to wait for the second half of this season in Spring 2017 where all the motives will be explained (even though I think that 12 episodes aren't enough to end the current arc which is still continuing in the manga, but it should be enough to explain most things). |
Dec 19, 2017 10:04 AM
#92
while it comes off as complaining, i do agree with TC on some things....however thats how most shonens are anyway. take simple concepts and turn the volume from a measley 10 to an overwhelming 100. i do feel the same way about the story sometimes with that the student should just transfer and the story was getting kinda meh imo when the dictator-esque supervillain showed up and his goal is basically nationwide genocide via starvation. seriously, who other than rich folks could afford fancy food. but that is accomplishing one thing...is to root for the little diner guy in Soma to kick all their asses (even tho he'll likely lose in this week's episode, i havent watched it yet) at least all the other stuff for the show is on point and still has its charm. meanwhile im just over here waiting for Daddy Soma to show up. |
Dec 19, 2017 12:49 PM
#93
I don't care how much power the Elite Ten is supposed to have, but overthrowing the very man that owns the school is so unrealistic IT HURTS. Isnt that the aspect why people watch animes, movies, read comics etc. Because its something that is not realistic? X_x Whatever,most people that hate the 3rd season are gonna watch the next season Its every season the same, nothing new in the MAL/Anime Community |
Dec 19, 2017 1:01 PM
#94
You have wrote an essay, in the end what is your purpose and what do you actually want? Trying to brainwash people like Digibro and sway people thinking this 3rd season anime to be bad just like SAO, or you want to be acknowledged to be the 1st one to discredit this so that you can be famous like Digibro? For one everyone has their own preference & genres, so what you consider bad doesn't mean others hold the same opinion as you. This also applies to how an original work being animated, like how people thinking the humour parts not being proportioned well. Number 2 not everyone acts like a scientist or reviewer, people doesn't watch an anime just to criticize/examine it critically later or during mid-stage. So don't even assume people to be like,"holy shit does this even make sense" or "how is this shit even funny" all the time. Do you get the point? Whether a series in 1st rating of all time or 3rd highest rated TV anime currently airing, the result is there not because everyone examine critically but it is just simply people like it. Let me tell you some about Digibro who you seem to view him as someone great. If you think he is great, then I can tell you might be brainwashed by him to some degree. All of his "tactics" can be seen/revealed easily once you have a certain amount of knowledge in the anime industry etc. Number 1 Digibro is very knowledgable in that industry, which leads people who is not knowledgable thinking his reviews are top-notch and true. This is a common phenomenon where uneducated people always follow those educated easily. Number 2 his knowledge is pretty one-sided which is influenced by his own bias, He has his own standard point of view and preference. This part here is dangerous because of his amount of dumb fanbase, thinking his choices are mostly correct which lead people following his idea/views/preference. Of course I won't say all his fans following his idea loyally, some still have their own thoughts. Number 3 The model and pattern of his videos are very obvious. Well I won't delve in too much as every youtuber has their own style in brainwa.. ops making a video. One of his video pattern is being repetitive. You might think his video is long and educative, but in fact the things he says are the same thing. Basically all he has been saying the same meaning with different wordings, making you think there are many problem in the series. Definately Digibro understands his taste very percisely which is a good thing when he review something, but its too poison to the community when he can influence his huge fanbase easily eventhou he has pointed out no need to follow what he says. Anyway I bet you don't realise he milks people money by making those "educative" videos eventhou its repetitive most of the time. Well I guess its still educative, bias to his own taste thou. Thats why in underground net people use "infamous" on Digibro. SAO, one of highly rated series with controversial ratings & reviews. Do you know that Digibro is the one who started the whole 'SAO is bad' train? How suddenly some people become so "intellectual" in criticizing the series and how more youtubers flying out to make 'SAO is bad' video, yup thx to the infamous Digibro. He literally made SAO from "many flaws but still entertaining" to "make you looked dumb after watching it". Let me tell you what is the real SAO problem, where people suddenly become so "intellectual" in criticizing a highly rated series like it is unworthy to be one after watching a brainwashing video. Every anime has plothole and disproportion, its an exaggeration to mark it as "SAO problem" to begin with. |
Mar 23, 2019 12:01 AM
#95
It is because, in the anime the food that the characters prepare are all real dishes and it teaches the viewers a lot about the cooking world. |
May 24, 2019 2:48 PM
#96
Even though this post is 1.5 years old, I'll say it This post is full of bullsh*t This is easily the best season IMO |
-Aincrad-May 25, 2019 2:49 AM
May 24, 2019 2:58 PM
#97
-Aincrad- said: Funnilly enough regardless of whether it applies to this season or not, almost all op's complaints are things that would go on to kill the entire series both in terms of quality and financial success with the most recent arc. Definitely shows that the seeds of failure could be planted even during one of the best parts of something, I really liked this season alot, but it was without a doubt the beginning of the end for what became one of the biggest trainwrecks jump has ever seen and something that has soured years of content.Even though this post is 2.5 years old, I'll say it This post is full of bullsh*t This is easily the best season IMO |
Immahnoob said: Jizzy, I know you have no idea how to argue for shit, tokiyashiro said: Jizzy as you would call yourself because youre a dick The most butthurt award goes to you And clearly you havent watched that many shows thats why you cant determine if a show is unique or not Or maybe you're just a child who likes common stuffs where hero saves the day and guys gets all the girls. Sad taste you have there kid you came up to me in the first place making you look more like a kid who got slapped without me even knowing it and start crying about it to me |
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