| all these series are fairly high rated (esp. kingdom S2); it's a vocal minority, just like the people who dislike SSY cause of the gay stuff.. some peeps just get triggered hard by cg. if you're not one of them, good for you what do you think of Berserk, sir lord of nutella? |
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| I don't hate CG, but I certainly don't like the aesthetic look to it. It's too janky and the age of retro polygons as graphics for me ended awhile ago. |
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| It didn't look too good because animators haven't master making CGI look like 2D give it time. That said, I love Kingdom and SSY. Though the CG scene does irk me a bit. |
| Signature removed. Please follow the signature rules, as defined in the Site & Forum Guidelines. |
| There was no hatred towards CGI until they ruined berserk with it,even recent mainstream animated films like "Kimi no na wa" used CGI animation in some part as well. |
| I think CGI can enrich an Anime, like "SAO". But when it's over-done and done poorly, like "Aldnoah.Zero" it hurts. I also think the reason that CGI gets hate is that it dominates so much of all entertainment, from animation to live action, it's overkill. It's lost a lot of it's novelty. |
| Mrs. Landingham, what's next? |
| I think people can judge which CGI is bad and which one is good. Those example you mentioned is anime that is ruined by CG and I think it"s a fair point. No one would hate the CG if it's done as good as Captain Harlock, Ars Nova or FF Advent Child. |
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| Nup... is just that bad CGI makes a bad anime. You gave as an example Ajin. That story is very dark and awsome, and the atmosphere and feel we get in the manga is missing from the anime. If Ajin would had been made using 2D traditional artstyle it would had been one of the anime of the year, but with that cheap CGI it just looks like some Jetix cartoon that everyone wants to forget about. The frame rate of CGI anime is crap, and is a failure in many other aspects too. CGI can look awsome, but it must be done well, and combined with 2D art Style like we see in Tales of Zerestria and many others. RoyTF said: There was no hatred towards CGI until they ruined berserk with it,even recent mainstream animated films like "Kimi no na wa" used CGI animation in some part as well. You are absolutly wrong. You are probably new here, but CGI anime had allways been hated by the majority of the anime fans. When Bersek was announced as a CGI animation, this was not recived well by pretty much anyone, and it was the common oppinion that the anime will be shit. |
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CGI is used in a vast majority of anime. If you are talking about full CGI then we had Ajin and Bubuki Buranki before Bersek. There where also Divine Gate, Big Order and Luck&Logic who combined shitty CGI with 2D animation too - and all of those aired this year... they may had been some that I didn't watched too. |
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| Nah, CGI in itself is neither good nor bad. Bad CGI is bad, good CGI is good. Full on CGI is just bad though. |
| No, ShiroBako explained this perfectly: The problem with CG is that it can not be as detailed as hand-drawn. But we are at an age of IT where it could replace some hand drawn parts, whilst drawing it faster. And perhaps in the near-future, there will be CGs that's detailed enough to replace hand-drawn as a whole. |
| Plebs please... Watch FF VII Advent Children before complaining about CG |
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| CG mixed with drawings mostly sucks. Even the positive examples people like to bring up, like Cowboy Bebop and Stand Alone Complex, are conspicuous. The two art forms look too different. It rarely works. As Miyazaki said, "Why do we need computers for things that can be done by hand?" |
| i may be a maverick but i think the cgi in ajin was beautiful and way better than most low-budget "2d-anime" |
Z-Dante said: I just remember it being a terrible movie. I don't see what it has to do with this discussion, though. We're talking about CG blended with drawings, right?Plebs please... Watch FF VII Advent Children before complaining about CG |
| I don't like shows that mix regular animation with CGI, it looks terrible and feels unnatural. If you're going to use CGI, go big or go home. I didn't like Berserk at first, but I got over the CGI. |
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Ezekiel said: If you not nothing about the FF VII background, then of course it'd seem bad to you ¯\_(ツ)_/¯Z-Dante said: I just remember it being a terrible movie. I don't see what it has to do with this discussion, though. We're talking about CG blended with drawings, right?Plebs please... Watch FF VII Advent Children before complaining about CG Oh. I thought it was just another thread bashing all CGs... =_= Then again, you guys should look at Ufotable and PA Works to see how proper anime CGs are done |
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| People be salty. Just ignore them. I enjoyed all of the shows you mentioned. Sure, it would be great if every full CGI series could look like high-budget Pixar movies or FFV: Kingsglaive but it's not like non-CGI TV Series look anywhere close to as good as high budget non-CGI movies either. A difference in quality is to be expected. And the shows OP mentioned still look okay overall, just like most TV Series look just okay. They're good shows, with exciting stories and solid characters and that's really most of what I care for in TV anime. If I want amazing visuals I'll watch high-budget movies or sakuga compilations, not TV anime full of stills and other budget-saving techniques. Ezekiel said: CG mixed with drawings mostly sucks. Even the positive examples people like to bring up, like Cowboy Bebop and Stand Alone Complex, are conspicuous. The two art forms look too different. It rarely works. As Miyazaki said, "Why do we need computers for things that can be done by hand?" Pretty much every anime these days has some CGI in it tho. Just because it isn't obvious or shitty doesn't mean it's not there. RoyTF said: There was no hatred towards CGI until they ruined berserk with it,even recent mainstream animated films like "Kimi no na wa" used CGI animation in some part as well. You don't seem to have been on MAL to witness the reactions to any of the previously aired full-CGI shows so how would you know? Literally every full-CGI show has had vocal haters that constantly trashed them while they aired. Berserk didn't invent that trend by any means. |
| I probably regret this post by now. |
Pullman said: 3D CG mixed with drawings mostly sucks.Ezekiel said: CG mixed with drawings mostly sucks. Even the positive examples people like to bring up, like Cowboy Bebop and Stand Alone Complex, are conspicuous. The two art forms look too different. It rarely works. As Miyazaki said, "Why do we need computers for things that can be done by hand?" Pretty much every anime these days has some CGI in it tho. Just because it isn't obvious or shitty doesn't mean it's not there. |
| Nah, ufotable uses CGI with 2D perfectly and almost everyone is praising its quality. It's really just a matter of how you'll use and execute it. For example : the cgi in kuusen madoushi was bad while in Saijaku Muhai no Bahamut and Heavy Object was satisfactory. ,Sidonia no Kishi was acceptable and Rakuen Tsukiho also used CGI in a positive way |
keySLSep 12, 2016 6:42 AM
| The point where the darkness lies Is the place I hide my true self Are you prepared to open your eyes? Cause between those line is yourself |
shintai88 said: It really depends, CGI Expressions can be bad in some cases. I remember a few awkward animations in talk scenes. But ideally I guess is because the CGI at first seems like a bad choice. Or because it something we aren't used to. When Kingdom first appeared and it was CGI. it was awkward cause there was a mix of animation and CGI being used. And to me the animation sections looked better than the CGI, so it felt like..... why use CGI. But I guess it made sense due to the number of people who would appear on the battlefield, and the use of a single model could save alot of time on Redrawing or tracing. Especially considering they had to finalise an episode each week for airring. Yeah a bunch of the full CGI shows, or shows that use a lot of CGI are shows with huge armies which otherwise might not have been able to be properly animated in a TV format with budget and time restrictions. Kingdom, Nobunaga Concerto, Berserk, Arslan. While I agree that it sometimes looks sloppy I don't think it's that big of a deal. The other CGI-heavy aspect is machinery like mechs, spaceships, cars etc.. Sidonia no Kishi and many mecha shows fall under that category. The only show where I don't see a particular reason for being full-CGi or CGI-heavy is Ajin. |
| I probably regret this post by now. |
Z-Dante said: That's not really an excuse. I've enjoyed plenty of movies not knowing the prior installments or source materials.Ezekiel said: If you not nothing about the FF VII background, then of course it'd seem bad to you ¯_(ツ)_/¯I just remember it being a terrible movie. I don't see what it has to do with this discussion, though. We're talking about CG blended with drawings, right? |
RoyTF said: @Pullman Didn't Ajin got good response?What I've experienced since I joined MAL is that "berserk" is the most hatred anime right now for using "CGI" and I got no idea about previous titles. Well, in that case you'll just have to trust me (and others in this thread) that for every show OP mentioned there were tons of threads and comments trashing them because they're CGI. Below is just one example for Ajin. https://myanimelist.net/forum/?topicid=1463969 And you will see general comments like this very frequently too: https://myanimelist.net/forum/?topicid=1526167#msg46641948 Ezekiel said: Z-Dante said: I just remember it being a terrible movie. I don't see what it has to do with this discussion, though. We're talking about CG blended with drawings, right?Plebs please... Watch FF VII Advent Children before complaining about CG Not really, OP has listed a bunch of full-CGI shows and the Final Fantasy Movies are also full-CGI and therefore a relevant comparison when it comes to showing what anime CAN do with full-CGI, if only the budget is right. It was you (and some others) who brought the hybrid CGI/drawing topic into this thread. |
| I probably regret this post by now. |
Pullman said: shintai88 said: It really depends, CGI Expressions can be bad in some cases. I remember a few awkward animations in talk scenes. But ideally I guess is because the CGI at first seems like a bad choice. Or because it something we aren't used to. When Kingdom first appeared and it was CGI. it was awkward cause there was a mix of animation and CGI being used. And to me the animation sections looked better than the CGI, so it felt like..... why use CGI. But I guess it made sense due to the number of people who would appear on the battlefield, and the use of a single model could save alot of time on Redrawing or tracing. Especially considering they had to finalise an episode each week for airring. Yeah a bunch of the full CGI shows, or shows that use a lot of CGI are shows with huge armies which otherwise might not have been able to be properly animated in a TV format with budget and time restrictions. Kingdom, Nobunaga Concerto, Berserk, Arslan. While I agree that it sometimes looks sloppy I don't think it's that big of a deal. The other CGI-heavy aspect is machinery like mechs, spaceships, cars etc.. Sidonia no Kishi and many mecha shows fall under that category. The only show where I don't see a particular reason for being full-CGi or CGI-heavy is Ajin. so this cgi is basically when the show is cheaply made for the most part? |
| @Pullman Thanks for clearing my doubt out :) ,I realized that anything related to CGI is bound to get lots of hatred in anime community regardless of other aspects but isn't it different for high budget CGI animated films,especially the one made by American studios? This year Zootopia and Finding dory have been phenomenal hit even bigger than fan favorites like Captain america,BvsS,deadpool and many more so the response is different for those? |
PoeticJustice said: Pullman said: Yeah a bunch of the full CGI shows, or shows that use a lot of CGI are shows with huge armies which otherwise might not have been able to be properly animated in a TV format with budget and time restrictions. Kingdom, Nobunaga Concerto, Berserk, Arslan. While I agree that it sometimes looks sloppy I don't think it's that big of a deal. The other CGI-heavy aspect is machinery like mechs, spaceships, cars etc.. Sidonia no Kishi and many mecha shows fall under that category. The only show where I don't see a particular reason for being full-CGi or CGI-heavy is Ajin. so this cgi is basically when the show is cheaply made for the most part? All TV anime are made cheaply for the most part, CGI is just another tool to support that philosophy and in specific areas like huge armies/crowds and mechanical designs/vehicles it's very efficient so it's already used more and more in those areas and I don't see this trend stopping. |
| I probably regret this post by now. |
RoyTF said: @Pullman Thanks for clearing my doubt out :) ,I realized that anything related to CGI is bound to get lots of hatred in anime community regardless of other aspects but isn't it different for high budget CGI animated films,especially the one made by American studios? This year Zootopia and Finding dory have been phenomenal hit even bigger than fan favorites like Captain america,BvsS,deadpool and many more so the response is different for those? Well, on the one hand a movie with a budget of hundreds of millions of dollars (or idk how much exactly, but very much in any case) is bound to look much better than a TV Series with a budget of maybe a few 100k dollars per episode, or less. That can't be avoided and to some degree it's understandable that people enjoy one more than the other. But it's silly to expect any animated TV Series to look as good as a high-budget movie, no matter which techniques are used. TV Anime look like shit compared to Redline as well but you don't see people being 'unable to watch' TV anime because they don't look like the best available movies out there. There's usually a double-standard for CGI and more traditional animation in that sense. A lot of people don't mind cheap traditional animation in TV Series but for CGI will not accept anything that isn't at least as good as your average Pixar Movie. Then there's also the people who put anime on some pedestal and treat it differently than any other form of animation, having double standards in that particular sense and hating on CGI in the specific context of anime only. Lastly there will also be people who just generally hate the CGI aesthetics. Not much that can be done about that. It's just that most of the time those people still enjoy tons of shows that use CGI, they're just not aware of it when it is well done. So it's more like a prejudice. I think those sum up most of the CGI-haters. |
| I probably regret this post by now. |
| It depends on the execution, it seems. The Fate series being a gorgeous example. It's kind of a very hard thing to master. Inadequate use can lead to mediocre and laggy results. Anime like most of what op said above has pretty decent CGI. If they incorporate 2D elements with it, chances are it will look quite out of place, too. One probable reason is that they aren't used to looking at it since it's unconventional compared to the usual kind of animation. It's not necessarily bad, but people always think of the negative aspects of it first. Cancerous CGI like the ones from Big Order give it a bad name :p |
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| imo i hate cgi buts its just me, the older the people gets, the more they hate change. but if you'd ask younger audince they wouldn't mind i think |
| My biggest regret is using my real name as my user name. The continuous pursuit of finding that genuine thing. |
aqing0601 said: No, ShiroBako explained this perfectly: The problem with CG is that it can not be as detailed as hand-drawn. But we are at an age of IT where it could replace some hand drawn parts, whilst drawing it faster. And perhaps in the near-future, there will be CGs that's detailed enough to replace hand-drawn as a whole. In the near future wherein the robots so the work for humans, and humans do nothing.... |
| I'm glad that people are bringing up Ajin as an example of good CGI anime . However that anime is a double edged sword; it has some of the laziest 3D animation animation I've ever seen, the animation was soooo bad that it looked pretty uncanny-valley-ish at times (Maybe that was the point based on the content of the show but I doubt it). |
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_Ako_ said: aqing0601 said: No, ShiroBako explained this perfectly: The problem with CG is that it can not be as detailed as hand-drawn. But we are at an age of IT where it could replace some hand drawn parts, whilst drawing it faster. And perhaps in the near-future, there will be CGs that's detailed enough to replace hand-drawn as a whole. In the near future wherein the robots so the work for humans, and humans do nothing.... Woah...dude...Robot drawing anime...that sounds awesome yet terrifying. |
| simple! CGI - games 2D - anime combining the two are tragedy. |
The world is cruel, ugly and pitiful. Let's watch anime and make it colorful |
| If it's CGI is auto bad for me. I don't want to get eye cancer |
| Love live CGI NotLikeThis It really depends. Sometimes it looks decent, but more often than not CGI in anime looks like shit. |
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If those robots can't even CGDCT I'll build my own microwave and go back to the past. In short, I don't care if its hand-drawn of CGI, as long as the art is acceptable in my own eyes. |
| @_ako_ If I recall from ShiroBako, that most of the modern anime has a lot of CGIs involved. Maybe not as much as to say anime such as Ajin, but most anime does use CGI. To both reduce the cost to recruit more animators and that the speed with CGI is significantly faster. |
aqing0601 said: @_ako_ If I recall from ShiroBako, that most of the modern anime has a lot of CGIs involved. Maybe not as much as to say anime such as Ajin, but most anime does use CGI. To both reduce the cost to recruit more animators and that the speed with CGI is significantly faster. Lol... I've watched Ajin, and the awkwardness of how the characters walk is just really, funny... The lack of details are also there... I have watched ShiroBako, and it has CGI? Really? SoL anime with a touch of CGI? I knew that both technique can co-exist... It really just how it is used, depending on the series, I know that most Shounen have CGI, and Love Live!, I don't know about "how" it is because, I'm not part of the staff... |
| Because a lot of CG just plain looks bad. |
| "No, son, you may not have your body pillow at the dinner table!" |
| CGI used in Ajin (and somewhat to Berserk) is amazing, I dont care what others think but judging the whole anime based on visual difference is bad. |
| dont't watch that anime if you are going to give it 1* and cry 10000 words in review about it. |
| Vehicles and dance scenes are hard to do without some CGI. Anime done completely with CGI generally don't look too great, but some CGI is necessary in order to produce each episode within the budget without overworking the employees too much. |
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