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| Holy shit. |
Fai said: Grail is not "entombed" in Irisviel - Irisviel IS the vessel. That is the role of Einzbern family. They seek to replicate something they did thousand years ago, so they keep creating clones in form of artificial humans like Irisviel, meant to become a grail vessel. Most of explanation on that matter in UBW and HF routes. Grail is not a sham. Fuyuki Grail is pretty much the only grail system in the world that can grant wishes. Or could, before things went wrong. It STILL grants wishes but in its own ways. Yet again, most of explanation in FSN. Grail, working or not, can only grant wishes in the ways that the one wishing knows how - in Kerry's case it would be through "Sacrifice few to save many". A wish for peace in this case would eventually end with everyone but Kiritsugu dead, as grial would keep killing few to save many to preserve peace. Thus Kerry's wish was impossible no matter what. Kiritsugu was forced to realize where his wish would lead and had to "sacrifice few " to prevent it from happening. Now all that is left is for him to learn the PRICE of the said few. It was not "REAL" Irisviel or Illya. It was representation of their "records". The real Iris is dead. So for Iris, it was close enough to original to be true. Angra, as well as why grail is the way it is now, is slowly explained through all three routes. Saber's magic resistance allows her to resist even command spells to a degree. Kerry had no time so he used two to negate that. Majority of the FSN plot itself is spoiled by Zero already though. Also when someone talks about FSN, they generally are NOT speaking about the 2006 version which is a godawful anime original storyline that tried to fuse bits and pieces of all three routes into one and fell flat on its face. so if we shouldn't watch the Fate/Stay night from 2006 which fate/stay night do we watch? is there another? I just finished fate/zero and am thoroughly confused. like who got the wish? did no one get a wish since kiritsugu denied wishing for peace and shit bc he would have to kill everyone? why does he kill the image of Ilya right after he says he loves her and shit? what happened to the grail? WAS it destroyed by saber? what happened to saber? how the hell did archer become human???? how does that make sense? and how is kirei alive? like the grail JUST HAPPENS to be able to revive people AND give them human bodies???? and we're just finding this out now??? hasn't this thing been around for a long time? wouldn't people have known that it can do that or??? ALSO whatever did happen to assassin?? like they staged his death but then he was actually alive and then....?? assassin kinda just disappeared from the show without a word. the ending confused me more than freakin Evangelion. btw who the hell is even watching Ilya??? |
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SoraKiryu said: so if we shouldn't watch the Fate/Stay night from 2006 which fate/stay night do we watch? is there another? the porn game visual novel |
Svelten said: SoraKiryu said: so if we shouldn't watch the Fate/Stay night from 2006 which fate/stay night do we watch? is there another? the porn game visual novel This is correct. There's no FSN adaptation that can replace source material. |
 |
| [Re-watch | BD version] This episode was so full of pain, frustration, sorrow... oh, so much pain. The ultimate sacrifice Kiritsugu was to make, abandon his only family for the sake of 6 billions of people... He was willing to never see again his wife, and her daugher for the greater good. Kiritsugu is someone that can bear all the evil of the world... Kiritsugu vs Kirei, what an amazing battle... each blow, each shot, each punch and kick, each movement was aim to kill. A total charge of adrenaline. Could Kiritsugu have died without Avalon? Maybe, but he had it and he based his approach on that advantage. In any case, Kirei showed to be a formidable opponent. Saber vs Berserker, the sad looking face or Arthuria... the pain and sorrow in her look... her eyes... In any case, I do not understand how people may have thought that was really Irisviel, I think they may have let themselves carry away for the moment, but that was not Irisviel. It only took Iri's will to take that form an comunicate with Kerry. Of course it would react that way towards what Kerry later did, it copied Iri... Iri died, Kiritsugu knew that, and he was not going to let himself be manipulated with her image. Sorry Kiritsugu, the Grail is corrupted. It won't grant you the wish you wanted the way you wanted... If you want to erase all the evil of the world it would have to destroy any possible evil, you would not allow it to kill so many people... So, he has to destroy it. Bearing the course placed upon him, now he orders Saber -contrary to what she thinks- to destroy the very grail she desires, they very grail she thought he wanted more in the world, the very grail they thought could save them both. What a tragic outcome... Sorry Saber, you just don't understand the motives behind the last command spell. [I'm sorry, I wanted to make a joke about Gilgamesh asking Saber to marry him and how Kery and Kirei had their ultimate battle in the batcave, but the episode is too strong for me to joke this time] |
| We Game of Thrones Boysss :)) |
| OMG, this episode is too much for me to handle.. But in the end, Kiritsugu made the right decision. |
| Irisviel needs to be near Saber in order to heal herself with the scabbard, but Kotomine doesn't. FAKE!!! |
Wicked_Edward said: kotomine? he didnt have the scabbard though?Irisviel needs to be near Saber in order to heal herself with the scabbard, but Kotomine doesn't. FAKE!!! |
Maloghurst said: Wicked_Edward said: kotomine? he didnt have the scabbard though?Irisviel needs to be near Saber in order to heal herself with the scabbard, but Kotomine doesn't. FAKE!!! Mistake. I mean Kiritsugu. |
Wicked_Edward said: ooohhh. the difference between iri and kiritsugu is that kiritsugu has a contract with saber giving him a firm connection to her. with iri she can still make use of it but kiritsugu has to periodically restock avalon with mana and have saber close by to receive a real benefit from it. for Kerry his contract lets him use avalon without the real need for saber to be standing right by him. though it should be pointed out that she's in the same building as him.Maloghurst said: kotomine? he didnt have the scabbard though? Mistake. I mean Kiritsugu. |
Maloghurst said: Wicked_Edward said: ooohhh. the difference between iri and kiritsugu is that kiritsugu has a contract with saber giving him a firm connection to her. with iri she can still make use of it but kiritsugu has to periodically restock avalon with mana and have saber close by to receive a real benefit from it. for Kerry his contract lets him use avalon without the real need for saber to be standing right by him. though it should be pointed out that she's in the same building as him.Mistake. I mean Kiritsugu. ...Good point!.. |
| Wow. Kirei is OP as hell, taking on Kiritsugu's Kaio-ken times 3 with just one working hand. Too bad he's just an evil piece of crap who has no idea what he really wants. Dream sequence was trippy as fuck. I can imagine people who haven't read HF feeling really confused at this point. I feel sorry for Kiritsugu - but I fucking love how he thinks on his feet. With the Grail having betrayed him and his entire dream crumbling around him, he realised right away what the right thing to do was. No hesitation whatsoever. |
| One side said, that not accepting the grail is foolish and not understandable and the other says that initself is foolish and not understandable. I'm at loss of words. |
 Behold of my awesomeness~ controversial and/or sensitive topics likely devolve into the same repetitive, derogatory, abusive, and harassing comments can no longer be posted. But my feels. |
| Wow, that was pretty twisted episode. |
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| What an episode! Very intense at the end. Though the fight between Saber and Berserker definitely felt short. Bullet time, speed accelerator. Is there anything Kiritsugu cant do?? :O I really thought it was Irisviel, but just an image on Kiritsugu's mind. Still I guess he didn't any miracle or way that could have saved everything he wanted. Last episode. Man finally I can't finish this and go to UTW :) |
| Damn, the animation and direction! Really HQ!! Everything is so intense :D From Kiritsugu-Kirei fight, to Kirirsugu dream to that final scene! :D |
  “I despise common sense. I’ve seen the world from every possible angle. This cruel, ridiculous, beautiful world.” - Lacie Baskerville ||❤|| |
| ummm........ ok WHY DID I HAVE TO GO THROUGH MORE SUFFERING SEEING IRISVIEL "DIE" AGAIN AND THIS TIME WITH ILLYA??? SIGH |
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that escalated quickly from heartwarming to ice cold   |
| just because I’ve gotten weaker, doesn’t mean that you got stronger, does it? |
| GG no re the series indeed. Kirei vs Kiritsugu is the best anime fight scene I've watched in a while. The grail scenes are great as well. Hm, this episode to leave it ambiguous as to if Lancelot could forgive Saber on some level or if it was because he was a Berserker that he attacked her so ferociously. 10/10 episode besides that which was lol wut. |
| Why did I have to witness Iris neck getting snapped twice in one season? Thats cruel. Also I have to say priest-kun as the antagonist was kinda weak. The weakest part of this show. Why did Gil-kun suddenly decide to get a crush on Arturia? I get it she has golden hair and he has a gold fetish but still. (Btw as we have seen with Iskander Servants to have their own mana supply, but also not really, so without a master, where gets Gil his mana from?) |
| "This emotion is mine alone. It is for Madoka alone." - Homura or how I would descripe Mahou Shoujo Madoka Magica. |
| Dude. How many times do I have to see Iri die? I know it wasn't her, but still. Poor woman can't have a rest. Everyone fought to death for the grail. Meanwhile, Gilgamesh to Saber: "Will you be my waifu?" xD |
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| Lol so Kirei decided to waste his Command Seal to defend against Kiritsugu. I assume he can use his own magic than to waste his Command Seal. And Kirei shouldn't informed yet of Kiritsugu's Origin Shot. What I'm trying to say is normally he should've used his own magic circuit and yet again he suddenly used the Command Seal to defend. It's understandable if Kirei is already informed of Kiritsugu's Origin Shot, but no, he DOESN'T KNOW. Kariya is dead I guess. So the Holy Grail only grant what the wisher can only comprehend. How ironic for a cold-blooded killer to wish for a world without conflict and in the end he can't comprehend how that could work. Meh, even Kirei couldn't have his wish granted even if Kiritsugu gave it. He doesn't even know what he want, lol. And I assume ordering the same command using Command Seal strengthen the Servant's will to follow it. |
Kish0Jun 14, 2019 3:05 AM
| He who smiles in a crisis has found someone to blame. |
| Wasn't nice to see Iri become a cup... The fight between Kiritsugu and Kirei was really awesome. Can't even begin to imagine Kiritsugu's pain having to kill Maiya,Illya and Iri even though they were just illusions. That Illya was just too precious T_T .... The Grail apparently is just a big scam, what's even the point for all this slaughter in order to win it even? Gilgamesh really wants some of that Saber ass hah, surprised he's still around, guess Kirei not actually dead. That Saber despair in the end sure was something damn. |
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| Kirei literally couldn't think of one way to make the world better besides destroying the cup? And the idea that humanity would continuously choose to kill despite knowing the consequences from all past events until there is no one left is just reductive trash. It's a slippery slope fallacy cop out. There are 2 ships: one with 300 and one with 200. The one with 300 clearly witness a God-like Kiritsugu kill everyone on the ship with 200 without contest. Why would anyone contest him again? By this logic, we should all die from the unsatiated curiosity of touching fire repetitively because it's "human nature". Is that why the Grail only chooses the stupidest people on Earth to fight the Grail War, because they lack the imagination to develop a vision and the conviction to believe in it? Everyone in this show became easily flustered the moment someone contested their vision and gave up on it immediately. Kariya immediately gave up on the woman he "loved" upon conflict, and couldn't muster a single sentence to defend his beliefs about Sakura. Kirei immediately gave up on his religion on 5 minutes worth of prodding, like imagine if someone completely changed everything he believed in after watching a dumbed down version of the "prove me wrong" guy on YouTube. Kiritsugu immediately gave up on his lifelong ambition upon being shown a 5 minute clip of one possible version of events. He would rather not take any wish than to wish for, say, "nutritious plants are discovered in sub-Saharan desert enough to feed everyone starving", or "it becomes law that everyone in wealthy countries must devote 1% of their income to feed the poor and homeless", or "human beings become emotionally incapable of killing other human beings without due process under law", or, holy shit, "every starving person spontaneously gains one year's supply worth of grain". Saber couldn't defend her lifelong ideals with a single sentence, and let multiple characters talk all over her without even a single coherent rebuttal. At least, unlike Kariya, she could articulate what she supposedly believes in, but she could not state why. Maybe she is just a little girl as Rider says. Which brings me to realization #2, Fate/Zero is sexist as hell. All the girls in this show are just sacrificial lambs without their own beliefs; they're just lost little girls with daddy issues that needed a man to point them in the right direction. It's pathetic. |
katsucatsSep 16, 2019 5:53 PM
| My subjective reviews: katsureview.wordpress.com THE CHAT CLUB. |
| Wow what a great reductio ad absurdum! "Favouring the majority is bad because they'll keep dividing into two groups until literally no one survives." Come on, is that why Japanese people frown upon arguing, because they're so bad at it? Also lol at Kerry not being able to conceive even one other method that increases well-being. Biggest moron in anime I've seen in recent memory. "Uhh they don't allow my eternal peace wish without a logistical ground, guess I'll destroy it then." Saber's dialogue while battling Lancelot was also hilariously stupid. "Oh wow my right hand man is completely deranged, Rider must have been right I was too selfless." Great logic leaps as always. Thanks Urobuchi. |
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| this season had a lot of dialogue just the beginning and end were good, there are interesting things in the middle but not of great impact as for example the Kiritsugu fillers, the poorly explained ending of why Saint Grall did that, other characters were left out , also didn’t have many battles, compared to the first one it’s calmer just the end saves difficult to choose a verdict, the animation counts soundtrack too but in general I close with 6/10. |
| God, Emiya Kiritsugu is the worst. I hate him from the bottom of my guts. Making saber do things against her will? He is worser than Gilgamesh and Caster. He can't even be a good father. How can he understand the value of life? Emiya is the fool. He must rot to hell. Worst father ever. Kirei could have atleast used it for something worthwhile, to explore himself. But Emiya is the worst. Also Lancelot is a dick as usual |
 Without change,we end up becoming the very person we hate. I was dead until the moment I met you. I was a powerless corpse pretending to be alive. Living without power, without the ability to change my course, was bound to lead me to a slow death. |
| Kiritsugu. Kirei. This is it! Kirei vs Kiritsugu. A battle determined by fate since the 1st episode. LETS GO!!!!!!!!!!! Saber struggles vs Berserker. The origin bullet didn't work? Time Alter: Double Accel! Kirei is using command spells as his mana source. Oh shit! Kirei sent Kiritsugu flying. DAMN!!! Dat kick to the face. Iri's body got burned away. The Grail appears. Kiritsugu fires at Kirei. Double Accel! Damn! The bullert entered Kirei's hand and left through the elbow. Time Alter: Tripple Accel! LMAO at Kirei blocking Kiritsugu's knife attacks. Time Alter: Square Accel! The Grail! Dat light! What an episode. Kirei vs Kiritsugu is still amazing 9 years later. I'm still upset that the fight was interrupted. Dat Yamero still hits. |
RobNov 4, 2021 1:52 AM
| If you see that my post is exactly 1 month old (or more) from when it was posted... Don't waste your time, especially when you want to reply with something petty & insignificant. Assume that I've moved on (because I have). |
| Kirei vs Kiritsugu was so fucking dope. Loved it and in the end, we got to see how OP Gilgamesh is and he also wants to marry Saber. LOL. But, damn Kiritsugu even rejecting his own wife and daughter. SO MUCH PAIN...!!! |
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| I feel like I should hate Kiritsugu after all this, but I don't really care enough from some reason. Why does he want to break the Holy Grail now? I don't get it, it's like he went through all that to get rid of it. Anyway, fucking Gilgamesh just joined Saber's reverse harem at the end there |
| goodgoodgoodgood |
| this is why you keep your wishes simple |
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| I don't understand the dream scene Or why kiritsugu wants to destroy the holy grail Is it just because his wish can't be granted |
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| Let's go! Destroy the grail! |
| “I won’t rely on anyone anymore. I don’t care if no one understands.” – Homura Akemi |
| Uh yeah actually, this is the best episode, THEN it's End of Honour. Kind of didn't think much of it when I first watched it, but now seeing it again, I realize how good the fight between Kiritsugu and Kotomei is, mainly because it's been built up so well over the course of the show. On the surface, both appear to be stone-cold, cold-blooded, cold-hearted killers. But one is devoid of all love and compassion, while one has a bit of a heart, as seen as he uses his final command spells to order Saber to destroy the Grail, seeing how it has become corrupt. I don't know the lore and such in how it become corrupt, or if it was always like this, some evil entity working under the guise of granting wishes, only to twist them for its own benefit, but Kiritsugu is able to hold fast to his ideals, and rejects the Grail and its manipulation. Speaking of though, neither do I quite know what the technicalities are, but as the Grail overflowed, it covered both Kiritsugu AND Kirei. Why did it choose Kiritsugu, or was it always after Kiritsugu from the start, knowing his wish would be most easy to make use of (I don't know if the actual wish matters, or if the Grail just uses any human wish to manifeset itself, or whatever, again I'm not hardcore enough to read the full visual novels)? Anyway, I'm just a little bummed out that the grail kind of interrupted the fight that was going on in batman's basement. I totally forgot that the servant would be granted a wish too. What would happen if the wishes of the master and the servant are in conflict with each other? I guess that doesn't really matter, it doesn't seem like the grail would give much of af at this point. Now Saber was approaching the grail, but Gilgamesh was blocking her. Did she simply have to go and touch it for it to grant her wish? Because if that were the case, even though it seems like Gilgamesh is not wanting of much, he seems to still want Saber as his wife. He should've gone and grabbed the grail right then and there and wished it to be so. Or maybe he is aware of the twisted nature of the grail, somehow? Sigh. It's not that nothing makes sense, it's just that I have a lot of questions. At least it has been made simple of for us to at least get the gist of it. Grail is evil, Kiritsugu recognizes that and rejects it, and orders Saber to destroy it. Now onto the last episode, which honestly is a blur for me in my memory. Hopefully it clears up some things at least. |
  NYANPASU  whiskey tango foxtrot |
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