| The concept of meta has been floating around for some time in many mediums, but I remember the term came to be used in the anime community widely when Monogatari/Oreimo came out and many series began to follow in their footsteps as far as making self-aware references. I've heard "meta" used both as a term of praise (indicating a series is playing with the tropes it's using) and as an insult (indicating the show is up its own ass with otaku-pandering, for instance), and it seems that no two definitions of the term are the same from viewer to viewer. So in your opinion, what makes a series meta? |
| How much sipping tea, staring contest and deep references it contains. |
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| The problem with self-awareness in many of those recent anime is that it does nothing to contradict the archetypes, it just admits their belonging to them. And at the end, the implied dialogue that tried to be witty ends up feeling just way too artificial and out of place. |
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Lordwen said: The problem with self-awareness in many of those recent anime is that it does nothing to contradict the archetypes, it just admits their belonging to them. And at the end, the implied dialogue that tried to be witty ends up feeling just way too artificial and out of place. This week on "What did Light Novel Adaptations Ruin through over-use?" Self-referential humor.  A joke like this for example doesn't work because it defeats the whole purpose of the suspiciously similar brand name. It's like writing a massive plot-hole into a story and having the characters spell out why it's a plot hole. |
RLinksoul said: Lordwen said: The problem with self-awareness in many of those recent anime is that it does nothing to contradict the archetypes, it just admits their belonging to them. And at the end, the implied dialogue that tried to be witty ends up feeling just way too artificial and out of place. This week on "What did Light Novel Adaptations Ruin through over-use?" Self-referential humor. A joke like this for example doesn't work because it defeats the whole purpose of the suspiciously similar brand name. It's like writing a massive plot-hole into a story and having the characters spell out why it's a plot hole. wow, I watched Toradora twice and I don't remember that moment. |
RLinksoul said: Lordwen said: The problem with self-awareness in many of those recent anime is that it does nothing to contradict the archetypes, it just admits their belonging to them. And at the end, the implied dialogue that tried to be witty ends up feeling just way too artificial and out of place. This week on "What did Light Novel Adaptations Ruin through over-use?" Self-referential humor. A joke like this for example doesn't work because it defeats the whole purpose of the suspiciously similar brand name. It's like writing a massive plot-hole into a story and having the characters spell out why it's a plot hole. That's quite unimportant actually. I was thinking about stuff like these: |
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Lordwen said: RLinksoul said: This week on "What did Light Novel Adaptations Ruin through over-use?" Self-referential humor. A joke like this for example doesn't work because it defeats the whole purpose of the suspiciously similar brand name. It's like writing a massive plot-hole into a story and having the characters spell out why it's a plot hole. That's quite unimportant actually. I was thinking about stuff like these: That's a bad example because Hitagi is not really tsundere, she has some characteristics of one sure, but she doesn't have hesitation in admitting her true feelings towards Araragi that a true tsundere has. |
| no one bring gintama? seriously? after watch them, everything feel mild meta... |
 "If taking responsibility for a mistake that cannot be undone means death, it's not that hard to die. At least, not as hard as to live on." |
| pokemon cuz like... metapods n stuff |
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| in the case of Oreimo, its use of 'meta' was when it played off as some sort of deconstruction of the little sister genre in the first season.. except it really was a little sister anime so its meta falls flat on its ass Heres a nice Digibro video that goes into more detail on Oreimo, meta, what it is, what it isnt, and how it's changed within the industry dramatically over the years and all that.. Kuma said: no one bring gintama? seriously? after watch them, everything feel mild meta... ? not meta, it's parody |
 Freddy Nicholas said: have control, be yourself, god is dead |
Malarkey said: gintama is not only parody, but very slef awarness (meta) about their self, like some the early of benizakura arc when elizabeth saying "is it suddenly plot coming?" or something. there are plenty meta jokes too, like infamous kanashibari scane. gintama is not all about parody.Kuma said: no one bring gintama? seriously? after watch them, everything feel mild meta... ? not meta, it's parody |
"If taking responsibility for a mistake that cannot be undone means death, it's not that hard to die. At least, not as hard as to live on." |
SuperRed said: That's a bad example because Hitagi is not really tsundere, she has some characteristics of one sure, but she doesn't have hesitation in admitting her true feelings towards Araragi that a true tsundere has. do you know what meta is? the fact that she isnt a tsundere is why the meta works.. |
Freddy Nicholas said: have control, be yourself, god is dead |
Kuma said: gintama is not only parody, but very slef awarness (meta) about their self, like some the early of benizakura arc when elizabeth saying "is it suddenly plot coming?" or something. there are plenty meta jokes too, like infamous kanashibari scane. gintama is not all about parody. isnt that just breaking the fourth wall then? |
Freddy Nicholas said: have control, be yourself, god is dead |
| It just means anime about (or including references to) anime. |
| Be thankful for the wisdom granted to you. |
Malarkey said: isn't 4th wall breaking also meta jokes? correct me if i am wrong thou. not really familiar with term.Kuma said: gintama is not only parody, but very slef awarness (meta) about their self, like some the early of benizakura arc when elizabeth saying "is it suddenly plot coming?" or something. there are plenty meta jokes too, like infamous kanashibari scane. gintama is not all about parody. isnt that just breaking the fourth wall then? |
"If taking responsibility for a mistake that cannot be undone means death, it's not that hard to die. At least, not as hard as to live on." |
Kuma said: isn't 4th wall breaking also meta jokes? correct me if i am wrong thou. not really familiar with term. meta is more like self-aware irony while breaking the fourth wall is just a type of joke if you watch the video I mentioned above, (not the two Bake ones but the one before those) youll get a better understanding bc Digibro explains the concept far better than I have; the video makes more sense if youve seen Eva, Haruhi, and Bake additional: Fourth Wall |
Freddy Nicholas said: have control, be yourself, god is dead |
| Meta-fiction is any fiction that's aware that it is fiction and addresses that. Good meta-stories address the nature of stories and their medium. Some series have meta elements but aren't meta. Hyperdimension Neptunia has meta elements, but it doesn't deal with any philosophical depth. |
| WEAPONS - My blog, for reviews of music, anime, books, and other things |
| Self aware humour isn't quite the same as 'meta'. A series that is 'meta' is what it's about, or to put it another way, it's about what it is. But in anime it's more common to see things which are 'meta' crop up as self-referential gags, lampshading of tropes, fourth wall breaking, extensive symbolism, and double-ups of thematic ideas. Gakkougurashi! flirts with 'meta' thematically, by having themes of perception and escapism present in the narrative both literally and figuratively. Yuki's completely biased perception of events are in stark contrast to the other characters, but so is the audience's perception (because they have no choice). The characters are escaping from the world and hiding away in their delusions, just like otaku do, although the characters are also literally hiding away from the world because of all the spoilers running around. The title itself 'School-Live!' means at least three different things simultaneously. FLCL has a scene where the setting becomes a movie set and the characters become actors playing their roles, allowing the characters to be characters pretending to be their characters. The most clear example of 'meta' I can think of would be this review. A scene plays where Erina is reviewing Soma's cooking. Simultaneously, Erina reviews the series Shokugeki no Soma. It's also a review of itself. |
| Now you're wondering if there's white text in any of my other posts. Over there, I'm everywhere. I know that. |
| When the work itself is aware that it is a work. This isn't new at all, Homer introduced the illiad as a chant, thus, acknowledging its manufactured nature. Aristophanes deals about Tragedies and playwrights in "the frogs" (ranae), yet the main topic is Politics. |
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Caelidesu said: Self aware humour isn't quite the same as 'meta'. A series that is 'meta' is what it's about, or to put it another way, it's about what it is. But in anime it's more common to see things which are 'meta' crop up as self-referential gags, lampshading of tropes, fourth wall breaking, extensive symbolism, and double-ups of thematic ideas. Gakkougurashi! flirts with 'meta' thematically, by having themes of perception and escapism present in the narrative both literally and figuratively. Yuki's completely biased perception of events are in stark contrast to the other characters, but so is the audience's perception (because they have no choice). The characters are escaping from the world and hiding away in their delusions, just like otaku do, although the characters are also literally hiding away from the world because of all the spoilers running around. The title itself 'School-Live!' means at least three different things simultaneously. FLCL has a scene where the setting becomes a movie set and the characters become actors playing their roles, allowing the characters to be characters pretending to be their characters. The most clear example of 'meta' I can think of would be this review. A scene plays where Erina is reviewing Soma's cooking. Simultaneously, Erina reviews the series Shokugeki no Soma. It's also a review of itself. Is there a difference between 'meta humor' and 'self aware humor'? |
| WEAPONS - My blog, for reviews of music, anime, books, and other things |
TheBrainintheJar said: I didn't do the best job of explaining it in that last post tbh. There's a really blurry line between the two in some cases.Is there a difference between 'meta humor' and 'self aware humor'? Using the same anime from before as an example: 'meta humour' would be something like the scene from FLCL where the characters take a break from playing themselves for a scene, whereas an example of self-aware (but not meta) humour is when Gakkougurashi references Stephen King's novels, or 'I am Legend'.  It shows an awareness of works which use similar tropes, and thus helps to convince the viewer that it's a 'self aware' piece, but it's not 'being itself' in any sense, so it's not 'meta'. |
| Now you're wondering if there's white text in any of my other posts. Over there, I'm everywhere. I know that. |
Caelidesu said: TheBrainintheJar said: I didn't do the best job of explaining it in that last post tbh. There's a really blurry line between the two in some cases.Is there a difference between 'meta humor' and 'self aware humor'? Using the same anime from before as an example: 'meta humour' would be something like the scene from FLCL where the characters take a break from playing themselves for a scene, whereas an example of self-aware (but not meta) humour is when Gakkougurashi references Stephen King's novels, or 'I am Legend'. It shows an awareness of works which use similar tropes, and thus helps to convince the viewer that it's a 'self aware' piece, but it's not 'being itself' in any sense, so it's not 'meta'. The Neptunia series often features jokes that I'm not sure fit self-awareness or meta. The characters often express knowledge that they're in a game/tv show and mention it - 'Oh, it's the fanservice episode!". What would you call it? |
| WEAPONS - My blog, for reviews of music, anime, books, and other things |
TheBrainintheJar said: The Neptunia series often features jokes that I'm not sure fit self-awareness or meta. The characters often express knowledge that they're in a game/tv show and mention it - 'Oh, it's the fanservice episode!". What would you call it? That sounds more like classic 'self-awareness' |
| Now you're wondering if there's white text in any of my other posts. Over there, I'm everywhere. I know that. |
| an anime is meta if it can deal a lot of more dmg than other animu and it's mostly simply overpowered. here you go |
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