Aldnoah.Zero 2nd Season Episode 8 Discussion

deadoptimist said:


Code Geass was not written so appalingly, and it had clearly visible political (well, "political") plot. I don't believe A.Z will manage anything good in the remaining episodes.

As we see now in the light of the new development (cause A.Z is terrible at showing motivations), Slaine didn't have any vision, he gained power simply cause he could and to pass time.
He tried to kill Inaho just cause and because of Asseylum.
He killed Saazbaum by chance and because of Asseylum.
he gained more power cause he didn't have anything else to do for Asseylum and to keep her safe.
Then he stopped believing that she would regain consciousness and did a lot of fun things.
...but she immediately gained consciousness, so he went back to care for her and condemns himself for trying to do anything else.
I hoped that we simply were not shown nis other motivations, but it seems now that it was like this! It's horrible.
I dunno, his life is so broken by her, that he should try to kill her instead of Lemrina in the end in my opinion, but it will happen the other way around...

Raziel1991 said:
Against Laser-Kun most of the work was done by Magbaredge, Inaho just had a supporting role. Also her appearing in the last second bailing out everyone and saving Inaho and Marito is also pretty meaningful.

Darklight0303 said:


By trying to keep her distracted with a fake garden of eden on his castle and not telling her anything

Raziel1991 said:
Against Laser-Kun most of the work was done by Magbaredge, Inaho just had a supporting role. Also her appearing in the last second bailing out everyone and saving Inaho and Marito is also pretty meaningful.

CookingPriest said:


Peopel are still bitching about Inaho despite Marito taking out MAzuurek few episodes back?

MonadoRudra said:


...not really.

Inaho literally told or gave hints to Magbaredge where to shoot for every shot and was in control of the entire operation. Magbaredge literally did nothing more than pressing a few buttons or tell her men to press a few buttons when Inaho told them to.

Raziel1991 said:


All Inaho did was pull the trigger. The most important part of the job, luring Mazuurek into Inahos line of fire, was done by Marito.

MonadoRudra said:
I think you're simplifying this a bit too much here.

Slaine didn't try to kill Inaho 'just because' or because of Asseylum. Slaine told Inaho to walk away but he didn't and pointed a gun back at him, Slaine's only option there was to shoot.

If Slaine didn't at all care about Saazbaum's cause he wouldn't have saved Saazbaum in season 1 or done various things to further Saazbaum's version of a fairer Mars before seemingly losing hope in Asseylum's recovery. If Asseylum was all he cared about he would care far too much about what she thinks of him instead of furthering Saazbaum's goals. I can't see Slaine's words to Harklight when he became a count anything but genuine.

Raziel1991 said:


All Inaho did was pull the trigger. The most important part of the job, luring Mazuurek into Inahos line of fire, was done by Marito.

deadoptimist said:


Though I think jealousy played the biggest part in him shooting Inaho in ep. 12.
Why he saved Saazbaum is a bit unclear. It can be explained by protecting the place of his own, that the count gave him, the first time and by wanting to use the count to save the princess afterwards.
His words to Harklight contradict it, but damn, is Harklight and that whole part of the situation developped poorly. I won't be surprised if they retcon it out as they did with dr. Troyard's research and Orlaine. It could tie well with Rayet's drama, but we haven't seen anything about the simple martians anyway, none of the simple martians appear as even half-important characters (Harklight just goes around, doesn't have personality and he is a knight now).

______________
People, who argue that Inaho had no part in defending Mazuurek, are hopeless, sorry. Marito and Ko couldn't do anything, and even then one of them almost died stupidly. The only reason they didn't die right away was cause Mazuurek didn't want to kill them. And then they called Inaho and he shot the kat from space with the power of his miraculous eye. They couldn't have done it wothout him.
Inaho is the key to every single victory, no matter does he it personally or orchestrate it. The fact that there're some other characters doesn't change it.

And the reason they survived in the last two eps is because he told them to use the smoke (both times, cause they apparently can't think of it themselves).

MonadoRudra said:


No, Inaho didn't just 'pull the trigger'. He was the only reason why the Deucalion can even accurately aim at the damn thing.

There was no logical reason for Marito needing to lure it anywhere. The Deucalion can travel at much much faster speeds than Marito can and it's also perfectly able to decelerate from extremely high speeds in a matter of seconds (as shown in this episode).

blackbishop said:


Inaho would never won if he was alone, in other hand if Magbaredge would just apply heavy artillery fire over the area she would have got the same result, although spending more ammo.

Raziel1991 said:


episode 16

15:01 Inaho: Thank you for luring it into position, Lt. Marito.
16:10 We are no longer in an area with a line of fire. It looks like this is all the help we can give you.

The episode made it pretty clear that luring him into Inahos line of fire was the key to defeating him. Like Cookingpriest said, Inaho could have been replaced by a random satellite.

MonadoRudra said:
There was no logical reason for Marito needing to lure it anywhere. The Deucalion can travel at much much faster speeds than Marito can and it's also perfectly able to decelerate from extremely high speeds in a matter of seconds (as shown in this episode).

MonadoRudra said:


This confuses me too. Even if the truth is exposed and Slaine dies, what next? Most of the Martian Counts are more than happy to invade Earth. The Emperor is too ill to stop them and if Asseylum tries to some Count will probably try to kill her again like Saazbaum did. Hell, Lemrine is even there to step in as the new Princess at any time. A civil war on Vers could also easily break out over invading Earth or stop invading Earth and in the end Mazuurek will get Asseylum killed and/or destroy his country.

Mazuurek seems to be a rather dim character honestly and possibly even more stupid than his now deceased acquaintance. Baroucruhz would have fit the 'Slaine's thorn within Vers' role much better as he actually seems to have a head.

skudoops said:
So a 16 year old has detailed knowledge about biomechanical engineering, electrical engineering, physics (standard with engineering I suppose), chemistry, classical literature and music and history (among other things that they probably haven't shown us). Japan has some amazing students! He didn't even finish high school yet and knows all this!

Interesting how the eye just randomly can do things now like picking up radio signals, who knows what power it contains still! You know, I think my biggest gripes with this show is that they try to put too many scenarios to make inaho look awesome and it's just badly done.

If they had reeled back in the "awesome" and done things a bit simpler the show would have been a lot better for it.This guy with the cloning mech, obviously didn't think it would make sense for his mech to carry a weapon for whatever reason... I suppose he thinks that it might make too much sense? Things might be too effective or easy? Who knows. Slaine's storyline is at least good but that's mostly because of his political movements rather than him being awesome.

MonadoRudra said:


No Inaho couldn't have been replaced by a satellite lmaot. A satellite doesn't have a pin point accurate aiming system that works at hundreds of miles.

Inaho is the only one with the technology in his left eye, and that's a fact until someone or something else comes along with the same tech.

Like I said, there was no logical reason for Marito to lure the thing anywhere apart from saving his own ass because the Deucalion is fast enough to travel anywhere around the Earth in a matter of minutes and also decelerate to 0 velocity ridiculously quickly as shown in this episode. Marito was the burden in that operation and he needed Inaho to save his ass. There was absolutely nothing stopping Deucalion staying still and Inaho shooting the crap out of Mazuurek's mech except PIS.

skudoops said:
Not sure why people are bothering to defend inaho's characterization. It's quite clear they wanted to make him the super smart, emotionless, "awesome" type character. I'll just quote myself here...

skudoops said:
Not sure why people are bothering to defend inaho's characterization. It's quite clear they wanted to make him the super smart, emotionless, "awesome" type character. I'll just quote myself here...

Z4k said:

Self insert of course.

Raziel1991 said:


It was implied by Laser-kun that Inahos cyborg eye has the accuracy of an observation satellite, so yes they do have that accuracy or at very least in the world of aldnoah zero they do. Also, like I said the dialogue in the actual episode ouright stated that Maritos actions were the key to victory.

Raziel1991 said:


Im not sure why would anyone want to self insert into someone who is very likely to end up a vegetable by the time this series ends.

Raziel1991 said:


Im not sure why would anyone want to self insert into someone who is very likely to end up a vegetable by the time this series ends.

EDIT: Also I thought the main reason people hated Inaho was because he was not relatable due to him being "emotionless" and now people are saying he is a self-insert? lol

Raziel1991 said:


Im not sure why would anyone want to self insert into someone who is very likely to end up a vegetable by the time this series ends.

deadoptimist said:


But apparently people do. Also a possible tragic ending doesn't contradict self-inserting for the course of the story in the slightest.
If people don't feel personal connections with Inaho, why do they treat admitting, that maybe Inaho's character has some problems with the way it's written, as if it would bring the end of the world? Normally no one is going to blame you for liking or supporting a non-ideal character anyway.

Non-normal is a standard for Mary Sues, btw. Psychopaths are among the most loved protagonists now too.

deadoptimist said:
btw. Psychopaths are among the most loved protagonists now too.

Inugirlz said:
I heard the self insert theory but honestly i doubt it's something that complex. People just like cool, powerful characters. The end. That's the easiest way to explain it rather than getting into complex self-association theory.

Inugirlz said:
LOL Tsukiyama Shuu from Tokyo Ghoul. Best example. (although he's not a protagonist...just a psycho)

deadoptimist said:


Yeah, also this. They tried to lure the thing away from the city, but it couldn't play that big of a role in shooting it from space.



A good point dicussed here. I find the whole development with Mazuurek a bit distasteful and out of the blue. The fact that Inaho can now also judge people so well doesn't help the story too.
Mazuurek really isn't a count material and it doesn't fit their setting. He can't be a first generation count, but if there're second generation counts around Earth, why aren't there more of people disinterested in war? And why haven't seomeone ambitious taken him out in a duel? More importantly why is he so eager to believe an enemy? He seems politically blind too, since it's true that Slaine can hardly be stopped from the counts pov.
More importantly he doesn't seem to care about his own people in the slightest.

I understand that he is supposed to be that one guy, who only cares about truth, but the counts are made into 99% of total scum and one good guy almost without shades. And he has responsibilities of a suzerain.

deadoptimist said:


Well... I'll get eaten, but Inaho has many traits of Marty Sue...

I don't think that we have to go deep, it's pretty straightforward with cases like this. There're people on this forum that react to any criticism of Inaho as to something personal.
I mean that Inaho is not an interesting character to watch as a detached viewer, but he is vague enough to attach yourself to and very comfy - he has no flaws, not many defined traits to alienate or make uncomprehensible.
Though, I think, it takes a certain type of person to have the nerve to. You should believe in yourself a lot to side with someone who is always right. Typically these are young males. I've seen the discussion where they harp on a character for his stupidity, inability to see the right way and lack of technical knowledge a thousand times. The idea is that they for sure know better and could do better.

I am sorry, if I am offending someone, but I haven't pointed out any nicknames and that's what I really think.


I was thinking Dexter, but Gourmet is great. Have you seen this short video? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3jXM8SGrMaY&list=UU9kpZplMXyFqTsseWSr_xmw Very funny, but suits him well.

ANGRY2011 said:
Oh yea, I forgot the eye is also great again this episode.

The ship can't fly properly because all the systems are down?

It's ok, here's Inaho and his eye! We're all safe now.

"Well how did you-"

"Robot eye."

"Oh... So then the time that you-"

"Robot eye."

"I see... Well how do you explain how you-"

"Robot. Eye."

kymano said:
Mazuurek's a Count who's only interest is laying claim to Earth's resources, though so, he pledges loyalty to the Old Vers.Slaine's ascension to being Count goes against everything Mazuurek believes in, so yes Slaine is not on Mazuurek's good side and Slaine now becoming Emperor being applaud by other Counts is just frustrating to Mazuurek.
However i sort of get the sense that Inaho purposely made Slaine more powerful ,giving Mazuurek Slaine's necklace which brings back Asseylum's memories is only putting more of a chance for Slaine to ascend to Emperor and destroy the Old Vers.

Savethebestforu said:

Symqn said:
finally shits going to happen!

ANGRY2011 said:
So they do opt for a fighting retreat, good. Keeps things interesting. Of course, now that they've fought the next attack will be winnable. Waiting to see the "plan."

Everytime I think Slaine is about to finally "get" Lemrina he just turns his eyes and does the "guilt" thing. He broke the rules this episode, he made muh cripple princess cry.

-10 points for Slaine becoming more boringly predictable with each episode. Potential wasted.

Savethebestforu said:

CookingPriest said:


Still more realistic and with more downsides than Slaines "lol I predict the future because mech"

CookingPriest said:

kymano said:
Mazuurek's a Count who's only interest is laying claim to Earth's resources, though so, he pledges loyalty to the Old Vers.Slaine's ascension to being Count goes against everything Mazuurek believes in, so yes Slaine is not on Mazuurek's good side and Slaine now becoming Emperor being applaud by other Counts is just frustrating to Mazuurek.
However i sort of get the sense that Inaho purposely made Slaine more powerful ,giving Mazuurek Slaine's necklace which brings back Asseylum's memories is only putting more of a chance for Slaine to ascend to Emperor and destroy the Old Vers.

CookingPriest said:
Slaine can be described in three words:

"Self pity party".

CookingPriest said:
Still more realistic and with more downsides than Slaines "lol I predict the future because mech"

Makaze_no_Moujuu said:
Why do people keep saying Slaine is "screwed" because the Asseylum now remembers?

It's like people forget that before all of this Slaine was more, or less, her best friend, or someone she felt hella comfortable being around. I doubt that Asseylum will suddenly go out-of-character, and completely denounce Slaine on the spot. It's very likely that they'll talk, and it's in that talk that we'll find out whatever Slaine is trying to accomplish. That will determine how she will see him after this.

Also, I feel really bad for Lemrina. Slaine is my dude, but the way he's treating her is cruel, and completely uncalled for. I know he feels like he can't love her, but he should at least be her friend. She's lonely as f*ck! I'm really hoping for something redeeming between in this "relationship" within these last 4 eps.

Duri1n said:
U know, despite all the bullshit and plotholes and stuff,

Alnoah.zero 2nd season is one of the animes I look forward to the most every week.

Right now, I'm all pumped up for next weeks episode. Wondering what the princess will do to Slaine now she knows what an asshole he is, hehehe

skudoops said:
Slaine is definitely a self insert character, I mean it's so bad that he hasn't received any development from since the beginning of the show. I don't know much more about him from then till now, only that he's a genius at everything. He's like a much worse version of Tatsuya.

Darklight0303 said:


Not if that someone said to my face taht he would stop at nothing to kill the most important person in my life. Also I would reflect on why I was shot down in the first place.

Raziel1991 said:


Well, Slaine outright stated that he was trying to prevent Asseylum from regaining her memories. That line must have been there for some reason right?

kymano said:
Mazuurek is what you call a benefactor of the Old Vers regime as well as loyal to the Old Vers , Mazuurek had made many qoutes that he will NOT sell out his country, yet he quickly made alliance with Slaine(who is a threat to the Old Vers regime).
So why did Inaho think he was a best candidate for the job? Simple because Mazuurek will go out of his ways to keep the Old Vers and those who have higher power ie Slaine/Asseylum can change things.
Asseylum needs are also Slaine's needs , Slaine already created a New Vers Colony and cannot stop half-way through.His success in uniting the Counts in strength is giving him more support from Counts.The only problem was Asseylum was not with Slaine due her problems.
Now that Asseylum memories have recovered, her dislike of the Old Vers might re-appear and once learned that she now indirectly in power of the New Vers(which is on a roll) she will have to confront Slaine about.Although it is possible she is not in favour of keeping the Old Vers around.
So its like Inaho getting Mazuurek to help Slaine get rid of the Old Vers.

Makaze_no_Moujuu said:
It's not implied that he's "screwed" if she finds out. If worse came to worse, he could realistically silence her without anyone noticing. Not saying that will happen (it could...I kinda want it to, seeing as I very much dislike naive, goodness personified characters, who don't consider the feelings of anyone else, and thinking what they're doing is completely just regardless of the obvious problems they ignorantly create.