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| ...I need a moment to process what I have just witnessed. I think I'll never process it. This is on the level of 'Master of Martial Hearts'. |
Litrydow said: See the difference? The mysteries were there. Do the Others exist? Do the dragons exist? What was the strange event in the prologue of the first book? That kind of stuff gets answered and twisted as the story goes on, they didn't appear out of thin air. Were monsters and evil lords ever mentioned in Samurai Flamenco? They're living in a reallistic setting, it's not a fantasy or sci-fi. Even if it was to be revealed it was a fantasy or sci-fi, it needed something beforehand pointing that out. But I think we're just being trolled by the director, this must be the TV show Hazama was going to appear in. It's not possible for a writer to be this shitty. You're still wrong. He all but establishes that there isn't any supernatural stuff and only then does he pull it out. And besides, the fact that you rely on TVtropes as some kind of infallible guide to storytelling is fucking laughable. I have seen multiple examples of these so-called asspulls that worked very well. To dismiss it outright as bad writing because it is a sharp turn makes zero sense. Candor said: Therefore if Martin showed supernatural stuff you won't complain, 'cause it's been foreshadowed before. In Samurai Flamenco nothing of that sort has been mentioned before. The series remained a SoL series for 6 episodes now without any hints of it becoming a supernatural series, so it turning 180 degrees is awful writing. Why? 'cause it makes no sense. How did suddenly supernatural stuff appeared in the realistic world Samurai Flamenco built? To me it established the characters way more than the world. Yeah, it's a totally realistic world in which the cops work with some superhero who can defeat bad guys used "super advanced office supplies" while a group of pop idols go around kicking people in the balls. Why is it so hard for you people to say "I didn't like this." It's four simple words. You. Didn't. Like. It. It wasn't bad. It wasn't an asspull. It was a creative choice that did not appeal to your own personal taste. The hubris of associating that with something objectively bad is ridiculous. Get off your high horses. |
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| Please, just stop embarrassing yourself. This isn't even funny anymore. |
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| In the back of my mind I was hoping for a twist like this, but I CAN'T BELIEVE IT ACTUALLY HAPPENED??? Time to wait and see if we're being trolled or not. |
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Litrydow said: Please, just stop embarrassing yourself. This isn't even funny anymore. Hahaha you guys are always the same. Unable to argue so you pretend the argument is beneath you. Go back to your TV tropes bible. I'll be back here in "allowing people to be creative" land. You should visit sometime. Oh, and you want storytelling 101? This was episode 7. This show has 22. This was the final establishing element to the first act of this story. It wasn't a deus ex machina presto chango solution at the end. It was still within what you could call the exposition to the story. So go ahead, don't "sink to my level." oh great one. Fucking lol. |
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| Now that's gotta be a dream of Msayoshi's. And I like how frustrated about the lack of criminal activity Flamenco Girls was. Sent with Mal Updater |
 "Only the dead have seen the end of war". ~Plato~ |
| What the fuck did I just watch..... |
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Candor said: World =/= characters. The world itself is realistic with nothing supernatural, or even any hints of it. The characters aren't realistic. This is still the first act of the story. Frankly I'm kinda shocked to see these reactions. Sure, I expected people to not like the direction, but this whole "HRUMPH! THIS ISN"T PROPER STORYTELLING!!!" line is a complete mystery to me. I can't help but think of the people who said "selective colors? What are you, some kind of IMPRESSIONIST painter? Get the fuck out of our academy, Monet. You don't know what you're doing. Ever read arttropes.com? It says you have to use REALISTIC COLORS!" |
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JizzyHitler said: neontaster said: yah and you know why that would work? because it happens in 30 minutes, its still in its premise, this did it hours in real time and months in story time into its series and is close to its halfway point. pulling it this far into it is again, horrendous writing.JizzyHitler said: Thats like having a romantic comedy, then 30 minutes into it ZOMBIES. That takes no skill. How is that remotely applicable to this scenario? No, this would be akin to a comedy about a nerd who loves Zombie things and then 30 minutes in we get real zombies. neontaster said: Cause it does happen, not often cause its terrible writing, you just havent watched themJizzyHitler said: Thats like having a romantic comedy, then 30 minutes into it ZOMBIES. That takes no skill. And if doing this is so easy and takes no skill, how come I've NEVER seen it happen before ever? heres a great example of one http://myanimelist.net/anime/5020/Zettai_Shougeki:_Platonic_Heart ouch, comparing this to that is pretty harsh |
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| Thank you candor and litrydrow for saying all the things i would whilst i was away eating. |
Immahnoob said: Jizzy, I know you have no idea how to argue for shit, tokiyashiro said: Jizzy as you would call yourself because youre a dick The most butthurt award goes to you And clearly you havent watched that many shows thats why you cant determine if a show is unique or not Or maybe you're just a child who likes common stuffs where hero saves the day and guys gets all the girls. Sad taste you have there kid you came up to me in the first place making you look more like a kid who got slapped without me even knowing it and start crying about it to me |
gedata said: yah and you know why that would work? because it happens in 30 minutes, its still in its premise, this did it hours in real time and months in story time into its series and is close to its halfway point. pulling it this far into it is again, horrendous writing. This was at the 1/3 point of the show. If this was a 90 minute movie, it happening after 30 minutes is EXACTLY like it happening in episode 7. Candor said: Not liking this direction means there's something wrong with the writing. Let's imagine Martin never spoke of dragons or zombies or even hinted of any in the first book, but made the world remain as a normal medieval world, then in the 2nd book and in the middle of it out of nowhere dragons started appearing or zombies started walking, how would that feel? Excuse me? Who put you in charge of deciding what is good writing or not? Are you so perfect that you only like good stuff and only hate bad stuff? That's a pretty inflated sense of self-worth right there. |
rodacNov 22, 2013 2:29 AM
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neontaster said: nice job ignoring the question there, the anime_name tactic doesnt work on usCandor said: Not liking this direction means there's something wrong with the writing. Let's imagine Martin never spoke of dragons or zombies or even hinted of any in the first book, but made the world remain as a normal medieval world, then in the 2nd book and in the middle of it out of nowhere dragons started appearing or zombies started walking, how would that feel? Excuse me? Who put you in charge of deciding what is good writing or not? Are you so perfect that you only like good stuff and only hate bad stuff? That's a pretty inflated sense of self-worth right there. |
Immahnoob said: Jizzy, I know you have no idea how to argue for shit, tokiyashiro said: Jizzy as you would call yourself because youre a dick The most butthurt award goes to you And clearly you havent watched that many shows thats why you cant determine if a show is unique or not Or maybe you're just a child who likes common stuffs where hero saves the day and guys gets all the girls. Sad taste you have there kid you came up to me in the first place making you look more like a kid who got slapped without me even knowing it and start crying about it to me |
neontaster said: gedata said: yah and you know why that would work? because it happens in 30 minutes, its still in its premise, this did it hours in real time and months in story time into its series and is close to its halfway point. pulling it this far into it is again, horrendous writing. This was at the 1/3 point of the show. If this was a 90 minute movie, it happening after 30 minutes is EXACTLY like it happening in episode 7. um I didn't write that lol |
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JizzyHitler said: neontaster said: nice job ignoring the question thereCandor said: Not liking this direction means there's something wrong with the writing. Let's imagine Martin never spoke of dragons or zombies or even hinted of any in the first book, but made the world remain as a normal medieval world, then in the 2nd book and in the middle of it out of nowhere dragons started appearing or zombies started walking, how would that feel? Excuse me? Who put you in charge of deciding what is good writing or not? Are you so perfect that you only like good stuff and only hate bad stuff? That's a pretty inflated sense of self-worth right there. Because the question makes no sense. This is a show about a super hero. Now we have super villains. The superhero doesn't have super powers but the villains do. Hmm... Where have I seen that scenario before? Oh yeah, FUCKING BATMAN. So the question is why wait this long? First of all, we don't fucking know why because it only just happened, but I'm not the one condemning it at face value like this. This was the end of act one of the story. In what fucking universe is that a bad time to introduce a left turn like this? Madoka basically changed its tone at this point in the story too (it was a shorter show so it happened sooner, but ratio wise it was similar). What the fuck is all this butthurt about supernatural shit not being established upfront? That would have totally skewed the things that happened thus far, which will undoubtedly have an effect on things that happen later. A world that suddenly is introduced to the supernatural is a totally different scenario than a world where the supernatural is already established. Capiche? |
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gedata said: neontaster said: gedata said: yah and you know why that would work? because it happens in 30 minutes, its still in its premise, this did it hours in real time and months in story time into its series and is close to its halfway point. pulling it this far into it is again, horrendous writing. This was at the 1/3 point of the show. If this was a 90 minute movie, it happening after 30 minutes is EXACTLY like it happening in episode 7. um I didn't write that lol Oh oops. The quoting system here is so confusing haha. |
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| *whispers* what the actual fuck |
| just imagine if Goto got his head chopped off too how'd you feel about that? |
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| what the shit. |
JizzyHitler said: And that's exactly how this series operated. You just didn't notice. With each episode things were getting more and more unrealistic:Creating a twist that completly catches you off guard that has been heavilly hinted at and foreshadowed throughout a portion of the series = good writing - a GQ model getting hit and healed with no bruises - Samurai Girl's tools to fight the bad guys - Samurai Flamenco's ridiculous gadgets going against all plausible laws of physics - Lack of defined Evil, Villain, Antagonist or whatever you call it - The will from Masayoshi's grandfather the serious intent for Samurai Flamenco to fight evil If you read my comments and discussion with a couple of other guys at the end of the ep.6 thread, you'll notice, how I was actually missing this huge conflict and twist to the show. But this whole time the stage was simply being set up, prepared step by step: getting a police cover with the best friend, training, becoming a team with SG, getting gadgets and a mad professor to develop them, and so on. My only complain is they should've done it probably one episode earlier - pacing would've been better. But other than that, everything what happened in ep.7 was extremely welcome and foreshadowed. And still, I was amazed and stunned. Damn was that EPIC writing! |
Candor said: There are set rules for writing something, rules based on things that makes sense. Like for example a conclusion should come after a climax, not the other way round (like for example ASoIaF, in the middle of the series Martin tells you who dies and who lives, then starts with writing how and why and explains. That's bad writing) When the writing follow the rules, or try to follow it as much as possible, it's called good writing. When the author makes you intrigued about things and make you excited for them, that's called good writing. When an author pulls something out of his ass, which means he did something that made no sense in the world he build, then that's called bad writing. What you are describing would have applied if this was the finale of the show, and all of a sudden Samumenco had super powers to escape from a sticky situation. There's still two thirds of the show left to go, and introducing the supernatural here didn't act as a deus ex machina to save the hero or as some kind of convenient development, and hence is NOT a goddamn asspull. Candor said: When did Batman have supernatural things? Every time ever except for the Christopher Nolan movies. Even the Burton movies had supernatural things. Catwoman was bitten by some cats and came back to life. Poison Ivy controlled plants. The Riddler stole people's brains... And in the comics it's even MORE supernatural. |
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| What the hell was that? Haha, I hope it's just a movie filming for PR or something but it seems off and there were dead people.. Man, I just hope there is no supernatural thing in here.. |
soulelle said: JizzyHitler said: And that's exactly how this series operated. You just didn't notice. With each episode things were getting more and more unrealistic:Creating a twist that completly catches you off guard that has been heavilly hinted at and foreshadowed throughout a portion of the series = good writing - a GQ model getting hit and healed with no bruises - Samurai Girl's tools to fight the bad guys - Samurai Flamenco's ridiculous gadgets going against all plausible laws of physics - Lack of defined Evil, Villain, Antagonist or whatever you call it - The will from Masayoshi's grandfather the serious intent for Samurai Flamenco to fight evil If you read my comments and discussion with a couple of other guys at the end of the ep.6 thread, you'll notice, how I was actually missing this huge conflict and twist to the show. But this whole time the stage was simply being set up, prepared step by step: getting a police cover with the best friend, training, becoming a team with SG, getting gadgets and a mad professor to develop them, and so on. My only complain is they should've done it probably one episode earlier - pacing would've been better. But other than that, everything what happened in ep.7 was extremely welcome and foreshadowed. And still, I was amazed and stunned. Damn was that EPIC writing! That was the main reason I wasn't totally shocked - they clearly hadn't gotten to the ACTUAL STORY yet. This does't feel like a slice of life show that will just continue in this way until the end. I felt something was coming... |
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| honestly I don't think they did what I saw they did, did they? the heads rolling caught me off-guard, that's not fair. Also we get a hint? that Goto's girlfriend is alive, I hope so |
neontaster said: soulelle said: JizzyHitler said: And that's exactly how this series operated. You just didn't notice. With each episode things were getting more and more unrealistic:Creating a twist that completly catches you off guard that has been heavilly hinted at and foreshadowed throughout a portion of the series = good writing - a GQ model getting hit and healed with no bruises - Samurai Girl's tools to fight the bad guys - Samurai Flamenco's ridiculous gadgets going against all plausible laws of physics - Lack of defined Evil, Villain, Antagonist or whatever you call it - The will from Masayoshi's grandfather the serious intent for Samurai Flamenco to fight evil If you read my comments and discussion with a couple of other guys at the end of the ep.6 thread, you'll notice, how I was actually missing this huge conflict and twist to the show. But this whole time the stage was simply being set up, prepared step by step: getting a police cover with the best friend, training, becoming a team with SG, getting gadgets and a mad professor to develop them, and so on. My only complain is they should've done it probably one episode earlier - pacing would've been better. But other than that, everything what happened in ep.7 was extremely welcome and foreshadowed. And still, I was amazed and stunned. Damn was that EPIC writing! That was the main reason I wasn't totally shocked - they clearly hadn't gotten to the ACTUAL STORY yet. This does't feel like a slice of life show that will just continue in this way until the end. I felt something was coming... that and the fact that as a slice of life, I can't see how this would need 22 episodes |
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Candor said: Yes but it does go against what the show built so far. The show set an atmosphere of a parody show in a realistic world since the beginning (Batman was serious from the beginning), yet out of nowhere it turned itself into a serious show with villains and all that shit. There wasn't enough foreshadowing or build-up. Again, all the people being caught off-guard by this turn of events means the show did something wrong, and call it whatever you want, such things are called bad writing. Ok let's not call it an asspull, but the last scene lacked a proper build-up for it. All I see here is "this isn't like other things so I don't like it." To me this felt really refreshing, actually. Establish some good characters and a whole scenario, and then throw a wrench into it (a monkey wrench hahaha). I haven't really seen it done before this way. Like watching some regular comedy and thinking "I wonder how these characters would react if suddenly there was an alien invasion." Because WHY NOT try something like this? Like if in Kick Ass 2 suddenly there was some actual supervillain with powers that Kick Ass and Hit Girl etc. had to battle. I think that would be a great idea for a sequel. Because why not??? I would love to watch Hazama now become a legitimate superhero. Maybe the military will design a crazy super suit for him because of his reputation and now suddenly he's a legit hero? That's fucking cool as shit! At least in my opinion. |
neontasterNov 21, 2013 6:00 PM
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| wtf did i just watch |
| >User since 2008 Please god help me quit this website. Such great community that doesn't even know how demographics work, AND gives """detailed"""" reviews after first episodes. |
| What. The. Actual. Fuck. |
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| So we are actually going down that route?! god damn it SF! it's to early to judge those last few mins but this show might end up losing it's charm to me which is unfortunate |
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| Did that really just happen? My brain can't comprehend this plot twist |
| am i the only one that actually enjoed the plot twist no justsu/batman ripoff in this episode? if this keep going like this this show might become one of my favorites |
 "Be who you are and say what you mean, because those who mind don't matter, and those who matter don't mind" - Dr. Seuss |
| Well... shit just went down. I guess it was bound to happen, but... huh. I have no idea how to react to this except just stare slack-jawed. |
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| Why not wait till the next episode before claiming this is an asspull or not and even arguing about it? you do realize that all of this would be pointless if it turned to be a dream or a movie or w/e, right? Nah, who am I kidding!. This is the internet, continue with your pointless arguments and continue to stroke your e-peens. |
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Candor said: Look, from the beginning I wanted this show to be proper tokusatsu show with evil and good, so stop the nonsense about "It's not like I wanted so I don't like it", 'cause it's not that way. I have no problem with the show turning into an action show, but not in this abrupt way. They director/script-writer should've thrown hints from the beginning of how he wants the show to be, things that tell us the show is more than just a SoL adventures of a super-hero-wannabe, or at least put something like that in the OP (which also shows no supernatural elements). The first 2-3 episodes, the episodes that normally set-up how a show should be, showed nothing of that sort, they just showed some parody realistic aspects with absolutely no hints of supernatural things. Yet out of nowhere, and after 2:15 hours of 6 episodes and a half, the show started introducing some mutating creatures and flying evil villain. The hints soulelle brought are subtle hints that may say the show is a "bit" not that unrealistic, which can be overlooked due to the fact that this is an anime, but suddenly a villain appears and the show turns into serious mode with a lot of too supernatural stuff? Of course people would go wtf. I did have thoughts about "why would the show be 22 episodes for such a simple plot?", but that doesn't mean it should be ok to make things random as fuck without proper writing. Wait what? The OP has him in a real superhero suit battling a giant robot that shoots lasers! Granted, that's technically not "supernatural" but it certainly hints at something more towards the fantasy realm of super heroes. Besides, I still think the subtle hints are there. Once the whole grandfather thing came into play I really started to feel like something big was coming. I actually thought that the samumenco logo on the grave was some kind of button that would open up into a secret lair with high tech crime fighting gear. Hell, that may still happen. |
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Candor said: We might be dealing with a 'superhero' genre deconstruction here. Postmodernism in all its beauty. I had this thought appearing in my head for a second last week and now it's got some good reasoning behind. This show is not black (as in true super-hero) or white (slice of life comedy). It's not even grey. It seems to grow into a total rainbow! Deal with it ^__^The show set an atmosphere of a parody show in a realistic world since the beginning... Candor said: I wouldn't extrapolate here. Surprised - majority. In a negative way - didn't notice much in this thread.Again, all the people being caught off-guard in a negative way by this turn of events |
soulelleNov 21, 2013 6:28 PM
soulelle said: I wouldn't extrapolate here. Surprised - majority. In a negative way - didn't notice much in this thread. The reactions I saw on twitter were almost across the board positive. |
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| WTF!?!? @.@ |
skualninja said: My guess is they are filming the episode they were talking about before. Either that or the series just went crazy all of a sudden lol. My thought exactly... The decapitating of heads felt really out of place. |
| What in the flying fuck just happened? Haven't been this mindfucked by an anime for a while now. |
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neontaster said: and over 80% voters rated this episode with 4 or higher (two thirds voting with 'loved it') at this very moment. So no. Not negative at all. At least for now.The reactions I saw on twitter were almost across the board positive. |
| There's no preview so.... it's just a freaking film or just samumenco's imagination!!(I really hope that's not a case)(but who cares.. let's just wait for the nxt epi) Can't wait to see the reaction of flamenco girls If it's really real |
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