| We worship God because he does not exist, we fear him if he he does. If God had existed, we would have killed him. If God had not existed, then he shall be invented. Therefor, God cannot exist. "We worship God because he does exist." God is a concept of an ideal human being, that is why we worship him and accept him. It is in this state that he is free to be manipulated into what humans want him to be and what he needs to be. "We fear him if he he does." God is an ideal being, therefor he is superior to us and more powerful than us. If he does exist, we would fear the power that he would possess because we will doubt him and his faithfulness to his ideal. This doubt will in time turn into fear that will eventually.... "If God had existed, we would have killed him." To kill God, to protect us from something that we cannot comprehend or control. We must destroy anything that threaten or could threaten the human kind and God is such a being that has the ability to wipe out the human kind. In order to not be killed, we must kill first. This will happen because we fear God, and eventually lead us to making a mistake that we believe could anger God. In fear of avoiding his wrath that might not exist, we must terminate the cause. "If God had not existed, then he shall be invented." "If God did not exist, it would be necessary to invent Him" - Voltaire God is an ideal human, he give us hope and guidance and more importantly a way to control the mass so that they do not think and question world. The society needs God(or in current day, something equivalent to the concept of God) to function properly. That is why if we did kill God, we would have to create a replacement for him. If God never existed, then we will need to create him to serve that purpose. In a way, God is actually a martyr for human greed. A way for small group to control the masses and keep society running the way it was, is and will be. If oxen and lions had hands or could draw with hands and create works of art like those made by men, lions would draw pictures of gods like lions, and oxen gods like oxen, and they would make the bodies (of their gods) in accordance with the form that each species itself possesses.~Xenophanes (570-475 BC), Fragment 15. *I have used he/him, but in reality i would careless about the gender of God. *Edit: The God i am referring to here is the religious God, not the philosophical God. *All of these represent my personal opinions and in no way written with intention to harm any person or organization specifically. Also, Merry Christmas, Happy Belated End of the World and Happy New Year! |
YggdrasilDec 26, 2012 9:41 AM
| horrible argument you are even using the wrong definition of God. The definition of God is essentially "truth" "He is substance of every great eternal law, And He can be perceived in the universal forces of life. He is without any form, yet dwells inside and outside all things With form and shape, Yet He is entirely free of error, faultless and pure. He is far beyond anything a human body can comprehend. And being the Divine Poet. He is inspiration itself. He maintains peace and harmony because He is both peace and Harmony made manifest." -Vedas (translated from Sanskrit It (what is known as God here in the west) is basically the ultimate reality. Whatever the truth is is God. The ultimate reality cannot be killed, like you are saying. Abrahamic religions describe a dualism of God and man, Heaven and Earth, etc. This "God" which I describe ("God"/Truth as described by Sanatana Dharma) transcends such humanistic ideas. God (the ultimate Reality) is an architect whose structures all exist within him. Nothing can exist outside the Supreme Reality, and it in turn is within all |
RandomChampionDec 25, 2012 7:47 PM
| Even though I'm not religious, I couldn't give a shit. |
 Just this once, I'll fulfill whatever your wish is. |
| I love how i got to choose my religion and beliefs on my own without others trying to force it down my throat, i became an athiest on my own accord and thats how it should be PLease Yggdrasil, dont be a jackass and try to shove beliefs down others throats, there is no need for this thread, if you think god cant exist then keep it to yourself, why should go preaching it off to others? do you like it if you get ganged up on by a bunch of religious nuts telling you that god is real? Obviously not, so shut up about the topic |
Immahnoob said: Jizzy, I know you have no idea how to argue for shit, tokiyashiro said: Jizzy as you would call yourself because youre a dick The most butthurt award goes to you And clearly you havent watched that many shows thats why you cant determine if a show is unique or not Or maybe you're just a child who likes common stuffs where hero saves the day and guys gets all the girls. Sad taste you have there kid you came up to me in the first place making you look more like a kid who got slapped without me even knowing it and start crying about it to me |
| So... should this be serious discussion or casual discussion? Discuss. Derp. Agnosticism all the way. Adopting a "we'll see" attitude always gets non-aggressive responses! |
| You could find the true answers to everything if they exist, because people put questions about things that are invalid sometimes, and the absence of proof is not always proof of absence, either way, the importance of it all does not pass the level of mere words. |
| The definition of God is essentially "truth" "He is substance of every great eternal law, And He can be perceived in the universal forces of life. He is without any form, yet dwells inside and outside all things With form and shape, Yet He is entirely free of error, faultless and pure. He is far beyond anything a human body can comprehend. And being the Divine Poet. He is inspiration itself. He maintains peace and harmony because He is both peace and Harmony made manifest." -Vedas (translated from Sanskrit It (what is known as God here in the west) is basically the ultimate reality. Whatever the truth is is God. The ultimate reality cannot be killed, like you are saying. Abrahamic religions describe a dualism of God and man, Heaven and Earth, etc. This "God" which I describe ("God"/Truth as described by Sanatana Dharma) transcends such humanistic ideas. God (the ultimate Reality) is an architect whose structures all exist within him. Nothing can exist outside the Supreme Reality, and it in turn is within all |
| How do you kill an omnipotent being that can destroy all creation with a passing thought? |
| The Art of Eight |
| What was the point of this? Why throw this out here just so you can irritate Christians? Really, nobody cares if you don't think he exists or if you do. Pointless. |
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DJIzzyIzzyHitler said: PLease Yggdrasil, dont be a jackass and try to shove beliefs down others throats, there is no need for this thread, if you think god cant exist then keep it to yourself, why should go preaching it off to others? do you like it if you get ganged up on by a bunch of religious nuts telling you that god is real? Obviously not, so shut up about the topic While I'm not one to scream my views down the throats of others, how can you possibly say that finding out the truth is not important? "God" is a big deal which has been the cause of many things in our culture entire freaking world, to throw it off as unimportant or just a "personal belief" is pretty silly. Finding the truth should be held to the absolute highest importance, regardless of whether or it's just some personal thing which doesn't affect anyone else (which of course on this case, isn't the case). RandomChampion said: -snip- You have an eagle and an American flag as your avatar. |
TrapaliciousDec 25, 2012 7:57 PM
Itami-chan said: What was the point of this? Why throw this out here just so you can irritate Christians? Really, nobody cares if you don't think he exists or if you do. Pointless. True but you have to admit it is averagely more interesting than the most topics atm. |
| tl;dr don't believe anyway. |
| Now now people, no one's forcing views/beliefs down anyone's throat here. You only bring that upon yourself, no one else. |
Just this once, I'll fulfill whatever your wish is. |
| I believe you. |
| "Every man shall reap what he has sown, from the highest lord to the lowest gutter rat. And some will lose more than the tips off their fingers, I promise you. They have made my kingdom bleed, and I do not forget that" |
| The existence of god has not been proven nor unproven so it's a matter of if you want to believe or not. I'm an atheist but I never try to influence other people into not believing in god why should it bother you whether someone believes in a god or not |
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SkyKyz said: I'm an atheist but I never try to influence other people into not believing in god why should it bother you whether someone believes in a god or not Perhaps because of how much belief in God has, and still does influence our society and laws? Being that you're an Atheist, how can you possibly overlook that? |
SkyKyz said: Alright, I'll be the one to crash this party. God, or at least certain qualities of God, can be unproven. For instance...The existence of god has not been proven nor unproven so it's a matter of if you want to believe or not. 1. If God always acts perfectly, then all his actions must follow along an ideal path maximizing efficiency and results. 2. If God's actions always maximize efficiency and results, then there can be no other possibilities. 3. If there are no other possibilities, then this ideal path is determinable. 4. Therefore, a perfect God lacks free will. OR 1. If God's power is infinite, then he must be more powerful than himself. 2. God cannot be more powerful than himself. 3. Therefore, God is not all-powerful. |
| My subjective reviews: katsureview.wordpress.com THE CHAT CLUB. |
katsucats said: SkyKyz said: Alright, I'll be the one to crash this party. God, or at least certain qualities of God, can be unproven. For instance...The existence of god has not been proven nor unproven so it's a matter of if you want to believe or not. 1. If God always acts perfectly, then all his actions must follow along an ideal path maximizing efficiency and results. 2. If God's actions always maximize efficiency and results, then there can be no other possibilities. 3. If there are no other possibilities, then this ideal path is determinable. 4. Therefore, a perfect God lacks free will. OR 1. If God's power is infinite, then he must be more powerful than himself. 2. God cannot be more powerful than himself. 3. Therefore, God is not all-powerful. Than an omnipotent God just laughs and change the rules. |
| The Art of Eight |
| God is supposedly all powerful. Can God create something that even he cannot lift? I'm just lobbing gasoline on top of the fire. Feel free to have a BBQ. |
| As a child, I was told that society is a melting pot of talents; knowledge and experience combined to form important alloys that will contribute to mankind. When I got to highschool, however, I thought that it's more like a river in which the water represents our peers while we ourselves are the stones in the river. Constant erosion by mindless majority sheeping has made us lose our unique edge. After I hit the age of 18, I realized that I've been wrong all along. Society is no melting pot. Society is no river. Society is a person, a very skilled rapist, and he has fucked us all. |
| Not this again lol |
BloodRequiem said: God is supposedly all powerful. Can God create something that even he cannot lift? I'm just lobbing gasoline on top of the fire. Feel free to have a BBQ. Is he omnipotent. Yes he can ActualGLoRY said: God is outside of logic. /sarcasm Is he omnipotent. Then, yes he is. If you accept the hypothetical existence of an omnipotent being and then try to disprove its existence with logical fallacies or moral deficiencies than you have already lost because omnipotence is the ultimate cheat card. |
| The Art of Eight |
| Impending shitstorm! Hold on, I gotta get mah poppin' corn. |
 |
| Are you fucking retarded? |
 |
ActualGLoRY said: I don't accept the hypothetical existence of an omnipotent being. Religious people need to have some really good evidence for the existence of what they are asserting before they start assigning qualities to it. Sure, and I'm not even mentioning religion here. I'm just showing that using logical traps on an omnipotent being is not a sound argument. Although a God doesn't necessarily needs to be omnipotent to be a God. He just to be much more powerful than anything else around. ie. Superman could easily make himself out to be a God to Earthlings if he wants too. |
| The Art of Eight |
Red_Keys said: |
 |
| the very concept of omnipotence is a logical fallacy on its own. such as the 'creating a rock so heavy he cant lift, if he can hes not omni, if he cant, hes incapable of doing so, so not omni' there's a whole lot of other logical fallacies with the concept of an omnipotent god, but i wont bother with that, most people already know it. the way i see it, all types of people created their own type of god to explain things that (at the time, or currently) cant be explained through scientific observation or because they simply lacked the means to understand. the concept is called 'god of the gaps' a good thought experiment i always ask heavily religious people, and they can never answer, i ask, if tomorrow, the world as we knew it was to be destroyed, all knowledge erased, and mankind to start anew, the god/religion you once believed in wouldn't be recreated, it would be something completely different, science and maths on the other hand are always true/constant, if you destroyed all knowledge, 1+1 still equals 2, relativity still exists, gravity is still around, blah blah. your god/religion though will just be another completely different made up story, the science would always be true, and would be recreated the exact same |
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eldest said: the very concept of omnipotence is a logical fallacy on its own. such as the 'creating a rock so heavy he cant lift, if he can hes not omni, if he cant, hes incapable of doing so, so not omni' there's a whole lot of other logical fallacies with the concept of an omnipotent god, but i wont bother with that, most people already know it. no it isn't. True Omnipotence>>>>Logic. Since as an omnipotent, it was what created logic in the first place. |
| The Art of Eight |
dankickyou said: eldest said: the very concept of omnipotence is a logical fallacy on its own. such as the 'creating a rock so heavy he cant lift, if he can hes not omni, if he cant, hes incapable of doing so, so not omni' there's a whole lot of other logical fallacies with the concept of an omnipotent god, but i wont bother with that, most people already know it. no it isn't. True Omnipotence>>>>Logic. Since as an omnipotent, it was what created logic in the first place. the entire concept of omnipotence is a complete logical fallacy, you cant prove a logical fallacy with another one. |
|
eldest said: dankickyou said: eldest said: the very concept of omnipotence is a logical fallacy on its own. such as the 'creating a rock so heavy he cant lift, if he can hes not omni, if he cant, hes incapable of doing so, so not omni' there's a whole lot of other logical fallacies with the concept of an omnipotent god, but i wont bother with that, most people already know it. no it isn't. True Omnipotence>>>>Logic. Since as an omnipotent, it was what created logic in the first place. the entire concept of omnipotence is a complete logical fallacy, you cant prove a logical fallacy with another one. An omnipotent God changes the rules and now it can. See where I'm going with this. Disproving religion is pretty easy though as you've shown above. |
| The Art of Eight |
dankickyou said: eldest said: dankickyou said: eldest said: the very concept of omnipotence is a logical fallacy on its own. such as the 'creating a rock so heavy he cant lift, if he can hes not omni, if he cant, hes incapable of doing so, so not omni' there's a whole lot of other logical fallacies with the concept of an omnipotent god, but i wont bother with that, most people already know it. no it isn't. True Omnipotence>>>>Logic. Since as an omnipotent, it was what created logic in the first place. the entire concept of omnipotence is a complete logical fallacy, you cant prove a logical fallacy with another one. An omnipotent God changes the rules and now it can. See where I'm going with this. that's why its hard arguing with semi knowledgeable religious people, there's so many things like this that can be brought up. its never ending. although in real life that often isnt the case since most of the time the prerequisite for being fanatically religious is the lack of knowledge. |
|
| Looking at Philosophy by Donald Palmer. I recommend checking out this book, as we don't need to cause needless debate to force others to regurgitate possible arguments (already accounted). Inside you'll find many of the most important topics in philosophy and epistemology, clearly explained and hand illustrated by the author. |
 Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum videtur. |
| me agnostic peace we should have bake a cake together we must <3 |
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aintnoponyexpres said: Do you even go here?me agnostic peace we should have bake a cake together we must <3 |
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aintnoponyexpres said: me agnostic peace we should have bake a cake together we must <3 I still worship GLaDOS, and she tells me cakes do not exist over the internet, so, sorry, our beliefs are not compatible with one another. |
Just this once, I'll fulfill whatever your wish is. |
dankickyou said: Nope. Rules can't contradict other rules. Even God can't create a boolean value that's both true and false at the same time.An omnipotent God changes the rules and now it can. See where I'm going with this. And if you still aren't convinced, even God can't create a boolean value that's both true and false at the same time, and must be valid according to logic -- therefore God can't be omnipotent. There. Can God change logic without changing logic? The concept of omnipotence is fail. In order for something to be possible, it must be possible without contradicting logic. Logic is the only thing in the world that can't be broken. |
| My subjective reviews: katsureview.wordpress.com THE CHAT CLUB. |
| Let's sit around and laugh at these clowns: |
| Old news is old. |
 |
 |
Alone on a Friday night? Remember that DIO did nothing wrong! |
aintnoponyexpres said: me agnostic peace we should have bake a cake together we must <3 Agnostic? What type of agnostic? No type? I guess you lack common sense. |
Play League of Legends here! Autocrat said: Hitler was good, objectively. |
| "God is more real than air" |
| God is just a hoax... I am the truth! |
Play League of Legends here! Autocrat said: Hitler was good, objectively. |
| A thread about moe being crap: 11 pages. A thread that at least tries to bring some discussion: 3 pages. Oh well... Immahnoob said: God is just a hoax... I am the truth!  |
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BatoKusanagi said: A thread about moe being crap: 11 pages. A thread that at least tries to bring some discussion: 3 pages. Oh well... Immahnoob said: God is just a hoax... I am the truth! Worst villain ever. |
| The Art of Eight |
| I'll rustle thy later. |
Play League of Legends here! Autocrat said: Hitler was good, objectively. |
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| I think our minds are our God. |
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