| I think he was stronger than Frieren and Fern. What do you think guys ? |
| No way was Himmel ever stronger than Frieren, Fern maybe but I wouldn't bet on him given how much magic has advanced since his prime. |
ZarutakuFeb 25, 2024 6:23 AM
*kappa* |
| Hell nah you're delusional af |
 |
| Impossible to answer this without spoiling, since himmel wasnt even shown fighting at all |
| Fern maybe but Feieren has well over 1000 years of experience, not to mention, he wasn't even fated to be the legendary hero |
Reply to ZXEAN
@Saphhh I mean everyone seems to remember him more than Frieren and I think he was the leader of their group as well.
| @ZXEAN to be the leader or the hero who everyone remembers doesn't mean that he is the strongest. Frieren was definitely stronger but Himmel was the better leader and the one who brought all together and the one who wanted to be the hero |
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| Well I think frieren was always stronger but I don't think that the frieren when she got recruited could win against prime Himmel in a fight, since prime himmel got much much more experience in fighting than frieren at that time. but now after 20+ years of dungeons, adventuring, etc. plus her 1000+ years of being mage, there is no chance that Himmel could win a fight. But Himmel is also definitely stronger than fern, but fern will soon even be stronger than Himmel since she's also a talented mage |
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| he's not stronger but he crushes everyone when it comes to rizz😏xD |
ZXEAN said: @Saphhh I mean everyone seems to remember him more than Frieren and I think he was the leader of their group as well. Doesn't mean shit tho, we literally heard Flamma say to small Frieren that she should work in silence and not leave her name in history books. He is well known cause he is the so called ‘hero' and in all fantasy anime the hero is known by all. ‘the one who'll save the world trope’. |
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Reply to Saphhh
ZXEAN said:
@Saphhh I mean everyone seems to remember him more than Frieren and I think he was the leader of their group as well.
@Saphhh I mean everyone seems to remember him more than Frieren and I think he was the leader of their group as well.
Doesn't mean shit tho, we literally heard Flamma say to small Frieren that she should work in silence and not leave her name in history books.
He is well known cause he is the so called ‘hero' and in all fantasy anime the hero is known by all. ‘the one who'll save the world trope’.
| @Saphhh I am not a manga reader but according to @Yosakusan "Himmel was able to break an unbreakable barrier, which Frieren said she couldn't." If that's true that my assumption isn't wrong I assume. |
| He would body fern and starke currently. but idk about frieren. |
| I haven't read the manga, but from what I saw in the anime, Physical Attack > Magic Defense. Magic Attack > Physical Defense. However, Strong Will > Magic Spells (those who overcame Aura's magic) Himmel seems to be SUPER fast and obviously exceptionnally strong willed. While magic needs some charging up. The scene where Flamme obliterates 3 demons, she tells Frieren that the Demons were concealling their mana, until they knew Flamme and Frieren were mages. Which may imply that demons were concealling their mana in case they were dealing with warriors and would have resorted to surprise attack if that was the case. Does that mean that direct confrontation between fighters of Himmel's type could be at the disadvantage of mages? After all, adventurers parties seem to need different roles/classes, so it's hard to compare "strength" between them. I assume each class has a strength/weakness against an other... (the flower monster was "stronger" than everyone if it wasn't for Sein because he's a Priest immune to curses...) Just my theory, I haven't read the manga beyond where is the anime is, so I'd prefer to avoid spoilers. |
Radical_OrionFeb 24, 2024 10:14 AM
Reply to Saphhh
Hell nah you're delusional af
| @Saphhh No he isn´t. Himmel was the leader of the party that defeated the demon king. It is a very valid question. If I had to guess, I would say he would beat Fern but not Frieren just because of her vast experience. But as an anime-only viewer, I have no clue of his strength. |
| Stronger than fern? Probably, stronger than frieren though? Well probably not, though it's also a apples to oranges case as himmel and frieren fight in 2 different ways and it's very likely himmel would have counter magician capabilities, but i think it's pointless to compare them and it's entirely possible it would be a tie/they'd end up killing each other. But yeah as much as i think fern could give him a hard time, i think himmel's experience would give him the edge. |
| No, lol Himmel's entire thing is he was not "strong", he war ordinary but good natured, believed in his party members, cared for others, and was willing to work with others. It was the whole "power of bonds is the real power" thing, we even got the story itself allude to it very heavy handedly with the whole hero's sword thing. Himmel was not powerful or strong in the usual anime power level ways, he was strong and powerful via the more human, more intangible ways. But he would not have been able to hold his own against Frieren or Fern, no. |
Reply to NaoKurobane
He was stronger than Fern. Fern is not even the strongest mage in the current arc exam. Mages like Denken or Methode are way stronger.
But Himmel wouldn't win against Frieren not even in 200 years of training. Frieren is just way too OP. She was without any doubt the strongest in the party.
And yet she isn't even the strongest character in the series. Characters like Serie or Kraft are stronger than she is. And also it's kind of confirm that the demon king was stronger than Frieren (it will be quoted soon in the Anime)
But Himmel wouldn't win against Frieren not even in 200 years of training. Frieren is just way too OP. She was without any doubt the strongest in the party.
And yet she isn't even the strongest character in the series. Characters like Serie or Kraft are stronger than she is. And also it's kind of confirm that the demon king was stronger than Frieren (it will be quoted soon in the Anime)
| @NaoKurobane appreciate the spoilers friend. |
| I think Himmel in his prime would have defeated Fern, though not without problems (because magic), but not Frieren. He was a capable warrior, but several centuries of Frieren's experience, combined with her talent and skills she learnt from the legendary Flamme... Nah, I say it would've been too much for him to handle. |
Reply to joeykeys
@NaoKurobane appreciate the spoilers friend.
| @joeykeys I'm not a manga reader and I haven't caught up with the latest episodes yet, but wasn't it already implied in the show? (details down below) I don't think that @NaoKurabane's post was spoilerish. |
AdnashFeb 24, 2024 5:10 PM
Reply to Adnash
@joeykeys I'm not a manga reader and I haven't caught up with the latest episodes yet, but wasn't it already implied in the show? (details down below) I don't think that @NaoKurabane's post was spoilerish.
| @Adnash yeah, thats fair enough I guess. Since it hasn't been explicity said that they are stronger(including the demon king) I read their comment as a spoiler. I just dont like it when manga readers go on the anime forums and imply things. |
| ^ Lucky for anime-onlies, HIMmel is featless, so its all just conjecture. So far, all we really know is that Mages are like at the apex of civilization and Frieren is strong AF. |
| Keep scrolling |
joeykeys said: @Saphhh No he isn´t. Himmel was the leader of the party that defeated the demon king. It is a very valid question. If I had to guess, I would say he would beat Fern but not Frieren just because of her vast experience. But as an anime-only viewer, I have no clue of his strength. I was only talking about Frieren Even though we don't know about Himmel’s and Fern’s true strength as the anime till now hasn't clearly shown just that they are strong but we can conclude that Frieren is stronger than Himmel there's no comparison so in that context... |
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Reply to joeykeys
@Adnash yeah, thats fair enough I guess. Since it hasn't been explicity said that they are stronger(including the demon king) I read their comment as a spoiler. I just dont like it when manga readers go on the anime forums and imply things.
| @joeykeys Ye, I also don't like when manga readers barge into an anime thread to say that "actually, it's not like this, because...", and start spreading spoilers left or right, mostly without tagging them properly. I usually don't give a damn about spoilers, but it surely can be annoying to chill out with other anime only viewers and see someone flexing out of nowhere about content from the manga that might not be even adapted in the current season. Or purposely suggesting stuff, like why someone's theory is bad or good (if you know the source material, then for sure you can tell whose line of thinking is correct and whose not, lmao). Luckily, I think - however I haven't whether the previous person was familiar with the manga - the post from before was just mere guessing, judging by what the show has told so far. I wasn't that much surprised after hearing about Kraft or Serie, and like I said before, I am still yet to complete watching several episodes to be up to date. If it was, then again, I think it wasn't that much of a spoiler per se, if it wasn't explicitly mentioned in the manga in any chapter that hasn't been adapted yet. Of course, we can only wonder what could be the extent of full-power Frieren's might, same with Kraft's, Serie's or Himmel's. I feel it's not that much important for this show. Power scaling, I mean. The whole idea of the aforementioned characters being insanely strong is enough for the story to develop. Despite this series being a shounen, it's not specifically a battle-oriented one, even if it has action sequences here or there. RobertsahDHDA said: Yeah, that's a hint helpful to gauge, even with a huge margin of error, the general power level between different classes. It'd risk saying that mages who are trained enough, top warriors who are on the similar level of experience and skills (just in wielding weapons, not using magic and spells), and they top them by default (though exceptions might happen, of course).So far, all we really know is that Mages are like at the apex of civilization and Frieren is strong AF. Mizuwa said: True. I think pime Himmel would've surely lost against present time Frieren, and even Fern. Not to belittle Himmel, he was surely a capable party leader and great warrior who has accomplished great things in his life. It's just... it's kinda unfair to compare his warrior skills to mages and their spells, going by regular "what is stronger" factor. They are just too different.However, given that he never unsealed Qual and beat him by himself, this is unlikely and he would lose to present day Frieren and Fern. Frieren wouldn't be able to wield his weapon as good as him, but that doesn't make her inferior as a party member. Everyone in the party have their role and need to fit it, for the sake of the whole party itself. |
| I'm surprised to see this kind of discussion around this series. I guess nothing is immuned to anime consumers ' antics. |
LG545 said: @Nikaisaka Back then Frieren was weaker then Himmel and serve artillery role + anti spell against demon magic Why she was weaker? Without fly magic she had slow mobility and without defence spell she was very vulnerable in close combat Yeah that’s what I meant. Frieren couldn’t win a fight. But still her raw power was stronger than that from Himmel. |
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Reply to LG545
Radical_Orion said:
I haven't read the manga, but from what I saw in the anime, Physical Attack > Magic Defense. Magic Attack > Physical Defense. However, Strong Will > Magic Spells (those who overcame Aura's magic)
I haven't read the manga, but from what I saw in the anime, Physical Attack > Magic Defense. Magic Attack > Physical Defense. However, Strong Will > Magic Spells (those who overcame Aura's magic)
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Nope. OVERWHELMING physical attack > Magic Defence
Universal Defence magic DESIGN to counter physical attacks from monsters and Warriors. You basicly need to threw a mountain in order to break this shield (which is possible to do for mages but hard to achieve for Warriors)
| @LG545 Yeah I forgot about that Richter explanation, but what about special attacks like Stark's Lightning Strike, that split mountains in half? That seems like some overwhelming blunt force! |
ProteccAkane said: No, lol Himmel's entire thing is he was not "strong", he war ordinary but good natured, believed in his party members, cared for others, and was willing to work with others. It was the whole "power of bonds is the real power" thing, we even got the story itself allude to it very heavy handedly with the whole hero's sword thing. Himmel was not powerful or strong in the usual anime power level ways, he was strong and powerful via the more human, more intangible ways. But he would not have been able to hold his own against Frieren or Fern, no. He was definitely stronger than fern since fern still lacks many many amount on experience. And not being able to lift the legendary sword doesn’t mean you are weak but just that you are not him. You have to be strong to be able to be the leader of the party who defeated the demon king. He wasn’t the strongest but definitely strong. |
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