| I feel like there’s so many shows I enjoy, but this tends to happen in a lot of shonen, but not specific to. (Which is why I tend to avoid them, because it’s a more frequent trend in that category.) Shows like: Naruto Hunter x Hunter (Currently watching and maybe only the beginning is like this.) Some Isekai anime (I’m very forgetful on the names of some anime, I’ll binge on a whim.) Fairy tale Some story arcs or villains will be introduced as some horrible, no morals, balls to wall straight incarnate of evil, and maybe even kill a few of the MC’s friends/ acquaintances. You would expect there to be a great fight with some grit since everything is at stake, but then the MC just flat out forgives them and spends half the episode trying to persuade the villain to be a better person. I don’t know, but it kills a lot of the shows for me. It doesn’t seem realistic ( I know it’s anime, far from realism. Come on though not everything gets resolved peacefully.) I wish some shows would just let the villain be a villain and leave it at that. Tired of shows getting me to hate a villain just for them to get off easier than some of the people they killed. It’s not that I’m a negative person, but I don’t watch an action show to get a lesson on the power of friendship in every other series. Just had to go on a little rant about it. Edit: I’m posting this thread as a rant of my own opinion and wondering what other people think about the subject. I did not intend to start an argumentative thread. If you want to be toxic go do it somewhere else. |
ValderunJan 30, 2021 4:45 PM
| “Hunter x Hunter having power of friendship” -_- |
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Tendo_GM said: So far that’s what it seems like. I am currently watching it though so no spoilers.“Hunter x Hunter having power of friendship” -_- |
| Your not alone. It's cool in the first few shows you watch but after a while it get's spoiled. Things become way too predictable and boring. Like they say, too much of anything is bad for you. |
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| I watch a few anime and the power of friendship thingy exist everywhere tbh The last anime that I've seen other than ongoing shows that have that is Symphogear. So yeah, it's really a frequent thing for anime in general. I kinda agree with your opinion because a lot of shows that I put on 10/10 are shows that are not dependent on power of friendship. But it's not like I hate it or anything. Despite the power of friendship, Symphogear for me is pretty good. |
 I wasted all my time in rewatching to the point of my rewatch total is higher than my overall anime total lmao |
ren0080 said: Yeah I agree with you, I still enjoy other aspects of the shows. It’s just something that really rubs me the wrong way lol, like what was all that training and preparation for? Might as well have went to school and got a degree in psychology so you can defeat your enemies with therapy.I watch a few anime and the power of friendship thingy exist everywhere tbh The last anime that I've seen other than ongoing shows that have that is Symphogear. So yeah, it's really a frequent thing for anime in general. I kinda agree with your opinion because a lot of shows that I put on 10/10 are shows that are not dependent on power of friendship. But it's not like I hate it or anything. Despite the power of friendship, Symphogear for me is pretty good. |
| Shounen's demographic is targeted towards younger audiences, as in they have interests that are different from older audiences. Imagine looking at Thomas and Friends or Paw Patrol and putting that at the standard of a more mature show you've seen then complaining about it. |
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Valderun said: oh, the original.... -_-Tendo_GM said: So far that’s what it seems like. I am currently watching it though so no spoilers.“Hunter x Hunter having power of friendship” -_- Just watch the 2011 better version and there will be no power of friendship (and there will be something far more different) |
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| You're absolutely not alone, I see lots of complaints or people make fun of the trope all the time. I don't share your opinion, but I'm also not a big fan of action anime. |
Bloomberry said: Yeah, which is why I avoid them. Even with your whimsical point you were trying to make it’s still common in anime as a whole, in a lot of categories. Go get your kicks in another thread.Shounen's demographic is targeted towards younger audiences, as in they have interests that are different from older audiences. Imagine looking at Thomas and Friends or Paw Patrol and putting that at the standard of a more mature show you've seen then complaining about it. |
Bloomberry said: Shounen's demographic is targeted towards younger audiences, as in they have interests that are different from older audiences. Imagine looking at Thomas and Friends or Paw Patrol and putting that at the standard of a more mature show you've seen then complaining about it. That's kinda an extreme because shonen still is more teen oriented mainly towards those in their late teens. You also just have titles aimed at the upper and lower echelons of the age group since 12-18 are signififcantly different. Secondly I will say I don't think it's just purely shows aimed at kids to instill good morals of forgiveness etc. It might come from partially Japan's own history and how they dealt with the aftermath of the war. I mean even in say war dramas like Gundam where the MC doesn't exactly forgive his opponent there is a lot of time spent to get you to sympathize with guys like Zeon despite dropping a side on Earth and killing billions of people. That isn't even a bad thing but the reason why battle shonen do that is for the same reason. Regardless it depends on execution I wouldn't say this is power of friendship trope nor is it a bad trope inherently. OP I think you are mistaking two different tropes here. Power of Friendship is when characters get power boosts to overcome obstacles due to their bonds with their friends you aren't talking about that here. There are times where I agree it makes no sense for characters to seek redemption. You don't have to seek pure revenge to understand that someone is a danger to you and society and they need to be restrained or if not killed. |
BilboBaggins365Jan 30, 2021 2:23 PM
| Oh man... something tells me OP would hate some amount of the magical girl genre then lol... I mean, I feel like the examples I've seen in that genre at least make some of these forgiven villains a bit more morally gray before main characters forgive, but... On-topic: Dunno, I feel like I haven't seen enough examples with this since I haven't seen/read a lot of shounen... so no opinion on this I guess. |
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| Yeah thats part of what I call childish writing. Does not exist only in shounen battle anime btw. |
| HxH? Power of friendship? Nice joke. |
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Tendo_GM said: I’ll take your word for it and give 2011 a shot thanks 👍Valderun said: oh, the original.... -_-So far that’s what it seems like. I am currently watching it though so no spoilers. Just watch the 2011 better version and there will be no power of friendship (and there will be something far more different) |
Valderun said: Bloomberry said: Yeah, which is why I avoid them. Even with your whimsical point you were trying to make it’s still common in anime as a whole, in a lot of categories. Go get your kicks in another thread.Shounen's demographic is targeted towards younger audiences, as in they have interests that are different from older audiences. Imagine looking at Thomas and Friends or Paw Patrol and putting that at the standard of a more mature show you've seen then complaining about it. Yes, yes. My bad. You giving JJK KNY, the PINNACLE of shounen a 10/10 means you're trying to avoid it. Seeing you can't back your own points, this topic is on ignore. |
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BilboBaggins365 said: Yes, I’m not making a point to say violence is the answer to everything. I agree it depends on how it is executed, but I hate to see it being overused in many shows and especially when the villain is consciously doing wrong with no regret of what they have done what so ever.Bloomberry said: Shounen's demographic is targeted towards younger audiences, as in they have interests that are different from older audiences. Imagine looking at Thomas and Friends or Paw Patrol and putting that at the standard of a more mature show you've seen then complaining about it. That's kinda an extreme because shonen still is more teen oriented mainly towards those in their late teens. You also just have titles aimed at the upper and lower echelons of the age group since 12-18 are signififcantly different. Secondly I will say I don't think it's just purely shows aimed at kids to instill good morals of forgiveness etc. It might come from partially Japan's own history and how they dealt with the aftermath of the war. I mean even in say war dramas like Gundam where the MC doesn't exactly forgive his opponent there is a lot of time spent to get you to sympathize with guys like Zeon despite dropping a side on Earth and killing billions of people. That isn't even a bad thing but the reason why battle shonen do that is for the same reason. Regardless it depends on execution I wouldn't say this is power of friendship trope. There are times where I agree it makes no sense for characters to seek redemption. You don't have to seek pure revenge to understand that someone is a danger to you and society and they need to be restrained or if not killed. |
Bloomberry said: I watch what my friends recommend, because I try to keep an open mind lol. I do enjoy some of them too. Have a great day anyways!Valderun said: Yeah, which is why I avoid them. Even with your whimsical point you were trying to make it’s still common in anime as a whole, in a lot of categories. Go get your kicks in another thread. Yes, yes. My bad. You giving JJK KNY, the PINNACLE of shounen a 10/10 means you're trying to avoid it. Seeing you can't back your own points, this topic is on ignore. |
| have you considered reading the synopsis before watching an anime? and checking the tags? |
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2077 said: Currently watching and so far there’s been a few cases of it here and thereyeah, lots of shounen series suffer from the "the power of friendship" trope. imo its not necessarily a bad trope but if its overused then it can ruin a series. not sure why you put hunter x hunter there though... |
| Well, power of friendship, if done right, can be absolutely beautiful. Like for example, Black Clover and KnY are shows that utilizes Power of friendship in such ways that they aren't the usual "power of friendshjp" where the mc sees their friends get hurt then they one shot the enemy because mc angry. The way BC and KnY does their way is that, they utilizes their MC's weaknesses (Asta being Magicless and Tanjirou being a human) against the enemies that are far stronger than they are. They use the MC's friends not as a power scaling tools for the MC, but as genuine support in order to beat the enemies. They do it in such ways that the only thing you can call this power of friendship of theirs is called Teamwork. And that's beautiful for a shounen action series. Though KnY is perfect for this just because they actually kill the enemies, not sparing them for some bullshit nakama shits. |
| I wasted all my time in rewatching to the point of my rewatch total is higher than my overall anime total lmao |
| Small doses for me is fine but generally I find is nauseating when there is a lot of it. I debated watching Fairy Tail but kept sounding like it would be too much for me |
| Yes, Dragon Ball went downhill the very moment Goku chose to forgive Piccolo. Piccolo had so far been characterized as sadistic and irredeemable: evil incarnate. The Oniisama e anime also had a stupid redemption arc that wasn't in the manga. This was after they gave her a bunch of filler scenes that made her look even more villainous. Easily the anime's worst character. The "power of friendship" also made it harder to write tragic scenes without bending over backwards. Which is crucial for a melodrama such as Oniisama e. Osamu Dezaki was a terrible director. |
LucifrostJan 30, 2021 3:03 PM
| その目だれの目？ |
ren0080 said: I thoroughly enjoyed KnY. If it’s executed well enough I agree it’s nice to have, but yeah I despise the ol angry one shot with no explanation lol.Well, power of friendship, if done right, can be absolutely beautiful. Like for example, Black Clover and KnY are shows that utilizes Power of friendship in such ways that they aren't the usual "power of friendshjp" where the mc sees their friends get hurt then they one shot the enemy because mc angry. The way BC and KnY does their way is that, they utilizes their MC's weaknesses (Asta being Magicless and Tanjirou being a human) against the enemies that are far stronger than they are. They use the MC's friends not as a power scaling tools for the MC, but as genuine support in order to beat the enemies. They do it in such ways that the only thing you can call this power of friendship of theirs is called Teamwork. And that's beautiful for a shounen action series. Though KnY is perfect for this just because they actually kill the enemies, not sparing them for some bullshit nakama shits. |
jisatsu- said: Hopefully, It most likely will. My friends that recommended it said the arcs get better further into the series.keep in mind that a really large part of shounen anime and manga's target is elementary-middle school students, so ofc the "unrealistic" parts of an anime go over their heads. the power of friendship is kind of a plot armor that protects the main characters in a lot of shounens, its a big cliche and it can be pretty annoying sometimes. hxh focuses a lot on gon and killuas relationship & the development of their friendship, but i wouldnt really say theres "the power of friendship" protecting the characters from villains or anything. you'll probably change your mind once you finish it |
Valderun said: ren0080 said: I thoroughly enjoyed KnY. If it’s executed well enough I agree it’s nice to have, but yeah I despise the ol angry one shot with no explanation lol.Well, power of friendship, if done right, can be absolutely beautiful. Like for example, Black Clover and KnY are shows that utilizes Power of friendship in such ways that they aren't the usual "power of friendshjp" where the mc sees their friends get hurt then they one shot the enemy because mc angry. The way BC and KnY does their way is that, they utilizes their MC's weaknesses (Asta being Magicless and Tanjirou being a human) against the enemies that are far stronger than they are. They use the MC's friends not as a power scaling tools for the MC, but as genuine support in order to beat the enemies. They do it in such ways that the only thing you can call this power of friendship of theirs is called Teamwork. And that's beautiful for a shounen action series. Though KnY is perfect for this just because they actually kill the enemies, not sparing them for some bullshit nakama shits. Well, once you get around to my experience, you can't help but see a lot of those shows you're talking about. There'll be a lot of shounen that will let their mouth do the talking instead of their fists. Not just in shounen, but in action anime in particular. But yeah, don't mind about that too much. Or be like me who gave up in action and tried every single genre out there lmao(except yaoi... still need that one step of courage in order to start watching yaoi) |
| I wasted all my time in rewatching to the point of my rewatch total is higher than my overall anime total lmao |
ren0080 said: Yeah, I’ve definitely strayed from the niche category I originally watched when I first started anime. I used to never watch Slice of Life, now I enjoy quite a few of them. I’ve never heard of yaoi lol lowkey scared to look it up xDValderun said: I thoroughly enjoyed KnY. If it’s executed well enough I agree it’s nice to have, but yeah I despise the ol angry one shot with no explanation lol. Well, once you get around to my experience, you can't help but see a lot of those shows you're talking about. There'll be a lot of shounen that will let their mouth do the talking instead of their fists. Not just in shounen, but in action anime in particular. But yeah, don't mind about that too much. Or be like me who gave up in action and tried every single genre out there lmao(except yaoi... still need that one step of courage in order to start watching yaoi) |
Valderun said: ren0080 said: Yeah, I’ve definitely strayed from the niche category I originally watched when I first started anime. I used to never watch Slice of Life, now I enjoy quite a few of them. I’ve never heard of yaoi lol lowkey scared to look it up xDWell, once you get around to my experience, you can't help but see a lot of those shows you're talking about. There'll be a lot of shounen that will let their mouth do the talking instead of their fists. Not just in shounen, but in action anime in particular. But yeah, don't mind about that too much. Or be like me who gave up in action and tried every single genre out there lmao(except yaoi... still need that one step of courage in order to start watching yaoi) Basically, yaoi is gay shit. Of course there are a lot of actual good yaoi anime that came out (like Banana fish, Free, or some shits like that) but I didn't watch any of them except for like Hakata Tonkotsu Ramens which in a way, kinda yaoi but since the other guy crossdress, he ain't gay looking. I'm not stranger to yaoi since ngl, I read a lot of doujins of yaoi (mainly someone like Astolfo from FGO) but I still can't imagine myself sitting through and watching a full season of yaoi anime. I just can't lmao |
| I wasted all my time in rewatching to the point of my rewatch total is higher than my overall anime total lmao |
ren0080 said: Oooh alright yeah doesn’t really bother me actually I watched Banana Fish I thought it was pretty good.Valderun said: Yeah, I’ve definitely strayed from the niche category I originally watched when I first started anime. I used to never watch Slice of Life, now I enjoy quite a few of them. I’ve never heard of yaoi lol lowkey scared to look it up xD Basically, yaoi is gay shit. Of course there are a lot of actual good yaoi anime that came out (like Banana fish, Free, or some shits like that) but I didn't watch any of them except for like Hakata Tonkotsu Ramens which in a way, kinda yaoi but since the other guy crossdress, he ain't gay looking. I'm not stranger to yaoi since ngl, I read a lot of doujins of yaoi (mainly someone like Astolfo from FGO) but I still can't imagine myself sitting through and watching a full season of yaoi anime. I just can't lmao |
| Nakamaship makes people come together Nakamaship makes people do stupid things Nakamaship gives reasons to stupid decisions NAKAMA STRONG |
  . |
| Extravaganza Epoch has shown me that friendship speeches and big anime titties don't mix well. |
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| Nice of you to point that out. Yeah, the typical shounen trope always goes this path. There's always good and bad, and for some light-hearted ones, its always good triumphs over evil. This makes sense to me since, I have a strong sense of morality and if it confirms my ideas, then for me, it is a good show. There are a lot of incongruities in the world, and true, what is presented in anime in general may seemed exaggerated or far-fetched but still as these ideas are much like grounded of how society is there is still some truths in the message they present. The power of nakama. Very cliche, very dramatic, very romantic. But it exist. In real life sense, thats what you call unconditional positive regard. That UPR is a skill I learned while dealing with people. And it works, people are social creatures. We need to belong, we need to feel accepted, and most of our traumas, our issues stems from haviing a lack of this. If a person gives UPR to a troubled person then they might change or not. Villians become villains because they did something bad and they have some issues with themselves, the protagonists tries to challenge their issues by giving them UPR. Making them feel accepted or loved. That's true in life. |
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| Fairy Tail has way worse problems than the friendship powerups people complain about so much. |
| Your rant seems to me about forgiving villains rather than about power of friendship, but that's shonen for you anyways, it's more or less about teaching kids those values. Watch JoJo, I think you gonna like it. |
TheBerserker said: Well yeah, you can say that I'm not extremely articulate when putting my thoughts into words, but yes I don't like when a protagonist tries to befriend a blatantly evil villain. I did enjoy JoJo ty for the recommendation. I thought I put it on my list.Your rant seems to me about forgiving villains rather than about power of friendship, but that's shonen for you anyways, it's more or less about teaching kids those values. Watch JoJo, I think you gonna like it. |
| Yes, you're the first and only one....over 50 years of Animation and Storytelling have peaked in your opinion. Thanks for enlightening us, I'm sure noone ever thought about this Topic. I sure haven't. I was always just like "Damn, this Power-Up is cool and totally makes sense, too" ...Not. Jesus. That Thread exist's like soooo many times already, here on MaL alone. Let alone in the Web. Also ...It's funny you're critiquing mostly Isekai and Shonen Anime falling into this whole "Power of Friendship" trope. Really? These are the two Genres that are MADE for this sort of Story-Device. (Even tho, your opinion about HxH is plain bs) That's like going to McDonalds, demanding Lobster. You're like any other Teen who thinks he's seen through it all, while stating something painfully obvious. Not every thought you have is some kind of genius idea noone ever had before, kay?^^ |
 |
| Shonen caters to a particular demographic : primarily teens and kids. With that, they help re-enforce positive, easy to digest moral messages that anyone and their mom can understand and get onboard with. It's why it's an overused trope within that anime that target that demographic; because it's effective and keeps people engaged in the series. |
xenosysJan 30, 2021 5:28 PM
Bunsuke said: HXH POWER OF FRIENDSHIP HAHAHAHAHA It is. Gon is friends with killua and becomes OP. |
Merve2Love said: You alright? Hahaha I'm new to MAL so your veteran experience is so humbling. Anyways have a nice day hope it gets better pal!Yes, you're the first and only one....over 50 years of Animation and Storytelling have peaked in your opinion. Thanks for enlightening us, I'm sure noone ever thought about this Topic. I sure haven't. I was always just like "Damn, this Power-Up is cool and totally makes sense, too" ...Not. Jesus. That Thread exist's like soooo many times already, here on MaL alone. Let alone in the Web. Also ...It's funny you're critiquing mostly Isekai and Shonen Anime falling into this whole "Power of Friendship" trope. Really? These are the two Genres that are MADE for this sort of Story-Device. (Even tho, your opinion about HxH is plain bs) That's like going to McDonalds, demanding Lobster. You're like any other Teen who thinks he's seen through it all, while stating something painfully obvious. Not every thought you have is some kind of genius idea noone ever had before, kay?^^ |
Bunsuke said: Crucify me all you want lol, my opinion will probably change when I get further into the series.HXH POWER OF FRIENDSHIP HAHAHAHAHA |
xenosys said: True, most of my irl friends that recommend me them are not teens anymore, but maybe they watched it when they were not too long ago.Shonen caters to a particular demographic : primarily teens and kids. With that, they help re-enforce positive, easy to digest moral messages that anyone and their mom can understand and get onboard with. It's why it's an overused trope within that anime that target that demographic; because it's effective and keeps people engaged in the series. |
Valderun said: Merve2Love said: You alright? Hahaha I'm new to MAL so your veteran experience is so humbling. Anyways have a nice day hope it gets better pal!Yes, you're the first and only one....over 50 years of Animation and Storytelling have peaked in your opinion. Thanks for enlightening us, I'm sure noone ever thought about this Topic. I sure haven't. I was always just like "Damn, this Power-Up is cool and totally makes sense, too" ...Not. Jesus. That Thread exist's like soooo many times already, here on MaL alone. Let alone in the Web. Also ...It's funny you're critiquing mostly Isekai and Shonen Anime falling into this whole "Power of Friendship" trope. Really? These are the two Genres that are MADE for this sort of Story-Device. (Even tho, your opinion about HxH is plain bs) That's like going to McDonalds, demanding Lobster. You're like any other Teen who thinks he's seen through it all, while stating something painfully obvious. Not every thought you have is some kind of genius idea noone ever had before, kay?^^ Oh... you didn't knew about "Power of Friendship" , cause you're new, is what you're saying? Doubt that. Since you're using this exact term xD. Nothing to do with beeing a veteran^^ Im not. Then again ...Im not an attention-whore either. Have a nice one, friend. Hope it get's better soon. All the best. |
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Merve2Love said: I didn't browse forums or haven't before joining this site. I can rant about things I don't like and can have my own opinions. No one asked you to come in here and start trash talking people on the internet. Go be toxic somewhere else and I am having a great day thanks :)Valderun said: You alright? Hahaha I'm new to MAL so your veteran experience is so humbling. Anyways have a nice day hope it gets better pal! Oh... you didn't knew about "Power of Friendship" , cause you're new, is what you're saying? Doubt that. Since you're using this exact term xD. Nothing to do with beeing a veteran^^ Im not. Then again ...Im not an attention-whore either. Have a nice one, friend. Hope it get's better soon. All the best. |
TheFireNinja said: "The power of friendship" theme isn't really an issue for me. If it leads to interesting developments in villains motives or the story itself, then I'm all for it. I don't think there's anything wrong with feeling sympathy for villains since not all people are "good" or "bad." If they were just evil for the sake of being evil, then they would be one-dimensional. Therefore, they wouldn't feel realistic. TheFireNinja said: Yeah I would agree, I mean it wouldn't be so basic as being evil to just be evil. I just use very general situations since I don't like spoiling any other shows for anyone. The world isn't black and white I agree strongly with that, life needs a balance of both. I don't mind it if there's a development into the overall theme of the show, but I don't like when during the fight they reveal the villains past and somehow the MC knows just what to say to bring them to an epiphany. Although I also think even some real people are pretty one dimensional in their ideals and beliefs being willfully ignorant to change."The power of friendship" theme isn't really an issue for me. If it leads to interesting developments in villains motives or the story itself, then I'm all for it. I don't think there's anything wrong with feeling sympathy for villains since not all people are "good" or "bad." If they were just evil for the sake of being evil, then they would be one-dimensional. Therefore, they wouldn't feel realistic. |
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