NicoHolmes said: deep stories? Laugh out loud. Let's be real, it's all about the grim edge gore & violence. If you like character driven storytelling involving cute girls, you're a sad pedo virgin faggot (huh?). But if you like watching some crazy guy in black blow people's heads up and slice up their organs while laughing & screaming edgily, you're so sophisticates and like "deep plot."you like cute girls? burn in hell you like deep stories cool you deserve a fucking PHD |
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X3blizzard said: Most viewer like lolis cause they are cute not because they want to stick their dicks into them, not sure bout japan tho If only people would actually believe that if I told it to them. Anyone I tell that too (obviously my anime friends) always think I'm some closet rapist. |
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PeripheralVision said: Lyuze said: Liking cute things and wanting to put your dick into cute things are two completely different concepts. If you like the cute little girls for being cute, that's fine and dandy; there's absolutely nothing wrong with liking cute things. Liking the little girl because you want to have sex with it is not okay. Lolisi come from the Moe boom. Lolis are moe, thus lolis are included on a large scale. Most fans of lolis don't want to stick their dicks in them, they want to adopt them and be overly parenting to them. It is essentially no different than rabbits or bunnies. But that's just outright horseshit. The word "loli" is taken from "lolicon" which, according to Wikipedia, is Japanese discourse or media focusing on the attraction to young or prepubescent girls. When discussing "loli" you're discussing sexualized young girls in Japanese media. The very word "lolicon" is coined from the novel "Lolita" which is about a middle aged man who wants to bone his 12 year old step-daughter. I don't refer to Rin in Usagi Drop as a "loli" because she's not sexualized, despite being a 6 year old girl. I would however refer to Rin from Kodomo no Jikan as a loli, because her entire existance based on pandering to "lolicon." When you're discussing "loli" you're not referring to all young girls in general, you're referring to the ones who are sexualized. |
| another thing that gives anime a bad rep is people who don't watch it and are quick to judge people "why would a teenager spend all their time at home watching shows?" is just an absurd question |
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KazuyaKujo said: another thing that gives anime a bad rep is people who don't watch it and are quick to judge people "why would a teenager spend all their time at home watching shows?" is just an absurd question It's not really so absurd a question. As much as I really, really, really love anime; it's completely ridiculous to dedicate all of your free time to Asian cartoons to the detriment of your real life relationships and experiences. I'm not saying that spending a large chunk of your time dedicated to anime is bad, but it's terrible that there are people who do nothing but watch anime and are incapable of seeing any problem with that. |
| Loli is a body type too. Konata is commonly called a loli despite being 17. |
| Anime fans give anime a bad reputation. |
הלב שלי כבר מת |
| What doesn't give anime a bad reputation? Cynics will use any excuse to hate on anime. In fact, I'm willing to bet true cynics don't even know about loli/shotacon (or at least, not what it actually means), or even about incestuous undertones. The most comments I've heard say that it's either too violent, too childish, or that it has too much sex in it. |
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Lyuze said: I sense a hint of "loli is only for little girls whose treatment I disapprove of" here. Let's compare the two mangas: I don't refer to Rin in Usagi Drop as a "loli" because she's not sexualized, despite being a 6 year old girl. I would however refer to Rin from Kodomo no Jikan as a loli, because her entire existance based on pandering to "lolicon." And as far as the lolicon fanbase is concerned, author/animator intent is largely irrelevant. After all, Cardcaptor Sakura was mostly an innocent kids' show, yet Sakura Kinomoto is one of the most iconic lolis out there. Of course, any popular child character in Western animation gets plenty of Rule34 attention as well, but mainstream media don't play it up because it's a lot easier/safer to generate ratings and clicks by ragging on exotic foreign media and its supposedly deviant fanbase. |
| only if people keep talking about it |
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| that depends what group of people think |
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Fierce_Deity22 said: YES they give anime a horrible reputation they need to go away ASAP. Its already hard enough to get people into anime. Trying to find person number 16. Those things is the definition of trash. Do you know nothing of profit or managing an industry? Taking out key fetishes will lose the company money and anyway, who cares if its hard getting people into anime? |
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| I didn't even know of the existence of 'Things like lolicon/shotacon and incest' within anime until I actually got into the fandom. Not many people outside of the fandom really know much about that stuff. What gave me a bad impression of anime fans was their weird obsession with kid centric action shows and dumb gorefests. |
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PeripheralVision said: I don't care for people who thinks lolicon is bad. I dislike most conservative moral crusaders anyway. Really, we should only ban stuff that is known to cause harm in society, instead of going on a witch hunt. But you care for people who think about fucking loli characters mmm okay :^/ |
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| Anime is shit and only lolicon can save it. |
Rance-sama said: Anime is shit and only lolicon can save it.  |
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| That could be true. Being a lolicon is certainly looked down upon. Unfortunately, I am a lolicon and a shotacon, so I have a vested interested in it staying a part of anime culture. Edit: Lyuze said: Liking cute things and wanting to put your dick into cute things are two completely different concepts. If you like the cute little girls for being cute, that's fine and dandy; there's absolutely nothing wrong with liking cute things. Liking the little girl because you want to have sex with it is not okay. Can't adults be cute? To me, loli and shota are body types. It's uncommon for adults to have certain kinds of cuteness, but there are still adults who look that way. And this is going to become more common with technology exponentially increasing and more cosmetic surgeries appearing. Some people, like me, just aren't really attracted to secondary sex characteristics. And cuteness is sexy. But that doesn't mean we want to hurt anybody. My response to my sexuality and my gender identity, is to use future technology to become a loli myself. |
FairyTechnologyJan 5, 2015 7:55 AM
PeripheralVision said: Would you want your daughter near that man though? Or even alone with and supervising any child for that matter?Oni_Link said: But you care for people who think about fucking loli characters mmm okay :^/ And they cause harm by....wanting to bone virtual girls. Okay. I should care why? It's not like they want to bone a real one. Besides, even if a guy did want to bone my daughter, that's his business. There's no problem if he keeps it in his pants and leave my daughter alone. If he has the self control, than I will respect his decision to seek or not seek therapy. |
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FairyTechnology said: Yes , of course. Can't adults be cute?  |
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| She does have a cute face. I'm guessing if she had a more androgynous body, people would call her a loli. |
FairyTechnology said: The only way she would be called a loli is if she looked like a little girl.She does have a cute face. I'm guessing if she had a more androgynous body, people would call her a loli. |
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| I get the feeling that people would think she looked like a little girl if she didn't have boobs. Though, to be honest, I have never heard of a single flat chested female anime character who wasn't called a loli. |
FairyTechnology said: I seriously doubt that considering her height. Characters like Mayumi , Riruka and Rukia are flat chested yet they are not seen as lolis. Lolis are little girls so that's why they tend to be flat chested.I get the feeling that people would think she looked like a little girl if she didn't have boobs. Though, to be honest, I have never heard of a single flat chested female anime character who wasn't called a loli. |
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DrGeroCreation said: Characters like Mayumi , Riruka and Rukia are flat chested yet they are not seen as lolis. I suppose that depends on who you ask. Rukia is totally a loli to me. |
FairyTechnology said: You are the only person I have heard refer to her as a loli. Kenpachi's vice captain Yachiru is a loli not Rukia. Rukia is just short and petite.DrGeroCreation said: Characters like Mayumi , Riruka and Rukia are flat chested yet they are not seen as lolis. I suppose that depends on who you ask. Rukia is totally a loli to me. |
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| Well, that's interesting. I'm not the only person I have heard refer to Rukia as a loli. |
FairyTechnology said: Those people probably think every female character that is short is automatically a loli, which is obviously not true.Well, that's interesting. I'm not the only person I have heard refer to Rukia as a loli. |
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| The thing about words, is that they evolve. Loli or Lolita also describe a cute, girly, frilly, childlike fashion style. But it doesn't have anything to do with pedophilia or sexualizing children. The term moe has done the same thing, it's very broad in its meaning. They're umbrella terms. |
FairyTechnology said: So you are telling me that loli has evolved to mean any female anime character that is short? That is news to me.The thing about words, is that they evolve. Loli or Lolita also describe a cute, girly, frilly, childlike fashion style. But it doesn't have anything to do with pedophilia or sexualizing children. The term moe has done the same thing, it's very broad in its meaning. |
DrGeroCreationJan 5, 2015 3:24 PM
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DrGeroCreation said: im with gero's_abomination on this that would be news to me as wellFairyTechnology said: So you are talling me that loli has evolved to mean any female anime character that is short? That is news to me.The thing about words, is that they evolve. Loli or Lolita also describe a cute, girly, frilly, childlike fashion style. But it doesn't have anything to do with pedophilia or sexualizing children. The term moe has done the same thing, it's very broad in its meaning. |
DrGeroCreation said: So you are talling me that loli has evolved to mean any female anime character that is short? That is news to me. Mmmm... moreso flat chested. But both certainly helps. The more childlike features she has, the more likely people are going to consider her a loli. Loli is pretty synonymous with DFC in the West right now, though. But a cute, childlike face, or being short will certainly add to that. Hips, too. They're similar to breasts. In that they're a secondary sex characteristic. A woman with androgynous hips is probably going to be seen as more loli. |
FairyTechnology said: Rukia has no childlike features at all, she is just short and petite. Lolis to me were always little girl characters not female characters that are short and flat chested.DrGeroCreation said: So you are talling me that loli has evolved to mean any female anime character that is short? That is news to me. Mmmm... moreso flat chested. But both certainly helps. The more childlike features she has, the more likely people are going to consider her a loli. Loli is pretty synonymous with DFC in the West right now, though. But a cute, childlike face, or being short will certainly add to that. Hips, too. They're similar to breasts. In that they're a secondary sex characteristic. A woman with androgynous hips is probably going to be seen as more loli. |
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DrGeroCreation said: Rukia has no childlike features at all, she is just short and petite. Lolis to me were always little girl characters not female characters that are short and flat chested. Um, I don't know how to say this. But being short and flat chested are childlike features. It's possible for adult women to have childlike features like that. |
FairyTechnology said: DrGeroCreation said: Rukia has no childlike features at all, she is just short and petite. Lolis to me were always little girl characters not female characters that are short and flat chested. Um, I don't know how to say this. But being short and flat chested are childlike features. It's possible for adult women to have childlike features like that. Childlike =!= child For the sake of debate, words must be used by their literal definitions. If everybody argued with their own personal ideas of what words mean, discussion would be... Well... MAL threads. The literal definition of lolicon is "Japanese discourse or media focusing on the attraction to young or prepubescent girls." Now, there's a difference between liking lolicon and liking petite body types. It's lolicon as a concept that's sickening. The idea of having sex with a child is what disturbs other people. If the person just looks rather young but they're of age and perfectly capable of receiving vaginal penetration, then that's cool. But having sex with someone who is clearly not of age and clearly not prepared to take a dick is disgusting. Again, there's a large difference between liking petite bodies and liking children. |
Lyuze said: Childlike =!= child Loli =!= child Lyuze said: For the sake of debate, words must be used by their literal definitions. If everybody argued with their own personal ideas of what words mean, discussion would be... Well... MAL threads. The literal definition of lolicon is "Japanese discourse or media focusing on the attraction to young or prepubescent girls." There are no permanent "literal" definitions of words. All words evolve. Loli and Lolicon, even, are new terms, without a long history of standing, unaltered usage. If there were to be any words with a stable definition, loli and lolicon would not be among them. Words are defined by the people who use them. And a large portion of people who use the term, mean loli to mean nothing more than a body type. Lyuze said: Again, there's a large difference between liking petite bodies and liking children. That's true, but there isn't a large difference between liking petite bodies, and being a lolicon. |
FairyTechnology said: Lyuze said: Childlike =!= child Loli =!= child Lyuze said: For the sake of debate, words must be used by their literal definitions. If everybody argued with their own personal ideas of what words mean, discussion would be... Well... MAL threads. The literal definition of lolicon is "Japanese discourse or media focusing on the attraction to young or prepubescent girls." There are no permanent "literal" definitions of words. All words evolve. Loli and Lolicon, even, are new terms, without a long history of standing, unaltered usage. If there were to be any words with a stable definition, loli and lolicon would not be among them. Yes, there are literal definitions. We have dictionaries for a reason, it's why we can form cohesive sentences. When you're debating, you can't argue with your personal opinion of what a word means, you have to use their current definition whether you agree with it or not. I think "execution" means "getting bullied." How well do you think I'd do at a debate about capital punishment? Whether you like it or not, the current definitions of loli and lolicon are explicitly related to the sexualization of young/prepubescent girls. That definition may change in the future, none of us can predict that. But as of now, at this moment in time, during this discussion, in this MAL thread, the definition of lolicon is "Japanese discourse or media focusing on the attraction to young or prepubescent girls." |
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