Re:Zero kara Hajimeru Isekai Seikatsu 2nd Season Episode 6 Discussion

mozgow said:
I did not expect anyone will mention arc 1 here. Nice job recalling that (or did you re-watch arc 1 ?)
What Elsa said back then (it was translated as "So you're one of them") will make sense once you learn who hired her.

This one will also make sense once it is revealed who hired her.

Rob7 said:
The disbalance of abilities in Re:Zero remembers this parody of Avengers:

Nieznajomy43 said:
It will also explain how she knew word "hikikomori"/"shut-in"??

mozgow said:
I think yes, but it's more "why Emilia did not know that word?" thing.

whitehat43 said:
Subaru: I Just Wanna Die..

Opens beatrice room..

WTF..

Nurguburu said:
Beatrice saved Subaru but Petra and maybe Frederica and Ram are dead. Pretty cool Frederica transformation. I think that Subaru is going to die after talking with Beatrice, here we go again buddy.

Raon said:
@Rob7 there's something that's really bugging me with you're post. But even what I want to say could be considered a spoiler so .... ahhhhhh .... I have to remain silent.

Rob7 said:


Really thanks Raon, but can you not pretend that you don't know the next events?

I always do it when i am discussing in topics of an anime that i already know what is going to happen (usually by reading the manga, since i'm not a fan of novels).


Novel-readers actually CAN help anime-onlies to enjoy the show without to openly of subtly spoiling the truth.

- By just highlighting PAST scenes, facts or dialogues already exhibited in the anime, without confirming or denying theories.


An example of a good "no-spoiler": when the users put a foreshadow mark in Puck's speech at episode 1 "Subaru, take care of Lia in my place".

Nobody would pay attention in this phrase, and the hell, even paying now it don't means much, but i'm sure when the time comes, we will be "OHHHHH, so was that".



Now a bad, a failed "no-spoiler-but-actually-spoiling": "No, your theory is WRONG because you should pay attention on..." WTF man, it is already spoiler.

Or: "All this will be explained when Subaru meets ------" What, so he will meet that person, and this person will reveals things about this question? COME ON


Or yet: "You should not be worried with Petra, all is going to be okay" ...now it would be an open spoiler.

(just examples)



Can you guys see the difference? All the bad "no-spoiler" is based on something that is going to happen, while the good no-spoiler just highlight what you already watched and should know, and nothing more.


I thank the users that suppress our natural desire to show ourselves as smart asses by revealing what we know about the future in the plot. It is not being smart, really.

Rob7 said:

Hey, a quote means "what i am going to comment right next to the quote is about your post BUT not all what i'm going to comment is about that post or even less about your person, for the dog'ssake"

North25 said:

Lots of top contenders this season.

Raon said:

you clearly said "can you not pretend that you don't know the next events?"

Rob7 said:


I mean, "in place of say that you must be silent to not spoiler when correcting what other user said that is wrong, you, i, we, everyone... can pretend that we are anime-only and fix it the same way, but by appointing the error based in past facts of the series".


Exactly the case, because i did a mistake about previous facts, what can be appointed without to spoiler anything.

whitehat43 said:

I'm afraid that will alter the respawn point because it was unpredictable..

ProofByColor said:
No idea why they would think they need to save Beatrice. I don't think boob assassin could find her even if she tried. Plus she's pretty fucking strong and can defend herself. Obviously Rem tho so it's whatever. Anyway the fact the Subaru can always die and restart does take away a lot of the suspense of characters dying and such, but it is a little more interesting after he survives an episode where other characters have died. I mean maaaaaybe he'll reach a save point and Petra will stay dead, but probably not.

taynis said:


Also...can Elsa even kill Beatrice?

Sury said:
For some reason I thought it was impossible for anyone but Subaru to leave the barrier. Did I miss something?

Rob7 said:



In the middle of episode 5 there is a reunion where the character Ryuzu is introduced and she re-explains that only half-blood are arrested there and what happens if they try to leave with the help of pure blood (no matter if human, demon, beast, dragon etc)

Rob7 said:

I believe that Elsa will found a way to enter in the Forbidden Library by opening all the doors of the mansion (the last one must always be Beako's place), and attack them there inside, after Subaru and Bea hava their conversation.

That is why Subaru found (in the previous timeline and this time too) all doors open in the Mansion's corridors. It is Elsa's strategy to find Beatrice.

Sury said:


Yeah, I was aware of that, though I'm not sure what qualifies people as half-blood in that series. I kinda thought it would equal demi-humans, but I guess it doesn't.

Usaka_ said:
Patrasche is male( stated in season 1 shortly after he is selected as Subaru's mount for the Subjugation of the White Whale. Petra's quich whit and decisive ness under pressure is well beyond her years and admirable.

Usaka_ said:
3. ELSA: She mentions her employer in S1 Ep 1. And again here in in this episode. Both times refusing to give any info. As for when she arrives at the mansion it could be as early as before the Witches Cult is defeated to just a moment before we see her with her knife to Petra's throat. There is no clear indication of her arrival. But she flat out tells us her orders was to kill Fredrica, Petra, and Beatrice just before Subaru's arrival. Obviously his arival 2 days early throws he entire plan off. This along with the absence of orders to kill Rem leads me to believe that her employer doesn't know Rem is there and therefore can't be Roswaal. No matter how creepy and deceitful Roswaal acts.

Usaka_ said:
****Her mention of Meili/ Maylie while spelt differently are pronounced the same. So please refrain from saying one or the other is incorrect. The latter is the English spelling while the previous is the Japanese spelling. Neither are incorrect. ****

mozgow said:
I think yes, but it's more "why Emilia did not know that word?" thing.

Mich666 said:

People are not thinking about who her actions would benefit though. It's clear her target is to invoke Subaru's RbD ability and force his developement, meaning someone else knows about it . Echidna probably knows too yet in between lines she actually portrayed all the witches, excluding Satella, as good ones. Also, judging by what Roswal told him before (he basically spelled out that he would use any means necessary to up her chances to get her on the throne and Subaru is his plot device to do that) Elsa may as well as be his right hand because she actually brought Subaru to his mansion (all according to the plan).

People should ask themselves why Subaru actually has RbD ability and who forced him into this world (disregarding the fact that everything could be just his hikkikomori fantasy and way to chhallenge himself back to normal life after he go heart-stroke IRL). In Memory Snow, while mostly non-canon, it was mentioned Emilia knows about his witch scar and that she regrets that she did something to him. Speculating further, it may be that Satella as a witch split her being into Emilia's body and Subaru's soul and whole this mess is just her way to seize the throne and get back to life. This being the case, Roswal can actually be the one who oversees her rebirth and getting them both powerful enough to break out of chain.

swordmaster2551 said:
I think that's a bit of an overreach given the info we have at this point in the story. It sounds like you're trying to be spoilery

Nieznajomy43 said:


but wouldn't Puck know this word?

Usaka_ said:

3. ELSA: She mentions her employer in S1 Ep 1. And again here in in this episode. Both times refusing to give any info. As for when she arrives at the mansion it could be as early as before the Witches Cult is defeated to just a moment before we see her with her knife to Petra's throat. There is no clear indication of her arrival. But she flat out tells us her orders was to kill Fredrica, Petra, and Beatrice just before Subaru's arrival. Obviously his arival 2 days early throws he entire plan off. This along with the absence of orders to kill Rem leads me to believe that her employer doesn't know Rem is there and therefore can't be Roswaal. No matter how creepy and deceitful Roswaal acts.

(...)
5. FREDERICA: I dont understand why so many are giving her a free pass all of a sudden. Firstly her oath is clearly hiding needed info about Elsa and/or Roswaal or some other individual. Because we find that she is willing to leave and go to sanctuary. I would think its knowledge of Elsa and possibly her oath was to her. Hopefully we find out in the next episode after Subaru resets current events. Still guilty party in my book reguardless of the fact that she seemingly sacrifices herself so the others can save Rem and Beatrice. She could very well just be upstairs hiding somewhere while the others are wiped out. But Elsa says that she killed her. So probably not. Also see # 8.

Mich666 said:

People are not thinking about who her actions would benefit though. It's clear her target is to invoke Subaru's RbD ability and force his developement, meaning someone else knows about it. Echidna probably knows too yet in between lines she actually portrayed all the witches, excluding Satella, as good ones. Also, judging by what Roswal told him before (he basically spelled out that he would use any means necessary to up her chances to get her on the throne and Subaru is his plot device to do that) Elsa may as well as be his right hand because she actually brought Subaru to his mansion (all according to the plan).

People should ask themselves why Subaru actually has RbD ability and who forced him into this world (disregarding the fact that everything could be just his hikkikomori fantasy and way to chhallenge himself back to normal life after he go heart-stroke IRL). In Memory Snow, while mostly non-canon, it was mentioned Emilia knows about his witch scar and that she regrets that she did something to him. Speculating further, it may be that Satella as a witch split her being into Emilia's body and Subaru's soul and whole this mess is just her way to seize the throne and get back to life. This being the case, Roswal can actually be the one who oversees her rebirth and getting them both powerful enough to break out of chain.

dragynfaerie said:
Sometimes I can't figure Beatrice out. What was she thinking, 'Let me sit here powerful as fuck in my library and watch everybody die except Subaru. Him, I'll save cuz we have a contract and Puck likes him.' She let Roswal's maids get killed and his castle jacked up.

Who the hell is Mylie? Is she someone I'm forgetting?

ProofByColor said:
No idea why they would think they need to save Beatrice. I don't think boob assassin could find her even if she tried. Plus she's pretty fucking strong and can defend herself. Obviously Rem tho so it's whatever. Anyway the fact the Subaru can always die and restart does take away a lot of the suspense of characters dying and such, but it is a little more interesting after he survives an episode where other characters have died. I mean maaaaaybe he'll reach a save point and Petra will stay dead, but probably not.

ChainxBastard said:
Do people not understand that Beatric would mop the floor with Elsa?

Are we forgetting when Beatrice fought Roswaal in a timed loop, who is said to be the most powerful mage in existence at this time? And I'm sure that she was fairly confident in being able to hold him off/beat him.

Rob7 said:



Hey 1st welcome to MAL, really good considerations there and thanks for adding a lot to this discussion.


The timeline of events in the loops (ANIME only) can be organized like this:

DAY 1. The night of the 1st trial (8:00 PM)
Loop 0 and Loop 1: - Here is the savingpoint, lets say, around 8:00 PM (by the end of the 1st trial), because right after the sunset they went to Echidona's Tomb, and it looks like summer season in Lugunica (we know that they have snowy winter).


DAY 1. The reunion late in the night (10:00 PM)
Loop 0 - Emilia was so shocked that she slept the whole night. Without Emilia we have the introduction of Ryuzu that explains about the Barrier.
Loop 1 - Emilia recovered earlier because Subaru conforted her the intire time after her fail. Then she also attends the meeting.


DAY 1. The reunion late in the night (11:00 PM)
Only in Loop 1: Right after the meeting with Ryuzu, Subaru have his talk with Roswaal and decides to leaves with Ram in the next morning.

DAY 2. Right after the sunrise (05:00 AM)
Loop 0 - Subaru greets Emilia when she wakes up, she grabs his arm, another nice moment erased by his death.
Loop 1 - Subaru, Patrasche and Ram are ready to leave the Sanctuary.


DAY 2. In the middle of daylight. (11AM to 14PM)
Loop 0 - Subaru and Ram are hanging the laundry and she explains to him about the opposite "factions" inside the Sanctuary.
Loop 1 - Subaru arrives at the mansion with Ram (in Light Novel we are told that the trip takes 6 hours**) and then all the shit happens (they meet Petra and Frederica, Elsa attacks, Petra dies, Subaru ends up with Beatrice and here we are now)


DAY 2. After the sunset (6:00 PM to midnight)
Loop 0 - Emilia fails again. Subaru have his meeting with Trollswaal. Subaru and Emilia dating under a starry sky (also erased, uhu).


DAY 3. OFFSCREEN
Loop 0 - Subaru convinces Garfiel to release the villagers.

DAY 4. OFFSCREEN
Loop 0 - Subaru and the villagers do the preparations to leave the Sanctuary the next morning.

DAY 5. At morning.
Loop 0 - Subaru and the villagers returns, and the trip is longer than 6 hours (since the caravan is slower than a single Land-Dragon cantering fast)

DAY 5. Before the sunset (4-5 PM)
Loop 0 - Subaru leave the people in the Village and goes to the Mansion, being killed without to see anyone other than Elsa.


It means, Elsa was near the Mansion since the first day after the savingpoint, and she could wait more 4 days there to meet Subaru. In the timelie 0, she and the Demon Beasts probably killed Petra, Frederica, Rem and Beatrice without any rush during these 4 days.

And i agree with Roswaal innocence, but Elsa problably was hired around the moment when Subaru and Emilia left the Mansion. And at that time, neither Roswaal knew about the existence of Rem. Btw, Subaru never told anything about the forgotten Rem to Roswaal. So Elsa's ignorance about Rem is not a good alibi for Ros.


**Curiosity: If Patsrache can gallop somewhat faster than a horse, but it was not in rush like when fighting the White Whale, so i think their speed was around 30 km/h.

The distance between the Mansion and Sactuary can be longer than 100km to 180km. All that in Mathers's lands.





Now, i do believe in the innocence of Furryrica. Roswaal do not is suspitious of her. Ram is not so suspitious of her and understand that she is under a silence vow. In fact, Ros and Ram just was getting along with Subaru distrusts, since it doesnt make difference in Ram's plan to discover the real culprit. Frederica is someone that is working with them for 10 years. If Subaru still distrusts her, it should be the same level as he distrusts Roswaal and the "Ros-fanatic" Ram... what is not the wrong thing to do.

Roswaal and Ram would not hesitate a 1 second to kill Emilia, and in fact we can affirm that Is intentionally ALREADY let Emilia to be killed multiple times trusting in RbD.

If Subaru and Emilia could left the Sanctuary, carry Rem's body with them and runaway from Mathers's lands to hide somewhere, that would be the safest thing to do.


-----------------------



A plot device that if WELL MADE i would love from the deep of my heart, BUT as it rearely is well made, i HATE it, is the "all according the plan".

This trope is the biggest cause for the worst and more ridiculous Plot Holes in any kind of story, because is too easy to find contradictions, and too hard to avoid it if the author did not prepared this since the beginning of the story in all its details, what is difficult in commercial works strongly influenced by the opinion of the producers or distributors.

I really hope that Tappei don't shit his work by relying on that.


That said, IF right now Roswaal don't know about the RbD, it is a plot hole, because all his actions in Arc 3 only can be based on, otherwise he would be too stupid, in absurd level.

BUT if Roswaal was directing the fate of Subaru since the MC arrived in that world, it is ALSO a plot hole, because every objective (force him to use RbD? made him obsessed with Emilia etc) at that point could have be achieved in a way a lot more objective than relying on random events and even involving Reinhard.

So for the sake of the plot, i guess Trollswaal know about RbD, but he is not the person who hired Elsa. Quite the contrary, he just is not worrried with Elsa, Petelgeuse etc because he knows about RbD.

On other hand, do Roswaal and Satella have some link?

We can safely say that Roswaal is like a Sin Archbishop of Equidna. His family is protecting (and worshiping) the place where her soul rests since generations.

We can safely say, since he admitted it, that he is an enemy of the Dragon that defeated Satella.

So, by the logic "the enemy of my enemy is my ally", so Ros and Satella could be at the same side. Even so Satella killed Equidna. Even if they are in the same side, it dont means that they are "coconspiii~rators".

Dragloncon said:


I think you misunderstood that fight

dragynfaerie said:
Who the hell is Mylie? Is she someone I'm forgetting?

ChainxBastard said:
Do people not understand that Beatric would mop the floor with Elsa?

Are we forgetting when Beatrice fought Roswaal in a timed loop, who is said to be the most powerful mage in existence at this time? And I'm sure that she was fairly confident in being able to hold him off/beat him.

Dragloncon said:

I think you misunderstood that fight

Mich666 said:

Meili, the girl with the bald dog which turned into mabeast (given her name is written with katakana - meaning it's not of japanese origin, it could be also transcripted as Mary). To avoid any future spoilers, just seek her out in episode 9 of the original season (or double-episode 5 of directors cut).