False rape accusers are finally facing punishment... and feminists don&#039;t like it.

Online

Mar 2008

48909

Rotton-Girl said:

DreamingBeats said:

"there are plenty of rapists or accused rapists that are successfull in life" argument makes as much sense as saying

"hey there's plenty of successfull people, even millionaire and billionaires who never went to college, so you can totally become one too without a degree!"

My dad actually was very poor. When I was growing up, we lived in an apartment in the poorest part of town. He now lives in a half a million dollar home. And he doesn't have a degree. How did he do it? Knowing how to type 100 words per minute in the 90's. And my dad says, you can still earn $20 an hour if you could type at least 80 words.

That depends where you live and how many positions are open. Anyway your point made no sense. All you showed is how rich and famous people get a pass easier.

Aug 30, 2017 8:59 AM

#56

LoneWolf

Offline

Aug 2009

8328

traed said:

LoneWolf said:
@traed
Apparently you read the article, but you didn't read my response. I never said the writer didn't want punishment, but rather she thought the punishment was too harsh. You're complaining about the justice system being so harsh, but why did it take 15 men getting falsely accused before they decided to act? It's these shitty rape shield laws that don't allow the system or the accused to look at the history of the victim. It's so focused on protecting the "victim" that they ignore the due process rights of the accused.

How am I playing the victim card? I just want justice to be blind to things like race, gender, religion etc. like it should. If you haven't noticed there is a massive gender sentencing gap in every single country and while it is a fact that men do commit more crimes, it does not take away from the fact that women often do far less time for the same crimes as men. As far as restorative justice and rehabilitation programs. Yes I agree there should be more, but the ones that are around are again... often targeted at women. While keeping people in prison in expensive, these programs are often more so. It would be nice if the prison system could be re hauled to actually address the root cause of the problem instead of just trying to punish people; but also if you feel like its ok to falsely accuse 15 people of the worst crime imaginable other than murder, I don't really think a rehabilitation program is going to help.

You gave that impression from how you worded it. I cant recall what it was that made me think that. A non-guilty conviction doesnt mean a person is lying it means there isn't enough evidence to prove a positive. For there to be a conviction of perjury they would have to have it proven in court it was a lie. Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence and sometimes rape victims misidentify people or it's a person that actually believes they were raped from a delusion so in those cases they aren't intentionally lying so it's nor perjury but it could be charged with defamation of character but that has to be brought forth by the victims of such circumstances.

I already outlined that. You spend too much time complaining about privilege instead of the bigger picture of what is wrong with the legal system in general that causes this and sometimes you just bring forward the notion of furthering punishment for women but that would change nothing for men. I understand it is sometimes used simply to point out things but with how you present things you leave the impression you legitimately want longer incarceration of women more than you want fairer incarceration time for men. Maybe you don't but you don't make it sound that way. It's more complicated than just male and female it also depends on how attractive they are and how they dressed when they appear in court and socioeconomic class influences appearance as well as what a person can afford for a lawyer. Courts at least try to make a jury roughly half male and half female at least though for rape and sexual assault cases so at least that seems fair. What are you basing rehabilitation and restorative justice being primarily focused on women? I'm not aware of such things. Well rehabilitation is not just a reintegration program but psychotherapy. A person would not so much likely continue if you solve the reason for their actions. Also feminism doesn't have much to do with sentencing times, that is more due to cultural conceptions and individual psychology.

Indeed it could be that they're not intentionally lying, but as @DreamingBeats pointed out there is absolutely financial incentive for accusing people of sexual assault and rape. Obviously these cases should be looked at closely to make sure the accuser is not simply misidentifying someone rather than intentionally accusing people. I think in the Beale case it was quite clear what her motives were.

I agree that the system should be looked at. There should not be this sort of financial incentive to accuse people of rape and sexual assault. The people who came up with this compensation system clearly did not think ahead about the way this could be easily abused. As far as why I'm pushing for harsher punishment, it is because I don't want to see these types of crimes occur in the future. If the legal system shows that they are serious about punishing the people that abuse it and give them harsher sentences it is a deterrent to future false accusers. It's clear that at this current time these false accusers are not facing sufficient punishment, especially if they feel like they can accuse 15 separate individuals within only 3 years and get away with it.

I agree that there shouldn't have been a way to abuse the system in this way in the first place and there should take steps to ensure that it isn't in the future, but it is also important to maintain the integrity of the legal system and show that people that abuse it and waste the resources of the public and falsely imprison innocents will not be tolerated.

As for restorative justice programs targeting women that is mostly anecdotal through my studies, so perhaps it is only relevant to Canada. Restorative justice is also prevalent among aboriginal communities, in fact they have their own separate courts called Gladue Courts here in Canada. It is something they are slowly implementing in Canada, but they are not yet focusing on the bulk of the prison population (Aboriginals do make up about 1/4 of the Canadian prison population though to be fair).

As for feminism affecting the legal system I think it is more that they are not allowing the gender sentencing to become more balanced, by pushing the women as victims narrative. Women have always received lighter sentences and have been less likely to be convicted. Ideally it should have changed by this time, but I believe the ideology is holding back the change. In this case it would be because of the rape shield laws that protect accusers.

"The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. If you try it, you will be lonely often, and sometimes frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself."
-Friedrich Nietzsche

Aug 30, 2017 9:00 AM

#57

Energetic-Nova

Offline

Jun 2011

5537

traed said:

Rotton-Girl said:

My dad actually was very poor. When I was growing up, we lived in an apartment in the poorest part of town. He now lives in a half a million dollar home. And he doesn't have a degree. How did he do it? Knowing how to type 100 words per minute in the 90's. And my dad says, you can still earn $20 an hour if you could type at least 80 words.

That depends where you live and how many positions are open. Anyway your point made no sense. All you showed is how rich and famous people get a pass easier.

I accused someone of rape, everyone took his side (because he actually raped me).

I know someone whose daughter was raped and she says even though her daughter was 15, she was accused of lying constantly by even FBI who harrassed her... until the guy was convicted. In the courtroom, not a single person was on her daughter's side other than her... And they let that guy out early on "good behavior".

I know someone else who was molested by her step brother and her father took her step brother's side.

I donno, I know more rapists who are precieved as "oh they could never!"

Oh and add on top of it my husband who was raped by his step sisters was straight up told it was his fault cause he is a guy and should have been able to fight off girls who were much older than him.

Rapists are not normally some stranger in the night... they are normally someone very close to you that your friends know and your family knows and you know their family you are so close to them... :(

I gave real examples more because I am sick of being called a liar honestly. But it is true. It seems accusing someone of rape actually does mean NOTHING. I didn't go to school because I was raped. I dropped out. Where was he? He got his degree and moved on. He is fine. I have suffered years of mental trauma and he talks about how much he loves Game of Thrones.

Energetic-NovaAug 30, 2017 9:11 AM

The anime community in a nutshell.

Aug 30, 2017 11:47 AM

#58

Online

Mar 2008

48909

Rotton-Girl said:

traed said:

Rotton-Girl said:

DreamingBeats said:

Rotton-Girl said:

-Swish said:
She deserves to be the in prison for the rest of her life. Just accusing someone of rape can ruin their life, let alone 7 years in prison. She's a disgusting human and whatever justice she gets will be too good.

I don't know what you are talking about

Here are a list of very successful people who have been accused of rape:

"there are plenty of rapists or accused rapists that are successfull in life" argument makes as much sense as saying

"hey there's plenty of successfull people, even millionaire and billionaires who never went to college, so you can totally become one too without a degree!"

My dad actually was very poor. When I was growing up, we lived in an apartment in the poorest part of town. He now lives in a half a million dollar home. And he doesn't have a degree. How did he do it? Knowing how to type 100 words per minute in the 90's. And my dad says, you can still earn $20 an hour if you could type at least 80 words.

That depends where you live and how many positions are open. Anyway your point made no sense. All you showed is how rich and famous people get a pass easier.

I accused someone of rape, everyone took his side (because he actually raped me).

I know someone whose daughter was raped and she says even though her daughter was 15, she was accused of lying constantly by even FBI who harrassed her... until the guy was convicted. In the courtroom, not a single person was on her daughter's side other than her... And they let that guy out early on "good behavior".

I know someone else who was molested by her step brother and her father took her step brother's side.

I donno, I know more rapists who are precieved as "oh they could never!"

Oh and add on top of it my husband who was raped by his step sisters was straight up told it was his fault cause he is a guy and should have been able to fight off girls who were much older than him.

Rapists are not normally some stranger in the night... they are normally someone very close to you that your friends know and your family knows and you know their family you are so close to them... :(

I gave real examples more because I am sick of being called a liar honestly. But it is true. It seems accusing someone of rape actually does mean NOTHING. I didn't go to school because I was raped. I dropped out. Where was he? He got his degree and moved on. He is fine. I have suffered years of mental trauma and he talks about how much he loves Game of Thrones.

I'm sorry that happened to you and others and I understand why that would frustrate you( for lack of better words) but that doesn't mean that allegations of rape has no impact on anyone's life, it means that some people defend the alleged whether they did it or not usually either because they dont want it to be true and they are incapable of seeing that person in a bad light so they look for justification as a psychological defence mechanism. You're also bringing up the issue of victim blaming. Again that's a different issue. You also brought up the issue of people not believing something happened when it did. While these are real issues it doesnt mean that when people do believe allegations that it always leads to nothing, that just isnt true. I understand why you would think otherwise from those personal instances but that doesnt represent the full picture. You seem to have gotten caught up in your feelings about rape and slipped away from how we aren't talking about actual rape but false allegations of rape. If a person is convicted even if they are actually innocent they lose their job and are on a sex offender list for life which prevents them from obtaining certain jobs. If any person believes they did it even if they did not they could lose that person from their life. There are various instances of people vandalising homes of people on sex offender lists. There are people that commit suicide over false allegations. In some cases they are murdered. I know it's not a 100% guarantee they actually didn't rape anyone but there is no 100% in the legal system for guilty or not guilty. I also am aware sometimes victims drop charges to avoid going to court or there isnt enough evidence but just for sake of example lets assume these articles are true that they are innocent.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3714547/Heartbroken-mother-55-teenager-hanged-false-rape-allegations-kills-anniversary-death-couldn-t-future-without-him.html
www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/9788265/Teenager-falsely-accused-of-rape-beaten-to-death-by-gang.html

traedAug 30, 2017 12:09 PM

Aug 30, 2017 12:09 PM

#59

Offline

Sep 2012

3600

Dont mind me but I think we should let the false accuser raped in prison then release her. At least she can understand the real horror that way.

Aug 30, 2017 1:33 PM

#60

Online

Mar 2008

48909

sasalx said:
Dont mind me but I think we should let the false accuser raped in prison then release her. At least she can understand the real horror that way.

How about not...you're literally advocating for rape and trivialising it by saying it'ss a tool to teach lessons. That's how rapists think

Aug 30, 2017 2:04 PM

#61

Offline

Sep 2012

3600

traed said:

sasalx said:
Dont mind me but I think we should let the false accuser raped in prison then release her. At least she can understand the real horror that way.

How about not...you're literally advocating for rape and trivialising it by saying it'ss a tool to teach lessons. That's how rapists think

/shug

She said she was raped. I would like to see her face after a real rape.

There are many people that needs help and because of this false rape thing many ignore the real rape cases.

If you think I am "advocating" and "trivialising" rape well that is sad.

Aug 30, 2017 6:15 PM

#62

RuneRem

Offline

Jul 2016

4988

ElPysCongroo said:
Umm where's the option that should be punished, but in no way should they have the same time as actual rapists, that's just fucking ridiculous.
Also what a waste of prison space, just give them community service or something.

False rape accusers are just as bad as Rapists, if no worse.
They are sending men to jail for 8 years, where those men will get assaulted in prison.

False rape accusers should get life in jail.

Aug 30, 2017 6:41 PM

#63

RuneRem

Offline

Jul 2016

4988

Rotton-Girl said:

Maneki-Mew said:

Maybe, if someone has influence and his own adviser tells him how to deal with that. I don't even know and heart many details of that.
Normal people could lose their job and maybe the trust of their friends and family. Even if people are offcially rehabilitated, there could always the unsureness of "is it true?" and people badmouthing them. And I said it could happen ... don't know why you feel the need to act lowkey aggressive towards me. XD Tell me about the real world, senpai x3 It depends on your personal enviroment and how the people around you react, for both sides.
10 years are pretty, pretty harsh, but I won't defend that behavior either by "ah, nobody got hurt". It's bad for the person, who is falsely accused of a crime and also disrespectful against rape victims.

I feel bad too for the people falsely accused but why was she able to convict 15? At what point is the court at fault? I am not saying she isn't to blame but there is definitely a certain amount of blame to be placed squarely on the bade detective work in these cases. Something is not adding up to me. How is she able to put that many people behind bars falsely without the court being at fault?

**according to the article, only one person was convicted. They caught her. Pay out the money to the guy (which is standard in all court wrongdoings). They didn't even go to court with the other ones. The figured her out because she was being silly. anyway. whatever. Nobody believed me. People do not default believe you if you are a victim. It would be a dream if they did.

Filling out a false police report is a misdemenor or a felony here. I don't know what it is there. It is already a crime. I don't know why people are bitching.

Many of your arguments are about rich people not being affected by false accusations, and you completely ignoring the fact that they are rich and famous.

Ordinary men aren't rich or famous, so a false accusation is serious.

And you keep saying a false police report is already a crime, this thread has nothing to do with general false police reports, but false rape accusations.
One of the guys the woman in the article accused went to prison for 7 years, and your acting like this is just a minor crime, and trying to blame the courts, even tho it's feminists pressuring the courts to be lenient and favour women.
Feminists are at fault, for creating these conditions where the women is always believed, and for pressuring prosecutors not to prosecute false accusers.

Aug 31, 2017 5:37 AM

#64

Hias

Offline

Aug 2007

1816

What is with you and feminism lately? Like holy shit I feel like you've made a thread about it everyday. Where are these insane femnazi types that you and alt-righters love to claim are on every street corner waiting to accuse men of sexual assault? I've yet to meet any in person. This is getting ridiculous.

HiasAug 31, 2017 2:03 PM

Aug 31, 2017 6:37 AM

#65

-Swish

Offline

May 2013

443

Rotton-Girl said:

-Swish said:
She deserves to be the in prison for the rest of her life. Just accusing someone of rape can ruin their life, let alone 7 years in prison. She's a disgusting human and whatever justice she gets will be too good.

I don't know what you are talking about

Here are a list of very successful people who have been accused of rape:
Woody Alllan
Bill Cosby
Donald Trump
R.Kelly (straight up charged with a sex crime)
John Trovolta
CeeLo Green
Britney Spears
Kobe Bryant
Bryan Singer
Gary Glitter (actually went to jail because child molestation and porn eventually)- yet his sports anthem still plays.
Sean Penn (has been charged with domestic violence, is still famous)
Mike Tyson (actually did rape someone and was convicted!)
Tupak Sakur (convicted of Battery even though the other person said it was rape, they couldn't prove it)
Tucker Carlson was accused of rape was proven false. he still worked news just fine.
David Copperfield- accused of rape, they could not find evidence.
Jerry Lawler- WWE wrestler who was convicted of raping a 15 year old girl, girl later admitted to making up the story, guy still works and seems to be doing fine.
Donald Trump- Who is President and has been accused by lots of women. Including an exwife who had proof but it was at a time when raping your wife was not illegal.

Do I need to bring up Michael Jackson? Who after death is becoming less and less remembered for the wackier things and more remembered for just his music.

And there are some people who honestly deserve to be scrubbed off all our DVDs... like Scott Freeman who really did have child porn and I wish I never had to hear his stupid voice again.

I was talking about the average guy. Like the guys in the article. You know like 99% of men out there. You can get away with just about anything if you have enough money. Bill Cosby's life is ruined and rightfully so. Kobe Bryant is a perfect example. The girl lied about her age, had a fake ID and looked over 21. A gold digging whore and her scheming mom looking for easy money. Thank god it didnt ruin his NBA career

Aug 31, 2017 11:46 AM

#66

CharlesMarlow

Offline

Jun 2011

1362

Dudes, I have a very good advice for you to prevent facing false rape accusations.
Always, always be recording.
Record all your interactions with girls.
Save every text message.
Record sound during sex and video if you manage to set up a hidden cam.
This way you'll always win.
You should be cautious if she's : a) a tomboy (run like hell); b) career-focused woman (chances are she's a feminist.)
Also, this is very tricky, but get her to show you her ID, she may be lying about her age. You don't want to end up in jail because you didn't know that she was out of legal age range.

It doesn't matter how old are you. I almost got charged with sexual harassment when I was 15, so listen to me if you seriously consider getting some pussy.

Aug 31, 2017 11:31 PM

#67

DirtyYogurt

Offline

Feb 2010

113

I love how an issue relating to about 5% of reported sexual assaults has more time and discussion devoted to it on forums like this one than the many many many issues that face the other 95%.

Sep 1, 2017 12:04 AM

#68

LoneWolf

Offline

Aug 2009

8328

DirtyYogurt said:
I love how an issue relating to about 5% of reported sexual assaults has more time and discussion devoted to it on forums like this one than the many many many issues that face the other 95%.

Yeah it's unfortunate that people are not willing to talk about things like rape in prison, but when men are the victims there unfortunately tends to be a lot less interest and compassion.

"The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. If you try it, you will be lonely often, and sometimes frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself."
-Friedrich Nietzsche

Sep 1, 2017 1:30 AM

#69

Offline

Jun 2008

15842

Nyu said:

Rotton-Girl said:

Maneki-Mew said:

Rotton-Girl said:

Maneki-Mew said:
People always faced punishment when they accused someone of a crime he haven't commited. You are destroying someone's life with false accusations and putting them through social judgement and outlawing. 10 years are pretty harsh tho and I think it's also fair to doubt her sanity, which isn't an excuse, but the reason why such things maybe won't happen everyday.
Many victims are ashamed and don't want to put themselves in this situation and let everyone know. You have to let people you don't know like psychologists and the policer officers take a look in your soul and the your privacy.
I'm positive that there are not just a few cases of false accusations and these things happen, but I bet there aren't so many either. But okay, if nothing had happened tho, maybe it's easier to speak about uncomfortable questions about your private and sexual life with a police officer.

Trump became president despite being accused numerous times. I see no proof it really destroys lives just by accusation alone. There are several cases of people actually being charged with rape and going on to have very successful careers. I really don't see any proof it ruins anyone's lives unless they were falsely imprisoned. But seriously, accusing a guy of rape? Guess what happens in the real world? His friends believe him and not you. His family believes him and not you. Your friends are skeptical of you. That is how it is in the real world. Sorry you live in a fantasy.

PS. even if they believe you, they downplay it as "not as bad" because this and this and this didn't happen to you that happen to other victims.

Maybe, if someone has influence and his own adviser tells him how to deal with that. I don't even know and heart many details of that.
Normal people could lose their job and maybe the trust of their friends and family. Even if people are offcially rehabilitated, there could always the unsureness of "is it true?" and people badmouthing them. And I said it could happen ... don't know why you feel the need to act lowkey aggressive towards me. XD Tell me about the real world, senpai x3 It depends on your personal enviroment and how the people around you react, for both sides.
10 years are pretty, pretty harsh, but I won't defend that behavior either by "ah, nobody got hurt". It's bad for the person, who is falsely accused of a crime and also disrespectful against rape victims.

I feel bad too for the people falsely accused but why was she able to convict 15? At what point is the court at fault? I am not saying she isn't to blame but there is definitely a certain amount of blame to be placed squarely on the bade detective work in these cases. Something is not adding up to me. How is she able to put that many people behind bars falsely without the court being at fault?

**according to the article, only one person was convicted. They caught her. Pay out the money to the guy (which is standard in all court wrongdoings). They didn't even go to court with the other ones. The figured her out because she was being silly. anyway. whatever. Nobody believed me. People do not default believe you if you are a victim. It would be a dream if they did.

Filling out a false police report is a misdemenor or a felony here. I don't know what it is there. It is already a crime. I don't know why people are bitching.

Many of your arguments are about rich people not being affected by false accusations, and you completely ignoring the fact that they are rich and famous.

Ordinary men aren't rich or famous, so a false accusation is serious.

And you keep saying a false police report is already a crime, this thread has nothing to do with general false police reports, but false rape accusations.
One of the guys the woman in the article accused went to prison for 7 years, and your acting like this is just a minor crime, and trying to blame the courts, even tho it's feminists pressuring the courts to be lenient and favour women.
Feminists are at fault, for creating these conditions where the women is always believed, and for pressuring prosecutors not to prosecute false accusers.

Not only that but even those rich and famous are affected also. They may not lose everything they have etc but if you are a rich famous actor getting accused of rape etc then good luck finding roles and you will have everyone staring at you with condemn etc. Is the kind of thing that can make you not want to leave your house anymore.
If someone as powerful as them with even fans and support and excuses(being accused because they are famous possibility) then imagine what a normal man will go threw.

Sep 1, 2017 1:31 AM

#70

Offline

Jun 2008

15842

DirtyYogurt said:
I love how an issue relating to about 5% of reported sexual assaults has more time and discussion devoted to it on forums like this one than the many many many issues that face the other 95%.

5% my ass. Always trying to diminish issues involving men being abused.

Also if you want to talk in percentages trannys are not even 1% of population and gays a 4% max yet their issues are all over the place with a lot bigger discussion than this get ever. I have a feeling you will be keen discussing those for some reason and i call hypocrisy then.

Sep 1, 2017 2:04 AM

#71

DirtyYogurt

Offline

Feb 2010

113

Monad said:

DirtyYogurt said:
I love how an issue relating to about 5% of reported sexual assaults has more time and discussion devoted to it on forums like this one than the many many many issues that face the other 95%.

5% my ass. Always trying to diminish issues involving men being abused.

Also if you want to talk in percentages trannys are not even 1% of population and gays a 4% max yet their issues are all over the place with a lot bigger discussion than this get ever. I have a feeling you will be keen discussing those for some reason and i call hypocrisy then.

The most widely accepted statistics show 2-8% of cases being false reports, which is in line with false reports for every other crime.

The FBI represents the 8% figure with reputable advocacy groups representing the lower end.

Also not sure why you're bringing up trans people. US estimates place the adult trans population around .58%. The average number of men falsely accuse of sexual assault is .0017% of the US population. Not sure why you think I shouldn't be able to show more care for a group of people roughly 341 times larger than the amount of falsely accused men.

EDIT: Also really weird to compare the discrimination between the two. Falsely accused men do not face anywhere near the level of hate and discrimination that trans people do.

DirtyYogurtSep 1, 2017 2:08 AM

Sep 1, 2017 3:53 AM

#72

manicheo

Offline

Jan 2016

330

In my country whoever accuses someone of a felony, knowing well he/she's innocent, can get from a mimumum of 2 years to a maximum of 6 years. The punishment is increased by one third if the reported felony sets a prison term of 10 years or more (which is the case for rape). The punishment ranges from 4 to 12 years if the false accused person actually spend 5 or more years in prison. At last the punishment ranges from 6 to 20 years if the reported felony set for a life sentence.

In this particular case, she would face a prison term from 4 to 12 years. And since she's recidivist the punishment would be increased by at least one third. Then at least a prison term from 5 years and 4 months to 16 years, at the discretion of the judge.
As she's made no less than 15 false rape allegations a prison term of 15 years seem reasonable to me. Maybe even too light.. people like this ruin lives and make harder to believe the real rape victims.

manicheoSep 1, 2017 4:09 AM

Sep 2, 2017 10:51 AM

#73

ezikialrage

Offline

Aug 2009

5519

Those who falsely accuse others of rape should face a harsh penalty. Beside trying to ruin the lives of those that are falsely accused and costing tax payers a shit load of money those false accusations destroy the credibility of actual rape victims.

Sep 2, 2017 3:06 PM

#74

Offline

Sep 2012

3600

razor39999 said:

DirtyYogurt said:

The most widely accepted statistics show 2-8% of cases being false reports, which is in line with false reports for every other crime.

The FBI represents the 8% figure with reputable advocacy groups representing the lower end.

Also not sure why you're bringing up trans people. US estimates place the adult trans population around .58%. The average number of men falsely accuse of sexual assault is .0017% of the US population. Not sure why you think I shouldn't be able to show more care for a group of people roughly 341 times larger than the amount of falsely accused men.

EDIT: Also really weird to compare the discrimination between the two. Falsely accused men do not face anywhere near the level of hate and discrimination that trans people do.

CE has a tendency of overblowing the importance of white men problems, which exist, but aren't the biggest issue around.

"Hurr durr my problem is really important than others problems look at those white men with problems hurr durr"

Problems are problems. You cant just rate the importance of someone else problem by your value. There are many hungry, homeless or jobless people around the world. Should we stop talking about our problems because of that?

Sep 2, 2017 4:18 PM

#75

Offline

May 2015

5409

Hias said:
What is with you and feminism lately? Like holy shit I feel like you've made a thread about it everyday. Where are these insane femnazi types that you and alt-righters love to claim are on every street corner waiting to accuse men of sexual assault? I've yet to meet any in person. This is getting ridiculous.

You're really gonna act like they don't exist? They're a cancer to the internet, and the world as a whole.

Sep 2, 2017 4:21 PM

#76

Offline

May 2015

5409

traed said:

Rotton-Girl said:

traed said:

Rotton-Girl said:

DreamingBeats said:

Rotton-Girl said:

-Swish said:
She deserves to be the in prison for the rest of her life. Just accusing someone of rape can ruin their life, let alone 7 years in prison. She's a disgusting human and whatever justice she gets will be too good.

I don't know what you are talking about

Here are a list of very successful people who have been accused of rape:

"there are plenty of rapists or accused rapists that are successfull in life" argument makes as much sense as saying

"hey there's plenty of successfull people, even millionaire and billionaires who never went to college, so you can totally become one too without a degree!"

My dad actually was very poor. When I was growing up, we lived in an apartment in the poorest part of town. He now lives in a half a million dollar home. And he doesn't have a degree. How did he do it? Knowing how to type 100 words per minute in the 90's. And my dad says, you can still earn $20 an hour if you could type at least 80 words.

That depends where you live and how many positions are open. Anyway your point made no sense. All you showed is how rich and famous people get a pass easier.

I accused someone of rape, everyone took his side (because he actually raped me).

I know someone whose daughter was raped and she says even though her daughter was 15, she was accused of lying constantly by even FBI who harrassed her... until the guy was convicted. In the courtroom, not a single person was on her daughter's side other than her... And they let that guy out early on "good behavior".

I know someone else who was molested by her step brother and her father took her step brother's side.

I donno, I know more rapists who are precieved as "oh they could never!"

Oh and add on top of it my husband who was raped by his step sisters was straight up told it was his fault cause he is a guy and should have been able to fight off girls who were much older than him.

Rapists are not normally some stranger in the night... they are normally someone very close to you that your friends know and your family knows and you know their family you are so close to them... :(

I gave real examples more because I am sick of being called a liar honestly. But it is true. It seems accusing someone of rape actually does mean NOTHING. I didn't go to school because I was raped. I dropped out. Where was he? He got his degree and moved on. He is fine. I have suffered years of mental trauma and he talks about how much he loves Game of Thrones.

I'm sorry that happened to you and others and I understand why that would frustrate you( for lack of better words) but that doesn't mean that allegations of rape has no impact on anyone's life, it means that some people defend the alleged whether they did it or not usually either because they dont want it to be true and they are incapable of seeing that person in a bad light so they look for justification as a psychological defence mechanism. You're also bringing up the issue of victim blaming. Again that's a different issue. You also brought up the issue of people not believing something happened when it did. While these are real issues it doesnt mean that when people do believe allegations that it always leads to nothing, that just isnt true. I understand why you would think otherwise from those personal instances but that doesnt represent the full picture. You seem to have gotten caught up in your feelings about rape and slipped away from how we aren't talking about actual rape but false allegations of rape. If a person is convicted even if they are actually innocent they lose their job and are on a sex offender list for life which prevents them from obtaining certain jobs. If any person believes they did it even if they did not they could lose that person from their life. There are various instances of people vandalising homes of people on sex offender lists. There are people that commit suicide over false allegations. In some cases they are murdered. I know it's not a 100% guarantee they actually didn't rape anyone but there is no 100% in the legal system for guilty or not guilty. I also am aware sometimes victims drop charges to avoid going to court or there isnt enough evidence but just for sake of example lets assume these articles are true that they are innocent.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3714547/Heartbroken-mother-55-teenager-hanged-false-rape-allegations-kills-anniversary-death-couldn-t-future-without-him.html
www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/9788265/Teenager-falsely-accused-of-rape-beaten-to-death-by-gang.html

People believing the accuser no matter what, even when it never happened, is way worse.

Sep 2, 2017 5:18 PM

#77

Online

Mar 2008

48909

sasalx said:

traed said:

How about not...you're literally advocating for rape and trivialising it by saying it'ss a tool to teach lessons. That's how rapists think

/shug

She said she was raped. I would like to see her face after a real rape.

There are many people that needs help and because of this false rape thing many ignore the real rape cases.

If you think I am "advocating" and "trivialising" rape well that is sad.

Therapy and taking to rape victims would do a better job than her being raped.

Kittens-kun said:

People believing the accuser no matter what, even when it never happened, is way worse.

Worse than what? False accusations believed worse than true allegations not believed and a rapist getting away with it giving them the opportunity to do it to others? No, it's not.

traedSep 2, 2017 5:21 PM

Sep 2, 2017 5:22 PM

#78

Offline

May 2015

5409

traed said:

sasalx said:

/shug

She said she was raped. I would like to see her face after a real rape.

There are many people that needs help and because of this false rape thing many ignore the real rape cases.

If you think I am "advocating" and "trivialising" rape well that is sad.

Therapy would do a better job than her being raped. Your logic is retarded.

Kittens-kun said:

People believing the accuser no matter what, even when it never happened, is way worse.

Worse than what? False accusations believed worse than true allegations not believed and a rapist getting away with it giving them the opportunity to do it to others? No, it's not.

So someone's life getting ruined because of something they never did is a more preferable option to you?

Sep 2, 2017 5:29 PM

#79

Online

Mar 2008

48909

Kittens-kun said:
So someone's life getting ruined because of something they never did is a more preferable option to you?

Neither is good. You dont have to choose. That is just stupid to look at it that way. Btw I edited my post as you replied I had added that they should have rape victims talk to them. Also probably a judge or officer.

Sep 2, 2017 5:39 PM

#80

Offline

Sep 2012

3600

Ah would you look at that? Here I am thinking I was in a civil discussion with someone. Thanks for the fast qoute @Kittens-kun .

@traed

Maybe at the end you are the one who needs a therapy. By your logic liars needs therapy anyways. PM me when you stop calling people retarded so we can continue.

Sep 2, 2017 6:37 PM

#81

Offline

May 2015

5409

traed said:

Kittens-kun said:
So someone's life getting ruined because of something they never did is a more preferable option to you?

Neither is good. You dont have to choose. That is just stupid to look at it that way. Btw I edited my post as you replied I had added that they should have rape victims talk to them. Also probably a judge or officer.

There's really only two options though: Believe the victim, or the perpetrator.

Sep 2, 2017 6:43 PM

#82

Online

Mar 2008

48909

sasalx said:
Ah would you look at that? Here I am thinking I was in a civil discussion with someone. Thanks for the fast qoute @Kittens-kun .

@traed

Maybe at the end you are the one who needs a therapy. By your logic liars needs therapy anyways. PM me when you stop calling people retarded so we can continue.

I said your logic is retarded. That's different than straight out calling you retarded. Do you not know what retarded means? It means held back. The way you're looking at things is held back by irrational emotional outbursts of cries for vengeance.

Kittens-kun said:
There's really only two options though: Believe the victim, or the perpetrator.

No, you believe the evidence. Do you not know how the legal system works?

Sep 2, 2017 6:47 PM

#83

Offline

May 2015

5409

traed said:

sasalx said:
Ah would you look at that? Here I am thinking I was in a civil discussion with someone. Thanks for the fast qoute @Kittens-kun .

@traed

Maybe at the end you are the one who needs a therapy. By your logic liars needs therapy anyways. PM me when you stop calling people retarded so we can continue.

I said your logic is retarded. That's different than straight out calling you retarded. Do you not know what retarded means? It means held back. The way you're looking at things is held back by irrational emotional outbursts of cries for vengeance.

Kittens-kun said:
There's really only two options though: Believe the victim, or the perpetrator.

No, you believe the evidence. Do you not know how the legal system works?

And how does that change the fact that there are two parties, and one will win the case? Do you even realize what you just said?

Sep 2, 2017 6:53 PM

#84

Online

Mar 2008

48909

Kittens-kun said:
And how does that change the fact that there are two parties, and one will win the case? Do you even realize what you just said?

I said that you cant convict without evidence and with a lack of evidence you can't assume innocence or guilt unless it's proven with evidence that directly contradicts claims. What are you trying to say?

Sep 2, 2017 6:57 PM

#85

Offline

May 2015

5409

traed said:

Kittens-kun said:
And how does that change the fact that there are two parties, and one will win the case? Do you even realize what you just said?

I said that you cant convict without evidence and with a lack of evidence you can't assume innocence or guilt unless it's proven with evidence that directly contradicts claims. What are you trying to say?

If there was no evidence, then there would be no trial to begin with. Gotta have some kind of case on either side.

Sep 2, 2017 7:54 PM

#86

bridievinn

Offline

Oct 2016

87

I don't think feminists have a problem with it. Like, at all. Also, if you do your research, the amount of rape accusations that end up being false are very statistically low

Sep 2, 2017 8:34 PM

#87

Hias

Offline

Aug 2007

1816

Kittens-kun said:

You're really gonna act like they don't exist? They're a cancer to the internet, and the world as a whole.

I'm sure they do, maybe if you dig deep into tumblr. But I generally don't see these type of women, both online and in person. Why do you have such a deep disdain for feminism? Calling it a 'cancer to the internet' is pretty extreme. Unless you have some personal beef with women, it just seems ridiculous to act like it's the decline of western civilization.

Sep 2, 2017 8:34 PM

#88

LoneWolf

Offline

Aug 2009

8328

bridievinn said:
I don't think feminists have a problem with it. Like, at all. Also, if you do your research, the amount of rape accusations that end up being false are very statistically low

I think you're not really looking at the big picture here. It's not just about false accusers and throwing innocents in jail. Its about the integrity of the criminal justice system as a whole. If the system is so easily abused and so so many people can be falsely put behind bars (one of these man even served a 7 year sentence before he was finally exonerated) why should people trust in the justice system to do the right thing? Why should they trust the police, the courts the prisons? It throws the whole system intro question. It's a huge systemic issue. It doesn't matter if it is "statistically low".

This case is a landmark precedent setting case and people will look to it in the future. There are a lot more factors to such as financial incentive for people to falsely accuse others. The victims get money from the accused when they accuse them of rape as compensation. Apparently the people that wrote this law in didn't think ahead about how this could be abused. A lot of these cases are throwing presumption of innocence out of the window and not looking as thoroughly at these cases as they should. Often when there is a lack of evidence it becomes a he said, she said situation and the vast majority of the time they side with the accuser. Lastly there are laws that protect the accusers called rape shield laws which cause a huge problem for due process. They protect the accusers identity from the accused and general public, they prevent the accusers history from being used against them, this includes their history of accusing people of sexual assault, falsely or not; they protect the accuser from being cross examined in court and prevent disclosure from occurring and they even protect the accused from having to come to court and testify on their behalf.

The thing that you'll likely find most relevant is that the more of these false cases are found the less likely it will be that people will take the real cases seriously. The author makes a point to say how this woman is an "ambassador" for all for all women. While I don't agree with this, this will have an affect on how people deal with cases of rape in the future. Attention and resources that could have been put towards resolving real rape cases, could very well be subverted to dealing with these false claims and in some cases they many not even be looked at or dismissed, because of how easy it is to falsely accuse someone. When the system is broken it is not only the falsely accused or accusers that suffer, but all of the real rape victims that want to be taken seriously. False accusers are not only attacking the people they falsely accuse, but they are attacking the very law system itself.

I'm not trying to go off on you or w.e I think this is just some general information that needs to be put out there, for people too lazy to read the cited article or the thread (like yourself I imagine). There is a lot of misinformation and ignorance regarding this issue and a lot of people just trying to simplify or dismiss this as something not important. You're pretty much taking the same stance as the writer of the article, simply stating that these cases are rare and calling it a day without even looking at the details or trying to understand the laws and policies around them.

LoneWolfSep 2, 2017 8:56 PM

"The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. If you try it, you will be lonely often, and sometimes frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself."
-Friedrich Nietzsche

Sep 3, 2017 4:01 AM

#89

Offline

Aug 2017

204

bridievinn said:
Also, if you do your research, the amount of rape accusations that end up being false are very statistically low

+1

What is also stastistically low are the numbers or rapists who actually gets convicted. That is what should truly worry people, but that's not the case here on misogynistic-MAL at least.

Sep 3, 2017 4:48 AM

#90

bridievinn

Offline

Oct 2016

87

deadprez said:

bridievinn said:
Also, if you do your research, the amount of rape accusations that end up being false are very statistically low

+1

What is also stastistically low are the numbers or rapists who actually gets convicted. That is what should truly worry people, but that's not the case here on misogynistic-MAL at least.

yeah, i wish it wasn't the case but you're right :c

LoneWolf said:

bridievinn said:
I don't think feminists have a problem with it. Like, at all. Also, if you do your research, the amount of rape accusations that end up being false are very statistically low

I think you're not really looking at the big picture here. It's not just about false accusers and throwing innocents in jail. Its about the integrity of the criminal justice system as a whole. If the system is so easily abused and so so many people can be falsely put behind bars (one of these man even served a 7 year sentence before he was finally exonerated) why should people trust in the justice system to do the right thing? Why should they trust the police, the courts the prisons? It throws the whole system intro question. It's a huge systemic issue. It doesn't matter if it is "statistically low".

This case is a landmark precedent setting case and people will look to it in the future. There are a lot more factors to such as financial incentive for people to falsely accuse others. The victims get money from the accused when they accuse them of rape as compensation. Apparently the people that wrote this law in didn't think ahead about how this could be abused. A lot of these cases are throwing presumption of innocence out of the window and not looking as thoroughly at these cases as they should. Often when there is a lack of evidence it becomes a he said, she said situation and the vast majority of the time they side with the accuser. Lastly there are laws that protect the accusers called rape shield laws which cause a huge problem for due process. They protect the accusers identity from the accused and general public, they prevent the accusers history from being used against them, this includes their history of accusing people of sexual assault, falsely or not; they protect the accuser from being cross examined in court and prevent disclosure from occurring and they even protect the accused from having to come to court and testify on their behalf.

The thing that you'll likely find most relevant is that the more of these false cases are found the less likely it will be that people will take the real cases seriously. The author makes a point to say how this woman is an "ambassador" for all for all women. While I don't agree with this, this will have an affect on how people deal with cases of rape in the future. Attention and resources that could have been put towards resolving real rape cases, could very well be subverted to dealing with these false claims and in some cases they many not even be looked at or dismissed, because of how easy it is to falsely accuse someone. When the system is broken it is not only the falsely accused or accusers that suffer, but all of the real rape victims that want to be taken seriously. False accusers are not only attacking the people they falsely accuse, but they are attacking the very law system itself.

I'm not trying to go off on you or w.e I think this is just some general information that needs to be put out there, for people too lazy to read the cited article or the thread (like yourself I imagine). There is a lot of misinformation and ignorance regarding this issue and a lot of people just trying to simplify or dismiss this as something not important. You're pretty much taking the same stance as the writer of the article, simply stating that these cases are rare and calling it a day without even looking at the details or trying to understand the laws and policies around them.

tl;dr you clearly don't get it either lmao

Sep 3, 2017 5:30 AM

#91

Offline

May 2015

5409

Hias said:

Kittens-kun said:

You're really gonna act like they don't exist? They're a cancer to the internet, and the world as a whole.

I'm sure they do, maybe if you dig deep into tumblr. But I generally don't see these type of women, both online and in person. Why do you have such a deep disdain for feminism? Calling it a 'cancer to the internet' is pretty extreme. Unless you have some personal beef with women, it just seems ridiculous to act like it's the decline of western civilization.

Modern feminism IS cancer. Hell, it's not even needed anymore unless you live in a country where women don't have equal rights. I've seen PLENTY of videos and articles to back this up. Meeting one myself isn't required for me to say they exist, and ARE a problem.

Sep 3, 2017 5:31 AM

#92

Offline

May 2015

5409

deadprez said:

bridievinn said:
Also, if you do your research, the amount of rape accusations that end up being false are very statistically low

+1

What is also stastistically low are the numbers or rapists who actually gets convicted. That is what should truly worry people, but that's not the case here on misogynistic-MAL at least.

LOL, you people are hilarious. "misogynistic" Did you really just say that? xD

Sep 3, 2017 8:11 AM

#93

dontnoticeme

Offline

Jan 2015

553

ElPysCongroo said:
Umm where's the option that should be punished, but in no way should they have the same time as actual rapists, that's just fucking ridiculous.
Also what a waste of prison space, just give them community service or something.

I think they should serve prison time. If the guy gets convicted wrongfully he is fucked for life.

Sep 3, 2017 8:55 AM

#94

Offline

Aug 2017

204

Kittens-kun said:
LOL, you people are hilarious. "misogynistic" Did you really just say that? xD

LOL, you people with your tinfoil-hats living in your parents basement are hilarious. xD

Sep 3, 2017 4:32 PM

#95

Offline

Jun 2008

15842

deadprez said:

bridievinn said:
Also, if you do your research, the amount of rape accusations that end up being false are very statistically low

+1

What is also stastistically low are the numbers or rapists who actually gets convicted. That is what should truly worry people, but that's not the case here on misogynistic-MAL at least.

I like how they are rapist even when they didn't get convicted. Sorry that the courts aren't convicting absolutely everyone with no proof just yet. Don't worry we are getting there considering how many are convicted with just the word of the woman and nothing else.

DirtyYogurt said:

Monad said:

5% my ass. Always trying to diminish issues involving men being abused.

Also if you want to talk in percentages trannys are not even 1% of population and gays a 4% max yet their issues are all over the place with a lot bigger discussion than this get ever. I have a feeling you will be keen discussing those for some reason and i call hypocrisy then.

The most widely accepted statistics show 2-8% of cases being false reports, which is in line with false reports for every other crime.

The FBI represents the 8% figure with reputable advocacy groups representing the lower end.

Also not sure why you're bringing up trans people. US estimates place the adult trans population around .58%. The average number of men falsely accuse of sexual assault is .0017% of the US population. Not sure why you think I shouldn't be able to show more care for a group of people roughly 341 times larger than the amount of falsely accused men.

EDIT: Also really weird to compare the discrimination between the two. Falsely accused men do not face anywhere near the level of hate and discrimination that trans people do.

I love your false comparisons. 0.58%(yes put the zero infrond, don't try to be false news), are trannies and they can or may be affected by the issues of their group.
How many are men? Certainly not 0017% or whatever. It is an issue for all men because anyone of them can end up being falsely accused. So no is more like 0.58% against 50% or something(don't know the exact number of men close top half the population i guess).

You are right on one thing though. Falsely accused men do not face the same discrimination and hate that trans people do. They face a lt worse than trans people do.

Btw i i'll take more of the FBI numbers that the "advocacy groups" that even a moron knows their affiliations by now.

Sep 3, 2017 5:15 PM

#96

removed-user

Offline

Jul 2018

564252

Welcome to CE
aka land of the first world problem MRAs
false rape accusations aren't the only problem in the world boys if they're the worst injustice in the world to you - esp if you've never been affected by it yourself- you're obviously not aware of far worse that exists within the world.

honestly can we not just say that society is a problem and leave it at that? societal double standards suck, fine but fuck this

Sep 4, 2017 4:18 AM

#97

Offline

Aug 2017

204

Monad said:
I like how they are rapist even when they didn't get convicted. Sorry that the courts aren't convicting absolutely everyone with no proof just yet. Don't worry we are getting there considering how many are convicted with just the word of the woman and nothing else.

Nice strawman. I know it's no use asking you to read up on a subject, but somebody as massively ignorant as you really should.

https://www.rainn.org/statistics/criminal-justice-system

Sep 4, 2017 5:30 AM

#98

Offline

Jun 2008

15842

deadprez said:

Monad said:
I like how they are rapist even when they didn't get convicted. Sorry that the courts aren't convicting absolutely everyone with no proof just yet. Don't worry we are getting there considering how many are convicted with just the word of the woman and nothing else.

Nice strawman. I know it's no use asking you to read up on a subject, but somebody as massively ignorant as you really should.

https://www.rainn.org/statistics/criminal-justice-system

How the hell can you know that 344 out of a thousand are reported when the other aren't reported? Those are nothing but estimates they make with high chance of them being completely off since they have no data about not reported crimes.

Also again as i stated you claim that the police should try to prosecute anyone reported just because he/she was accused. Which is stupid. First they must see if there is any evidence and second if the rape allegation stands. If the one being accused for rape was in the other part of the town doing something else with witnesses, kind of doesn't fit you know.
So as i said sorry that not everyone isn't just prosecuted just because and there is still some due diligence.
And btw i wonder how many of those aren't even continuing because they seem false from the start and are not even measured in the false allegations statistics.

Sorry but is not prudent to just throw people in jail with no evidence and just by accusations. Yes some rapist may get away but is not wise to start throwing innocent people behind bars just so you can be sure you caught all the criminals.

Lastly in modern society the definition of rape and the wording of it has being heavily twisted to the point of statistics putting rape in many things that aren't actually rape like sexual assault or drunken sex etc etc.

Sep 4, 2017 5:49 AM

#99

Offline

Aug 2017

204

Monad said:

How the hell can you know that 344 out of a thousand are reported when the other aren't reported? Those are nothing but estimates they make with high chance of them being completely off since they have no data about not reported crimes.

Research can be done on reported crimes and none-reported crimes. It's not that complicated.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/100000-assaults-1000-rapists-sentenced-shockingly-low-conviction-rates-revealed-8446058.html

Monad said:
Also again as i stated you claim that the police should try to prosecute anyone reported just because he/she was accused. Which is stupid. First they must see if there is any evidence and second if the rape allegation stands. If the one being accused for rape was in the other part of the town doing something else with witnesses, kind of doesn't fit you know.
So as i said sorry that not everyone isn't just prosecuted just because and there is still some due diligence.

Sorry but is not prudent to just throw people in jail with no evidence and just by accusations. Yes some rapist may get away but is not wise to start throwing innocent people behind bars just so you can be sure you caught all the criminals.

Why repeat the same strawman again?

Monad said:
Lastly in modern society the definition of rape and the wording of it has being heavily twisted to the point of statistics putting rape in many things that aren't actually rape like sexual assault or drunken sex etc etc.

"Drunken sex", lol. Unfortunately too many people think rape is not rape if the woman is too drunk to say no or physically resist.....

I've never seen anyone try this hard to defend rape.

Sep 4, 2017 6:00 AM

#100