Re:ZERO -Starting Life in Another World- (light novel)
| Be careful of what you say here bro. The Re:Zero fans will rip into you like rabid dogs. I guess I'll add my two cents to this. While I do appreciate having a flawed protagonist I think Re:Zero goes a bit to far with it. I feel like Subaru has almost no common sense due to some of the stupid actions he takes. Although with all the shit he goes through later on it's somewhat understandable. |
_Kairu_Jul 24, 2016 2:59 PM
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| I do think it's hard to watch but mainly because of how emotionally damaged Subaru is. I can't really expect him to keep a cool head after everything he's been through. I'll admit he keeps screwing up, but I'm always finding ways to sort of defend his actions and behaviour. He's certainly one of the most interesting main characters I've seen in recent years But yeah, lots of people are bashing Subaru for acting like a flawed, broken teenager but that's exactly what he is. |
| Let the Kirito's here have their fun, guys. |
| I fail to see much development on Subarus part even through all these episodes. He still acts like an idiot and it doesn't really look like he ever learns much of anything. I do like the mystery of the anime and I want to know more about the world, and I like how they keep giving teases to what really is going on. But overall theres been a hell of a lot of backtracking and repeating stuff and we get just little hints of plot progression as a reward for sitting through all this repetition and Subarus endless ranting and raving. Its not that I dont appreciate what many people are saying is realism in the sense that Sabaru is being affected pretty badly by traumatic events and repeated deaths , but that doesn't make me like his character since constant stupdity is hard to watch. I'm really wondering if he is going to get some kind of strength whether it be mentally and/or physically (or through some power or ability) that would be nice. Not that I want to see him overpower everyone but I just want to see him progress into something competent and useful. |
midnightbladeJul 24, 2016 2:58 PM
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| Same here, I feel with you. I begin to hate this character, I hate anyway all those who are yelling all the time. He doesn't use his head at all, even when it could help him to understand what's happening. He is about to fall down to the zero-level of ikoma, the MC in Koutetsujou no Kabaneri. The voice acting is overdoing it sooooo much, it's tiiiiiiiiiiring. Dialogs are also in the "overdoing" register. This show started so well and now it becomes a pain to watch. bad bad bad. |
| I agree! Any normal person would handled this easily and not be stress beyond belief. Watching yours friends and anything you close to resembling family die repeatedly while being unable to stop it due to scale of the threat? Even after going for help and not in any decent timeframe? Pfft. Weaksauce. |
Well, I don't hate Subaru but I see his face really funny...  |
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| In my opinion, it's more of Subaru's descent into madness and how he overcomes it. He shows HUGE signs of mental and personality disorders. It's evident that he is far different from the start of the series. He literally treated this as a video game at the start of the series. He was happy and excited to be in a new world and was in awe with all the types of characters are around him. He was even starstruck when he saw Emilia as a half-elf. As the series goes on, he does retain some of his old self, which I found him unbearable at times, but that slowly disappears each and every time he dies. Not only he loses his life, he loses a part of himself due to the trauma he received from dying and the events that led up to that point. Emotional and psychological trauma is a serious thing and we bare witness to his fall into insanity. It's easy to see that he's affected not just by being killed, but the memories with the people he cares about are erased too. His memories exist with Emilia when he helped return the young girl to the Appa Merchant. The first time he did the victory pose with Emilia is gone too. With Rem, Subaru knows that she killed him twice, but she has no memory of doing such things. Before Rem killed him for the 2nd time, Subaru hits a breaking point when he realizes that the memories he had with everyone only exists with him when he was yelling at Rem. Subaru: Why don't you remember?! What did I ever do to you? Why do you all keep leaving me behind? Why do you guys hate me so much? During the Emilia/Subaru argument, it's even more apparent that he's becoming more and more delusional in this world that only exists for him. He points out that he has saved Emilia and the others countless times, yet to them, he's only saved them once or twice. He keeps losing his sanity each and every time he dies but still tries to save everyone. Only he can see that and Emilia can't. Emilia: The version of me that lives within you must be amazing. That's because that version of her only exists in Subaru. She is not aware of how they first met and what they did together. This breaks Subaru down even further into despair, knowing that when he fails, those memories are gone forever for them. Those feelings are gone. Everything is gone. The only thing that exists for him are the ones that he survives in. He is literally surviving in a world that not only he has no knowledge of, but he is also living in his own little world. So to me, he's a different brand of hero. Not all heroes are built the same and for him, his story is different. As far as character development goes, I believe that this series focuses solely on him crashing and burning, only to rise above the ashes again, albeit a different person. If the previous Subaru fails, the new Subaru will prevail as long as he keeps standing up. Make no mistake about it, Subaru is a really good guy. As seen in the lap pillow scene, he truly loves being with everyone in this world. He tries so damn hard and everytime he fails, a part of him dies knowing that all his attempts are only known to him. We don't know Subaru in the real world and what life is like on the other side, but on this side, he keeps trying despite his mind decaying and that to me is worthy of the title called "Hero". Now I'm not telling anyone to agree with me nor am I bashing anyone who doesn't likes Subaru. Everyone is entitled to their opinions and as long as someone is respectful to mine, I'll be respectful to yours. You are allowed to hate him, it truly is not my problem, but I do feel obligated to defend people I like, whether its friends, family or fictional characters. I just feel better throwing my two cents in in defending my interest or likes to myself and myself alone. Anyways, I hope you all enjoy the rest of your viewing. If anyone plans to drop this, just be respectful about it. Now that's asking too much, but I enjoy talking to everyone here in a civil manner. Thanks for reading. |
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| I guess Subaru never learned anything especially last episode when he negotiated with the merchants which happened as a result of taking the advice one of the candidates gave him hmm I guess that's not learning or thinking huh. |
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| His jokes are insufferable, yeah. It feels like he has no character flaws besides being an idiot until ep 13. He's a guy who jokes around who's a really good person, which is something learned in the first episode - it's like the only solid foundation this character has. I see no real gradual descent into despair and find him really unbelievable as a character. Having him almost be instantly transported to this world with no contrast with the life he was leading was probably a mistake. |
| Wow some people here sure had some sheltered lifes to not understand something like mental illness or insanity. If you can't accept this and don't relate to the experience in any way you have no hope of understanding any development in this show. |
| Until episode 13 I found him annoying, but after that more than like him, I consider him funny for all what he is suffering, the guy can't just get one thing right on his first try hahaha. |
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Lucky96u said: SKP138 said: In my opinion, it's more of Subaru's descent into madness and how he overcomes it. He shows HUGE signs of mental and personality disorders. It's evident that he is far different from the start of the series. He literally treated this as a video game at the start of the series. He was happy and excited to be in a new world and was in awe with all the types of characters are around him. He was even starstruck when he saw Emilia as a half-elf. As the series goes on, he does retain some of his old self, which I found him unbearable at times, but that slowly disappears each and every time he dies. Not only he loses his life, he loses a part of himself due to the trauma he received from dying and the events that led up to that point. Emotional and psychological trauma is a serious thing and we bare witness to his fall into insanity. It's easy to see that he's affected not just by being killed, but the memories with the people he cares about are erased too. His memories exist with Emilia when he helped return the young girl to the Appa Merchant. The first time he did the victory pose with Emilia is gone too. With Rem, Subaru knows that she killed him twice, but she has no memory of doing such things. Before Rem killed him for the 2nd time, Subaru hits a breaking point when he realizes that the memories he had with everyone only exists with him when he was yelling at Rem. Subaru: Why don't you remember?! What did I ever do to you? Why do you all keep leaving me behind? Why do you guys hate me so much? During the Emilia/Subaru argument, it's even more apparent that he's becoming more and more delusional in this world that only exists for him. He points out that he has saved Emilia and the others countless times, yet to them, he's only saved them once or twice. He keeps losing his sanity each and every time he dies but still tries to save everyone. Only he can see that and Emilia can't. Emilia: The version of me that lives within you must be amazing. That's because that version of her only exists in Subaru. She is not aware of how they first met and what they did together. This breaks Subaru down even further into despair, knowing that when he fails, those memories are gone forever for them. Those feelings are gone. Everything is gone. The only thing that exists for him are the ones that he survives in. He is literally surviving in a world that not only he has no knowledge of, but he is also living in his own little world. So to me, he's a different brand of hero. Not all heroes are built the same and for him, his story is different. As far as character development goes, I believe that this series focuses solely on him crashing and burning, only to rise above the ashes again, albeit a different person. If the previous Subaru fails, the new Subaru will prevail as long as he keeps standing up. Make no mistake about it, Subaru is a really good guy. As seen in the lap pillow scene, he truly loves being with everyone in this world. He tries so damn hard and everytime he fails, a part of him dies knowing that all his attempts are only known to him. We don't know Subaru in the real world and what life is like on the other side, but on this side, he keeps trying despite his mind decaying and that to me is worthy of the title called "Hero". Now I'm not telling anyone to agree with me nor am I bashing anyone who doesn't likes Subaru. Everyone is entitled to their opinions and as long as someone is respectful to mine, I'll be respectful to yours. You are allowed to hate him, it truly is not my problem, but I do feel obligated to defend people I like, whether its friends, family or fictional characters. I just feel better throwing my two cents in in defending my interest or likes to myself and myself alone. Anyways, I hope you all enjoy the rest of your viewing. If anyone plans to drop this, just be respectful about it. Now that's asking too much, but I enjoy talking to everyone here in a civil manner. Thanks for reading. This. All of this. I failed to mention him seeing people he cares about die constantly and how it affects his judgement. Soldiers may be able to handle such situations in war when they see their comrade be slain since they are trained to deal with such situations. Subaru is not a soldier nor did the real world would teach him how to handle terrible situations such as murder. The people he cares about didn't die of natural causes, the people around him were KILLED by someone else's hand, or for one of Rem's deaths, curses, which was brought upon her by another being, so that can still be considered murder. When I was 17 years old, I do not recall a course in school on how to deal with seeing/knowing someone close to me being killed. Subaru is the same, it's a situation he is new to and when it happens over and over, he further descends into madness by his failures. |
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He's been an annoying twat this arc. I've been waiting for him to shape up. I read the synopsis on the light novels to decide if it's still worth putting up with. |
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| I feel like people keep forgetting what Subaru actually is, a NEET. I guess people have been spoiled so much by your typical protagonist managing to solve everything with friendship and typical shounen stuff. A NEET generally has little to no life experience and often self centered/care for themselves only, that's why they're not employed and mooch money off their parents. This meaning it becomes difficult for them to overcome obstacles, especially mentally, as they have no experience to back them up. They can't get out of a certain life phases; they can't grow up. Similar to Subaru with his tantrums and angry bickering. Then add in the fact he's having anxiety attacks non stop from dying and seeing those around him die sure doesn't help any of it. Regardless, humans backed into a corner can do some terrible stuff. |
Necromia said: He's been an annoying twat this arc. I've been waiting for him to shape up. I read the synopsis on the light novels to decide if it's still worth putting up with. He has amnesia I swear... |
Paul said: True, but Subaru acted exactly opposite of selfish (there was a momentarily lapse when he pondered taking advantage of his knowledge to get rich and live easy, but it was so unbelievable based on how he was characterized before that it rang incredibly false). If he didn't bring it up multiple times in beginning, how would you even be aware he was meant to be one?A NEET generally has little to no life experience and often self centered/care for themselves only, that's why they're not employed and mooch money off their parents. |
TonyTheme said: Paul said: True, but Subaru acted exactly opposite of selfish (there was a momentarily lapse when he pondered taking advantage of his knowledge to get rich and live easy, but it was so unbelievable based on how he was characterized before that it rang incredibly false). If he didn't bring it up multiple times in beginning, how would you even be aware he was meant to be one?A NEET generally has little to no life experience and often self centered/care for themselves only, that's why they're not employed and mooch money off their parents. I think the fact that they felt the need to bring it up in the beginning means they wanted it to be factored as part personalty. Assuming that's what you're asking as the question seems a bit weird (if he didn't bring it up, how would I be aware? He brought it up so I am aware...? Confused) |
Air-Dragon said: Necromia said: He's been an annoying twat this arc. I've been waiting for him to shape up. I read the synopsis on the light novels to decide if it's still worth putting up with. He has amnesia I swear... He has amnesia... because he fears and hates pain and trauma of death? Good lord... |
| I feel like it would be way more tolerable if we were binging this series instead of watching it weekly |
| @Paul Eh, being a NEET isn't a personality trait and I mentioned how he contradicts what you expect from someone meant to be selfish and only care about himself. Plus, if someone did mention something about another character that's never displayed by them (his selfishness displayed in later episode has nothing to do with this), isn't that just bad writing? Is the only possible way to learn something about a character by them blurting it out? Think about it like this, he's a shut in but he can impale a mabeast on a part of a tree and wield that big club. His interpersonal skills are much better than you'd expect, he talks easily with people, and has no problem flirting with girls. He's ready to throw caution to the wind and risk his life to save people he barely knows after getting transported to a different dimension while showing no signs of longing for his own world (of presumed leisure) or has a passing thought about his parents. Being a shut in really informs you about nothing. |
No he has amnesia because he keeps doing the same dam thing over an over. Actually he loves pain, walks right into hopeless situations, fear to stupid to have real fear, hasn't even pissed his pants just fooling himself. Trauma he is too self conceited ffor that. Good Witch |
| I think the author is overplaying the insanity card in the 3rd arc. All I see now when Subaru speaks nonsense makes me laugh. When he dies, I think he deserved. There is a fine line between Thriller/Psychological and Comedy (like a B-rated horror movie from the 80s). I cannot see how he will snap out of this in a realistic way. If he starts using his brain, it will be weird now. |
AdrianRubinskyJul 24, 2016 5:34 PM
| No complain for me about him. He have so many flaws but in same time, it's why i like for me. Too much human i think. ^^ |
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TonyTheme said: @Paul Eh, being a NEET isn't a personality trait and I mentioned how he contradicts what you expect from someone meant to be selfish and only care about himself. Plus, if someone did mention something about another character that's never displayed by them (his selfishness displayed in later episode has nothing to do with this), isn't that just bad writing? Is the only possible way to learn something about a character by them blurting it out? Think about it like this, he's a shut in but he can impale a mabeast on a part of a tree and wield that big club. His interpersonal skills are much better than you'd expect, he talks easily with people, and has no problem flirting with girls. He's ready to throw caution to the wind and risk his life to save people he barely knows after getting transported to a different dimension while showing no signs of longing for his own world (of presumed leisure) or has a passing thought about his parents. Being a shut in really informs you about nothing. I feel like it does though. The anime is trying to show him growing out of the phase but still has yet. Like the scene where he tries to live in the mansion without having to work and the only reason he went back to working was because it was part of why they suspected him and why Rem died during that arc. Him trying to save random strangers in beginning is just the common sense of justice, which he probably got from gaming, as you can see all the gaming talk he does in the beginning and I would have to guess anime/manga as you can see his note of 'maid uniforms' meaning he has knowledge of the 'otaku culture'. Shounen is very abundant in both of these and can easily be an influence. In terms of socials skills, I can only make assumptions here to be honest, since the show doesn't feel like giving much backstory on Subaru. One things NEETs love to do is game and there's a popular type of gaming involving communication, that being MMOs and IMO, being a NEET doesn't mean you're instantly socially awkward or in-adept. And too add on to the otaku culture, his need to add'cute' suffixes to Emilia's name such as -tan. The reason he cares after to keep on trying to save them is because actual friendship, possibly true friendship/love for the first time. You'll note that Subaru never reminiscent about his family or friends despite being in such a situation, like any normal person would, why is this? Possibly because he has no actual friends? But in the end, these are still just assumptions. |
PaulJul 24, 2016 5:43 PM
| He's absolutely awful and imo he shouldn't have any emotional baggage since he is literally immortal, he knows at the end of the day he can just re-spawn like its COD it really kills any stakes the show carries for me like this thing with Rem could'nt he just kill himself like in the earlier episodes and change the route he takes And him being human isn't really an argument either since when the scenes are light hearted he acts like a over-exited twat but when the show gets dark suddenly he gets all sad and literally just cries and yells even though he knows that he literally cant die. |
jakobpabloJul 24, 2016 6:00 PM
| Instead of trying to know why everybody is forgetting about rem he just screams and punches others. Nothing changed since midway on this series and I really can't wait to see it over. |
| The closer you get to the light,the greater your shadow becomes. |
Paul said: I think him gladly working in the first scenario, expressing he's never worked so hard in his life (IIRC) and that he would like to keep the wounds on his fingers as a reminder all of the effort he's put in contradicts this idea - he was happy. He had no real aversion and didn't even think asking to be a permanent guest was a possibility until Emilia told him he could've because of his good nature. It's not like sloth and selfishness were his motivations. The anime is trying to show him growing out of the phase but still has yet. Like the scene where he tries to live in the mansion without having to work and the only reason he went back to working was because it was part of why they suspected him and why Rem died during that arc. Him trying to save random strangers in beginning is just the common sense of justice, which he probably got from gaming, as you can see all the gaming talk he does in the beginning and I would have to guess anime/manga as you can see his note of 'maid uniforms' meaning he has knowledge of the 'otaku culture'. Too many assumptions, I think Subaru is more grounded in reality than that. When he's having his monologue before deciding to help, he's thinking about the selfless acts Emilia did despite the inconvenience and sees them as examples to follow. Let's not forget Subaru is only 18. Not like he's been out of school much if he's graduated, so whatever gaming experience he has and its connection to being a NEET is flimsy. Much like you said one is not necessarily socially inept if they're a shut in, knowledge of video games does not imply being a shut in. The former is far more likely, though. You'll note that Subaru never reminiscent about his family or friends despite being in such a situation, like any normal person would, why is this? Possibly because he has no actual friends? I'd agree he doesn't really act like a normal person. I assume he doesn't have any friends, too, but if that were true, it would make sense if that was brought up at any point. The show omits details that could potentially make this character either more empathetic or sympathetic, something that can give his actions more meaning. But in the end, these are still just assumptions. Which is why your argument doesn't really work. You can make so many assumptions (his parents are dead, they molested him, some other unfounded shit), but it's just headcanon. |
jakobpablo said: He's absolutely awful and imo he shouldn't have any emotional baggage since he is literally immortal, he knows at the end of the day he can just re-spawn like its COD it really kills any stakes the show carries for me like this thing with Rem could'nt he just kill himself like in the earlier episodes and change the route he takes And him being human isn't really an argument either since when the scenes are light hearted he acts like a over-exited twat but when the show gets dark suddenly he gets all sad and literally just cries and yells even though he knows that he literally cant die. There's a big difference. First off, there is no mental state of the video game character, it's just a game character, no matter how much a game character dies, they stay the sam. Next, the actual player. If you want to feel closer to what he is, then put the game on the hardest difficulty and play CoD for the first time, if you already played it on a easier difficulty, then everything you did becomes invalid snce you already have knowledge of it, Subaru didn't. You'll start getting angry after dying so many times which applies to Subaru's mental breakdown because it's not just a game for him. Him being human is a definitely a reasonable argument but because it seems like you understand how it feels to constantly die over and over, I'll assume you can reset time too. |
TonyTheme said: But in the end, these are still just assumptions. Which is why your argument doesn't really work. You can make so many assumptions (his parents are dead, they molested him, some other unfounded shit), but it's just headcanon.I think it's perfectly fine to make various amounts of assumptions as long as they don't conflict with your others . Though I'm sure mines have flaws since I honestly never to put much effort into thinking about this kind of stuff, it was mostly just being curious about the topic and just stating what I could remember. Digging for the true/deeper meaning has never been my forte since I do tend to lose sight of the small details. |
| Not really. Yes, clearly he's screwing up more than before but there's no reason throw all the mud on him. His speech, behavior, and actions are all justified given all the consecutive traumas he has experienced AND he knows he will experience unlike everyone around him. Yeah there are probably a number of things he could've done but the realistic scanario for an average character (which Subaru is so far) is that you'd begin lose your rationality so it is only natural there's so much difference between Subaru then and now. Once or twice you can still keep your sanity but he has been through so many and now he is experiencing a new kind of trauma he had not encountered before. He still has no special abilities he can rely on and with Rem gone he is even more helpless. I disagree with this "my ideal MC should stay ideal always" mindset. |
   “There are two kinds of arrogance. One where you are unequal to the task and one where your dreams are too big. The former is commonplace stupidity... but the latter is a rare species that is difficult to find.”  |
| Thread Cleaned Keep your shitpostings to yourself thanks. Your popcorn gifs are irrelevant and spam. Promoting haters and fans to bicker, is also off-topic. |
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| @Paul Don't sweat it, at least you're not telling people they have no life experience or don't understand anything if they don't like or relate to Subaru and you're having an actual discussion. Assumptions based on events and information in the story are all right, obviously. I'm not crazy. Leaving in blanks to fill can be fine and even part of the charm, allowing the audience to imbue things into the narrative, but I think how this goes about it in relation to Subaru is too much and it hurts his character more than anything. This is why I think his attitude in ep 13 and 14 was him at his most interesting besides 7. |
| I think Subaru has the behaviour that anyone else would have. I mean if you died multiples times trying to save people who died a lot of times and you're trying to alert them that something's coming and no-one wan to believe you, you're gonna go insane. It's kinda realistic character don't you think ? He's pratically in Hell |
| His actions are pretty cringe worthy, and no its not because he is descending into madness... its just the way its portrayed.. like THAT FACE and those stupid Steins Gate poses and some of the things he says are just plain dumb (which again has nothing to do with his mental state). |
| Kirito is a much better MC than Subaru |
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brittanyhoot said: I know he is damaged now and that affects his character, but at the same time I feel that he could make more progress if he would keep a cool head. If he would have kept a cool head, what would be the meaning of the show ? He would be exactly as the same we all saw during the first 2-3 episodes. It's pointless. jakobpablo said: He's absolutely awful and imo he shouldn't have any emotional baggage since he is literally immortal, he knows at the end of the day he can just re-spawn like its COD Waw... Try to put you at his place. Even though you have the ability to respawn everytime, you would be ok with sufferring every single time ? Like Subaru never died "peacefully". I bet if someone shoots you in an arm you will not want to feel the same pain again. Imagine him dying brutally everytime then (Like frozen to death, his head got cut off, jumped off a cliff etc...). Would you be ok with seeing the people you're trying to save everytime die no matter what you're trying to do to protect them ? Would you be ok being unable to explain why you want to save people and why you know what will happen to them ? And even if you can, who says they would believe you, would be ok with that ? But if you want to compare his situation to CoD... If you're saying that he became unbearable, he has no reason to go insane etc when the guy died multiple times since the beginning of the show, trying to save everyone using his ability, you should probably stop watching it.. |
jakobpablo said: He's absolutely awful and imo he shouldn't have any emotional baggage since he is literally immortal, he knows at the end of the day he can just re-spawn like its COD it really kills any stakes the show carries for me like this thing with Rem could'nt he just kill himself like in the earlier episodes and change the route he takes And him being human isn't really an argument either since when the scenes are light hearted he acts like a over-exited twat but when the show gets dark suddenly he gets all sad and literally just cries and yells even though he knows that he literally cant die. He doesn't know that , he doesn't know a thing about his power. He has said it before, he doesn't know if there is a limit to how many tries he gets. So each and every try he treats it like the last. The only thing he knows are what he has assumed. And you can't just kill yourself , you have to keep going to see what the future holds. If you solve one problem without having the next problem being addressed he won't be able to solve problems the right way. Most people watching don't know how they would actually be able to solve the whole current arc and complain on how he doesn't know on top of him being emotionally and mentally exhausted. There is a lot of ways to justify his actions and because of those very reasons people look down on his actions. |
liddojuniorJul 24, 2016 10:06 PM
Air-Dragon said: No he has amnesia because he keeps doing the same dam thing over an over. Actually he loves pain, walks right into hopeless situations, fear to stupid to have real fear, hasn't even pissed his pants just fooling himself. Trauma he is too self conceited ffor that. Good Witch So did he in episode 14 & 15 go to get help? Did he in episode 14 & 15 use lessons he learned from the other candidates to establish a proper negotiation with merchant convoy to evacuate the villagers? If he didn't then what is this bull your speaking? Because this is clearly not him doing the something over and over again. Not mention even see the fact all extreme situations are making emotionally unstable then you freaking blind. Yes he hasn't made all best moves, but so fucking what? Who wouldn't after what he's gone through and still going with the mounting pressure? But thanks for ignoring what happens in the episodes to say generalize nonsense because you can't handle someone having work though their problems while barely holding themselves together. |
Iron_MawJul 24, 2016 11:24 PM
| Leave it up to the pretentious overthinkers to think edge = character development. Your long essays are hilarious, KEEP THEM COMING!! Using the time reset premise and not utilising it at all but instead just being torture porn for edgelords is retarded. This is shitty writing at it's finest. And it's so funny that people eat this shit up because it has the tinniest bit of self awareness. |
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