Sayalol said: mightykid218 said: tesiga2003 said: alcurad said: Exactly.at such situations do you really think one is in full control of re/actions? it wasn't a fucking yeti, or someone with a weapon. it was a guy looting. his life wasn't threatened to a point where this is even close to acceptable. Yes, but, there are no real witnesses other than him. All they have is what he says since the guy who broke in is dead. People will view it as, some guy tried to break in, the guy defended his property. That's what it will be seen as. Hell, if some body were to every break into my house and steal my stuff, stuff I bought with the money I worked for, trust me, I would make sure that guy leaves my house in a body bag. I live in Texas though, as stated before, so, it's actually legal for me to do that with out a need for a trial or even to be looked into. He doesn't live in Texas. However, he almost certainly does live in a state where there are laws on excessive force. Kinda like in American History X. "Oh is dat some black man outside mah house?" /curb. Not nearly as extreme mind you, but it's the same idea. "Oh noes he take mah stuff!" /sword. He could have just, I dunno, not killed him. But that's biased. Because I hate our legal system. I think we need to get rid of all this "what if/moral" bullshit grey area, and if you kill someone, regardless of why, you fucking go to jail. Forever. |
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| So if someone is holding a gun to you're head and you stab him in the leg with a pocket knife in self defense and he ends up bleeding out. You think that you should go to jail? |
Speed is Life - 1st ID... patch on my shoulder. |
tesiga2003 said: So if someone is holding a gun to you're head and you stab him in the leg with a pocket knife in self defense and he ends up bleeding out. You think that you should go to jail? Well, on paper yeah. Because if we made it evident we were going to show no mercy for killing, people wouldn't do this even half as much as they do now. The whole violence problem we have, in my opinion, has a lot to do with all the ways you can get away with killing someone. This (not your example, thread topic) is a great example. Clearly excessive force, yet due to lack of witness (he samurai'd the only one) he can say whatever the hell he wants and more likely than not people are gonna roll with it. |
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Beef_Whistle said: tesiga2003 (66.2% Male) said: Beef_Whistle said: Guess what? That nerd is going to jail. Ass rape anyone? And how do you figure that? It doesnt say anywhere on there that the guy got arrested... He killed another man. With a sword. He can't just get off without some kind of punishment. It was self defense. So obviously he won't go to jail. |
| More importantly: will his sword be at ebay? |
 Waratte Oemashou Sore ha Chiisana Inori |
ladyxzeus said: More importantly: will his sword be at ebay? you mean male escorts? |
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| He'd have been fucked if they had guns. |
mightykid218 said: tesiga2003 said: So if someone is holding a gun to you're head and you stab him in the leg with a pocket knife in self defense and he ends up bleeding out. You think that you should go to jail? Well, on paper yeah. Because if we made it evident we were going to show no mercy for killing, people wouldn't do this even half as much as they do now. The whole violence problem we have, in my opinion, has a lot to do with all the ways you can get away with killing someone. This (not your example, thread topic) is a great example. Clearly excessive force, yet due to lack of witness (he samurai'd the only one) he can say whatever the hell he wants and more likely than not people are gonna roll with it. No matter what, he still did it to protect himself. Now, yes, the robber might of possibly said "Oh shit, I'll leave you have a sword," but, he could of also attacked him knowing he had a sword thinking he could dodge it, or get it from him. We really don't know. What we do know is, this guy broke into his gauarge with the intention of stealing this guys stuff. I, personally, don't feel anyone should be punished for killing someone in self defence. It's you or him. If he's attacking you, and the only way you could effectivley defend your self is with a sword, gun, or something else, and use use it, hit a vital part of the body and this person dies, you should not be held responsible. The robber's hand was almost severed, and his upper body was lacerated. The hand could of been easily damaged like that because the robber tried to black the sword from hitting him. What would you do if someone broke into your house and you were right there to see it and all you had was a knife in your hands(let's say you were cutting some vegitables for dinner)? I know I wouldn't let him leave. He broke into my house trying to steal my stuff. That doesn't work for me. |
 L2 Search - http://fc04.deviantart.com/fs48/f/2009/236/3/9/L2_Search_by_Siya_Akuma.jpg We're all getting trolled by Mayans. They probably thought "Fuck this shit, let's end the calendar and say shit's gonna go down." |
| Where did he get a samurai sword o_O or wasnt it those real ones. |
| Needs more Drill Hair. |
LaiLidE said: Where did he get a samurai sword o_O or wasnt it those real ones. It's not hard to get. You can buy Katanas, tantos, etc...Any where. Online, sword shops. |
L2 Search - http://fc04.deviantart.com/fs48/f/2009/236/3/9/L2_Search_by_Siya_Akuma.jpg We're all getting trolled by Mayans. They probably thought "Fuck this shit, let's end the calendar and say shit's gonna go down." |
| Those Hopkins guys are crazy. Back when I was in school I was at a lacrosse match against JHU when one of my friends made a rather disparaging comment about Mr. Hopkins and his university loudly enough that one dude in a Hopkins Med shirt who overheard became so visibly agitated that I was afraid he was going to take his scalpel set out and incise my friend on the spot. Perhaps that's what happened here. If you don't believe me that they're insane, visit their main library sometime. It's built like NERV HQ. All that's missing is a big pool of goo and a giant nailed to a cross in the cellar, which might very well be down there if you can slip past the janitors. |
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| The problem here isn't self-defense, its the the fact that he become an attacker rather than a defender. You are armed, the man isn't, you want to make him pay for entering your home with bad intentions. No matter how you look at it, the 'right' thing to do is to spare his life and give him a second chance. The 'wrong' thing to do would be revenge. Yes, maybe you are putting yourself at risk of a second robbery or even assault, but then it becomes kill or be killed if you argue it that way, which in the eyes of many is an over exaggeration. |
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Xyik said: The problem here isn't self-defense, its the the fact that he become an attacker rather than a defender. You are armed, the man isn't, you want to make him pay for entering your home with bad intentions. This is assuming he wasn't attacked by the robber first. Just because someone isn't armed, doesn't mean they're not a threat. No matter how you look at it, the 'right' thing to do is to spare his life and give him a second chance. The 'wrong' thing to do would be revenge. To you. This guy could use that second chance to go off and rob some other guy or kill, etc..So, the "right" thing to do in some peoples opinions, would be to take him our before he gets the chance. "Right" and "wrong" are not exact. No one truely knows what right or wrong is.Yes, maybe you are putting yourself at risk of a second robbery or even assault, but then it becomes kill or be killed if you argue it that way, which in the eyes of many is an over exaggeration. I wouldn't see it as that. If someone is trying to killl me, I sure as hell would try to kill him back. |
L2 Search - http://fc04.deviantart.com/fs48/f/2009/236/3/9/L2_Search_by_Siya_Akuma.jpg We're all getting trolled by Mayans. They probably thought "Fuck this shit, let's end the calendar and say shit's gonna go down." |
| Lol at the people who are damning this guy already without full knowledge of what happened. |
| If he was being attacked then it is self defense and it is justified in my eyes. Otherwise I see no reason to slice someone with a samurai sword. There are other solutions to robbers, such as calling the police. |
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Xyik said: If he was being attacked then it is self defense and it is justified in my eyes. Otherwise I see no reason to slice someone with a samurai sword. There are other solutions to robbers, such as calling the police. Yeah! Slicing people with swords is lame. What kind of person would like that kind of thing!?  |
Xyik said: If he was being attacked then it is self defense and it is justified in my eyes. Otherwise I see no reason to slice someone with a samurai sword. There are other solutions to robbers, such as calling the police. Really? So, the theif can get away before the police ever arive? I don't think so. |
L2 Search - http://fc04.deviantart.com/fs48/f/2009/236/3/9/L2_Search_by_Siya_Akuma.jpg We're all getting trolled by Mayans. They probably thought "Fuck this shit, let's end the calendar and say shit's gonna go down." |
| Legal issues aside, I would go fucking berserk if someone tried to break in my house. Maybe I sound conservative, but I think being able to defend your property from intruders is a natural law. In the Islamic Faith, you have the right to kill anyone who invades your home, which is what "Jihad" essentially means; and I personally think it's a very sound idea, and the Muslims would praise this so called, "NERD" you guys are talking about. I mean, if a guy breaks into your house, takes things that you own, and leaves without you even making an effort to stop him yourself... you might as well leave all your valuable shit on your front lawn and put a sign that says, "STEAL THIS, I WON'T HURT YOU." |
| What isn't red? What isn't blue? |
Lamring said: [url=http://www.gantdaily.com/news/35/ARTICLE/61257/2009-09-15.html]http://www.gantdaily.com/news/35/ARTICLE/61257/2009-09-15.html After reading this article i have put serious consideration in purchasing a samurai sword. This kid just made Kenshin Himura cry.  |
| Click on this. I dare you. | MAL Fantasy Football League | Currently Watching List RWBY Club. RWBY is anime. Deal with it. |
KyuuA4 said: Lamring said: [url=http://www.gantdaily.com/news/35/ARTICLE/61257/2009-09-15.html]http://www.gantdaily.com/news/35/ARTICLE/61257/2009-09-15.html After reading this article i have put serious consideration in purchasing a samurai sword. This kid just made Kenshin Himura cry. KyuuA4 said: Lamring said: [url=http://www.gantdaily.com/news/35/ARTICLE/61257/2009-09-15.html]http://www.gantdaily.com/news/35/ARTICLE/61257/2009-09-15.html Nooooooooooooooooooo Kenshin im so sorry i didn't mean it! please stop crying. |
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Sayalol said: Xyik said: The problem here isn't self-defense, its the the fact that he become an attacker rather than a defender. You are armed, the man isn't, you want to make him pay for entering your home with bad intentions. This is assuming he wasn't attacked by the robber first. Just because someone isn't armed, doesn't mean they're not a threat. Techincally speaking there's a difference between self defense and your system of preventive threat assesment. Self defense is NOT the right to kill the person threatening your life. Self defense is the right to to prevent the person from harming you. You can do this in several ways which in most cases do not involve killing (maiming, incapacitation etc.) but if you choose that killing him is less of a bother then we have two scenarios: 1) You kill him with the first attack (shot/knife to the head etc.) and they can't do anything to you since you can always argue that you panicked. 2) You incapacitated him by other means (shot to the leg, hell even both legs if that works for you, why not all four limbs that would be okay with me) and then decide that he may still be a threat to you and proceed to take more drastic measures. In the second scenario you made a preventive threat assessment which honestly most of the times is out of place and exaggerated. It's basically murder since you don't have the right to decide whether or not hes a big enough threat to put out of its misery. You have the right to defend ones self not prevent potential harm to it.... if that would be the case then you could kill a burgler even if it wasn't your house the one being burglered. No matter how you look at it, the 'right' thing to do is to spare his life and give him a second chance. The 'wrong' thing to do would be revenge. To you. This guy could use that second chance to go off and rob some other guy or kill, etc..So, the "right" thing to do in some peoples opinions, would be to take him our before he gets the chance. "Right" and "wrong" are not exact. No one truely knows what right or wrong is.Then again YOU don't have the right to give a verdict on what's "right" or whats "wrong". Some people have a job to better discern between the two, mainly because they are more objective then you will ever be when confronted with such a situation. Yes, maybe you are putting yourself at risk of a second robbery or even assault, but then it becomes kill or be killed if you argue it that way, which in the eyes of many is an over exaggeration. I wouldn't see it as that. If someone is trying to killl me, I sure as hell would try to kill him back. So according to the last phrase it would seem that society is not the place for you. Let's say that in self defense you kill someone and are afterwards through an odd procedure sentenced to death.... then if the latter statement is true you'd become nothing more than another criminal. This post made me think alot about the Punisher... In all honesty if the system fails repeatedly change the system not ignore it completely. Edit: Waaaaay to many typos. |
PinguinusSep 17, 2009 6:43 PM
| That's not my point. Here in Texas, if someone breaks into your home, you can legally kill them. Wow. My assumption that Texas had at least a minimal degree of civilization was utterly crushed in one sentence. ROLF xD oh and that sword, how the hell was it that sharp to begin with? |
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Pinguinus said: Then again YOU don't have the right to give a verdict on what's "right" or whats "wrong". Some people have a job to better discern between the two, mainly because they are more objective then you will ever be when confronted with such a situation. No, they don't. No one does. Why? because what is right and wrong varies between cultures and people. Fact is, someone thinking it's the right thing to do and spare someone who just tried to kill them would be the same concept of me thinking it's right to kill someone because they tried to kill me first. No one has the right to define what right and wrong is. You have your moral standards, I have mine, everyone else has theres. That all. Fact is, I never said I have that verdict now did I? Hence So, the "right" thing to do in some peoples opinions, would be to take him our before he gets the chance. So according to the last phrase it would seem that society is not the place for you. Let's say that in self defense you kill someone and are afterwards through an odd procedure sentenced to death.... then if the latter statement is true you'd become nothing more than another criminal. What point are you trying to make? I would try and kill someone if they tried to kill me. As in, if they come at me with a gun, or knife, I will fight back, and I will do just as much attempt to kill them as they do me. I'm not going to go back and try and kill them if they don't succeed and manage to get away. This post made me think alot about the Punisher... Except the Punisher went back for Revenge. I would do it in the heat of the moment. Big difference. |
L2 Search - http://fc04.deviantart.com/fs48/f/2009/236/3/9/L2_Search_by_Siya_Akuma.jpg We're all getting trolled by Mayans. They probably thought "Fuck this shit, let's end the calendar and say shit's gonna go down." |
mardycardy said: That's not my point. Here in Texas, if someone breaks into your home, you can legally kill them. Wow. My assumption that Texas had at least a minimal degree of civilization was utterly crushed in one sentence. ROLF xD oh and that sword, how the hell was it that sharp to begin with? They wouldn't normally kill them unless it was self defense. Also I can tell you don't know anything about katanas. |
| i dont get it ? where in the article does it say hes a nerd? |
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Kazuzu said: i dont get it ? where in the article does it say hes a nerd? He has a samurai sword. If that doesn't make him a nerd, I don't know what does. |
Malapharos said: Kazuzu said: i dont get it ? where in the article does it say hes a nerd? He has a samurai sword. If that doesn't make him a nerd, I don't know what does. Don't you know? Guns are the cool American things nowadays. |
| Click on this. I dare you. | MAL Fantasy Football League | Currently Watching List RWBY Club. RWBY is anime. Deal with it. |
| I think the undergraduate student must have been watching too much Samurai X or reading Vagabond. He got the perfect oppurtunity to try out his skillz and he got it. The burglar had a previous conviction but I don't think he would go to jail for long. |
Watch your thoughts; they become words. Watch your words; they become actions. Watch your actions; they become habits. Watch your habits; they become character. Watch your character; it becomes your destiny- Lao-Tze. |
| While these expert legal discussions between 15 year-olds who haven't yet graduated high school are plenty amusing, let's at least get the facts right. The student has not even been arrested, let alone charged with a crime, let alone convicted by the DA. I asked a friend who works as a lawyer on the East Coast about this, and he says it's unlikely that the student will get charged, since the thief has an extensive criminal record, had already burglarized the place, and lunged at the student in question. If the other witnesses corroborate this last sentence, there are virtually no legal grounds upon which to charge him with a crime. |
| Texas > All other states Shit, we can kill people for breakin' into our homes. Is that not badass or what? |
| I'm back. |
Malapharos said: Kazuzu said: i dont get it ? where in the article does it say hes a nerd? He has a samurai sword. If that doesn't make him a nerd, I don't know what does. I didn't know having a sword made somebody a nerd. |
YoungVagabond said: While these expert legal discussions between 15 year-olds who haven't yet graduated high school are plenty amusing, let's at least get the facts right. For the record, just becasue you haven't graduated high school doesn't mean you can't know what you're talking about when it comes to the law. Sick_Bastard said: Texas > All other states Shit, we can kill people for breakin' into our homes. Is that not badass or what? True story Drunk_Samurai said: Malapharos said: Kazuzu said: i dont get it ? where in the article does it say hes a nerd? He has a samurai sword. If that doesn't make him a nerd, I don't know what does. I didn't know having a sword made somebody a nerd. The ability to kill is always nerdy clearly :P |
L2 Search - http://fc04.deviantart.com/fs48/f/2009/236/3/9/L2_Search_by_Siya_Akuma.jpg We're all getting trolled by Mayans. They probably thought "Fuck this shit, let's end the calendar and say shit's gonna go down." |
| I'm moving to texas when i'm older now. |
Sayalol said: YoungVagabond said: While these expert legal discussions between 15 year-olds who haven't yet graduated high school are plenty amusing, let's at least get the facts right. For the record, just becasue you haven't graduated high school doesn't mean you can't know what you're talking about when it comes to the law. Well, you've totally convinced me. From now on, I'll take all my legal advice from 15 year-olds on an Internet anime forum. Fuck all those professional lawyers with more years of law school and case trials than you've been alive, and 60+ hours a week poring over state laws, legal documents, and Supreme Court cases. Obviously, you're the bigger expert. My bad. |
| dude, we're discussing the moral implications, not laws per se :) |
Beef_Whistle said: Guess what? That nerd is going to jail. Ass rape anyone? Gonna have fun tossing salad. |
 Xiaoling Squirrel; baddest rodent in the forest. |
Sick_Bastard said: Texas > All other states Shit, we can kill people for breakin' into our homes. Is that not badass or what? Texas<Arizona. We can kill robbers in our homes, and now can legally carry concealed weapons into bars...genius! \Back to the wild wild west, baby. I guess the Sheriff got tired of shooting -cans, and wants to liven things up. We'll soon have new stories of gunslingers and bounty hunters. The Great Light Rail robbery of 2012 will go down in history, along with the Shootout at the OK Corral Trailer and RV park. Bang, bang...bitches. |
| Is there another word for synonym? |
YoungVagabond said: Well, you've totally convinced me. From now on, I'll take all my legal advice from 15 year-olds on an Internet anime forum. Fuck all those professional lawyers with more years of law school and case trials than you've been alive, and 60+ hours a week poring over state laws, legal documents, and Supreme Court cases. Obviously, you're the bigger expert. My bad. Yes...because that's exactly what a I meant...-_- That is not even close to what I said nor is it some how in any way implied. You said While these expert legal discussions between 15 year-olds who haven't yet graduated high school are plenty amusing, let's at least get the facts right. By specifically pointing out the age and education level you imply that if you're 15 years old or have not graduated High School you don't know anything about the laws and legal system and how they work. I said For the record, just becasue you haven't graduated high school doesn't mean you can't know what you're talking about when it comes to the law. This only says that just because we have not graduated High School does not mean we do not know what we're talking about. Nothing else was implied at all. So I'm not even sure what kind of a point you were tying to make by post that response. |
SayalolSep 17, 2009 10:16 PM
L2 Search - http://fc04.deviantart.com/fs48/f/2009/236/3/9/L2_Search_by_Siya_Akuma.jpg We're all getting trolled by Mayans. They probably thought "Fuck this shit, let's end the calendar and say shit's gonna go down." |
Sayalol said: By specifically pointing out the age and education level you imply that if you're 15 years old or have not graduated High School you don't know anything about the laws and legal system and how they work. No, no you don't. This is a complex legal issue that necessitates specific knowledge of Maryland state law and precedent, and which even professional lawyers will have diverging opinions about. Considering that you're too young to have even taken a basic Law 101 class, your opinion on this matter (and mine, for that matter) is entirely worthless. |
| Omg, this is reverting into another of those hypocrit "OMG KILLING IS BAD LULZ" topic. Heck. Try being a bit more original guys! Fuck USA best state crap. You guys fight even because of that? Whats the point?! Come on for christ sake, that sounds as childish as "console wars" crap. YoungVagabond says the truth. Tho I don't know why he said something like: YoungVagabond said: other than asking people to fight him head on.While these expert legal discussions between 15 year-olds who haven't yet graduated high school are plenty amusing... |
| Hiten Mitsurugi Style! PROPERTY PROTECTION! |
Ryushi said: Omg, this is reverting into another of those hypocrit "OMG KILLING IS BAD LULZ" topic. Heck. Try being a bit more original guys! Fuck USA best state crap. You guys fight even because of that? Whats the point?! Come on for christ sake, that sounds as childish as "console wars" crap. YoungVagabond says the truth. Tho I don't know why he said something like: YoungVagabond said: other than asking people to fight him head on.While these expert legal discussions between 15 year-olds who haven't yet graduated high school are plenty amusing... Take some Ritalin and a nap son, you're getting worked up over nothing. Your limits of english comprehension are showing, even I can't read a challenge to fisticuffs in the above statement (and when I get drink tequila, I can read a challenge in every 'hello' or 'excuse me' that is said...). LOL @ Lepchin17, 'cept his reverse blade from taiwan hadn't arrived yet... |
| Is there another word for synonym? |
Akito38 said: money is not greater than life. But the well being and survival of my family is definitely greater than some little shit criminal. Oh but we are just supposed to lose everything to save the life of some rat scum. That is lower than a diseased alley cat? I think not. that king of overboard moralist Idealism is incredibly naive. Want to break into someones home to Steal stuff, commit rape or murder etc? At that point you are taking a risk. Are you going to get away with it? or are you going to get shot? After all when someone is breaking into your home or business you don't know why they are there. Maybe they just want to steal your t.v, Maybe they want to rape your wife or daughter. Maybe they want to kill all of you. Or maybe they just wanted to sneak in do some crack and leave. Who knows? likewise you don't know if they are armed or not. Back to what happened with my parents business. The scum rat who broke in was in fact my cousin. He had no criminal history but needed some help getting started in life. He also stole the key from one of the other supervisors. As a result of his actions not only did we lose everything. The people working for us lost their jobs as well. My dad had a horrible heart attack as a result. Tax payers dollars were wasted on the investigation. A lot was lost. don't want to get shot or stabbed breaking into someplace? then don't break in. I am not going to lose out when I have done nothing wrong for those little shits. Likewise the world revolves around money anyway. Everything you see. Politics, wars, business,religion everything. If you don't see that then get your head of the clouds. So, feel free to correct me if I'm wrong here, but based on what you've posted anyone breaking in anywhere at any time should be punished by death, no matter what, armed or not, because of a particularly bad personal experience you had? Noting again that I'm not saying you've no right to that opinion, because that is a dreadful thing to have happen, but there just seems to be something wrong with the "no mercy" ever attitude. And grouping a break in automatically with rape and murder is also iffy. And yes, I'm still in college, I know I'm not a lawyer, let's not have that pointed out. but the minimal law I've had to take so far is more than enough to know that the repercussions legally for rape and theft are very different. And for a good reason. And before it even becomes a problem, I am not at all suggesting that self defense would be wrong were an armed, dangerous person enters your house. even if they are unarmed. but if you simply kill someone just because you see them stealing, nothing more or less, I think that's an issue itself. |
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mightykid218 said: but there just seems to be something wrong with the "no mercy" ever attitude. And grouping a break in automatically with rape and murder is also iffy. And yes, I'm still in college, I know I'm not a lawyer, let's not have that pointed out. but the minimal law I've had to take so far is more than enough to know that the repercussions legally for rape and theft are very different. And for a good reason. And before it even becomes a problem, I am not at all suggesting that self defense would be wrong were an armed, dangerous person enters your house. even if they are unarmed. but if you simply kill someone just because you see them stealing, nothing more or less, I think that's an issue itself. That's why it's easier when your country doesen't allow death sentences. If you kill him in your house it's still murder. Frankly i never understood why killing is better than a life of torture and ass raep. If someone killed a member of my family i would love to see him suffer until i get bored of it instead of just seeing him dead.... Also why do you think police officers only shoot when absolutely necesarry instead of applying a shoot first, try to convince him to surrender later policy. If they see a person running with a potentially deadly weapon say an axe why don't they just shoot him first thing in order to prevent potential harm to others? |
| ..well, that issue is really complicated in our country where police officers abuse their power of being able to shoot a suspect..most of them end up killing the suspect..i think that it is better if they shoot to immobilize rather than to kill..they really need further training on these matters..*sigh*...but i get ur point, pinguinus..how is it done in your country?? |
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