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SaneSavantElla said: Red_Ranger_Wien said: The second half was kind of stupid, not gonna lie. The "hero" knows everything is a lie but keeps it going anyway despite the fact that it'd be better for everyone involved if he just came clean. It's not "better for everyone". Did you even listen to the guy's last words to Kino? "I don't want to ruin anything anymore. Not my friend's way of life as a spy for the royal family. Not the feelings of those kind people who don't know anything. Not the new system we created for this country after the revolution. And... not my life with my lover who really wasn't just using me." If he revealed the truth, several things could happen at once: 1. His friend was a spy for the royal family. Remember that it was only 5 years since the revolution; loyalists can try to restore the monarchy using the princess, which... 2. Could lead to civil war, destroying the new system of the country. 3. He would hurt the trust of the people who truly cared for and pitied him. 4. The princess' life could be targeted by the revolutionaries, destroying their life together. He knows all of these and decided to sacrifice one thing: to be able to express his feelings openly to the woman he loves. And so he indirectly expresses his love by declaring that he would wait for her forever (and she for one, is flattered that he loved her so much he would not want another woman). Thus the subtitle of the episode "Waiting For You". Then just tell her. Pretend when anyone comes snooping around but there's zero reason to keep it up when it's just the two of them. |
| Wow, the second part "Country of liars" was awesome and pretty much on the level as episodes from the first series. |
One Piece episode 914 & 915 & 1027 were a mistake and 957 brought the salvation - FMmatron |
| I really enjoyed this episode, both parts were really good. I do think that the first part of it was overpowered by the second half. It was depressing hearing that motorrad's voice being all raspy and begging to die. But Kino kinda helped him by sending that young boy to talk to him at the end to possibly spark something. I may be the in the minority, but i really like the first half compared to the second as we see what happens to motarrads without their originally owner which has been on mind since the beginning of this show. |
| 2 countries in 1 episode... 1 setup for the kid to take the dirt bike. 2 dude's pro at acting like a crazy man. |
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ThatCynicalOtaku said: The most fucked up and disgusting episode of this series by far. Everyone's a liar, and they're happy with it. Kino's positive reaction and the music further reinforces that it's apperenlty good for everybody to be lying to each other. You must be either living in a good environment or too ignorant to the real world when you can say that. The amount of thing people will do for the sake of maintaining the status quo is staggering. Lying is pretty tame, some countries in our world went as far as genocide. They may be living in lies, but that's better than having another civil war. The citizen can enjoy their newly found peace, the hero and the princess are together. Nothing wrong with that Little confused by the ending. Does the man know everything? That the woman whom he's living with is actually his lover, the princess? Yes, he also know that his friend (the guy who told Kino about the country history) is a spy for the royal family. |
| another predictable episode, but not bad. better than anything that came before |
| N.etorare T.echnical R.esearcher |
ThatCynicalOtaku said: Red_Ranger_Wien said: Then just tell her. Pretend when anyone comes snooping around but there's zero reason to keep it up when it's just the two of them. I think it could be more of a psychological thing. Maybe the man doesn't want to accept the fact that if he tells his lover he knows who she is, he would actually have to live with the truth. Basically, he's still lying to HIMSELF, to not deal with the reality. I think it's bcoz if they become lovely dovey all of a sudden, the townspeople will realize, hey you know what wtf those two fooled us his not our "hero" anymore and the princess is alive, kill her along with our "hero". Like the hero stated at the end, he don't want to ruin the current system "they have created" |
TsundeReaper said: ThatCynicalOtaku said: I think it could be more of a psychological thing. Maybe the man doesn't want to accept the fact that if he tells his lover he knows who she is, he would actually have to live with the truth. Basically, he's still lying to HIMSELF, to not deal with the reality. I think it's bcoz if they become lovely dovey all of a sudden, the townspeople will realize, hey you know what wtf those two fooled us his not our "hero" anymore and the princess is alive, kill her along with our "hero". Like the hero stated at the end, he don't want to ruin the current system "they have created" 1) How would the townspeople know. It seemed like they rarely went out there to see him and when they did the scenario you described seems a bit OOC at least for the townspeople we see in the episode. 2) They could just leave. |
| It was too obvious when that guy started telling the lover's story that the princess was the maid. It was also too obvious that the "crazy guy" was lying near the end of episode then the titlecard "land of liars" came up. I think that's my main problem with the show overall, nothing really surprising happened yet. |
| Yes. Yes. YES. This is the Kino I want. Shocked nailed everything I wanted to say about the episode so no need to rephrase. Shocked said:  This is what I've been waiting for since the beginning of the series. No violence, lots of interactions with people, storybook-like narratives, and fairly straightforward short stories that have a layer or two of implicitness and complexity underneath. I liked the first story for how it relates back to Kino's history without really saying too much, while leaving the ending open to let you guess at what might happen to the motorrad in the museum. Plus, Kino's response to not take any action to either save or destroy the motorrad was excellent. I liked the second story for having a surprisingly complex relationship described within half an episode. Everyone was living a lie, and they were all aware of their lies and were content with it. Heck, even Kino played along. Simple without having to overextend. Kino's Journey is fully capable of telling profound stories, but it's also capable of being quaint and cathartic in its other tales. Admittedly, I've taken a liking to the opening and ending themes, through they're still new to me, and the CGI is still distracting when a CGI Kino is standing next to another 2D character in the same frame. But, as far as establishing nice atmosphere and tone, I'm definitely a fan of this episode. About this, though: ThatCynicalOtaku said: My problem with this episode is how it GLORIFIES, lying. The characters are happy about it. Kino's happy about it. The music is bright and cheerful. Nothing is left for interpretation: lying is good if people are happy about it. And that's fucked up. No, and it's kind of sad that this needs to be clarified because the Kino of this season has been so prone to intervene in political issues. Kino is not the heroine of this story, she is not there to fix things but to understand why they are set that way. People have their reasons, societies work in different ways and all she can do is listen and accept because that is her motto as a traveller. She is not anymore happy here than she was when she knew and understood the truth about the country in the first episode, she likes to hear and dig into the countries she visits and how they work and that's ultimately what leads to this satisfaction to her. On the other hand I'm quite surprised that of all scenarios you are reacting so strongly against this. I mean, each one has its own set of morals but I don't think accepting a lie that makes people happy under its illusion is a big moral deal compared with slaughtering citizens, invading other countries or controlling crime through mob lynching. Either way that's not relevant because you are not taking into account that this show does not judge. It shows: people are happy this way, they have found a comfortable statu quo in their lives. The implications however are left to reflection. Whether it is morally acceptable or not, whether things should be fixed or not, this series is not about giving these definite answers. Just because it's "bright and colorful" (really?) or because characters don't tell you in the face that they are in the wrong doesn't mean that the episode condones anything because the series is not about condoning or justifying behaviors. It is reality seen through Kino's lens, and Kino's lens is objective and neutral. |
ThatCynicalOtaku said: jal90 said: On the other hand I'm quite surprised that of all scenarios you are reacting so strongly against this. I mean, each one has its own set of morals but I don't think accepting a lie that makes people happy under its illusion is a big moral deal compared with slaughtering citizens, invading other countries or controlling crime through mob lynching. Either way that's not relevant because you are not taking into account that this show does not judge. It shows: people are happy this way, they have found a comfortable statu quo in their lives. The implications however are left to reflection. Whether it is morally acceptable or not, whether things should be fixed or not, this series is not about giving these definite answers. Just because it's "bright and colorful" (really?) or because characters don't tell you in the face that they are in the wrong doesn't mean that the episode condones anything because the series is not about condoning or justifying behaviors. It is reality seen through Kino's lens, and Kino's lens is objective and neutral. You haven't answered any of my points. The protagonist's point of view of the story, and the music that is used, are basic but major components in setting a scene's tone and delivering the message. To ignore these components is to throw away any critical analysis in favor of biased fanboyism. Kino is supposed to be the "neutral observer" in order to prevent any episode from being biased towards one side or the other. If this episode is "not about condoning or justifying behaviors", then why does: -Kino smile for everyone's decision at the end? -The music that plays at the end positive and uplifting? This is my problem with most people on MAL: they treat anime as though it is a life of its own, so anything it says, it will be said directly by the characters, rather than characters' point of view, cinematography, choice of music, etc. It is a delusional way to view anime that prevents any critical thinking. No sir, nobody says that the anime is a life of its own, you are saying that the creator/director of this anime condones this behaviour through lighting and colour and through the events it narrates, which if you have some minimal experience with Kino no tabi it's very easy to debunk. And it's not about the story being a sentient entity in its own, it's about the story being created under a purpose that has remained for every episode and that is its main appeal. Why does Kino smile? What a question. Why shouldn't she? She is in no way outraged. She is happy to know how people live there and to understand them. She could have said: "Hey, you are living a lie" but that goes against her philosophy of life, which you should know of at this point and again, if you don't I can only blame this show having Kino take a proactive role various times this season for this confusion. This is how Kino actually looks like 95% of the time so better get used. Why did Kino not help the motorrad in the first story? Why did Kino not try to save the traveller in episode 1? Can I ask what aesthetic alternative would you have presented? A grim one that doesn't reflect the state of mind of the world and characters introduced? If a character talks about his happiness would you make the scene sad-looking on purpose? Because THAT would be a very blatant and uncalled for positioning. Also, the next time you can't shut your mouth with implications and ad hominems cry them to the wall in your room because I don't want to read them. |
ThatCynicalOtaku said: jal90 said: No sir, nobody says that the anime is a life of its own, you are saying that the creator/director of this anime condones this behaviour through lighting and colour and through the events it narrates, which if you have some minimal experience with Kino no tabi it's very easy to debunk. And it's not about the story being a sentient entity in its own, it's about the story being created under a purpose that has remained for every episode and that is its main appeal. Why does Kino smile? What a question. Why shouldn't she? She is in no way outraged. She is happy to know how people live there and to understand them. She could have said: "Hey, you are living a lie" but that goes against her philosophy of life, which you should know of at this point and again, if you don't I can only blame this show having Kino take a proactive role various times this season for this confusion. This is how Kino actually looks like 95% of the time so better get used. Why did Kino not help the motorrad in the first story? Why did Kino not try to save the traveller in episode 1? Can I ask what aesthetic alternative would you have presented? A grim one that doesn't reflect the state of mind of the world and characters introduced? If a character talks about his happiness would you make the scene sad-looking on purpose? Because THAT would be a very blatant and uncalled for positioning. Also, the next time you can't shut your mouth with implications and ad hominems cry them to the wall in your room because I don't want to read them. Simple. Don't have cheerful music play. Or heck, don't have any music play. Have Kino's expression at the end be of uncertainty, when she thinks back on her encounter. When she smiled at the end for everyone, that was her basically agreeing, which contradicts the purpose of her as a neutral observer, alienating any audience member like me who believes its wrong for the characters to be lying. As for Kino's actions like the motorcycle? That's not what I've been talking about, you're going off-topic. I wasn't throwing ad hominems; I was just saying that, form my perspective, you weren't thinking outside of the box and were looking on whether the characters follow logic, more than what their actions are saying, basically, just like so many people on MAL, who excuse any criticism with, "but this is how the character behaves, so it's inevitable" My perspective comes from experience with the show, the character and the expectations it sets, yours is debunked in the same episode, not only in the first but in the second story. Nowhere it is said that Kino agrees with the moral and emotional reasons, she is grateful for being told about them, and thanks people for telling her, and I know that because Kino says herself and because she smiles then. Your accusation is a personal interpretation that is never told bluntly or even suggested. And if from your perspective I'm a blind fanboy who is incapable of thinking clearly you can go fuck yourself and your perspective. Is it clear? Not play any music? So just because the show does not take an active stance for or against something it doesn't have to use aesthetics to reflect a mood? Show me an alternative that is viable and makes sense in context and we'll talk. Not playing any music is telling you that the scene is dead serious, it is invalidating the happiness of this character and in turn his lifestyle. If I tell you that the intent of the show is not to prove characters right or wrong tell me what is the point of this alternative. |
ThatCynicalOtaku said: jal90 said: My perspective comes from experience with the show, the character and the expectations it sets, yours is debunked in the same episode, not only in the first but in the second story. Nowhere it is said that Kino agrees with the moral and emotional reasons, she is grateful for being told about them, and thanks people for telling her, and I know that because Kino says herself and because she smiles then. Your accusation is a personal interpretation that is never told bluntly or even suggested. And if from your perspective I'm a blind fanboy who is incapable of thinking clearly you can go fuck yourself and your perspective. Is it clear? Not play any music? So just because the show does not take an active stance for or against something it doesn't have to use aesthetics to reflect a mood? Show me an alternative that is viable and makes sense in context and we'll talk. Not playing any music is telling you that the scene is dead serious, it is invalidating the happiness of this character and in turn his lifestyle. If I tell you that the intent of the show is not to prove characters right or wrong tell me what is the point of this alternative. I think you're still ignoring most of the things I've said. From my experience, when people on the internet start asking people to, "offer an alternate solution", they're actually saying, "I will never agree with you". At this point, no matter whatever "solution" I offer, you will find a way to throw it out the window: you will continue insulting me (ie "fuck yourself"), oversimplify/exaggerate anything I say, all for the purpose, of never agreeing with me, no matter how much logical sense my opinion is. "And if from your perspective I'm a blind fanboy who is incapable of thinking clearly" It's not just you. I consider myself to be far more intelligent than 90% of people online. I'm not joking, but I'm sorry for oversimplifying your perspective down to fanboyism. Are you going to play the victim now? Can't you just apologize or just, you know, move on? I am not the one who heated this debate with the "blind fanboyism" argument, so don't put the blame on me if I respond accordingly. I am not going to respect something that disrespects me, I was nice enough in my second answer I think. If you didn't mean harm then fine, let's move on and focus on the debate at once. I have mentioned stuff from the series, the character psychology, the same episode and even the same story in my arguments, don't play the "you are ignoring most of what I said" card either because it's simply not true. Like seriously why do I have to bother with this toxicity when we can have a fucking normal conversation about different interpretations of an anime episode. You want to convince me that the music and artstyle dictate the moral stance of the episode? Tell me why and how. I ask for alternatives but you can answer with reasons if that's more fit for debate. |
jal90Nov 5, 2017 3:01 PM
iArinko said: But why are they still lying to each other when they know the truth. They could just pretend they lie to the outside and lying to everyone except each other. Red_Ranger_Wien said: Then just tell her. Pretend when anyone comes snooping around but there's zero reason to keep it up when it's just the two of them. The point stands though that it is not "better for everyone", which is what this post was originally supposed to answer. Anyway, the man is simply not willing to risk it. Given that there are spies in the country, how could he be sure that he and the princess aren't being watched from the shadows 24/7? It was not mentioned in the episode, but the princess went back with permission from her parents, and is still communicating with them (but how? likely, there's still a support system for the royal family within the country, which could easily be a double-edged sword for the princess. If they found out that the man is not crazy, game over for both of them.) |
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ThatCynicalOtaku said: jal90 said: Are you going to play the victim now? Can't you just apologize or just, you know, move on? I am not the one who heated this debate with the "blind fanboyism" argument, so don't put the blame on me if I respond accordingly. I am not going to respect something that disrespects me, I was nice enough in my second answer I think. If you didn't mean harm then fine, let's move on and focus on the debate at once. I have mentioned stuff from the series, the character psychology, the same episode and even the same story in my arguments, don't play the "you are ignoring most of what I said" card either because it's simply not true. Like seriously why do I have to bother with this toxicity when we can have a fucking normal conversation about different interpretations of an anime episode. You want to convince me that the music and artstyle dictate the moral stance of the episode? Tell me why and how. I ask for alternatives but you can answer with reasons if that's more fit for debate. How am I playing the victim? All I said is that the moment anybody starts saying, "offer an alternate solution", the chances of anybody agreeing with each other hit 0. I've never seen anybody online agree after someone said, "offer an alternate solution" I meant that I think that I thought that you missed the point of my opinion, and were more focused on monologuing yours. But fine, I'll offer my, "solution", but I'm just going to take a bet that anybody who reads it, not just you, anybody, will automatically disagree, because this is the internet. If I were the creators of this episode, I would have the characters, not just Kino, show more signs of hesitation at them lying: not completely regretting it, but not completely comfortable with it, either. Then at the end, when Kino's alone, make the music a LITTLE upbeat, and then have a quick dialogue between Kino and Hermes where they're not exactly sure whether what the people were doing was right. I would agree with this if it was another series and character, because seriously, those reactions would be easily expected for anybody else but Kino, maybe for Shizu; the problem is that we are talking about a character who saw a man get shot and pierced in front of her and wasn't bothered a bit (first episode), she is never going to condemn or doubt the morals of the country she sets in and whenever she has it was because of exceptional and personal reasons. Is this for the better? Up to the viewer but it certainly is not expected to have her discuss the moral implications of this place and people, much less criticize them. Of course, we could have had some extra introspection if Kino and Hermes talked about the experience but in a series that already sets from the beginning its "the world is ugly and that's why it's beautiful" motto I can't see a scenario where this fits. About the rest of the characters, that is debatable, but... wouldn't it be actually counterproductive for the depiction of these characters? These people are convinced that they are doing what is best. They have created a system where living through an intricate structure of lies makes them happy. That happiness through deception is shady and ambiguous, but it exists and it keeps a statu quo these characters are fond of. Are the villagers in the first episode uncomfortable about killing delinquents? The point of this series and episodes is that the societies that Kino visits follow their own values and what you are asking here is for them to adopt an external moral stance. |
jal90Nov 5, 2017 4:13 PM
ThatCynicalOtaku said: jal90 said: I would agree with this if it was another series and character, because seriously, those reactions would be easily expected for anybody else but Kino, maybe for Shizu; the problem is that we are talking about a character who saw a man get shot and pierced in front of her and wasn't bothered a bit (first episode), she is never going to condemn or doubt the morals of the country she sets in and whenever she has it was because of exceptional and personal reasons. Is this for the better? Up to the viewer but it certainly is not expected to have her discuss the moral implications of this place and people, much less criticize them. Of course, we could have had some extra introspection if Kino and Hermes talked about the experience but in a series that already sets from the beginning its "the world is ugly and that's why it's beautiful" motto I can't see a scenario where this fits. About the rest of the characters, that is debatable, but... wouldn't it be actually counterproductive for the depiction of these characters? These people are convinced that they are doing what is best. They have created a system where living through an intricate structure of lies makes them happy. That happiness through deception is shady and ambiguous, but it exists and it keeps a statu quo these characters are fond of. Are the villagers in the first episode uncomfortable about killing delinquents? The point of this series and episodes is that the societies that Kino visits follow their own values and what you are asking here is for them to adopt an external moral stance. Okay you're right about Kino. Then it'd be better if she didn't really smile at the end. The last few shots would just be of her wandering off, screen starts to fade to black, no music, no dialogue. No dark, or light. Neutral. It does something like this, though. Kino moves away in her bike, with no strings attached, like she always does. It didn't make a difference to her. As for why she smiles: she ended on good terms with everybody there, she learned about the structure of a new country, she knows that people are happy this way, she is being told at that precise moment how this happiness works. Being objective and neutral does not mean that Kino is devoid of emotion. If things go fine she will leave the country on a good note, if there are problems and tension she will find the situation more uncomfortable. I mean, I hate bringing this example again but her reaction to visiting the country of the first episode, which personally I find much more disturbing than this, was equally positive and uplifted. In this same episode, Kino finds a different mood in the previous country she visits and her reaction is not the same. ThatCynicalOtaku said: The problem with making ALL the characters (except Kino) 100% happy with the fact that they're lying, means that the episode is saying that lying is good, if it makes people happy. Come on! I can't agree with this logic, not in Kino no tabi which so often portrays perfectly functioning societies through morals and social rules that don't conform to the norm. It makes sense in context that these people are 100% happy (the context where some people are happy in a semi-slave regime, some in a country where you can mob lynch any delinquent and etc.) and what would actually stand out and be odd is having the inhabitants inside of the country doubting the moral grounds they've based their society on. These people have lived this way for years, and they've found a stability. ThatCynicalOtaku said: Messages in any form of storytelling are explored through characters' perspectives. Fate/Zero has one guy hating chilvalry, another character loving chivalry, making things gray. At the end of Monster, when someone asks, "who is the real monster?" the lack of any exact perspectives on the question make the answer ambiguous: Is Johan the "Monster" or society? It's not clear because of the lack of the characters' perspectives on it. The message of the corruption of the upper class in The Great Gatsby wouldn't be nearly as impactful if Nick did NOT come to hate New York. Yes, I know this and I agree, which is actually why Kino no tabi should be treated as an exception to the rule. This series will never tell you that a moral or social construction is wrong through its characters because in their minds it is perfectly fine, and it will never tell you through Kino because as a traveller she wants to know and realize how vast the world is, which is why she always wants to explore and embrace the culture of the countries she visits. The show is deliberately ambiguous on this in order to make the viewer reach their own conclusions, and that's how in every episode discussion there is somebody who will mention that this or that country is terrible, has fucked up morals, or will instead defend it based on whatever perspective. None of these mention the authorial intent as a catalyst for these conclusions so I admit I was surprised to see you doing it here. |
jal90Nov 5, 2017 5:23 PM
TheDoggoneGirl said: I loved the second half more than the first because the first half is just sad. The people from that country which Kino visited created a memorial for a man who was a traveler who saved their country and became their first President, and they displayed all his possessions like it's some kind of national treasures including his motorrad he used to ride when he's alive. And that motorrad turns out is so depressed because he was displayed instead of being ridden. Not even Kino and Hermes can help him because they don't want to make enemies with the people from that town, but turns out that motorrad will have his new rider: that kid Kino talked to. I hope that kid can yeah save that poor motorrad. Kinda glad nobody's weird in that country, though. That poor motorrad made me sad. The second half is about Kino visiting another country and the focus was the man who fell in love with a farmer's daughter, but she turns out to be the princess sneaking out of the castle (like Aladdin yeah, specifically Princess Jasmine haha). Then they planned a revolution against their king, and that guy is one of the leaders of the revolution, and everyone thought he'd killed his own lover because he was the one who threw the grenade at their car while they're trying to escape, hence it made him insane because he couldn't handle the fact that he killed his own lover with his own hands. Then they made him think that his lover left for a journey and it's been like that for 5 years. And many caretaker gave up on him, but there's one who lasted for 3 years and she's a traveler. And that freaking reveal, maaan. That guy's caretaker is the princess herself who traveled back to that country for that "insane" guy, but THAT INSANE GUY IS NOT INSANE AFTER ALL: he's just pretending. Lmfaooooo. Little did that princess and everyone in that country know that he's been lying. Lmfao. Heck, everyone in that country are liars after all. Justice to this episode's title. Haha. I have queries, though. First, how come the people from that country didn't recognize that princess when she came back to that country "as a traveler"? It boggles me. Second, does that "insane" guy knows that his housekeeper is his lover? It looks like he doesn't know. P.S. That CGI KINO, THOUGH. HAHAHA. Nothing wrong with it; I find it cute, tbh. 5/5 <3 Yeah, I was confused by this as well. The guy in town that told Kino the story specifically said, "I was sure those two would marry." That's literally implying he's seen them together before. But we also have to consider the fact that she could dye her hair or something, and maybe the guy telling the story hasn't seen the housekeeper at all. But then the title of this episode confuses me more, which is called Country of Liars. So was everyone lying? Or did the people in town genuinely believe what they were saying? If they knew the secret, then I don't see why anyone would need to keep that lie up.. |
 Three things cannot be long hidden.. ...the s u n, the m oo n, and the tr u th. |
Zelev said: TheDoggoneGirl said: I loved the second half more than the first because the first half is just sad. The people from that country which Kino visited created a memorial for a man who was a traveler who saved their country and became their first President, and they displayed all his possessions like it's some kind of national treasures including his motorrad he used to ride when he's alive. And that motorrad turns out is so depressed because he was displayed instead of being ridden. Not even Kino and Hermes can help him because they don't want to make enemies with the people from that town, but turns out that motorrad will have his new rider: that kid Kino talked to. I hope that kid can yeah save that poor motorrad. Kinda glad nobody's weird in that country, though. That poor motorrad made me sad. The second half is about Kino visiting another country and the focus was the man who fell in love with a farmer's daughter, but she turns out to be the princess sneaking out of the castle (like Aladdin yeah, specifically Princess Jasmine haha). Then they planned a revolution against their king, and that guy is one of the leaders of the revolution, and everyone thought he'd killed his own lover because he was the one who threw the grenade at their car while they're trying to escape, hence it made him insane because he couldn't handle the fact that he killed his own lover with his own hands. Then they made him think that his lover left for a journey and it's been like that for 5 years. And many caretaker gave up on him, but there's one who lasted for 3 years and she's a traveler. And that freaking reveal, maaan. That guy's caretaker is the princess herself who traveled back to that country for that "insane" guy, but THAT INSANE GUY IS NOT INSANE AFTER ALL: he's just pretending. Lmfaooooo. Little did that princess and everyone in that country know that he's been lying. Lmfao. Heck, everyone in that country are liars after all. Justice to this episode's title. Haha. I have queries, though. First, how come the people from that country didn't recognize that princess when she came back to that country "as a traveler"? It boggles me. Second, does that "insane" guy knows that his housekeeper is his lover? It looks like he doesn't know. P.S. That CGI KINO, THOUGH. HAHAHA. Nothing wrong with it; I find it cute, tbh. 5/5 <3 Yeah, I was confused by this as well. The guy in town that told Kino the story specifically said, "I was sure those two would marry." That's literally implying he's seen them together before. But we also have to consider the fact that she could dye her hair or something, and maybe the guy telling the story hasn't seen the housekeeper at all. But then the title of this episode confuses me more, which is called Country of Liars. So was everyone lying? Or did the people in town genuinely believe what they were saying? If they knew the secret, then I don't see why anyone would need to keep that lie up.. The guy who told Kino the country's history is the spy working for the royal family (as the hero mentioned at the end of the episode), he knows the truth about the princess, and probale the one who made sure nobody learned her true identity. |
Shinraro said: Zelev said: Yeah, I was confused by this as well. The guy in town that told Kino the story specifically said, "I was sure those two would marry." That's literally implying he's seen them together before. But we also have to consider the fact that she could dye her hair or something, and maybe the guy telling the story hasn't seen the housekeeper at all. But then the title of this episode confuses me more, which is called Country of Liars. So was everyone lying? Or did the people in town genuinely believe what they were saying? If they knew the secret, then I don't see why anyone would need to keep that lie up.. The guy who told Kino the country's history is the spy working for the royal family (as the hero mentioned at the end of the episode), he knows the truth about the princess, and probale the one who made sure nobody learned her true identity. Oh, really..? Gonna be honest, I was only paying attention 85% of the time. Even then, I thought the "hero" was the guy that had faked memory loss. |
Three things cannot be long hidden.. ...the s u n, the m oo n, and the tr u th. |
| This sums-up the whole episode: A country full of Liars! 3/5. |
 |
| Not sure how that would be any good to each other, but ok. |
| god im loving this series and the second half of this ep was just beautiful loved the fact they already knew who each other was but are lying to each other so good how they play it out but i can also understand as to why the lying needs to happen especially with how things played out in the past for them so the lying is for the best great ep am looking forward to the next ep and see what awaits |
| "one step at a time" |
Red_Ranger_Wien said: TsundeReaper said: I think it's bcoz if they become lovely dovey all of a sudden, the townspeople will realize, hey you know what wtf those two fooled us his not our "hero" anymore and the princess is alive, kill her along with our "hero". Like the hero stated at the end, he don't want to ruin the current system "they have created" 1) How would the townspeople know. It seemed like they rarely went out there to see him and when they did the scenario you described seems a bit OOC at least for the townspeople we see in the episode. 2) They could just leave. Why won't you be the main character of that story? Why should everyone be like you? I don't understand tho. Every person is unique, not everyone is just like you. ThatCynicalOtaku said: jal90 said: My perspective comes from experience with the show, the character and the expectations it sets, yours is debunked in the same episode, not only in the first but in the second story. Nowhere it is said that Kino agrees with the moral and emotional reasons, she is grateful for being told about them, and thanks people for telling her, and I know that because Kino says herself and because she smiles then. Your accusation is a personal interpretation that is never told bluntly or even suggested. And if from your perspective I'm a blind fanboy who is incapable of thinking clearly you can go fuck yourself and your perspective. Is it clear? Not play any music? So just because the show does not take an active stance for or against something it doesn't have to use aesthetics to reflect a mood? Show me an alternative that is viable and makes sense in context and we'll talk. Not playing any music is telling you that the scene is dead serious, it is invalidating the happiness of this character and in turn his lifestyle. If I tell you that the intent of the show is not to prove characters right or wrong tell me what is the point of this alternative. I think you're still ignoring most of the things I've said. From my experience, when people on the internet start asking people to, "offer an alternate solution", they're actually saying, "I will never agree with you". At this point, no matter whatever "solution" I offer, you will find a way to throw it out the window: you will continue insulting me (ie "fuck yourself"), oversimplify/exaggerate anything I say, all for the purpose, of never agreeing with me, no matter how much logical sense my opinion is. "And if from your perspective I'm a blind fanboy who is incapable of thinking clearly" It's not just you. I consider myself to be far more intelligent than 90% of people online. I'm not joking, but I'm sorry for oversimplifying your perspective down to fanboyism. "It's not just you. I consider myself to be far more intelligent than 90% of people online. I'm not joking, but I'm sorry for oversimplifying your perspective down to fanboyism." Holy shit, that's a new level of self proclaimed here. Anyway, no one here talk abut glorifying lying (except you ofc). Lying is good if it for better reason. And if you apply your logic here, just watch the previous episode. The one with town on the ship. When he tell them the truth, and boom, they don't want that. and back to the ship while in denial. Some things just better the way it was. Not every change is better, you see. |
| "As long as you're alive, something happy bound to happens" -What a Wonderful World |
| it seems that some user here think that mc on any anime will and always force their way of thinking (or their justice) to others like generic shounen character. |
linua said: it seems that some user here think that mc on any anime will and always force their way of thinking (or their justice) to others like generic shounen character. linua said: it seems that some user here think that mc on any anime will and always force their way of thinking (or their justice) to others like generic shounen character. Exactly. I wonder why... Maybe they're just some selfish person... It's like, they only want the MC to be a good-to-everyone person... That's just... Oh well... |
| "As long as you're alive, something happy bound to happens" -What a Wonderful World |
Red_Ranger_Wien said: TsundeReaper said: I think it's bcoz if they become lovely dovey all of a sudden, the townspeople will realize, hey you know what wtf those two fooled us his not our "hero" anymore and the princess is alive, kill her along with our "hero". Like the hero stated at the end, he don't want to ruin the current system "they have created" 1) How would the townspeople know. It seemed like they rarely went out there to see him and when they did the scenario you described seems a bit OOC at least for the townspeople we see in the episode. 2) They could just leave. The guards would know, if he suddenly stopped asking people for her lover, I'm sure people would know They can't leave remember? It's forbidden to leave The royals escaped bcoz they have connections, he doesn't have that, now the former princess too looks like didn't planned to escape the county again, so it's pretty much impossible for them now |
| is that akikra ishida????? |
Cross  AngeHey guys check my profile for current airing season anime recommendation (guaranteed best taste) |
| Really loved how this episode played out. I was wondering what made it a "country of liars". Did not see that coming at all. |
| Holy shit, that episode was basically Lie-caption. The townspeople were lying to him about what happened to his lover. His "housekeeper" was actually his lover who was alive and was lying to him about her identity. And then the man himself played the ultimate card and was lying about everything, he knew the townspeople were lying to him, he knows his housekeeper is his lover, and he keeps up the lie to avoid being a part of the government and having to deal with the repercussions of his spy life and fixing his relationship with the girl...so now all parties are "happy" with the situation. He's got the easiest way out though, all he has to do is wake up, and spin another lie like "oh shit, lover is that you?" Like he has a moment of clarity all of a sudden. |
ThatCynicalOtaku said: jal90 said: No sir, nobody says that the anime is a life of its own, you are saying that the creator/director of this anime condones this behaviour through lighting and colour and through the events it narrates, which if you have some minimal experience with Kino no tabi it's very easy to debunk. And it's not about the story being a sentient entity in its own, it's about the story being created under a purpose that has remained for every episode and that is its main appeal. Why does Kino smile? What a question. Why shouldn't she? She is in no way outraged. She is happy to know how people live there and to understand them. She could have said: "Hey, you are living a lie" but that goes against her philosophy of life, which you should know of at this point and again, if you don't I can only blame this show having Kino take a proactive role various times this season for this confusion. This is how Kino actually looks like 95% of the time so better get used. Why did Kino not help the motorrad in the first story? Why did Kino not try to save the traveller in episode 1? Can I ask what aesthetic alternative would you have presented? A grim one that doesn't reflect the state of mind of the world and characters introduced? If a character talks about his happiness would you make the scene sad-looking on purpose? Because THAT would be a very blatant and uncalled for positioning. Also, the next time you can't shut your mouth with implications and ad hominems cry them to the wall in your room because I don't want to read them. Simple. Don't have cheerful music play. Or heck, don't have any music play. Have Kino's expression at the end be of uncertainty, when she thinks back on her encounter. When she smiled at the end for everyone, that was her basically agreeing, which contradicts the purpose of her as a neutral observer, alienating any audience member like me who believes its wrong for the characters to be lying. As for Kino's actions like the motorcycle? That's not what I've been talking about, you're going off-topic. I wasn't throwing ad hominems; I was just saying that, form my perspective, you weren't thinking outside of the box and were looking on whether the characters follow logic, more than what their actions are saying, basically, just like so many people on MAL, who excuse any criticism with, "but this is how the character behaves, so it's inevitable" You're picking this episode to throw a little bitch fit about? Your logic makes no fucking sense. Because Kino smiled at the end and because the music was happy, she was agreeing with the country's situation and thus not being a neutral observer? How so? She didn't intervene in any way whatsoever. She didn't pick sides, because there was no side to choose. Simply smiling because it's nice that the country's fucked up methods of happiness work for them isn't showing any bias. If this get you tilted for no reason, you must've had a vomit filled seizure when Kino assassinated the king in the coliseum country or sabotaged the AI leaders on the floating island country, or sided with the moving fort country when they plowed through the walled nation. |
ThatCynicalOtaku said: Jonesy974 said: You're picking this episode to throw a little bitch fit about? Your logic makes no fucking sense. Because Kino smiled at the end and because the music was happy, she was agreeing with the country's situation and thus not being a neutral observer? How so? She didn't intervene in any way whatsoever. She didn't pick sides, because there was no side to choose. Simply smiling because it's nice that the country's fucked up methods of happiness work for them isn't showing any bias. If this get you tilted for no reason, you must've had a vomit filled seizure when Kino assassinated the king in the coliseum country or sabotaged the AI leaders on the floating island country, or sided with the moving fort country when they plowed through the walled nation. You say that I was "throwing a fit" and must've had a, "vomit filled seizure", but ironically, from your post, it looks like you're the one who had a "vomit filled seizure" from reading somebody else's opinion. If you're going to throw insults like a 5 year old because you disagree with someone's opinion on a cartoon, especially after that same person elaborated on his opinion, AND go almost off-topic, please save yourself from the embarrassment, and either delete your post, or stop throwing insults. None of my posts of this episode implied that I was, "throwing a fit". No, "throwing a fit" would mean to bombard people with insults, like you are doing. I have simply explained my issues with this episode in logical detail, yet you, good sir, are throwing a fit over MY opinion. Ah so you're doing the whole straw-man argument of "oh someone called me out on my antics, so I'm going to belittle the importance of the show by calling it a cartoon, and then act like a good respectable person as a façade to try and bolster your argument?" Ok, sweet. Cool beans. We'll just pretend you didn't also blanket insult the entire MAL community by stereotyping the why people critique a show. And we'll pretend you didn't completely ignore my remark about how what you're getting mad about happened in other episodes. AND we'll pretend that you weren't trying to present your opinion as facts the entire time. Golly gee, playing pretend sure is fun. |
| Pretty good episode. Glad we got to see another talking bike and Kinos bit with that other kid was cool. I wasn't a fan of the second part. Not sure if I'm correct in thinking both of these people know the other person is there lover but are content living the rest of their days lying about it? Would they not of been happier if they told each other the truth and didn't have to constantly bullshit about his lover coming lol. Seems stupid to me but oh well |
| funny enough, the answer for why Kino wont do anything on the 2nd story are already answered on the previous episode and 1st story of this episode. on previous episode we see how Shizu trying to change a country but in the end he dont take the resposibility to stay and lead that country, but instead he just "throw" them to live on the land. on the other hand on the 1st story of this episode, we are being shown the aftermath of a country that being saved by a traveler and how he stay and lead them to be a better country. "If you can't see something through to the end, then don't do anything." quote from Itami Yoji (GATE season 1 episode 11) |
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